Restaurant Lost Our Debit Card
March 13, 2017 7:46 AM Subscribe
I would really like to know:
1. How should the restaurant have handled this?
2. What should my husband and I have done?
(semi)Short story: While we were in a vacation town this weekend, a server lost our debit card between charging our card and returning it to us. We were not notified right away, when we sought out an assistant manager, she was unaware of the situation, the manager in charge was notified even later, and then did not apologize, got defensive, and escalated quickly. She was making the scene in the restaurant, not us. The police came and asked us outside. We found out the manager had told the police that we wouldn't leave and wanted them to escort us out. She had never asked us to leave and we were still waiting for information! We ended up filing a police report, and clearly we won't ever go back. What *should* have happened?
Long story, and really, I'm trying to edit but still give all the info!
We had an okay meal at a tourist-trap type of restaurant away from home this weekend. We paid the bill with our debit card. After about 20 minutes, the waiter returned, apologized and told us that another member of the wait staff had picked up the folder with our debit card in it (after it was charged), and they were looking for it.
After another 10 minutes with no further info, my husband found an assistant manager who was unaware of the situation. He filled her in, and she launched a look behind things and look in the garbage campaign. She told us that cards fall behind the cash register - they'd look, don't cancel yet. That seemed odd - we were told it was taken by another wait person. We figured it had already walked out of the restaurant.
After a total 45+ minutes, the manager in charge came to our table. (We were still sitting there, the table had not been cleared, no further info from anyone) She did NOT apologize, she was very defensive, and she did say that she would comp our meal, as if that was a huge gift and she was put out to even do that. My husband told her that was a good start but that they needed to do more to help us figure out what happened - is the card here, is it gone, what? Plus, we wanted a written assurance that the restaurant would be liable for any charges to the card between when it was taken from us and when we cancelled.
She returned while my husband was calling the bank, so I also asked about filing a police report in case it was stolen. At that point, she flew off the handle and started yelling about how I could I possibly think they stole my card, and don't I trust them? I told her that of course I don't - nothing in our interactions so far inspired any trust and I also told her that of course I meant that another customer (who may not be trustworthy) might have walked out with it. She insisted that it was still in the restaurant, and wouldn't we feel ashamed when she called at 10:30 that night with the card. I let her know that it was now being cancelled and she just didn't get it and kept telling us that they would tear apart the place and find it.
She handed us a paper that refunded (or didn't put the charge through) our meal, but nothing else. When we asked, she said she didn't have the authority to authorize any more, and we were ridiculous to ask. She also refused to call the general manager who did have authority. Our position was that they took the card, and waited so long before notifying us or a manager that it was long gone from the restaurant, and there had been time to rack up charges before we cancelled.
Wrapping up, I promise. She called the police (we thought to file a report) and then asked if we wanted to go outside to talk with them. We said no, because we wanted the police to see the whole situation. 10 minutes pass, and then the police come in to escort us out. When we talk with them outside and tell our story, they (without details) let us know they had a completely different version from the manager. As she was the hysterical one and we were calm, the officer listened to us, and helped us file a missing card report.
What would an organized, on the ball restaurant do in this situation? How could we have done better? Should we leave honest social media reviews to protect future customers?
Long story, and really, I'm trying to edit but still give all the info!
We had an okay meal at a tourist-trap type of restaurant away from home this weekend. We paid the bill with our debit card. After about 20 minutes, the waiter returned, apologized and told us that another member of the wait staff had picked up the folder with our debit card in it (after it was charged), and they were looking for it.
After another 10 minutes with no further info, my husband found an assistant manager who was unaware of the situation. He filled her in, and she launched a look behind things and look in the garbage campaign. She told us that cards fall behind the cash register - they'd look, don't cancel yet. That seemed odd - we were told it was taken by another wait person. We figured it had already walked out of the restaurant.
After a total 45+ minutes, the manager in charge came to our table. (We were still sitting there, the table had not been cleared, no further info from anyone) She did NOT apologize, she was very defensive, and she did say that she would comp our meal, as if that was a huge gift and she was put out to even do that. My husband told her that was a good start but that they needed to do more to help us figure out what happened - is the card here, is it gone, what? Plus, we wanted a written assurance that the restaurant would be liable for any charges to the card between when it was taken from us and when we cancelled.
She returned while my husband was calling the bank, so I also asked about filing a police report in case it was stolen. At that point, she flew off the handle and started yelling about how I could I possibly think they stole my card, and don't I trust them? I told her that of course I don't - nothing in our interactions so far inspired any trust and I also told her that of course I meant that another customer (who may not be trustworthy) might have walked out with it. She insisted that it was still in the restaurant, and wouldn't we feel ashamed when she called at 10:30 that night with the card. I let her know that it was now being cancelled and she just didn't get it and kept telling us that they would tear apart the place and find it.
She handed us a paper that refunded (or didn't put the charge through) our meal, but nothing else. When we asked, she said she didn't have the authority to authorize any more, and we were ridiculous to ask. She also refused to call the general manager who did have authority. Our position was that they took the card, and waited so long before notifying us or a manager that it was long gone from the restaurant, and there had been time to rack up charges before we cancelled.
Wrapping up, I promise. She called the police (we thought to file a report) and then asked if we wanted to go outside to talk with them. We said no, because we wanted the police to see the whole situation. 10 minutes pass, and then the police come in to escort us out. When we talk with them outside and tell our story, they (without details) let us know they had a completely different version from the manager. As she was the hysterical one and we were calm, the officer listened to us, and helped us file a missing card report.
What would an organized, on the ball restaurant do in this situation? How could we have done better? Should we leave honest social media reviews to protect future customers?
Response by poster: Just wanted to add to my Ask - we clearly know we waited too long to cancel. We were both confused and so hopeful it would be found since this was Saturday, we had to drive home Sunday, and my husband had to then travel again on Monday. We also know we might have expected too much, but what should we have expected?
If the manager had be notified quickly, come over to us right away and said, "We're so sorry this happened. You should probably cancel your card before someone has a chance to charge anything," I'm sure we would have been upset, but done so, and thought they handled it well.
posted by banjonaut at 8:00 AM on March 13, 2017 [5 favorites]
If the manager had be notified quickly, come over to us right away and said, "We're so sorry this happened. You should probably cancel your card before someone has a chance to charge anything," I'm sure we would have been upset, but done so, and thought they handled it well.
posted by banjonaut at 8:00 AM on March 13, 2017 [5 favorites]
I was a customer service manager for a long time. I would have approached your table, apologized, comped your meal, have myself and staff spend 5- 10 min searching and checking every folder then apologize again and suggest that you have your card cancelled.
