Why does my child smell when he's extremely upset?
March 22, 2011 8:15 PM Subscribe
My son has severe rages. When he has these meltdowns, he gives off a certain odor. It isn't sweat. Any idea what's going on?
He had a big meltdown at his therapy session this afternoon, and his therapist mentioned the way he smells when he's raging. I'd thought it was something all kids do when they get that worked up, but the therapist -- who has certainly seen her fair share of rages -- said no, she's the only one of her clients who does this.
He's eight years old, physically healthy, bathes reasonably often, and doesn't have a diet that's remarkable in any way. The smell has persisted through various medications and times when he hasn't been taking anything. I don't remember when it started, but it's been at least a year and probably much longer. He has severe ADHD and related issues.
Has anyone else run into this odor? Do you know what it is?
He had a big meltdown at his therapy session this afternoon, and his therapist mentioned the way he smells when he's raging. I'd thought it was something all kids do when they get that worked up, but the therapist -- who has certainly seen her fair share of rages -- said no, she's the only one of her clients who does this.
He's eight years old, physically healthy, bathes reasonably often, and doesn't have a diet that's remarkable in any way. The smell has persisted through various medications and times when he hasn't been taking anything. I don't remember when it started, but it's been at least a year and probably much longer. He has severe ADHD and related issues.
Has anyone else run into this odor? Do you know what it is?
I have a diabetic friend who starts to smell like cherry blossom when his blood sugar's way off. He's usually punch drunk and babbling at this point, and is sometimes coherent enough to ask if he's smelling.
posted by scruss at 8:26 PM on March 22, 2011
posted by scruss at 8:26 PM on March 22, 2011
The diabetes-related smell that two commenters are describing comes from ketones. Ketones can become present in the blood when the body starts to burn fat instead of sugar. Their presence is not exclusive to diabetics. For instance, people on the Atkins diet deliberately try to induce ketones.
posted by Conrad Cornelius o'Donald o'Dell at 8:28 PM on March 22, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by Conrad Cornelius o'Donald o'Dell at 8:28 PM on March 22, 2011 [1 favorite]
I don't have kids. But something that came to mind was when my boyfriend would have low blood sugar when he was first diagnosed with diabetes, and he'd get really nasty and angry. Blood sugar being out of whack can cause ketoacidosis, which would make a person smell fruity. This is the same kind of thing that people on low carb diets experience (ketosis), sometimes it smells like nail polish too.
On preview: what Dasein and scruss said.
posted by cabingirl at 8:28 PM on March 22, 2011
On preview: what Dasein and scruss said.
posted by cabingirl at 8:28 PM on March 22, 2011
Please everyone be aware that ketosis in a healthy person (such as from Atkins dieting) is not at all the same thing as ketoacidosis in a diabetic, which can be fatal.
I would definitely recommend that you hunt down the cause of the smell (i.e. with actual doctors and such) as it really seems like it could indicate a metabolic or other physiological problem.
posted by madmethods at 8:42 PM on March 22, 2011 [3 favorites]
I would definitely recommend that you hunt down the cause of the smell (i.e. with actual doctors and such) as it really seems like it could indicate a metabolic or other physiological problem.
posted by madmethods at 8:42 PM on March 22, 2011 [3 favorites]
just for clarification's sake, diabetic ketoacidosis does not go along with low blood sugar - diabetics who are in ketoacidosis have very high blood sugars because their bodies are unable to use the sugar for energy.
posted by treehorn+bunny at 9:00 PM on March 22, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by treehorn+bunny at 9:00 PM on March 22, 2011 [2 favorites]
I don't know your son's history, or the validity of this, but your question reminded me of reading about schizophrenics having a unique sweat smell: http://www.sciencemag.org/content/166/3903/398.abstract
posted by rainygrl716 at 9:03 PM on March 22, 2011
posted by rainygrl716 at 9:03 PM on March 22, 2011
Mod note: From the OP:
The smell is musty, sort of like old shoes or corn chips, but not too unpleasant. Definitely not sweet or fruity. You have to be very close to him to smell it. The smell fades, although it does linger a bit in his hair. He's under a great deal of stress at these times, and very sweaty. I'm waiting to hear back from his doctors about it. And thank you for your polite answers, as I know this sounds odd.posted by jessamyn (staff) at 9:46 PM on March 22, 2011
You say that it isn't sweat, but I have certainly noticed that my sweat from anxiety/stress/fear is different than my sweat from physical exertion. It's sort of like an allover film instead of droplets concentrated in the major sweatzones, and it smells different.
