buying a dishwasher

November 12, 2005 10:46 PM

We just bought a 1968 house with a 1968 dishwasher. Food is clinging to dishes, and it is clogging. After reading the manual, I can't figure out how to clean this thing out, and I'm ready to buy something newer that won't do this. I've been using the internets since I whenever the first browser came out (1994?) and I swear I can't find a site that gives good, multiple user reviews of dishwashers. I just want something that works well and isn't terribly loud for 3-400 bucks. It's been ten years, why is this so hard? And should I fix the old machine or get a new one?

Apologies for such a boring question. "My name is mecran01, and I beg strangers for help with buying appliances."

posted by mecran01 to Home & Garden (35 answers total)

When buying appliances I always use the Consumer Reports website - a small yearly fee, but worth it.
posted by LadyBonita at 10:54 PM on November 12, 2005

I bought a vacuum on their recommendation, a hoover windtunnel. It works, but it's a shoddy piece of crap. I subbed to their website too, for a while. They're good, but not inviolable. Still, this is something that should be on the web, darnit.
posted by mecran01 at 10:58 PM on November 12, 2005

Yeah, CR doesn't love the Dyson nearly as much as it should, based on my experiences :)

I would highly recommend a new dishwasher, versus fixing the old one: in the long run, you'll find it's more efficient with both water and power, as well as actual cleaning. Not to mention that it will enhance your home's resale value, even if that's not currently in your line of thinking. Furthermore, a thirty-five year old dishwasher will not just need to be fixed once, it will need to be fixed often.

I can't be of too much help pointing you toward a resource, since our own dishwasher-buying saga was a kind of special case, based on an even older kitchen with severe limitations. I would say start at Sears, and if that doesn't get you where you need to be, we ended up finding dishwasher nirvana at Best Buy.
posted by padraigin at 11:31 PM on November 12, 2005

Go with Consumer Reports. Yahoo has some info from Consumer Reports for free.

I'm surprised a 37-year-old dishwasher still works. Wow! I would suggest upgrading it. What is the deductible on your insurance if the current dishwasher floods and wrecks your flooring, cabinets, etc? Don't forget to consider your time, effort and stress. I'd say $300 to $500 is worth it. You can get a good Sears dishwasher, which is really just the Sears brand name put on a good model.

Also, old dishwashers don't have the mechanism that chops up food on dishes -- they may also struggle with pots and pans. In the old days, dishwashers were just an aid, not something people relied on to absolutely clean everything.
posted by acoutu at 11:35 PM on November 12, 2005

I'm by no means a plumber or even especially experienced in this area, but when I moved into my apartment the dishwasher was backing up and not cleaning anything well besides and I fixed everything to my continuing satisfaction by replacing the output hose (in my case, a line running to the garbage disposal). It seems like a natural choke point, and you'll likely have to buy some hose anyway to connect a new unit, so why not give it a shot? Because I don't know what I'm talking about, that's why. But if you dig anecdotal diagonses...
posted by moift at 12:07 AM on November 13, 2005

I've had the pleasure of installing two dishwashers in our last two houses, neither of which had a dishwasher. It's easy, because I could do it and I'm not really handy.

My wife picked the models, and she did all of her research on line. I believe she just went to manufacturer web sites, Sears.com, BestBuy.com, etc. and just compared models. She mad spreadsheets -- she loves that kind of detail (I'd ask her what she did, but she's sleeping).

We got ours from Sears. I would also recommend upgrading. Ours probably uses a fifth of the water that yours does, and uses less energy, to boot. I used a 20 year old dishwasher, and our new one is VASTLY superior to that one, which was in perfect working order.
posted by teece at 12:14 AM on November 13, 2005

Sears usually is very helpful when you go there, or they were for me, explaining all the differences between the models. Plus, since they have their own brand, they have practically every option you could want in a dishwasher if not physically on site, then special order. They were also helpful months after I bought it, when I had an issue.

Have you tried Epinions? They are somewhat limited in models that are reviewed, but I often find myself happier with products I've chosen based on reviews there than CR.