On my side the moment that you "wanted written assurance from me that the resturant would be liable for any charges" was the moment that I *knew* you guys were going to be a customer service nightmare and it was going to be a scene to get you to leave the restaurant. The reason is that it is a request so huge, so totally unlikely to be honored by any establishment anywhere (I'm including Disney, Nordstrom and Virgin in this) that I have no realistic ability to end this situation to your satisfaction. Now I'm not caring about customer service, I want your gone as quickly as possible.
posted by saradarlin at 8:00 AM on March 13, 2017 [108 favorites]
On my side the moment that you "wanted written assurance from me that the resturant would be liable for any charges" was the moment that I *knew* you guys were going to be a customer service nightmare and it was going to be a scene to get you to leave the restaurant. The reason is that it is a request so huge, so totally unlikely to be honored by any establishment anywhere (I'm including Disney, Nordstrom and Virgin in this) that I have no realistic ability to end this situation to your satisfaction. Now I'm not caring about customer service, I want your gone as quickly as possible.
posted by saradarlin at 8:00 AM on March 13, 2017 [108 favorites]
I would have just canceled the card and left, leaving a phone number where they could call me if it turned up. I would have assumed they handed the card back to the wrong person, who left with it. I don't think this is a scam - most CC scams involve stealing the number, not stealing the physical card. I think generally you are not liable for fake charges on your CC, so asking for a written statement from the restaurant seems overboard. Sorry, it's easy to go overboard in the heat of the moment, I know.
posted by Mid at 8:01 AM on March 13, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Mid at 8:01 AM on March 13, 2017 [5 favorites]
If this is a U.S. debit card from any but the most off-brand bank, you wouldn't have been liable for those charges anyway. It was a weird request to make.
posted by praemunire at 8:06 AM on March 13, 2017 [50 favorites]
posted by praemunire at 8:06 AM on March 13, 2017 [50 favorites]
I wouldn't have assumed anywhere in here that the card was purposefully stolen. Dropped into some deep, dark recess, perhaps. Given back to the wrong customers, probably. Fraudulent charges showing up on cards is a routine occurrence, there was no need to get the restaurant involved in resolving those because the bank is already on that. Heck, my bank calls me just to check and see every time I take a vacation or charge something unusual.
The restaurant took too long to deal with it, but I probably would have just approached the manager and said that I'm tired, want to leave, here's my phone number in case it turns up, but we're cancelling the card now, and we're not paying for our meal, bye.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:08 AM on March 13, 2017 [3 favorites]
The restaurant took too long to deal with it, but I probably would have just approached the manager and said that I'm tired, want to leave, here's my phone number in case it turns up, but we're cancelling the card now, and we're not paying for our meal, bye.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:08 AM on March 13, 2017 [3 favorites]
Yeah, this sucks and was irresponsible of the restaurant. However there was no way they would ever put in writing that they would cover the financial damages. First of all, from the manager's perspective, what if you were the scammers, and you had nicked the card from the folder then requested a comped meal? Next, that is simply not the restaurant's job.
I think it's normal to request a comped meal and a call back the next day to confirm if the card was found. It would be normal to expect an apology. For the financial risk, that belongs to your debit card company to sort out.
posted by samthemander at 8:18 AM on March 13, 2017 [2 favorites]
I think it's normal to request a comped meal and a call back the next day to confirm if the card was found. It would be normal to expect an apology. For the financial risk, that belongs to your debit card company to sort out.
posted by samthemander at 8:18 AM on March 13, 2017 [2 favorites]
I am not sure what more you expected them to do other than comp your meal. This was handled poorly by both sides. If it were me, I would flag it and move on. Cancel the card and vow to never come back.
posted by AugustWest at 8:19 AM on March 13, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by AugustWest at 8:19 AM on March 13, 2017 [4 favorites]
I'm sorry, but I think you really overreacted. I know situations like this are super frustrating, and I personally would have been pretty unhappy if this happened to me. But in general people aren't actively trying to screw you over, and I find it's best for my own sanity to not get wrapped up in thoughts about "Why wasn't this handled differently? What should have been done?"
You say you were "calm" but I am pretty skeptical that you weren't communicating your anger to the restaurant staff. People don't want to help you if you're shitty to them.
Also, nthing that the request that the restaurant hold itself liable for any fraudulent charges on your card was really strange, and if you made that request of me I would immediately assume that you were scamming me somehow.
posted by schroedingersgirl at 8:23 AM on March 13, 2017 [8 favorites]
You say you were "calm" but I am pretty skeptical that you weren't communicating your anger to the restaurant staff. People don't want to help you if you're shitty to them.
Also, nthing that the request that the restaurant hold itself liable for any fraudulent charges on your card was really strange, and if you made that request of me I would immediately assume that you were scamming me somehow.
posted by schroedingersgirl at 8:23 AM on March 13, 2017 [8 favorites]
How could we have done better?
By having expectations that were reasonably grounded in reality. For instance, Saradarlin correctly notes that no establishment would be likely to honor your request ("that the restaurant would be liable for any charges"), but I'd take that a step further: do you think the manager at this "tourist trap" restaurant was likely authorized to honor that request, even if she'd wanted to? Doubtful. In my experience in both retail and food service, that's a request that would need to be passed up to the owner(s). A floor manager is probably not authorized to contract new liabilities on behalf of the business.
Similarly, you remained in the restaurant "because we wanted the police to see the whole situation." This sounds like when people have a fender-bender at a four-way intersection and leave their cars blocking traffic "so the police can see what happened." Those people watch too much TV. Unless someone died, a reconstruction team will not be dispatched to tape-off the scene and take measurements. Trying to "preserve" the situation for police—usually—just exacerbates whatever problem exists. Exactly what did you want the police to see? Don't do that. De-escalate the situation, then chat with police when they arrive.
But the larger point is that if we assume your emotional impressions of the situation are accurate—that you were the reasonable party, and the restaurant staff behaved unprofessionally—then still, it sounds like you're too affected by this. Okay, so they handled things unprofessionally. We're talking about employees at a "tourist-trap" restaurant, not executives at Apple. In a perfect world, sure, they would have done X and Y and Z. In this world, tourist-trap food-service jobs don't come with spectacular salaries or training. If I order a hamburger and it arrives with cheese, I'm going to be displeased, but my displeasure will vary depending whether I'm at Eleven Madison or McDonald's, y'know? Adults need to have reasonable expectations, and to base their reactions thereupon. It sounds like you didn't.
Should we leave honest social media reviews to protect future customers?
Maybe. From what? You got a free meal. Did you suffer some other measure of damage—did they lose your coat, refuse to comp the valet fee, etc? If there's something specific you think future customers need to be protected from, then leave a review. If you just want to warn future customers that tourist-trap restaurants don't always provide top-flight customer service...? Most people are already aware.
posted by cribcage at 8:32 AM on March 13, 2017 [23 favorites]
By having expectations that were reasonably grounded in reality. For instance, Saradarlin correctly notes that no establishment would be likely to honor your request ("that the restaurant would be liable for any charges"), but I'd take that a step further: do you think the manager at this "tourist trap" restaurant was likely authorized to honor that request, even if she'd wanted to? Doubtful. In my experience in both retail and food service, that's a request that would need to be passed up to the owner(s). A floor manager is probably not authorized to contract new liabilities on behalf of the business.
Similarly, you remained in the restaurant "because we wanted the police to see the whole situation." This sounds like when people have a fender-bender at a four-way intersection and leave their cars blocking traffic "so the police can see what happened." Those people watch too much TV. Unless someone died, a reconstruction team will not be dispatched to tape-off the scene and take measurements. Trying to "preserve" the situation for police—usually—just exacerbates whatever problem exists. Exactly what did you want the police to see? Don't do that. De-escalate the situation, then chat with police when they arrive.
But the larger point is that if we assume your emotional impressions of the situation are accurate—that you were the reasonable party, and the restaurant staff behaved unprofessionally—then still, it sounds like you're too affected by this. Okay, so they handled things unprofessionally. We're talking about employees at a "tourist-trap" restaurant, not executives at Apple. In a perfect world, sure, they would have done X and Y and Z. In this world, tourist-trap food-service jobs don't come with spectacular salaries or training. If I order a hamburger and it arrives with cheese, I'm going to be displeased, but my displeasure will vary depending whether I'm at Eleven Madison or McDonald's, y'know? Adults need to have reasonable expectations, and to base their reactions thereupon. It sounds like you didn't.
