How to Introduce Someone to the Fab Four
October 11, 2019 11:33 AM Subscribe
How would you introduce a young adult to the Beatles?
I work with a younger generation of computer science professionals that were born in India. They are all in their early to mid 20's. I asked them if they'd ever heard of Mick Jagger before, and all of them had a glazed look in their eyes. Then I asked if they'd ever heard of The Beatles.
Blank stares.
This isn't the first time I've encountered this phenomenon, but I would love to introduce them to the Fab Four. My question for you is, how would you go about introducing a 20-something year old to The Beatles?
I have access to most of their catalog in my digital music library, so the question isn't about media/format, and I am not going to jump into making them watch snippets of Yellow Submarine or Hard Day's Night on YouTube...I'm more looking to see which songs should be featured for someone who has no frame of reference. I don't think deep cuts are going to do it (number 9, number 9, lol), but their early stuff and their later stuff? Which tunes would you pick?
I work with a younger generation of computer science professionals that were born in India. They are all in their early to mid 20's. I asked them if they'd ever heard of Mick Jagger before, and all of them had a glazed look in their eyes. Then I asked if they'd ever heard of The Beatles.
Blank stares.
This isn't the first time I've encountered this phenomenon, but I would love to introduce them to the Fab Four. My question for you is, how would you go about introducing a 20-something year old to The Beatles?
I have access to most of their catalog in my digital music library, so the question isn't about media/format, and I am not going to jump into making them watch snippets of Yellow Submarine or Hard Day's Night on YouTube...I'm more looking to see which songs should be featured for someone who has no frame of reference. I don't think deep cuts are going to do it (number 9, number 9, lol), but their early stuff and their later stuff? Which tunes would you pick?
It might be better to approach this as a cultural moment, and an important part of the popular history of the postwar world. The music is great, but the Beatles were more than music. Huffy Puffy's suggestion to start with the Ed Sullivan show is a great one. You get the music, you get their look, you get a whole audience of people losing their damn minds. Something like 40% of America tuned in to watch them on TV.
posted by phunniemee at 11:51 AM on October 11, 2019 [5 favorites]
posted by phunniemee at 11:51 AM on October 11, 2019 [5 favorites]
I wonder if you may have a situation where they may have heard the music but just never knew the origin, you know? Like they may not have heard of "the Beatles," but if you played them something like "Yesterday" or "Yellow Submarine" they'd say "Oh hang on, I know that song!"
So maybe try one or two of the Big Hits and see if that rings any bells.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:01 PM on October 11, 2019 [3 favorites]
So maybe try one or two of the Big Hits and see if that rings any bells.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:01 PM on October 11, 2019 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Given the audience, I'd lean towards their later more psychedellic stuff, which has a fair amount of Indian musical influence. It's going to at least give them some anchor point to their own culture. I mean, Ravi Shankar was/is pretty fucking famous in India (which, I know is a huge geographical area with tons of ethnic variation, but he was really fucking famous), and he introduced the beatles to the sitar. He might not be super famous to that cohort...but I'm guessing they've heard of him.
I'd make a mix of "Pre-indian influence, and Post-indian influence." Like, show them how their culture got mashed up with british pop music. I mean, I'd be stoked if my culture directly influenced one of the most famous bands in the western world...or would at least like knowing the trivia of it.
There's a good list of singles here, but I wouldn't stick to this list necessarily.
posted by furnace.heart at 12:08 PM on October 11, 2019 [2 favorites]
I'd make a mix of "Pre-indian influence, and Post-indian influence." Like, show them how their culture got mashed up with british pop music. I mean, I'd be stoked if my culture directly influenced one of the most famous bands in the western world...or would at least like knowing the trivia of it.
There's a good list of singles here, but I wouldn't stick to this list necessarily.
posted by furnace.heart at 12:08 PM on October 11, 2019 [2 favorites]
I think the best "classic" material (in any form) can be divided into stuff that's groundbreaking versus stuff that's perfect. The groundbreaking stuff doesn't age as well, because it's harder to appreciate because it's already laid the groundwork. Raging Bull is a great movie, but some of its impact is because of the incredibly visceral way the fight scenes are shot -- but every action scene since then has learned from it, and those scenes seem tame when you've seen a Bourne or John Wick. Goodfellas is also a great movie; it wasn't as inventive -- it's just a well-written, well-acted, well-filmed story -- and I think it that's why holds up better to just casual enjoyment today. In the same vein musically, the early punks and rappers had a shock value that has just been sanded off over the past 40 years as their sounds became mainstream; it doesn't make "God Save The Queen" or "Fuck The Police" bad songs, they're still great, they just don't have the punch in the face and sense of danger they did when they came out.
