Baby bedtime woes
April 11, 2015 8:17 PM Subscribe
My 4 month old wakes up every 30-45 minutes for three hours after bedtime. Can you help me think of something I haven't tried?
I've read every sleep book out there and I'm still stuck on this one aspect of my son's sleep. I am not opposed to CIO (worked great with my oldest), but I think he's a little too young for it right now (he's just exactly 4 months, and he was a week early. He's 14 pounds and exclusively breastfed.).
I don't mind either helping him get to sleep at bedtime or the 2-3 night nursings we're still doing. But running in there every half hour between his bedtime and mine means I don't get a break to do anything in the evening, like take a long bath or make a phone call or put my oldest to bed uninterrupted. My husband and I tag-team it, but still. This has been going on daily since he was five weeks old, so it's not a four-month-sleep-regression thing.
We have a firm bedtime (7 p.m.) and a solid routine (wipe hands and face, change into pajamas, vitamin drops, say goodnight to sister/daddy, nurse, song).
During the day he naps 4-5 times still; he's never awake for more than 2 hours at a time and he seems tired after 90 minutes usually. His last nap is a catnap of 20-30 minutes around 5 so he's got 90 minutes of awake time before bedtime.
He's swaddled (not yet rolling - but probably will soon), the room is dark, and we've got good white noise going.
One of us generally stays with him until he's asleep or almost there, and that's the part we have to repeat until he finally drops off to his long sleep. I've been trying drowsy-but-awake at naps and bedtime for a few weeks with no luck.
Rarely, he cries out and fusses a bit and then goes back to sleep without help (we always give him a few minutes to make sure it's the real thing). About half the time, he continues screaming even as we rub his head or sing to him, and then he just suddenly stops screaming after 5-20 minutes and goes to sleep. The rest of the time, he calms when we comfort him and slowly falls back to sleep. He doesn't want to nurse and will just bite if I try. If we pick him up or rock him, that's great, but he gets upset upon being transferred back to bed. He does not seem gassy or refluxy, burping doesn't help, and his diaper is still clean and dry. He'll do this every 30-45 minutes until 10 or so.
He usually wakes every three hours for the rest of the night to eat, sometimes will go four or five. I wait a few minutes at each waking to make sure he's actually hungry; occasionally he falls back asleep without needing anything but usually he does want to eat. He eats efficiently and I can leave before he falls asleep again.
I'm sort of stumped. A lot of what I've read says this happens when babies are overtired, but seriously, he doesn't go more than two hours awake ever. I've tried moving bedtime a little earlier, but it's hard - Daddy gets home just after six so that's really exciting, and the toddler can't entertain herself at that time of day, so I need to wait for another parent or we're interrupted constantly. Plus that late afternoon catnap is in the way, but he still seems to need it. I've tried moving bedtime a little later but then I wind up with a fussier baby who has a harder time getting to sleep initially and still wakes up every sleep cycle for a few hours. If we can't fix it in the next two months, we will try CIO, but I don't want to wait that long, or at least I'd like to try some more things in the meantime. (Two months was picked because he'll be six months old, and we will be traveling at the beginning of June so we'd do it once we got home.) Also, the screaming-while-being-comforted thing makes me nervous that CIO won't work right now.
Help?
I've read every sleep book out there and I'm still stuck on this one aspect of my son's sleep. I am not opposed to CIO (worked great with my oldest), but I think he's a little too young for it right now (he's just exactly 4 months, and he was a week early. He's 14 pounds and exclusively breastfed.).
I don't mind either helping him get to sleep at bedtime or the 2-3 night nursings we're still doing. But running in there every half hour between his bedtime and mine means I don't get a break to do anything in the evening, like take a long bath or make a phone call or put my oldest to bed uninterrupted. My husband and I tag-team it, but still. This has been going on daily since he was five weeks old, so it's not a four-month-sleep-regression thing.
We have a firm bedtime (7 p.m.) and a solid routine (wipe hands and face, change into pajamas, vitamin drops, say goodnight to sister/daddy, nurse, song).
