Old car repairs
August 17, 2013 11:38 AM Subscribe
The catalytic converter needs to be replaced. The car is old and I don't have much spare money. What should I do?
I have a 2001 Nissan Altima with over 150,000 miles on it.
A couple weeks ago the check engine light popped on. I took it to Mechanic A, who said it was an oxygen sensor, which they replaced for ~$175. A week later, the check engine light popped on again soon, and I took the car to Mechanic B. This time the code that came up was the catalytic converter, and Mechanic B was a little skeptical of Mechanic A (they didn't write down the initial oxygen sensor code). The car has two catalytic converters, and the front would be more expensive to replace than the rear, but it wasn't clear off hand which was the problem. I took it back to A, they got the same catalytic converter code. They deleted the code, told me it could have been a mistake (caused by the oxygen sensor replacement?), and told me to come back if the light turned on again.
The light turned on last night, and I took it to both mechanics. A tells me it's definitely the front cat that needs to be replaced, and tells me to call on Monday to get an estimate. B tells me that he thinks he knows what's going on. (Although actually he said he couldn't do the heat test -- "CK CAT EFFICIENCY" -- he was going to do because his equipment is down, but he looked at something else...) He thinks that the front cat is definitely bad, but that the rear cat and the rear sensor might also be bad -- he could replace the front cat, and the rear cat and rear sensor would clear up with a new front cat... but, alternatively, he could replace the front cat and it might still demand replacing the rear as well. The front cat would be $700, the rear cat and rear sensor would be ~$600 together. So he warned me not to necessarily think of the repair as just the $700 front cat, because there's a fair chance it would be $1300 altogether.
A major consideration here is that this is a 12-year-old car that couldn't be worth more than $3 or $4k if this wasn't going on -- so should I put all this money into this car? However, I've heard that a breaking off point is that you never pay more than half of the value of the car in repairs, but it might be reasonable to pay less than half; and this is less. Another major consideration is that I have very little money, any of these repairs would swallow up the amount in my bank account, and would go on my credit card. However, because of that, if I did buy a new car, I wouldn't be buying anything more than $5k at the absolute tops, and financing it would mean that I would have to pay comprehensive insurance, most likely taking my insurance from $100 to $200 a month, on top of a monthly payment that I could barely squeak out affording.
In addition, this is the only car I've ever owned, which I bought with cash two or three years ago, and the hassle of selling a car I know is bad (how does one even do that?) plus buying a car I know is likely to have problems in the near future as well (because I would be buying another cheap old used car) is NOT something I'd look forward to doing. Further consideration -- I'm in California, and the car needs to be smogged in October. I'm assuming that with these problems, it most likely will not pass inspection...
My question is simple -- what should I do? Car people: what do you think of these repairs? Sensible people: what do you think about the financial issues involved?
I have a 2001 Nissan Altima with over 150,000 miles on it.
A couple weeks ago the check engine light popped on. I took it to Mechanic A, who said it was an oxygen sensor, which they replaced for ~$175. A week later, the check engine light popped on again soon, and I took the car to Mechanic B. This time the code that came up was the catalytic converter, and Mechanic B was a little skeptical of Mechanic A (they didn't write down the initial oxygen sensor code). The car has two catalytic converters, and the front would be more expensive to replace than the rear, but it wasn't clear off hand which was the problem. I took it back to A, they got the same catalytic converter code. They deleted the code, told me it could have been a mistake (caused by the oxygen sensor replacement?), and told me to come back if the light turned on again.
The light turned on last night, and I took it to both mechanics. A tells me it's definitely the front cat that needs to be replaced, and tells me to call on Monday to get an estimate. B tells me that he thinks he knows what's going on. (Although actually he said he couldn't do the heat test -- "CK CAT EFFICIENCY" -- he was going to do because his equipment is down, but he looked at something else...) He thinks that the front cat is definitely bad, but that the rear cat and the rear sensor might also be bad -- he could replace the front cat, and the rear cat and rear sensor would clear up with a new front cat... but, alternatively, he could replace the front cat and it might still demand replacing the rear as well. The front cat would be $700, the rear cat and rear sensor would be ~$600 together. So he warned me not to necessarily think of the repair as just the $700 front cat, because there's a fair chance it would be $1300 altogether.