Should we leave honest social media reviews to protect future customers?
Maybe. From what? You got a free meal. Did you suffer some other measure of damage—did they lose your coat, refuse to comp the valet fee, etc? If there's something specific you think future customers need to be protected from, then leave a review. If you just want to warn future customers that tourist-trap restaurants don't always provide top-flight customer service...? Most people are already aware.
posted by cribcage at 8:32 AM on March 13, 2017 [23 favorites]
they needed to do more to help us figure out what happened - is the card here, is it gone, what? Plus, we wanted a written assurance that the restaurant would be liable for any charges to the card between when it was taken from us and when we cancelled.
I feel like the restaurant has a pretty limited ability in these situations. It's clear that they didn't quite know what happened but that the end result was that your card was gone. That sucks. In that situation, what they should have been doing was trying to make it up to you, comping meals and otherwise being very conciliatory and sorry about things. They weren't. That is too bad. They also took too much time managing this situation and did not think about your feelings/wasted time in this situation. That also sucks.
THAT said, it's just a debit card. If something legit happened, like it was stolen from the restaurant, you are not liable for fraudulent charges. The bank is. So, putting the restaurant into a position where they should be responsible for something that you're not on the hook for seems weird. I got a debit card skimmed (i think) at a tourist trap Disneyland place in California. Didn't report i since I didn't know. Hundreds of dollars of fraudulent charges racked up. Called the bank when I saw them (i.e. weeks later) and they were all taken off my bill. However I did NOT get to know what happened or anything else, just didn't have to pay for it.
So I get that this leaves you feeling bad about the restaurant and insecure about the whole situation. At the same time, I think you are taking your bad feeling out on service workers who may have managed a situation poorly but are likely not running some sketch criminal enterprise out of the restaurant. You should have gotten a free dessert and an apology, instead you got yelled at and insulted. That's crappy. But it seems to me that involving the police and turning it into A Thing was where you could have made a different set of choices. I'd leave this all off of social media in the interests of putting it behind you.
posted by jessamyn at 8:34 AM on March 13, 2017 [4 favorites]
I feel like the restaurant has a pretty limited ability in these situations. It's clear that they didn't quite know what happened but that the end result was that your card was gone. That sucks. In that situation, what they should have been doing was trying to make it up to you, comping meals and otherwise being very conciliatory and sorry about things. They weren't. That is too bad. They also took too much time managing this situation and did not think about your feelings/wasted time in this situation. That also sucks.
THAT said, it's just a debit card. If something legit happened, like it was stolen from the restaurant, you are not liable for fraudulent charges. The bank is. So, putting the restaurant into a position where they should be responsible for something that you're not on the hook for seems weird. I got a debit card skimmed (i think) at a tourist trap Disneyland place in California. Didn't report i since I didn't know. Hundreds of dollars of fraudulent charges racked up. Called the bank when I saw them (i.e. weeks later) and they were all taken off my bill. However I did NOT get to know what happened or anything else, just didn't have to pay for it.
So I get that this leaves you feeling bad about the restaurant and insecure about the whole situation. At the same time, I think you are taking your bad feeling out on service workers who may have managed a situation poorly but are likely not running some sketch criminal enterprise out of the restaurant. You should have gotten a free dessert and an apology, instead you got yelled at and insulted. That's crappy. But it seems to me that involving the police and turning it into A Thing was where you could have made a different set of choices. I'd leave this all off of social media in the interests of putting it behind you.
posted by jessamyn at 8:34 AM on March 13, 2017 [4 favorites]
Assuming United States: Consumer liability and procedures to follow for lost or stolen credit, ATM, and debit cards.
What typically happens when fraudulent charges occur: the issuing bank and the merchant who accepted the fraudulent transaction split the loss. (Side note: This has been affected by chip-and-PIN card issuance.)
The restaurant in your case, therefore, would not be liable for fraud charges. Assuming you reported the loss/theft in a timely manner (see link) neither are you.
(If you really want to keep the inconvenience of lost/stolen cards to a minimum, use a credit card with no direct ties to bank accounts. Sometimes the biggest hassle when a debit card is lost/stolen is getting authorization holds released, which isn't something the FTC has a hand in.)
posted by gnomeloaf at 8:37 AM on March 13, 2017 [2 favorites]
What typically happens when fraudulent charges occur: the issuing bank and the merchant who accepted the fraudulent transaction split the loss. (Side note: This has been affected by chip-and-PIN card issuance.)
The restaurant in your case, therefore, would not be liable for fraud charges. Assuming you reported the loss/theft in a timely manner (see link) neither are you.
(If you really want to keep the inconvenience of lost/stolen cards to a minimum, use a credit card with no direct ties to bank accounts. Sometimes the biggest hassle when a debit card is lost/stolen is getting authorization holds released, which isn't something the FTC has a hand in.)
posted by gnomeloaf at 8:37 AM on March 13, 2017 [2 favorites]
Losing a debit card can induce a moment of panic, especially when you don't feel you have other options to pay for anything (while out of town!). Most banks are really good about cancelling cards and getting a new one out to you quickly. As for a "better" way to handle things, I'd just make sure in the future that you have a back up plan like another card or cash or even just a family member who would wire you money in an emergency. This time the card was lost, but cards get stolen or damaged all the time as well, so a back up plan is necessary.
Many places have policies about cards that have been left behind and it is common to destroy them if the owner is no longer in the building. This is so that the business cannot be held liable for other charges. As a consumer, you should not be expected to know the restaurant's policies and can reasonably ask questions about what they can and cannot do for you.
posted by soelo at 8:38 AM on March 13, 2017 [1 favorite]
Many places have policies about cards that have been left behind and it is common to destroy them if the owner is no longer in the building. This is so that the business cannot be held liable for other charges. As a consumer, you should not be expected to know the restaurant's policies and can reasonably ask questions about what they can and cannot do for you.
posted by soelo at 8:38 AM on March 13, 2017 [1 favorite]
Look, we've all been there-- so furious at some customer service slight that we get a rush of adrenaline that inspires us to make demands that might sound clever in a movie script, and causes us to expect some satisfying comeuppance for the villainous server/sales associate/whatever. But, look, she was being "hysterical" because you were being a classic day-ruining, disruptive, impossible customer. Truly. There is no possible way she could have paused the entire restaurant, with dozens of other customers, to find your card or the culprit. There is no way that she or the general manager or even the owner would have agreed to cover all fraudulent charges.
The real lesson you should take from this experience is to stop using debit cards, which while technically promise to reverse all fraudulent charges, are much scarier in that regard than credit cards.
posted by acidic at 8:39 AM on March 13, 2017 [17 favorites]
The real lesson you should take from this experience is to stop using debit cards, which while technically promise to reverse all fraudulent charges, are much scarier in that regard than credit cards.
posted by acidic at 8:39 AM on March 13, 2017 [17 favorites]
My personal 2 cents is that this stage was weird:
My husband told her that was a good start but that they needed to do more to help us figure out what happened - is the card here, is it gone, what? Plus, we wanted a written assurance that the restaurant would be liable for any charges to the card between when it was taken from us and when we cancelled.
I mean, what did your husband really expect? They lost your card, end of story. All you had to do at this point was call your debit card company, ask them to cancel the card and not authorize any further charges (confirming nothing nefarious had happened in the last 45 minutes), and if you were feeling especially pissed, I guess you could have left a bad Yelp review. Demanding written assurance etc seems pretty weird to me.