During the day he naps 4-5 times still; he's never awake for more than 2 hours at a time and he seems tired after 90 minutes usually. His last nap is a catnap of 20-30 minutes around 5 so he's got 90 minutes of awake time before bedtime.
He's swaddled (not yet rolling - but probably will soon), the room is dark, and we've got good white noise going.
One of us generally stays with him until he's asleep or almost there, and that's the part we have to repeat until he finally drops off to his long sleep. I've been trying drowsy-but-awake at naps and bedtime for a few weeks with no luck.
Rarely, he cries out and fusses a bit and then goes back to sleep without help (we always give him a few minutes to make sure it's the real thing). About half the time, he continues screaming even as we rub his head or sing to him, and then he just suddenly stops screaming after 5-20 minutes and goes to sleep. The rest of the time, he calms when we comfort him and slowly falls back to sleep. He doesn't want to nurse and will just bite if I try. If we pick him up or rock him, that's great, but he gets upset upon being transferred back to bed. He does not seem gassy or refluxy, burping doesn't help, and his diaper is still clean and dry. He'll do this every 30-45 minutes until 10 or so.
He usually wakes every three hours for the rest of the night to eat, sometimes will go four or five. I wait a few minutes at each waking to make sure he's actually hungry; occasionally he falls back asleep without needing anything but usually he does want to eat. He eats efficiently and I can leave before he falls asleep again.
I'm sort of stumped. A lot of what I've read says this happens when babies are overtired, but seriously, he doesn't go more than two hours awake ever. I've tried moving bedtime a little earlier, but it's hard - Daddy gets home just after six so that's really exciting, and the toddler can't entertain herself at that time of day, so I need to wait for another parent or we're interrupted constantly. Plus that late afternoon catnap is in the way, but he still seems to need it. I've tried moving bedtime a little later but then I wind up with a fussier baby who has a harder time getting to sleep initially and still wakes up every sleep cycle for a few hours. If we can't fix it in the next two months, we will try CIO, but I don't want to wait that long, or at least I'd like to try some more things in the meantime. (Two months was picked because he'll be six months old, and we will be traveling at the beginning of June so we'd do it once we got home.) Also, the screaming-while-being-comforted thing makes me nervous that CIO won't work right now.
Help?
Oh hey, I'm in your boat kind of, but it's going a little better.
I have an 8 week old, second child to his 3 year old sister, so we are a little wiser from that experience.
First, I think it's a little odd your critter is still having 2-3 feedings a night at 4 months. My 8 week old is only doing a wakeup for feeding once a night. I think it's because my wife is smart and started kind of enforcing that a few weeks ago. There's a huge difference between a kid waking up, and a hungry kid waking up.
What we did for our first was at exactly 4 months we did sleep training. Something like 6:30-7pm she went into her room, in her crib (after all the sleep ritual stuff like warm washcloth on face and such). We would read her two little books, and she would be swaddled in her crib.
I can't emphasize this enough. Always enforce and early and ruthless bedtime. Always.
That was it. She cried and cried for the 15 minutes we had to wait. My wife cried much more. On the prescribed intervals we went in, patted her, talked to her, but never picked her up. We had to do the whole thing, every 10 minutes after that for a few times. She did fall asleep on her own. After two nights, she slept on her own right out of the bat and that was that, never a problem anymore. Slept like a champ. Two nights.
That said, Later on, like 6-9 months, I would go in at about 9:30 every night and do a "dream feed". Basically give her a bottle of milk about the normal size for her at the time. She was basically asleep, but feeding, and that was that, just put her right down after. I'm not sure she ever woke up really.
My wife swears by the Tracy Hogg books from the library, find them on amazon too, we have recently picked them up again. I definitely suggest that. Our second kid has been much easier to deal with since we have been through it once before and know what to expect.
It's never perfect to whatever a book says, kids are all different. But after about 6-8 weeks babys get pretty predictable, a few months in, even more. I am fully in with Ms. Hogg and her theories. It completely gave me and my wife's life back when we only had one. Kid goes down at 7pm, stays asleep all night, what do we do with all this free time!?!?!