Which is a roundabout way of saying start with the #1 singles collection. The Beatles on Sullivan or their later albums were important landmarks at the time, but the idea of a screaming crazy fanbase for an artist or a really involved innovative studio presence in the creation of an album are so omnipresent that it's impossible today to appreciate them as something that somebody did first. But my god are those singles still great, and the compilation is excellent for these purposes; it's chronological so you can hear the growth of the band, and the 27 #1s is short enough that it's not a marathon, but long enough to go a little deeper than the most omnipresent (which I suspect they will have heard, even if they don't realize they are all from the same four guys from the same 6 years).
Also, this is a great opportunity for a dialogue; your Indian millennial coworkers no doubt know a lot of music (classic or current) whose names you would greet with a blank stare. So make sure you learn from them as much as you teach.
posted by Homeboy Trouble at 12:10 PM on October 11, 2019 [5 favorites]
Which is a roundabout way of saying start with the #1 singles collection. The Beatles on Sullivan or their later albums were important landmarks at the time, but the idea of a screaming crazy fanbase for an artist or a really involved innovative studio presence in the creation of an album are so omnipresent that it's impossible today to appreciate them as something that somebody did first. But my god are those singles still great, and the compilation is excellent for these purposes; it's chronological so you can hear the growth of the band, and the 27 #1s is short enough that it's not a marathon, but long enough to go a little deeper than the most omnipresent (which I suspect they will have heard, even if they don't realize they are all from the same four guys from the same 6 years).
Also, this is a great opportunity for a dialogue; your Indian millennial coworkers no doubt know a lot of music (classic or current) whose names you would greet with a blank stare. So make sure you learn from them as much as you teach.
posted by Homeboy Trouble at 12:10 PM on October 11, 2019 [5 favorites]
Don’t assume they’re going to love or like or be impressed by the Beatles even if they hear them in the perfect contextualized way. Cometh the hour, cometh the music; but the hour goes again.
posted by clew at 12:14 PM on October 11, 2019 [9 favorites]
posted by clew at 12:14 PM on October 11, 2019 [9 favorites]
You could organize a viewing of the recent film Yesterday, which you can rent and stream from Amazon for 6 bucks.
It has an Indian English main character, a singer/guitarist who finds himself in a parallel world where the Beatles never existed so he gets to introduce the world to their music.
posted by w0mbat at 12:46 PM on October 11, 2019 [9 favorites]
It has an Indian English main character, a singer/guitarist who finds himself in a parallel world where the Beatles never existed so he gets to introduce the world to their music.
posted by w0mbat at 12:46 PM on October 11, 2019 [9 favorites]
I was born post-Beatles, and when I started paying attention to music, in my teens, it occurred to me that I'd been hearing them all my life; in ads, movies, and piped in to all kinds of public places.
I respect their music a lot, and enjoy nearly all I've heard, but I have found that some Beatles fans, rare ones, will get huffy because I didn't hear all the album tracks in order from their favorite album. Pro-tip: don't get caught up on making them listen to, say, SPLHCB from beginning to end-- just help them find the Beatles music they'll like. (Zeppelin fans are worse than Beatles fans in this respect. "What do you mean, you've never listened to Led Zeppelin II?")
And, this might be anathema to a more hardcore Beatles fan, but I really liked the movie based on the Beatles Musical "Across the Universe," which ginned up a narrative in which Jude (natch) comes over from Liverpool, falls in love with a girl named Lucy (natch), and they all have a bunch of late 60s adventures, including Vietnam, and a weird hippie caravan lead by Bono. Telling a love story through Beatles songs makes them, IMO, more approachable than a cold listening of someone else's love song in headphones in the back of a car. Like most musicals, the songs are all sung by the cast, all of whom did a credible job.
Also, maybe a reach, but "Echo in the Canyon" is hitting DVD right about now; it's about the Laurel Canyon music scene circa 1966-68; Mammas and the Pappas, Beach Boys, Byrds, Buffalo Springfield, etc. There's crossover with the Beatles, and some extended music sequences, which is about 2/3 documentary and 1/3 concert performance (by the Jakob Dylan-led "Echo in the Canyon Band," covering songs of the aforementioned groups. (And even if they don't like it, I bet you will.)
posted by Sunburnt at 12:52 PM on October 11, 2019 [2 favorites]
I respect their music a lot, and enjoy nearly all I've heard, but I have found that some Beatles fans, rare ones, will get huffy because I didn't hear all the album tracks in order from their favorite album. Pro-tip: don't get caught up on making them listen to, say, SPLHCB from beginning to end-- just help them find the Beatles music they'll like. (Zeppelin fans are worse than Beatles fans in this respect. "What do you mean, you've never listened to Led Zeppelin II?")
