Giving up air travel and travel dreams
October 27, 2024 8:02 AM Subscribe
I love travel and can finally afford it and have people to travel with (spouse, kid). But with the climate emergency, traveling abroad once a year seems irresponsible.
I am 40ish and got to do some cool shoestring budget living/working/studying in Europe and Latin America about 20 years ago. I always hoped once I was established I could go see more places (especially Asia and Africa where I have never been) with the plan of using local guides/family run hotels etc. But now that the time has come, air travel seems irresponsible, given the climate emergency. I have done some of the other things that would help mitigate my impact, like driving an e.v., eating plant based, and have some plans for others, like solar panels and wearing only natural fibers. But all of that seems nearly irrelevant if I fly abroad once a year and use all that carbon. How have you dealt with this?know it is extremely privileged to even have the option of travel and most people will never get to go abroad ever. So I am grieving something most humans never get or got anyway. At the same time, it is one of the things I feel most excited about in middle age. I finally found a partner and a good career path, which took all of my twenties and half my thirties. I guess I had travel in mind as my next horizon and it was going to be this fun adventure. How do I grieve it and/or get past the individualism inherent in it (e.g. it's so important for ME to see this natural phenomenon, but me traveling to see it actually contributes to its destruction and the suffering of my species and others)?
I know the answer here might just be "get over yourself/grow up," but if you have a more creative way to think about it, that would be very helpful.
I am 40ish and got to do some cool shoestring budget living/working/studying in Europe and Latin America about 20 years ago. I always hoped once I was established I could go see more places (especially Asia and Africa where I have never been) with the plan of using local guides/family run hotels etc. But now that the time has come, air travel seems irresponsible, given the climate emergency. I have done some of the other things that would help mitigate my impact, like driving an e.v., eating plant based, and have some plans for others, like solar panels and wearing only natural fibers. But all of that seems nearly irrelevant if I fly abroad once a year and use all that carbon. How have you dealt with this?know it is extremely privileged to even have the option of travel and most people will never get to go abroad ever. So I am grieving something most humans never get or got anyway. At the same time, it is one of the things I feel most excited about in middle age. I finally found a partner and a good career path, which took all of my twenties and half my thirties. I guess I had travel in mind as my next horizon and it was going to be this fun adventure. How do I grieve it and/or get past the individualism inherent in it (e.g. it's so important for ME to see this natural phenomenon, but me traveling to see it actually contributes to its destruction and the suffering of my species and others)?
I know the answer here might just be "get over yourself/grow up," but if you have a more creative way to think about it, that would be very helpful.
Can you buy carbon off-sets?
posted by saturdaymornings at 8:22 AM on October 27 [2 favorites]
posted by saturdaymornings at 8:22 AM on October 27 [2 favorites]
Why carbon offsetting is not going to solve the problem of climate change
posted by rabia.elizabeth at 8:25 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
posted by rabia.elizabeth at 8:25 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
People flying once a year are not the problem.
While you would be adding significantly to your personal carbon footprint, in the bigger picture everyone taking just one flight a year would make aviation sustainable.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 8:29 AM on October 27 [72 favorites]
While you would be adding significantly to your personal carbon footprint, in the bigger picture everyone taking just one flight a year would make aviation sustainable.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 8:29 AM on October 27 [72 favorites]
Do not worry about how your actions as a regular person add to the climate crisis. Take that impulse and spend time helping efforts to lobby for better environmental and economic regulations.
posted by Jon_Evil at 9:01 AM on October 27 [47 favorites]
posted by Jon_Evil at 9:01 AM on October 27 [47 favorites]
It's hard to know how accurate any carbon calculator is, but I did one awhile ago and I was struck how flights didn't have nearly as much impact as consumerism - my footprint was relatively small because I rarely buy new things. I played around with the calculator a bit - adding an extra international flight a year did increase the footprint a bit, but not nearly as much as if I hiked up my consumption of new clothes by $100 a month. The fact that you're eating a plant based diet and driving an EV is also likely more significant than one flight per year. You might compromise by only visiting places that you fly directly to, since taking off/landing are emission-heavy. Or if that would be too limiting, two legs only. Since you are contemplating solar panels, I assume you own your home - you might also consider getting rid of your lawn and growing a meadow (NYTimes link). I personally think individual choices do matter, because making choices based on the climate crisis is likely to encourage other people to do so as well, and that cumulative effect has the potential to be really significant. But I also think it's never healthy to expect perfection of yourself either.
Carbon-offsetting is controversial for a reason, and certainly a fair number are pure greenwashing, but donating to reputable environmental charities is perhaps a better route. Earth Justice is basically a non profit law firm for the earth, and they do good work with tangible outputs.