You in fact get most of your life back at night, it's crazy but it's definitely doable and it's awesome.
posted by sanka at 8:59 PM on April 11, 2015 [1 favorite]
I have an 8 week old, second child to his 3 year old sister, so we are a little wiser from that experience.
First, I think it's a little odd your critter is still having 2-3 feedings a night at 4 months. My 8 week old is only doing a wakeup for feeding once a night. I think it's because my wife is smart and started kind of enforcing that a few weeks ago. There's a huge difference between a kid waking up, and a hungry kid waking up.
What we did for our first was at exactly 4 months we did sleep training. Something like 6:30-7pm she went into her room, in her crib (after all the sleep ritual stuff like warm washcloth on face and such). We would read her two little books, and she would be swaddled in her crib.
I can't emphasize this enough. Always enforce and early and ruthless bedtime. Always.
That was it. She cried and cried for the 15 minutes we had to wait. My wife cried much more. On the prescribed intervals we went in, patted her, talked to her, but never picked her up. We had to do the whole thing, every 10 minutes after that for a few times. She did fall asleep on her own. After two nights, she slept on her own right out of the bat and that was that, never a problem anymore. Slept like a champ. Two nights.
That said, Later on, like 6-9 months, I would go in at about 9:30 every night and do a "dream feed". Basically give her a bottle of milk about the normal size for her at the time. She was basically asleep, but feeding, and that was that, just put her right down after. I'm not sure she ever woke up really.
My wife swears by the Tracy Hogg books from the library, find them on amazon too, we have recently picked them up again. I definitely suggest that. Our second kid has been much easier to deal with since we have been through it once before and know what to expect.
It's never perfect to whatever a book says, kids are all different. But after about 6-8 weeks babys get pretty predictable, a few months in, even more. I am fully in with Ms. Hogg and her theories. It completely gave me and my wife's life back when we only had one. Kid goes down at 7pm, stays asleep all night, what do we do with all this free time!?!?!
You in fact get most of your life back at night, it's crazy but it's definitely doable and it's awesome.
posted by sanka at 8:59 PM on April 11, 2015 [1 favorite]
4 months was about the time my babe switched to the 2-3-4 nap schedule. It took a little pushing the first little bit to get him to stay awake for the 4hr block but he was ready for lots of books and floor time. The nap schedule switch really helped bedtime be easy and we started nursing less at night too because he was sleeping so well.
posted by Swisstine at 9:03 PM on April 11, 2015
posted by Swisstine at 9:03 PM on April 11, 2015
According to my pediatrician, a 14 lb four month old doesn't need to eat so frequently. They should be able to go at least six hours. He told me this when my baby was two months old and 12.5 lbs.
So, since baby bedtime is 630-7pm, I just made it so that if he woke up anytime until about 1am, he didn't get fed, just shushed and pacifier replaced and so forth. Once he was getting the hang of that I added in the dream feed so that the 6 hour stretch would be from that feeding.
This might not help since you mentioned during the early wakeups he doesn't want to nurse, but perhaps it would help him with the concept of self soothing, which might lead into helping the the early wakeups?
posted by treehorn+bunny at 9:37 PM on April 11, 2015
So, since baby bedtime is 630-7pm, I just made it so that if he woke up anytime until about 1am, he didn't get fed, just shushed and pacifier replaced and so forth. Once he was getting the hang of that I added in the dream feed so that the 6 hour stretch would be from that feeding.
This might not help since you mentioned during the early wakeups he doesn't want to nurse, but perhaps it would help him with the concept of self soothing, which might lead into helping the the early wakeups?
posted by treehorn+bunny at 9:37 PM on April 11, 2015
I'm sorry to tell you, my son did the same thing. Babies do not adhere to a schedule, despite what you read in books or a doctor might tell you.
The first few months are on the baby's schedule, not yours. I cannot imagine making a tiny 4-month old baby adhere to a schedule. They want food, love, and comfort. Maybe that's not your thing, but it's baby's thing. Sometimes they even scream in the middle of the night for no reason.
