American Shibboleth
September 29, 2013 7:19 AM Subscribe
With the global saturation of American culture I've gotten to wondering about a question relating to American identity that is surprisingly difficult to answer well, are there any Shibboleths that Americans today could use that would reasonably identify other Americans while also excluding non-Americans? During WWII GI's would quiz suspicious soldiers claiming to be American on baseball knowledge, as the sport gets more popular elsewhere and less popular in the US, is there anything left that Americans today could use? What would be culturally ubiquitous enough to reach everyone in the US without also reaching the world?
For example, the ability to answer questions about Mr. Rogers neighborhood, such who King Friday XIII is, would be sensitive for detecting Americans as both PBS and Mr. Rogers are ubiquitous across the 50 states, yet at the same time specific to Americans as neither are really very culturally relevant elsewhere.
Football is also obvious, and excellently specific, but not necessarily so sensitive to less sport oriented Americans or those who live in places dominated by college ball or basketball.
Bonus points for not forgetting to include more than just middle class white Americans and even more for excluding Canadians.
For example, the ability to answer questions about Mr. Rogers neighborhood, such who King Friday XIII is, would be sensitive for detecting Americans as both PBS and Mr. Rogers are ubiquitous across the 50 states, yet at the same time specific to Americans as neither are really very culturally relevant elsewhere.
Football is also obvious, and excellently specific, but not necessarily so sensitive to less sport oriented Americans or those who live in places dominated by college ball or basketball.
Bonus points for not forgetting to include more than just middle class white Americans and even more for excluding Canadians.
The ability to make s'mores and a correct PB and J is something some Europeans have vague theoretical knowledge over but often no practical knowledge.
Camp songs, I feel like? I've been to international scout jamborees and there's some overlap but not a lot.
posted by jetlagaddict at 7:26 AM on September 29, 2013
Camp songs, I feel like? I've been to international scout jamborees and there's some overlap but not a lot.
posted by jetlagaddict at 7:26 AM on September 29, 2013
Some Prom related thing, I would guess. It's a mystery to me. (but of course, there are many movies about it).
posted by dhruva at 7:28 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by dhruva at 7:28 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
It depends on the age group of people you are talking about... I think if you were trying to distinguish among slightly older people, you could ask some past political question that Americans would remember but no non-Americans would by that time. Like, who was Ronald Reagan's vice president. Do you think many non-Americans would know that without looking it up?
Of course, I say "slightly older" people because I am pretty sure many of your typical 18-22 year old soldiers today might not know that either.
posted by raspberrE at 7:29 AM on September 29, 2013
Of course, I say "slightly older" people because I am pretty sure many of your typical 18-22 year old soldiers today might not know that either.
posted by raspberrE at 7:29 AM on September 29, 2013
Best answer: What temperature is it out today?
What temperature do you cook chicken at?
I'm a USian and I've used the metric system heavily at work but find it difficult to give temperatures in celsius for the more mundane things. In the UK, back when I lived there in the late 80s, stove temperatures were sometimes measured in some mysterious system that referred to things as "Gas mark 3"
posted by sciencegeek at 7:30 AM on September 29, 2013 [15 favorites]
What temperature do you cook chicken at?
I'm a USian and I've used the metric system heavily at work but find it difficult to give temperatures in celsius for the more mundane things. In the UK, back when I lived there in the late 80s, stove temperatures were sometimes measured in some mysterious system that referred to things as "Gas mark 3"
posted by sciencegeek at 7:30 AM on September 29, 2013 [15 favorites]
Best answer: College sport is probably better for this particular purpose than the professional leagues. It doesn't really travel unless it's in Americans' cultural luggage.