And, this might be anathema to a more hardcore Beatles fan, but I really liked the movie based on the Beatles Musical "Across the Universe," which ginned up a narrative in which Jude (natch) comes over from Liverpool, falls in love with a girl named Lucy (natch), and they all have a bunch of late 60s adventures, including Vietnam, and a weird hippie caravan lead by Bono. Telling a love story through Beatles songs makes them, IMO, more approachable than a cold listening of someone else's love song in headphones in the back of a car. Like most musicals, the songs are all sung by the cast, all of whom did a credible job.
Also, maybe a reach, but "Echo in the Canyon" is hitting DVD right about now; it's about the Laurel Canyon music scene circa 1966-68; Mammas and the Pappas, Beach Boys, Byrds, Buffalo Springfield, etc. There's crossover with the Beatles, and some extended music sequences, which is about 2/3 documentary and 1/3 concert performance (by the Jakob Dylan-led "Echo in the Canyon Band," covering songs of the aforementioned groups. (And even if they don't like it, I bet you will.)
posted by Sunburnt at 12:52 PM on October 11, 2019 [2 favorites]
Oh, 2 other things to remember:
1. Avoid the movies. Probably especially avoid “Help!”
2. For the Beatles specifically, most of their singles weren’t released on their albums, so it’s a kind of dual-track situation where you can listen to the albums, and they’re really good, but you’ll miss a lot of Really Big Hits when you do so. So they’re specifically a good candidate to play a greatest hits album, or individual singles.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 1:24 PM on October 11, 2019
1. Avoid the movies. Probably especially avoid “Help!”
2. For the Beatles specifically, most of their singles weren’t released on their albums, so it’s a kind of dual-track situation where you can listen to the albums, and they’re really good, but you’ll miss a lot of Really Big Hits when you do so. So they’re specifically a good candidate to play a greatest hits album, or individual singles.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 1:24 PM on October 11, 2019
So you specifically poopoo "Revolution #9" BUT let me give you this data point from my own tender youth--think like 10 years old--the first Beatles album I listened to was The White Album and I was 100% sold. I had heard all the early, super-poppy stuff that you'll find on the greatest hits comps and I was not impressed at all. I was like, this is the 1960s equivalent of the Backstreet Boys (which in 1999 was the gravest insult possible.) I think without context a hip twentysomething would not be blown away by "I Want To Hold Your Hand." But the White Album shows off the Beatles at their most courageous while still having plenty of down-to-earth accessible moments.
posted by zeusianfog at 1:25 PM on October 11, 2019 [1 favorite]
posted by zeusianfog at 1:25 PM on October 11, 2019 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: The conversation started with a sweet dessert, which contained jaggery. I learn from them as much as possible (they explained the dessert, where they got it, what it contains, etc.), and then threw in a pun, "Mick Jaggery"...giving it a long shot to resonate. None of them had heard of Mick Jagger. Or the Rolling Stones. Or the Beatles. Or Elvis. But they all knew who Michael Jackson was, and I gave them some insight into Sir Paul's relationship to Michael and who wound up owning their songs.
My assumption still holds that they've all heard a Beatles song, they probably just don't know who to attribute it to - but given that they are all Indian-born, there is also the possibility that they've never heard of them or any of their songs. I met a young woman in London who had never heard of the Beatles, and she had lived in London for 2 years after growing up in Turkey.
I was also considering using the Cirque du Soleil soundtrack to Love. I have 1, which is a good suggestion, and I never thought of the pre/post Shankar angle, which is why I love this site so much.
Thanks, all, keep the ideas coming. I will do it right.
posted by Chuffy at 1:35 PM on October 11, 2019 [1 favorite]
My assumption still holds that they've all heard a Beatles song, they probably just don't know who to attribute it to - but given that they are all Indian-born, there is also the possibility that they've never heard of them or any of their songs. I met a young woman in London who had never heard of the Beatles, and she had lived in London for 2 years after growing up in Turkey.
I was also considering using the Cirque du Soleil soundtrack to Love. I have 1, which is a good suggestion, and I never thought of the pre/post Shankar angle, which is why I love this site so much.
Thanks, all, keep the ideas coming. I will do it right.
posted by Chuffy at 1:35 PM on October 11, 2019 [1 favorite]
Beatles music is not yet an endangered language that has to be actively taught, to ensure it doesn't die out. It is still very much a part of contemporary culture. I think you should leave your colleagues to hear and discover it for themselves, randomly. That way, they'll create their own associations to the songs, rather than getting yours second-hand.