I agree about Consumer Reports, I'm thinking we bought the same crappy Hoover :) (which I did recently replace with a Dyson, which I recommend over and over)
posted by phox at 12:37 AM on November 13, 2005

A 1968 Camaro -- that you might want to fix. But a dishwasher?! Sheesh.

Sears is the place to go for kitchen and laundry appliances. Tons of choices, prices from top to bottom. Look for close-out specials (basically last year's model). Scan your Sunday newspaper, look for the sales. Wait until you can get some kind of "deal" like free financing, free delivery, rebate, etc.

For a dishwasher, I suggest electronic touch controls and "quiet" option. Oh... before you go shopping, make sure your under-counter height is the standard 34 inches.
posted by fuzzy_wuzzy at 12:53 AM on November 13, 2005

Go to Sears, tell the clerk you will spend no more than $400, and take whatever he recommends. It will have a warranty, will be efficient, and best of all new. You can't go wrong. This is precisely what Sears is all about.
posted by davidmsc at 1:01 AM on November 13, 2005

I haven't bought any dishwashers lately, but you can't go wrong by checking the different merchants websites. Some of them will compare the different models features for you. One thing I look for in my home appliances is the energy star rating or total power consumption. Another thing I always do is to look for the last years models since they're usually on sale. I don't mind buying a demonstration unit as long it comes complete and without any broken knobs or noticeable scratches or dents. These units may have a little dust on them, since they were never hooked up (they're practically brand new). I bought my last washer and dryer at Lowes.
posted by plokent at 1:36 AM on November 13, 2005

A couple years ago I was in the market for a new dishwasher and followed LadyBonita's advice. Consumer Reports listed a bunch of dishwashers, basically recommending a number of outrageously expensive models with outstanding performance and a couple price/performance leaders. I decided on a reasonably priced Maytag (looks like this model) and I couldn't be happier. Consumer Reports worked out well for me.
posted by sexymofo at 4:41 AM on November 13, 2005

Also keep in mind that there may be good deals on dishwashers during the day after Thanksgiving sales (assuming you're in the US). If you can brave the crowds, it might be a good time to hit up Sears, which as others have suggested is your best bet for finding a good one.
posted by schoolgirl report at 4:42 AM on November 13, 2005

Modern dishwashers are amazing. I have a Maytag something-or-other, a couple of years old... and you can dump practically anything into it and have it come out clean. You don't have to worry about prewashing, even if your dishes are going to sit several days before you hit Start. I've had very, very few things NOT come out clean.

BTW, Consumer Reports really is a good site. I bought both my microwave and my vacuum cleaner based on their reports... both Kenmore, and both are great. Oh, I also bought my Whirlpool washer/dryer based on their recommendation, and they have also been excellent.

CR isn't perfect, but they're the single best site I know for appliance reviews.
posted by Malor at 5:23 AM on November 13, 2005

OK, I was mistaken, the dishwasher *looks* like it was from 1968, but it's actually from the mid-80s. Still, something is clogged and no water is getting to the dishes now. But it is probably time for a new one anyway, and I covet the cleaning power of the newer machines. I think I am going to go for whichever name brand has a food grinder and perhaps add some extra sound insulation on my own. According to the above Yahoo link, the big three (Frigidaire/Maytag/Whirlpool/GE) make all of them under different brands. The only bit of useful info I was able to glean from review sites is that the Bosch models are really quiet.

I am still peeved that the promise of information disintermediation hasn't been extended to home appliances. I want a "tom's hardware" of large home machinery, oh mighty lazy web. Thanks all.
posted by mecran01 at 6:45 AM on November 13, 2005

Sears are Whirlpool just rebranded. Produced in the same factory on the same line, so shop both brands for price and be sure to get quiet mode as noted above.
posted by mss at 7:04 AM on November 13, 2005

(not to derail, but) Re: access to Consumer Reports. There's a good chance that your public library offers remote access to a database that has CR full-text. This could save you from paying twice for that info.
posted by ArcAm at 7:47 AM on November 13, 2005

Unless they have some exclusive feature you must have stay away from maytag, replacement parts are always at least 50% more than anybody elses and they aren't sigificantly better. Stainless liners are much more durable than plastic, I'd buy the cheapest whirlpool unit with a stainless liner you can find.

