It's another cheating question!

July 26, 2010 7:43 AM

Some friends found my husband's active profile on a swinging website. I did not know he was doing this. Needless to say, I'm angry.

Got married in April of this year. I've been away at conferences for the last 2 weeks; going home Wednesday. This morning I had an email link from friends (a couple) who are active in the local swinging scene, saying they'd seen my husband advertising solo on a swinging website.

I phoned him, and thank goodness he had the good sense not to deny the obvious. We talked for a while, but I had some meetings to get to and decided to leave it at that for now. He expressed remorse in the usual ways. He said he hadn't met anyone from the ad in person but there is simply no way for me to know if that's true. He certainly was exchanging contact details with people from what my friends said.

We've talked about polyamory as a possibility for us sometime in the future (I've been in poly relationships before, and generally operate in a poly-friendly world; he hasn't and doesn't). However I have made it clear, repeatedly, that I consider any play without informing the other person and agreeing where we were as a couple on limits and feelings to be inappropriate and cheating. I haven't been with anyone else since we moved in together last year, I thought that was the case for him too.

Sex-wise, it's been a busy year for both of us so while it's been okay with frequency about 2-3 times a week, I definitely feel I've been getting less than I want and the quality isn't great... can't even think of the last time he initiated. I like to hope I'm GGG, but guess maybe not, if this happened.

His last relationship ended four years ago because of cheating. I chose to regard his significant regrets and remorse about that as a Good Thing, since surely someone who lost love because of such a decision before wouldn't a) be so honest with me about what went wrong and why unless they learned from that and b) ever want to go through that again. Also, it may not be relevant, but both of his parents have been married 4 times each. This is not someone who has seen a lot of relationships working out.

He is in a military service and will be stationed somewhere away from our city for a year, starting in November. Unfortunately I have experience with a previous partner (not poly) who was military, and lived on base, and cheated while I lived in another city. I could move too, but I don't want to, because I think if someone's going to cheat, my breathing down his neck won't improve that. Also I love where I live now, love my job and friends. Commuting isn't an option for me, I don't have a car, and there's no direct train between the two. The plan had been for him to drive back on the weekends because it would be less than an hour drive for him. He's offered to leave the service if it comes down to choosing between that or the marriage, but I don't think that would be a good idea, and also was said in the heat of the moment, perhaps to appease me.

I live in another country to the US. This is important because right after we married, I changed my visa to a marriage-related one (was on a long term work visa before, but wanted the freedom to change jobs). For me to stay permanently, I would have to stick it out until May 2011. I am also the higher earner, with significant net worth and property from cashing out of a previous business. We didn't sign a prenup, and I regret the hell out of that now.

On Saturday we're having the official wedding party, and I don't know what to do. I would hate to cancel with people coming from all over, but on the other hand I couldn't be fake happy in front of his family and friends. And we have vacation plans together for all of August, but right now, even the thought of going home disgusts me.

So, my questions:

1. Everything's pretty raw right now, and I don't know what I want yet - staying has problems, so does going. Some strategies for how to deal with the short term would be appreciated, though. When I do make a decision I want to do it from a place of dealing with this issue, not dumping all my insecurity and anger from a previous relationship gone wrong onto him. I want to set myself up well to make the right choices. Yes, I have a lawyer and he is apprised of the potential situation (and remarkably good at not saying 'I told you so' re: prenup).

2. What to do about the party? Many of my friends are coming from far away and it's very late to make changes. His are local. Am tempted to disinvite all his people and have the party just for me.

posted by anonymous to Human Relations (23 answers total)

Well, that blows.

I don't think there are any easy answers, or any right answers. But here's a thought: the way you handle the party, in the short term, may determine what happens to this relationship in the long term. That is, if you disinvite his friends and have a party for yourself, it's probably over. If you hold the party as planned but it becomes clear to all your friends that you're already on the rocks, it's going to be that much harder to reconcile if you decide that's what you want.

As to the lack of prenup: this surely varies from state to state, but I think you're entitled to take out of the marriage what you brought into it. IANAL and all that. And a divorce requires an equitable division of joint property (property acquired during the marriage).
posted by adamrice at 7:58 AM on July 26, 2010 [1 favorite]

gees, you're poly & open & yet he still cheated? this man has issues with intimacy but you probably already know that. he needs to really work on that. you don't say that you love him and want to stay with him however it might be too raw for that but i think therapy is in order definately for him for his issues, maybe for you if you feel you need support & maybe for you both if you want to work this through as a couple. as for the party, i liked your idea. he broke a promise and he can deal with the fallout when you disinvite them. have the party for you and have fun. however if you want to avoid the wierdness of calling people and telling them why the party 'theme' has changed, i say fake it through the day. or get the advise & perspective of a few close friends on how to handle the party and rally some support for you for that day. if the word gets out, it might be wierd but you won't be at fault. i'm sorry & good luck.
posted by UltraD at 8:02 AM on July 26, 2010 [1 favorite]

You can reschedule the party for two months from now you know. Fake an illness in the family. Do whatever you can to get the pressure off so you can work this stuff out.
posted by By The Grace of God at 8:13 AM on July 26, 2010 [13 favorites]

Well, shit. I'm sorry.

