Kids Discussion So Soon?

September 14, 2010 1:56 PM

For a month I've been dating someone I've met online. His online profile displays N/A on the topic of wanting children. While on another conversation topic he mentions that he "doesn't really want children". I do. Should I be discussing this topic conversation just one month into dating? I can't even begin to know how to talk about this so soon, but -- yeah -- it will eventually be an issue. What now?
posted by alice_curiouse to Human Relations (27 answers total)

Talk about it. I don't know how old you are, but if it's important to you, it's worth talking about. Bring it up casually or seriously; doesn't matter.
posted by Madamina at 2:00 PM on September 14, 2010 [2 favorites]

This is one of those points that's a dealbreaker all around. I don't want to sound like a downer, but it's unlikely that he'll change his mind. There are lots of guys out there who do indeed want kids, I suggest you move on.
posted by dbiedny at 2:01 PM on September 14, 2010 [2 favorites]

I agree but for a different reason: if it is important enough for the guy to mention, then it is important enough for you to confront, discuss, or end things.
posted by Postroad at 2:02 PM on September 14, 2010

Did your online profile say you wanted kids?

Who contacted whom first?

Depending on the answers to those two questions, he might think the kids thing is not a big deal to you, since you are dating him despite what his profile says.

If his kids attitude is a dealbreaker for you, have the conversation now and move on.
posted by vincele at 2:02 PM on September 14, 2010 [2 favorites]

If you are dating for marriage, ie, not necessarily ready to marry this guy tomorrow, but dating with the intent to find the relationship that will lead to marriage, then you pretty much are wasting your time with this guy. There's nothing to discuss -- he's said he doesn't want children. The "really" is a softener so he doesn't come off as a misanthrope.

And by marriage I mean whatever relationship state you will want to be in before having children.
posted by thebazilist at 2:03 PM on September 14, 2010 [3 favorites]

Are you both looking for long term relationships? Do you want your long term relationship to eventually involve having children? If yes, then I don't think it's too late. "Doesn't really want children" isn't necessarily set in stone. It's impossible to know what you'll want in 5 or 10 years, but if he absolutely knows he won't want children ever, then maybe it'd be a good idea to not get involved with him.

Depending on how old you are, I don't think it's ever weird to ask those kinds of questions. It's an important life thing to know about the person you are dating. Casually bring it up. You can even start by talking about your niece/nephew/cousin. Then, ask him if he'd ever want kids. As long as you don't make a big deal out of his answer immediately, it's fine. Don't break up with him on the spot if he says "absolutely no, not ever".
posted by two lights above the sea at 2:05 PM on September 14, 2010

Depends on if it's important to you.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:09 PM on September 14, 2010

If you know you want children, it's best to ask up front. If he doesn't want them, it's better to cut your losses now than to get further enmeshed.
posted by Anima Mundi at 2:11 PM on September 14, 2010 [1 favorite]

If you are dating to find a life partner, and having kids is important to you, the rule is that you do not date people who don't want kids. Seriously, it may be a pleasant waste of time but it's a waste of your time.

There is nothing wrong with being clear with others about what you want out of your life. Honestly, it's OK to say "I really enjoy your company and I've enjoyed these last few weeks, but while I respect your decision not to have kids, they are important to me and so is spending my dating time with someone who is at least open to that in case the relationship unfolds long term."

See what he says but be prepared to wish him goodbye and good luck on the basis of his response.
posted by DarlingBri at 2:12 PM on September 14, 2010 [6 favorites]

As someone who does not want children, and that being a deal breaker for me, I don't believe it's ever too soon to have the discussion. My general rule was that I wanted to have the discussion before we had sex, so that if anything happened we'd be on the same page.
posted by librarianamy at 2:50 PM on September 14, 2010

Best answer: Well, he put "N/A", which means he's either on the fence, or he didn't understand the question and thought it was more of a "check this box if you want children" thing.

If it were "No", would you have started dating him? Ask him. Find out why he answered a yes/no question with "N/A". It's a fundamental thing, and as someone who loves his kids but doesn't want any more, if I were dating I wouldn't be choosing people who had answered "yes" to that question...unless I wasn't interested in dating long term, and I was a bit flexible with the truth, so then I might answer "N/A" instead of "no" so I didn't accidentally disqualify myself from potential dates.

So ask, and the context of "why did you put N/A?" is a great opener that isn't heavy.
posted by davejay at 2:54 PM on September 14, 2010 [2 favorites]

Disclaimer: My husband and I have been married for 16 yrs, and we are "childfree by choice" and loving it.