schoolgirl report writes "Also keep in mind that there may be good deals on dishwashers during the day after Thanksgiving sales (assuming you're in the US). If you can brave the crowds, it might be a good time to hit up Sears,"

If you use your Sears card Sears will match the lowest price in the next 30 days on any white good. The clerk will charge you the sticker price when you buy your dishwasher and then enter a credit on the sale day for the difference. At least they will here in Canada.
posted by Mitheral at 7:48 AM on November 13, 2005

ask.metafilter: the promise of the web, fulfilled on a very small scale. :)
posted by mecran01 at 8:02 AM on November 13, 2005

When I went through this 5 years ago, I looked in consumer reports, saw that #2 was a sears kenmore for about $500 and #1 was about $900. I went to sears, actually to buy a cheaper model (same as the consumer reports model, but less options), and found the more expensive model on sale for the same price (~350-400). Bought it and loved it. Almost never used the pots and pans wash, everything came out great..Had to convince guests that wanted to help with the dishes not to pre-rinse (No, really, just put it in!).
posted by 445supermag at 8:04 AM on November 13, 2005

Whatever you get, you want to get professional installation.

I recently figured that I could handle installing a dishwasher on my own -- I'm pretty smart and handy. I lost most of a weekend to the installation and probably spent just as much money between the four trips to Home Depot and the various wire caps, socket wrenches, and plumbing pieces that I did not own.

Most stores offer free installation and delivery at a certain price point.

2005 dishwashers aren't heavy and could fit in the back of my sporty wagon, but the 1960s-era dishwasher that was in my house took two people to carry to the curb.
posted by LeiaS at 8:33 AM on November 13, 2005

I replaced a ~20 year-old machine a year or so ago. I went with a Maytag that was in the $400 neighborhood. I don't know if it's the Maytag or newer dishwashers in general but I'm pretty sure they are magical.
posted by Carbolic at 11:04 AM on November 13, 2005

Spend just a little more money and get a Bosch. According to Sears's site, you can get one on sale this week for $600. Very quiet (53 dB), very efficient (estimated water heater costs $24/Yr). Cheap dishwashers are neither.

Over the course of 10 years, $600 is $5 per month. You might save that kind of money on reduced water costs. Oh, and check your local power and water providers. They might give you a rebate for buying a more efficient unit.
posted by ilsa at 12:57 PM on November 13, 2005

Whatever brand you get, make sure it can be serviced locally. Sears wants you to buy the ripoff extended warranty, and charges a lot to visit. They came to look at my freezer, which could have been avoided if the person on the phone had bothered, and wanted to charge a 2nd fee to answer a 2nd question, because that's how they do things.

If there's a Lowe's near you, they often have dinged models, or ones that have been superseded by the newer color. They are often willing to bargain, cause they always need floor space.
posted by theora55 at 1:48 PM on November 13, 2005

Go new. It will clean better, be quieter and use less energy. Your library will have recent Consumer Reports for research. We recently spent $$$ on a Bosch. Nice, but a GE at half the price would be almost as nice. The amount saved in marital counseling, however, far outweighs the price difference.
posted by caddis at 1:56 PM on November 13, 2005

If you spend anytime at all in your kitchen, go with the Bosch or Miele. We have a big open floor-plan kitchen, dining, living room and the Bosch can run at any point throughout the evening without interrupting a chat, TV time, a phone call, relaxing, cuddling, reading the paper, whatever. It's so quiet that we sometimes open it mid-cycle because you can barely hear it. Seriously. If you just need to do the dishes, go with something slightly cheaper and it'll still be like heaven compared to that thing which probably whirrs, shakes, and boogies before finally giving you half-smeared dishes.
posted by barnone at 2:38 PM on November 13, 2005

a wise man you are, caddis. i salute you.
posted by five fresh fish at 4:44 PM on November 13, 2005

I see two people have recommended Bosch washers. I don't know about now, but the consumer reports I read some years ago rated them the absolute worst for getting dishes clean. They were the quietest though. Some friends bought a house with a bosch and gave up on using it. The dishes had to be nearly clean before they were put in. But it was quiet. Maybe things have changed, but I would research very carefully before buying one (plus they're twice as expensive).
posted by 445supermag at 5:26 PM on November 13, 2005

