How do you say "you shouldn't say that?"
September 3, 2008 8:44 PM Subscribe
What's the best thing to say to someone who has harshly belittled someone else without reason that A. doesn't attack the offending speaker and B. brings to light just how harmful their words can be to others?
Response by poster: No, that can be dismissed to easily. I mean, something that will really get the person thinking about what they said.
posted by MaryDellamorte at 8:48 PM on September 3, 2008
posted by MaryDellamorte at 8:48 PM on September 3, 2008
I think a lot depends on the context, but "I think that remark reflects more on you than it does on him/her" works.
posted by Nattie at 8:51 PM on September 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by Nattie at 8:51 PM on September 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
No, I think that tomorrowful is on to something...
Why can't you say to this person, as straight faced, and as serious as possible, "Look, you really overstepped your bounds, you were completely out of line in your comments, and your words were very harmful not just to so-and-so but to my impression of you. I hope that you think about what you've said..."
posted by wfrgms at 8:52 PM on September 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
Why can't you say to this person, as straight faced, and as serious as possible, "Look, you really overstepped your bounds, you were completely out of line in your comments, and your words were very harmful not just to so-and-so but to my impression of you. I hope that you think about what you've said..."
posted by wfrgms at 8:52 PM on September 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
It's all about tone of voice - making it clear that while your word choice may be diplomatic, you're really indicating "that was too damn much, cut it back."
Of course, tone of voice really doesn't carry well over text...
posted by Tomorrowful at 8:52 PM on September 3, 2008
Of course, tone of voice really doesn't carry well over text...
posted by Tomorrowful at 8:52 PM on September 3, 2008
Culture and situation specific, methinks.
How about:
"That was (really) uncalled for"
"You're such a twat for saying that"
"Stop it you bastard, no need for that"
No need to be too polite in this sort of situation, but that's just my opinion,
posted by phax at 9:21 PM on September 3, 2008
How about:
"That was (really) uncalled for"
"You're such a twat for saying that"
"Stop it you bastard, no need for that"
No need to be too polite in this sort of situation, but that's just my opinion,
posted by phax at 9:21 PM on September 3, 2008
"That's a very prickish thing to say."
posted by turgid dahlia at 9:29 PM on September 3, 2008
posted by turgid dahlia at 9:29 PM on September 3, 2008
Why not just reflect it back to them and pause? Making someone confront their own (offensive, impulsive) statement without anything added is often the most powerful response.
Often the cause of their making the response is that they are trying displace the very feeling they have onto you. If you don't bite, and can hold it together and calmly reflect, then the original person still has to deal with their feelings, which is their stuff, not yours.
posted by No New Diamonds Please at 9:36 PM on September 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
Often the cause of their making the response is that they are trying displace the very feeling they have onto you. If you don't bite, and can hold it together and calmly reflect, then the original person still has to deal with their feelings, which is their stuff, not yours.
posted by No New Diamonds Please at 9:36 PM on September 3, 2008 [1 favorite]
Very calmly and coldly say, Oh really? I happen to think very highly of Mr. X. The burn of your disapproval will hurt far worse than any playground insult ever could.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:36 PM on September 3, 2008 [9 favorites]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:36 PM on September 3, 2008 [9 favorites]
I find that saying, "Wow, you're a dick" or "Wow, you're a bitch" - then laughing and walking off gets the point across.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 9:54 PM on September 3, 2008
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 9:54 PM on September 3, 2008
I like TPS's Miss Manners-esque approach in this case--not only will they immediately know that you disapprove, it can actually help them think about the person they're trashing in a new, more fair, light.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 10:03 PM on September 3, 2008
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 10:03 PM on September 3, 2008
I think TPS has it here. This response really fulfils your requirement A, it doesn't attack or even engage with what they said yet still gets across your disapproval in a non-ambiguous way. PhoBWanKenobi is also correct in that it gives them a kinder viewpoint to consider along the way.
posted by shelleycat at 10:29 PM on September 3, 2008
posted by shelleycat at 10:29 PM on September 3, 2008
The problem here is we're giving a lot of thought to a situation that would likely demand spontaneity. Give me thirty seconds (or minutes) and I can often think of exactly the right thing to say in response to someone else's aggressive nastiness. But on the spot, I find it very difficult to not screw up on condition A. Even if I pull a Jesus Christ, look the transgressor in the eye and say, "I love you, too," I know deep down inside I'm trying to get a rise out of them.
