Quit my job for an other job? the expat coming home edition
July 7, 2015 8:09 AM Subscribe
I have been working as an architect for an international company in China for 14 months now.
My previous boss has just asked me to come back to my home country to give me back my job.
Should I accept?
The question cannot be reduced to if i like China or not, because I love Beijing and anyway I am by nature pretty cool with wherever I end up. I do not miss my home, just my family and friends.
I have been working as an architect for this international company for 14 months, i have 2 months ago signed a new contract till the end of 2016. I do not plan to stay that long in any case, just till the end of what I am working on.
I am not terribly happy with the work I do at the moment and that I will do for the most part of the foreseeable future, it is pure management. I do not have a lot of experience in it, I am not a political animal and I often feel I am not doing enough, but I do not know how to do more. This may be compounded by a bit of imposter syndrome. I am learning a lot, but I am quite sure I have no wish to remain in project management.
I work well enough with my team leader, but he will go on to extended leave of absents in the next few months, because of a parent's illness. That leaves me in charge according to management, but with no real power, because I do not have the seniority over my Chinese team members, . I am getting more assertive, but I am not always very good at getting my voice heard. Case and point, hr got me to agree to cutting 6 days off my holidays.
Under my previous boss I was mostly a competition monkey. I did a lot of pure architecture, but not much practical work, so I lacked experience. After 5 years I did feel I was getting to the end of what I could actively learn there.
Despite this I was for the best part happy there, because I liked what we did, because after 5 years I did know how to work with those people and things got done. Things do not get done in China. I know I would not go back to the same environment, as the office has shrunk and moved and I know I memory creates fondness for the past.
I did not quit that job, I was let go because of the economy crash, with the promise that I would be called back, as it has happened. I have never actual quit a job in my life and do not know when is the right moment to do it.
The money offered is more or less the same as I get now, and my old boss would like me back even if he has to wait out my 2 months notice, but the he can only offer me a job for 6 months, prospect after that are good, but nothing is assured.
So metafiles, should I stay in China to finish this project because I am learning and out of loyalty to my team leader, of should I go back to Europe to do a temporary job which I would probably like more and see where the economy will be in 6 months?
How does one choose?
The question cannot be reduced to if i like China or not, because I love Beijing and anyway I am by nature pretty cool with wherever I end up. I do not miss my home, just my family and friends.
I have been working as an architect for this international company for 14 months, i have 2 months ago signed a new contract till the end of 2016. I do not plan to stay that long in any case, just till the end of what I am working on.
I am not terribly happy with the work I do at the moment and that I will do for the most part of the foreseeable future, it is pure management. I do not have a lot of experience in it, I am not a political animal and I often feel I am not doing enough, but I do not know how to do more. This may be compounded by a bit of imposter syndrome. I am learning a lot, but I am quite sure I have no wish to remain in project management.
I work well enough with my team leader, but he will go on to extended leave of absents in the next few months, because of a parent's illness. That leaves me in charge according to management, but with no real power, because I do not have the seniority over my Chinese team members, . I am getting more assertive, but I am not always very good at getting my voice heard. Case and point, hr got me to agree to cutting 6 days off my holidays.
Under my previous boss I was mostly a competition monkey. I did a lot of pure architecture, but not much practical work, so I lacked experience. After 5 years I did feel I was getting to the end of what I could actively learn there.
Despite this I was for the best part happy there, because I liked what we did, because after 5 years I did know how to work with those people and things got done. Things do not get done in China. I know I would not go back to the same environment, as the office has shrunk and moved and I know I memory creates fondness for the past.
I did not quit that job, I was let go because of the economy crash, with the promise that I would be called back, as it has happened. I have never actual quit a job in my life and do not know when is the right moment to do it.
The money offered is more or less the same as I get now, and my old boss would like me back even if he has to wait out my 2 months notice, but the he can only offer me a job for 6 months, prospect after that are good, but nothing is assured.
So metafiles, should I stay in China to finish this project because I am learning and out of loyalty to my team leader, of should I go back to Europe to do a temporary job which I would probably like more and see where the economy will be in 6 months?
How does one choose?
Anecdotal data point: I did four years abroad and found that international experience to be a HUGE benefit in my job search when I came back to the US. Maybe it wouldn't be precisely the same for you (I work a corporate job for a big multi-national, so the cross-border stuff was attractive to them), but at bare minimum the things you've learned (and will continue to) working in unfamiliar territory will be a terrific point of differentiation for you on the job market if/when you choose to return.
