My Job Search Went Nuts
September 11, 2023 4:10 AM
There is a very VERY strong possibility I will soon get a job offer from the place I've been temping at; however, 2 days ago I had a very promising interview somewhere that would be WAY better. How long can I "think about" the offer for the first job, to give the second job a chance to see what pans out?
I've been actively looking for work since mid-July, when I got laid off. I immediately went out on the hunt - and found Deck Job that same night; something with the same pay in a similar location. It didn't have employer-sponsored health insurance, which gave me pause (they are a VERY small company), but they said they'd consider some other way to assist. However - the DAY AFTER I interviewed the company restructured and eliminated that position. But my boss at Deck Job advocated for bringing me in on a contract basis, part time, for a couple months; he confided in me that he hoped the owners would see me in action and be impressed. And, I could continue to job hunt.
I have been there all through August, and continued to search; nothing else panned out in August for the job hunt, with a lot of applications sent into space and a couple of first-round interviews that went nowhere. Meanwhile I was staying at Deck Job.
Then - things really started heating up all over.
* last Thursday I had a long talk with the Deck Job VP's wife (she's started doing some bookkeeping). which was effectively a second interview. She asked me what kind of office-manager-type stuff I could do, since she's been gunning to get someone in there to do that. We discussed salary even; I told her that if I could get what I was getting at my last job, and with health insurance, I'd be happy as a clam. About an hour after that talk, my boss and the owners went into a closed-door meeting to talk about a whole lot of stuff. My boss later confided that the owners are likely figuring out what kind of an offer they can give me; he said it would very likely be the salary I was making at my last job, BUT using a pretax portion of that to offset health insurance. There has been no further word about that.
* But then Friday I had an extremely promising first-round interview with a different company - and that job would be WORLDS BETTER. It would be a 20K increase on my last job, the schedule would be right, it's a PLUM of a benefits package, and I could work it great. I asked a lot of good questions and the interviewer seemed impressed. She told me that there would be two further rounds to get through, and I would know sometime this morning about whether I make it to round 2.
So - at some point this week, possibly today, I could be getting a job offer from Deck Job, with Prime Job's interview process waiting in the wings.
HOW IN THE HELL DO I NAVIGATE THAT.
The Prime Job's interview process is going to take time, no matter what. I will hear whether I make it to round 2 today, but I don't know when round 2 or round 3 of the interview process would be; meanwhile there is only so long I can stall Deck Job if they make me an offer. It's also entirely possible that Deck Job could take several days to get their shit together, which would buy me time seeing what's happening with Prime Job. And, it is of course possible Prime Job could say "thanks but no thanks".
I'm just freaking out about what the hell do I say if I walk into Deck Job this morning and they're standing there with a job offer, meanwhile Prime Job has yet to get back to me about interview 2. Or if in a week Deck Job is still all "so, have you thought about it?" and I'm still waiting to hear about interview 3 at prime job and whether I've gotten that round.
Every turn in this job search has been a left this time around. Help.
I've been actively looking for work since mid-July, when I got laid off. I immediately went out on the hunt - and found Deck Job that same night; something with the same pay in a similar location. It didn't have employer-sponsored health insurance, which gave me pause (they are a VERY small company), but they said they'd consider some other way to assist. However - the DAY AFTER I interviewed the company restructured and eliminated that position. But my boss at Deck Job advocated for bringing me in on a contract basis, part time, for a couple months; he confided in me that he hoped the owners would see me in action and be impressed. And, I could continue to job hunt.
I have been there all through August, and continued to search; nothing else panned out in August for the job hunt, with a lot of applications sent into space and a couple of first-round interviews that went nowhere. Meanwhile I was staying at Deck Job.
Then - things really started heating up all over.
* last Thursday I had a long talk with the Deck Job VP's wife (she's started doing some bookkeeping). which was effectively a second interview. She asked me what kind of office-manager-type stuff I could do, since she's been gunning to get someone in there to do that. We discussed salary even; I told her that if I could get what I was getting at my last job, and with health insurance, I'd be happy as a clam. About an hour after that talk, my boss and the owners went into a closed-door meeting to talk about a whole lot of stuff. My boss later confided that the owners are likely figuring out what kind of an offer they can give me; he said it would very likely be the salary I was making at my last job, BUT using a pretax portion of that to offset health insurance. There has been no further word about that.