So, in answer to the question, without time to think about it, I suspect silence would be my immediate response, then maybe a rousing chorus of "Uma Paloma Blanca".
posted by philip-random at 10:41 PM on September 3, 2008
So, in answer to the question, without time to think about it, I suspect silence would be my immediate response, then maybe a rousing chorus of "Uma Paloma Blanca".
posted by philip-random at 10:41 PM on September 3, 2008
I find that a moment of silence, then, "Wow." is usually enough.
posted by Verdandi at 10:46 PM on September 3, 2008 [3 favorites]
posted by Verdandi at 10:46 PM on September 3, 2008 [3 favorites]
How about nothing? Not only does it avoid the pitfalls of being too harsh or too flip, it also keeps you out of it...which is what I think is the best. Unless the person in question is going after the other person face to face, then you have no obligation to speak. Just walk away and let them wonder why.
posted by The Light Fantastic at 11:17 PM on September 3, 2008
posted by The Light Fantastic at 11:17 PM on September 3, 2008
Illustrating logical extensions of their sentiments is a good way to highlight nascent fallacies. Hand Person A a stone and say, "Why don't you really hurt them?"
posted by carsonb at 12:45 AM on September 4, 2008
posted by carsonb at 12:45 AM on September 4, 2008
If a simple check "Geez, that was harsh" doesn't get Person A thinking, they probably won't be convinced that they were out of line by anything.
posted by toomuchpete at 12:47 AM on September 4, 2008
posted by toomuchpete at 12:47 AM on September 4, 2008
Best Answer: "Jeez, man. That was a little harsh."
No, that can be dismissed to easily. I mean, something that will really get the person thinking about what they said.
If a simple check "Geez, that was harsh" doesn't get Person A thinking, they probably won't be convinced that they were out of line by anything.
There you have it. Of course, how the line is delivered can convey additional emphasis, but that's the proper thing to say. It's a common phrase in American English that expresses your disapproval of the speaker's comments without making a big deal of it which would make the person to whom it is directed become unreceptive to the good advice you are trying to give her.
"Lighten up Francis" would be a bit more obscure, but equivalent comment.
posted by three blind mice at 1:13 AM on September 4, 2008
No, that can be dismissed to easily. I mean, something that will really get the person thinking about what they said.
If a simple check "Geez, that was harsh" doesn't get Person A thinking, they probably won't be convinced that they were out of line by anything.
There you have it. Of course, how the line is delivered can convey additional emphasis, but that's the proper thing to say. It's a common phrase in American English that expresses your disapproval of the speaker's comments without making a big deal of it which would make the person to whom it is directed become unreceptive to the good advice you are trying to give her.
"Lighten up Francis" would be a bit more obscure, but equivalent comment.
posted by three blind mice at 1:13 AM on September 4, 2008
"I don't appreciate that."
"That was below the belt."
posted by jejune at 3:15 AM on September 4, 2008
"That was below the belt."
posted by jejune at 3:15 AM on September 4, 2008
"Classy."
With raised eyebrow and a faint, condescending smile, in the same tone of "Bless your heart" as spoken by a proper Southern lady.
posted by availablelight at 5:19 AM on September 4, 2008
With raised eyebrow and a faint, condescending smile, in the same tone of "Bless your heart" as spoken by a proper Southern lady.
posted by availablelight at 5:19 AM on September 4, 2008
I can sometimes overstep my bounds into just-plain-mean territory, and more often than not, when I do I really really didn't mean to hurt anyone.
In these situations, the diplomatic and straightforward approach works best. Something like "That's a hurtful thing to say. It would make that person feel awful to hear that, and it makes me feel bad knowing that you're capable of saying such things." And, as trite as it is, "Wow... how would you feel if someone said that about you?" works as well - many people are catty as a defense mechanism, and can dish it out but can't take it.
Sarcasm and name-calling aren't going to work here, unless you want this person to bitch about you behind your back too. If someone all of a sudden calls you an asshole, you're more likely to think that they're the asshole, and pay them no mind (or start insulting back), than to pause and think, "Hmm. I really am an asshole and I should change that."
And it's really important in this situation to lead by example; if you also make a habit of talking shit about others, it'll blur the line for this person. But if you generally speak well of people and avoid using harshness in your conversations, this person (after a few "that was harsh" callouts) will start to realize that they do sound quite harsh compared to you, or to others in your group, and hopefully make an effort to back off.
posted by Metroid Baby at 5:30 AM on September 4, 2008
In these situations, the diplomatic and straightforward approach works best. Something like "That's a hurtful thing to say. It would make that person feel awful to hear that, and it makes me feel bad knowing that you're capable of saying such things." And, as trite as it is, "Wow... how would you feel if someone said that about you?" works as well - many people are catty as a defense mechanism, and can dish it out but can't take it.
Sarcasm and name-calling aren't going to work here, unless you want this person to bitch about you behind your back too. If someone all of a sudden calls you an asshole, you're more likely to think that they're the asshole, and pay them no mind (or start insulting back), than to pause and think, "Hmm. I really am an asshole and I should change that."