All that said, if you're comfortable sharing where you live, you could ask another question along the lines of "what places are worth visiting that are 12hrs of driving from [your city]." That might help you get excited about all there is to explore with your EV.
posted by coffeecat at 9:02 AM on October 27 [15 favorites]
Carbon-offsetting is controversial for a reason, and certainly a fair number are pure greenwashing, but donating to reputable environmental charities is perhaps a better route. Earth Justice is basically a non profit law firm for the earth, and they do good work with tangible outputs.
All that said, if you're comfortable sharing where you live, you could ask another question along the lines of "what places are worth visiting that are 12hrs of driving from [your city]." That might help you get excited about all there is to explore with your EV.
posted by coffeecat at 9:02 AM on October 27 [15 favorites]
If everybody flew as often as you want to, in large packed commercial flights, and took trains when available to travel away from hub destinations, air travel would become sustainable. You are welcome to do a different personal calculation, but I really think this is a case of your (totally understandable) anxiety about climate destruction getting in the way of you enjoying your life and the world.
If it really doesn’t shake out for you to allow yourself to travel by plane, there are long haul alternatives that might work out with enough planning ahead and time off. There are still passenger boats that cross oceans, and once you get to another hemisphere there are typically trains and roads that can get you to the vast majority of places on the connected continents. It would mean much longer travel times and a lot of passport hassle, and the logistics are much more complicated, but it can be done.
Or, you could focus on traveling more locally, and make a point to engage with virtual experiences of places farther afield. I’m assuming you’re in the US, and it is a truly enormous country with so many different things to see and do. I know an older couple who have tried to visit every national park and they haven’t managed it yet. There are virtual tours of many international museums and landmarks, and live cams of a huge number of natural phenomenons, animals, and places. Pick some interests of your spouse and kid and use them to guide you for making travel choices, starting locally and branching out as you go. You might be surprised how many things there are nearby or connected by train that will make your loved ones excited to visit, once you spend some time letting go of your specific travel plans.
posted by Mizu at 10:32 AM on October 27 [8 favorites]
If it really doesn’t shake out for you to allow yourself to travel by plane, there are long haul alternatives that might work out with enough planning ahead and time off. There are still passenger boats that cross oceans, and once you get to another hemisphere there are typically trains and roads that can get you to the vast majority of places on the connected continents. It would mean much longer travel times and a lot of passport hassle, and the logistics are much more complicated, but it can be done.
Or, you could focus on traveling more locally, and make a point to engage with virtual experiences of places farther afield. I’m assuming you’re in the US, and it is a truly enormous country with so many different things to see and do. I know an older couple who have tried to visit every national park and they haven’t managed it yet. There are virtual tours of many international museums and landmarks, and live cams of a huge number of natural phenomenons, animals, and places. Pick some interests of your spouse and kid and use them to guide you for making travel choices, starting locally and branching out as you go. You might be surprised how many things there are nearby or connected by train that will make your loved ones excited to visit, once you spend some time letting go of your specific travel plans.
posted by Mizu at 10:32 AM on October 27 [8 favorites]
I would try to move away from the all or nothing thinking here. Okay, so your conscience won't allow you to travel internationally once per year. What if you allow yourself to go every 5 years? If you started at 45 and ended at 80, that's still 8 amazing trips to look forward to. (Or pick another increment that feels good!) And as others have said, there are likely plenty of places to explore in your own country / continent, or more sustainable ways of travel.
I admire your commitment to sustainability, and it sounds like you're taking so many steps to live your values! But, as others have said, individuals are not the problem here. I liked coffeecat's response on that angle.
posted by leftover_scrabble_rack at 10:55 AM on October 27 [14 favorites]
I admire your commitment to sustainability, and it sounds like you're taking so many steps to live your values! But, as others have said, individuals are not the problem here. I liked coffeecat's response on that angle.
posted by leftover_scrabble_rack at 10:55 AM on October 27 [14 favorites]
Yes, I don't want to say individual choices don't matter at all. You should try to have your life reflect your values when possible, and network effects can end up being important, too. However, we shouldn't get mesmerized by the ascetic glamor of the big sacrifices, either. Let us assume that you are not actually called to be a saint. Is never ever traveling internationally actually the most effective use of the emotional energy required to renounce your great dream?
I travel internationally sometimes (though these days it's mostly Canada, but driving to BC from the US East Coast would be a lot). I don't own a car and rely on public transit (plus an occasional taxi where necessary). I live in a densely-populated city and support making it denser. I also of course support the party that believes in climate change, I recycle, I guess I'm going to be composting soon (do not love that one in a tiny apartment), I try not to randomly waste energy. I think I'm doing decently for one human being and I'm not going to wear sackcloth when big corporations are the real culprits here and don't stay up nights.