* But then Friday I had an extremely promising first-round interview with a different company - and that job would be WORLDS BETTER. It would be a 20K increase on my last job, the schedule would be right, it's a PLUM of a benefits package, and I could work it great. I asked a lot of good questions and the interviewer seemed impressed. She told me that there would be two further rounds to get through, and I would know sometime this morning about whether I make it to round 2.
So - at some point this week, possibly today, I could be getting a job offer from Deck Job, with Prime Job's interview process waiting in the wings.
HOW IN THE HELL DO I NAVIGATE THAT.
The Prime Job's interview process is going to take time, no matter what. I will hear whether I make it to round 2 today, but I don't know when round 2 or round 3 of the interview process would be; meanwhile there is only so long I can stall Deck Job if they make me an offer. It's also entirely possible that Deck Job could take several days to get their shit together, which would buy me time seeing what's happening with Prime Job. And, it is of course possible Prime Job could say "thanks but no thanks".
I'm just freaking out about what the hell do I say if I walk into Deck Job this morning and they're standing there with a job offer, meanwhile Prime Job has yet to get back to me about interview 2. Or if in a week Deck Job is still all "so, have you thought about it?" and I'm still waiting to hear about interview 3 at prime job and whether I've gotten that round.
Every turn in this job search has been a left this time around. Help.
Accept the offer from Deck Job and then quit if you get Prime Job. If you end up having to quit you can say, "I feel bad about this because you worked so hard to get me (blah blah blah) but of course I was job searching while I was waiting for your decision and I ended up with this dream offer that I can't turn down."
A burnt bridge here doesn't seem like it's going to be an issue for you. You've been at Deck Job less than two months, so you can very easily just leave this off your resume. Unless the people at Deck Job are wildly vindictive or incredibly well-connected, you can afford to upset them a little.
You don't even have the third interview lined up yet with Prime Job - it could take a month or longer to get to the offer stage. It would be super-weird to ask Deck Job for a month to think about an offer you've already discussed extensively (and you'd be missing out on a month of full-time work!).
posted by mskyle at 4:51 AM on September 11, 2023
A burnt bridge here doesn't seem like it's going to be an issue for you. You've been at Deck Job less than two months, so you can very easily just leave this off your resume. Unless the people at Deck Job are wildly vindictive or incredibly well-connected, you can afford to upset them a little.
You don't even have the third interview lined up yet with Prime Job - it could take a month or longer to get to the offer stage. It would be super-weird to ask Deck Job for a month to think about an offer you've already discussed extensively (and you'd be missing out on a month of full-time work!).
posted by mskyle at 4:51 AM on September 11, 2023
Yes to mskyle. You assuage your guilt by documenting everything and leaving the next person a great manual, and maybe offer to give feedback on resumes for their next hire.
posted by warriorqueen at 5:01 AM on September 11, 2023
posted by warriorqueen at 5:01 AM on September 11, 2023
I realized something that may work to my advantage....
The deal we made with the contract work was that Deck Job would be flexible if I had to step out for job-search activity. I will be hearing about whether Prime Job wants me for round 2 of interviews today - and when I get that news I will IMMEDIATELY tell Deck Job Boss that "hey, I just got a very promising interview somewhere, can I step out for 40 minutes on Wednesday to do a video call for that?"
I have the feeling that I would be beating them to the punch with that news, because at present things are in the "EC is just a contractor and is job hunting elsewhere" status quo stage, nothing to see here tralala.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 5:19 AM on September 11, 2023
The deal we made with the contract work was that Deck Job would be flexible if I had to step out for job-search activity. I will be hearing about whether Prime Job wants me for round 2 of interviews today - and when I get that news I will IMMEDIATELY tell Deck Job Boss that "hey, I just got a very promising interview somewhere, can I step out for 40 minutes on Wednesday to do a video call for that?"
