Am I evil for texting the other woman?
March 1, 2007 12:10 AM Subscribe
Am I evil for texting the other woman? And what can I do to avoid this type of situation in the future?
I met a guy online in November, quickly met for lunch and, although we live in different cities, things got intense very quickly. We were able to spend every other weekend together and a couple of week-long holidays. A combination of basic compatibility (similar interests, hobbies, and values, or so I thought) and desperation on both our parts (he is 40, I am 35, and we both want children) meant things seemed to get serious very fast. He said I am the best partner for him that he had ever found and he asked me to move in with him when I arrive in his city in September for grad school.
Then the other woman entered the picture. He had met her online a year ago, lost touch with her, and a month ago she emailed him out of the blue. They met up two weeks ago and it was precisely at this time he started treating me like dirt. He admitted to me that the other woman existed, slept with her, and then asked me to still go on a week-long trip together that we had planned and I stupidly accepted. He had never told her about me at all, claiming to her to be completely single.
During this trip, we had ups and downs. He said he couldn't decide between me and her because, although I was so compatible with him, she lived 3 miles away. I forced him to choose and he said that, because of the ultimatum, he was choosing her.
At this point I think I really messed up. I looked in his phone while he was in the shower, got her number, and texted her from my phone telling her about me and that we were on holiday together. She texted him back and asked if he had slept with me during the holiday. We had, so I texted her back, again from my phone, and said yes.
He is furious with me for hurting her and is not speaking to me. She told him that it was "the worst day of her life" getting the texts. I know I'm well rid of him but I have some lingering questions, and since he's not speaking to me I thought I'd ask here. 1. Was I evil to text her? Did I hurt her? How could this be "the worst day of her life" - isn't that a bit melodramatic? 2. Given that I really want to meet someone, how do I go slowly, take into account the warning signs, and back away from someone who is very attractive and who seems so compatible with me? I have a history of being with men who can't love and I want to change. Where do I start?
I met a guy online in November, quickly met for lunch and, although we live in different cities, things got intense very quickly. We were able to spend every other weekend together and a couple of week-long holidays. A combination of basic compatibility (similar interests, hobbies, and values, or so I thought) and desperation on both our parts (he is 40, I am 35, and we both want children) meant things seemed to get serious very fast. He said I am the best partner for him that he had ever found and he asked me to move in with him when I arrive in his city in September for grad school.
Then the other woman entered the picture. He had met her online a year ago, lost touch with her, and a month ago she emailed him out of the blue. They met up two weeks ago and it was precisely at this time he started treating me like dirt. He admitted to me that the other woman existed, slept with her, and then asked me to still go on a week-long trip together that we had planned and I stupidly accepted. He had never told her about me at all, claiming to her to be completely single.
During this trip, we had ups and downs. He said he couldn't decide between me and her because, although I was so compatible with him, she lived 3 miles away. I forced him to choose and he said that, because of the ultimatum, he was choosing her.
At this point I think I really messed up. I looked in his phone while he was in the shower, got her number, and texted her from my phone telling her about me and that we were on holiday together. She texted him back and asked if he had slept with me during the holiday. We had, so I texted her back, again from my phone, and said yes.
He is furious with me for hurting her and is not speaking to me. She told him that it was "the worst day of her life" getting the texts. I know I'm well rid of him but I have some lingering questions, and since he's not speaking to me I thought I'd ask here. 1. Was I evil to text her? Did I hurt her? How could this be "the worst day of her life" - isn't that a bit melodramatic? 2. Given that I really want to meet someone, how do I go slowly, take into account the warning signs, and back away from someone who is very attractive and who seems so compatible with me? I have a history of being with men who can't love and I want to change. Where do I start?
This post was deleted for the following reason: poster's reuest
I've never answered a human relations question before, but I have to say, the guy sound's like a dick. In the long run, you probably did the other girl a favour.
posted by kisch mokusch at 12:42 AM on March 1, 2007
posted by kisch mokusch at 12:42 AM on March 1, 2007
And please ignore the apostrophe in my previous sentence. It has no business being there.
posted by kisch mokusch at 12:44 AM on March 1, 2007
posted by kisch mokusch at 12:44 AM on March 1, 2007
While his anger might be understandable, given the breach of privacy, "hurting her"is hardly a trigger given that if she is indeed "hurt", it would've been his fault. The drama was unnecessary, both on your part and on hers, but at this point, walk away, and don't look back.
posted by Phire at 12:53 AM on March 1, 2007
posted by Phire at 12:53 AM on March 1, 2007
"Hi. You don't know me, but I know your name and phone number and by the way I'm on vacation fucking the guy you got together with last wee-- hey, you're not upset, are you?"
That would count as a pretty shitty day in my book; I'd be creeped out beyond belief if that happened to me. I wouldn't go so far as to call it evil, but you lashed out at the wrong person instead of the guy who truly deserved a smackdown.
He's a jerk. You know that. You knew that a while back but forged ahead anyway. Maybe you could ask yourself what you would say to your mother, sister, or best friend if she were in that situation. You'd probably have told them to get out long before it came to this. It helps to get the perspective of someone who's not in the flush of new romance, so you might want to enlist the help of your mother, sister, or best friend to be in charge of giving you sanity checks the next time you start a relationship. I'd recommend counseling, too, so you can learn to be more assertive and stand up for yourself when you're being treated like dirt.
posted by stefanie at 1:12 AM on March 1, 2007 [2 favorites]
That would count as a pretty shitty day in my book; I'd be creeped out beyond belief if that happened to me. I wouldn't go so far as to call it evil, but you lashed out at the wrong person instead of the guy who truly deserved a smackdown.
He's a jerk. You know that. You knew that a while back but forged ahead anyway. Maybe you could ask yourself what you would say to your mother, sister, or best friend if she were in that situation. You'd probably have told them to get out long before it came to this. It helps to get the perspective of someone who's not in the flush of new romance, so you might want to enlist the help of your mother, sister, or best friend to be in charge of giving you sanity checks the next time you start a relationship. I'd recommend counseling, too, so you can learn to be more assertive and stand up for yourself when you're being treated like dirt.
posted by stefanie at 1:12 AM on March 1, 2007 [2 favorites]
It's probably a good thing that he's not speaking to you.. this sounds like a really destructive relationship and you'll probably be better off (and much more drama-free) if you cut him off altogether. Him not talking to you makes this much easier.
Don't look back. You did what you did, right or wrong. Don't worry about what he thinks or about any of the aftermath of what happened.
I agree with Dizzy about talking to "a pro". A therapist or counselor could really help you make sense of what went on and how to avoid (or recognize and get out of much faster) future bad relationships.
On preview: what stefanie said as well.
posted by sherber at 1:16 AM on March 1, 2007
Don't look back. You did what you did, right or wrong. Don't worry about what he thinks or about any of the aftermath of what happened.
I agree with Dizzy about talking to "a pro". A therapist or counselor could really help you make sense of what went on and how to avoid (or recognize and get out of much faster) future bad relationships.
On preview: what stefanie said as well.
posted by sherber at 1:16 AM on March 1, 2007
No, you're not evil. But you have lost perspective. Give yourself a timeout and stay single for a while. Being manipulated like you have been by this guy really sucks.
Eventually (not now) it might be nice to apologize to the other woman. It doesn't appear that she's done anything wrong.
One important point: DO NOT TRY TO SAVE YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH THIS GUY. It is doomed. Any attempts to salvage this are going to end up hurting everyone involved.
