COVID indoor time conflict
October 22, 2020 2:51 PM Subscribe
I live alone. I had plans to hang out indoors with a friend who also lives alone over the winter, once a week. My circumstances and options changed, and I asked her if we could hang out indoors every other week so I could combine households with another friend part time. Friend one has not responded well. I admit that my ask was selfishly motivated, and she has every right to be unhappy with me, but have I been as truly awful as she says I am? How should I handle this moving forward?
I live alone and have have two close friends. One (1) lives on her own, works with people in person in a medical setting, and has a boyfriend that she see indoors and unmasked about once a month. Her boyfriend works from home, but has decided that the one COVID risk he's willing to take is going to an outdoor bar weekly with some friends, which is not something I'm super comfortable with. The other friend (2) lives with her retired parents, is currently unemployed because of COVID, and doesn't socialize with anyone else indoors and unmasked except her parents.
Up until now I've been hanging out with both friends outdoors and either distanced or masked. Over the summer, (1) and I had made plans that once it got too cold out, we would take our weekly dinners indoors, specifically on the day after she got her weekly COVID test, when her work gets her test results, so that there was the highest possible chance that if she had COVID, we'd know. Not a perfect system, since her work operates on an "assume you're negative unless you get a phone call" basis for these results and might not actually call until the next day if the test results arrived late in the day, but I was willing to take on the risk, because we're good friends, I care about her, and I know how much it sucks to live alone. We were also already going to skip the weeks after she has indoor time with her boyfriend since I'm not comfortable with the risk he's taking. We also have plans to do Thanksgiving together and go on a responsible vacation to the next state over in December for my birthday.
This past week, (2) offered to have me combine households with her and her family going forward. They're comfortable that my level of exposure is similar to theirs (grocery shopping on a weekly basis, occasionally ordering takeout, all socializing outdoors and either masked or distanced with one other person or very small groups. They don't work, and I work from home with 3x a week trips to work for a couple hours to deal with mail in a closed office and zero-minimal exposure to other people). Basically the agreement would be that if either side wanted to be indoors with someone outside of the household, they'd wait five days afterwards, and get a negative COVID test result before going back to hanging out indoors.
I told them about (1), about her risk factors, about my plans to see her for Thanksgiving, for the December vacation, and the plans that I'd made with her for weekly dinners indoors, and that I was not willing to entirely give up on those plans. I asked if they would be comfortable with me hanging out with her indoors every other week, and doing the agreed upon reentry into the pod afterwards. I'd basically be spending half my time with them, and half quarantineing and waiting on test results after seeing (1) which was going to be complicated, and I honestly didn't think they'd go for it, but they agreed that they'd be comfortable with that.
I then took this information to (1). Told her that I'd been invited to combine households with (2)'s family. Told her that I really wanted to take them up on the offer, but it would mean that we'd only get to hang out indoors every other week instead of every week. I told her that I would be down to either try to figure out something outdoors or do a phone call on the other weeks, with no changes to plans for Thanksgiving or the December vacation. I didn't expect this to be an easy conversation, and went into it knowing that (1) was losing out and that she wasn't going to be happy, but I also didn't quite expect the response that I got.
(1) has accused me of going back on my commitment to her, of not caring for her like a close friend should, of not giving her the same consideration she would give me, and of generally being a shitty person who is ok treating her friends as disposable. She has put a hold on any kind of socializing while she processes this new information about our friendship. This is... not the response that I was expecting from this friend, who has generally been measured and reasonable in the past, and who generally loves to talk through knotty relationship problems in-depth.
I know COVID times have been rough on everyone, so I'm trying to give her the benefit of the doubt here, and I'm also willing to admit that I am making a decision here where she loses out and that (1) has every right to be mad at me and sad about losing out on some time together indoors, which is currently at a premium. But this seems like... a lot for the kind of change that I proposed. I look at what I proposed and her response it doesn't line up. I truly wasn't trying to hurt her, just to make a decision based on changing information and situations and safety consideration, that yes, was selfishly motivated by my own wish to have in-person social contacts more often than once a week during the winter, with people who I feel I'm not stretching my risk tolerance to hang out in person with. The fact that this was selfishly motivated makes it harder to refute (1)'s claims that I'm being an awful person and going back on my word and treating her unfairly. My choice was selfish and she is losing out here. But I also... didn't think that the choice I was making was one with friendship-ending stakes. Which it now seems like this is, for her. We were already going to skip one week a month so she could see her boyfriend, so what was one more week? I was looking for a compromise, and to have a way to hang out in person with both of the important friends in my life over the winter. I worry that I may have grossly misjudged this situation and been truly shitty to (1) and royally fucked up my friendship with her. Have I been as shitty as she says? If so, how can I be better in the future, and how do I patch this up?