A major consideration here is that this is a 12-year-old car that couldn't be worth more than $3 or $4k if this wasn't going on -- so should I put all this money into this car? However, I've heard that a breaking off point is that you never pay more than half of the value of the car in repairs, but it might be reasonable to pay less than half; and this is less. Another major consideration is that I have very little money, any of these repairs would swallow up the amount in my bank account, and would go on my credit card. However, because of that, if I did buy a new car, I wouldn't be buying anything more than $5k at the absolute tops, and financing it would mean that I would have to pay comprehensive insurance, most likely taking my insurance from $100 to $200 a month, on top of a monthly payment that I could barely squeak out affording.
In addition, this is the only car I've ever owned, which I bought with cash two or three years ago, and the hassle of selling a car I know is bad (how does one even do that?) plus buying a car I know is likely to have problems in the near future as well (because I would be buying another cheap old used car) is NOT something I'd look forward to doing. Further consideration -- I'm in California, and the car needs to be smogged in October. I'm assuming that with these problems, it most likely will not pass inspection...
My question is simple -- what should I do? Car people: what do you think of these repairs? Sensible people: what do you think about the financial issues involved?
Response by poster: They haven't replaced anything yet, except for the front sensor a couple weeks ago. Mechanic B is just saying that it's likely the rear is bad as well, and I shouldn't count on just the front being the problem.
posted by lewedswiver at 12:44 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by lewedswiver at 12:44 PM on August 17, 2013
You can sometimes find mechanics willing to simply remove the CC, as I don't believe (though I may be very wrong about this -- I had a 1998 Chevy, so not the same car) the CC is a necessary piece. I believe it's only necessary if you live in a state with inspections.
posted by mrfuga0 at 12:44 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by mrfuga0 at 12:44 PM on August 17, 2013
If the car is in good shape otherwise, I'd replace the front converter, and if it turns out the rear is bad also, replace that one, too. Bear in mind that replacement converters have an extremely long warranty - I want to say it's lifetime, but I'm not certain of it. You won't see this problem again. Japanese cars last a long time, and if it's providing you good transportation, keep it.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 12:47 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by Kirth Gerson at 12:47 PM on August 17, 2013
Response by poster: California has very strict emissions standards, so I think it'd be unlikely for it to be unnecessary? I need it to pass an emissions test in a month or two.
posted by lewedswiver at 12:48 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by lewedswiver at 12:48 PM on August 17, 2013
Yes, it's almost certainly illegal to remove a converter in CA, as it is many other places.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 12:49 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by Kirth Gerson at 12:49 PM on August 17, 2013
Also, it may be that you cannot legally sell the car (except to a junkyard or repair shop) if it won't pass inspection.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 12:55 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by Kirth Gerson at 12:55 PM on August 17, 2013
Response by poster: Now mechanic A is telling me that he replaced the rear sensor not the front one, so revise my first reply.
posted by lewedswiver at 12:56 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by lewedswiver at 12:56 PM on August 17, 2013
It's definitely illegal in most places to remove the CC. But it IS an option if you have the right mechanic willing to do so. But obviously that won't work in this case.
posted by mrfuga0 at 1:04 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by mrfuga0 at 1:04 PM on August 17, 2013
Find out from Nissan which models have the converter yours uses. Then go to a junkyard and get it from a wreck on which the converter is intact.
Or go to the many used/reconditioned parts sites, such as Auto Parts Rebuilders Assn, Auto Parts Warehouse, Car-Part.com and GetUsedParts.
posted by KRS at 1:05 PM on August 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
Or go to the many used/reconditioned parts sites, such as Auto Parts Rebuilders Assn, Auto Parts Warehouse, Car-Part.com and GetUsedParts.
posted by KRS at 1:05 PM on August 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
Installing a used catalytic converter may also be illegal. I can't get the CA ARB website to answer that question, but it is definitely illegal in NY and some other places.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 1:11 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by Kirth Gerson at 1:11 PM on August 17, 2013
I agree with KRS. You may also need to find a more flexible / low-budget mechanic to work with -- look for a garage that's rough around the edges, possibly near a college campus, with a bunch of old VW's or Volvos sitting around, i.e. a place that's used to improvisation and making the best of imperfect old vehicles. You'll have to tolerate a few extra inconveniences and the indignity of a threadbare waiting area, but cheap, good mechanics do exist.