Many a time I was up, walking back and forth, singing the elephant song, walking up and down, because my baby decided he wanted to be walked around. Sometimes they just do that, and you have to comfort them. They are babies, after all.
posted by Marie Mon Dieu at 9:59 PM on April 11, 2015 [6 favorites]
The first few months are on the baby's schedule, not yours. I cannot imagine making a tiny 4-month old baby adhere to a schedule. They want food, love, and comfort. Maybe that's not your thing, but it's baby's thing. Sometimes they even scream in the middle of the night for no reason.
Many a time I was up, walking back and forth, singing the elephant song, walking up and down, because my baby decided he wanted to be walked around. Sometimes they just do that, and you have to comfort them. They are babies, after all.
posted by Marie Mon Dieu at 9:59 PM on April 11, 2015 [6 favorites]
I have read people suggesting that if your child is waking at a somewhat regular period after falling asleep, that you go in a little earlier than that to try to calm him back to sleep before he really wakes up. I've read it in relationship to naps primarily, but it might also work for nighttime sleep.
My baby finally got his sleeping act together at around 6 months old, so part of me just wants to say for you to give it some time. I know how frustrating it can be when the baby is just not sleeping when you think he should be. Starting on solids might help, him being out of the swaddle might help, who knows what magic might help. I don't think mine liked being swaddled much (although flailing was worse), and he really prefers sleeping on his stomach (he flips over almost immediately when I put him down now), so maybe your baby just hasn't found the best sleeping position for him and ends up not being good at falling asleep for a longer stretch at night until he's super exhausted.
posted by that girl at 10:01 PM on April 11, 2015
My baby finally got his sleeping act together at around 6 months old, so part of me just wants to say for you to give it some time. I know how frustrating it can be when the baby is just not sleeping when you think he should be. Starting on solids might help, him being out of the swaddle might help, who knows what magic might help. I don't think mine liked being swaddled much (although flailing was worse), and he really prefers sleeping on his stomach (he flips over almost immediately when I put him down now), so maybe your baby just hasn't found the best sleeping position for him and ends up not being good at falling asleep for a longer stretch at night until he's super exhausted.
posted by that girl at 10:01 PM on April 11, 2015
I'm going to throw out a completely different option from everyone else - could your child just not be tired? We are really flexible with our LO and sometimes he goes down at 6 and sometimes at 10 - if we try to get him down earlier when he is not tired, then he does what your child is doing. If we wait until he is actually, really tired, he goes down easily. Would you consider ignoring all the baby sleep advice out there, and trying to just see what works for your particular baby? It might just be not being tired.
posted by Toddles at 11:39 PM on April 11, 2015
posted by Toddles at 11:39 PM on April 11, 2015
Seconding that it might be time to switch to 2-3-4 nap schedule. 4-5 naps might be too much.
FWIW, we had 2-3 night feeds until the kid was almost 11 months and they didn't seem to interfere with his sleep (ate and then fell back asleep on his own in his crib), so I wouldn't cut out night feeds if I were you. OTOH, some kids go the whole night without feeding since 2 months old, so YMMV.
posted by gakiko at 1:33 AM on April 12, 2015
FWIW, we had 2-3 night feeds until the kid was almost 11 months and they didn't seem to interfere with his sleep (ate and then fell back asleep on his own in his crib), so I wouldn't cut out night feeds if I were you. OTOH, some kids go the whole night without feeding since 2 months old, so YMMV.
posted by gakiko at 1:33 AM on April 12, 2015
This doesn't seem like a strange pattern for a breastfeed 4 month old. "Through the night" for most 4 month olds means 5-7 hours of sleep at the longest stretch, so 10pm-3am or 10-5 with dome shorter periods of sleep on either side. Its the rare baby who sleeps 10 hours and wakes up once.
You probably don't need a 7pm bedtime yet unless you have a very long bedtime routine.
Wait 2-4 weeks and one less daily nap and the pre-10pm sleep will turn into a solid block.
posted by sputzie at 4:36 AM on April 12, 2015 [3 favorites]
You probably don't need a 7pm bedtime yet unless you have a very long bedtime routine.
