MayDay! Historical floundering!
August 6, 2010 11:40 AM Subscribe
Mad Men historical accuracy filter: Would public schools really have had a maypole dance in 1963?
My husband and I are watching Mad Men on DVD, and every now and then, like all good Mad Men fans, we wonder about the historical accuracy of some things on the show. (Given the executive producer's notoriety for being a stickler about this stuff--e.g., holding up shooting because the fruit in a bowl is too big for the 60s--I think it's justified.)
In the episode, "Love Among the Ruins," Don and Betty Draper attend an event at their daughter's school that features a maypole dance. My husband shot that down right away, claiming that no public school (and we're assuming that these kids do go to public school, since they're living in a high-income suburban area) would have had a maypole dance in 1963. His rationale: still too close to the McCarthy era, and the fear of Communism was still rampant; May Day would have been associated too closely with the Soviet Union and any school that celebrated it would have been attacked for Communist leanings.
What do folks here think? If anyone was in elementary or middle school at that point, did your school do such a thing? Is this rationale justified?
My husband and I are watching Mad Men on DVD, and every now and then, like all good Mad Men fans, we wonder about the historical accuracy of some things on the show. (Given the executive producer's notoriety for being a stickler about this stuff--e.g., holding up shooting because the fruit in a bowl is too big for the 60s--I think it's justified.)
In the episode, "Love Among the Ruins," Don and Betty Draper attend an event at their daughter's school that features a maypole dance. My husband shot that down right away, claiming that no public school (and we're assuming that these kids do go to public school, since they're living in a high-income suburban area) would have had a maypole dance in 1963. His rationale: still too close to the McCarthy era, and the fear of Communism was still rampant; May Day would have been associated too closely with the Soviet Union and any school that celebrated it would have been attacked for Communist leanings.
What do folks here think? If anyone was in elementary or middle school at that point, did your school do such a thing? Is this rationale justified?
Google News Archive: 1960-1965, maypole+school has 562 hits.
posted by zamboni at 11:47 AM on August 6, 2010 [3 favorites]
posted by zamboni at 11:47 AM on August 6, 2010 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: Hah. At least three of those articles are in Hartford, too--close to home. (What a neat resource!)
posted by dlugoczaj at 11:50 AM on August 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by dlugoczaj at 11:50 AM on August 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
Some of those maypoles are place names, but there's plenty of
posted by zamboni at 11:51 AM on August 6, 2010
Apr 24, 1964: A traditional Maypole dance officially will open Spartanburg Day School's seventh annual Spring fair
May 24, 1964: Close to 600 children dressed in cripe paper costumeswill dance around a Maypole Wednesday on the front lawn of BarnardBrown School to honor the month of Mayetc.
posted by zamboni at 11:51 AM on August 6, 2010
A quick google of this and I found class mates from the 1960's on facebook talking about "remember us doing the maypole dance!"
I found people talking about it from the 60's to 70's at different schools throughout the US.
e.g.
posted by zephyr_words at 11:51 AM on August 6, 2010
I found people talking about it from the 60's to 70's at different schools throughout the US.
e.g.
posted by zephyr_words at 11:51 AM on August 6, 2010
We had Maypoles at my school in the early/mid sixties, on Field Day, which may or may not have been on May First but was very close to it.
posted by Some1 at 11:52 AM on August 6, 2010
posted by Some1 at 11:52 AM on August 6, 2010
Here are some young ladies doing a Maypole dance in Florida in 1962.
Here are May Day dancers in Mendon, Utah in 1961.
The Communist associations with May are recent. May Day traditions are centuries old.
posted by oneirodynia at 11:52 AM on August 6, 2010 [2 favorites]
Here are May Day dancers in Mendon, Utah in 1961.
The Communist associations with May are recent. May Day traditions are centuries old.
posted by oneirodynia at 11:52 AM on August 6, 2010 [2 favorites]
Regarding Mad Men and historical accuracy in general: in the second episode of the first season, they show betty in the car with her kids. When they first shot that scene, which took place in April 1960, they had the kids playing with an Etch A Sketch. They then discovered that that toy wasn't released until July 1960, so in the name of historical accuracy, they re-shot the scene. Which tells me that in general, they are pretty much sticklers for historical accuracy.
posted by Kololo at 12:01 PM on August 6, 2010 [3 favorites]
posted by Kololo at 12:01 PM on August 6, 2010 [3 favorites]
and we're assuming that these kids do go to public school, since they're living in a high-income suburban area
Well, this doesn't necessarily follow; high income earners are the largest consumers of private schools.