I'm just saying this to give you a sense of how someone else might perceive the situation.
posted by latkes at 8:41 AM on March 13, 2017 [5 favorites]
My husband told her that was a good start but that they needed to do more to help us figure out what happened - is the card here, is it gone, what? Plus, we wanted a written assurance that the restaurant would be liable for any charges to the card between when it was taken from us and when we cancelled.
I mean, what did your husband really expect? They lost your card, end of story. All you had to do at this point was call your debit card company, ask them to cancel the card and not authorize any further charges (confirming nothing nefarious had happened in the last 45 minutes), and if you were feeling especially pissed, I guess you could have left a bad Yelp review. Demanding written assurance etc seems pretty weird to me.
I'm just saying this to give you a sense of how someone else might perceive the situation.
posted by latkes at 8:41 AM on March 13, 2017 [5 favorites]
I think the second you asked for written assurance about the restaurant being liable, you flagged yourself as a troublemaking patron with unrealistic expectations, and a situation that didn't have to become confrontational, became a giant disaster. There are already rules in place about credit card fraud and consumer liability, and it was unreasonable to ask a random restaurant manager to commit a company she doesn't own to override those rules. (Nor would I expect a general manager to be able to do this, even if they were willing - that's the kind of request that you don't agree to without consultations with lawyers, no one was going to sign off on a letter like that written on the back of a napkin while everyone involved was angry and upset.)
You were understandably panicked and upset, they didn't handle it as well as they could have, your expectations weren't realistic, everything escalated, and it sounds like it was really upsetting for you. I'm sorry that happened to you. I don't think this is a situation where leaving social media reviews about it would provide any useful information to future customers, though. Any restaurant can lose a card, and it sounds as if their response was within the range of normal until things escalated dramatically for reasons that weren't entirely their fault.
If you can just put this bad experience behind you and move on, I would do that. There's nothing further to be gained here, for anyone.
posted by Stacey at 8:43 AM on March 13, 2017 [4 favorites]
You were understandably panicked and upset, they didn't handle it as well as they could have, your expectations weren't realistic, everything escalated, and it sounds like it was really upsetting for you. I'm sorry that happened to you. I don't think this is a situation where leaving social media reviews about it would provide any useful information to future customers, though. Any restaurant can lose a card, and it sounds as if their response was within the range of normal until things escalated dramatically for reasons that weren't entirely their fault.
If you can just put this bad experience behind you and move on, I would do that. There's nothing further to be gained here, for anyone.
posted by Stacey at 8:43 AM on March 13, 2017 [4 favorites]
My husband told her that was a good start but that they needed to do more to help us figure out what happened - is the card here, is it gone, what? Plus, we wanted a written assurance that the restaurant would be liable for any charges to the card between when it was taken from us and when we cancelled.
Agreed that this is where everything went off the rails and that you and your husband were being unreasonable and unnecessarily difficult. If the card was truly lost, how on earth would they help you figure out what happened? I mean, the very definition of "we lost it," implies they don't know what happened to it.
And the thing about wanting written assurance is way too far. Maybe you were scared and didn't know how your debit card works in terms of fraudulent charges or forgot in the moment? Because I agree with the above poster that almost all banks won't put you on the hook for fraudulent charges. I guess if you didn't know that about your bank, this question might sort of make sense, but it still isn't something any manager can agree to do.
On preview, what Stacey said.
If you want to leave a review, the review should start with an apology to the managers and servers you interacted with that day.
posted by purple_bird at 9:12 AM on March 13, 2017 [6 favorites]
Agreed that this is where everything went off the rails and that you and your husband were being unreasonable and unnecessarily difficult. If the card was truly lost, how on earth would they help you figure out what happened? I mean, the very definition of "we lost it," implies they don't know what happened to it.
And the thing about wanting written assurance is way too far. Maybe you were scared and didn't know how your debit card works in terms of fraudulent charges or forgot in the moment? Because I agree with the above poster that almost all banks won't put you on the hook for fraudulent charges. I guess if you didn't know that about your bank, this question might sort of make sense, but it still isn't something any manager can agree to do.
On preview, what Stacey said.
If you want to leave a review, the review should start with an apology to the managers and servers you interacted with that day.
posted by purple_bird at 9:12 AM on March 13, 2017 [6 favorites]
but what should we have expected?
An effort to search for the card, which you got, and a comped meal, which you got.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 9:49 AM on March 13, 2017 [29 favorites]
An effort to search for the card, which you got, and a comped meal, which you got.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 9:49 AM on March 13, 2017 [29 favorites]
If you are using a card to pay, then you should have known how cards work.
You're not liable in the US for fraudulent purchases in most cases, especially in a situation like this where you can identify the time, place, and person you handed your card to where it immediately went missing. Asking what you asked was silly, unnecessary, and beyond what the restaurant was responsible for. They handled the whole thing shite and should have immediately directed you to clarify the policies of your card with bank customer service.
This is why I use an Amex and not a bank card connected to my bank accounts. Once a server at a restaurant copied my card number and used it for expensive international phone calls. Your number can get used even if you get the physical card back, just FYI.
posted by jbenben at 10:16 AM on March 13, 2017
You're not liable in the US for fraudulent purchases in most cases, especially in a situation like this where you can identify the time, place, and person you handed your card to where it immediately went missing. Asking what you asked was silly, unnecessary, and beyond what the restaurant was responsible for. They handled the whole thing shite and should have immediately directed you to clarify the policies of your card with bank customer service.
This is why I use an Amex and not a bank card connected to my bank accounts. Once a server at a restaurant copied my card number and used it for expensive international phone calls. Your number can get used even if you get the physical card back, just FYI.
posted by jbenben at 10:16 AM on March 13, 2017
Just as a data point: It's not all that unusual for a busy restaurant to lose a patron's card between the table and the place where they run the card. It happened to me a few weeks ago at a fancy-ish, non-touristy restaurant that I frequent often: the server was in a hurry because the place was very busy, and when he picked up the billfold thing they leave the bill in, the card fell out. We had a few moments of panic and then he found the card on the floor not too far from the table.
I'd bet folding money that's what happened here, so to the manager, who's probably seen that play out a few times, your insistence that someone had stolen the card and used it illicitly in the short time it was missing probably seemed pretty overwrought. And yes, respectfully, your reaction was pretty out of line; you can't reasonably ask a restaurant manager to put in writing that her employer will be on the hook for unauthorized charges on a customer's card. That's simply an unreasonable request.
posted by holborne at 10:17 AM on March 13, 2017 [4 favorites]
I'd bet folding money that's what happened here, so to the manager, who's probably seen that play out a few times, your insistence that someone had stolen the card and used it illicitly in the short time it was missing probably seemed pretty overwrought. And yes, respectfully, your reaction was pretty out of line; you can't reasonably ask a restaurant manager to put in writing that her employer will be on the hook for unauthorized charges on a customer's card. That's simply an unreasonable request.
posted by holborne at 10:17 AM on March 13, 2017 [4 favorites]
At that point, she flew off the handle and started yelling about how I could I possibly think they stole my card, and don't I trust them? I told her that of course I don't - nothing in our interactions so far inspired any trust and I also told her that of course I meant that another customer (who may not be trustworthy) might have walked out with it.
(emphasis added)
For future reference, telling somebody to their face "I don't trust you" is almost guaranteed to go badly.