As far as the rushing it goes ... try to understand the difference between love and infatuation. Those fuzzy feelings you have for the first few months may stay, or they may leave. But making lifelong decisions after a month is a great way to cause yourself future pain later (as you've found out.) Also, I'm betting there's some "safe" guys you know that you don't think are that viable for relationships. You might try dating one in a few months, instead of always going after the prick.
posted by Happydaz at 1:21 AM on March 1, 2007
Eventually (not now) it might be nice to apologize to the other woman. It doesn't appear that she's done anything wrong.
One important point: DO NOT TRY TO SAVE YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH THIS GUY. It is doomed. Any attempts to salvage this are going to end up hurting everyone involved.
As far as the rushing it goes ... try to understand the difference between love and infatuation. Those fuzzy feelings you have for the first few months may stay, or they may leave. But making lifelong decisions after a month is a great way to cause yourself future pain later (as you've found out.) Also, I'm betting there's some "safe" guys you know that you don't think are that viable for relationships. You might try dating one in a few months, instead of always going after the prick.
posted by Happydaz at 1:21 AM on March 1, 2007
Best answer: Was I evil to text her?
Yes? No? Hell, I don't think anyone can answer this for you, not really. If she says she's hurt, then she's hurt. Do you really care? It seems like you want someone to tell you that there's nothing wrong with what you did, but morality isn't decided by a committee. If you think you did the right thing, then don't worry about it. But posting this makes it seem like some part of you thinks you didn't do the right thing. If I were in your position, I'd listen to that part of me, and come to terms with it. The worst thing to do is to reach out for anonymous support so that you can push that worry away. Deal with your feelings honestly and move on. We've all heard the stories of people cheated on who informed the other woman because it wasn't right for her not to know. I don't see anything wrong with that. Do you feel like that's what you were doing? Or was this more about hurting him? Listen to your gut, and figure out how what happened makes you feel.
As far as avoiding men like this in the future: The best advice I know of is to pay more attention to how he makes you feel abaout yourself, instead of how you feel about him. I don't know if that makes any sense, but the idea is that these guys often do a very good job of making you feel lucky to be around them, but don't make it clear how lucky they are to be with you. If you're with a guy who makes you feel like you're worth dating, give him a shot. If the relationship feels more like it's about how cool HE is, that may be a sign of you going down the same path again.
posted by shmegegge at 1:27 AM on March 1, 2007 [3 favorites]
Yes? No? Hell, I don't think anyone can answer this for you, not really. If she says she's hurt, then she's hurt. Do you really care? It seems like you want someone to tell you that there's nothing wrong with what you did, but morality isn't decided by a committee. If you think you did the right thing, then don't worry about it. But posting this makes it seem like some part of you thinks you didn't do the right thing. If I were in your position, I'd listen to that part of me, and come to terms with it. The worst thing to do is to reach out for anonymous support so that you can push that worry away. Deal with your feelings honestly and move on. We've all heard the stories of people cheated on who informed the other woman because it wasn't right for her not to know. I don't see anything wrong with that. Do you feel like that's what you were doing? Or was this more about hurting him? Listen to your gut, and figure out how what happened makes you feel.
As far as avoiding men like this in the future: The best advice I know of is to pay more attention to how he makes you feel abaout yourself, instead of how you feel about him. I don't know if that makes any sense, but the idea is that these guys often do a very good job of making you feel lucky to be around them, but don't make it clear how lucky they are to be with you. If you're with a guy who makes you feel like you're worth dating, give him a shot. If the relationship feels more like it's about how cool HE is, that may be a sign of you going down the same path again.
posted by shmegegge at 1:27 AM on March 1, 2007 [3 favorites]
1. No, you weren't evil to text her. No, you didn't hurt her--he did. You had a beautiful moment of clarity when you filled her in on the situation. Pat yourself on the back. Her having "the worst day of her life" was his fault, not yours.
2. This is another question entirely, isn't it? Perhaps you are just innately attracted to aloof scoundrel types. If that's the case, and you also have a conflicting need to find a caring parent to co-found a breeding program, you're going to have to choose: do I want to be with someone I'm attracted to, or a good parent? They're probably not going to be the same person.
posted by mullingitover at 1:31 AM on March 1, 2007
2. This is another question entirely, isn't it? Perhaps you are just innately attracted to aloof scoundrel types. If that's the case, and you also have a conflicting need to find a caring parent to co-found a breeding program, you're going to have to choose: do I want to be with someone I'm attracted to, or a good parent? They're probably not going to be the same person.
posted by mullingitover at 1:31 AM on March 1, 2007
Eh. It's not an awesome thing to do but I'd allow that you were hurting and lashing out randomly as hurt people sometimes do. Not a proud moment to be sure, but it's hardly worth making moral judgments about.
posted by birdie birdington at 1:34 AM on March 1, 2007
posted by birdie birdington at 1:34 AM on March 1, 2007
Best answer: The communication wasn't evil in itself, but the method of it wasn't particularly sparing of the Other Woman's feelings.
Now, if I were the Other Woman I would be upset by the method, hurt freaked out and pissed off about being cheated upon, but upon reflection I would be GLAD that I was told about it.
Of course, I wouldn't have much love for you, being that you weren't intending to notify this woman until the guy said that he cho-cho-chose her instead of you.
Believe me, you're not evil or bad. I might have done the same thing you did in a well-justified fit of rage.
As regards your next question: Desperate people need to be MORE picky, not less. You don't have time to be shagging somebody unsuitable for you.
As regards steadiness vs. attractive traits, attractive traits can be successfully cultivated in steady types.
posted by By The Grace of God at 1:50 AM on March 1, 2007
Now, if I were the Other Woman I would be upset by the method, hurt freaked out and pissed off about being cheated upon, but upon reflection I would be GLAD that I was told about it.
Of course, I wouldn't have much love for you, being that you weren't intending to notify this woman until the guy said that he cho-cho-chose her instead of you.
Believe me, you're not evil or bad. I might have done the same thing you did in a well-justified fit of rage.
As regards your next question: Desperate people need to be MORE picky, not less. You don't have time to be shagging somebody unsuitable for you.
As regards steadiness vs. attractive traits, attractive traits can be successfully cultivated in steady types.
posted by By The Grace of God at 1:50 AM on March 1, 2007
I'm guessing that he had other undisclosed relationships.
Picking-a-man-filter: People in their early 20's might want to try living with someone to figure out how it works. After you figure it out though, I think marriage becomes important. If a potential guy is old enough to understand what marriage means, and he wants to live together instead, I'd discuss it as a prelude to dumping him.
Texting her wasn't evil. What was your other option? Phone call? Could have been worse.
posted by ewkpates at 3:09 AM on March 1, 2007
Picking-a-man-filter: People in their early 20's might want to try living with someone to figure out how it works. After you figure it out though, I think marriage becomes important. If a potential guy is old enough to understand what marriage means, and he wants to live together instead, I'd discuss it as a prelude to dumping him.
Texting her wasn't evil. What was your other option? Phone call? Could have been worse.
posted by ewkpates at 3:09 AM on March 1, 2007
If she really loved the guy, it could easily be the worst day of her life to find out that he's been successfully deceiving her for a year. Of course, she'd have to have had a relatively easy life as well. But no, I don't think that's melodramatic, or that you should diminish her feelings by insisting it is. HOWEVER, under no circumstances should you let this guy convince it's your fault that he cheated on her. Come on.
