Is it the depression or is it just us?
March 6, 2016 5:25 PM
My boyfriend is depressed and I'm at a loss about how to talk to him about issues that have come up in our relationship without possibly sinking him farther into a funk. Please help me sort through my feelings and tell me if I need to have a reality check. Details inside.
If it helps, I'm 22F and he's 26M. We've been together for a few years now, from the same hometown and college. He's a sweet, smart, and funny guy. We moved to a far away city to start anew, and now I'm a full time student and he's working a job (that he hates). We both had trouble adjusting but we had each other as supports when our loved ones were miles and miles away.
Originally, he said he wanted to apply to med school. But a year passed and he still hadn't gone through the pre-reqs. I asked every once in a while but noticed the more I asked, the more he would withdraw--so I stopped. Eventually he told me that he wasn't sure what he wanted to do with his life, and I said that's fine, but what should we do to help him figure it out? I mean, I have access to career counseling because I'm a student, but he doesn't really have options.
Then I noticed that daily life activities were hard for him, like cleaning, eating or doing laundry. I couldn't go over to his house because it had started to look like a hoarder's house and there was black mold...everywhere. The only thing that made him clean was having his roommates guilt trip him, so the house is now clean. The laundry is still an issue, and he will now re-wear dirty clothes (EVEN THOUGH I have offered him my laundry, which is free, or even doing his laundry for him--but he refuses.)
Lastly, he has been down on his luck with his job. It's very low pay, even though he has a degree and experience, and it has horrible hours so his sleep schedule is awful. His bosses are manipulative. (There's a dream job of his that's opened up, but sadly he's too afraid to apply.) His current job is 1.5 hours away via public transport in a bad neighborhood. A month ago his car broke down. Because of this, I have to give him rides to work. I'm happy to do this...to an extent. He can't pay me back for gas money because that money is needed for his rent and food. That's ok. But his search for a car is not happening, and he says that he cannot get a car until he has enough money for a loan. I inherited my sister's old car, so I don't comment on what it's like to buy a new car.
All in all, he's landed squarely on depression. I made a doctor's appointment for him because he mentioned he was suicidal and they started him on medicine that lasts 2 weeks. The doctor asked him to make an appointment with a recommended therapist and then come back after his meds were done. The only barrier here is that his job has not given him his insurance information (although he does have insurance!) but he just WON'T ask for it because he's afraid it would bother his bosses.
I'm at my wit's end. I want to help my boyfriend as much as I can, but I feel like a mom. And I'm SURE he must think I'm a nag by now. I can understand not having all these things in place, but I get worried/anxious when he is not making an effort to help himself get better. (But couldn't this all be the depression at work??) Especially with the suicidal thoughts, I think about him all night and if I don't hear from him for a while, I'm afraid that he's gone.
We've talked about marriage and I wonder if these things will be a forever issue? "Forever issue" is probably not the right phrase, but it's been two years now and nothing has really changed for the better. I feel like I'm supposed to find the solution, although I try to reflect it back as "What can I do that would help you best?" And he doesn't really know. (He will solve some things, but in most ways I'm his only social support right now. Family is complicated on his side.) But I feel extremely guilty, especially when it could all be the depression and I'm just being negative and needy. I just don't know how to express my needs (perhaps the need to know if he has a plan of action to either get a not-soul-crushing job or a used car or do his laundry or what will we do with finances etc if we're married or when can we go on a date again?) when he has all this other important, harrowing stuff going on.
tl;dr please help
If it helps, I'm 22F and he's 26M. We've been together for a few years now, from the same hometown and college. He's a sweet, smart, and funny guy. We moved to a far away city to start anew, and now I'm a full time student and he's working a job (that he hates). We both had trouble adjusting but we had each other as supports when our loved ones were miles and miles away.