Don't measure your sacrifices by how important they feel to you; do it by how effective they actually are.
posted by praemunire at 11:10 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
I travel internationally sometimes (though these days it's mostly Canada, but driving to BC from the US East Coast would be a lot). I don't own a car and rely on public transit (plus an occasional taxi where necessary). I live in a densely-populated city and support making it denser. I also of course support the party that believes in climate change, I recycle, I guess I'm going to be composting soon (do not love that one in a tiny apartment), I try not to randomly waste energy. I think I'm doing decently for one human being and I'm not going to wear sackcloth when big corporations are the real culprits here and don't stay up nights.
Don't measure your sacrifices by how important they feel to you; do it by how effective they actually are.
posted by praemunire at 11:10 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
Response by poster: Just to give context on the individual contributions point: obviously nothing I do means anything in the scheme of terrible policy choices and the fossil fuel industry's culpability. I don't pretend otherwise. But I also just want to model a sustainable lifestyle for my kid and do what I can.
The person who pointed out that this comes from climate anxiety is absolutely right. Mine has gotten a lot worse since having a kid. I made the choice to have a kid because I genuinely believe our situation is not hopeless and humans could still work together to sustain and adapt and avoid the worst. I already vote (and always have) for the best climate candidates. I feel like I have mostly done what I can. So I think the motive is not the "ascetic glamour" mentioned above so much as a desire to try to control something that I can control. The catch is: making this sacrifice might not make me feel much better and, as several people point out, might not help much either.
posted by Sophiaverde at 11:32 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
The person who pointed out that this comes from climate anxiety is absolutely right. Mine has gotten a lot worse since having a kid. I made the choice to have a kid because I genuinely believe our situation is not hopeless and humans could still work together to sustain and adapt and avoid the worst. I already vote (and always have) for the best climate candidates. I feel like I have mostly done what I can. So I think the motive is not the "ascetic glamour" mentioned above so much as a desire to try to control something that I can control. The catch is: making this sacrifice might not make me feel much better and, as several people point out, might not help much either.
posted by Sophiaverde at 11:32 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
Thanks for asking this question and caring about the climate emergency. I'm not here to help you to decide if flying is ok or not for you. But you might want to dig into this feeling of guilt that is driving your decisions. What if you spent as much time making fossil fuel executives, financial institutions, and politicians feel guilty for their complicity in climate change as you do agonizing over your personal decision to fly? I believe you might find that your energies are better spent and the feeling of guilt turns to power as you join others doing this same work. I encourage you to listen to this podcast: Climate One—What more can I do? which can provide some much needed perspective here.
Also, you might want to look into Climate Changemakers, a community of advocates advancing bold climate policy through focused civic action. Just over the past two years, we've run campaigns to divest our banks from fossil fuel financing, move our money away from those banks, elect pro-climate politicians, enable composting services in our cities, get our lawmakers to pass the Inflation Reduction Act, our cities to enable more electrification, and our states to enable greater electrical transmission capacity. Notice how none of these things mention flying or any consumer choices. If you only have one hour a week, you can get this stuff done. Baby steps add up over time.
From Wikipedia:
"Critics argue that the original aim of promoting the personal carbon footprint concept was to shift responsibility away from corporations and institutions and on to personal lifestyle choices. The fossil fuel company BP ran a large advertising campaign for the personal carbon footprint in 2005 which helped popularize this concept. This strategy, employed by many major fossil fuel companies, has been criticized for trying to shift the blame for negative consequences of those industries on to individual choices."
posted by oxisos at 11:33 AM on October 27 [21 favorites]
Also, you might want to look into Climate Changemakers, a community of advocates advancing bold climate policy through focused civic action. Just over the past two years, we've run campaigns to divest our banks from fossil fuel financing, move our money away from those banks, elect pro-climate politicians, enable composting services in our cities, get our lawmakers to pass the Inflation Reduction Act, our cities to enable more electrification, and our states to enable greater electrical transmission capacity. Notice how none of these things mention flying or any consumer choices. If you only have one hour a week, you can get this stuff done. Baby steps add up over time.
From Wikipedia:
"Critics argue that the original aim of promoting the personal carbon footprint concept was to shift responsibility away from corporations and institutions and on to personal lifestyle choices. The fossil fuel company BP ran a large advertising campaign for the personal carbon footprint in 2005 which helped popularize this concept. This strategy, employed by many major fossil fuel companies, has been criticized for trying to shift the blame for negative consequences of those industries on to individual choices."
posted by oxisos at 11:33 AM on October 27 [21 favorites]
Most of the usual serious suggestions have been offered above.