For the short term, you do have a week to chill and decide. You sound adequately disgusted that you might want to ask him to stay with a friend for a few days? Or stay at a hotel yourself? Take some time for yourself. You can always uninvite his friends on Friday (with a link to the profile in the email?) (ok, that might be over the top).

For the long run, it does sound like this could be doomed unless he commits to long-term changes. As a condition of not calling everything off, or of moving back in, you could ask him to:
- retroactively sign a pre-nup (post-nup)
- put $X in an escrow account to pay for couple's therapy for six months, after which point you two split the cost
To some, those might sound like overly formal steps, but the legality might communicate the seriousness of what's at stake.

As adamrice said, there are no right answers, so trust yourself. I do think your apparent instinct to set a "zero tolerance" boundary for this is good, given his history.
posted by salvia at 8:15 AM on July 26, 2010 [2 favorites]

I agree with By The Grace of God -- cancel the party, get that pressure off your back. It'll only make you even more resentful. If you just have the party for you, I think you'll have an absolutely miserable time.

Also, I think cancelling the party would be a BIG FLASHING NEON SIGN that his marriage is going to end sooner rather than later if he doesn't figure some stuff out NOW.

Couples counseling and therapy for him, now, if he wants to fix this. Preferably with a poly-friendly therapist. That he cheated on you even knowing that an open relationship was a possibility suggests to me that he has some issues with self-sabotage.
posted by desuetude at 8:22 AM on July 26, 2010 [6 favorites]

I wish this were something we, as strangers, could help you with better. Based just on the details here, my personal instinct is that you and he sound less than ideally compatible, and there are so many genuinely (= healthily, honestly) poly people in the world you could find and build a life with.

As you know -- but some other posters above not getting -- polyamory (pre-negotiated, entirely transparent and honest non-monogamy) is the opposite of cheating. This man has a strong history of cheating and no apparent desire to join you in being actually poly.

Please feel free to direct-message me if you want any more specific help or resource pointers/discussion. You sound like you might have some poly community around you already, but maybe there's something I can add (from the perspectve of someone in committed poly marriage/parenthood).
posted by kalapierson at 8:43 AM on July 26, 2010 [1 favorite]

The Fraud Detective Squad, as usual, hit every point I came here to make, but one of them bears repeating.

Your GGG status is a quality unto itself, intrinsic to your own sexual and relationship nature. The way someone else conducts himself with you is not a statement about your nature, but his.

I made myself miserable for years trying to be what the previous Mr. F appeared to want in a sex partner. I do not advise hurting yourself in similar fashion.
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 8:54 AM on July 26, 2010 [9 favorites]

Regarding the pre-nup, you may be able to execute a post-nup equivalent, which may be especially important if you're in a community property state. Having the post-nup would reduce some tension for you and send a clear message to him that you're willing to work on the marriage but also intent on protecting yourself.

I think you should use some of your (newly protected) resources to get a car if you drive. Alternatively, does he really need a car on base or does it make more sense for you to keep it for the moment. That could be the big hairy sacrifice he makes to demonstrate seriousness as you work things through.
posted by carmicha at 9:04 AM on July 26, 2010

How often you get sex, your previous discussions about polyamory and his advertising his willingness to step out are all worthy things to think about. However, something jumped out at me: You never once mentioned how your relationship is otherwise. You told us you get sex 2-3 times per week, but that isn't enough; you told us the two of you have discussed the possibility of a poly lifestyle in the future; we know of his advertising for sex....but what about everything else? A good relationship doesn't begin and end with frequency of sex, quality of sex or anything else. You're asking for suggestions on how to handle something when nobody here knows if you otherwise have a good relationship or if he's a cad in other ways, etc. It sounds to me like you're putting all your relationship eggs in one basket - the sex basket. Despite what TV and movies tell you -- it takes much more than getting the sex ducks all in a row.

Good luck!
posted by Gerard Sorme at 9:15 AM on July 26, 2010 [2 favorites]

How terrible.

Yes, cancel the party. When I was cheated on, I found myself still trying to take care of my partner and make nice with everyone so as not to rock the boat. It's the only choice I regret from that period.

There's no clear answer here - you'll have to figure out the answers for yourself. I recommend giving yourself time and space to do so. Talk to friends, spend time alone, go to therapy. You need help to navigate this one and decide what should come next.

I'm so sorry he did this, and good luck to you.
posted by serazin at 9:21 AM on July 26, 2010

you need to ask him about it.

don't cancel the party without allowing him to speak - if you are about to marry him, then he should have at least earned the right to speak in his defense.

(though admittedly, from your description, there seems to be no defense).
nevertheless, do not act on your assumptions - you need to confront him
posted by Flood at 10:13 AM on July 26, 2010

I also think you should cancel the party, if only to communicate to him the seriousness of what's gone down...