I have the feeling that I would be beating them to the punch with that news, because at present things are in the "EC is just a contractor and is job hunting elsewhere" status quo stage, nothing to see here tralala.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 5:19 AM on September 11, 2023
One other advantage of taking mskyle's advice is that if an offer from Prime Job does come through, it may prompt Deck to make an even better counter offer, that happens more often than you would believe.
posted by Lanark at 5:25 AM on September 11, 2023
posted by Lanark at 5:25 AM on September 11, 2023
The deal we made with the contract work was that Deck Job would be flexible if I had to step out for job-search activity. I will be hearing about whether Prime Job wants me for round 2 of interviews today - and when I get that news I will IMMEDIATELY tell Deck Job Boss that "hey, I just got a very promising interview somewhere, can I step out for 40 minutes on Wednesday to do a video call for that?"
Yes but it sounds like the tenor of your job discussions have changed. You discussed salary, benefits, and the wife wanting what you would do in an expanded role - so the risk of being that transparent is they ask “so you aren’t that interested if we offer you what you asked for that you said would make you happy as a clam?” The answer there may lead them to think their offer is pointless and to just not make one.
If you get to round 2, I would ask for time for an appointment for the 2nd and then 3rd interview. I would accept the offer if it comes from your existing employer in the interim. And then if you get the other offer present things to your current employer. Being too transparent after only one of three interviews risks undermining their increased interest in having you around for what is very much not a sure thing second process.
posted by openhearted at 5:44 AM on September 11, 2023
Yes but it sounds like the tenor of your job discussions have changed. You discussed salary, benefits, and the wife wanting what you would do in an expanded role - so the risk of being that transparent is they ask “so you aren’t that interested if we offer you what you asked for that you said would make you happy as a clam?” The answer there may lead them to think their offer is pointless and to just not make one.
If you get to round 2, I would ask for time for an appointment for the 2nd and then 3rd interview. I would accept the offer if it comes from your existing employer in the interim. And then if you get the other offer present things to your current employer. Being too transparent after only one of three interviews risks undermining their increased interest in having you around for what is very much not a sure thing second process.
posted by openhearted at 5:44 AM on September 11, 2023
At this point I'd play your cards a bit close to your chest. The current job doesn't need to know about the interviews, and they don't know that if you say yes to an offer, you might bail in a month or two if the better offer comes through.
Waiting sucks, but right now you are holding all the cards. You have an ok part-time gig, you have the potential of that part-time gig turning into something better, and you have had a positive first round interview at another place. Your best plan is just to be patient, accept an offer from the current place if it is good, and keep looking for something more perfect.
You are clearly good at what you do, since the current place would like to keep you and the second place is at least preliminarily interested. So even if you accept the offer from the current place, and if the second offer doesn't happen, you know you are good enough to go out and get other offers if you want. You aren't just needing to settle for whatever comes first.
Personally I've had bad experience both times I worked at a small, owner-operated place, with lots of promises made that went unfilled. But if the people are good, then I am sure it will be a great place to work.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:20 AM on September 11, 2023
Waiting sucks, but right now you are holding all the cards. You have an ok part-time gig, you have the potential of that part-time gig turning into something better, and you have had a positive first round interview at another place. Your best plan is just to be patient, accept an offer from the current place if it is good, and keep looking for something more perfect.
You are clearly good at what you do, since the current place would like to keep you and the second place is at least preliminarily interested. So even if you accept the offer from the current place, and if the second offer doesn't happen, you know you are good enough to go out and get other offers if you want. You aren't just needing to settle for whatever comes first.