Wait 2-4 weeks and one less daily nap and the pre-10pm sleep will turn into a solid block.
posted by sputzie at 4:36 AM on April 12, 2015 [3 favorites]
I was also going to suggest moving to a 2-3-4 schedule. I think it was around 4-6 months that we did that. He would go to sleep around 7, then wake up around 11 when I went to bed, and then once in the middle of the night. He pretty much kept that schedule until we night weaned at around 15 months.
There is a sleep regression at 4 months, when sleep gets all fubar. I don't really remember the details but that gives you a search term.
Good luck! Baby sleep is maddening.
posted by apricot at 5:10 AM on April 12, 2015
There is a sleep regression at 4 months, when sleep gets all fubar. I don't really remember the details but that gives you a search term.
Good luck! Baby sleep is maddening.
posted by apricot at 5:10 AM on April 12, 2015
Not addressing the schedule but addressing how to attend to the older kid's bedtime, have you tried using a sling, because that would let you get on with things in the evening a little easier. It would also give your four-month-old more mummy-time. Your physical presence may soothe the baby in a way that swaddled-up sleep doesn't.
Also, all babies are different, and so are all families, but that seems like a lot of day-time naps to me. With both babies and grandchildren we were (successfully) trying to keep them awake in the day more at 3 - 4 months old, which translated to better night times.
posted by glasseyes at 5:14 AM on April 12, 2015 [1 favorite]
Also, all babies are different, and so are all families, but that seems like a lot of day-time naps to me. With both babies and grandchildren we were (successfully) trying to keep them awake in the day more at 3 - 4 months old, which translated to better night times.
posted by glasseyes at 5:14 AM on April 12, 2015 [1 favorite]
My son woke up every 40 minutes (occasionally sleeping 80 minutes in a row) all night long for his first 8 months, until we did our version of "sleep training" (parents stay in room, soothing but not picking up) which basically fixed the problem in 3 days with pretty minimal crying. Since then my son has had his little ups and downs in sleep, like most babies/toddlers, but we have never returned to the extraordinarily bad sleep that was making him miserable and making me regularly hallucinate from exhaustion. Like your child, my son didn't really want comforting or nursing at his early wakings, and eventually not at his later ones either - he wasn't waking for cuddles or nursing. I'll paste in the list of things we tried with him before we eventually did the sleep training just in case it helps you. I hope you find a solution - I'm still extremely wary of any kind of sleep training with a young infant because they can't tell you why they're crying, and it's difficult to be fully confident that the problem is just "can't stay asleep, need to learn" as opposed to some kind of pain/anxiety/discomfort/other need that needs addressing.
1. Cosleeping (cosleeper the first 4 months, then we tried giving him his own room to see if he would sleep better that way - no difference though, he came back into our bed every night after a few hours)