I think you did two things wrong - you told her by text (calling her or arranging to meet her would have been classier) and you continued to have sex with the guy knowing he was lying to her.
posted by joannemerriam at 3:11 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
I think you did two things wrong - you told her by text (calling her or arranging to meet her would have been classier) and you continued to have sex with the guy knowing he was lying to her.
posted by joannemerriam at 3:11 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Infatuation makes people do unreasonable things. Analyze your behavior as if you were drunk, because, in fact, you are... just not on alcohol.
What follows SOUNDS criticizing and condemning, but I am intentionally trying to be just observant, and apologize if it sounds sermonizing.
What you did seems mean, vengeful, and misdirected. You hurt someone who had not offended you in order to hurt someone who had.
At best, it's immature. At worst, manipulative. Evil? Perhaps a read of 'The Road Less Travelled' by M. Scott Peck can shed some light on it. He defines evil as a pathology and you can judge for yourself if you qualify.
Succumbing to Darwinian human urges is not a hallmark of a mature adult, and if you aspire to be one, and to contribute to the betterment of our species, it would be better to develop mature methods of reacting to life's disappointments because they are bound to happen frequently.
It sure sounds like everyone had a bad day. Worst day of one's life? Perhaps in a young life. Things can get a lot worse.
Really, there's no need to do this sort of thing. Just walk away. Be bigger than your antagonist and you'll like yourself a lot more, with good reason.
posted by FauxScot at 3:30 AM on March 1, 2007
What follows SOUNDS criticizing and condemning, but I am intentionally trying to be just observant, and apologize if it sounds sermonizing.
What you did seems mean, vengeful, and misdirected. You hurt someone who had not offended you in order to hurt someone who had.
At best, it's immature. At worst, manipulative. Evil? Perhaps a read of 'The Road Less Travelled' by M. Scott Peck can shed some light on it. He defines evil as a pathology and you can judge for yourself if you qualify.
Succumbing to Darwinian human urges is not a hallmark of a mature adult, and if you aspire to be one, and to contribute to the betterment of our species, it would be better to develop mature methods of reacting to life's disappointments because they are bound to happen frequently.
It sure sounds like everyone had a bad day. Worst day of one's life? Perhaps in a young life. Things can get a lot worse.
Really, there's no need to do this sort of thing. Just walk away. Be bigger than your antagonist and you'll like yourself a lot more, with good reason.
posted by FauxScot at 3:30 AM on March 1, 2007
I would have tried to arrange to meet her face to face rather than texting her, but other than that, no, you are not evil for having told her. You're human. And God knows, that had to feel very cathartic. I would consider it to be an error due to endorphins and chalk it up to experience. I would say that "next time" you will be able to make a better decision, but I hope that there isn't a next time for you. Seriously, though, it sounds like a sort of mangled attempt to stand up for yourself, and that's actually a good thing.
posted by Medieval Maven at 3:53 AM on March 1, 2007
posted by Medieval Maven at 3:53 AM on March 1, 2007
He is furious with me for hurting her and is not speaking to me.
You didn't hurt her, he did. and him not speaking to you is a plus.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:14 AM on March 1, 2007
You didn't hurt her, he did. and him not speaking to you is a plus.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:14 AM on March 1, 2007
I would want to know if I were her. Of course it hurt to find out that her new lover was cheating on her, but I'm sure it didn't hurt as badly as finding out a year, two years, ten years from now, that her long term partner was cheating. If she would have preferred not to know, she has bigger problems.
posted by textilephile at 4:42 AM on March 1, 2007
posted by textilephile at 4:42 AM on March 1, 2007
Best answer: Texting the other woman: I wouldn't have done it, at least not before I dumped his ass. Which you should do, promptly, if you haven't yet. It's in the past now, though, so don't beat yourself up over it; just learn from your mistake and hie thee to a clinic to get tested for STDs if you didn't use protection with him.
Avoiding this pattern in the future: To put it bluntly, just because you're feeling older and desparate is not a good reason to get married and have a child. It virtually ensures you'll pick someone who's just marginally compatible with you, and marginal compatability does not a stable family make. Think about your future child, if not yourself: kids are deeply affected by unhappy marriages, and you can't be the kind of parent your child deserves when you're miserable. Children make marriage harder, not easier. You will not feel closer to your husband when it's 3am and you're arguing over whose turn it is to feed the baby. Families started with the best of intentions sometimes break apart; why would you bring a child into an environment where that is virtually assured?
Instead, focus on yourself and becoming someone you like -- someone who feels worthy of the kind of treatment that you deserve. The old adage about love finding you when you're not looking for it is true, but not necessarily because it's all serendipity: rather, being comfortable enough with yourself not to be looking for someone else's affection and approval at every turn sets you up to recognize love when you see it, and to know what you need from a relationship.
Look, you're going to grad school soon. This is the perfect time to take a break from dating and spend some quality time with yourself. Forget the whole biological clock thing. You do not need a man or a baby to be whole. When you can really accept that, I think you'll be well on your way.
(And yes, therapy would probably be a very good idea if you can swing it, it will make recognizing destructive patterns in your behaviour a lot easier.)
posted by AV at 4:56 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Avoiding this pattern in the future: To put it bluntly, just because you're feeling older and desparate is not a good reason to get married and have a child. It virtually ensures you'll pick someone who's just marginally compatible with you, and marginal compatability does not a stable family make. Think about your future child, if not yourself: kids are deeply affected by unhappy marriages, and you can't be the kind of parent your child deserves when you're miserable. Children make marriage harder, not easier. You will not feel closer to your husband when it's 3am and you're arguing over whose turn it is to feed the baby. Families started with the best of intentions sometimes break apart; why would you bring a child into an environment where that is virtually assured?
Instead, focus on yourself and becoming someone you like -- someone who feels worthy of the kind of treatment that you deserve. The old adage about love finding you when you're not looking for it is true, but not necessarily because it's all serendipity: rather, being comfortable enough with yourself not to be looking for someone else's affection and approval at every turn sets you up to recognize love when you see it, and to know what you need from a relationship.
Look, you're going to grad school soon. This is the perfect time to take a break from dating and spend some quality time with yourself. Forget the whole biological clock thing. You do not need a man or a baby to be whole. When you can really accept that, I think you'll be well on your way.
(And yes, therapy would probably be a very good idea if you can swing it, it will make recognizing destructive patterns in your behaviour a lot easier.)
posted by AV at 4:56 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Of course you hurt her. Didn't it hurt you when he told you he had replaced you with another woman? That doesn't mean it was a totally evil or wrong thing to do. He sounds like a manipulative slimeball, and she should know about it. (But a text, from his phone no less, is kind of passive-aggressive; a phone call, visit, or even an email would have been kinder.)
But that is all in the past; your real question is how to find and maintain better relationships. I'm firmly of the opinion that you can only be happy in a relationship if you are first happy with yourself. So figuring out what you have been getting from these not-great relationships, and then learning how to give yourself what you need without resorting to bad relationships, would be a good course of action.
How you get there depends on you. Some people can spend a long weekend thinking and being self-reflective, and make a decision to move on. Others need self-help books, or sessions with a therapist, or any of the other techniques that are suggested. Whatever works for you --- the key is understanding that what you have been and are doing isn't working for you, and you will need to change if you want events to work differently in the future.
Fundamentally, you need to value yourself enough to feel worthy of being with someone who is good for you. Until then, you will find yourself with men who treat you as badly as you treat yourself, I think.