Personally I've had bad experience both times I worked at a small, owner-operated place, with lots of promises made that went unfilled. But if the people are good, then I am sure it will be a great place to work.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:20 AM on September 11, 2023
I missed the edit window. This should be: The current job doesn't need to know about the interviews, and they don't need to know that if you say yes to an offer...
posted by Dip Flash at 6:42 AM on September 11, 2023
posted by Dip Flash at 6:42 AM on September 11, 2023
Do the best you can at Deck Job, telling them nothing, and if you decide to leave for Prime Job give them decent notice, and at the end of it all, you treated them well, they will have got a bunch of great work out of you and there should be no hard feelings, because shit happens.
posted by seanmpuckett at 6:45 AM on September 11, 2023
posted by seanmpuckett at 6:45 AM on September 11, 2023
I agree with everyone telling you to stop involving Deck Job with your job hunt info. Try to get the best deal you can out of them, and simultaneously keep going with that second possible job...and then keep going if that one falls through. The folks at Deck Job do not need to be involved in the details! You've already been clear that you want salary + benefits, and that's all they need to know. If you end up having to leave next week or next month or next year, you'll just have to say "This new thing fell in my lap" and walk away.
posted by BlahLaLa at 7:27 AM on September 11, 2023
posted by BlahLaLa at 7:27 AM on September 11, 2023
don't tell Deck Job about the other interview. People get very butthurt when they know their employees are interviewing elsewhere, regardless of how irrational that is. Right now they're feeling like they're trying to do something "for you" and they will resent it if you tell them about your other process.
Just quietly do what you need to do - don't lie, but don't bring it up - and yes, quit when/if you get that other offer. Offer processes can take a very long time. (And if they don't? Then your tenure at Deck Job will be even shorter and easier to leave. Win either way.)
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:37 AM on September 11, 2023
Just quietly do what you need to do - don't lie, but don't bring it up - and yes, quit when/if you get that other offer. Offer processes can take a very long time. (And if they don't? Then your tenure at Deck Job will be even shorter and easier to leave. Win either way.)
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:37 AM on September 11, 2023
It might help to remember that Deck Job is not doing you a favor by meeting your salary requirements or figuring out how to get you health insurance. They need a job done and are calculating the minimum amount it will cost them to get it done.
They might be nice people but, in the end, it is a business arrangement. Just like your last job, if Deck Job suddenly didn't need the work done or didn't have the budget, they would let you go.
posted by mcduff at 7:52 AM on September 11, 2023
They might be nice people but, in the end, it is a business arrangement. Just like your last job, if Deck Job suddenly didn't need the work done or didn't have the budget, they would let you go.
posted by mcduff at 7:52 AM on September 11, 2023
Start working with Prime Job and let them know that you are expecting a job offer. See if they can accelerate their process. Notify Prime Job again once an offer is on the table. Sometimes employers can accelerate their processes for desirable candidates at risk of going elsewhere.
One week is a pretty standard amount of time to think over an offer. The first offer must be countered anyway and that needs time to shake out.
I agree with the advice to take Deck Job and quit. It’s a better outcome though if you can bring this job dichotomy to a conclusion before it gets to that.
posted by shock muppet at 7:52 AM on September 11, 2023
One week is a pretty standard amount of time to think over an offer. The first offer must be countered anyway and that needs time to shake out.
I agree with the advice to take Deck Job and quit. It’s a better outcome though if you can bring this job dichotomy to a conclusion before it gets to that.
posted by shock muppet at 7:52 AM on September 11, 2023
I agree you should keep your cards close to the vest. If you get Plum Job, take it! Flatter Deck Job when you leave about how great they were, how they contributed to your professional growth, etc.
This is great! Keep us posted!
posted by jgirl at 7:54 AM on September 11, 2023
This is great! Keep us posted!
posted by jgirl at 7:54 AM on September 11, 2023
I'm sure you were extremely relieved to find work so fast after being laid off, but Deck Job has actually been treating you cavalierly! Don't worry about their feelings and don't treat them as a partner in your quest for long-term work!
posted by praemunire at 8:44 AM on September 11, 2023
posted by praemunire at 8:44 AM on September 11, 2023
Agreed with almost all - keep it quiet!
One thing I didn't notice anyone say: don't count on this prime job before you have an offer. You had one promising first interview but that can mean far less than you think.
I'm sure you are qualified and amazing!... but you don't know anything about the rest of Prime Job's interview process. Maybe they have an internal candidate already and are going through the motions. Maybe they loved you but really loved another candidate even more. Maybe they won't hire anyone for the job b/c something is messed up behind the scenes. From personal experience, I think I did about a half dozen second interviews during the job search that landed me my current job... but I didn't get a half dozen job offers.