Originally, he said he wanted to apply to med school. But a year passed and he still hadn't gone through the pre-reqs. I asked every once in a while but noticed the more I asked, the more he would withdraw--so I stopped. Eventually he told me that he wasn't sure what he wanted to do with his life, and I said that's fine, but what should we do to help him figure it out? I mean, I have access to career counseling because I'm a student, but he doesn't really have options.
Then I noticed that daily life activities were hard for him, like cleaning, eating or doing laundry. I couldn't go over to his house because it had started to look like a hoarder's house and there was black mold...everywhere. The only thing that made him clean was having his roommates guilt trip him, so the house is now clean. The laundry is still an issue, and he will now re-wear dirty clothes (EVEN THOUGH I have offered him my laundry, which is free, or even doing his laundry for him--but he refuses.)
Lastly, he has been down on his luck with his job. It's very low pay, even though he has a degree and experience, and it has horrible hours so his sleep schedule is awful. His bosses are manipulative. (There's a dream job of his that's opened up, but sadly he's too afraid to apply.) His current job is 1.5 hours away via public transport in a bad neighborhood. A month ago his car broke down. Because of this, I have to give him rides to work. I'm happy to do this...to an extent. He can't pay me back for gas money because that money is needed for his rent and food. That's ok. But his search for a car is not happening, and he says that he cannot get a car until he has enough money for a loan. I inherited my sister's old car, so I don't comment on what it's like to buy a new car.
All in all, he's landed squarely on depression. I made a doctor's appointment for him because he mentioned he was suicidal and they started him on medicine that lasts 2 weeks. The doctor asked him to make an appointment with a recommended therapist and then come back after his meds were done. The only barrier here is that his job has not given him his insurance information (although he does have insurance!) but he just WON'T ask for it because he's afraid it would bother his bosses.
I'm at my wit's end. I want to help my boyfriend as much as I can, but I feel like a mom. And I'm SURE he must think I'm a nag by now. I can understand not having all these things in place, but I get worried/anxious when he is not making an effort to help himself get better. (But couldn't this all be the depression at work??) Especially with the suicidal thoughts, I think about him all night and if I don't hear from him for a while, I'm afraid that he's gone.
We've talked about marriage and I wonder if these things will be a forever issue? "Forever issue" is probably not the right phrase, but it's been two years now and nothing has really changed for the better. I feel like I'm supposed to find the solution, although I try to reflect it back as "What can I do that would help you best?" And he doesn't really know. (He will solve some things, but in most ways I'm his only social support right now. Family is complicated on his side.) But I feel extremely guilty, especially when it could all be the depression and I'm just being negative and needy. I just don't know how to express my needs (perhaps the need to know if he has a plan of action to either get a not-soul-crushing job or a used car or do his laundry or what will we do with finances etc if we're married or when can we go on a date again?) when he has all this other important, harrowing stuff going on.
tl;dr please help
It sounds like he's in a bad place, and has been for a while. How would you feel if things never got much better for him? Because for some people, that's the case. Depression may be manageable, or it can be largely solved, or not at all, and that's really not very predictable. So you have to ask yourself (I think) if you're happy enough in the relationship to take things as they are now, instead of hoping for a future where things will be better.
posted by xingcat at 5:47 PM on March 6, 2016
posted by xingcat at 5:47 PM on March 6, 2016
also, I don't think I made it too clear in my Ask, but how could I kindly talk to him about how I'm feeling without sending him into a spiral/what do I say? The words just don't come to me when I talk and I either just feel like crying or shut down in frustration. Thanks all, you're wonderful.
posted by socky bottoms at 5:55 PM on March 6, 2016
posted by socky bottoms at 5:55 PM on March 6, 2016
This is a crisis. A mental health crisis. It's not normal to live with mold or wear dirty clothes...
Hey. The mold might be causing a lot of these mental health issues. Can he move? Beside clothes that he can put through the dryer, he might consider junking or treating his possessions. I'm serious.
This is a crisis and your guy needs an intervention. The mold is not helping. I think you need to go with him to the doctor, see what more can be done.