"How do you pronounce 'Hyundai'?" gets you some of the way in the English-speaking world, but lumps the US in with Canadians.
posted by holgate at 7:34 AM on September 29, 2013
"How do you pronounce 'Hyundai'?" gets you some of the way in the English-speaking world, but lumps the US in with Canadians.
posted by holgate at 7:34 AM on September 29, 2013
"What is the second amendment?"
posted by sciencegeek at 7:35 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by sciencegeek at 7:35 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
Seconding the date. The US is nearly the only country to use the middle-endian date format.
posted by Metroid Baby at 7:38 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Metroid Baby at 7:38 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Best answer: What typically goes on top of green bean and sweet potato casseroles, respectively, at Thanksgiving?
posted by argonauta at 7:40 AM on September 29, 2013 [15 favorites]
posted by argonauta at 7:40 AM on September 29, 2013 [15 favorites]
Is pumpkin a sweet or a savoury?
Is the entree your first or second course of a meal?
posted by goshling at 7:42 AM on September 29, 2013
Is the entree your first or second course of a meal?
posted by goshling at 7:42 AM on September 29, 2013
Best answer: A couple book examples:
"Where's Waldo?" (US/Canada) is "Where's Wally?" everywhere else.
The first Harry Potter book/movie is called Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone everywhere except the US.
posted by Metroid Baby at 7:45 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
"Where's Waldo?" (US/Canada) is "Where's Wally?" everywhere else.
The first Harry Potter book/movie is called Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone everywhere except the US.
posted by Metroid Baby at 7:45 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Those baseball questions worked because WWII soldiers were more homogenous than the general population, and because the US was more of a monoculture in those days than it is now. It's going to be a challenge to come up with something that works as well for the 21st-century general public.
That said, stuff about non-metric measurement seems like an area with potential.
posted by box at 7:46 AM on September 29, 2013 [4 favorites]
That said, stuff about non-metric measurement seems like an area with potential.
posted by box at 7:46 AM on September 29, 2013 [4 favorites]
Flavours would indeed weed out Canadians; the US has wayyyy more flavours of everything. Doritos US vs Canada for example.
posted by kmennie at 7:59 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by kmennie at 7:59 AM on September 29, 2013
Best answer: Oh, forgot the obvious-- health insurance lingo and handling medical bills...
posted by jetlagaddict at 8:01 AM on September 29, 2013 [9 favorites]
posted by jetlagaddict at 8:01 AM on September 29, 2013 [9 favorites]
Flavours would indeed weed out Canadians....
I wonder if simply asking people to spell "flavor" or "color" or the like may also work.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:01 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
I wonder if simply asking people to spell "flavor" or "color" or the like may also work.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:01 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
As an Aussie that now lives in the US some suggestions are.
Ask them to tell you how they serve sweet potatoes. If it's smothered in brown sugar with optional marshmallows or as a sweet side dish they are probably from the US.
Serve them fruit salad with a meal, just put it on the table with all the main course/entree food, do they put it in a salad bowl and eat it with the main meal or assume it's a dessert?
Ask them the date. If they do the date as mm/dd/yyyy they are either from the US or Belize (the only countries that do dates that way). It is easy to try to fake doing it another way, but even after 4 years I have to stop and think about how I write the date every single time.
Ask them the temperature in relation to weather, I know a few people that can use metric for cooking, but would still have no idea how to dress for a 24C day. My very insular FIL is great at metric measurements and weights as he is a doctor, but still couldn't believe we used Dollars in Australia too, so metric distances etc might not catch all Yanks out, though it would most likely throw the less educated.
Take them out for dinner, do they tip even average service?
How they hold their forks and knives and cut their food. They do a lot of swapping forks and knives from hand to hand to cut and cut up a lot of food at once, and then swap hands to get the food to their mouths.
Do they have trouble making change in another currency? While Canadians also use quarters it would at least narrow them down to North American.
posted by wwax at 8:02 AM on September 29, 2013
Ask them to tell you how they serve sweet potatoes. If it's smothered in brown sugar with optional marshmallows or as a sweet side dish they are probably from the US.
Serve them fruit salad with a meal, just put it on the table with all the main course/entree food, do they put it in a salad bowl and eat it with the main meal or assume it's a dessert?
Ask them the date. If they do the date as mm/dd/yyyy they are either from the US or Belize (the only countries that do dates that way). It is easy to try to fake doing it another way, but even after 4 years I have to stop and think about how I write the date every single time.