It's easy to get caught up in the emotion of wanting the other person to admit they did something wrong and apologize or correct it or whatever. You need to decide what's more important to you: "scoring" verbally and pushing for an acknowledgement of wrongdoing, or resolving the situation. Saying "no, I don't trust you" is confrontational and likely to make the other person dig in their heels and become even less willing to work with you. Trying to position it as you're both working to solve the problem, perhaps by saying something like "oh, no, of course I trust you! I was worried that one of the other customers might have picked it up!" can be a lot more productive.
posted by Lexica at 10:29 AM on March 13, 2017 [6 favorites]
(emphasis added)
For future reference, telling somebody to their face "I don't trust you" is almost guaranteed to go badly.
It's easy to get caught up in the emotion of wanting the other person to admit they did something wrong and apologize or correct it or whatever. You need to decide what's more important to you: "scoring" verbally and pushing for an acknowledgement of wrongdoing, or resolving the situation. Saying "no, I don't trust you" is confrontational and likely to make the other person dig in their heels and become even less willing to work with you. Trying to position it as you're both working to solve the problem, perhaps by saying something like "oh, no, of course I trust you! I was worried that one of the other customers might have picked it up!" can be a lot more productive.
posted by Lexica at 10:29 AM on March 13, 2017 [6 favorites]
What the restaurant should have done:
A good faith effort to locate the card, a comped meal, and a sincere apology. It sounds like you got 2 of the 3, but they really fell down on the apology part of things. If you want to write a bad Yelp review, that is what I would focus on -- that they didn't seem to care or express any apology for what had occurred.
As they are not private investigators, I would not expect them to actually find the card or figure out what happened -- obviously that would be ideal, but is likely not realistic. Definitely they should not have offered to cover future fraudulent charges because that is not how credit/debit cards work.
What you should have done:
Resolved all of this more quickly (which I think you know), and without over the top escalation. It is beyond bizarre to demand the restaurant cover charges made to the card -- this is simply not how stolen cards work! I would have called to cancel the card immediately, and then let that be that. I do not think I have EVER heard of someone filing a police report (!) over a lost credit/debit card. Maybe if you know for sure that someone intentionally stole your wallet, but something like this where the most likely scenario is that it ended up at the wrong table or behind a counter? Perhaps it's because I've always lived in big cities, but it just seems like police have better things to do with their time. Report it to the company, and they will go through their process, and it will get resolved.
For future reference, it's often wise to use a credit card in these sorts of situations, since sorting things out is easier in the case of a lost/stolen card. It's a little hard to tell from your description, but it sounds like part of what was stressing you out was future travel and maybe you didn't have alternate ways to pay for that? This is definitely a good lesson in always having back-up cards, especially when travelling. You don't have to use them every month -- mine is tucked away and I literally never charge anything to it, but it's there in case something happened and I needed emergency funds. Get a no-fee card for this, so you're not paying for the peace of mind.
posted by rainbowbrite at 10:36 AM on March 13, 2017 [6 favorites]
A good faith effort to locate the card, a comped meal, and a sincere apology. It sounds like you got 2 of the 3, but they really fell down on the apology part of things. If you want to write a bad Yelp review, that is what I would focus on -- that they didn't seem to care or express any apology for what had occurred.
As they are not private investigators, I would not expect them to actually find the card or figure out what happened -- obviously that would be ideal, but is likely not realistic. Definitely they should not have offered to cover future fraudulent charges because that is not how credit/debit cards work.
What you should have done:
Resolved all of this more quickly (which I think you know), and without over the top escalation. It is beyond bizarre to demand the restaurant cover charges made to the card -- this is simply not how stolen cards work! I would have called to cancel the card immediately, and then let that be that. I do not think I have EVER heard of someone filing a police report (!) over a lost credit/debit card. Maybe if you know for sure that someone intentionally stole your wallet, but something like this where the most likely scenario is that it ended up at the wrong table or behind a counter? Perhaps it's because I've always lived in big cities, but it just seems like police have better things to do with their time. Report it to the company, and they will go through their process, and it will get resolved.
For future reference, it's often wise to use a credit card in these sorts of situations, since sorting things out is easier in the case of a lost/stolen card. It's a little hard to tell from your description, but it sounds like part of what was stressing you out was future travel and maybe you didn't have alternate ways to pay for that? This is definitely a good lesson in always having back-up cards, especially when travelling. You don't have to use them every month -- mine is tucked away and I literally never charge anything to it, but it's there in case something happened and I needed emergency funds. Get a no-fee card for this, so you're not paying for the peace of mind.
posted by rainbowbrite at 10:36 AM on March 13, 2017 [6 favorites]
I do think it's strange the server and the manager insisted the card was lost and asked you not to cancel it. That does sound like it confused you and delayed a resolution. But from the server's point of view, I think you're missing any empathy at all from their perspective. Have you ever worked in food service? It can be very stressful and customers try to scam restaurants all the time. From their point of view, they may have thought you were trying to scam them for a free meal (or more when you mentioned future charges on the bill). It's really common for customers to casually demand a server be fired for poor service. They may have felt their jobs were at stake and became overly defensive. You brought up calling the police to the manager. Do you know how many undocumented workers work in restaurants? These are the kind of issues the manager may have been considering. I get that you were stressed from travel and having to call your bank, but that's a much lower stress than the workers could be facing. Again, I think they shouldn't have initially told you not to cancel the card. But I think that mistake was intended to diffuse the situation, even if it was a mistake. Your actions - mentioning police, saying you didn't trust her, asking for more info about where the card was, escalated the stress. Also, consider from the manager's point of view that you had remained at the table for more than an hour, were demanding recourse she simply could not offer, and did not "go outside" when she suggested you do so. That's why she asked the police to escort you out, because how else were you going to leave?
posted by areaperson at 11:42 AM on March 13, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by areaperson at 11:42 AM on March 13, 2017 [8 favorites]
Former restaurant server, current "I only log onto Metafilter to tell people how to behave in restaurants"-er:
I'm not sure that the restaurant handled this perfectly, but you overreacted and made things a lot worse.
I was a good server, and I only almost lost someone's card once. I found it on the floor after a panicky twenty minutes of searching. I was not maliciously trying to steal some dude's Amex - I just had a four checks in my hand and managed to drop one.
When out drinking with a friend, I had a bar give my debit card to the wrong person (who brought it back), and I was significantly nicer and less of a drama llama about it than you were here.
Also, if I had a nickel for the number of times a table has accused me of stealing something that I did not steal, I'd be able to buy myself a really fancy cup of coffee.
She told us that cards fall behind the cash register - they'd look, don't cancel yet. That seemed odd - we were told it was taken by another wait person. We figured it had already walked out of the restaurant.
They were trying to help you find your card by looking in trash cans, and instead of appreciating the fact that they're trying to find your card, you're immediately suspicious.
She did NOT apologize, she was very defensive, and she did say that she would comp our meal, as if that was a huge gift and she was put out to even do that.
Some managers don't have the best people skills, and she might have been unpleasant for you to deal with. Sorry. But she comped your meal. That is an apology, but not an admission of guilt, because you guys were already being difficult and she didn't want to open herself up to more trouble. I'm not going to argue with you that she wasn't being defensive or combative - I wasn't there.
Plus, we wanted a written assurance that the restaurant would be liable for any charges to the card between when it was taken from us and when we cancelled.
That's completely unreasonable, for reasons other Mefites have explained better.
I told her that of course I don't - nothing in our interactions so far inspired any trust and I also told her that of course I meant that another customer (who may not be trustworthy) might have walked out with it.