Maybe the doctor's office can call his job's HR for his insurance info? Maybe you can get the name of the insurance company off his pay stub or tax info? Then you just call the insurance company and get his policy info.
You have to use your big girl words and take action. Stay strong. No, none of this is acceptable or normal. In the future, don't let anything like this drag on for two years. 2 months is acceptable. It's not nitpicking to speak up when someone starts sliding. Stay strong.
posted by jbenben at 6:04 PM on March 6, 2016
Hey. The mold might be causing a lot of these mental health issues. Can he move? Beside clothes that he can put through the dryer, he might consider junking or treating his possessions. I'm serious.
This is a crisis and your guy needs an intervention. The mold is not helping. I think you need to go with him to the doctor, see what more can be done.
Maybe the doctor's office can call his job's HR for his insurance info? Maybe you can get the name of the insurance company off his pay stub or tax info? Then you just call the insurance company and get his policy info.
You have to use your big girl words and take action. Stay strong. No, none of this is acceptable or normal. In the future, don't let anything like this drag on for two years. 2 months is acceptable. It's not nitpicking to speak up when someone starts sliding. Stay strong.
posted by jbenben at 6:04 PM on March 6, 2016
Telling my boyfriend "You need to get help for your depression because I cannot cope" is, in retrospect, one of the best relationship decisions I made in college.
posted by yarntheory at 6:23 PM on March 6, 2016
posted by yarntheory at 6:23 PM on March 6, 2016
Oh my god, I am so sorry for you both. Can you contact his parents or any of his family? I know it's complicated, but it seems like he really needs a bigger support network than just you right now. You can't do this all by yourself. It's brave of you to try, but you need backup. My ex-husband went through this before we divorced, and he had a complicated relationship with his parents too. They showed up, though, when it was clear his life was on the line. And their support was invaluable to him.
You are trying to doing all the right things, I can see that. But you know this is not your responsibility, so do what you need to do for yourself, and (I know this is super hard) remember that worrying about him is not going to help. You can't control anything about his situation, and the more deeply you realize that, the less awful this is going to be for you. I'm so sorry. I have been in that place and it is really tough. PM me if you want to talk.
posted by ananci at 8:34 PM on March 6, 2016
You are trying to doing all the right things, I can see that. But you know this is not your responsibility, so do what you need to do for yourself, and (I know this is super hard) remember that worrying about him is not going to help. You can't control anything about his situation, and the more deeply you realize that, the less awful this is going to be for you. I'm so sorry. I have been in that place and it is really tough. PM me if you want to talk.
posted by ananci at 8:34 PM on March 6, 2016
Telling my boyfriend "You need to get help for your depression because I cannot cope" is, in retrospect, one of the best relationship decisions I made in college.
I pretty much came here to say this.
I have watched several friends destroy themselves trying to carry the entire load for someone in situations like this. Like, the endpoint here is either a complete meltdown on your part, inpatient on his, or something else along those lines.
You need to not only have the "you need to do this right now" conversation, but the "i cannot stay if nothing changes" one.
"Not having untreated mental health issues" is a pretty standard and reasonable dealbreaker for your own mental health. Struggling with something and having a plan in place to deal with it that you're actively working through is a lot different from literally having to be pushed through each step and coming up with milquetoast excuses for inaction with even the tiniest things that would be positive or forward moves.
And i'm writing this as someone who has struggled with depression since forever, from a family of people who have depression and have struggled with it. And who has dated people struggling with it.
posted by emptythought at 8:58 PM on March 6, 2016
I pretty much came here to say this.
I have watched several friends destroy themselves trying to carry the entire load for someone in situations like this. Like, the endpoint here is either a complete meltdown on your part, inpatient on his, or something else along those lines.
You need to not only have the "you need to do this right now" conversation, but the "i cannot stay if nothing changes" one.