I live alone and have have two close friends. One (1) lives on her own, works with people in person in a medical setting, and has a boyfriend that she see indoors and unmasked about once a month. Her boyfriend works from home, but has decided that the one COVID risk he's willing to take is going to an outdoor bar weekly with some friends, which is not something I'm super comfortable with. The other friend (2) lives with her retired parents, is currently unemployed because of COVID, and doesn't socialize with anyone else indoors and unmasked except her parents.
Up until now I've been hanging out with both friends outdoors and either distanced or masked. Over the summer, (1) and I had made plans that once it got too cold out, we would take our weekly dinners indoors, specifically on the day after she got her weekly COVID test, when her work gets her test results, so that there was the highest possible chance that if she had COVID, we'd know. Not a perfect system, since her work operates on an "assume you're negative unless you get a phone call" basis for these results and might not actually call until the next day if the test results arrived late in the day, but I was willing to take on the risk, because we're good friends, I care about her, and I know how much it sucks to live alone. We were also already going to skip the weeks after she has indoor time with her boyfriend since I'm not comfortable with the risk he's taking. We also have plans to do Thanksgiving together and go on a responsible vacation to the next state over in December for my birthday.
This past week, (2) offered to have me combine households with her and her family going forward. They're comfortable that my level of exposure is similar to theirs (grocery shopping on a weekly basis, occasionally ordering takeout, all socializing outdoors and either masked or distanced with one other person or very small groups. They don't work, and I work from home with 3x a week trips to work for a couple hours to deal with mail in a closed office and zero-minimal exposure to other people). Basically the agreement would be that if either side wanted to be indoors with someone outside of the household, they'd wait five days afterwards, and get a negative COVID test result before going back to hanging out indoors.
I told them about (1), about her risk factors, about my plans to see her for Thanksgiving, for the December vacation, and the plans that I'd made with her for weekly dinners indoors, and that I was not willing to entirely give up on those plans. I asked if they would be comfortable with me hanging out with her indoors every other week, and doing the agreed upon reentry into the pod afterwards. I'd basically be spending half my time with them, and half quarantineing and waiting on test results after seeing (1) which was going to be complicated, and I honestly didn't think they'd go for it, but they agreed that they'd be comfortable with that.
I then took this information to (1). Told her that I'd been invited to combine households with (2)'s family. Told her that I really wanted to take them up on the offer, but it would mean that we'd only get to hang out indoors every other week instead of every week. I told her that I would be down to either try to figure out something outdoors or do a phone call on the other weeks, with no changes to plans for Thanksgiving or the December vacation. I didn't expect this to be an easy conversation, and went into it knowing that (1) was losing out and that she wasn't going to be happy, but I also didn't quite expect the response that I got.
(1) has accused me of going back on my commitment to her, of not caring for her like a close friend should, of not giving her the same consideration she would give me, and of generally being a shitty person who is ok treating her friends as disposable. She has put a hold on any kind of socializing while she processes this new information about our friendship. This is... not the response that I was expecting from this friend, who has generally been measured and reasonable in the past, and who generally loves to talk through knotty relationship problems in-depth.