A serious, off-the-wall suggestion: learn to sail, buy a sailboat, and use wind power to get a different view of the world. One of the biggest problems with this for most people at your stage of life is often getting the time to do this, but... there are problems and challenges with every form of travel. This isn't a cheap suggestion either, but serious travel abroad adds up if you do it annually, and it's not clear from the above what your income is. There are destitute MeFites and there are truly wealthy (top ~3) MeFites, but often folks who go on long sailing trips are less wealthy than people may assume.
posted by cupcakeninja at 12:17 PM on October 27
A serious, off-the-wall suggestion: learn to sail, buy a sailboat, and use wind power to get a different view of the world. One of the biggest problems with this for most people at your stage of life is often getting the time to do this, but... there are problems and challenges with every form of travel. This isn't a cheap suggestion either, but serious travel abroad adds up if you do it annually, and it's not clear from the above what your income is. There are destitute MeFites and there are truly wealthy (top ~3) MeFites, but often folks who go on long sailing trips are less wealthy than people may assume.
posted by cupcakeninja at 12:17 PM on October 27
This is not on you. It really isn't. 15% of the population takes 70% of the flights. The top five private jet users emit 500x the C02 per year that you do.
You are not the problem. Paris is not the problem. Don't fall for climate crisis theatrics that make you the problem!
posted by DarlingBri at 12:51 PM on October 27 [13 favorites]
You are not the problem. Paris is not the problem. Don't fall for climate crisis theatrics that make you the problem!
posted by DarlingBri at 12:51 PM on October 27 [13 favorites]
But I also just want to model a sustainable lifestyle for my kid and do what I can.
The flipside of that is that you experience the world – the wider world that needs to be taken care of – because you have visited it. People who stay in their local cultures all their lives are notorious for not being able to see the bigger picture.
Your kid may end up knowing how to live sustainably, but also may end up without much motivation to do so.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 12:53 PM on October 27 [12 favorites]
The flipside of that is that you experience the world – the wider world that needs to be taken care of – because you have visited it. People who stay in their local cultures all their lives are notorious for not being able to see the bigger picture.
Your kid may end up knowing how to live sustainably, but also may end up without much motivation to do so.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 12:53 PM on October 27 [12 favorites]
Can you take that energy and redirect it to climate or community action? Instead of taking the trip to Calais can you spend a week planting trees or volunteering for Habitat for Humanity, or writing letters to politicians, or protesting, or working a plot in your community garden, or taking classes from your local extension office or college on sustainable living? Involving yourself (and your kid) to be an active and caring member of the community is the best antidote to climate anxiety I've found.
posted by Ookseer at 1:02 PM on October 27
posted by Ookseer at 1:02 PM on October 27
Response by poster: Although it would be great to up my climate activism and somehow make fossil fuel execs feel bad, my day job is combatting police misconduct and at home I have a toddler. I just...don't have it in me to go beyond my consumer choices right now in terms of my own work on this. I know the carbon footprint was a bit of misdirection by BP. Still, there are things we can and should do (diet choices being number one). I appreciate everyone's insights here because it reminds me that lots of people have thought about what they would/wouldn't be willing to give up at this point in the crisis.
posted by Sophiaverde at 1:14 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
posted by Sophiaverde at 1:14 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
This might not be very feasible because American vacation policies, but what if, instead of taking 1-week trips every year, take more extensive travel time less often? (e.g. a 5-week trip every 5 years). That way you can fly somewhere far away once and then spend a longer time visiting other places by train, bus, car, etc.
posted by btfreek at 1:26 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
posted by btfreek at 1:26 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
I seriously think you shouldn't trouble yourself; the United States military's (and Israel, UK, Russia, China etc) daily fuel expenditure - and the entire fossil fuel driven war complex is so extraordinarily profligate. While you could take one flight a year, go somewhere interesting, and learn something beautiful and new. We are being driven to have these feelings to enable this vast (and very profitable) death system.
I discovered my current career while cycling in the United States. But yes, I flew there. And the next year I flew to Europe and did the same thing. And I've done a few flights since - as a result of this, I am a better designer. I can achieve results on the land that I definitely couldn't have learned in my country. I also have a very good understanding of the United States' and Europe's role in the world. Again I could not have understood those things without traveling, and unravelling theose systems..
I don't believe in carbon credits (or in offsets of any kind at all). They are only designed to maintain business as usual, and if you look into them in any depth, they all look like fraud. So if you want to feel better (and be better) about traveling then do some things to improve where you live in your neighbourhood. Individual actions unless they are scaled through collective action will never have any sufficient effect on the hegemony.