FWIW, I just looked up the Altima catalytic converter on RockAuto. They carry a bunch of different aftermarket brands, including some legal in California, for $200-$300. For a variety of reasons (unfamiliarity, uncertainty about quality, loss of markup profits) most mechanics will be unfriendly to the idea of installing parts that didn't come from their regular suppliers, but some will work with you.
posted by jon1270 at 1:19 PM on August 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
FWIW, I just looked up the Altima catalytic converter on RockAuto. They carry a bunch of different aftermarket brands, including some legal in California, for $200-$300. For a variety of reasons (unfamiliarity, uncertainty about quality, loss of markup profits) most mechanics will be unfriendly to the idea of installing parts that didn't come from their regular suppliers, but some will work with you.
posted by jon1270 at 1:19 PM on August 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
Oh, and if there's any chance that the other O2 sensor is faulty, I'd replace it first. But I wouldn't pay $175 to do it. The OEM sensor is really expensive, but quality aftermarket sensors can be had for much less, and labor shouldn't be all that much.
posted by jon1270 at 1:24 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by jon1270 at 1:24 PM on August 17, 2013
I found it; sale of used catalytic converters is not allowed in CA (PDF).
Current U.S. EPA policy permits the sale of used original equipment catalytic converters if they are screened to ensure they perform at levels generally comparable to those required for new aftermarket converters. The adopted amendments would sunset California’s similar provisions [in 2009] because screening methods to ensure that used original equipment converters can perform at levels comparable to staff’s proposed requirements for newaftermarket converters are not economically feasible.posted by Kirth Gerson at 1:31 PM on August 17, 2013
I feel like adding, because I've been driving cheap old cars for more than 20 years now and still remember what it was like to be in your position before I figured out how to navigate all this: the markup on parts supplied by your mechanic is often huge. Consider that they're in the business of getting customers' cars back to them very quickly, usually the same day. To accomplish that, they have to have a relationship with a big and nearby parts warehouse that keeps almost every part for every car, in stock all the time, which is can be expensive to begin with. The parts are delivered to the shop by a delivery driver making a special trip (i.e. not UPS or the mailman) which adds to the expense. They don't have much incentive to shop around save you money. And typically your car is broken and you really need it, so you're in a bad negotiating position. I've gotten estimates from shops that wanted to charge me four times what the same part could be bought for online. When your car is totally crippled or when driving it will do more damage, you don't have much choice. But if you can plan a repair project and defer it for a few days until parts are shipped to you, you can sometimes save a bunch.
posted by jon1270 at 1:49 PM on August 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by jon1270 at 1:49 PM on August 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Spoke to Mechanic B again, and basically he seemed to recommend considering above all how much money I would be putting into the car. He said I should think of it as a $1300 repair, not $700 and then a possibility for more -- and basically said that if the transmission had been rebuilt, I should do the repair, but if it was the original transmission (with 158k miles on it, and therefore couldn't be expected to last much more beyond the 120-180k miles expected) then I should just sell it.
A lot of you are recommending buying a catalytic converter myself. I can't tell if everyone is saying just to buy a new aftermarket piece (can one do that?) or buy used -- clearly the used is illegal in CA, but it seems that lots of the parts on RockAuto also say "Not legal for sale in CA", etc. So it seems like this is a good idea that doesn't work in this situation?
Is there any way to find out whether or not the car has the original transmission? I bought it from a deal in early 2011. I think it's unlikely it would have been replaced in the first 10 years of use, but who knows. That really does seem like it'd make a key difference... I don't want to put $1300 into the car now if I will need to put say $2,000 into it in year. (However, it does seem to be driving fine. And while I do like to think that Japanese cars will last forever, I think it perhaps is irresponsible to count on that?)
posted by lewedswiver at 2:01 PM on August 17, 2013
A lot of you are recommending buying a catalytic converter myself. I can't tell if everyone is saying just to buy a new aftermarket piece (can one do that?) or buy used -- clearly the used is illegal in CA, but it seems that lots of the parts on RockAuto also say "Not legal for sale in CA", etc. So it seems like this is a good idea that doesn't work in this situation?
Is there any way to find out whether or not the car has the original transmission? I bought it from a deal in early 2011. I think it's unlikely it would have been replaced in the first 10 years of use, but who knows. That really does seem like it'd make a key difference... I don't want to put $1300 into the car now if I will need to put say $2,000 into it in year. (However, it does seem to be driving fine. And while I do like to think that Japanese cars will last forever, I think it perhaps is irresponsible to count on that?)
posted by lewedswiver at 2:01 PM on August 17, 2013
I've heard that a breaking off point is that you never pay more than half of the value of the car in repairs, but it might be reasonable to pay less than half; and this is less.
