Finding friends as a nonspiritual person
January 9, 2011 7:39 PM Subscribe
How do I find friends and relationships as a formerly-religious-now-agnostic person?
When I was a teenager, I embraced a fairly fundamentalist, evangelical form of Christianity. I attended a religious college and made lots of friends who shared my beliefs and convictions. After college I became very involved in a church, led Bible studies, outreach, and continued to grow and expand my circle of friends from those activities. When many people my age were out going to clubs, seeing bands, and forming circles around other things, I was in prayer meetings and Christian volunteer groups. I had no problem forming friendships during that phase of my life - I'm a warm, social guy and people liked to be around me.
Late in my 20s the pent-up doubts that I had been experiencing for a while came to the surface, and at the tail end of those years I realized that I no longer believed all of those things that had so defined me for more than a decade of my most formative years. Even though the process of coming to terms with my lack of faith was gutwrenching, I'm absolutely glad that I went through it and consider myself healthier for it.
The issue is that virtually all of my friendships were forged in the time in my life where I was known as a "strong believer". Now I feel absolutely torn between two worlds. Even though I have many great friends who care for me deeply, they still see me as someone that USED TO believe what they believe. They're fine people, but still when I open up and try to be "real" with them about my life now, there's a sense that they are hoping and praying that I will see the light and return to my former convictions, something that will probably never happen.
So. . .I need to make some new friendships that fit who I am NOW, not who I used to be. But I'm finding this very difficult. First, I'm finding it hard to relate to people who aren't religious because such a huge chunk of my life was spent having different life experiences. In my formative years church and church related activities were so central to my social life that I missed out on how to make friends outside that context. I also operated under a completely different set of assumptions about relationships during that time, and I'm finding it hard to adjust as I go about dating. I have been active in online dating, but find it difficult because I probably give off an unintended religious vibe - many of the people who express interest in me are of the religious type and I can't seem to generate interest among those not religious.
So, I guess my rambling question is - how do I go about meeting and making new friends and finding relationships in my early thirties as someone who missed out on all the nonreligious socializing in my 20s?
When I was a teenager, I embraced a fairly fundamentalist, evangelical form of Christianity. I attended a religious college and made lots of friends who shared my beliefs and convictions. After college I became very involved in a church, led Bible studies, outreach, and continued to grow and expand my circle of friends from those activities. When many people my age were out going to clubs, seeing bands, and forming circles around other things, I was in prayer meetings and Christian volunteer groups. I had no problem forming friendships during that phase of my life - I'm a warm, social guy and people liked to be around me.
Late in my 20s the pent-up doubts that I had been experiencing for a while came to the surface, and at the tail end of those years I realized that I no longer believed all of those things that had so defined me for more than a decade of my most formative years. Even though the process of coming to terms with my lack of faith was gutwrenching, I'm absolutely glad that I went through it and consider myself healthier for it.
The issue is that virtually all of my friendships were forged in the time in my life where I was known as a "strong believer". Now I feel absolutely torn between two worlds. Even though I have many great friends who care for me deeply, they still see me as someone that USED TO believe what they believe. They're fine people, but still when I open up and try to be "real" with them about my life now, there's a sense that they are hoping and praying that I will see the light and return to my former convictions, something that will probably never happen.
So. . .I need to make some new friendships that fit who I am NOW, not who I used to be. But I'm finding this very difficult. First, I'm finding it hard to relate to people who aren't religious because such a huge chunk of my life was spent having different life experiences. In my formative years church and church related activities were so central to my social life that I missed out on how to make friends outside that context. I also operated under a completely different set of assumptions about relationships during that time, and I'm finding it hard to adjust as I go about dating. I have been active in online dating, but find it difficult because I probably give off an unintended religious vibe - many of the people who express interest in me are of the religious type and I can't seem to generate interest among those not religious.
So, I guess my rambling question is - how do I go about meeting and making new friends and finding relationships in my early thirties as someone who missed out on all the nonreligious socializing in my 20s?
It's been my experience that the best way to meet new people (whether it be for friendship or love) has been by getting involved in some extracurriculars after work or on the weekends- Join a class on something you're interested in, volunteer for a cause you believe in, etc etc. You will already have at least one thing in common with the people you meet while doing so, and though it takes time, I'm sure you will be able to make friendships. The other thing to keep in mind is the power of the networks you will build while doing so. You may get invited out to a group event and get introduced to the friend of one of the people you know and really hit it off. Try to take advantage of every conceivable opportunity to be introduced to people that you already like... Their friends are likely to be people that you can find something in common with as well. Lastly, take risks! Be bold in introducing yourself to folks, show them you're confident, and if you get shot down, the only harm is maybe a little embarrassment. On the other hand if you don't ever reach out and take a chance, the harm could mean never meeting anyone. I think/hope these principles really ought to apply whether you're religious or not.... I wish you all the best in your search!
posted by samuraipizza at 7:59 PM on January 9, 2011
posted by samuraipizza at 7:59 PM on January 9, 2011
This seems almost too obvious to mention, but.. HOBBIES!