But, there's been no mention as to whether the Draper's kids are in public or private school.
posted by dfriedman at 12:22 PM on August 6, 2010
Well, this doesn't necessarily follow; high income earners are the largest consumers of private schools.
But, there's been no mention as to whether the Draper's kids are in public or private school.
posted by dfriedman at 12:22 PM on August 6, 2010
I would think that most East Coasters in the 50s and 60s would know the difference between maypole May Day and Commie/International Workers May Day. Of course in current times, I would see parents objecting to May Day celebrations because of its "OMG Evil" pagan origins
posted by Ranucci at 12:28 PM on August 6, 2010
posted by Ranucci at 12:28 PM on August 6, 2010
> I would think that most East Coasters in the 50s and 60s would know the difference between maypole May Day and Commie/International Workers May Day.
Yes, I was in elementary school in those years and there was no Commie association with maypoles. Nice try, Mr. dlugoczaj!
posted by languagehat at 12:30 PM on August 6, 2010
Yes, I was in elementary school in those years and there was no Commie association with maypoles. Nice try, Mr. dlugoczaj!
posted by languagehat at 12:30 PM on August 6, 2010
Which tells me that in general, they are pretty much sticklers for historical accuracy.
EXCEPT WHEN IT COMES TO TYPEFACES DAMMIT
breathe...breathe...
I'm OK.
posted by overeducated_alligator at 12:30 PM on August 6, 2010 [5 favorites]
EXCEPT WHEN IT COMES TO TYPEFACES DAMMIT
breathe...breathe...
I'm OK.
posted by overeducated_alligator at 12:30 PM on August 6, 2010 [5 favorites]
Response by poster: in current times, I would see parents objecting to May Day celebrations because of its "OMG Evil" pagan origins
No shit. That's part of the reason I thought it might actually bear some weight. Mr. Dlugoczaj's fundie ex-wife buys into most hysteria of this type and we've had to fight for Christmas wreaths and trees, Easter eggs and jack-o-lanterns for his kids. I don't think we've ever had to fight about a maypole but she might not have known that we took them anywhere that had one (we did).
posted by dlugoczaj at 12:40 PM on August 6, 2010
No shit. That's part of the reason I thought it might actually bear some weight. Mr. Dlugoczaj's fundie ex-wife buys into most hysteria of this type and we've had to fight for Christmas wreaths and trees, Easter eggs and jack-o-lanterns for his kids. I don't think we've ever had to fight about a maypole but she might not have known that we took them anywhere that had one (we did).
posted by dlugoczaj at 12:40 PM on August 6, 2010
No may poles at my suburban DC elementary school in the early 1960s. However Felix and Oscar dance with one in Central Park in the beginning of "The Odd Couple" TV show, so maybe the tradition was stronger in NYC in the early 1970s.
posted by Rash at 12:42 PM on August 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by Rash at 12:42 PM on August 6, 2010 [1 favorite]
I was 7 years old in 1963, living in Salem, OR, attending public school (McKinley Elementary, to be specific.) I don't remember if it was exactly 1963, but I definitely participated in Maypole dances in the '60's in public school.
posted by McMark at 1:18 PM on August 6, 2010
posted by McMark at 1:18 PM on August 6, 2010
I went to elementary school in Canada in the 1970s until the mid-1980s , and I was forced to perform in maypole dances each spring.
posted by KokuRyu at 1:20 PM on August 6, 2010
posted by KokuRyu at 1:20 PM on August 6, 2010
May Day would have been associated too closely with the Soviet Union and any school that celebrated it would have been attacked for Communist leanings.
Maypole dancing has absolutely nothing to do with Communism. It's an ancient spring fertility rite.
posted by KokuRyu at 1:23 PM on August 6, 2010
Maypole dancing has absolutely nothing to do with Communism. It's an ancient spring fertility rite.
posted by KokuRyu at 1:23 PM on August 6, 2010
Response by poster: Maypole dancing has absolutely nothing to do with Communism. It's an ancient spring fertility rite.
I know that, and so does he. He didn't say it was a RATIONAL anti-Communist reaction--more like the kind of paranoia that made people rename Liberty cabbage and freedom fries.
posted by dlugoczaj at 1:49 PM on August 6, 2010
I know that, and so does he. He didn't say it was a RATIONAL anti-Communist reaction--more like the kind of paranoia that made people rename Liberty cabbage and freedom fries.
posted by dlugoczaj at 1:49 PM on August 6, 2010
Yes. I did that.
posted by thinkpiece at 1:50 PM on August 6, 2010
posted by thinkpiece at 1:50 PM on August 6, 2010
Law Day was established in 1958 in order to obliterate May Day, which the Soviet Union had co-opted into a patriotic holiday for them.