And I second Homeboy Trouble's suggestion: ask them to recommend music that might excite you. They haven't grown up in a musical vacuum, that's for certain.
posted by MinPin at 1:40 PM on October 11, 2019 [8 favorites]
And I second Homeboy Trouble's suggestion: ask them to recommend music that might excite you. They haven't grown up in a musical vacuum, that's for certain.
posted by MinPin at 1:40 PM on October 11, 2019 [8 favorites]
I faced this question last weekend from a ten year old. He saw the movie 'Yesterday' the day before, and wanted to know more, hear some songs. Being in the car, I could only go with full albums. I went with Rubber Soul.
Then he wanted to know more about John. I talked about his artistry, and also that he was the most political. "What does that mean, 'political'?" I said that he wanted laws to promote peace, and that he wanted people to work for peace. Then the boy asked why then he was shot, and my heart cracked.
So to answer your question: Rubber Soul. Not too early, not too late, everything catchy and easy. You don't want to start with their best (Revolver).
posted by Capt. Renault at 1:50 PM on October 11, 2019 [4 favorites]
Then he wanted to know more about John. I talked about his artistry, and also that he was the most political. "What does that mean, 'political'?" I said that he wanted laws to promote peace, and that he wanted people to work for peace. Then the boy asked why then he was shot, and my heart cracked.
So to answer your question: Rubber Soul. Not too early, not too late, everything catchy and easy. You don't want to start with their best (Revolver).
posted by Capt. Renault at 1:50 PM on October 11, 2019 [4 favorites]
My daughter is 16 and having a real moment with The Beatles this year. I believe The White Album was her gateway but I wouldn't be surprised if it was some weird midcentury memes for modern teens Instagram page that initially piqued her curiosity. If I can get any better information out of her I will post an update.
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:02 PM on October 11, 2019 [1 favorite]
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:02 PM on October 11, 2019 [1 favorite]
I'd start showing where such a musical creation story began in a soft way with a viewing of "Backbeat". Then the offer up the albums, if possible always with headphones as private event.
posted by Freedomboy at 2:32 PM on October 11, 2019
posted by Freedomboy at 2:32 PM on October 11, 2019
John said in an interview that Sean wasn't aware that he'd been a Beatle until the boy went to a friend's and saw Yellow Submarine.
posted by brujita at 5:40 PM on October 11, 2019
posted by brujita at 5:40 PM on October 11, 2019
As the daughter of a rabid Beatles fan who insists liking those mediocre white boys is somehow in my DNA... for the love of little green apples, don't insist they are Incredible Geniuses And If You Don't Understand Their Music You Are A Failure.
I've never listened to a full Beatles album, and very few songs, in part because I was so thoroughly put off by people insisting that this (to my Queen-loving, Freddy Mercury worshipping teenage and young adult self) square as fuck group of boys in bad haircuts were somehow the Greatest Ever, plus the incredible misogyny a lot of older dude fans especially have about Beatlemania. (Screaming teenage girls made your fave popular enough to do the fancy experimental shite from their later careers, deal.)
All of that to say... Honestly, just point them in the direction of one of the greatest hits albums and let the chips fall where they may.
posted by Tamanna at 7:01 PM on October 11, 2019 [4 favorites]
I've never listened to a full Beatles album, and very few songs, in part because I was so thoroughly put off by people insisting that this (to my Queen-loving, Freddy Mercury worshipping teenage and young adult self) square as fuck group of boys in bad haircuts were somehow the Greatest Ever, plus the incredible misogyny a lot of older dude fans especially have about Beatlemania. (Screaming teenage girls made your fave popular enough to do the fancy experimental shite from their later careers, deal.)
All of that to say... Honestly, just point them in the direction of one of the greatest hits albums and let the chips fall where they may.
posted by Tamanna at 7:01 PM on October 11, 2019 [4 favorites]
Wow. -1. 'Mediocre'. Huh...Your favorite band sucks?