And then you made the whole much, much worse.
When I've dealt with customers like this in the past, a comment like the one I just quoted would have taken you from someone I cared about leaving with a positive impression to someone who I wanted to just get the fuck out and never come back. You don't get to act like a customer service nightmare and expect to get excellent customer service.
She called the police (we thought to file a report) and then asked if we wanted to go outside to talk with them. We said no, because we wanted the police to see the whole situation.
Jeeze Louise. We're talking about a lost - almost certainly not stolen - debit card, and you've decided to go all Law and Order and make the police see the scene of the crime. I would not have bothered filing a police report in the first place - that strikes me as a bit hysterical and over the top - but I guess you were within you're legal rights to do so.
You were absolutely, a hundred percent right to cancel the card. I'm not sure why the restaurant argued with you on that point. Just cancel the card, leave the restaurant, and move on. No need to engage further. Where you acted like a pair of unreasonable, difficult people was playing amateur detective with the staff and demanding that the restaurant assume full financial liability. The restaurant could've handled this more gracefully, but you escalated this situation and made it much worse.
The restaurant comped your meal and made what sounds like a good faith effort to find your card. That's all that you can reasonably expect.
posted by ablazingsaddle at 2:43 PM on March 13, 2017 [12 favorites]
I'm not sure that the restaurant handled this perfectly, but you overreacted and made things a lot worse.
I was a good server, and I only almost lost someone's card once. I found it on the floor after a panicky twenty minutes of searching. I was not maliciously trying to steal some dude's Amex - I just had a four checks in my hand and managed to drop one.
When out drinking with a friend, I had a bar give my debit card to the wrong person (who brought it back), and I was significantly nicer and less of a drama llama about it than you were here.
Also, if I had a nickel for the number of times a table has accused me of stealing something that I did not steal, I'd be able to buy myself a really fancy cup of coffee.
She told us that cards fall behind the cash register - they'd look, don't cancel yet. That seemed odd - we were told it was taken by another wait person. We figured it had already walked out of the restaurant.
They were trying to help you find your card by looking in trash cans, and instead of appreciating the fact that they're trying to find your card, you're immediately suspicious.
She did NOT apologize, she was very defensive, and she did say that she would comp our meal, as if that was a huge gift and she was put out to even do that.
Some managers don't have the best people skills, and she might have been unpleasant for you to deal with. Sorry. But she comped your meal. That is an apology, but not an admission of guilt, because you guys were already being difficult and she didn't want to open herself up to more trouble. I'm not going to argue with you that she wasn't being defensive or combative - I wasn't there.
Plus, we wanted a written assurance that the restaurant would be liable for any charges to the card between when it was taken from us and when we cancelled.
That's completely unreasonable, for reasons other Mefites have explained better.
I told her that of course I don't - nothing in our interactions so far inspired any trust and I also told her that of course I meant that another customer (who may not be trustworthy) might have walked out with it.
And then you made the whole much, much worse.
When I've dealt with customers like this in the past, a comment like the one I just quoted would have taken you from someone I cared about leaving with a positive impression to someone who I wanted to just get the fuck out and never come back. You don't get to act like a customer service nightmare and expect to get excellent customer service.
She called the police (we thought to file a report) and then asked if we wanted to go outside to talk with them. We said no, because we wanted the police to see the whole situation.
Jeeze Louise. We're talking about a lost - almost certainly not stolen - debit card, and you've decided to go all Law and Order and make the police see the scene of the crime. I would not have bothered filing a police report in the first place - that strikes me as a bit hysterical and over the top - but I guess you were within you're legal rights to do so.
You were absolutely, a hundred percent right to cancel the card. I'm not sure why the restaurant argued with you on that point. Just cancel the card, leave the restaurant, and move on. No need to engage further. Where you acted like a pair of unreasonable, difficult people was playing amateur detective with the staff and demanding that the restaurant assume full financial liability. The restaurant could've handled this more gracefully, but you escalated this situation and made it much worse.
The restaurant comped your meal and made what sounds like a good faith effort to find your card. That's all that you can reasonably expect.
posted by ablazingsaddle at 2:43 PM on March 13, 2017 [12 favorites]
I do think that 20 minutes was too long between first taking your card and telling you it was missing, but I agree that you overreacted. I just wanted to add this:
She returned while my husband was calling the bank, so I also asked about filing a police report in case it was stolen. At that point, she flew off the handle
I could see how someone in an industry that is so dependent on undocumented workers might not be happy about someone bringing the cops around for no reason whatsoever.
posted by Room 641-A at 3:12 PM on March 13, 2017 [2 favorites]
She returned while my husband was calling the bank, so I also asked about filing a police report in case it was stolen. At that point, she flew off the handle
I could see how someone in an industry that is so dependent on undocumented workers might not be happy about someone bringing the cops around for no reason whatsoever.
posted by Room 641-A at 3:12 PM on March 13, 2017 [2 favorites]
Honestly, I don't even think the restaurant saying not to cancel yet is that weird. My read on that is that they were trying to save you some hassle. Having a card get canceled and be replaced is a pain in the butt. If they thought there was a chance they could find it, I could easily see them saying "hey, don't cancel just yet, let us have a few more minutes to try to find it before you put yourself through all that."
And I really want to nth the people who are recommending using a credit card rather than a debit card. It is true that you're not liable for fraudulent charges, but in the time period between when a charge is made and you notice, notify the bank, and have them reverse it, checks can bounce, ATM withdrawals can fail, and other much more frustrating and potentially costly things can happen. I personally use my debit card solely at ATMs, and I try very hard to stick to ATMs inside of bank branches when I can.
posted by primethyme at 4:28 PM on March 13, 2017 [5 favorites]
And I really want to nth the people who are recommending using a credit card rather than a debit card. It is true that you're not liable for fraudulent charges, but in the time period between when a charge is made and you notice, notify the bank, and have them reverse it, checks can bounce, ATM withdrawals can fail, and other much more frustrating and potentially costly things can happen. I personally use my debit card solely at ATMs, and I try very hard to stick to ATMs inside of bank branches when I can.
posted by primethyme at 4:28 PM on March 13, 2017 [5 favorites]
I'm going to differ from the crowd and take your side. I don't think you overreacted, you were livid and I would have been too. Does it make us customer service nightmares? Perhaps, but I don't think it makes you in the wrong. I've never had my card lost at a restaurant and I eat out a lot. If my card went missing at a restaurant, I'd totally think it was stolen, hands down and may have called the police myself. Also, I don't think the onus is on you be concerned about the documentation status of the workers and thus refrain from calling the police. There could be any number of situations that calls for police at any given time, a restaurant with undocumented workers is always at risk but that risk is not on you. I don't even think you were wrong when you said you didn't trust them. Why would you? At best they were negligent, at worst deceitful and neither trait is desirable. The most important thing to take away from this interaction is cancel your card quicker next time and perhaps don't tell th.your calling the police. Simply file a report and handle it outside the restaurant.
posted by CosmicSeeker42 at 5:50 PM on March 13, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by CosmicSeeker42 at 5:50 PM on March 13, 2017 [3 favorites]
But, look, she was being "hysterical" because you were being a classic day-ruining, disruptive, impossible customer.
Sorry, I can't agree with this. There's something called "customer service" Apparently the manager doesn't know what that involves. The people having a ruined day were the customers, not the manager.