Ask them the temperature in relation to weather, I know a few people that can use metric for cooking, but would still have no idea how to dress for a 24C day. My very insular FIL is great at metric measurements and weights as he is a doctor, but still couldn't believe we used Dollars in Australia too, so metric distances etc might not catch all Yanks out, though it would most likely throw the less educated.
Take them out for dinner, do they tip even average service?
How they hold their forks and knives and cut their food. They do a lot of swapping forks and knives from hand to hand to cut and cut up a lot of food at once, and then swap hands to get the food to their mouths.
Do they have trouble making change in another currency? While Canadians also use quarters it would at least narrow them down to North American.
posted by wwax at 8:02 AM on September 29, 2013
I also like the metric questions. What temperature does water freeze? (Someone who grew up using Celsius would say 0 degrees; an American who grew up with Fahrenheit measurements would say 32.)
posted by elizeh at 8:02 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by elizeh at 8:02 AM on September 29, 2013
To the flavor or color points, I think the question is an answer that only Americans can answer the American way, not simply something that Americans do differently from everyone else. I think it's well known that Americans spell color and flavor differently.
posted by telegraph at 8:02 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by telegraph at 8:02 AM on September 29, 2013
"what favors do Doritos come in?"
What typically goes on top of green bean and sweet potato casseroles, respectively, at Thanksgiving?
I know these are supposed to be national customs, but I (born and bred in the U S of A) have no idea what flavors Doritos come in, and I have never been to a Thanksgiving with green bean casserole. In fact, I think the green bean casserole is partly regional. When my friend moved from Philly to Idaho and was asked to bring green bean casserole to her first Thanksgiving there, she made sauteed green beans with almonds and was aware that she had done it wrong by the polite but slightly detectable dismay her dish produced. I'm sure there are people in Philly who also made whatever the traditional green bean casserole is said to be, but it wasn't necessarily expected to be at every Thanksgiving table in the city. THen again, maybe not in Idaho either, outside the group she found herself invited with.
The problem with trying to find a piece of "American" knowledge is really not that American culture has spread, so much as the idea of "America" as a unified culture is not really going to work. Americans have joined the Taliban. They might know all about Doritos, though.
posted by third rail at 8:02 AM on September 29, 2013 [7 favorites]
What typically goes on top of green bean and sweet potato casseroles, respectively, at Thanksgiving?
I know these are supposed to be national customs, but I (born and bred in the U S of A) have no idea what flavors Doritos come in, and I have never been to a Thanksgiving with green bean casserole. In fact, I think the green bean casserole is partly regional. When my friend moved from Philly to Idaho and was asked to bring green bean casserole to her first Thanksgiving there, she made sauteed green beans with almonds and was aware that she had done it wrong by the polite but slightly detectable dismay her dish produced. I'm sure there are people in Philly who also made whatever the traditional green bean casserole is said to be, but it wasn't necessarily expected to be at every Thanksgiving table in the city. THen again, maybe not in Idaho either, outside the group she found herself invited with.
The problem with trying to find a piece of "American" knowledge is really not that American culture has spread, so much as the idea of "America" as a unified culture is not really going to work. Americans have joined the Taliban. They might know all about Doritos, though.
posted by third rail at 8:02 AM on September 29, 2013 [7 favorites]
Best answer: I have, for years, been running an informal survey that I like to call, "The American Childhood Test." The survey has only one question: "When you were a kid, with whom did you watch The Price is Right?" I have never had a person who spent a couple of years in the US before the age of 10 tell me that they didn't watch The Price is Right, much less that they didn't know what it was. And everyone has a story of sitting down to watch it with a grandparent, an aunt, a mom, a babysitter. It was apparently a way that immigrants used to acclimate themselves to the country, since it would teach you how much was usual to pay for laundry soap (or a dune buggy, if you were ever in the market for a dune buggy). A few foreigners have heard of the show, and some short-term visitors have even seen it a few times, but truly understanding it and watching it regularly is reserved for people who spent their childhoods in America. So, I would ask your respondents a series of detailed questions about The Price is Right.
posted by decathecting at 8:03 AM on September 29, 2013 [22 favorites]
posted by decathecting at 8:03 AM on September 29, 2013 [22 favorites]
A few foreigners have heard of the show, and some short-term visitors have even seen it a few times, but truly understanding it and watching it regularly is reserved for people who spent their childhoods in America.