I say post-acid: Sgt Pepper's, Magical Mystery Tour, Revolver, Abbey Road. Make a nice short playlist of your faves. Of course, these are all 'albums' and millennials hardly listen to full albums sequentially. If a tune is appreciated, listen to it in the context of the whole record.
posted by j_curiouser at 9:13 PM on October 11, 2019 [1 favorite]
I say post-acid: Sgt Pepper's, Magical Mystery Tour, Revolver, Abbey Road. Make a nice short playlist of your faves. Of course, these are all 'albums' and millennials hardly listen to full albums sequentially. If a tune is appreciated, listen to it in the context of the whole record.
posted by j_curiouser at 9:13 PM on October 11, 2019 [1 favorite]
Knowing more about their musical background and what they enjoy listening to might help you pick personally relevant gateway pieces.
posted by bunderful at 5:42 AM on October 12, 2019
posted by bunderful at 5:42 AM on October 12, 2019
They may well have a Hindustani or Carnatic classical music background. Definitely go via George Harrison's interest in Indian classical music and their trip to Rishikesh. Play them the songs they wrote there. Maybe play a few standalone songs (i.e. not on any album) with an Indian influence like The Inner Light. Show them the video footage of George being taught sitar by Ravi. Mention his work with the Hare Krishnas. I think they would know who prabhupada is. Then go right to the very beginning.
This is tricky because it's best to go through their work in chronological order. The Beatles are especially fantastic in chronological order because their story is amazing. It's the story and also how they completely absorbed the influences around them.
Do not start with Abbey Rd. It's too good. You cannot go anywhere from there and may as well give up. Only go to Abbey Rd when all other options have been exhausted. Never play Dizzy Miss Lizzy or any unnecessary songs from Help!
Are they musically technical? Please visit youtube to see Howard Goodall's analysis of their work. I cannot link properly from this phone, sorry.
posted by ihaveyourfoot at 7:09 AM on October 12, 2019
This is tricky because it's best to go through their work in chronological order. The Beatles are especially fantastic in chronological order because their story is amazing. It's the story and also how they completely absorbed the influences around them.
Do not start with Abbey Rd. It's too good. You cannot go anywhere from there and may as well give up. Only go to Abbey Rd when all other options have been exhausted. Never play Dizzy Miss Lizzy or any unnecessary songs from Help!
Are they musically technical? Please visit youtube to see Howard Goodall's analysis of their work. I cannot link properly from this phone, sorry.
posted by ihaveyourfoot at 7:09 AM on October 12, 2019
Start with the 1 greatest hits album. Has a little bit of everything. If they get into it, they can explore from there if they want to.
posted by sallybrown at 8:01 AM on October 12, 2019 [1 favorite]
posted by sallybrown at 8:01 AM on October 12, 2019 [1 favorite]
You have to distinguish the Beatles' innovation and influence -- which are indisputable -- from whether some particular person might enjoy their music. A person can't really appreciate their importance unless they can remember what pop music and pop culture were like before they appeared. Pop music and pop culture changed enormously in the few years 1963 -- 1967 and the Beatles led the charge. A lot of their influence was cultural, not musical at all.
For example their 'bad haircuts' -- the important thing was that they were the first celebrity men in mainstream western culture to have long hair in the 20th century. It is hard to believe now how shocking this was at the time. Men couldn't have long hair -- it just wasn't done! I remember editorials claiming it indicated the end of western civilization. But then it changed almost overnight - everyone imitated them, if you were in a rock band you had to have long hair, and it became an option for everyone.
This was just one aspect of a big shift in pop culture from encouragement of duty and conformity to permission for self-expression and hedonism, and the Beatles were in the vanguard of that. For those of us who remember it, it is difficult to separate the importance of all this from the quality (or lack of it) in the Beatles' music. But for young people now the Beatles' music doesn't have any of these connotations -- it has to stand on its own.
posted by JonJacky at 12:48 PM on October 12, 2019
For example their 'bad haircuts' -- the important thing was that they were the first celebrity men in mainstream western culture to have long hair in the 20th century. It is hard to believe now how shocking this was at the time. Men couldn't have long hair -- it just wasn't done! I remember editorials claiming it indicated the end of western civilization. But then it changed almost overnight - everyone imitated them, if you were in a rock band you had to have long hair, and it became an option for everyone.
This was just one aspect of a big shift in pop culture from encouragement of duty and conformity to permission for self-expression and hedonism, and the Beatles were in the vanguard of that. For those of us who remember it, it is difficult to separate the importance of all this from the quality (or lack of it) in the Beatles' music. But for young people now the Beatles' music doesn't have any of these connotations -- it has to stand on its own.
posted by JonJacky at 12:48 PM on October 12, 2019
I'm reminded of that "Science Shows Best Music Was When You Were Twelve" headline. But, since there seem to be a lot of Beatles-appreciators in the thread, am I the only old guy that thought that "1" kind of sucked because they remixed everything? Note: what I really wonder is did it really sound different or am I just really old and hearing-damaged?
posted by Gilgamesh's Chauffeur at 2:13 PM on October 12, 2019
posted by Gilgamesh's Chauffeur at 2:13 PM on October 12, 2019
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 11:42 AM on October 11, 2019 [1 favorite]