FWIW, I think this is kind of a dumb rule. If the repair is mandatory for the car to be useful, and the value of the repaired car will be larger than the cost of the repair plus the car's scrap value, then SOMEBODY is going to fix the car, and unless your time is especially valuable then it may as well be you who has it fixed. Because if you sell it without fixing it (assuming you're honest about its problems) then the price will be lower by more than just the repair cost.
So, cast a critical eye on the car, assess it's overall condition, and look up its private party value. Don't use Kelly Blue Book; their prices are generally overoptimistic. Use Edmunds. Then ask your mechanic(s) what can be done to be more confident about what repairs are really necessary, and once you're reasonably confident, look for cheaper ways of getting the work done. If repairs+scrap value < repaired value, then go ahead and fix the car. After it's fixed, you can think about whether it makes more sense to keep it, or sell it and get another.
posted by jon1270 at 2:33 PM on August 17, 2013
FWIW, I think this is kind of a dumb rule. If the repair is mandatory for the car to be useful, and the value of the repaired car will be larger than the cost of the repair plus the car's scrap value, then SOMEBODY is going to fix the car, and unless your time is especially valuable then it may as well be you who has it fixed. Because if you sell it without fixing it (assuming you're honest about its problems) then the price will be lower by more than just the repair cost.
So, cast a critical eye on the car, assess it's overall condition, and look up its private party value. Don't use Kelly Blue Book; their prices are generally overoptimistic. Use Edmunds. Then ask your mechanic(s) what can be done to be more confident about what repairs are really necessary, and once you're reasonably confident, look for cheaper ways of getting the work done. If repairs+scrap value < repaired value, then go ahead and fix the car. After it's fixed, you can think about whether it makes more sense to keep it, or sell it and get another.
posted by jon1270 at 2:33 PM on August 17, 2013
1- Nissans don't enjoy the same reputation for reliability that Toyotas and Hondas do.
2- I would recommend replacing the oxygen sensors with proper Nissan branded parts. They do indeed go bad, and a "compatible" part may not be so compatible.
3- Yes, the setup is almost assuredly that the first oxygen sensor is used by the computer to keep the car running properly, and the second one of used to monitor the efficiency of the catalytic convertor. What the emmissions control computer does is compare the indicated oxygen level from the front sensor to the same from the rear. If it sees the same amount of oxygen, or somehow more, it will trigger the error. But this depends on both sensors working properly. An oxygen sensor can fail in a way that the computer is not able to detect. When that happens, you get weird codes like this.
It is both easy and hard to kill a catalytic convertor. If the car is running correctly at the proper mixture (the job of the front oxygen sensor), the convertor should outlast the vehicle. However, if the car is running rich because the front sensor is lazy, the catalytic can get carboned up very quickly.
So my advice is to get both replaced at the same time with Nissan OEM parts, and then run it for a month or two on "top tier" gas and see if it starts to work better.
Also, a mechanic that is trying to sell you a catalytic convertor should have an exhaust gas analyzer and a scope for the oxygen sensor(s) to determine what is actually going on. Instead of relying on poorly interpreted error codes.
(Finally, a car is an expendable / wear item, not an asset. You put money into it to achieve a goal: reliable transportation. The car isn't worth the street price as much as it is worth what it would take to replace. Do the math: what's your cost per mile of doing the repair versus buying a new car? It is almost always cheaper to do the repair.)
posted by gjc at 2:40 PM on August 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
2- I would recommend replacing the oxygen sensors with proper Nissan branded parts. They do indeed go bad, and a "compatible" part may not be so compatible.
3- Yes, the setup is almost assuredly that the first oxygen sensor is used by the computer to keep the car running properly, and the second one of used to monitor the efficiency of the catalytic convertor. What the emmissions control computer does is compare the indicated oxygen level from the front sensor to the same from the rear. If it sees the same amount of oxygen, or somehow more, it will trigger the error. But this depends on both sensors working properly. An oxygen sensor can fail in a way that the computer is not able to detect. When that happens, you get weird codes like this.
It is both easy and hard to kill a catalytic convertor. If the car is running correctly at the proper mixture (the job of the front oxygen sensor), the convertor should outlast the vehicle. However, if the car is running rich because the front sensor is lazy, the catalytic can get carboned up very quickly.
So my advice is to get both replaced at the same time with Nissan OEM parts, and then run it for a month or two on "top tier" gas and see if it starts to work better.