What are your hobbies? If your hobbies are on the more anti-social end of the spectrum, maybe you need to find a more social hobby. Join a league, band, crew, team or troupe of your choice.
I've always played in bands and made lots of close friendships that way.
posted by j03 at 8:00 PM on January 9, 2011
What are your hobbies? If your hobbies are on the more anti-social end of the spectrum, maybe you need to find a more social hobby. Join a league, band, crew, team or troupe of your choice.
I've always played in bands and made lots of close friendships that way.
posted by j03 at 8:00 PM on January 9, 2011
try http://www.atheistnexus.com
posted by ChefJoAnna at 8:02 PM on January 9, 2011
posted by ChefJoAnna at 8:02 PM on January 9, 2011
Have you considered seeking out nontheistic social groups in your area? Several years back I found one here in SC via Meetup; while I was a little nervous about it at first, the group was quite welcoming and fun. I know of several people in the group who said they'd joined specfically because they were looking for some alternative to the social interaction they'd gotten as part of belonging to a religious group, so it's certainly not uncommon - and it isn't as if the group somehow "met" to be non-religious together; instead, it was just a bunch of very down-to-earth people who would meet for drinks and dinner every week or so, plus the occasional party at someone's house, without ever having to worry about explaining to anyone why you weren't religious ... lots of fun and really not intimidating at all, even to a social doofus like myself.
posted by DingoMutt at 8:19 PM on January 9, 2011
posted by DingoMutt at 8:19 PM on January 9, 2011
Here's a data point: I love hearing about people's religious upbringings. I'm pretty secular, I was raised secular, but I am very interested in learning about other people's religious beliefs and the cultural environment they were raised in. Sometimes I'm a little bit jealous of the strong community found in some fundamentalist belief systems. Some of the best conversations I've had at school have been talking with my classmates about our families, communities and religious backgrounds - and talking about religion brought us past polite chit chat to get to really know each other.
So for what it's worth, there are probably a ton of people out there who had secular upbringings, who would be very interested to learn about yours and welcome you with open arms.
posted by ladypants at 8:20 PM on January 9, 2011
So for what it's worth, there are probably a ton of people out there who had secular upbringings, who would be very interested to learn about yours and welcome you with open arms.
posted by ladypants at 8:20 PM on January 9, 2011
Since you describe yourself as agnostic (as opposed to atheistic), I wonder if trying out different congregations might be a good way to go for you?
I wasn't raised in an Evangelical background, and I'm not a huge believer in organized religion, but I do value church as a community-building space. I think that since this seems to be what you miss most, it might be worth investigating to see whether you can find a "worshipful" congregation that's more in line with your values.
There are tons of congregations (individual congregations or organized religions) that have very different approaches to religious belief than Evangelical Christianity. I'm Episcopalian (which I wouldn't necessarily recommend for you - it definitely requires some sort of adherence to a doctrine), but I've been drawn to the approaches of Unity Churches and Unitarianism. In fact, some Unitarians even allow for atheism.
posted by lesli212 at 8:20 PM on January 9, 2011
I wasn't raised in an Evangelical background, and I'm not a huge believer in organized religion, but I do value church as a community-building space. I think that since this seems to be what you miss most, it might be worth investigating to see whether you can find a "worshipful" congregation that's more in line with your values.
There are tons of congregations (individual congregations or organized religions) that have very different approaches to religious belief than Evangelical Christianity. I'm Episcopalian (which I wouldn't necessarily recommend for you - it definitely requires some sort of adherence to a doctrine), but I've been drawn to the approaches of Unity Churches and Unitarianism. In fact, some Unitarians even allow for atheism.
posted by lesli212 at 8:20 PM on January 9, 2011
I totally get it and I'm so lucky to have a group of ex-believers from my fundamentalist xian college. We get drunk and sing hymns and can make baptisn and communion jokes together. There's something to that shared history.
is there an ex-sherlockt's denomination internet resource?
posted by kristymcj at 8:39 PM on January 9, 2011
is there an ex-sherlockt's denomination internet resource?