Follow the advice above: take any job offer that improves your position. If another one comes later, give your notice and take that one. Don't damage your opportunities by sharing too much info.
posted by RajahKing at 9:00 AM on September 11, 2023
One thing I didn't notice anyone say: don't count on this prime job before you have an offer. You had one promising first interview but that can mean far less than you think.
I'm sure you are qualified and amazing!... but you don't know anything about the rest of Prime Job's interview process. Maybe they have an internal candidate already and are going through the motions. Maybe they loved you but really loved another candidate even more. Maybe they won't hire anyone for the job b/c something is messed up behind the scenes. From personal experience, I think I did about a half dozen second interviews during the job search that landed me my current job... but I didn't get a half dozen job offers.
Follow the advice above: take any job offer that improves your position. If another one comes later, give your notice and take that one. Don't damage your opportunities by sharing too much info.
posted by RajahKing at 9:00 AM on September 11, 2023
and when I get that news I will IMMEDIATELY tell Deck Job Boss that "hey, I just got a very promising interview somewhere, can I step out for 40 minutes on Wednesday to do a video call for that?"
No, please don't do it. Do not actively advertise that you are job-searching. You'd be effectively telling them "nevermind about that job offer you were considering for me".
posted by M. at 9:34 AM on September 11, 2023
No, please don't do it. Do not actively advertise that you are job-searching. You'd be effectively telling them "nevermind about that job offer you were considering for me".
posted by M. at 9:34 AM on September 11, 2023
I wouldn’t rely on Deck Job for anything. The owners don’t have a firm idea of what they need or want, and they are trying to do things for cheap. (I’m not saying they are terrible business people, just … don’t rely on them.) I vote for “don’t tell them about Prime Job opportunity.”
posted by stowaway at 9:56 AM on September 11, 2023
posted by stowaway at 9:56 AM on September 11, 2023
It's 1 pm and I haven't heard anything either way from EITHER job yet. I'm supposed to hear from Prime Job today, either way - either I make it to round 2 or I don't, but either way I should know today, and tomorrow is my day off Deck Job anyway.
I've got a call scheduled with a high school friend who went into HR and he said he's going to help me strategize a bit (plus we're gonna shoot the breeze a little too). But so far he agrees with all of you 100%, and he also says y'all are smart.
But so far today I think this may not be an issue I need to worry about, and I have time to arm myself.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:58 AM on September 11, 2023
I've got a call scheduled with a high school friend who went into HR and he said he's going to help me strategize a bit (plus we're gonna shoot the breeze a little too). But so far he agrees with all of you 100%, and he also says y'all are smart.
But so far today I think this may not be an issue I need to worry about, and I have time to arm myself.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:58 AM on September 11, 2023
Deck Job doesn't appear to be meeting your requirements. You had a job where you got X and paid your own health insurance. You said you would be happy with your previous salary. You'll be getting your previous salary, minus a (likely big) cut for health insurance, and you'll also be doing more work. That's not what you asked for. Just keep an eye on what you're actually receiving as a part of the Deck Job deal.
In general it's considered bad practice to use your previous salary as a metric, and I can confirm it's caused me problems in the past. The question is what are you worth to them, and what are you worth on the open market / what would they pay to find someone else on the open market, not what you were previously paid.
I believe Ask A Manager will have more on negotiations in general, but you might want to think about that before talking salary with Prime Job. Also, if you are in a state where they're required to disclose salary ranges for jobs, know your rights.
posted by How much is that froggie in the window at 10:06 AM on September 11, 2023
In general it's considered bad practice to use your previous salary as a metric, and I can confirm it's caused me problems in the past. The question is what are you worth to them, and what are you worth on the open market / what would they pay to find someone else on the open market, not what you were previously paid.