Or Canada.
A lot of these questions will catch Canadians as well, especially Canadians who are trying to trick you into believing they're American (as I assume they would from the thrust of the question). I cook in Fahrenheit and don't have much trouble using either C or F for weather. Actually I'm not sure any of these questions are general knowledge enough that you can assume all Americans know it with no regional variations but country-specific enough that people pretending to be American, particularly Canadians who grew up with US tv, would generally not know it.
posted by jeather at 8:11 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
Or Canada.
A lot of these questions will catch Canadians as well, especially Canadians who are trying to trick you into believing they're American (as I assume they would from the thrust of the question). I cook in Fahrenheit and don't have much trouble using either C or F for weather. Actually I'm not sure any of these questions are general knowledge enough that you can assume all Americans know it with no regional variations but country-specific enough that people pretending to be American, particularly Canadians who grew up with US tv, would generally not know it.
posted by jeather at 8:11 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
The Price Is Right has had localised versions in the UK & Australia.
posted by goshling at 8:12 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by goshling at 8:12 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
The Price is Right was a regular show on Australian Television all through my childhood.
posted by wwax at 8:12 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by wwax at 8:12 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
Best answer: Where does Oscar the Grouch live? (I never watched The Price Is Right.) Under what circumstances would Johnny Carson's sidekick ring a random person's doorbell?
posted by headnsouth at 8:15 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
posted by headnsouth at 8:15 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
Sesame Street has been shown all over the world since the early 1970's & still is. I'll shut up about TV now, but you can pretty much just assume that anyone in an English speaking country is familiar with most popular US TV shows.
posted by goshling at 8:18 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by goshling at 8:18 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
If the person is old enough: Who laughed at Chuckles the Clown's funeral?
"A little song, a little dance..."
posted by Fortran at 8:20 AM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
"A little song, a little dance..."
posted by Fortran at 8:20 AM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
“What do you do with the tassel on your mortar board after collecting your high-school diploma?”
You'd probably have to ask another question to filter out Canadians (maybe along temperature/Gretzky/French words for breakfast cereal ingredients), but the whole thing around graduation from high school is not universal. As an outsider, it took me thirty years of watching dance/teen movies to learn about the tassel thing.
The sweet things on the main course plate etiquette is another one. Srsly; sweet roll on the side of my baked chicken, WHAT IS YOUR PURPOSE?
posted by scruss at 8:23 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
You'd probably have to ask another question to filter out Canadians (maybe along temperature/Gretzky/French words for breakfast cereal ingredients), but the whole thing around graduation from high school is not universal. As an outsider, it took me thirty years of watching dance/teen movies to learn about the tassel thing.
The sweet things on the main course plate etiquette is another one. Srsly; sweet roll on the side of my baked chicken, WHAT IS YOUR PURPOSE?
posted by scruss at 8:23 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Best answer: If you enter a building and climb a flight of stairs, you are either on the second floor, or the first.
posted by Jacen at 8:28 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
posted by Jacen at 8:28 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
Ask them the last letter in the alphabet. Americans say zee while others, including dastardly Canadians, say zed.
posted by graymouser at 8:29 AM on September 29, 2013 [12 favorites]
posted by graymouser at 8:29 AM on September 29, 2013 [12 favorites]
Given the season: "What does pumpkin taste like?" I'm guessing to many USAians, "pumpkin" tastes like pumpkin pie spices.
Of course, it's possible the USAian need for pumpkin-flavor-everything at this time of year has spread to Canada. If so, I apologize Canada.
posted by Fortran at 8:31 AM on September 29, 2013
Of course, it's possible the USAian need for pumpkin-flavor-everything at this time of year has spread to Canada. If so, I apologize Canada.
posted by Fortran at 8:31 AM on September 29, 2013
What is this percentage: 0.7 (U.S.=zero point seven, elsewhere=naught point seven).
posted by headnsouth at 8:33 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by headnsouth at 8:33 AM on September 29, 2013
A surprisingly large number of Europeans I meet assume that an apple pie is just a kind of apple cake (but the Brits know the difference, so I assume people living in former British colonies also know the difference).