2. Special plush sheets to make him more comfortable
3. Warmer and cooler temperatures in his bedroom
4. More and less clothing
5. An attachment object (lovey) that was also silky and soft
6. Humidifier because he was a winter baby and the air was very dry; I've heard this can wake a lot of young infants
7. Painkillers in case he had pain (of course we took him to the doctor to check for ear infections, etc.)
8. White noise (6 different types of white noise in fact)
9. Blackout curtains
10. Night light in case he hated the dark
11. Different bedtimes between 6:30 and 9:00 PM
12. Absolutely rock-solid predictable bedtime routine from 3 weeks on
13. Lavender massages
14. No overhead lights for an hour before bedtime
15. More food, less food and no food right before bed
16. 6 different brands of pacifiers
17. Walking to sleep instead of always nursing, wearing him in carriers, bouncing him
18. Putting down awake when possible, starting at 8 weeks of age
19. Much more activity to exhaust him, and much less activity to avoid overstimulation
20. Sunlight in the morning
21. Vitamin D in the morning, or no vitamin D at all
22. Probiotics in case he was gassy
23. Attempting to soothe in his crib with songs, backrubs, etc.
24. Elevating his crib to prevent theoretical reflux
25. 5 different types/brands of diapers, in case he was uncomfortable
posted by Cygnet at 5:17 AM on April 12, 2015 [1 favorite]
1. Cosleeping (cosleeper the first 4 months, then we tried giving him his own room to see if he would sleep better that way - no difference though, he came back into our bed every night after a few hours)
2. Special plush sheets to make him more comfortable
3. Warmer and cooler temperatures in his bedroom
4. More and less clothing
5. An attachment object (lovey) that was also silky and soft
6. Humidifier because he was a winter baby and the air was very dry; I've heard this can wake a lot of young infants
7. Painkillers in case he had pain (of course we took him to the doctor to check for ear infections, etc.)
8. White noise (6 different types of white noise in fact)
9. Blackout curtains
10. Night light in case he hated the dark
11. Different bedtimes between 6:30 and 9:00 PM
12. Absolutely rock-solid predictable bedtime routine from 3 weeks on
13. Lavender massages
14. No overhead lights for an hour before bedtime
15. More food, less food and no food right before bed
16. 6 different brands of pacifiers
17. Walking to sleep instead of always nursing, wearing him in carriers, bouncing him
18. Putting down awake when possible, starting at 8 weeks of age
19. Much more activity to exhaust him, and much less activity to avoid overstimulation
20. Sunlight in the morning
21. Vitamin D in the morning, or no vitamin D at all
22. Probiotics in case he was gassy
23. Attempting to soothe in his crib with songs, backrubs, etc.
24. Elevating his crib to prevent theoretical reflux
25. 5 different types/brands of diapers, in case he was uncomfortable
posted by Cygnet at 5:17 AM on April 12, 2015 [1 favorite]
Best answer: The vitamin drops stand out to me. Maybe they are upsetting his tummy? Try cutting those out or moving them to the morning for a while and see if that helps.
posted by dawkins_7 at 6:06 AM on April 12, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by dawkins_7 at 6:06 AM on April 12, 2015 [1 favorite]
My son did that until I figured out that he didn't like the quiet. I could leave music playing in his room and he slept better. For my daughters, it was an hepa filter. They needed the white noise. It could be that, because you do have a toddler, baby is used to napping with noise and the quiet of the night is unsettling. It doesn't hurt to try.
The good news is that you are almost at the end of this. Once baby starts eating cereal, the problem should resolve on its own.
In the meantime, consider asking a relative or close friend to give you an evening off. It's okay to ask for help. And no one complains about having to hold a sweet baby so mom can have a long bath.
posted by myselfasme at 6:32 AM on April 12, 2015
The good news is that you are almost at the end of this. Once baby starts eating cereal, the problem should resolve on its own.
In the meantime, consider asking a relative or close friend to give you an evening off. It's okay to ask for help. And no one complains about having to hold a sweet baby so mom can have a long bath.
posted by myselfasme at 6:32 AM on April 12, 2015
Uggh, this is so hard. I remember it vividly. Lack of sleep and limited downtime create such a sense of desperation. I feel your pain.
It definitely sounds like the 5 pm nap is a problem. You say it's around 20 minutes; in my experience, that's right around the time that infants go from light sleep into deeper sleep. It might be that he's waking after a light sleep cycle but you're then waking him up completely - maybe before he would fall into a deeper sleep - for his nighttime routine. So, if I were in your shoes, I'd try two things.
First, I'd start the nighttime routine at 430, nurse him around 5, and put him down for the night after that around 6. I'm assuming he's still nursing for maybe 40 minutes or an hour; if that's incorrect, I'd try the same thing just starting at 445 or 5, whatever it takes to get him from beginning of routine to, say, 6 pm rather than 7 pm. It might be that he's early to bed/early to rise - and you have my sympathies - which my son definitely was. He needed to be down for the night no later than 630 or he was up at least twice before midnight. And he was rarely up for the day before 530 am until after the 18 month mark.
If that didn't work, I'd introduce time on a playmat, playpen, or playing some soft but upbeat music and putting him in an upright bouncy seat around 5pm. Bring him into the kitchen and cook or do dishes or some other thing that's visually interesting. If you can get him to 530 or so you can then start your bedtime routine and have him down between 6 and 630. It might be that you can train him out of that last mini-sleep cycle and into a little playtime before you start your bedtime.