I don't know about other Bosches, but ours (SHU66) is reasonably quiet, not silent, but some of that noise probably comes from a less than optimal installation into the cabinets, yet cleans extremely well, despite putting the dishes in with dried and cooked on proteinacious soil. Even dishes packed closely together get clean. I do not care for the rack. Too bad you can't bring your dishes into the store to do an experimental loading.
posted by caddis at 7:02 PM on November 13, 2005

Why can't you bring your dishes to the store to do an experimental loading?
posted by five fresh fish at 7:57 PM on November 13, 2005

For what it's worth, I had equal performance (and looks) from the Frigidaire unit for $350 I bought in my old house a few years ago, compared to the new $500 Maytag unit I have now.

Oh, and the Frigidaire unit was quieter. Much.

Don't know if you're keeping your house long term or not, but making sure the dishwasher matches the rest of the appliances will help when you decide to sell. Black oven? Get a black dishwasher. This kind of thing, apparently, matters to home buyers.

You'll pay a hair more for stainless steel, but it's worth it, IMHO.
posted by TeamBilly at 7:38 AM on November 14, 2005

Don't wait. A twenty-year-old dishwasher is a ticking time-bomb, because you can get slow leaks that can put a lot of water (over time) under the floor. (And no, you wouldn't want to use your homeowner's insurance for this - it's a water-related claim, which is the fastest way to have your insurance company decide that they no longer want to insure you because of potential mold problems.)

And don't invest any money repairing something that is far louder and far less efficient than anything you can buy today.

Also, the nice thing about paying for installation (besides having it done professionally) is that they'll haul away your old dishwasher as part of the process.

And if you go to Sears, and don't have a credit card, they'll typically offer you a "come-on" of a one-time 10 or 15 percent off whatever you buy that day (and sometimes even no interest for the first 12 months). So a $400 dishwasher would be $40 or $60 cheaper. [I'm not a big fan of going in debt, so I also suggest paying off the credit card balance before interest starts accruing, and cancelling it in a year or so if you have a lot of other cards.]
posted by WestCoaster at 12:55 PM on November 14, 2005

Yeah, I had no problem getting Sears (or other major retailers) to give me 10% off when I asked.

BTW, ask your real estate agent if they have any arrangements with appliance/furniture stores. We were given a certificate entitling us to buy at contractor rates at a major store. We saved about 30%.
posted by acoutu at 6:39 PM on November 14, 2005

Thanks all, this was a great thread.

Here's what happened: (because there are few things more interesting than the conclusion of a story about appliance purchasing):

1. an appointment canceled, so I found the newest consumer reports I could get (2004) and read the reviews. Bosch and Kitchenaid were rated the highest, but whirlpool was in the running and more affordable.

2. With model numbers in hand, I went to the scratch and dent appliance outlet (RC Willey's)

3. Found the 2005 equivalent of the highest rated whirlpool, which, as mentioned, has the best reliability rating

4. For some reason the sales guy dropped the $400 price ($570 list) to $360 when I showed the slightest bit of hesitation.

5. Paid a third part $80 for the install, which included delivery

It should show up tomorrow. Housework is a *big* issue in our house, so this is totally worth it. I'll report back on the noise level, but I was also thinking that any number of automotive soundproofing products (brown bread) etc. used by the thumper crowd might help if it was too noisy.
posted by mecran01 at 10:16 PM on November 14, 2005

"paid a third party"

Dishwasher is missing one door spring, which will be installed today. Washes dishes great. In fact, we washed an old cookie sheet and it cleaned off some of the accumulated black gunk.
posted by craniac at 6:39 AM on November 16, 2005

Glad it worked out so well for you.

One thing I've found is that you have to be more careful about what you put in the dishwasher these days. The modern detergents are extremely caustic. It used to be the temperatures that were the biggest problem, but nowadays it's the super-concentrated detergent.

Wouldn't surprise me if that stuff would strip paint. :)
posted by Malor at 2:44 PM on November 19, 2005