posted by desuetude at 9:54 PM on March 22, 2011 [3 favorites]
posted by desuetude at 9:54 PM on March 22, 2011 [3 favorites]
I have had coworkers who emit odors very suddenly and it seems to coincide with stress. It lingers for a while. The whole room smells. It lingers in jackets. It's musty, and mostly unpleasant just because I know it's a body odor. Quite strong, but these are grown men. Not sure about old shoes, but corn chips could be right for what I've smelled. I have NO idea what it is and I'm not about to ask them.
posted by bread-eater at 10:16 PM on March 22, 2011
posted by bread-eater at 10:16 PM on March 22, 2011
Testosterone. When a friend of mine was on strong steroids for an illness he smelled like that. And was prone to crazy angry spells for a month or two there, it was kind of startling because it wasn't his normal personality.
posted by fshgrl at 10:27 PM on March 22, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by fshgrl at 10:27 PM on March 22, 2011 [1 favorite]
Could this just be the smell of blood, mucus and/or vomit on his breath? You say he's raging -- I presume he's screaming and crying, and possibly getting really worked up.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 10:32 PM on March 22, 2011
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 10:32 PM on March 22, 2011
I've noticed a buttery sort of popcorn smell from people on strong steroids. It's not a "good" smell, but it's not stinky like BO.
posted by dejah420 at 10:35 PM on March 22, 2011
posted by dejah420 at 10:35 PM on March 22, 2011
Adrenalin and/or testosterone are what come to mind for me, but this is definitely something to take to a physician (endocrinologist might be your eventual stop, but a good GP should be able to narrow it down) because of the gamut of possibilities.
posted by batmonkey at 11:46 PM on March 22, 2011
posted by batmonkey at 11:46 PM on March 22, 2011
I'm going with testosterone. We tend to think testosterone only starts up with puberty but it comes in waves (so I've been told) throughout childhood. I was also told this (can be considered as a cause of) changes in mood/behavior. I have two sons and one of them, when he gets really out of sorts, smells, the other does not.
posted by From Bklyn at 12:39 AM on March 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by From Bklyn at 12:39 AM on March 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
If it's testosterone, could that explain this crazy thing? Are there any chemical data that describe the smell of testosterone?
posted by turkeyphant at 3:29 AM on March 23, 2011
posted by turkeyphant at 3:29 AM on March 23, 2011
I have definitely described adolescent boy locker rooms (saturated with boy sweat!) as smelling somewhat of Doritos. Like, that is, to me, the definitive adolescent boy smell when they're sweaty ... a Dorito-y note.
Personally when I get very stressed I swear to god my sweat smells like paprika but nobody else seems to notice it.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 6:43 AM on March 23, 2011
Personally when I get very stressed I swear to god my sweat smells like paprika but nobody else seems to notice it.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 6:43 AM on March 23, 2011
"corn chips" was the exact term used to describe me after I had the closest call with serious injury/death I ever had. I absentmindedly stepped out into the street and my friend yanked me VERY hard back to the curb just as a car went screaming by. It was such a near miss that my fingertips and knee brushed the car. I was completely shaken and took a while to compose myself.
A few minutes later we stopped for a beer. We decided to sit at the bar and after I took my jacket off to hang it on the back of my seat, my friend said "Hey, you smell like corn chips."
So I'm going to say from anecdata that "adrenaline or testosterone" is worth investigating.
posted by Mayor Curley at 6:47 AM on March 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
A few minutes later we stopped for a beer. We decided to sit at the bar and after I took my jacket off to hang it on the back of my seat, my friend said "Hey, you smell like corn chips."
So I'm going to say from anecdata that "adrenaline or testosterone" is worth investigating.
posted by Mayor Curley at 6:47 AM on March 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
There are some diseases of inborn errors of metabolisms that could produce a musty "mousy" body odor in children. The classic that come to mind is: PKU . However, there appear to be no association between the spikes in the smell and emotional stress and all newborns (at least in US) should have under gone mandatory screening a week or so after birth.
posted by Pantalaimon at 6:53 AM on March 23, 2011
posted by Pantalaimon at 6:53 AM on March 23, 2011
He's eight years old, he probably doesn't have much circulating testosterone.
posted by Anatoly Pisarenko at 7:46 AM on March 23, 2011
posted by Anatoly Pisarenko at 7:46 AM on March 23, 2011
He's eight years old, he probably doesn't have much circulating testosterone.