Also, a mechanic that is trying to sell you a catalytic convertor should have an exhaust gas analyzer and a scope for the oxygen sensor(s) to determine what is actually going on. Instead of relying on poorly interpreted error codes.
(Finally, a car is an expendable / wear item, not an asset. You put money into it to achieve a goal: reliable transportation. The car isn't worth the street price as much as it is worth what it would take to replace. Do the math: what's your cost per mile of doing the repair versus buying a new car? It is almost always cheaper to do the repair.)
posted by gjc at 2:40 PM on August 17, 2013 [1 favorite]
Are you familiar with California Bureau of Automotive Repair's emissions-related Consumer Assistance Program?
It gives you a few more options: to apply for financial assistance to make emissions repairs, or to be paid to retire your vehicle.
Before paying for any more repairs, you may want to read through the procedure for financial assistance carefully. You can't ask to be reimbursed after the fact for repairs already completed -- you need to follow a series of steps, and use certain test-and-repair shops.
posted by nacho fries at 3:47 PM on August 17, 2013
It gives you a few more options: to apply for financial assistance to make emissions repairs, or to be paid to retire your vehicle.
Before paying for any more repairs, you may want to read through the procedure for financial assistance carefully. You can't ask to be reimbursed after the fact for repairs already completed -- you need to follow a series of steps, and use certain test-and-repair shops.
posted by nacho fries at 3:47 PM on August 17, 2013
Also: if as your posting history indicates, you happen to still be in Los Angeles and would like a recommendation for a very honest mechanic who specializes in Japanese cars, as well as an ethical smog-test shop (yes, they vary), MeMail me. Both are on the Westside. They got my old Japanese car through the smog rigamarole (including 02 sensor replacement) relatively painlessly.
posted by nacho fries at 3:50 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by nacho fries at 3:50 PM on August 17, 2013
I just wanted to point out that Nissan Altimas of this time period are NOTORIOUS for problems with their catalytic converters. You're going to have to do something about that if you want to pass an emissions test anytime soon. I hope you wrote down the cleared code from your OBDII; this forum post might be relevant.
posted by oceanjesse at 5:03 PM on August 17, 2013
posted by oceanjesse at 5:03 PM on August 17, 2013
Look, I think Mechanic B is giving you a pretty reasonable estimation of what the problem is. I don't own an Altima, but ideally, an engine code is supposed to tell you which sensor is failing. If you had the second sensor replaced, and it's telling you there is a problem between it and the engine, then you're going to either have a problem with the second cat, the first cat, or both. Or you might have a leak somewhere in the exhaust, or you may have bigger engine problems causing a poor air/fuel mixture.
As for your mechanic's skepticism. My understanding is that the catalytic converter itself doesn't tell the on-board electronics that there is a problem; that's what the 02 sensor does. At which point you have to figure out if the sensor is the problem, or the catalytic converter, or if there is a broken seal somewhere else. So replacing the rear 02 sensor was actually the "let's hope this isn't a bigger problem" solution.
From a financial perspective. First of all, make sure your car isn't burning through a ton of oil or underperforming. Because then maybe you have bigger problems and fixing the catalytic converter is sinking a bunch of money into a symptom. Then, if you had the money, I'd replace the front cat and front sensor, have the engine codes cleared and go in for an emissions test. If you fail, they of course let you come back for another test for free (I'm pretty sure AutoChek does this), then you can try replacing the rear catalytic converter. (Then again, if your front 02 sensor is failing - which I assume is located right after the front catalytic converter - then you know it's not the rear catalytic converter causing you problems. Does this make sense?)
Also, from now on, ask your mechanics to tell you what exactly the codes are, or call your local Autozone and find them out for yourself, probably for free. Being able to do this on your car, or future car, saves you a lot of headaches.
By all means look for aftermarket parts, but be sure to buy something new and simple that meets California emissions standards. A lot of people buy aftermarket high-flow catalytic converters or cat-less downpipes to improve engine performance; unfortunately, none of those options are going to pass emissions in this state.
If you're looking for an honest mechanic in Los Angeles, I've always had really positive experiences with Radi's in Echo Park, they go out of their way to be nice and explain things. And I took a chance on Ori's in Hollywood, and I was shocked by how helpful they were and how cheap the repairs were. Call ahead to either place and see if they can help you out.
posted by phaedon at 7:32 PM on August 17, 2013
As for your mechanic's skepticism. My understanding is that the catalytic converter itself doesn't tell the on-board electronics that there is a problem; that's what the 02 sensor does. At which point you have to figure out if the sensor is the problem, or the catalytic converter, or if there is a broken seal somewhere else. So replacing the rear 02 sensor was actually the "let's hope this isn't a bigger problem" solution.