I know COVID times have been rough on everyone, so I'm trying to give her the benefit of the doubt here, and I'm also willing to admit that I am making a decision here where she loses out and that (1) has every right to be mad at me and sad about losing out on some time together indoors, which is currently at a premium. But this seems like... a lot for the kind of change that I proposed. I look at what I proposed and her response it doesn't line up. I truly wasn't trying to hurt her, just to make a decision based on changing information and situations and safety consideration, that yes, was selfishly motivated by my own wish to have in-person social contacts more often than once a week during the winter, with people who I feel I'm not stretching my risk tolerance to hang out in person with. The fact that this was selfishly motivated makes it harder to refute (1)'s claims that I'm being an awful person and going back on my word and treating her unfairly. My choice was selfish and she is losing out here. But I also... didn't think that the choice I was making was one with friendship-ending stakes. Which it now seems like this is, for her. We were already going to skip one week a month so she could see her boyfriend, so what was one more week? I was looking for a compromise, and to have a way to hang out in person with both of the important friends in my life over the winter. I worry that I may have grossly misjudged this situation and been truly shitty to (1) and royally fucked up my friendship with her. Have I been as shitty as she says? If so, how can I be better in the future, and how do I patch this up?
If I read it right, your proposal to upset friend was essentially “I hang out with you less,” correct?
You get the advantage of seeing this other friend in the opposite weeks and your friend gets... what? I understand why you also want to see other friends! But for your upset friend it may feel like their simply getting cast aside in favor of this other person.
That being said, none of this makes you a shitty person. This is potentially a shitty thing to have done, but a singular act does not make you a terrible person. Give friend the time they need to process about it, and take that time for yourself to figure out what your motivations are regrets are as well. Ex “I don’t want to see you less, but I do want to be able to see other friend, and this felt like the only way to make that happen. I’m really sorry I hurt your feelings. What can we do to fix this and not have something similar happen again?” This is certainly not a friendship ending event... unless it’s a friendship you really wouldn’t want anyway.
posted by raccoon409 at 3:21 PM on October 22, 2020 [6 favorites]
You get the advantage of seeing this other friend in the opposite weeks and your friend gets... what? I understand why you also want to see other friends! But for your upset friend it may feel like their simply getting cast aside in favor of this other person.
That being said, none of this makes you a shitty person. This is potentially a shitty thing to have done, but a singular act does not make you a terrible person. Give friend the time they need to process about it, and take that time for yourself to figure out what your motivations are regrets are as well. Ex “I don’t want to see you less, but I do want to be able to see other friend, and this felt like the only way to make that happen. I’m really sorry I hurt your feelings. What can we do to fix this and not have something similar happen again?” This is certainly not a friendship ending event... unless it’s a friendship you really wouldn’t want anyway.
posted by raccoon409 at 3:21 PM on October 22, 2020 [6 favorites]
Best answer: I sort of suspect that this may be normal behavior from friend 1, but that you've been protected/insulated from it, perhaps because you don't normally go against her wishes? I could be wrong... but you might want to think through whether it's a possibility.
Also... the risk comparison was already NOT equal between these two friends. Your interactions with friend 1 were much higher risk than those with friend 2. From your description, it's also apparent that friend 1 has a great deal more social interaction than friend 2 - it's definitely not fair for her to guilt-trip you into complying with her wants when they go against something that would be beneficial for your needs.
Your suggested plan would have literally been you jumping through ridiculous hoops and readjusting your living situation weekly just to spend some time indoors with her once a week. That sounds exhausting. If she isn't satisfied by your willingness to do that... which is way too much, already, for her to expect, and she should be uber-appreciative of your willingness to do so... that gives a LOT of weight to my thoughts up there in paragraph one. The appropriate answer for her to give, if she was actually a true friend, would be for her to say no, you need to do what's best for your living situation - and that she's perfectly happy with phone, video, or online chats... and that given how things seem to be ramping up with the virus, it'd be a good thing to do anyway.
posted by stormyteal at 3:26 PM on October 22, 2020 [29 favorites]
Also... the risk comparison was already NOT equal between these two friends. Your interactions with friend 1 were much higher risk than those with friend 2. From your description, it's also apparent that friend 1 has a great deal more social interaction than friend 2 - it's definitely not fair for her to guilt-trip you into complying with her wants when they go against something that would be beneficial for your needs.