Precocious puberty is a possibility.
posted by Halloween Jack at 8:28 AM on March 23, 2011
Precocious puberty is a possibility.
posted by Halloween Jack at 8:28 AM on March 23, 2011
Sorry, no idea about the smell. My son had rages, as well. I learned to insist he go to the bathroom, as he was sometimes unaware of his need to pee or poop, and it caused stress. And to provide a quick snack, like a sliced apple or popcorn, and a glass of water. 2 other things helped. A shower acted as water therapy; he could cry or scream with no consequence, and it calmed him down, and Benadryl, on a doctor's advice. Don't use Benadryl without consulting his doctor.
posted by theora55 at 8:34 AM on March 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by theora55 at 8:34 AM on March 23, 2011 [1 favorite]
He's eight years old, he probably doesn't have much circulating testosterone.
No, not all the time. But during a rage? Certainly possible. Sex hormones ebb and flow, and as puberty comes in fits and starts, and only in response to higher testosterone levels, it makes sense that testosterone levels must start increasing before puberty appears, and that they aren't necessarily a steady thing.
(But it could be some other body process that correlates with testosterone- adrenelin, dopamine, what have you.)
posted by gjc at 8:47 AM on March 23, 2011
Testosterone is absolutely what occurred to me.
I know you are thinking, "Hey, he's only eight!" But that's why his therapist says the other kids don't have this smell--something is different about your eight-year-old.
Should be easy enough to take him to a doctor and ask to have his testosterone levels tested.
posted by misha at 10:29 AM on March 23, 2011
I know you are thinking, "Hey, he's only eight!" But that's why his therapist says the other kids don't have this smell--something is different about your eight-year-old.
Should be easy enough to take him to a doctor and ask to have his testosterone levels tested.
posted by misha at 10:29 AM on March 23, 2011
Oh, and I just wanted to say that if your son is on the kind of ADHD meds that are also basically amphetamines, and he is dealing with testosterone issues, it is no wonder he has really bad rages! Just thinking about that, and what he must be going through, makes me really feel for the kid. I hope you find the problem and can deal with it soon, it must be awful for him.
posted by misha at 10:32 AM on March 23, 2011
posted by misha at 10:32 AM on March 23, 2011
There are some diseases of inborn errors of metabolisms that could produce a musty "mousy" body odor in children. The classic that come to mind is: PKU . However, there appear to be no association between the spikes in the smell and emotional stress and all newborns (at least in US) should have under gone mandatory screening a week or so after birth.
This site describes some smells associated with metaboic disorders. If your son had the classical version of most of those disorders its highly unlikely he would have got to the age of 8 without being diagnosed. However he could possibly have a milder form of one of them.
The most likely one seems to me MADD (which is routinely screend in babies in the UK, but I don't know about the US). People with MADD can't burn fat properly to get energy, so they get low blood sugar if they don't eat for a while. Is your son more prone to rages when he's hungry?
posted by *becca* at 5:03 PM on March 23, 2011
This site describes some smells associated with metaboic disorders. If your son had the classical version of most of those disorders its highly unlikely he would have got to the age of 8 without being diagnosed. However he could possibly have a milder form of one of them.
The most likely one seems to me MADD (which is routinely screend in babies in the UK, but I don't know about the US). People with MADD can't burn fat properly to get energy, so they get low blood sugar if they don't eat for a while. Is your son more prone to rages when he's hungry?
posted by *becca* at 5:03 PM on March 23, 2011
I knew a man who had serious anger issues, bipolar disorder, and what seemed like the beginnings of paranoid schizophrenia (never formally diagnosed). He was prone to throwing destructive and violent tantrums, and he always had a very foul smell when he was in a rage. He also had this smell when he had stolen something or done something he knew was very wrong and was waiting to be caught.
The smell permeated everything he owned, to the point that when he moved, his landlord had to get rid of all the furniture in his room and replace the carpet.
The smell was much worse than corn chips though, it was closer to feces; very foul and sour. I always had thought it was fear and adrenaline, but now that I think about it testosterone could very well have played a part. The smell was most noticeable in his teens, during and after puberty.
posted by lockstitch at 10:31 PM on March 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
The smell permeated everything he owned, to the point that when he moved, his landlord had to get rid of all the furniture in his room and replace the carpet.
The smell was much worse than corn chips though, it was closer to feces; very foul and sour. I always had thought it was fear and adrenaline, but now that I think about it testosterone could very well have played a part. The smell was most noticeable in his teens, during and after puberty.
posted by lockstitch at 10:31 PM on March 24, 2011 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by oonh at 8:24 PM on March 22, 2011