From a financial perspective. First of all, make sure your car isn't burning through a ton of oil or underperforming. Because then maybe you have bigger problems and fixing the catalytic converter is sinking a bunch of money into a symptom. Then, if you had the money, I'd replace the front cat and front sensor, have the engine codes cleared and go in for an emissions test. If you fail, they of course let you come back for another test for free (I'm pretty sure AutoChek does this), then you can try replacing the rear catalytic converter. (Then again, if your front 02 sensor is failing - which I assume is located right after the front catalytic converter - then you know it's not the rear catalytic converter causing you problems. Does this make sense?)
Also, from now on, ask your mechanics to tell you what exactly the codes are, or call your local Autozone and find them out for yourself, probably for free. Being able to do this on your car, or future car, saves you a lot of headaches.
By all means look for aftermarket parts, but be sure to buy something new and simple that meets California emissions standards. A lot of people buy aftermarket high-flow catalytic converters or cat-less downpipes to improve engine performance; unfortunately, none of those options are going to pass emissions in this state.
If you're looking for an honest mechanic in Los Angeles, I've always had really positive experiences with Radi's in Echo Park, they go out of their way to be nice and explain things. And I took a chance on Ori's in Hollywood, and I was shocked by how helpful they were and how cheap the repairs were. Call ahead to either place and see if they can help you out.
posted by phaedon at 7:32 PM on August 17, 2013
FWIW, I also have a 2001-vintage Nissan (a Maxima). The Maximas of that year are notorious for throwing the same type of code I think you are getting (P0420?), indicating that the cat is bad. It's actually a miscommunication between the O2 sensor and the ECU. The cat isn't bad, it's just that the sensor is sending a value to the ECU that is just a bit out of spec, throwing a fault code.
The fix many Maxima owners have discovered is to install a spacer at the sensor mounting point, which moves the sensor a bit out of the stream. The result is that the values the sensor returns are more in spec, and you no longer get a fault code.
It would be very strange for a cat to be bad after only 150,000 miles, unless there was something majorly wrong with the engine, too.
posted by Thorzdad at 5:27 AM on August 18, 2013 [2 favorites]
The fix many Maxima owners have discovered is to install a spacer at the sensor mounting point, which moves the sensor a bit out of the stream. The result is that the values the sensor returns are more in spec, and you no longer get a fault code.
It would be very strange for a cat to be bad after only 150,000 miles, unless there was something majorly wrong with the engine, too.
posted by Thorzdad at 5:27 AM on August 18, 2013 [2 favorites]
Given what Thorzdad just said, I would get a tailpipe-emissions reading done. That ought to tell you if the converters are functioning or not. If they are, Thorzdad just saved you hundreds of dollars.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 5:33 AM on August 18, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by Kirth Gerson at 5:33 AM on August 18, 2013 [2 favorites]
On a car I used to have, I had the cataylitic converter replaced with a straight pipe. It cost me around $15 or $20.
This probably isn't a good idea if you need to pass emissions though.
But are you sure you really need to repair this now? What will happen if it isn't repaired, will it damage the vehicle, or is it just going to be unable to pass inspection in October? If you are going to take it to Oregon in October, you might want to get some quotes from shops there.
You might also want to read this.
posted by yohko at 9:41 AM on August 18, 2013
This probably isn't a good idea if you need to pass emissions though.
But are you sure you really need to repair this now? What will happen if it isn't repaired, will it damage the vehicle, or is it just going to be unable to pass inspection in October? If you are going to take it to Oregon in October, you might want to get some quotes from shops there.
You might also want to read this.
posted by yohko at 9:41 AM on August 18, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
The oxygen sensors are how the engine control system diagnoses the failure of the catalytic converters, and oxygen sensors do fail over time. Make sure that both oxygen sensors have been replaced before you proceed with any catalytic converter replacement.
The bundling of the replacement of the rear catalytic converter and rear oxygen sensor seems suspicious, if that is how it was presented to you. Catalytic converters are much more expensive than oxygen sensors, and are always replaced *after* oxygen sensors replaced, not at the same time.
posted by the Real Dan at 12:09 PM on August 17, 2013