I was 12 in 1962 and I do not remember any May Pole dances or any recognition of May Day.
posted by Danf at 3:30 PM on August 6, 2010
I was 12 in 1962 and I do not remember any May Pole dances or any recognition of May Day.
posted by Danf at 3:30 PM on August 6, 2010
more like the kind of paranoia that made people rename Liberty cabbage and freedom fries.
That seems pretty accurate, and I think the question would then be, do you think anyone still ate french fries after they were officially named freedom fries? Even if "law day" was established, it seems perfectly likely that ordinary schoolchildren would just be led along the regular old traditions without anyone paying mind to whatever political connotations were seen in them.
I mean, I never saw anyone actually order freedom fries - now and then someone would say something sarcastic after ordering french fries, but if they actually just wanted french fries, it would probably not be worth the reference...
posted by mdn at 3:46 PM on August 6, 2010
That seems pretty accurate, and I think the question would then be, do you think anyone still ate french fries after they were officially named freedom fries? Even if "law day" was established, it seems perfectly likely that ordinary schoolchildren would just be led along the regular old traditions without anyone paying mind to whatever political connotations were seen in them.
I mean, I never saw anyone actually order freedom fries - now and then someone would say something sarcastic after ordering french fries, but if they actually just wanted french fries, it would probably not be worth the reference...
posted by mdn at 3:46 PM on August 6, 2010
I did a Maypole dance in my preschool, and still remember it. This was in 1974.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:59 PM on August 6, 2010
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:59 PM on August 6, 2010
We did a maypole dance in elementary school in around 1995 in Fort Worth, Texas.
posted by cmoj at 2:27 PM on August 7, 2010
posted by cmoj at 2:27 PM on August 7, 2010
FWIW, Ossinining isn't just any suburb. Though it's known for Sing Sing, there are also areas like Briarcliff Manor, which is a beautiful and historically wealthy village that is partially within Ossining. I have always suspected that, if the Drapers' address were Google Mappable, we'd find it somewhere on the edge of the Briarcliff Manor school district rather than the Ossining school district.
School district matters. Hear me out.
If the kids went to the Briarcliff Manor schools, they'd be in a progressive, small school system with an active parent base. (Pretty much what we see on the show.) Theory: These sorts of people are fortunate enough to be immune to such passing fads as banning Maypoles.
But if the kids were in the Ossining district, they'd be in one that was resistant to change, for instance behind the ball on segregation and not fully integrated until 1977. Ossining was targeted for desegregation fairly early on, in 1968.
In the sixties, though, the school district had four elementary schools. They would have been neighborhood schools, and from what I can gather, Roosevelt and Brookside were the most historically "white."
Now, we look at Ossining on a map: Roosevelt school, which is now closed -- I don't know when it opened or was christened -- stood on Croton Avenue, which is sort of a main-drag-like street. The Brookside school was a more likely choice for the Drapers -- it's on a side road in an area where the rising upper middle class of the 1960s was establishing itself.
Even then, the Ossining district was much more economically diverse than the Briarcliff Manor district. But because the schools were divvied up by neighborhood, the elementary school Sally Draper attended was probably an all-white, all-wealthy, all-progressive sort of place. Which makes Maypole dances much more plausible.
posted by brina at 2:13 PM on August 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
School district matters. Hear me out.
If the kids went to the Briarcliff Manor schools, they'd be in a progressive, small school system with an active parent base. (Pretty much what we see on the show.) Theory: These sorts of people are fortunate enough to be immune to such passing fads as banning Maypoles.
But if the kids were in the Ossining district, they'd be in one that was resistant to change, for instance behind the ball on segregation and not fully integrated until 1977. Ossining was targeted for desegregation fairly early on, in 1968.
In the sixties, though, the school district had four elementary schools. They would have been neighborhood schools, and from what I can gather, Roosevelt and Brookside were the most historically "white."
Now, we look at Ossining on a map: Roosevelt school, which is now closed -- I don't know when it opened or was christened -- stood on Croton Avenue, which is sort of a main-drag-like street. The Brookside school was a more likely choice for the Drapers -- it's on a side road in an area where the rising upper middle class of the 1960s was establishing itself.
Even then, the Ossining district was much more economically diverse than the Briarcliff Manor district. But because the schools were divvied up by neighborhood, the elementary school Sally Draper attended was probably an all-white, all-wealthy, all-progressive sort of place. Which makes Maypole dances much more plausible.
posted by brina at 2:13 PM on August 8, 2010 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by two lights above the sea at 11:45 AM on August 6, 2010