Your suggested plan would have literally been you jumping through ridiculous hoops and readjusting your living situation weekly just to spend some time indoors with her once a week. That sounds exhausting. If she isn't satisfied by your willingness to do that... which is way too much, already, for her to expect, and she should be uber-appreciative of your willingness to do so... that gives a LOT of weight to my thoughts up there in paragraph one. The appropriate answer for her to give, if she was actually a true friend, would be for her to say no, you need to do what's best for your living situation - and that she's perfectly happy with phone, video, or online chats... and that given how things seem to be ramping up with the virus, it'd be a good thing to do anyway.
posted by stormyteal at 3:26 PM on October 22, 2020 [29 favorites]
Best answer: I get how painful this is. A few months ago we had a "pod" go up in a blaze of smoke, supposedly because I was engaging in risky behavior the other members weren't comfortable with--when they'd been engaging in behavior that was riskier than my own comfort levels all along, including occasionally seeing people or doing things we'd learn of after the fact. And it made me realize that this was about control, for the other parties involved--emotional control, but also control of perceived risk, because they perceived whatever they did as not-risky but anything other people did as terrible, and they felt they could lash out at me because that was a way to vent their frustrations about the virus. It wasn't fair, though, and wasn't kind.
What your friend did wasn't fair or kind either.
I don't think you did anything selfish here, if selfishness is a negative value. You have a right to chose who to spend your time with. You have a right to break up romantic relationships or stop seeing friends completely and you definitely have a right to chose to see one friend and not another. COVID has made a lot of people relinquish emotional control to other parties in a way I find frankly unhealthy.
I can't tell you what to do, but I can tell you that I feel some sadness about my friends, I also feel way happier and psychologically steady since I decided not to be in a pod I was never really that comfortable with, anyway.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 4:23 PM on October 22, 2020 [24 favorites]
What your friend did wasn't fair or kind either.
I don't think you did anything selfish here, if selfishness is a negative value. You have a right to chose who to spend your time with. You have a right to break up romantic relationships or stop seeing friends completely and you definitely have a right to chose to see one friend and not another. COVID has made a lot of people relinquish emotional control to other parties in a way I find frankly unhealthy.
I can't tell you what to do, but I can tell you that I feel some sadness about my friends, I also feel way happier and psychologically steady since I decided not to be in a pod I was never really that comfortable with, anyway.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 4:23 PM on October 22, 2020 [24 favorites]
I don't think you were shitty - sounds like you are going way out of your way to accommodate both 1 and 2, including taking some risks hanging out indoors with friend 1.
I've gotten through this pandemic by the grace of Zoom and FaceTime. I have asthma, so during the occasional times I see friends in person, we are both masked (actually, I'm wearing a respirator) and maybe take a short walk. Honestly, I much prefer chilling in the comfort of my own home, Zooming with friends in the comforts of their own homes, and watching a movie or having a glass of wine with them (which I can't do with a mask on!). Ever since this started I have hung out with friends probably at least three times a week this way - it's simple for everyone and I don't have to deal with anxiety about my safety. (I'm actually watching the debate tonight with friends via Zoom. :)
Anyway, just some food for thought. Honestly, your arrangements with 1 and 2 (1 more especially) sound really complicated and stress-inducing. Friends should be a nice thing during this pandemic, not an extra source of stress.
posted by mingodingo at 4:42 PM on October 22, 2020 [4 favorites]
I've gotten through this pandemic by the grace of Zoom and FaceTime. I have asthma, so during the occasional times I see friends in person, we are both masked (actually, I'm wearing a respirator) and maybe take a short walk. Honestly, I much prefer chilling in the comfort of my own home, Zooming with friends in the comforts of their own homes, and watching a movie or having a glass of wine with them (which I can't do with a mask on!). Ever since this started I have hung out with friends probably at least three times a week this way - it's simple for everyone and I don't have to deal with anxiety about my safety. (I'm actually watching the debate tonight with friends via Zoom. :)
Anyway, just some food for thought. Honestly, your arrangements with 1 and 2 (1 more especially) sound really complicated and stress-inducing. Friends should be a nice thing during this pandemic, not an extra source of stress.
posted by mingodingo at 4:42 PM on October 22, 2020 [4 favorites]
I also live alone, and would not take being attacked by Friend 1. I might withdraw and let her come to her senses ... we are all under a lot of stress ... but would not suffer being called "shitty" etc.
posted by cyndigo at 5:10 PM on October 22, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by cyndigo at 5:10 PM on October 22, 2020 [2 favorites]
Also, she is fine with limiting YOUR socializing while she sees her boyfriend, yet you are ... shitty? No. Just no.