In a few months you are going to be living in the same town as this guy and this woman. If it is a small town, and your social circles overlap, you will meet them all the time. Big city, different social circles, not so much. So you may as well take the next few months, pre-grad school, as a chance to really get your head on straight about all this. You don't want to mess up grad school by being all dramatic about your personal life when you need to be serious as a scholar.
posted by Forktine at 4:59 AM on March 1, 2007
But that is all in the past; your real question is how to find and maintain better relationships. I'm firmly of the opinion that you can only be happy in a relationship if you are first happy with yourself. So figuring out what you have been getting from these not-great relationships, and then learning how to give yourself what you need without resorting to bad relationships, would be a good course of action.
How you get there depends on you. Some people can spend a long weekend thinking and being self-reflective, and make a decision to move on. Others need self-help books, or sessions with a therapist, or any of the other techniques that are suggested. Whatever works for you --- the key is understanding that what you have been and are doing isn't working for you, and you will need to change if you want events to work differently in the future.
Fundamentally, you need to value yourself enough to feel worthy of being with someone who is good for you. Until then, you will find yourself with men who treat you as badly as you treat yourself, I think.
In a few months you are going to be living in the same town as this guy and this woman. If it is a small town, and your social circles overlap, you will meet them all the time. Big city, different social circles, not so much. So you may as well take the next few months, pre-grad school, as a chance to really get your head on straight about all this. You don't want to mess up grad school by being all dramatic about your personal life when you need to be serious as a scholar.
posted by Forktine at 4:59 AM on March 1, 2007
I think you did her a favor. He's the one that caused her to have "the worst day of her life" and caused you pain as well.
Don't have anything to do with that jerk ever again and get some therapy and work on building better relationships.
posted by Melsky at 5:00 AM on March 1, 2007
Don't have anything to do with that jerk ever again and get some therapy and work on building better relationships.
posted by Melsky at 5:00 AM on March 1, 2007
Best answer: He invited romantic interest from this woman a month ago after things with you two had escalated to the point where he'd asked you to move in (no wonder, since a woman living three miles away or less apparently trumps one he describes as "the best partner for him that he had ever found"). He's obviously good at pouring it on: lying to her about your existence, and likely making the same fast, extravagant promises and claims as he did to you. You're feeling shitty because she's not the right target for your rage -- she's just another girl who's been deluded by him. At some point she'll get over the pain and be better off for having dodged a bullet. (Or stick around for more of his lies -- who knows? People, even smart ones, make all kinds of horrific choices for the sake of something even vaguely resembling love.) You've dodged a bullet too, and you're right to ask why this happened to you in the first place.
Here's a few things I've found. It's good to be wary of people who make dramatic declamations at the start of a relationship --- they may turn out to be true, but when you're at the start of things together, it's just too damn easy to fall in love with love and not with the actual person you're going to have to wake up with once the infatuation's died down. Too, when you are driven to desperation -- because you want your own children and time's running short, or you're horribly lonely -- you're going to make desperate choices. You have to somehow come to peace with the idea that you might not get what you want. You want a partner, but you want someone who treats you well and truly loves you. You want kids, but you want a happy life for them.
The thing is, I'm guessing you know most of this already, but your judgment is being clouded by high emotion and desire and the prospect of never getting what it is you want. People advocate therapy all the time here for good or ill, but since you know what you want but can't seem to make the right choices to get it, a therapist might be able to help you match up your thinking to your actions. ou're feeling shitty because you know she's not the right target for your rage. If you had some help to critically examine why that is, I think you'd be much more likely to find the happiness you seek. I truly wish you well.
posted by melissa may at 5:11 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Here's a few things I've found. It's good to be wary of people who make dramatic declamations at the start of a relationship --- they may turn out to be true, but when you're at the start of things together, it's just too damn easy to fall in love with love and not with the actual person you're going to have to wake up with once the infatuation's died down. Too, when you are driven to desperation -- because you want your own children and time's running short, or you're horribly lonely -- you're going to make desperate choices. You have to somehow come to peace with the idea that you might not get what you want. You want a partner, but you want someone who treats you well and truly loves you. You want kids, but you want a happy life for them.
The thing is, I'm guessing you know most of this already, but your judgment is being clouded by high emotion and desire and the prospect of never getting what it is you want. People advocate therapy all the time here for good or ill, but since you know what you want but can't seem to make the right choices to get it, a therapist might be able to help you match up your thinking to your actions. ou're feeling shitty because you know she's not the right target for your rage. If you had some help to critically examine why that is, I think you'd be much more likely to find the happiness you seek. I truly wish you well.
posted by melissa may at 5:11 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
sounds to me like everyone is being melodramatic. the guy was part of your life for 3 months (and really, only for two weekends a month plus some vacation time!), and did not lie to you about the other woman or what was going on with her. He has been in the life of the other woman for a month plus however long they were hanging out a year ago before they lost touch, although he did lie to her. That to me seem indicative that he had already chosen her early on and was just having trouble getting out of the relationship with you because he had been enjoying it and you were taking it very seriously.
In any case, we could analyze the details here, but in the end, step back, chill out, and move on. It's just a relationship you got hopeful about that didn't work out. Do not apologize to the other woman or worry about her life. Do not think of it as a negative that he is no longer speaking to you. That is a positive development.
How do you avoid this in the future? It sounds to me like being more calm and reflective about things would help - you seem to be the sort who gets swept up in drama, which can lead both to ecstacy (after 3 months imagining this is true love) and tragedy (oops, I was wrong about that). If you can maintain perspective, qualify assessments, notice the aspects of the relationship that are going to need work, that might help. But remember that half the tragedy is in your head. Yes, it was upsetting for you that he was seeing someone else, but your relationship was young and he didn't hide an affair; he told you he was torn between you & someone else. that hurts, but more so when you've built up the relationship to be more than it was.
The tricky thing is that my tentative, pragmatic approach to relationships means I rarely have anything resembling a whirlwind romance, and though I don't get hurt often, one could claim that's because I don't open my heart enough or something. I tend to think it's because I don't meet the right people often enough, but whatever - the point is, it may just be a personality thing, and every approach to love has pluses and minuses. A lot of people like the drama most of all.
Still, I'd recommend balancing it at least a little bit, especially in your mid-30s. Think about your own life first, and try to take things slowly.
posted by mdn at 5:15 AM on March 1, 2007
In any case, we could analyze the details here, but in the end, step back, chill out, and move on. It's just a relationship you got hopeful about that didn't work out. Do not apologize to the other woman or worry about her life. Do not think of it as a negative that he is no longer speaking to you. That is a positive development.
How do you avoid this in the future? It sounds to me like being more calm and reflective about things would help - you seem to be the sort who gets swept up in drama, which can lead both to ecstacy (after 3 months imagining this is true love) and tragedy (oops, I was wrong about that). If you can maintain perspective, qualify assessments, notice the aspects of the relationship that are going to need work, that might help. But remember that half the tragedy is in your head. Yes, it was upsetting for you that he was seeing someone else, but your relationship was young and he didn't hide an affair; he told you he was torn between you & someone else. that hurts, but more so when you've built up the relationship to be more than it was.
The tricky thing is that my tentative, pragmatic approach to relationships means I rarely have anything resembling a whirlwind romance, and though I don't get hurt often, one could claim that's because I don't open my heart enough or something. I tend to think it's because I don't meet the right people often enough, but whatever - the point is, it may just be a personality thing, and every approach to love has pluses and minuses. A lot of people like the drama most of all.
Still, I'd recommend balancing it at least a little bit, especially in your mid-30s. Think about your own life first, and try to take things slowly.
posted by mdn at 5:15 AM on March 1, 2007
Damn, sorry for misediting that last paragraph.
posted by melissa may at 5:20 AM on March 1, 2007
posted by melissa may at 5:20 AM on March 1, 2007
You didn't hurt her, he did. and him not speaking to you is a plus.