Please, don't try to change his mind if he's not one who wants kids! I'm watching relationships all around me where the people involved think they're going to change their partners' minds about this (and other things, but that's a whole other thread) I'm supporting the multitude of folks who are saying, in essence, "Get a real answer now, and deal with it if the answer is NO." One of these couples i know is in their mid 20's and the guy can't make the girl understand that NO means NO. Luckily the guy realizes that no matter what he does, if they have sex, the procreation decision is in HER hands. (condoms break!)
posted by ChefJoAnna at 2:59 PM on September 14, 2010 [1 favorite]

I think it's fair to casually ask if he wants kids down the line. If you don't say anything about "our kids" or anything that would spook him, I think this would be a totally normal conversation once you've known each other a few weeks.

After you get a straight answer, you can decide how important it is to you to be with someone who has the same long-term goals as you.
posted by auto-correct at 3:47 PM on September 14, 2010

I suspect at this point in time, if you want kids, that is something to bring up on date number two. (Date number one being the date to see if you're even willing to want to see him another time.) On date 2, if you know for a fact he doesn't want 'em, then you're out early without too many hard feelings or too much attachment.

"Doesn't really want children" probably translates into "Left to my own devices, I don't really want 'em, but I'm not 100% adamant about it." (But not enthusiastic either.) He sounds kind of passively childfree rather than assertively so. So... you're probably gonna need to throw this fish back at any rate.
posted by jenfullmoon at 4:30 PM on September 14, 2010

Response by poster: All of this asking people on date two that I want kids sounds so strange, being that I am not even sure that I want to get married.

And I've decided that even if I'm single at some point, I will just adopt and be a single parent, and still date or whatever.

But I guess I do feel weird about dating someone who adamantly does not want kids.

It's just a weird conversation, but I guess I'd better have it.
posted by alice_curiouse at 4:42 PM on September 14, 2010

As someone whose 2 year relationship (with someone I was very much in love with) recently ended because he definitely doesn't want kids and I definitely do want kids I can tell you that I really wish I had brought it up earlier.

His dating profile left the question blank and I just never brought it up. I found out when he started talking about how he wanted to get a vasectomy so he wouldn't have to worry about it anymore.

Hell, I've brought it up with people I'm casually dating since then just in case the very casual turns into more. Yeah, not going through that again.
posted by magnetsphere at 5:13 PM on September 14, 2010 [2 favorites]

I think it's worth bringing up if it's important to you.

However, "doesn't really want kids" can mean a variety of things. Maybe he would want kids if he found the right person to have them with. Maybe he's in his mid 20's and can't see a time when he will earn enough money to provide a safe home, fund education savings plans, and pay for after-school activities, and so feels like it's irresponsible to consider having kids at this point. Perhaps he's using it as a defense against potential partners who want kids soon... so soon that this is the primary concern in their lives at this point.

My point is that yes, you should discuss this with him. However, as we don't know him or you, we can't really say if this is a firm "nope, never" or more of a point at which there may be some flexibility.
posted by everythings_interrelated at 5:16 PM on September 14, 2010

Everything's_Interelated makes some good points to consider. It may be that he doesn't want to raise a kid up from infancy (for whatever reason). While my SO and I are "No Kids, thanks," I have let her know that should she change her mind, I'm not opposed to adopting an older child in the 4-8 yr old range. So it is possible that it's the baby thing that he is not into. (FWIW, my no-babies-no-babies-no-babies-STOP! position has to do wth my age and my family's genetic health history, which is why I'm open to adoption of an older child-- I don't want to be an old man, still putting kids through high school, nor do I want to pass down a stacked DNA deck of chronic deadly illnesses)

Have the talk and find out WHY he doesn't want kids. There may be some middle ground there that neither of you are aware of yet.
posted by KingEdRa at 5:34 PM on September 14, 2010

"Doesn't really want children" probably translates into "Left to my own devices, I don't really want 'em, but I'm not 100% adamant about it." (But not enthusiastic either.) He sounds kind of passively childfree rather than assertively so. So... you're probably gonna need to throw this fish back at any rate.

This was exactly how my husband felt about it. In fact, when we started dating his dating profile said that he didn't want kids. However, he also acknowledged that he'd be reluctantly okay with it (and now he just says he'd be okay with it) if his partner ever wanted them.

These things can change over time, even if you shouldn't necessarily be campaigning actively to change them.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 5:41 PM on September 14, 2010

I don't deny that the second date idea is weird. But kids are the number one relationship dealbreaker of all time because there's no middle ground you can reach about it. You should probably get it over with, exactly for the reasons that magnetsphere said. Even if you 'might not want to get married', kids are a permanent commitment, right?