In either case, I'd make nursing/burping the last thing before an earlier bedtime. (You're burping, aren't you? It occurs to me as I type this that he might be gassy for awhile after his final feeding, and that might not be helping. I'd try to get at least one good burp then giving him his cuddle and song.)
It really sounds like 7 pm is a little too late for your little guy. Adjusting it forward may be just the ticket to at least a two-three hour stretch early on in the evening.
If it's encouraging at all, our son's no longer an early riser, thank heavens. He's almost three and was up this morning at 8:15.
Good luck! Baby sleep...uggh, the worst.
posted by TryTheTilapia at 10:54 AM on April 12, 2015
It definitely sounds like the 5 pm nap is a problem. You say it's around 20 minutes; in my experience, that's right around the time that infants go from light sleep into deeper sleep. It might be that he's waking after a light sleep cycle but you're then waking him up completely - maybe before he would fall into a deeper sleep - for his nighttime routine. So, if I were in your shoes, I'd try two things.
First, I'd start the nighttime routine at 430, nurse him around 5, and put him down for the night after that around 6. I'm assuming he's still nursing for maybe 40 minutes or an hour; if that's incorrect, I'd try the same thing just starting at 445 or 5, whatever it takes to get him from beginning of routine to, say, 6 pm rather than 7 pm. It might be that he's early to bed/early to rise - and you have my sympathies - which my son definitely was. He needed to be down for the night no later than 630 or he was up at least twice before midnight. And he was rarely up for the day before 530 am until after the 18 month mark.
If that didn't work, I'd introduce time on a playmat, playpen, or playing some soft but upbeat music and putting him in an upright bouncy seat around 5pm. Bring him into the kitchen and cook or do dishes or some other thing that's visually interesting. If you can get him to 530 or so you can then start your bedtime routine and have him down between 6 and 630. It might be that you can train him out of that last mini-sleep cycle and into a little playtime before you start your bedtime.
In either case, I'd make nursing/burping the last thing before an earlier bedtime. (You're burping, aren't you? It occurs to me as I type this that he might be gassy for awhile after his final feeding, and that might not be helping. I'd try to get at least one good burp then giving him his cuddle and song.)
It really sounds like 7 pm is a little too late for your little guy. Adjusting it forward may be just the ticket to at least a two-three hour stretch early on in the evening.
If it's encouraging at all, our son's no longer an early riser, thank heavens. He's almost three and was up this morning at 8:15.
Good luck! Baby sleep...uggh, the worst.
posted by TryTheTilapia at 10:54 AM on April 12, 2015
Yeah. Look up "four month sleep regression." And anything that works, let it.
At that age, mine stopped letting us put him down at. All. So he slept in the Snugli and the two of us coslept.
Good luck! It will change, I promise.
posted by orange (sherbet) rabbit at 1:44 PM on April 12, 2015 [1 favorite]
At that age, mine stopped letting us put him down at. All. So he slept in the Snugli and the two of us coslept.
Good luck! It will change, I promise.
posted by orange (sherbet) rabbit at 1:44 PM on April 12, 2015 [1 favorite]
Best answer: There are two kinds of tiredness: mental tiredness and physical tiredness. You need to be both mentally and physically tired in order to sleep well. Babies are often physically tired, in part because they are growing. But sometimes they aren't getting enough mental stimulation to be mentally tired. This can be hard to deal with in a baby because it can be hard to find a way to address their need for mental stimulation.
That was the source of waking up crying after an hour for my second son -- he did that when he was physically tired but not mentally tired enough to sleep. The mind revving and bored and trapped in a body that's asleep causes night terrors. I quit letting him get so physically exhausted and began working on making sure he got enough mental stimulation and he never woke up screaming again shortly after bedtime.
So maybe get some kind of age appropriate toys geared at mental stimulation and try to have that be something baby gets access to in the evening before bedtime. My niece had some kind of baby gym thing that involved a blanket and some kind of thing toys hung off of over the blanket and you could switch out what toys were hanging from it. She also slept a lot better when she got enough mental stimulation. Her mom had been fighting her at bedtime and taking forever to put her down and so on.