And it's really important in this situation to lead by example; if you also make a habit of talking shit about others, it'll blur the line for this person. But if you generally speak well of people and avoid using harshness in your conversations, this person (after a few "that was harsh" callouts) will start to realize that they do sound quite harsh compared to you, or to others in your group, and hopefully make an effort to back off.
posted by Metroid Baby at 5:30 AM on September 4, 2008
I like "was that really necessary?" You could follow with "what exactly does that accomplish?" if it doesn't click right away...get them to be introspective for a minute.
posted by aydeejones at 5:50 AM on September 4, 2008
posted by aydeejones at 5:50 AM on September 4, 2008
We do not condone personal attacks here. Perhaps we should break until we are ready to come back and discuss this as adults.
I like the TPS approach too.
posted by ml98tu at 6:40 AM on September 4, 2008
I like the TPS approach too.
posted by ml98tu at 6:40 AM on September 4, 2008
Culture and situation specific, methinks.
Very, Very much so.
For some people, you really have to lay into them just as harshly. For others, as little as a look of disapproval will have them wracked with guilt all day. And then there's the recipeint of the remarks to keep in mind. Are they present when you call the person out? Some people respond well to public humiliation. They need to be called out in front of others. But is the other person there? Will they just be embarrassed too, because it looks like they can't stand up for themselves, for instance? Or will they feel appreciative that someone is backing them up?
Also, a bit just about part a of your question. Well, your answer is basically in the question. You should focus on criticizing their arguments. Something like "you haven't addressed the topic at hand" or "well that doesn't answer the question. You're just avoiding it". We'll assume you have a specific person in mind, and that this is the best route to go. But like I said, some people do respond to harsh personal attacks. "You're an ass-hole" seems pretty unconstructive. But some people will just brush off anything less. Also, I point you to this video, by Jay Smooth on why he thinks people should attack racist comments themselves, instead of the person saying them.
posted by gauchodaspampas at 6:55 AM on September 4, 2008
Very, Very much so.
For some people, you really have to lay into them just as harshly. For others, as little as a look of disapproval will have them wracked with guilt all day. And then there's the recipeint of the remarks to keep in mind. Are they present when you call the person out? Some people respond well to public humiliation. They need to be called out in front of others. But is the other person there? Will they just be embarrassed too, because it looks like they can't stand up for themselves, for instance? Or will they feel appreciative that someone is backing them up?
Also, a bit just about part a of your question. Well, your answer is basically in the question. You should focus on criticizing their arguments. Something like "you haven't addressed the topic at hand" or "well that doesn't answer the question. You're just avoiding it". We'll assume you have a specific person in mind, and that this is the best route to go. But like I said, some people do respond to harsh personal attacks. "You're an ass-hole" seems pretty unconstructive. But some people will just brush off anything less. Also, I point you to this video, by Jay Smooth on why he thinks people should attack racist comments themselves, instead of the person saying them.
posted by gauchodaspampas at 6:55 AM on September 4, 2008
"You know, [attacked person] might just believe what you said is true, and that would be hurtful."
Or, more softly, "I know you didn't mean to be so harsh, but I'm worried (attacked person) may take what you said to heart."
posted by orthogonality at 7:06 AM on September 4, 2008
Or, more softly, "I know you didn't mean to be so harsh, but I'm worried (attacked person) may take what you said to heart."
posted by orthogonality at 7:06 AM on September 4, 2008
Maybe talk to the person separately, and say something like "That was uncalled for". It's not too harsh, gets the message across, and doesn't call them out in front of others.
This is a tough one, with many possible apporaches, but it's something that bothers me quite a bit. If you don't mind my getting on my soapbox... I notice more and more nowadays, that people tend to be hurtful or rude as if it is simply their way or their sense of humor. And when confronted, tend to dismiss it, and say, "I was only kidding!". Sorry, but it's rude. As an official Old Person, it irks me.
And now back to your regularly scheduled discussion...
posted by ObscureReferenceMan at 8:44 AM on September 4, 2008
This is a tough one, with many possible apporaches, but it's something that bothers me quite a bit. If you don't mind my getting on my soapbox... I notice more and more nowadays, that people tend to be hurtful or rude as if it is simply their way or their sense of humor. And when confronted, tend to dismiss it, and say, "I was only kidding!". Sorry, but it's rude. As an official Old Person, it irks me.
And now back to your regularly scheduled discussion...
posted by ObscureReferenceMan at 8:44 AM on September 4, 2008
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Tomorrowful at 8:47 PM on September 3, 2008 [1 favorite]