posted by cyndigo at 5:12 PM on October 22, 2020 [22 favorites]
posted by cyndigo at 5:12 PM on October 22, 2020 [22 favorites]
Best answer: You haven't been shitty. You didn't grossly misjudge. Consent is something that is always up for discussion, renegotiation, and redefinition in a healthy relationship. You did nothing wrong, and the way that your friend is reacting is crummy. I'm sure that your friend is under a lot of stress, like we all are, but accusing you of being selfish and a bad friend is really unkind. I'm sorry that that happened to you. You are not a bad person for trying to renegotiate something really sensitive and risky that you decided on at least two months ago. What you did was not wrong.
These plans you've laid out, though, are pretty risky. Maybe I'm too biased, since I'm answering this question with the eyes of someone who has not seen or touched another human or mammal for 230 days, but the interactions with friend 1 seem pretty unsafe. Waiting 5 days to see friend 2 and their parents, who I assume are older, is not sufficient. We know that false negatives on tests are not uncommon. Eating food indoors with one another is an incredibly risky activity; one of the riskiest things we can choose to do with people that we do not live with. The level of potential covid exposure friend 1 has is not low. You would be putting household 2 at risk. I know that you said that this is in your risk tolerance, but you may want to consider figuring out other activities that do not involve such high potential for transmission of this airborne virus. This thing is a sneaky disease out looking for hosts; it does not care about the median onset of symptoms hitting at day five.
posted by k8lin at 5:56 PM on October 22, 2020 [12 favorites]
These plans you've laid out, though, are pretty risky. Maybe I'm too biased, since I'm answering this question with the eyes of someone who has not seen or touched another human or mammal for 230 days, but the interactions with friend 1 seem pretty unsafe. Waiting 5 days to see friend 2 and their parents, who I assume are older, is not sufficient. We know that false negatives on tests are not uncommon. Eating food indoors with one another is an incredibly risky activity; one of the riskiest things we can choose to do with people that we do not live with. The level of potential covid exposure friend 1 has is not low. You would be putting household 2 at risk. I know that you said that this is in your risk tolerance, but you may want to consider figuring out other activities that do not involve such high potential for transmission of this airborne virus. This thing is a sneaky disease out looking for hosts; it does not care about the median onset of symptoms hitting at day five.
posted by k8lin at 5:56 PM on October 22, 2020 [12 favorites]
If I'm reading this right, friend 1's ONLY acceptable solution for you until this all is over is... you literally never hang out with anyone but them? That doesn't feel okay to me, and her response may be coming from stress, and everything right now sucks, but that doesn't make it any less controlling or red flaggy in my opinion.
posted by augustimagination at 6:25 PM on October 22, 2020 [9 favorites]
posted by augustimagination at 6:25 PM on October 22, 2020 [9 favorites]
Best answer: Well I see I'm not in the majority here, but honestly? Yes, my take from what you wrote is that you were a shitty friend.
I think it's unfair of you to make plans with friend #1 and then discuss with friend #2 and their family exactly how much contact with friend #1 would be ok, and only then go back to friend #1 and issue an edict about how your plans have changed. Why wouldn't you *first* go to friend 1 and tell her the offer and ask how she would feel about it? She might have been sad that she wouldn't see you as much but understand that it would be good for your mental health to not live alone anymore.
Instead, you went back on your word and you treated friend #1 as clearly less important to you. You provided her no chance to give input into a change in plans, making her feel powerless. And now you're trying to dictate how bad she's allowed to feel about being treated shabbily.
I think you owe her a sincere apology.
posted by Flock of Cynthiabirds at 6:27 PM on October 22, 2020 [11 favorites]
I think it's unfair of you to make plans with friend #1 and then discuss with friend #2 and their family exactly how much contact with friend #1 would be ok, and only then go back to friend #1 and issue an edict about how your plans have changed. Why wouldn't you *first* go to friend 1 and tell her the offer and ask how she would feel about it? She might have been sad that she wouldn't see you as much but understand that it would be good for your mental health to not live alone anymore.