I live basically as an anti-consumee, I don't have kids, I plant hectares of plants for a living and repair Earth. If we're already working to improve society, and or Earth, our impact from an occasional flight is not something we should trouble ourselves with.
posted by unearthed at 1:37 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
I discovered my current career while cycling in the United States. But yes, I flew there. And the next year I flew to Europe and did the same thing. And I've done a few flights since - as a result of this, I am a better designer. I can achieve results on the land that I definitely couldn't have learned in my country. I also have a very good understanding of the United States' and Europe's role in the world. Again I could not have understood those things without traveling, and unravelling theose systems..
I don't believe in carbon credits (or in offsets of any kind at all). They are only designed to maintain business as usual, and if you look into them in any depth, they all look like fraud. So if you want to feel better (and be better) about traveling then do some things to improve where you live in your neighbourhood. Individual actions unless they are scaled through collective action will never have any sufficient effect on the hegemony.
I live basically as an anti-consumee, I don't have kids, I plant hectares of plants for a living and repair Earth. If we're already working to improve society, and or Earth, our impact from an occasional flight is not something we should trouble ourselves with.
posted by unearthed at 1:37 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
Your abstaining from flight cannot fix oh, celebrities flying everywhere.
posted by jenfullmoon at 1:59 PM on October 27
posted by jenfullmoon at 1:59 PM on October 27
One of the things that stays with me from a trip abroad, many many years ago, is how little differences can be so much better. I once tried to explain this to my conservative evangelical relations, and they didn't believe me that anyone lived any differently. So perhaps you can view this as the chance to show your child the many rich and varied ways other people live, from how they buy food to how they travel to how they interact with their environments. Languages! What if every trip was an opportunity to learn without the blinkers of a travel editor deciding what's "nice" and what's not? Immerse yourself in some other place, enrich them with your travel dollars (you will do your homework of finding responsible places to see and stay) and give your kid that precious sense of being a citizen of the earth, not just 123 Blank street, city, etc.
posted by winesong at 2:11 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
posted by winesong at 2:11 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
How old is your kid? If kiddo is very young wait until they're older and can really appreciate it. And do explore your own country in depth. I lived in or traveled to several countries as a child and really didn't start appreciating it until I was 8 or so.
posted by mareli at 3:13 PM on October 27 [1 favorite]
posted by mareli at 3:13 PM on October 27 [1 favorite]
I'm going to try and answer this from the perspective of someone who basically does not like travel, in case that is useful.
Think about the element of travel that is, above all else, a form of endless desire and acquisition. The travel ethos of a lot of people in the 21st century is "I have to see as many places as possible before I die." (I'm not exaggerating. I have had people say basically this sentence to me.) Well, you don't. It's possible to enjoy things without enjoying all of them.
I said I don't like travel and what I mean is I go somewhere once in a while, kind of hate the practical part of it, have a great and interesting time being out of my element and seeing people in other places, then get home and am glad to be home. Keeping travel as unusual thing in my life didn't come from any plan or any sense of environmental responsibility, but it makes it special instead of a checklist.
Because, the carbon part aside, the way people travel now does ruin things. Places become A Thing and soon all the housing is airbnbs and you end up with the situation in Barcelona where the locals seethingly resent tourists for taking over their town. Forty or fifty years ago, travel was less of a hotdog-eating-contest situation and people would go on one big trip once in a while and looked back on it fondly. They did not miss out on life by not going to all the places.
I have not gone as many places as most people and it doesn't haunt me because I've took a few really unique trips (I went to the Soviet Union in the last weeks of it being the Soviet Union. Not everyone does this. The memories are vivid and interesting. I have never been back.) And because there's interesting stuff to be done at home, a full life to be lived without going everywhere. I attest this. Does this help at all?
posted by less-of-course at 3:26 PM on October 27 [7 favorites]
Think about the element of travel that is, above all else, a form of endless desire and acquisition. The travel ethos of a lot of people in the 21st century is "I have to see as many places as possible before I die." (I'm not exaggerating. I have had people say basically this sentence to me.) Well, you don't. It's possible to enjoy things without enjoying all of them.
I said I don't like travel and what I mean is I go somewhere once in a while, kind of hate the practical part of it, have a great and interesting time being out of my element and seeing people in other places, then get home and am glad to be home. Keeping travel as unusual thing in my life didn't come from any plan or any sense of environmental responsibility, but it makes it special instead of a checklist.
Because, the carbon part aside, the way people travel now does ruin things. Places become A Thing and soon all the housing is airbnbs and you end up with the situation in Barcelona where the locals seethingly resent tourists for taking over their town. Forty or fifty years ago, travel was less of a hotdog-eating-contest situation and people would go on one big trip once in a while and looked back on it fondly. They did not miss out on life by not going to all the places.