"Not having untreated mental health issues" is a pretty standard and reasonable dealbreaker for your own mental health. Struggling with something and having a plan in place to deal with it that you're actively working through is a lot different from literally having to be pushed through each step and coming up with milquetoast excuses for inaction with even the tiniest things that would be positive or forward moves.
And i'm writing this as someone who has struggled with depression since forever, from a family of people who have depression and have struggled with it. And who has dated people struggling with it.
posted by emptythought at 8:58 PM on March 6, 2016
I was in a position similar to you a few years ago. My boyfriend was really depressed and I wasn't sure what I should do about it. Turns out, he's now recovered (thanks to SSRIs and a job change) and we're married, and things are awesome. For us, it really was the depression (and, to own up to my side of things, my OCD, which is also much improved). But I realize that's not the case for every relationship, and I realize that not everyone with mental health issues improves. I feel very, very fortunate that my husband and I both have improved.
So, on the one hand, you're not married and you don't have to be his caregiver. You didn't sign up for that (yet). It's not bad or mean or selfish in any way if you decide that your own health and happiness requires separating from him now, even though a lot of cultural messages tell us that we're terrible people if we don't bend over backwards for the people around us. That's not true. It's also not true that the only way to help is to play mom, etc. Sometimes the best way to help, in the long run, is to leave. It's the whole put-on-your-oxygen-mask-before-helping-others thing.
On the other hand, I have to say that the few years after college were really rough for my husband and me, and pretty much all our acquaintances. Pretty much all of us were slogging through jobs we hated or slogging through advanced degrees we weren't sure would pay off in any sense of the term and trying to figure out who we were and what we were going to do with our lives, etc. For at least my husband and I, our 30s are so much better. So some of what you're going through (and what he's going through and what you're going through together) might just be the general unpleasantness of your 20s. It doesn't seem like an unlikely time for things like depression to crop up.
What really helped my husband (and me, for my OCD) was going to a psychiatrist and finding a permanent, daily med (in both our cases, SSRIs) that would help. It took some finagling for both of us to find the right med and the right dose, and that was no fun. But personally, I'd say that whole Wait-am-I-a-lab-rat? cycle was 100% worth it, given the level of recovery we've both had.
My husband was in much better shape than it sounds like your boyfriend is in - no suicidal ideation, fully able to take care of himself, no mold, etc. - and he took himself to a psychiatrist. For your guy, you might have to do some handholding or even girlfriendly ultimatums to get him in to see a psychiatrist. Talk therapy is also good. There are lots of other things you can do to help him when he's just in a low mood, like making choices so he doesn't have to, or cheerfully dragging him out of the house to activities you know he'd enjoy at least a little bit, or starting up an exercise routine and convincing him to join you. But at the point he's at now, and even at the point my husband was at then, it's really (in our experience) all about figuring out proper medication levels. Once those kick in, there's lots of non-med stuff that can help as an adjunct therapy, but at least for us, none of those would have worked even remotely without the baseline of meds.
So, I guess what I'm saying is, if he can get help and make progress, this is not a forever issue. This is a this-is-awful-but-will-get-better situation. The kicker, of course, is that you can't tell if he can get help and make progress, and you don't have a whole lot of control over it either. So you should probably take a look at how much your own health and happiness are affected here and whether you can reasonably keep up what you're doing given your own responsibilities and make a decision about the relationship based on that.
Since my husband was never suicidal, I'm not sure about the right approach there, but it seems like everything suddenly gets a lot more serious. You may need to tell him, for your own health and his safety, that he must check himself into a inpatient program or something - others may have better advice there.