Instead, you went back on your word and you treated friend #1 as clearly less important to you. You provided her no chance to give input into a change in plans, making her feel powerless. And now you're trying to dictate how bad she's allowed to feel about being treated shabbily.
I think you owe her a sincere apology.
posted by Flock of Cynthiabirds at 6:27 PM on October 22, 2020 [11 favorites]
Oh and, I agree that both of these scenarios are risky. But I also get that mental health and well-being cannot just be put on hold indefinitely and that you are trying to get your minimal socialization needs met even if it carries some risk.
posted by Flock of Cynthiabirds at 6:32 PM on October 22, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Flock of Cynthiabirds at 6:32 PM on October 22, 2020 [1 favorite]
Best answer: To be completely honest, I think your proposed arrangement with friend (1) puts a lot of strain on you and comes with sizeable risk for you and friend (2) if you were to combine households.
I'd only consider taking on this risk if I trusted this person to be completely honest with me about any potential exposure AND if I believed them to have my best interests at heart.
If someone had blown out at me like that. I'd worry that they might not be completely honest and forthcoming about any risky encounter if that meant they'd lose out on interacting with me (because upon hearing about it I might decide to skip a meeting with them to protect myself and my bubble).
I understand she might be disappointed but she was already asking you for a huge compromise.
I'd say the emotional blackmail is all the more reason to take a step back and carefully reconsider your plans with friend (1).
I see this as a question of consent.
Someone who reacts this strongly to you tentatively withdrawing consent might also be tempted to ignore your boundaries if they think they are unfair.
Also. you are probably aware that there is a significant percentage of falsely negative tests and late or missing results, and that the five day window will miss a lot of cases.
posted by M. at 12:10 AM on October 23, 2020 [10 favorites]
I'd only consider taking on this risk if I trusted this person to be completely honest with me about any potential exposure AND if I believed them to have my best interests at heart.
If someone had blown out at me like that. I'd worry that they might not be completely honest and forthcoming about any risky encounter if that meant they'd lose out on interacting with me (because upon hearing about it I might decide to skip a meeting with them to protect myself and my bubble).
I understand she might be disappointed but she was already asking you for a huge compromise.
I'd say the emotional blackmail is all the more reason to take a step back and carefully reconsider your plans with friend (1).
I see this as a question of consent.
Someone who reacts this strongly to you tentatively withdrawing consent might also be tempted to ignore your boundaries if they think they are unfair.
Also. you are probably aware that there is a significant percentage of falsely negative tests and late or missing results, and that the five day window will miss a lot of cases.
posted by M. at 12:10 AM on October 23, 2020 [10 favorites]
Response by poster: Thank you, all. I have apologized profusely to (1) for not asking for her input instead of bringing it up as something I'd basically already decided to do. That was shitty of me, and I should have been better to her. We did have plans, and I was trying to change them on her at the last minute, and that is a shitty thing to do to a person, full stop. I have offered everything from prioritizing her for hanging out outdoors on the weekends when we are not hanging out indoors since it would be warmer during the day to footing the bill on equipment like heated blankets for us to hang out outdoors on our usual evening. I did not offer to cancel indoor plans with (2) entirely, which maybe (1) would have accepted. Maybe that's what I should have done here, and lived with the original plans I made instead of trying for more. There are any number of reasons why I didn't, but in the end it comes down to that it didn't feel right, and I couldn't square making (1) the sole priority in my life, ahead of even my own happiness and risk tolerance, which is what capitulating on this would have felt like.
In response (1) ended our friendship and cancelled all of our future plans, and has maintained that I am untrustworthy and appallingly selfish and was just using her all along. I don't believe these things to be true, but of course I wouldn't; I'm biased. I have continued to receive detailed accounts of my poor behavior from her after accepting the end of the friendship and wishing her well.
My read on this in the end that I fucked up and handled this poorly, but from every angle that I look at it this shouldn't have been a friendship-ending misstep, or if it clearly was, then I... then I don't understand people as well as I thought I did, and (1) was right to cut me out of her life. Either way, the end of that friendship was the consequence of my actions and I accept it. I will get in touch with my therapist to figure out how to handle situations like this better in the future, since I don't feel qualified to rule on what I should have done at this point.