Just wanted to repeat that.
Also, I can't imagine too many women wouldn't rather know they were with a cad, and asap, no matter how shitty the way you find out.
posted by poxuppit at 5:32 AM on March 1, 2007
Just wanted to repeat that.
Also, I can't imagine too many women wouldn't rather know they were with a cad, and asap, no matter how shitty the way you find out.
posted by poxuppit at 5:32 AM on March 1, 2007
Best answer: It's not your fault she got hurt. It's his. Repeat that to yourself until you see what I mean.
You may have swung the hatchet down at the last second, but he's the one that put her head on the chopping block and the ax in your hand. Don't feel guilty. He's shirking responsibility for the whole thing because he's a scumbag.
He said he couldn't decide between me and her because, although I was so compatible with him, she lived 3 miles away. I forced him to choose and he said that, because of the ultimatum, he was choosing her.
A word of advice: when you give someone an ultimatum, they usually take the option you don't want them to take. You shouldn't of given him the liberty and luxury of choice; you should have decided for him by kicking his cheating, lying ass to the curb.
posted by milarepa at 5:33 AM on March 1, 2007
You may have swung the hatchet down at the last second, but he's the one that put her head on the chopping block and the ax in your hand. Don't feel guilty. He's shirking responsibility for the whole thing because he's a scumbag.
He said he couldn't decide between me and her because, although I was so compatible with him, she lived 3 miles away. I forced him to choose and he said that, because of the ultimatum, he was choosing her.
A word of advice: when you give someone an ultimatum, they usually take the option you don't want them to take. You shouldn't of given him the liberty and luxury of choice; you should have decided for him by kicking his cheating, lying ass to the curb.
posted by milarepa at 5:33 AM on March 1, 2007
Best answer: "1. Was I evil to text her? Did I hurt her? How could this be "the worst day of her life" - isn't that a bit melodramatic?"
"...Texting her wasn't evil. What was your other option? Phone call?..."
Do nothing and walk away with salvageable dignity?
Sorry for the tough love but I think what you did was pretty bad. I don't get the same read that some commenters have: that you were texting her to courteously inform her that she was being cheated on and lied to, sisterfriend to sisterfriend.
Instead, I think you were texting her in the hopes of shocking and upsetting her, and making her walk away so you would "win" him. And that is pretty evil, hurtful, and worthy of melodrama.
He was the only bad guy here, and good judgment would have led you to walk away as soon as you saw there was another woman in the picture. Instead, the high emotion of passionate infatuation led you to act irrationally.
"People, even smart ones, make all kinds of horrific choices for the sake of something even vaguely resembling love."
Quoted for truth. Consider what you did a karmic debt to repay to the universe, and move on.
You also might contemplate post-grad-school alternatives for starting a family on your own. Wanting children and wrestling with the calendar can be confusing and complicating, insuring that you only see potential mates through the wildly emotional BabyFilter. It might be worth considering separating sperm potential from companion/father potential.
posted by pineapple at 5:48 AM on March 1, 2007 [3 favorites]
"...Texting her wasn't evil. What was your other option? Phone call?..."
Do nothing and walk away with salvageable dignity?
Sorry for the tough love but I think what you did was pretty bad. I don't get the same read that some commenters have: that you were texting her to courteously inform her that she was being cheated on and lied to, sisterfriend to sisterfriend.
Instead, I think you were texting her in the hopes of shocking and upsetting her, and making her walk away so you would "win" him. And that is pretty evil, hurtful, and worthy of melodrama.
He was the only bad guy here, and good judgment would have led you to walk away as soon as you saw there was another woman in the picture. Instead, the high emotion of passionate infatuation led you to act irrationally.
"People, even smart ones, make all kinds of horrific choices for the sake of something even vaguely resembling love."
Quoted for truth. Consider what you did a karmic debt to repay to the universe, and move on.
You also might contemplate post-grad-school alternatives for starting a family on your own. Wanting children and wrestling with the calendar can be confusing and complicating, insuring that you only see potential mates through the wildly emotional BabyFilter. It might be worth considering separating sperm potential from companion/father potential.
posted by pineapple at 5:48 AM on March 1, 2007 [3 favorites]
Of course you hurt her. You're responsible for what you do. Your ex-boyfriend was a jerk and hurt you. You were a jerk in how you responded to this, and instead of dealing with the person who hurt you, you took it out on someone else.
Calling it "evil" is melodrama on your part. In fact, all of this sounds like a bad soap opera to me. If I were you, I'd take a "time out" from relationships and dating and work on your own issues, being happy in your own skin, and being more mature.
I have a history of being with men who can't love and I want to change. Where do I start?
So often we say "counseling" in answering questions like these. If it is a real patten in your life, you may need some help to change it.
posted by Robert Angelo at 5:49 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Calling it "evil" is melodrama on your part. In fact, all of this sounds like a bad soap opera to me. If I were you, I'd take a "time out" from relationships and dating and work on your own issues, being happy in your own skin, and being more mature.
I have a history of being with men who can't love and I want to change. Where do I start?
So often we say "counseling" in answering questions like these. If it is a real patten in your life, you may need some help to change it.
posted by Robert Angelo at 5:49 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
What 23skidoo said.
Texting this other woman was petty and spiteful. You should feel bad about it.
posted by thirteenkiller at 6:01 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Texting this other woman was petty and spiteful. You should feel bad about it.
posted by thirteenkiller at 6:01 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Of course you hurt her. You wanted to hurt her. Maybe now you feel badly about it, but at the time you were hurt that she "won" this jerk's favor (some prize) and wanted to lash out. Ultimately, you did her a favor, but you could have gone about it in better ways. Like, not taking the vacation, ending your relationship with the jerk, then telling her "hey just so you know, he saw me while he was seeing you. It's over now but I thought you should know." Then she could have dealt with it with him, without you being in the middle.
Also, doing this while you were on vacation with him was really stupid. What if he got violent with you while you were alone in a hotel room with him? You're right that you need to learn to look out for yourself -- therapy should be able to help you with this.
Also "he's not speaking to me" -- good. He shouldn't be. You're broken up. Let this go, move on, and get your ass into therapy before your self-destructive behavior gets you in real trouble.
posted by boomchicka at 6:21 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Also, doing this while you were on vacation with him was really stupid. What if he got violent with you while you were alone in a hotel room with him? You're right that you need to learn to look out for yourself -- therapy should be able to help you with this.
Also "he's not speaking to me" -- good. He shouldn't be. You're broken up. Let this go, move on, and get your ass into therapy before your self-destructive behavior gets you in real trouble.
posted by boomchicka at 6:21 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Why would you lash out at the woman, when it was clearly the guy that is a total wanker?
If she wasn't even aware you existed, and out of the blue she gets texts from a woman saying i'm sleeping with the guy you like, then she probably would be upset. If it was the worse day of her life, then her life probably ain't that bad.
posted by chunking express at 6:36 AM on March 1, 2007
If she wasn't even aware you existed, and out of the blue she gets texts from a woman saying i'm sleeping with the guy you like, then she probably would be upset. If it was the worse day of her life, then her life probably ain't that bad.
posted by chunking express at 6:36 AM on March 1, 2007
It wasn't the most mature thing, but it was far from evil. It's in the past; let it, along with the both of them, go. His anger is understandable, yes, and let him have it. He's mad at himself as well as you, just like you're mad at both yourself and him. That's OK. You just both have to move on, separately.