I also agree you need time and space and I would recommend therapy.
posted by xammerboy at 10:23 AM on July 26, 2010

DTMFA.. you are only delaying whats coming down the line. My wife's friend was in similar situation and their marriage lasted 6 months and its done.
posted by boomcha76 at 1:12 PM on July 26, 2010

um silly question but.... are you sure he's cheated? having simply contacted people..... might be more forgivable. whether that equals forgivable is for you to decide, but figure out the facts or at least decide what you firmly believe the facts to be, before deciding what to do from here.
posted by saraindc at 1:47 PM on July 26, 2010 [1 favorite]

I agree with everyone else about canceling the party. If I were you I'd do whatever makes you feel most yourself...whatever that is, apart from your partner. Go to a spa for a weekend to connect with how you feel. Charge ahead with what you want in life. If this includes sex with your partner and you feel safe doing so that's fine, but don't consider his needs for awhile. From what I know of such people this will probably make you all the more irresistible to him. All the better. Let him squirm awhile.
posted by Mertonian at 1:49 PM on July 26, 2010

um silly question but.... are you sure he's cheated? having simply contacted people..... might be more forgivable.

I think the OP was pretty clear: "He said he hadn't met anyone from the ad in person but there is simply no way for me to know if that's true."
posted by Jaltcoh at 2:03 PM on July 26, 2010

If attendees' travel plans are and plane tickets are one reason why you are considering going ahead with the party, why not contact a trusted friend, explain the situation, and see if that friend can either contact the invitees and explain the situation, or perhaps even organize an alternate event in your town for people flying in. Neither you nor your partner need to attend the event, but provides folks with at least some purpose and value should they want to fly in (or are unable to cancel their tickets, etc).

But you should cancel this party, and reevaluate your connection to this man.
posted by KokuRyu at 3:13 PM on July 26, 2010 [1 favorite]

I don't know anything at all about marriage visa issues, but would you be able to still stay in the US if you stay legally married to the guy, but separated until then? Okay, probably not "legally" separated, but if he's going to be out of the country cheating on you anyway you more or less would be doing that anyway.

I'd normally say DTMFA at this point if you are poly-friendly and he still wants to cheat (yeesh!), but the visa bit makes me think you're gonna have to handle it differently.
posted by jenfullmoon at 3:13 PM on July 26, 2010

So. He did something that suggests you should not trust him, and though he admitted it when confronted, the combination of the behavior and his track record have destroyed that trust.

Reasonable next steps:

1. Take the pressure off yourself to make any kind of rash decisions. You don't need to cancel the party today. Instead, focus on the practical nature of it -- how long can you put off that decision before it costs you money in fees/costs that won't be refunded, and before it costs other people money on plane tickets and such? Once you have that date, you know how long you have to make the decision to cancel.

2. Once that practical matter is done, talk to him, and lay it on the table so that you don't have to bear the burden of uncertainty: he has done something you consider to be extremely bad, and that thing isn't cheating -- which may or may not have happened -- but his violation of your trust. Now that you don't trust him, it's on him to earn that trust back, and that's going to take time. Depending on his response, you might decide to DTFMA, or you might start trusting him, or anything in between -- but putting your position on the table clearly and succinctly will be the catalyst that helps you get started through this process.

3. Assuming his response doesn't turn this into a clear DTMFA, talk about the party. Tell him just as clearly and succinctly that you don't want to pretend to be happy in front of his friends and family, and that you have until (whatever date) to cancel before such-and-such costs are incurred, but that despite what he's done you're still a couple that needs to make decisions like this as a team. Then, talk it out. Your ability (or failure) to successfully negotiate this practical matter despite the issues you're now struggling with will go a long way towards helping you understand whether this is something you can save or not.

Good luck, and all best.
posted by davejay at 3:15 PM on July 26, 2010

Er: "and his track record have destroyed that trust the trust you previously had."
posted by davejay at 3:16 PM on July 26, 2010

Hi, OP here.

I've just paid 5 bucks to address this snark directly, @wkearney99 :

If there's no trust then why did you get married? Oh right, for the sake of a work/visa convenience.

READ THE QUESTION, please. I am a US citizen who lives abroad. So don't go throwing your xenophobia on me, I'm packing a blue passport just like you, cowboy.

For what it's worth I married him because he asked and because I love him. I changed visas because in my sector, long-term positions are hard to come by for non-EU work permit holders, and I will potentially be better off when I have the freedom to change my (doctorate-level) job. But the visa I had was valid for another 2 years, and it was changed as a convenience to career, not as a ruse to stay in the country.
posted by SockyMcPuppet at 3:34 PM on July 26, 2010 [9 favorites]

Mod note: A couple comments removed. Dismissive comments don't help.
posted by cortex (staff) at 3:38 PM on July 26, 2010

Huh. Guess I was under the mistaken impression that people came on here to help others out. Must add going back to Internet Noob Skool on m to-do list.

@adamrice, thank you, you're framed exactly what I need to consider: still not sure what to do, but thinking how what happens in the short term could very well affect the long term and what message my (probably impulsive) choices might send. Thank you to the other helpful posters. I'll duck out now as this is clearly descending.
posted by SockyMcPuppet at 3:49 PM on July 26, 2010 [2 favorites]