My policy was that if a baby is not asleep within 15 to 20 minutes, they aren't really ready to sleep. If they aren't hungry, do not need a new diaper, and all other physical needs are met, then they are probably bored and need to have their brain made tired enough for sleep. So I would walk my niece around the house and show her different things and talk with her and get my sons involved in entertaining her and so on. Her sleep issues improved immensely -- all stuff I had learned from raising my kids.
Best of luck.
posted by Michele in California at 2:42 PM on April 12, 2015
That was the source of waking up crying after an hour for my second son -- he did that when he was physically tired but not mentally tired enough to sleep. The mind revving and bored and trapped in a body that's asleep causes night terrors. I quit letting him get so physically exhausted and began working on making sure he got enough mental stimulation and he never woke up screaming again shortly after bedtime.
So maybe get some kind of age appropriate toys geared at mental stimulation and try to have that be something baby gets access to in the evening before bedtime. My niece had some kind of baby gym thing that involved a blanket and some kind of thing toys hung off of over the blanket and you could switch out what toys were hanging from it. She also slept a lot better when she got enough mental stimulation. Her mom had been fighting her at bedtime and taking forever to put her down and so on.
My policy was that if a baby is not asleep within 15 to 20 minutes, they aren't really ready to sleep. If they aren't hungry, do not need a new diaper, and all other physical needs are met, then they are probably bored and need to have their brain made tired enough for sleep. So I would walk my niece around the house and show her different things and talk with her and get my sons involved in entertaining her and so on. Her sleep issues improved immensely -- all stuff I had learned from raising my kids.
Best of luck.
posted by Michele in California at 2:42 PM on April 12, 2015
Best answer: Vitamins in the morning, some vitamins might be stimulating. He is likely getting his teeth. Each kid is different, just because you feel routine is best, doesn't mean the routine you chose is working for this baby. Sounds like he wants two hours longer in close contact with family. One of my kids was colicky and there was no altering that. She would be happy in the snuggly on her father's chest while he did anything, read, vacuum, talk on the phone, but inconsolate otherwise until ten at night. She had a cry that would clear a waiting room. In three months he will start to crawl, then he will wear himself out and sleep. It is such a short time, when they are tiny.
posted by Oyéah at 8:51 PM on April 12, 2015
posted by Oyéah at 8:51 PM on April 12, 2015
When my daughter did this (it was just for a brief period), we just started putting her down at 10 instead to save us all the frustration. Eventually we started being able to go earlier and earlier.
posted by freezer cake at 1:21 PM on April 13, 2015
posted by freezer cake at 1:21 PM on April 13, 2015
Response by poster: There is no way on earth this baby is ready for a 2-3-4 schedule. The sleep charts I've seen in books and online still show 3-4 naps as normal for this age, and after just 2.5 hours awake, my son turns into a cranky, fussy monster who has to be held through the entire nap to stay asleep (if I put him down when he starts showing tiredness cues around 90-120 minutes, he goes to sleep easily). My daughter didn't move to that schedule until well over six months old, so I think we've got a while before we get there this time, too.
However, there are a lot of great things for me to think about and try here - changing vitamins around, playing with bedtime a little more, working on more mental stimulation before bed, stretch out the bedtime routine. Will try to come back and mark best answers if anything in particular seems to work.
posted by peanut_mcgillicuty at 12:20 PM on April 15, 2015 [3 favorites]
However, there are a lot of great things for me to think about and try here - changing vitamins around, playing with bedtime a little more, working on more mental stimulation before bed, stretch out the bedtime routine. Will try to come back and mark best answers if anything in particular seems to work.
posted by peanut_mcgillicuty at 12:20 PM on April 15, 2015 [3 favorites]
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Because I bought the plan, I can't tell you what we did exactly (proprietary, I guess), but essentially it was limited CIO with specific check in times and expectations, plus a nursing schedule that kept my LO from nursing all night.
PM me if you want to chat more. Hang in there. We did that for eleven months before I got help and I wish I'd done it sooner.
(Sorry if this sounds like Astroturfing. I'm just super evangelical about them since they literally changed my life.)
posted by mrfuga0 at 8:51 PM on April 11, 2015