For that reason, I'd stay in China for another year or two and earn that significant expat experience. Do your best to stay industry-current with the US as it relates to things like training, certs and the like, and you'll come back as a more interesting candidate for your next gig than you'd be without that experience.
posted by GamblingBlues at 8:23 AM on July 7, 2015
For that reason, I'd stay in China for another year or two and earn that significant expat experience. Do your best to stay industry-current with the US as it relates to things like training, certs and the like, and you'll come back as a more interesting candidate for your next gig than you'd be without that experience.
posted by GamblingBlues at 8:23 AM on July 7, 2015
The money offered is more or less the same as I get now
Doesn't sound like an amazing job offer to me. I would expect a big salary increase and long-term commitment to make an intercontinental move like that when you have a steady job already, even one you're dissatisfied with.
This goes double for someone who is a known quantity like yourself. They know exactly the high quality of work they can expect from you. For most new hires they will have to guess (and often guess wrong). That's worth a lot.
posted by grouse at 8:27 AM on July 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
Doesn't sound like an amazing job offer to me. I would expect a big salary increase and long-term commitment to make an intercontinental move like that when you have a steady job already, even one you're dissatisfied with.
This goes double for someone who is a known quantity like yourself. They know exactly the high quality of work they can expect from you. For most new hires they will have to guess (and often guess wrong). That's worth a lot.
posted by grouse at 8:27 AM on July 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Need to clarify about the money: unfortunatly the market for architects is bad in my homecountry (not US, southen europe). What I get in China is NOT expat pay, but just above what I would expect to be getting back home.
posted by thegirlwiththehat at 8:41 AM on July 7, 2015
posted by thegirlwiththehat at 8:41 AM on July 7, 2015
Both jobs sound equally unappealing, but I'd lean towards the old job just to be near close friends and family. Having a network of support when you're going through a crappy time can make all the difference. And you don't have to accept your old job on their terms, you know. Negotiate a salary increase and a longer commitment; as grouse wisely pointed out you're a known quantity and would be saving them considerable time, effort, and money. That's a valuable bargaining chip. If it pans out, great! If not, you have nothing to lose because their original offer wasn't worth anything to begin with. Whichever one you choose, spend some of your free time networking for a better job elsewhere.
posted by LuckySeven~ at 10:32 AM on July 7, 2015
posted by LuckySeven~ at 10:32 AM on July 7, 2015
Agreed with LuckySeven and grouse; you're in a position to demand* a significant salary increase and you can make a business case for it. It's not worth your time if you're going to move internationally for a six-month guarantee.
*in the sense of 'firmly request', not 'declare hubristically'
posted by a halcyon day at 11:18 AM on July 7, 2015
*in the sense of 'firmly request', not 'declare hubristically'
posted by a halcyon day at 11:18 AM on July 7, 2015
I'm curious how many folks above actually work in Architecture.
I have worked for the same architectural firm for 16 years now. That makes me something of a rarity. There really isn't job security. If the firm doesn't get the jobs, then what? And getting jobs is intensely political/knowing the right people/hoping the right people don't retire or change positions. When I hired on I made 5 people. We went up to about 18 (which was nuts). 2008 and other bad things happened, we went down to 5 again, all working 24 hours a week.
Now we are back to 10 people, and insanely busy. But all we have guaranteed are the jobs we have contracts on, which is over in about 14 months. This is the way it is unless you work for an institutional firm - e.g., McDonalds, TGIFridays, etc. have their own in-house architectural departments.
I think one of the ways I survived was never asking for a raise. I've gotten plenty, I just don't ask. (I work for some really good people, which helps.) I'll also put in the insane hours that are sometimes needed to get the job out the door, without complaining.
Having a former employer call you back is not common in my experience.
posted by rudd135 at 5:29 PM on July 7, 2015
I have worked for the same architectural firm for 16 years now. That makes me something of a rarity. There really isn't job security. If the firm doesn't get the jobs, then what? And getting jobs is intensely political/knowing the right people/hoping the right people don't retire or change positions. When I hired on I made 5 people. We went up to about 18 (which was nuts). 2008 and other bad things happened, we went down to 5 again, all working 24 hours a week.
Now we are back to 10 people, and insanely busy. But all we have guaranteed are the jobs we have contracts on, which is over in about 14 months. This is the way it is unless you work for an institutional firm - e.g., McDonalds, TGIFridays, etc. have their own in-house architectural departments.
I think one of the ways I survived was never asking for a raise. I've gotten plenty, I just don't ask. (I work for some really good people, which helps.) I'll also put in the insane hours that are sometimes needed to get the job out the door, without complaining.
Having a former employer call you back is not common in my experience.
posted by rudd135 at 5:29 PM on July 7, 2015
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Aranquis at 8:15 AM on July 7, 2015 [5 favorites]