I'm going to differ from the crowd and take your side. I don't think you overreacted, you were livid and I would have been too
Me, too! You were not the one at fault here.
First of all, the assistant manager should have come TO YOU after the first ten minutes to explain what happened with the card and give assurance that they were looking for it.
...45 minutes...(We were still sitting there, the table had not been cleared, no further info from anyone)
They can't be bothered to clear the table and offer you coffee or bother to update you on what's going on? That's BS.
the manager in charge... flew off the handle and started yelling about how I could I possibly think they stole my card, and don't I trust them?
...she did say that she would comp our meal, as if that was a huge gift and she was put out to even do that.
She insisted that it was still in the restaurant, and wouldn't we feel ashamed when she called at 10:30 that night with the card.
She called the police to escort you out? WTF??? The police ...had a completely different version from the manager. As she was the hysterical one and we were calm, the officer listened to us.
Really? And people on this site are insisting that you were at fault?
No, this is absolutely a piss poor manager. Being an ass about comping the meal? Yelling at a customer? Asking about trust? Insisting the card was there when she had absolutely no idea where it was? Telling a customer they will be ashamed when the card was found? Hogwash. Insisting that the customer leave the restaurant before the situation is resolved? Lying to the police about the situation?
Your table should have been cleared, and a good manager should have been proactive in coming to the table to explain the situation and detail what they were doing, offering an apology while doing so. You should have been offered coffee at a minimum, and a free desert if they were acting on good will at that point. After 20-25 minutes, she should have explained graciously that they were comping your meal, you were welcome to use their phone to call and cancel your card, and they restaurant was very apologetic about the hassle. Since you were wanting to file a police report, you should have been offered more coffee, welcomed to stay, and the manager should have sat with you and the police at your table to discuss what had transpired.
Another apology, and heck, even the offer of a gift certificate for another meal might have guaranteed them a repeat customer, or at least a good review or word of mouth reference.
No, there's no business that will give you some sort of written guarantee that they'd cover the card if stolen, but she should have encouraged you to talk to your bank about the card first, and that would have reassured you that your personal liability was covered.
IDK. You might have been loud, rude, disruptive, hysterical, overbearing, and impossible to please. I wasn't there.
But it sure sounds like the manager did an absolutely piss-poor job of managing.
posted by BlueHorse at 8:19 PM on March 13, 2017 [4 favorites]
Sorry, I can't agree with this. There's something called "customer service" Apparently the manager doesn't know what that involves. The people having a ruined day were the customers, not the manager.
I'm going to differ from the crowd and take your side. I don't think you overreacted, you were livid and I would have been too
Me, too! You were not the one at fault here.
First of all, the assistant manager should have come TO YOU after the first ten minutes to explain what happened with the card and give assurance that they were looking for it.
...45 minutes...(We were still sitting there, the table had not been cleared, no further info from anyone)
They can't be bothered to clear the table and offer you coffee or bother to update you on what's going on? That's BS.
the manager in charge... flew off the handle and started yelling about how I could I possibly think they stole my card, and don't I trust them?
...she did say that she would comp our meal, as if that was a huge gift and she was put out to even do that.
She insisted that it was still in the restaurant, and wouldn't we feel ashamed when she called at 10:30 that night with the card.
She called the police to escort you out? WTF??? The police ...had a completely different version from the manager. As she was the hysterical one and we were calm, the officer listened to us.
Really? And people on this site are insisting that you were at fault?
No, this is absolutely a piss poor manager. Being an ass about comping the meal? Yelling at a customer? Asking about trust? Insisting the card was there when she had absolutely no idea where it was? Telling a customer they will be ashamed when the card was found? Hogwash. Insisting that the customer leave the restaurant before the situation is resolved? Lying to the police about the situation?
Your table should have been cleared, and a good manager should have been proactive in coming to the table to explain the situation and detail what they were doing, offering an apology while doing so. You should have been offered coffee at a minimum, and a free desert if they were acting on good will at that point. After 20-25 minutes, she should have explained graciously that they were comping your meal, you were welcome to use their phone to call and cancel your card, and they restaurant was very apologetic about the hassle. Since you were wanting to file a police report, you should have been offered more coffee, welcomed to stay, and the manager should have sat with you and the police at your table to discuss what had transpired.
Another apology, and heck, even the offer of a gift certificate for another meal might have guaranteed them a repeat customer, or at least a good review or word of mouth reference.
No, there's no business that will give you some sort of written guarantee that they'd cover the card if stolen, but she should have encouraged you to talk to your bank about the card first, and that would have reassured you that your personal liability was covered.
IDK. You might have been loud, rude, disruptive, hysterical, overbearing, and impossible to please. I wasn't there.
But it sure sounds like the manager did an absolutely piss-poor job of managing.
posted by BlueHorse at 8:19 PM on March 13, 2017 [4 favorites]
I'll respond to the last few comments... the manager should have stepped in earlier to diffuse the situation. That was customer service failure, but the SECOND liability comes up (for any reason, slip and fall etc) customer service is DONE. You are no longer an unhappy customer, you are a risk. I want you out as soon as possible, without any further interaction with my staff or other guests. Ideally you will also NEVER come back. I am no longer going to apologize (that's admitting fault), and I'm not offering further compensation (opens me up to future liability). I'd instruct my staff to stay away from you, which is why your table was not cleared, as they might say something stupid and set you off again.
As a customer service manager in a tourist joint I know my local cops, paramedics and firefighters. I've called them many times over the years and they've always had my back when the angry drunks got violent, crazy people try to start fires in the bathroom, choke at the table, slip and break their leg or the 200+ other reasons that they've been there. They are going to "Yes ma'am, so sorry ma'am, that's terrible ma'am" you right out the door. We all know what it means to live/work in a tourist town.
Here's my A+, solid gold, certified advice to get you the customer service that you want and deserve... BE THE GUEST THEY WANT TO HELP! Stuff goes wrong, people who should know better make mistakes. When the server told you that your card was missing, if you had responded to them like you would a team mate who missed the goal, "Oh man, that's too bad. I can imagine that it happens from time to time what with so many people coming and going. Tonight's dinner rush was extra crazy!! What normally happens in this situation? What should WE do here?" You would have had a totally different experience. Being all in it together means everyone would have eagerly looked for it. The manager would have made it a point to talk to every server. They would have cheerfully comped your meal, brought out several desserts and coffee for you to enjoy while you wait without asking. I suspect that they would have found in under the table 2 over from yours where your server dropped it while juggling drink refills but if they didn't they would have apologized for the terrible inconvience. Suggested that your cancel your card, take your name and number just so that the manager could follow up as soon as they found out what happened because you'd want to know. They would also likely offer you a gift card to come back. On your next visit, I'd remember you. I'd have the same waiter serve you. I'd come over, thank you for coming back, apologize again for what happened. You, because your are an awesome customer would say "No worries, you took such good care of us last time, maybe you should lose our card every visit!" We'd all laugh! Your meal would be great (or as good as tourist food can be) and everytime you came back we'd chat like old friends. You guys are now valued regulars even if you only come in once a year. Also, we always have a table for you - no 45 min-here's-a-pager for you.
That's what being an amazing customer looks like. Pretty great, eh?!?
Make me want to help you. Make me like you. Recognize that we are all on "Team Dinner" together and we each have our positions to play!
posted by saradarlin at 9:08 PM on March 13, 2017 [8 favorites]
As a customer service manager in a tourist joint I know my local cops, paramedics and firefighters. I've called them many times over the years and they've always had my back when the angry drunks got violent, crazy people try to start fires in the bathroom, choke at the table, slip and break their leg or the 200+ other reasons that they've been there. They are going to "Yes ma'am, so sorry ma'am, that's terrible ma'am" you right out the door. We all know what it means to live/work in a tourist town.