I have also noted all your concerns regarding 5 days and a test not being enough protection against COVID, especially for (2)'s older parents. I will be taking this information back to them and proposing something more like a 14 day quarantine before rejoining the pod after indoors, unmasked time with another person. Since I will not be seeing (1) anymore, there's really no travelling or visiting others indoors that I'll be doing on my end.
posted by bridgebury at 8:26 AM on October 23, 2020 [3 favorites]
In response (1) ended our friendship and cancelled all of our future plans, and has maintained that I am untrustworthy and appallingly selfish and was just using her all along. I don't believe these things to be true, but of course I wouldn't; I'm biased. I have continued to receive detailed accounts of my poor behavior from her after accepting the end of the friendship and wishing her well.
My read on this in the end that I fucked up and handled this poorly, but from every angle that I look at it this shouldn't have been a friendship-ending misstep, or if it clearly was, then I... then I don't understand people as well as I thought I did, and (1) was right to cut me out of her life. Either way, the end of that friendship was the consequence of my actions and I accept it. I will get in touch with my therapist to figure out how to handle situations like this better in the future, since I don't feel qualified to rule on what I should have done at this point.
I have also noted all your concerns regarding 5 days and a test not being enough protection against COVID, especially for (2)'s older parents. I will be taking this information back to them and proposing something more like a 14 day quarantine before rejoining the pod after indoors, unmasked time with another person. Since I will not be seeing (1) anymore, there's really no travelling or visiting others indoors that I'll be doing on my end.
posted by bridgebury at 8:26 AM on October 23, 2020 [3 favorites]
Gosh, it sounds like (1) is quite the drama queen. I don’t think you did anything so terrible. Try not to take it personally.
posted by lakeroon at 8:33 AM on October 23, 2020 [8 favorites]
posted by lakeroon at 8:33 AM on October 23, 2020 [8 favorites]
Wow. I'm sorry you have been on the receiving end of this treatment. It's weird that she kept piling on you even after you acknowledged her breaking off the friendship.
Please do not beat yourself up. Do something good for yourself and be assured that you did the right thing. Your former friend does not seem like a person who has their stuff together at the moment. The times are crazy but you don't have to be anyone's punching bag.
All the best.
posted by M. at 10:26 AM on October 23, 2020 [3 favorites]
Please do not beat yourself up. Do something good for yourself and be assured that you did the right thing. Your former friend does not seem like a person who has their stuff together at the moment. The times are crazy but you don't have to be anyone's punching bag.
All the best.
posted by M. at 10:26 AM on October 23, 2020 [3 favorites]
Wow. I'm really sorry that things ended this way. Having your friendship go up in flames like this is really more a reflection of (1)'s reaction to you setting boundaries rather than you having done something wrong. Sure, you unilaterally changed your plans with her, but it was on the basis of managing not only your needs but those of (2). When you bring (1)'s risks into play...
As terrible and blunt as this may sound:
-It's not your responsibility to ensure that (1)'s social needs are met
-No one, including (1) gets to decide or relitigate how other people choose to prioritize them
-It's also not your fault that (1) is seemingly reliant on you to get their social needs met
-No adult can manage their friendships by assuming they're the only or most important stakeholder in another person's life, and (1)'s actions suggest that that's exactly what she was doing
-Friendships work so much better when you can navigate them without a sense of scarcity or control
While it's a difficult time for everyone out there, and not everyone is going to be on their best behaviour, people like (1) don't sound well-equipped to navigate relationships where they're not unequivocally someone's #1 priority. Not everyone has the social or conflict resolution skills to be good at pandemic-era friending; (1)'s shown you that she doesn't. If the way that (1)'s life has shaken out means that she'll only have social contact once a month with her boyfriend, so be it; this situation has shown you that maybe there's a reason she's in that predicament not by choice.