The answer to your second question is that you don't have to back away from people you're attracted to and compatible with, unless and until (and this is the important part) they are cheating on you.
As soon as anything resembling any kind of "other woman" (or man) is involved, that's when you cut and run, unless you're into that kind of thing. You don't need a super-in-tune warning sign RADAR--he told you outright that he was sleeping with someone else and lying to her about you. You just leave then.
posted by lampoil at 6:46 AM on March 1, 2007
The answer to your second question is that you don't have to back away from people you're attracted to and compatible with, unless and until (and this is the important part) they are cheating on you.
As soon as anything resembling any kind of "other woman" (or man) is involved, that's when you cut and run, unless you're into that kind of thing. You don't need a super-in-tune warning sign RADAR--he told you outright that he was sleeping with someone else and lying to her about you. You just leave then.
posted by lampoil at 6:46 AM on March 1, 2007
I argue that it WAS acceptable to contact the woman. Any normal woman would want to know if they're being cheated on. This woman is clearly in la-la land. You should NOT make this your problem. Both her and the guy are clearly fucked in the head. Run away from both of them.
I think whether you were being petty is irrelevant when infidelity is at the core of both of these relationships. Though others have extremely good points that you should have gotten the hell out of there before you took any action.
posted by zek at 7:00 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
I think whether you were being petty is irrelevant when infidelity is at the core of both of these relationships. Though others have extremely good points that you should have gotten the hell out of there before you took any action.
posted by zek at 7:00 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
scumbag
the guy sounds like a dick
his cheating, lying ass
that jerk
manipulative slimeball
he's a jerk
Whoa!
It's not clear to me that the guy cheated at all. Another equally plausible reading is that he believed that he was non-exclusively dating both of them, and then hazyjane threw down an ultimatum (on vacation, yet!) and then, when the ultimatum failed to produce the desired effect, decided that in that case she'd at least try to fuck up his life as much as possible.
HJ, I don't know that you're worse than Hitler, but I certainly wouldn't date you.
posted by myeviltwin at 7:14 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
the guy sounds like a dick
his cheating, lying ass
that jerk
manipulative slimeball
he's a jerk
Whoa!
It's not clear to me that the guy cheated at all. Another equally plausible reading is that he believed that he was non-exclusively dating both of them, and then hazyjane threw down an ultimatum (on vacation, yet!) and then, when the ultimatum failed to produce the desired effect, decided that in that case she'd at least try to fuck up his life as much as possible.
HJ, I don't know that you're worse than Hitler, but I certainly wouldn't date you.
posted by myeviltwin at 7:14 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
You want opinions? I'd have to go with stephanie and melissa may, if you know what I mean.
posted by Pressed Rat at 7:17 AM on March 1, 2007
posted by Pressed Rat at 7:17 AM on March 1, 2007
You were petty and vindictive, taking your anger out on another person who had been duped rather than on the guy.
Also, "men who can't love' is probably a misnomer. It takes two to tango in any relationship, and if you are finding a consistent pattern in the way your relationships end up, I would respectfully suggest to you that the consistent factor in all of them is *you*.
So, no doubt the guy's a dick, but on the other hand you were only dating for less than three months and seem to have got intense very quickly (proposing moving in? wow!). Perhaps you shouldn't be surprised that after meeting you online and quickly getting you in bed, he did the same to someone else.
Start thinking. Jerks can smell desperation a mile off, and it sounds like this guy took advantage of that.
posted by modernnomad at 7:24 AM on March 1, 2007
Also, "men who can't love' is probably a misnomer. It takes two to tango in any relationship, and if you are finding a consistent pattern in the way your relationships end up, I would respectfully suggest to you that the consistent factor in all of them is *you*.
So, no doubt the guy's a dick, but on the other hand you were only dating for less than three months and seem to have got intense very quickly (proposing moving in? wow!). Perhaps you shouldn't be surprised that after meeting you online and quickly getting you in bed, he did the same to someone else.
Start thinking. Jerks can smell desperation a mile off, and it sounds like this guy took advantage of that.
posted by modernnomad at 7:24 AM on March 1, 2007
It's not clear to me that the guy cheated at all.
Oh, come now. He asked her to move in with him.
posted by kmennie at 7:24 AM on March 1, 2007
Oh, come now. He asked her to move in with him.
posted by kmennie at 7:24 AM on March 1, 2007
myeviltwin: he asked her to move in. Sure, in the future, but that would seem pretty exclusive to most women.
posted by artifarce at 7:30 AM on March 1, 2007
posted by artifarce at 7:30 AM on March 1, 2007
Evil, no. Mean, yes.
Seriously, you text messaged her with this bombshell? If it was so important that she know what kind of two-timing jerk was likely going to break her heart next, don't you think that she rated at least a phone call?
posted by desuetude at 7:33 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Seriously, you text messaged her with this bombshell? If it was so important that she know what kind of two-timing jerk was likely going to break her heart next, don't you think that she rated at least a phone call?
posted by desuetude at 7:33 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Evil? You did her a favor. I wouldn't lose any sleep over this one. The one "you" hurt was him, and he deserved it. As others have said, the person who hurt her was him, not you.
posted by caddis at 7:41 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
posted by caddis at 7:41 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
modernnomad hits it on the head: You were petty and vindictive, taking your anger out on another person who had been duped rather than on the guy.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:59 AM on March 1, 2007 [2 favorites]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:59 AM on March 1, 2007 [2 favorites]
He said I am the best partner for him that he had ever found
Right there, you should have put the pedal to the metal. It's the ol' "you're the best until better comes along".
posted by thinkpiece at 8:01 AM on March 1, 2007
Right there, you should have put the pedal to the metal. It's the ol' "you're the best until better comes along".
posted by thinkpiece at 8:01 AM on March 1, 2007
myeviltwin: he asked her to move in. Sure, in the future, but that would seem pretty exclusive to most women.
OK, I admit that I missed that bit. However, I'm not sure how seriously to take it. It could be "baby, I want to stay with you forever and therefore you should move in with me as soon as you get here," or it could be "hey, if you need a place to stay while you get sorted out, you can stay with me."
I'm just saying that he disclosed the other relationship, he disclosed that it was sexual, and then he asked HJ whether she wanted to continue dating, and she said yes (i.e., she accepted his invitation to go away together). Then SHE unilaterally tried to change the terms of the relationship, and acted like a vindictive, histrionic baby when he didn't go along.
posted by myeviltwin at 8:03 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
OK, I admit that I missed that bit. However, I'm not sure how seriously to take it. It could be "baby, I want to stay with you forever and therefore you should move in with me as soon as you get here," or it could be "hey, if you need a place to stay while you get sorted out, you can stay with me."
I'm just saying that he disclosed the other relationship, he disclosed that it was sexual, and then he asked HJ whether she wanted to continue dating, and she said yes (i.e., she accepted his invitation to go away together). Then SHE unilaterally tried to change the terms of the relationship, and acted like a vindictive, histrionic baby when he didn't go along.
posted by myeviltwin at 8:03 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
isn't that a bit melodramatic?
Pot, Kettle, Black.
posted by koudelka at 8:06 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Pot, Kettle, Black.
posted by koudelka at 8:06 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Something similar happened to me, but over longer lengths of time. My ex-boyfriend was with a woman for seven years. We were together for two years. We broke up but continued to sleep together and behave as though we were in a relationship together. I discovered (he did not tell me) that he was sleeping with his ex-girlfriend of seven years. He was also trying to work things out with her. When I found out, I was devastated. I contacted her via email and informed her in a concise and succinct manner that over the course of the past four months since he and I broke up, we continued to be physically intimate on a daily to weekly basis. It was a mutual and conscious decision on both of our parts and I thought she had the right to know.