posted by kristymcj at 8:39 PM on January 9, 2011
IF you're still interested in talking about religion and religious topics, I suggest checking out your local Unitarian Universalist congregation. UU congregations (or fellowships) really vary, so it depends where you live, but in some areas it may be more like debate club on spiritual topics. You will probably meet people in a UU ccommunity who grew up in and/or still belong to a wide variety of faiths. The one I went to growing up had lots of pagans and lots of atheists and agnostics and a sprinkling of Christians as well as some regulars who were Jewish and Baha'i. This was in a very small fellowship with no regular chaplain or minister. Congregation members there give presentations, and discussion follows. My understanding of UUs in general is that bigger churches, who do have clergy members, follow a similar format but may be a bit more formal and/or may have a heavier spiritual element.
Either way, it's a community based around "search for truth" rather than around belief.
Obviously if you're not interested in religious topics right now, that's probably out--in which case, nthing Meetup.com, particularly book clubs (if you like to read). Discussion-focused groups tend to be good for making friends in my experience.
posted by equivocator at 9:32 PM on January 9, 2011
Either way, it's a community based around "search for truth" rather than around belief.
Obviously if you're not interested in religious topics right now, that's probably out--in which case, nthing Meetup.com, particularly book clubs (if you like to read). Discussion-focused groups tend to be good for making friends in my experience.
posted by equivocator at 9:32 PM on January 9, 2011
I thought you were describing me there!
Seriously, networking takes place everywhere: the bar, the bookstore, the library, the Hash House Harriers. Start with interests and go from there.
posted by chrisinseoul at 9:37 PM on January 9, 2011
Seriously, networking takes place everywhere: the bar, the bookstore, the library, the Hash House Harriers. Start with interests and go from there.
posted by chrisinseoul at 9:37 PM on January 9, 2011
Response by poster: Thanks for the answers so far. . .I do need to get out and make more of an effort to find classes, hobbies, and groups where I can meet people. I think I'm also looking for stories of people who have successfully built a different circle of friends after leaving faith behind - how they started the process, what it was like for them, etc.
posted by sherlockt at 10:04 PM on January 9, 2011
posted by sherlockt at 10:04 PM on January 9, 2011
Grew up an Orthodox Jew with a very tight-knit community. Went to an Orthodox college and transferred to a secular one but even there all my friends were Orthodox or at least Orthodox-ish Jews. Realized I didn't believe a couple of years out of college and by far the hardest part was losing my community and the sole way I knew how to make friends. It did not help that I'm an introvert.
Part of it is realizing that you're not really a totally different kind of human being than other people. If your community was anything like mine, you've been trained to think of people in kind of an "us-vs-them" mentality, but it's really just an illusion, like religion itself. There is no us and them. It's all us.
It's important to realize that people can seem to be very different -- this one's a rich snobby WASP, this one's an immigrant, this one's an actual Tea Party member -- and can still be your friends. Most of my closest friends have similar or even the same worldview as me, but I have non-inner-circle but still pretty good friends who are each of those things.
Therapy has also been helpful.
The secret to making friends, for me, is to see the same people repeatedly over a period of time. Sounds kind of obvious, but I think it's important to spell it out. You're probably not going to just meet someone at a party, hit it off, and magically be friends. You need to spend time with people repeatedly for a long time.
That's why classes, hobbies, and groups are so helpful, as you mentioned. I'd add work, if you work at a place with enough people or with the "right" people. I met my best friend at work. We were on a project together, both fresh out of college, and we both liked to play basketball. So we actually started a regular basketball game, Wednesday evenings, every week, with evites and everything. We also ate lunch together at work a lot after we weren't on the same project. Over a couple of years, we became good friends. I became friendly with others in the basketball group so that I looked forward to seeing them and talking with them, but didn't really hang out with them outside of basketball.
I also joined a chess club at work, where I made some less-close friends. One of those friends happened to have a volleyball group, so I joined that, and over a couple of years he became an ok friend, someone I enjoy talking to but don't spend much time with. Another person in that club became kind of a work-friend but not an outside-work friend.
Then a couple of years ago I started going back to the basketball group from my old, religious days. Most of the people there were Orthodox, but I also got to know some fellow ex-Orthodox people. Two of them became my very good, let's-all-hang-out-every-weekend friends. One of them is gradually turning into an even closer friend than that. They also know other ex-Orthodox people, so I've gotten to know them and it's kind of cool to know that there's a little "ex-pat" community.
I also joined an informal poker group, where I've gotten friendly with people but nobody's turned into a genuine friend yet.