Other things I've noticed non-Americans don't know:
Why do we celebrate Thanksgiving? What do you eat at Thanksgiving other than turkey?
What are the words to the Pledge of Allegiance?
Geography things that aren't just state names and capitals: where are the Rocky Mountains? Which ones are higher: the Appalachian Mountains or the Rockies? Which states belong to the Midwest? How long do you think it would take to drive across Texas (not that all Americans know that, but non-Americans tend to underestimate the distances involved in the U.S.)?
Name all of the characters from Sesame Street (they're different in other countries). Not just King Friday, but: who is Mr. Rogers? Who is Levar Burton?
Why is the 2nd Amendment so important to people? Why are so many people in the U.S. against publich health care? (again, these are questions that a lot of Americans can at least guess at even if they don't agree with the answer; everyone else in the world just seems baffled by both situations).
Do middle class people use the bus in the U.S.? If you live in a suburb in the U.S., how far away is the nearest bus stop? (I tell friends that in my parent's new neighborhood it takes 15 minutes to drive to the nearest bus stop, and they assume that means my parents have moved way out into the country, not to a typical suburb).
Why do Americans celebrate Black History Month?
posted by colfax at 8:33 AM on September 29, 2013
Other things I've noticed non-Americans don't know:
Why do we celebrate Thanksgiving? What do you eat at Thanksgiving other than turkey?
What are the words to the Pledge of Allegiance?
Geography things that aren't just state names and capitals: where are the Rocky Mountains? Which ones are higher: the Appalachian Mountains or the Rockies? Which states belong to the Midwest? How long do you think it would take to drive across Texas (not that all Americans know that, but non-Americans tend to underestimate the distances involved in the U.S.)?
Name all of the characters from Sesame Street (they're different in other countries). Not just King Friday, but: who is Mr. Rogers? Who is Levar Burton?
Why is the 2nd Amendment so important to people? Why are so many people in the U.S. against publich health care? (again, these are questions that a lot of Americans can at least guess at even if they don't agree with the answer; everyone else in the world just seems baffled by both situations).
Do middle class people use the bus in the U.S.? If you live in a suburb in the U.S., how far away is the nearest bus stop? (I tell friends that in my parent's new neighborhood it takes 15 minutes to drive to the nearest bus stop, and they assume that means my parents have moved way out into the country, not to a typical suburb).
Why do Americans celebrate Black History Month?
posted by colfax at 8:33 AM on September 29, 2013
If they do the date as mm/dd/yyyy they are either from the US or Belize (the only countries that do dates that way).
Canada also does it this way sometimes, and thermostats and ovens frequently show °F instead of °C.
posted by one more dead town's last parade at 8:33 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Canada also does it this way sometimes, and thermostats and ovens frequently show °F instead of °C.
posted by one more dead town's last parade at 8:33 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
"How do you pronounce 'Hyundai'?" gets you some of the way in the English-speaking world, but lumps the US in with Canadians.
Separate the Canadians out by asking how they pronounce "Mazda."
posted by one more dead town's last parade at 8:35 AM on September 29, 2013
Separate the Canadians out by asking how they pronounce "Mazda."
posted by one more dead town's last parade at 8:35 AM on September 29, 2013
Best answer: Alas, I think "how much do you pay for your health plan" would be the best. Someone non-American may have some sort of vague knowledge that it's not wholly or partially state subsidized, but this question asked of an American citizen will likely start a fight which will easily brand them as one of us.
posted by elizardbits at 8:37 AM on September 29, 2013 [10 favorites]
posted by elizardbits at 8:37 AM on September 29, 2013 [10 favorites]
Best answer: "You go to the store to buy milk. How much do you buy?" Would anyone save from the US say "a gallon" or "a quart"? (I guess there's still Burma and Liberia...)
posted by Fortran at 8:37 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
posted by Fortran at 8:37 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
Best answer: What kind of hat did Davey Crockett wear?