And definitely see if you can increase the size of your guys' support network. We kept my husband's depression a secret for awhile, and that was definitely the roughest part. After I told a close friend, it got a lot easier, even just because I had someone to talk to when I had a rough day. On that note, feel free to MeMail me if you want to talk more!
posted by bananacabana at 9:07 PM on March 6, 2016
So, on the one hand, you're not married and you don't have to be his caregiver. You didn't sign up for that (yet). It's not bad or mean or selfish in any way if you decide that your own health and happiness requires separating from him now, even though a lot of cultural messages tell us that we're terrible people if we don't bend over backwards for the people around us. That's not true. It's also not true that the only way to help is to play mom, etc. Sometimes the best way to help, in the long run, is to leave. It's the whole put-on-your-oxygen-mask-before-helping-others thing.
On the other hand, I have to say that the few years after college were really rough for my husband and me, and pretty much all our acquaintances. Pretty much all of us were slogging through jobs we hated or slogging through advanced degrees we weren't sure would pay off in any sense of the term and trying to figure out who we were and what we were going to do with our lives, etc. For at least my husband and I, our 30s are so much better. So some of what you're going through (and what he's going through and what you're going through together) might just be the general unpleasantness of your 20s. It doesn't seem like an unlikely time for things like depression to crop up.
What really helped my husband (and me, for my OCD) was going to a psychiatrist and finding a permanent, daily med (in both our cases, SSRIs) that would help. It took some finagling for both of us to find the right med and the right dose, and that was no fun. But personally, I'd say that whole Wait-am-I-a-lab-rat? cycle was 100% worth it, given the level of recovery we've both had.
My husband was in much better shape than it sounds like your boyfriend is in - no suicidal ideation, fully able to take care of himself, no mold, etc. - and he took himself to a psychiatrist. For your guy, you might have to do some handholding or even girlfriendly ultimatums to get him in to see a psychiatrist. Talk therapy is also good. There are lots of other things you can do to help him when he's just in a low mood, like making choices so he doesn't have to, or cheerfully dragging him out of the house to activities you know he'd enjoy at least a little bit, or starting up an exercise routine and convincing him to join you. But at the point he's at now, and even at the point my husband was at then, it's really (in our experience) all about figuring out proper medication levels. Once those kick in, there's lots of non-med stuff that can help as an adjunct therapy, but at least for us, none of those would have worked even remotely without the baseline of meds.
So, I guess what I'm saying is, if he can get help and make progress, this is not a forever issue. This is a this-is-awful-but-will-get-better situation. The kicker, of course, is that you can't tell if he can get help and make progress, and you don't have a whole lot of control over it either. So you should probably take a look at how much your own health and happiness are affected here and whether you can reasonably keep up what you're doing given your own responsibilities and make a decision about the relationship based on that.
Since my husband was never suicidal, I'm not sure about the right approach there, but it seems like everything suddenly gets a lot more serious. You may need to tell him, for your own health and his safety, that he must check himself into a inpatient program or something - others may have better advice there.
And definitely see if you can increase the size of your guys' support network. We kept my husband's depression a secret for awhile, and that was definitely the roughest part. After I told a close friend, it got a lot easier, even just because I had someone to talk to when I had a rough day. On that note, feel free to MeMail me if you want to talk more!
posted by bananacabana at 9:07 PM on March 6, 2016
Depression medications usually take a few weeks to kick in. He JUST started on the meds! Yes, almost everything you describe could be due to depression. Lack of motivation and inability to do usual daily activities like self care are very likely to be depression symptoms. I think talk about whether this is "a forever issue", dumping him right away or making him go to an inpatient facility is premature - he's only been on his starting dose of his first med for a matter of days! Yes, he might need treatment for depression forever, but that's like needing treatment for high blood pressure forever: if you're on medication that works then no one will even know it was a problem.
If I were you, I would hold off on any major moves until you see how he does now that he's finally getting actual treatment for depression. He could be a whole different person if this starts working for him - and the good news is that depression is a very treatable disease.