Here's my A+, solid gold, certified advice to get you the customer service that you want and deserve... BE THE GUEST THEY WANT TO HELP! Stuff goes wrong, people who should know better make mistakes. When the server told you that your card was missing, if you had responded to them like you would a team mate who missed the goal, "Oh man, that's too bad. I can imagine that it happens from time to time what with so many people coming and going. Tonight's dinner rush was extra crazy!! What normally happens in this situation? What should WE do here?" You would have had a totally different experience. Being all in it together means everyone would have eagerly looked for it. The manager would have made it a point to talk to every server. They would have cheerfully comped your meal, brought out several desserts and coffee for you to enjoy while you wait without asking. I suspect that they would have found in under the table 2 over from yours where your server dropped it while juggling drink refills but if they didn't they would have apologized for the terrible inconvience. Suggested that your cancel your card, take your name and number just so that the manager could follow up as soon as they found out what happened because you'd want to know. They would also likely offer you a gift card to come back. On your next visit, I'd remember you. I'd have the same waiter serve you. I'd come over, thank you for coming back, apologize again for what happened. You, because your are an awesome customer would say "No worries, you took such good care of us last time, maybe you should lose our card every visit!" We'd all laugh! Your meal would be great (or as good as tourist food can be) and everytime you came back we'd chat like old friends. You guys are now valued regulars even if you only come in once a year. Also, we always have a table for you - no 45 min-here's-a-pager for you.
That's what being an amazing customer looks like. Pretty great, eh?!?
Make me want to help you. Make me like you. Recognize that we are all on "Team Dinner" together and we each have our positions to play!
posted by saradarlin at 9:08 PM on March 13, 2017 [8 favorites]
They can't be bothered to clear the table and offer you coffee or bother to update you on what's going on? That's BS.
Just to show how every little thing can be misconstrued: If they had cleared the table, you might have felt rushed. A lot of people freak out if you clear their table and they're not ready to leave.
posted by ablazingsaddle at 10:43 PM on March 13, 2017 [7 favorites]
Just to show how every little thing can be misconstrued: If they had cleared the table, you might have felt rushed. A lot of people freak out if you clear their table and they're not ready to leave.
posted by ablazingsaddle at 10:43 PM on March 13, 2017 [7 favorites]
The restaurant comped your meal and made what sounds like a good faith effort to find your card. That's all that you can reasonably expect.
I saw that sentiment in a few answers, and I disagree. I think the manager should have apologized. If you lose someone else's stuff, you apologize. That's just basic good manners even in situations that don't involve customer service.
I think you and your husband did make unreasonable demands and that's what led to the unpleasant end to the incident, but that doesn't change the fact that the manager never apologized during her first conversation with you.
posted by Alluring Mouthbreather at 7:58 AM on March 14, 2017
I saw that sentiment in a few answers, and I disagree. I think the manager should have apologized. If you lose someone else's stuff, you apologize. That's just basic good manners even in situations that don't involve customer service.
I think you and your husband did make unreasonable demands and that's what led to the unpleasant end to the incident, but that doesn't change the fact that the manager never apologized during her first conversation with you.
posted by Alluring Mouthbreather at 7:58 AM on March 14, 2017
Make me want to help you. Make me like you.
What? This reads exactly like a tone argument: "I'll do my job, but only if I like you and you suck up to me."
"Oh man, that's too bad. I can imagine that it happens from time to time what with so many people coming and going. Tonight's dinner rush was extra crazy!! What normally happens in this situation? What should WE do here?"
If my debit card was lost/stolen/whatever, I would NOT react like this. It's a stressful situation FOR THEM. No one is going to say "wow, yeah, that's too bad" about a lost debit card, whether they're liable for fraudulent transactions or not. Sure, shit happens, but the onus is not on the customer to react in your approved way or to make you like them.
posted by altopower at 10:29 AM on March 14, 2017 [8 favorites]
What? This reads exactly like a tone argument: "I'll do my job, but only if I like you and you suck up to me."
"Oh man, that's too bad. I can imagine that it happens from time to time what with so many people coming and going. Tonight's dinner rush was extra crazy!! What normally happens in this situation? What should WE do here?"
If my debit card was lost/stolen/whatever, I would NOT react like this. It's a stressful situation FOR THEM. No one is going to say "wow, yeah, that's too bad" about a lost debit card, whether they're liable for fraudulent transactions or not. Sure, shit happens, but the onus is not on the customer to react in your approved way or to make you like them.
posted by altopower at 10:29 AM on March 14, 2017 [8 favorites]
I'll also add that no one seems to have considered you're financial situation. it's possible that was you're only form of payment and you didn't have any of your home banks nearby. Or that you had bills to pay the next day etc. The restaurant may be worried about liability but so were you. Also, in what world does someone lose or damage something related to your finances and your supposed to just be ok with that? I also suspect that the fact they didn't apologize only escalated the situation, apologizing is customer service 101, especially when you're in the wrong.
posted by CosmicSeeker42 at 1:35 PM on March 14, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by CosmicSeeker42 at 1:35 PM on March 14, 2017 [4 favorites]
A lot of people freak out if you clear their table and they're not ready to leave.
I guess we just have good places to eat in the valley, because part of their service is to clear the table, and they do it to make you comfortable and make you feel like you're not being rushed out. I'd think it was poor service if they didn't clear the table of empty dishes and debris before they brought the bill!
Good waitpersons and managers can say to their customers, "How about if I clear your table and give you some room here? Can I get you some dessert or coffee? Let me know when you're ready for your bill."
Caring about the customer and treating them as a valued guest, rather than a commodity to be exploited, makes a big difference.
Sounds like Mr. and Mrs. Banjonaut felt they were devalued and portrayed as being in the wrong, when they did nothing to deserve such treatment.
posted by BlueHorse at 7:49 PM on March 14, 2017 [2 favorites]
I guess we just have good places to eat in the valley, because part of their service is to clear the table, and they do it to make you comfortable and make you feel like you're not being rushed out. I'd think it was poor service if they didn't clear the table of empty dishes and debris before they brought the bill!
Good waitpersons and managers can say to their customers, "How about if I clear your table and give you some room here? Can I get you some dessert or coffee? Let me know when you're ready for your bill."
Caring about the customer and treating them as a valued guest, rather than a commodity to be exploited, makes a big difference.
Sounds like Mr. and Mrs. Banjonaut felt they were devalued and portrayed as being in the wrong, when they did nothing to deserve such treatment.
posted by BlueHorse at 7:49 PM on March 14, 2017 [2 favorites]
When the server told you that your card was missing, if you had responded to them like you would a team mate who missed the goal
I'm pretty sure the appropriate analogy here is a team mate who kicked the ball directly into your face from a few yards away, and the least you can expect is a huge apology and recognition that this was their fuck up and it is not a normal expected part of the event.
posted by the agents of KAOS at 10:12 PM on March 14, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'm pretty sure the appropriate analogy here is a team mate who kicked the ball directly into your face from a few yards away, and the least you can expect is a huge apology and recognition that this was their fuck up and it is not a normal expected part of the event.
posted by the agents of KAOS at 10:12 PM on March 14, 2017 [3 favorites]
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posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:48 AM on March 13, 2017 [33 favorites]