Like her, I wish I had had that conversation earlier in a relationship, though for different reasons.
posted by jenfullmoon at 7:33 PM on September 14, 2010

There are a lot of reasons not to have children. Maybe you should talk to him about why he doesn't want them and consider not having them yourself. We don't need to assume that he's the one that needs to change.
posted by outlandishmarxist at 7:44 PM on September 14, 2010

Perhaps he's a bit like me. I never feel comfortable answering that question because I'm not sure yet. When I meet the right person I will probably be more positive to the idea but it's really hard to think about it in my current situation.

What's his relationship history like? My only relationships (not for lack of trying) were 6 months and 2.5 months. It's hard for me to go into a relationship thinking "yes I really want kids" right now because I know want to be in a stable long-term relationship (probably married) and in a better financial situation first.
posted by globotomy at 8:02 PM on September 14, 2010

I had this conversation very early on in my relationship, too. (Probably about a month in as well.) For me, it was an awkward but mandatory conversation--I lean towards childfree, and while there is the possibility I may change my mind about it, I'm planning my life around the concept of 'no kids, no way' until when (IF) that lightning bolt hits me. So I wanted everything on the table and my guy has to be on the same page as me.

For me, I'm not really thinking of marriage, but I was definitely thinking about accidental pregnancies or whatnot, so one day out of the blue I just blurted out "Okay, so, what are your thoughts on kids? I'm not thinking of marriage or 10 years down the road or whatever, but I don't want kids now and likely not ever, and I need for you to be on the same page as me for at least the foreseeable future you see this relationship having."

Thankfully, my boyfriend replied that although he thinks he'd like kids and would make a good father, he has no inclination to be one for at least 4-5 years and thus is fully behind me in my choices. And I'm okay with a 4-5 year timeline.

I don't know if that kind of timeline works for you. Good luck with your conversation; it's never easy.
posted by Hakaisha at 8:15 PM on September 14, 2010

Wait, just realized that you're on the other side of this equation so my answer doesn't really apply to you. Whoops, need more caffeine.

Anyway. What I want to emphasize is that it's okay (and good!) to ask about important issues like this. I'm assuming it's all going great so far, and that you're a more long-term planner person, given that you're asking a question that implies you may potentially want kids with this person.

I think you need to decide on a rough timeline. Like, "I'd like kids in the next [timespan]" (5 months, 8 years, anything in between). Then ask him if he can be compatible with that timeline. "I don't want kids ever" vs. "I don't want kids in the next 2 years" are two very different things to work with. However, if you're the long-term planning type and he can't imagine past the next 1.5 years, if his answer is a 'no, I don't want kids now or within the next [timespan]', and can't imagine further than that, you'll have to decide if you can wait long enough for him to reassess after that time.

Again, good luck.
posted by Hakaisha at 8:28 PM on September 14, 2010

It really depends on you.

If he doesn't want kids and has written that, it's fairly clear. There is no mistake, he doesn't want them. If you are dating for marriage, or are leaving the possibility open for marriage and you want children, then there is no mistake. You want children.

There is no confusion here, only facts so you can't dance around this. You two obviously have very different views. Talking to him about it this early on will likely only scare him off. Granted, it's not written in stone, but two words usually frighten the hell out of them, the M word or the C word (which is a precursor to the M word). It already sounds like you have doubt or you wouldn't be posting.

I very seldom say this because I'm always the hopeful romantic, but not in this instance. You should probably move along and find another. It doesn't sound like the compatibility is there.

I met my husband online. Fortunately nowadays, they are many more in the sea due to the web. What a wonderful world it is!
posted by magnoliasouth at 9:13 PM on September 14, 2010

Best answer: Like PhoBWanKenobi, I'll say things can change. I was a definite "No kids wanted" guy - I'd even had a vasectomy - no "oops" for me, thank you very much. Then I met my wife, and she's pregnant with our child (I had the vasectomy reversed). I am not in a position to say how rare this change in viewpoint might be, I am simply one datapoint.

She knew I'd had the vasectomy shortly after we started dating, and my mind didn't change until the time I proposed. She never forced the issue - she simply let me know that she wanted kids. If she had made some sort of ultimatum before I came around to my current view, I'm not sure how I would have responded.

All this really means is that whatever his answers are for why he doesn't really want kids, and however certain he is about that now, it might change. I would hold off on having a 'serious' conversation about this at least until you get to the stage that you think you might want to have kids with him.
posted by birdsquared at 11:51 PM on September 14, 2010 [1 favorite]

Talk about it. When my partner and I first started dating, he said he didn't want kids. I was kind of ambivalent about it so it wasn't a big deal. But a few weeks later, we had a pregnancy scare and he was much more disappointed than I was when it came back negative. Now, we both know that we want to have kids together.
posted by xyla2000 at 2:50 AM on November 23, 2010