This all worked well for the menfolk, but dating was a little harder, since there were very few women at work, basketball, or poker. Therefore, I turned to online dating, which has been an enormous success for me. I went on a bunch of dud dates and then a couple of small relationships, and then a major relationship, and then I met my wife!
My wife is extremely extroverted, so that makes things even easier. Just last week, she befriended our neighbors and we had dinner at their house and are going to have them at our place next week. She's turned several friends-of-friends into friends, too.
(Oh, one more thing: Talking about leaving my religion is actually a great ice breaker! People find it fascinating, whether they are themselves religious or not. You don't want to be too obsessed with it, of course, but people really seem to respect me for making such a hard life choice, etc., and are curious to hear the story.)
So that's my story. Message: It gets better. Feel free to email me. :-)
posted by callmejay at 12:32 PM on January 10, 2011 [1 favorite]
Part of it is realizing that you're not really a totally different kind of human being than other people. If your community was anything like mine, you've been trained to think of people in kind of an "us-vs-them" mentality, but it's really just an illusion, like religion itself. There is no us and them. It's all us.
It's important to realize that people can seem to be very different -- this one's a rich snobby WASP, this one's an immigrant, this one's an actual Tea Party member -- and can still be your friends. Most of my closest friends have similar or even the same worldview as me, but I have non-inner-circle but still pretty good friends who are each of those things.
Therapy has also been helpful.
The secret to making friends, for me, is to see the same people repeatedly over a period of time. Sounds kind of obvious, but I think it's important to spell it out. You're probably not going to just meet someone at a party, hit it off, and magically be friends. You need to spend time with people repeatedly for a long time.
That's why classes, hobbies, and groups are so helpful, as you mentioned. I'd add work, if you work at a place with enough people or with the "right" people. I met my best friend at work. We were on a project together, both fresh out of college, and we both liked to play basketball. So we actually started a regular basketball game, Wednesday evenings, every week, with evites and everything. We also ate lunch together at work a lot after we weren't on the same project. Over a couple of years, we became good friends. I became friendly with others in the basketball group so that I looked forward to seeing them and talking with them, but didn't really hang out with them outside of basketball.
I also joined a chess club at work, where I made some less-close friends. One of those friends happened to have a volleyball group, so I joined that, and over a couple of years he became an ok friend, someone I enjoy talking to but don't spend much time with. Another person in that club became kind of a work-friend but not an outside-work friend.
Then a couple of years ago I started going back to the basketball group from my old, religious days. Most of the people there were Orthodox, but I also got to know some fellow ex-Orthodox people. Two of them became my very good, let's-all-hang-out-every-weekend friends. One of them is gradually turning into an even closer friend than that. They also know other ex-Orthodox people, so I've gotten to know them and it's kind of cool to know that there's a little "ex-pat" community.
I also joined an informal poker group, where I've gotten friendly with people but nobody's turned into a genuine friend yet.
This all worked well for the menfolk, but dating was a little harder, since there were very few women at work, basketball, or poker. Therefore, I turned to online dating, which has been an enormous success for me. I went on a bunch of dud dates and then a couple of small relationships, and then a major relationship, and then I met my wife!
My wife is extremely extroverted, so that makes things even easier. Just last week, she befriended our neighbors and we had dinner at their house and are going to have them at our place next week. She's turned several friends-of-friends into friends, too.
(Oh, one more thing: Talking about leaving my religion is actually a great ice breaker! People find it fascinating, whether they are themselves religious or not. You don't want to be too obsessed with it, of course, but people really seem to respect me for making such a hard life choice, etc., and are curious to hear the story.)
So that's my story. Message: It gets better. Feel free to email me. :-)
posted by callmejay at 12:32 PM on January 10, 2011 [1 favorite]
Check your mefi mail...
posted by scooterdog at 1:15 PM on January 10, 2011
posted by scooterdog at 1:15 PM on January 10, 2011
This thread is closed to new comments.
The answer is: find other points of connection, especially activities that you can do with other people that give you a common thing to talk about and an interval of scheduled time together each week. Find a boardgame store that has an open game night, join a hiking club, book group, photography club, casual soccer league, take a class, etc. Volunteer in some kind of local cause you endorse - help at a soup kitchen, help a local clean-up-trails group, help band birds with the Audubon society, etc. Friendships will come from some of these. If you have interests (running, photography, painting, fishing, whatever) you have something to talk to people about, and that's a basis for making friends.
posted by LobsterMitten at 7:55 PM on January 9, 2011 [2 favorites]