Were you evil to text her? I struggled with this same question while debating whether to send her the email. It was not my place to play judge or jury. I knew the only pure and acceptable motive in sending the email to her was to have interest in her well-being and if that was the case, one would probably not send it at all. I knew that my motives were far from that. The only other motive that I felt was acceptable in sending her that email was my own personal closure. Sending her that email would be the ultimate fuck you, the last act, so to speak. I needed finality. I'm not proud of what I did, but I would not change it.
Did you hurt her? Of course you did. How could you not? Whether or not it really was the worst day of her life remains to be seen as time marches on. Regardless, it really isn't your business to assess whether or not that statement is melodramatic. What is the point of either you or forty different MeFites speculating about this woman's emotional state? In my opinion, I think you've done enough in regards to this woman. Now it's time to slowly and calmly walk into the rest of your life.
How do you change your pattern for falling for the wrong men? The standard and safe advice is to get some professional help. I agree with this suggestion as well. In my case, I did not seek professional help. I did a major overhaul in my life. I decided to carry myself with more integrity, awareness, and empathy. I went through the realization that I did a lot of painful and just plain crazy things to him. I owned them. What he did to me did not excuse or minimize what I did. My father's death did not excuse anything I did. My distrust did not excuse what I did either. My actions stood alone. I never loved him properly, if at all. I treated him badly.
Then I said to myself, here are the things I'm not carrying any longer: the things he did wrong. The lies he told me. The things he never owned up to. The excuses he told to rationalize his behavior. Things might have been bad but that didn't excuse how he handled them. It was cowardly.
Like I said earlier, I made a lot of changes. I wrote letters to him that I never intended to send. I began to take responsibility for how my actions affected others. In taking responsibility for my actions, I also took control of my life ("Take your life in your own hands, and what happens? A terrible thing: no one to blame." -- Erica Jong) I stopped saying the knee jerk apologies for situations where it was inappropriate. I identified my triggers and patterns. Et cetera. Over time, I gained perspective. My life got a lot bigger, a lot busier, a lot fuller.
My intention in relaying my personal experience is not to belittle or preach to you. I hope that this post either offers some advice or at the very least, some reassurance. I wish you the best.
posted by somersault at 9:13 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Were you evil to text her? I struggled with this same question while debating whether to send her the email. It was not my place to play judge or jury. I knew the only pure and acceptable motive in sending the email to her was to have interest in her well-being and if that was the case, one would probably not send it at all. I knew that my motives were far from that. The only other motive that I felt was acceptable in sending her that email was my own personal closure. Sending her that email would be the ultimate fuck you, the last act, so to speak. I needed finality. I'm not proud of what I did, but I would not change it.
Did you hurt her? Of course you did. How could you not? Whether or not it really was the worst day of her life remains to be seen as time marches on. Regardless, it really isn't your business to assess whether or not that statement is melodramatic. What is the point of either you or forty different MeFites speculating about this woman's emotional state? In my opinion, I think you've done enough in regards to this woman. Now it's time to slowly and calmly walk into the rest of your life.
How do you change your pattern for falling for the wrong men? The standard and safe advice is to get some professional help. I agree with this suggestion as well. In my case, I did not seek professional help. I did a major overhaul in my life. I decided to carry myself with more integrity, awareness, and empathy. I went through the realization that I did a lot of painful and just plain crazy things to him. I owned them. What he did to me did not excuse or minimize what I did. My father's death did not excuse anything I did. My distrust did not excuse what I did either. My actions stood alone. I never loved him properly, if at all. I treated him badly.
Then I said to myself, here are the things I'm not carrying any longer: the things he did wrong. The lies he told me. The things he never owned up to. The excuses he told to rationalize his behavior. Things might have been bad but that didn't excuse how he handled them. It was cowardly.
Like I said earlier, I made a lot of changes. I wrote letters to him that I never intended to send. I began to take responsibility for how my actions affected others. In taking responsibility for my actions, I also took control of my life ("Take your life in your own hands, and what happens? A terrible thing: no one to blame." -- Erica Jong) I stopped saying the knee jerk apologies for situations where it was inappropriate. I identified my triggers and patterns. Et cetera. Over time, I gained perspective. My life got a lot bigger, a lot busier, a lot fuller.
My intention in relaying my personal experience is not to belittle or preach to you. I hope that this post either offers some advice or at the very least, some reassurance. I wish you the best.
posted by somersault at 9:13 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Sometimes you get into a bad situation in life - you get so entangled in badness that no option is acceptable. Whatever you do is going to create more badness.
You were in one of those situations. You got out of it. Everyone's feathers got ruffled. No one died or was seriously injured, and that's certainly a plus. (If this was really the worst day of that woman's life, we should all envy her good fortune.)
Consider yourself well shut of the whole affair and move on.
posted by ikkyu2 at 9:33 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
You were in one of those situations. You got out of it. Everyone's feathers got ruffled. No one died or was seriously injured, and that's certainly a plus. (If this was really the worst day of that woman's life, we should all envy her good fortune.)
Consider yourself well shut of the whole affair and move on.
posted by ikkyu2 at 9:33 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
well, I have to say that I was in a similar situation on the other end of the spectrum, so I would like to offer my opinion. Background: I was dating a guy who lived about 30 minutes from me so we didnt see each other all the time but were in a relationship. One night I get a call from his phone from a girl who said "I am riding his dick now", "he needs a real woman", and "oh don't cry, you'll get over it" (oh and "I have to go my beer is getting warm".. very tasteful) Now, although I was crushed... it was worth it!
He was not worth it!
(sorry for the bold, can't get it to go away)
I would rather have had it this way. I don't hate her, I don't even care actually. You are not a bad, evil person.. you only did what would be a natural reaction for most people. Keep moving forward.
posted by ForeverDcember at 10:12 AM on March 1, 2007
He was not worth it!
(sorry for the bold, can't get it to go away)
I would rather have had it this way. I don't hate her, I don't even care actually. You are not a bad, evil person.. you only did what would be a natural reaction for most people. Keep moving forward.
posted by ForeverDcember at 10:12 AM on March 1, 2007
What's the goal here, some specific measurement of badness?
You were angry and a little mean, and you'd shown bad judgment by going on that trip in the first place. I'd say you get some credit for briefing her on what kind of a fellow he is, but that only counts so much.
What you should be concentrating on isn't some mystical karma point number but where you should have known better. Which I'd say is where he told you he'd met up with and slept with her... and then you went ahead on this long intimate trip anyway.
When you fail to walk away from things you know are fucked up you can't help but find yourself doing fucked up things. Start learning to walk away.
posted by phearlez at 10:18 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
You were angry and a little mean, and you'd shown bad judgment by going on that trip in the first place. I'd say you get some credit for briefing her on what kind of a fellow he is, but that only counts so much.
What you should be concentrating on isn't some mystical karma point number but where you should have known better. Which I'd say is where he told you he'd met up with and slept with her... and then you went ahead on this long intimate trip anyway.
When you fail to walk away from things you know are fucked up you can't help but find yourself doing fucked up things. Start learning to walk away.
posted by phearlez at 10:18 AM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Many years ago I was on the receiving end of a similar communication. In my case, it was a phone call while I was at work which I think is possibly crappier than a text on my cellphone. The purported purpose of the call was "I'm only telling you this for your benefit" but the real purpose of the call was to get back at my now-ex.