I believe Ask A Manager will have more on negotiations in general, but you might want to think about that before talking salary with Prime Job. Also, if you are in a state where they're required to disclose salary ranges for jobs, know your rights.
posted by How much is that froggie in the window at 10:06 AM on September 11, 2023
You take the job and someone else suddenly offers you $20k more, so you take that one. If you explain the scenario to Deck Job with care on your way out the door, they will understand there's no way you could have been happy at Deck Job permanently, knowing you'd turned down a dramatic improvement to your quality of life. They will get it, and they will know there was no other way forward.
posted by kensington314 at 10:12 AM on September 11, 2023
posted by kensington314 at 10:12 AM on September 11, 2023
Don’t tell your current job until you literally have signed papers and have a start date for the second job. DO NOT. That’s how you end up with zero job. If you need to step away, you had a family emergency. These people have shown themselves to be wishy-washy in their treatment and consideration of you, don’t give them an excuse.
posted by Bottlecap at 10:36 AM on September 11, 2023
posted by Bottlecap at 10:36 AM on September 11, 2023
Just heard back from Prime job - they said no. I'm out of the running.
I guess that answers that. I will instead focus on practicing how to negotiate a TIIIIIIIIIIINY bit more salary wise from Deck Job if and when the offer comes up.
Thanks, all.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:32 AM on September 11, 2023
I guess that answers that. I will instead focus on practicing how to negotiate a TIIIIIIIIIIINY bit more salary wise from Deck Job if and when the offer comes up.
Thanks, all.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:32 AM on September 11, 2023
sorry, OP. Happens all the time, just so you know. First round interviewers are usually HR folks or recruiters, who have to be positive and be in "selling the job" mode with all interviewees, so having a pleasant and positive first interview rarely means much. (TBH in my experience, nothing means much until you've got a signed offer in hand; people can and do interview for multiple rounds without getting offers.) It's disappointing, and it can feel misleading, but at least in this case they haven't dragged it out.
posted by fingersandtoes at 1:15 PM on September 11, 2023
posted by fingersandtoes at 1:15 PM on September 11, 2023
Sorry about Prime Job, but also FYI Ask a Manager always counsels that when you're job hunting, you just keep going and applying and applying and applying, even when you've had a good interview. There are a million reasons you might not get a job, and very often none of them have anything to do with you -- like the funding falls through or they actually already had an internal candidate in mind, or someone else who interviewed was literally a 100% perfect match. None of that is in your control; continuing to job hunt is.
posted by BlahLaLa at 1:23 PM on September 11, 2023
posted by BlahLaLa at 1:23 PM on September 11, 2023
Yes, the best way to recover from a disappointment is to keep applying. It also keeps me from mentally measuring the drapes at the place where I've had a good interview; I ruminate on the outcome less.
posted by jgirl at 3:58 PM on September 11, 2023
posted by jgirl at 3:58 PM on September 11, 2023
Oh, just today I had yet another first-round interview with a staffing service who was pitching another job, yeah. I'll keep going until I get an offer from Deck Job and negotiate for a little more salary.
And - I'll also secretly stay in touch with my old job, who I'm pretty sure would totally let me know if and when there are openings again in a couple years.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:24 PM on September 11, 2023
And - I'll also secretly stay in touch with my old job, who I'm pretty sure would totally let me know if and when there are openings again in a couple years.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:24 PM on September 11, 2023
Just wanted to point out that we are in the 4th quarter of the year. If/when Deck Job offers you a job and insurance that you have to cover (that's a really sucky deal), you'll have to hit your deductible twice - now and again in January. I remember you injured your knee not that long ago, right? Still doing PT?
Definitely check into whatever insurance they are offering you - the doctors that are in their network, etc. It's a tiny company, which very well may mean shitty bare-bones insurance. Also, find out if they do FSA or pre-tax transit as part of your overall package. Get the money (and negotiate PTO)!!!
Best of luck to you!!
posted by dancinglamb at 2:52 AM on September 12, 2023
Definitely check into whatever insurance they are offering you - the doctors that are in their network, etc. It's a tiny company, which very well may mean shitty bare-bones insurance. Also, find out if they do FSA or pre-tax transit as part of your overall package. Get the money (and negotiate PTO)!!!
Best of luck to you!!
posted by dancinglamb at 2:52 AM on September 12, 2023
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posted by essexjan at 4:39 AM on September 11, 2023