posted by blerghamot at 11:18 AM on October 23, 2020 [9 favorites]
As terrible and blunt as this may sound:
-It's not your responsibility to ensure that (1)'s social needs are met
-No one, including (1) gets to decide or relitigate how other people choose to prioritize them
-It's also not your fault that (1) is seemingly reliant on you to get their social needs met
-No adult can manage their friendships by assuming they're the only or most important stakeholder in another person's life, and (1)'s actions suggest that that's exactly what she was doing
-Friendships work so much better when you can navigate them without a sense of scarcity or control
While it's a difficult time for everyone out there, and not everyone is going to be on their best behaviour, people like (1) don't sound well-equipped to navigate relationships where they're not unequivocally someone's #1 priority. Not everyone has the social or conflict resolution skills to be good at pandemic-era friending; (1)'s shown you that she doesn't. If the way that (1)'s life has shaken out means that she'll only have social contact once a month with her boyfriend, so be it; this situation has shown you that maybe there's a reason she's in that predicament not by choice.
posted by blerghamot at 11:18 AM on October 23, 2020 [9 favorites]
Yeah, (ex) friend (1) is being a real a**hole. I think you acted perfectly rationally. She's behaving in an incredibly selfish and entitled manner. I would not make myself available to listen to any more of her complaints and abuse of your character. You sound like a very nice person, I doubt you'll wind up missing her as much as she's going to miss you. Don't stress losing this person. Good riddance Id say.
posted by WalkerWestridge at 2:16 PM on October 23, 2020 [5 favorites]
posted by WalkerWestridge at 2:16 PM on October 23, 2020 [5 favorites]
Wow, (1) is really going out of her way to demonstrate to you how much better off you are without her friendship, isn't she?
posted by Ragged Richard at 5:55 PM on October 23, 2020 [6 favorites]
posted by Ragged Richard at 5:55 PM on October 23, 2020 [6 favorites]
In response (1) ended our friendship and cancelled all of our future plans, and has maintained that I am untrustworthy and appallingly selfish and was just using her all along. I don't believe these things to be true, but of course I wouldn't; I'm biased. I have continued to receive detailed accounts of my poor behavior from her after accepting the end of the friendship and wishing her well.
I'm sorry, but this is abusive. Her attempts to guilt you into limiting your social life to just her is an issue of control, not an issue of you being shitty.
in the end it comes down to that it didn't feel right, and I couldn't square making (1) the sole priority in my life, ahead of even my own happiness and risk tolerance, which is what capitulating on this would have felt like.
This is a good instinct.
When my pod fell apart, my daughter was (understandably) sad that she didn't get to see her best friend, another six year old, anymore. And it had come down to them being angry I wouldn't limit her social contact to just him. I told my daughter that it is sad, but one person is never enough for another--that you need lots of friends, even in a pandemic, and that if anyone ever stops you from trying to see other friends, then you should know that they're not a good friend. I'm glad your friend didn't successfully isolate you, and that you stood up for yourself here. You weren't being a shitty friend to her--you were being a good friend to yourself.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 5:52 PM on October 24, 2020 [3 favorites]
I'm sorry, but this is abusive. Her attempts to guilt you into limiting your social life to just her is an issue of control, not an issue of you being shitty.
in the end it comes down to that it didn't feel right, and I couldn't square making (1) the sole priority in my life, ahead of even my own happiness and risk tolerance, which is what capitulating on this would have felt like.
This is a good instinct.
When my pod fell apart, my daughter was (understandably) sad that she didn't get to see her best friend, another six year old, anymore. And it had come down to them being angry I wouldn't limit her social contact to just him. I told my daughter that it is sad, but one person is never enough for another--that you need lots of friends, even in a pandemic, and that if anyone ever stops you from trying to see other friends, then you should know that they're not a good friend. I'm glad your friend didn't successfully isolate you, and that you stood up for yourself here. You weren't being a shitty friend to her--you were being a good friend to yourself.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 5:52 PM on October 24, 2020 [3 favorites]
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Is friend 1 the friend you just made this arrangement with this summer? Your phrase "combining households," which you used here and which you used in your earlier question about her, made me wonder if she feels perhaps like you are replacing with her with this other friend, who has her parents to interact with. It could be that she's lonely and jealous. That doesn't mean you are an awful friend, though.
I wonder if this is also partly because she didn't see this coming. Had you let her know in advance this might be happening?
Also, I wonder if you could propose that you all get together, masked and outdoors, on the weeks when you're not hanging out indoors. Maybe a long walk outside would a partial substitute?
posted by bluedaisy at 3:04 PM on October 22, 2020 [7 favorites]