Was it a crappy day? Yup. Was it the worst day of my life? Not by a longshot. Would I have found out anyway? Absolutely. Was it "evil" to do it? Eeeeeh. Can't say one way or another. It probably helped hasten the death of a doomed relationship, so compressing some of the hurt into a nasty blow likely spared me some of the long drawn-out drama, so it's probably a wash in the end.
What's done is done. The best thing you can do now is move on and demand better for and from yourself in the future.
posted by ambrosia at 10:23 AM on March 1, 2007
Was it a crappy day? Yup. Was it the worst day of my life? Not by a longshot. Would I have found out anyway? Absolutely. Was it "evil" to do it? Eeeeeh. Can't say one way or another. It probably helped hasten the death of a doomed relationship, so compressing some of the hurt into a nasty blow likely spared me some of the long drawn-out drama, so it's probably a wash in the end.
What's done is done. The best thing you can do now is move on and demand better for and from yourself in the future.
posted by ambrosia at 10:23 AM on March 1, 2007
Response by poster: Thank you to everyone who has responded.
I've since heard from the guy and also from his ex-girlfriend (currently just his friend) who I had been getting friendly with too. The guy told me he had been seeing her for longer than he let on to me originally - that explains why she was so hurt. The ex-girlfriend told me he had continuously cheated on her during their relationship and that she thinks he has some kind of mental illness.
Regardless of whether I was right to warn the woman, my intentions were not good and that's what matters. It seems as though they're still going to keep seeing each other so it's not like the warning even inadvertently did any good.
Pot, Kettle, Black.
That's definitely true. At this point, I'm feeling ashamed of what I did and silly for having posted the question. I read somewhere that we tend to date people that are the same level of "crazy" as we are. I don't want that level anymore so clearly I have some work to do.
Thanks especially to everyone who said I need to walk away from this man. If I ever feel weak enough to write him back, I'll just reread this thread and that should cure me.
posted by hazyjane at 10:26 AM on March 1, 2007
I've since heard from the guy and also from his ex-girlfriend (currently just his friend) who I had been getting friendly with too. The guy told me he had been seeing her for longer than he let on to me originally - that explains why she was so hurt. The ex-girlfriend told me he had continuously cheated on her during their relationship and that she thinks he has some kind of mental illness.
Regardless of whether I was right to warn the woman, my intentions were not good and that's what matters. It seems as though they're still going to keep seeing each other so it's not like the warning even inadvertently did any good.
Pot, Kettle, Black.
That's definitely true. At this point, I'm feeling ashamed of what I did and silly for having posted the question. I read somewhere that we tend to date people that are the same level of "crazy" as we are. I don't want that level anymore so clearly I have some work to do.
Thanks especially to everyone who said I need to walk away from this man. If I ever feel weak enough to write him back, I'll just reread this thread and that should cure me.
posted by hazyjane at 10:26 AM on March 1, 2007
Response by poster: I just reread my last post and in case there was any confusion - the ex-girlfriend is not the person he was cheating on me with.
posted by hazyjane at 10:29 AM on March 1, 2007
posted by hazyjane at 10:29 AM on March 1, 2007
you lashed out at the wrong person instead of the guy who truly deserved a smackdown.
As is ALWAYS the case here, there's not nearly enough information to say for sure, but most people tend to get set in certain habits, moreso as they get older. I doubt there's anything you could say to the guy that would really get through to him; he's undoubtedly used to it at this point from the dozen other women he's done this to. Sure, it sucks to hear, but the phrase "don't shoot the messenger" exists for a good reason.
posted by dagnyscott at 12:21 PM on March 1, 2007
As is ALWAYS the case here, there's not nearly enough information to say for sure, but most people tend to get set in certain habits, moreso as they get older. I doubt there's anything you could say to the guy that would really get through to him; he's undoubtedly used to it at this point from the dozen other women he's done this to. Sure, it sucks to hear, but the phrase "don't shoot the messenger" exists for a good reason.
posted by dagnyscott at 12:21 PM on March 1, 2007
I think that by taking the number off his phone, you committed the ethical breach of violating his privacy. You told her the truth, in a way that was likely to be painful, so that was unkind. You had provocation, and you're not evil, but you clearly recognize that this was not a shining moment. You're experiencing some guilt, and it can teach you how to live your life in a way that is in line with your own ethics.
posted by theora55 at 2:57 PM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
posted by theora55 at 2:57 PM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
you lashed out at the wrong person instead of the guy who truly deserved a smackdown.
Maybe that's true, but the ONLY way she could hurt the guy was by contacting the girl. I think she did the best thing she could under the circumstances: it was the only thing she could do to have any control at all over the situation.
posted by Violet Hour at 5:38 PM on March 1, 2007
Maybe that's true, but the ONLY way she could hurt the guy was by contacting the girl. I think she did the best thing she could under the circumstances: it was the only thing she could do to have any control at all over the situation.
posted by Violet Hour at 5:38 PM on March 1, 2007
I think that by taking the number off his phone, you committed the ethical breach of violating his privacy.
Bingo.
Bingo.
Bingo.
Everything else you did follows from *that* evil you did.
posted by mediareport at 6:44 PM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Bingo.
Bingo.
Bingo.
Everything else you did follows from *that* evil you did.
posted by mediareport at 6:44 PM on March 1, 2007 [1 favorite]
Violet Hour: So it's OK because it was the only thing she could do to be "in control?"
I'm confused by that remark.
posted by wierdo at 11:47 PM on March 1, 2007
I'm confused by that remark.
posted by wierdo at 11:47 PM on March 1, 2007
THE LADY AND THE SNAKE
”It was really cold and a nice lady had a warm blanket. A poisonous snake nearby was shivering and begged the lady just to pick him up long enough for him to get warm. She resisted saying "you are a poisonous snake and you will bite me and I'll die!" He begged and pleaded and promised not to bite her so she finally gave in and picked him up and wrapped him in the blanket. He bit her and as she was laying there dying she asked "why did you bite me - you promised you wouldn't?" As he slithered away he looked back and said: "Lady you knew I was a snake when you picked me up!"
No, you're not evil but what you did sure was. And you just piled on top of the evil that was already being done. Sometimes people create a crisis to shake things up enough for them to be forced to find another pathway out. That's what you did; be glad something in your vengeful subconscious helped you found your way. Oh, and if you've never seen a production of Don Juan or Don Giovanni, or read a literary version of it, check it out. The way that guy worked you and the other woman was classic.
posted by fuse theorem at 5:09 AM on March 2, 2007
”It was really cold and a nice lady had a warm blanket. A poisonous snake nearby was shivering and begged the lady just to pick him up long enough for him to get warm. She resisted saying "you are a poisonous snake and you will bite me and I'll die!" He begged and pleaded and promised not to bite her so she finally gave in and picked him up and wrapped him in the blanket. He bit her and as she was laying there dying she asked "why did you bite me - you promised you wouldn't?" As he slithered away he looked back and said: "Lady you knew I was a snake when you picked me up!"
No, you're not evil but what you did sure was. And you just piled on top of the evil that was already being done. Sometimes people create a crisis to shake things up enough for them to be forced to find another pathway out. That's what you did; be glad something in your vengeful subconscious helped you found your way. Oh, and if you've never seen a production of Don Juan or Don Giovanni, or read a literary version of it, check it out. The way that guy worked you and the other woman was classic.
posted by fuse theorem at 5:09 AM on March 2, 2007
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And see a pro about why you want to punish yourself this way.
Everything else is Drama and Commentary...
posted by Dizzy at 12:26 AM on March 1, 2007