Don't be his mom anymore. Don't nag, and leave the whole business about jobs and cars and stuff on the shelf for a few weeks at least. Tell him you are so glad he is finally getting treatment for depression, and that you think it's crucially important that he do this for his health. Maybe something like "I love you, and it's been hard for me to see you hurting. I'm proud that you're working your way through this and getting help." Honestly, I don't know if I'd tell him how you feel just yet - I'd suggest venting to someone else for now, because I'm not sure he can be the supportive listener you need while he's in the depths of depression. If he fails to do what he needs to do to get help - then you can either leave him, or try giving him the ultimatum.
posted by treehorn+bunny at 10:59 PM on March 6, 2016
If I were you, I would hold off on any major moves until you see how he does now that he's finally getting actual treatment for depression. He could be a whole different person if this starts working for him - and the good news is that depression is a very treatable disease.
Don't be his mom anymore. Don't nag, and leave the whole business about jobs and cars and stuff on the shelf for a few weeks at least. Tell him you are so glad he is finally getting treatment for depression, and that you think it's crucially important that he do this for his health. Maybe something like "I love you, and it's been hard for me to see you hurting. I'm proud that you're working your way through this and getting help." Honestly, I don't know if I'd tell him how you feel just yet - I'd suggest venting to someone else for now, because I'm not sure he can be the supportive listener you need while he's in the depths of depression. If he fails to do what he needs to do to get help - then you can either leave him, or try giving him the ultimatum.
posted by treehorn+bunny at 10:59 PM on March 6, 2016
I should add, importantly, though - if he says he is suicidal, don't make an appointment with someone. Call 911 because he needs an emergency mental health evaluation.
posted by treehorn+bunny at 11:01 PM on March 6, 2016
posted by treehorn+bunny at 11:01 PM on March 6, 2016
Maybe I can come at this from the opposite angle. I was once much the same person as your boyfriend. Not quite as bad, but let's put it this way - I know what mold looks like. At the time - just like your guy - I had a loving girlfriend who tried her best to help. She eventually gave up, very wisely. (Years later we became friends again, just for the record.)
Looking back on that, I would say that, if you love your man, do your utmost for him, but only so far as your own strength and resources allow. If at any point you feel you have to leave, do so without the slightest twinge of guilt: it's not your fault and you have your own life to live.
Specifically, be tough on him. It's OK to be a "nag". Nag him till he bleeds. Require him to do his part. You can mother him a bit, make phone calls on his behalf, all that, but make sure he's making steps independently of your efforts. Call him out if he's not, hold him to account. It's his responsibility to get better, no one else's, and certainly not yours. Never feel guilty.
Hope it all turns out well.
posted by Pechorin at 7:28 AM on March 7, 2016
Looking back on that, I would say that, if you love your man, do your utmost for him, but only so far as your own strength and resources allow. If at any point you feel you have to leave, do so without the slightest twinge of guilt: it's not your fault and you have your own life to live.
Specifically, be tough on him. It's OK to be a "nag". Nag him till he bleeds. Require him to do his part. You can mother him a bit, make phone calls on his behalf, all that, but make sure he's making steps independently of your efforts. Call him out if he's not, hold him to account. It's his responsibility to get better, no one else's, and certainly not yours. Never feel guilty.
Hope it all turns out well.
posted by Pechorin at 7:28 AM on March 7, 2016
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Do you have a therapist of your own? You might want to see one if not. They can help you figure out methods to use to carve out your own life, where you are not solely his caregiver. That helped me get some clarity about my own situation, and gave me the strength to figure out that I really did personally need to leave both of those situations.
You aren't being negative or needy. It is not needy to want to date an adult who has his shit together. It's not needy to want to date someone who has the vital life-skills to get their own shit together when it falls apart. That's a desire for a mature, healthy relationship - that is not needy or negative at all.
You should not be his sole source of social support. He could have friends of his own, or a therapist of his own. Family is only one type of social support, a girlfriend/boyfriend/partner is another type, but there are many different life roles that people can fill that are socially supportive. The fact that he does not have these other sources of support is sad but it is not your cross to bear.
posted by sockermom at 5:46 PM on March 6, 2016