I have not gone as many places as most people and it doesn't haunt me because I've took a few really unique trips (I went to the Soviet Union in the last weeks of it being the Soviet Union. Not everyone does this. The memories are vivid and interesting. I have never been back.) And because there's interesting stuff to be done at home, a full life to be lived without going everywhere. I attest this. Does this help at all?
posted by less-of-course at 3:26 PM on October 27 [7 favorites]
Since you want to know how others have dealt with this - for both climate and family caregiving reasons, I’ve decided my air travel days are just about over other than for family emergency or required work stuff. There are enough places I can get to by train and have a great time at, that I don’t feel upset about that decision.
But even I don’t think it would be a huge deal, given the other choices you make and the limited scope of what individual choices can do, for you to allow yourself *some* air travel. Perhaps you do most travel domestically, plan a big trip abroad every few years, do your best to be thoughtful about how you plan that trip and avoid places where the locals are begging the tourists to stop fucking up their environment, and raise your child to love and feel connected to the whole world and not just their corner of it. I think that would be a perfectly reasonable set of choices consistent with the values you’ve laid out here.
posted by Stacey at 3:53 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
But even I don’t think it would be a huge deal, given the other choices you make and the limited scope of what individual choices can do, for you to allow yourself *some* air travel. Perhaps you do most travel domestically, plan a big trip abroad every few years, do your best to be thoughtful about how you plan that trip and avoid places where the locals are begging the tourists to stop fucking up their environment, and raise your child to love and feel connected to the whole world and not just their corner of it. I think that would be a perfectly reasonable set of choices consistent with the values you’ve laid out here.
posted by Stacey at 3:53 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
The flipside of that is that you experience the world – the wider world that needs to be taken care of – because you have visited it. People who stay in their local cultures all their lives are notorious for not being able to see the bigger picture.
Right. Travel is not just a time for unparalleled hedonism (I mean, it can be...). "Broadening your horizons" is an old-fashioned phrase, perhaps, but it reflects a real value. I would not want to raise kids without teaching them to be interested in the world beyond our country, as it actually is, not as social media shows it to us, or as we imagine it.
posted by praemunire at 4:10 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
Right. Travel is not just a time for unparalleled hedonism (I mean, it can be...). "Broadening your horizons" is an old-fashioned phrase, perhaps, but it reflects a real value. I would not want to raise kids without teaching them to be interested in the world beyond our country, as it actually is, not as social media shows it to us, or as we imagine it.
posted by praemunire at 4:10 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
But all of that seems nearly irrelevant if I fly abroad once a year and use all that carbon.
For now maybe think about flying once every two years?
If your job makes this possible, maybe you could save up more vacation days over the course of two years and use them to take a longer trip with one round-trip flight and any internal distances covered by train or other public transportation.
Maybe you could also "save up" for the carbon footprint by buying less and so on. This would help with raw numbers, but probably not help with the anxiety (and possibly exacerbate it, depending on your personality).
posted by trig at 9:24 PM on October 27 [1 favorite]
For now maybe think about flying once every two years?
If your job makes this possible, maybe you could save up more vacation days over the course of two years and use them to take a longer trip with one round-trip flight and any internal distances covered by train or other public transportation.
Maybe you could also "save up" for the carbon footprint by buying less and so on. This would help with raw numbers, but probably not help with the anxiety (and possibly exacerbate it, depending on your personality).
posted by trig at 9:24 PM on October 27 [1 favorite]
To reflect back with love and respect: you seem to be shooting down the suggestions you're getting here.
I get it. Climate change is a catastrophe and horrific. In a sense, nothing can mitigate how that feels. But it may be that if you are seeking to adjust your response to the reality we live in, you may need to try taking an approach that initially feels impossible or wrong.
posted by latkes at 9:51 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
I get it. Climate change is a catastrophe and horrific. In a sense, nothing can mitigate how that feels. But it may be that if you are seeking to adjust your response to the reality we live in, you may need to try taking an approach that initially feels impossible or wrong.
posted by latkes at 9:51 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
Is there any way you and your partner could find a way to set up your lives/negotiate at work so that you could take one big holiday every 4 years or so where you fly somewhere but then more travel, and a bunch of overland travel, when you are there?
posted by hotcoroner at 1:43 AM on October 28
posted by hotcoroner at 1:43 AM on October 28
Perhaps a slightly different perspective on this. Protecting the world from human destruction has many different aspects. I have been fortunate to go to e.g. South Africa and spend time in game reserves, watching animals obv. not hunting them. We had a long conversation with one of the rangers about preservation and wondering if we were doing more harm than good by visiting. He was quite adamant that without foreign visitors spending money in country, there would be no money and much more limited incentive for preservation in country.
Tourist dollars are a significant income stream in many countries and where the main attractions are e.g. the local wildlife that is an incentive for governments to enact policies and regulations that support wildlife preservation. It also means there are funds to enforce these policies and jobs for local people in both preservation and hospitality.
So foreign interest and visitors allows them to both shine a spotlight on endangered species and habitats to bring pressure to bear on the government but also provide the resources it takes to e.g. combat poaching or destructive industrial practices.
Re your child learning about the world I got to watch a lot of wildlife documentaries growing up but seeing a leopard a few feet from you in its natural habitat is very different from seeing it on TV in a wildlife documentary.
posted by koahiatamadl at 1:50 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
Tourist dollars are a significant income stream in many countries and where the main attractions are e.g. the local wildlife that is an incentive for governments to enact policies and regulations that support wildlife preservation. It also means there are funds to enforce these policies and jobs for local people in both preservation and hospitality.
So foreign interest and visitors allows them to both shine a spotlight on endangered species and habitats to bring pressure to bear on the government but also provide the resources it takes to e.g. combat poaching or destructive industrial practices.
Re your child learning about the world I got to watch a lot of wildlife documentaries growing up but seeing a leopard a few feet from you in its natural habitat is very different from seeing it on TV in a wildlife documentary.
posted by koahiatamadl at 1:50 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
I want to draw more attention to a point oxisos made above: the concept of a personal carbon footprint was invented by BP. It wasn't created by BP to help people do whatever little bit they can to live more sustainably -- it was created by BP so that they can continue making money by destroying the environment.
If you're looking for a creative way to think about this, maybe a new angle is that BP wants you to feel bad. You feeling bad about taking a flight to go on holiday is what BP has spent millions of advertising dollars on. So, why the heck would you do something that BP wants you to do?
Just the very fact that they want you to be thinking this way is reason enough for me to think that not only is this therefore not the way out of the climate crisis, but also probably more helpful to the goals of BP than to sustainability goals -- but the article I linked to goes into more detail.
posted by Pwoink at 2:17 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
If you're looking for a creative way to think about this, maybe a new angle is that BP wants you to feel bad. You feeling bad about taking a flight to go on holiday is what BP has spent millions of advertising dollars on. So, why the heck would you do something that BP wants you to do?
Just the very fact that they want you to be thinking this way is reason enough for me to think that not only is this therefore not the way out of the climate crisis, but also probably more helpful to the goals of BP than to sustainability goals -- but the article I linked to goes into more detail.
posted by Pwoink at 2:17 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
Sorry, I just want to clarify that when I said "The top five private jet users emit 500x the C02 per year that you do" I meant each. Taylor Swift emits 500x the C02 every year that you do. You can be conscious about your choices, yes, but your choices will make zero difference to climate crisis. And the plane is literally going whether you're on it or not.
posted by DarlingBri at 7:59 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
posted by DarlingBri at 7:59 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
I relate to this a lot. Here's my thinking (as someone with older kids, so I'm not trying to travel with a little one): I prioritize local trips and trips by train and ferry. I try to find fun trips like this and plan around that.
In the bigger picture, is it possible to plan a longer trip every few years? Can you ever go overseas for, say, three months? Six months? A year? That can be a very different cultural experience anyway, and maybe richer than going for a short visit once a year.
posted by bluedaisy at 11:53 AM on October 29
In the bigger picture, is it possible to plan a longer trip every few years? Can you ever go overseas for, say, three months? Six months? A year? That can be a very different cultural experience anyway, and maybe richer than going for a short visit once a year.
posted by bluedaisy at 11:53 AM on October 29
seeing a leopard a few feet from you in its natural habitat is very different from seeing it on TV in a wildlife documentary.
Oh god yes. Among other things, being in a place where I was not the top of the food chain sparked something very primal and visceral in me. I learned more about my relationship to nature during a three mile walk than I did in years of watching documentaries.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 7:36 AM on October 30 [1 favorite]
Oh god yes. Among other things, being in a place where I was not the top of the food chain sparked something very primal and visceral in me. I learned more about my relationship to nature during a three mile walk than I did in years of watching documentaries.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 7:36 AM on October 30 [1 favorite]
I also decided to give up air travel due to climate concerns (have only flown once since the pandemic, by necessity). For me - its was a matter of recognizing an action as harmful and not wanting to do it anymore as a result (whether or not that will "solve" anything).
Some thought for you that have been helpful for me:
- Closing one door can open up others. Over the past few years I've traveled WAY more in my surrounding area and states - visiting friends who live a few states away from me more often, or making plans for longer road trips than I might usually consider. Travel is less about WHERE you go than how you approach it. There is so much to see and do nearby and relationships to build which you might never get by traveling abroad. The travel I have done feels a lot DEEPER because my intentions around it have changed.
- A decision does not need to be forever. What works for you / feels right for you now might not necessarily work later, and that's totally fine. You also do not need to be perfect - leaving room for exceptions is part of being human. I am vegan/vegetarian - but I've also made an exception that I can eat meat if I am drunk/at a party. I recognize that allowing myself to be imperfect helps allow me to act according to my values better for the long run. The same can apply for travel.
- I wouldn't worry about "getting over" a specific point you are at in relationship to climate change / climate grief. Your mind/body is processing some incredibly heavy stuff - it is ok to accept where you are feeling at the moment and fully commit to processing that in the way that feels right. Sometimes that might mean taking collective action, sometimes that might be taking individual action, sometimes that might be grieving, or being in nature, or in community.
- I very much recommend finding people in your life who are processing the same things you are, and talking about your feelings with them. That could look like joining a group doing collective action, bringing up the topic with close friends or family who might be feeling similarly, or finding a community online.
Finally a book recommendation, written by the founder of the Good Grief Network:
https://www.goodgriefnetwork.org/book/
Hope some of these thoughts are helpful to you!
posted by grimace636 at 7:21 AM on November 3 [1 favorite]
Some thought for you that have been helpful for me:
- Closing one door can open up others. Over the past few years I've traveled WAY more in my surrounding area and states - visiting friends who live a few states away from me more often, or making plans for longer road trips than I might usually consider. Travel is less about WHERE you go than how you approach it. There is so much to see and do nearby and relationships to build which you might never get by traveling abroad. The travel I have done feels a lot DEEPER because my intentions around it have changed.
- A decision does not need to be forever. What works for you / feels right for you now might not necessarily work later, and that's totally fine. You also do not need to be perfect - leaving room for exceptions is part of being human. I am vegan/vegetarian - but I've also made an exception that I can eat meat if I am drunk/at a party. I recognize that allowing myself to be imperfect helps allow me to act according to my values better for the long run. The same can apply for travel.
- I wouldn't worry about "getting over" a specific point you are at in relationship to climate change / climate grief. Your mind/body is processing some incredibly heavy stuff - it is ok to accept where you are feeling at the moment and fully commit to processing that in the way that feels right. Sometimes that might mean taking collective action, sometimes that might be taking individual action, sometimes that might be grieving, or being in nature, or in community.
- I very much recommend finding people in your life who are processing the same things you are, and talking about your feelings with them. That could look like joining a group doing collective action, bringing up the topic with close friends or family who might be feeling similarly, or finding a community online.
Finally a book recommendation, written by the founder of the Good Grief Network:
https://www.goodgriefnetwork.org/book/
Hope some of these thoughts are helpful to you!
posted by grimace636 at 7:21 AM on November 3 [1 favorite]
One additional point -
- Taking amtrak especially has forced me to SLOW DOWN my travel - which has been transformative in itself. Rather than flying to California for a week to visit family, the fact it takes me 3 days to get there has led to me staying for longer periods of time, using a whole month to visit multiple people across the whole state - something I would have never done if I had flown.
posted by grimace636 at 7:29 AM on November 3 [1 favorite]
- Taking amtrak especially has forced me to SLOW DOWN my travel - which has been transformative in itself. Rather than flying to California for a week to visit family, the fact it takes me 3 days to get there has led to me staying for longer periods of time, using a whole month to visit multiple people across the whole state - something I would have never done if I had flown.
posted by grimace636 at 7:29 AM on November 3 [1 favorite]
How have you dealt with this?
with armchair travel i've explored the entire world & significantly increased my enjoyment of any travels i actually do; hospitality helps me see the world via different perspectives, also art
posted by HearHere at 12:57 AM on November 8
with armchair travel i've explored the entire world & significantly increased my enjoyment of any travels i actually do; hospitality helps me see the world via different perspectives, also art
posted by HearHere at 12:57 AM on November 8
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Some options for you:
1) Explore the country you reside in via train, bus, short flight, or short motor vehicle trip. I assume you're in the US or Canada and there's a ton to explore in both of those countries. You can't really exhaust your options.
2) Watch videos of places you'd like to have visited. I'm doing this for a lot of countries in SE Asia that I'm unlikely ever to visit. Warning: this can bring on fits of travel planning :-)
3) Travel as a volunteer, Habitat for Humanity or the like. Warning: the nonprofit sector often enables exploitation of the places and people they allegedly help. Do your homework.
posted by rabia.elizabeth at 8:21 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]