What is a counter top?
Do windows almost always have screens?
What is oleo?
What format does chewing gum normally come in?
Why are electrical sockets in a bathroom awesome?
Soap opera questions... Also perhaps the time of soap operas? Evening or day?
What is Downey wrinkle releaser?
Difference between jelly and jam and jello?
What kind of gravey goes on biscuits and gravey?
Can you leave mail for the postman to collect from your house?
What is a rain check and when can you use it?
Who yelled "the redcoats are coming"?
posted by misspony at 8:46 AM on September 29, 2013
What is a counter top?
Do windows almost always have screens?
What is oleo?
What format does chewing gum normally come in?
Why are electrical sockets in a bathroom awesome?
Soap opera questions... Also perhaps the time of soap operas? Evening or day?
What is Downey wrinkle releaser?
Difference between jelly and jam and jello?
What kind of gravey goes on biscuits and gravey?
Can you leave mail for the postman to collect from your house?
What is a rain check and when can you use it?
Who yelled "the redcoats are coming"?
posted by misspony at 8:46 AM on September 29, 2013
Response by poster: "What is your zip code?" If the number is not five digits, not produced immediately, or is 90210 they can be safely shot as a spy.
posted by Blasdelb at 8:48 AM on September 29, 2013 [25 favorites]
posted by Blasdelb at 8:48 AM on September 29, 2013 [25 favorites]
"How do you pronounce Nikon?" Everybody else says "Neekon." (Not sure about Canada, though.)
posted by Sticherbeast at 8:49 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by Sticherbeast at 8:49 AM on September 29, 2013
I have never seen the Price is Right. I thought it was a show in the 1960s?
posted by small_ruminant at 8:49 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by small_ruminant at 8:49 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
You could ask about the price of a gas. Americans would give $/gallon, Canadians $/L, and Europeans a drastically higher number in Euro/liter. Many Europeans call it "petrol" rather than "gas".
What are smarties candy. For Amercans it is a sour sugar wafer candy that Canadians call rockets. I think Europe is dominated by the Canadian/British interpretation of Smarties, which are a candy coated chocolate like an M&M.
There are some Canadian-only words you could use to distinguish on the basis of pronunciation. What's Different in Canada Tumblr has a funny/comprehensive list of differences. I imagine some of those would be very distinct from outside Canada+US.
"Cool Ranch" is called " Cool American" Over There
As far as I know, "Cool Ranch" Doritos are still "Cool Ranch" in Canada. Source: I'm a Canadian living in the US. I have eaten more than my fair share of Doritos in both countries.
posted by KevCed at 8:51 AM on September 29, 2013
What are smarties candy. For Amercans it is a sour sugar wafer candy that Canadians call rockets. I think Europe is dominated by the Canadian/British interpretation of Smarties, which are a candy coated chocolate like an M&M.
There are some Canadian-only words you could use to distinguish on the basis of pronunciation. What's Different in Canada Tumblr has a funny/comprehensive list of differences. I imagine some of those would be very distinct from outside Canada+US.
"Cool Ranch" is called " Cool American" Over There
As far as I know, "Cool Ranch" Doritos are still "Cool Ranch" in Canada. Source: I'm a Canadian living in the US. I have eaten more than my fair share of Doritos in both countries.
posted by KevCed at 8:51 AM on September 29, 2013
Finish this sentence... "Donna Martin...."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:53 AM on September 29, 2013 [6 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:53 AM on September 29, 2013 [6 favorites]
To separate Canadians and Americans, ask if their school had a marching band or what instruments are in a marching band (we had snare drums and bagpipes). Also ask whether they (or their town) has ever used bunting to decorate. 'The shot heard round the world' is different in the US vs. Canada (and I'm guessing the rest of the world). Also who started the War of 1812.
posted by hydrobatidae at 8:55 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by hydrobatidae at 8:55 AM on September 29, 2013
Best answer: Their opinion of Newt Gingrich.
posted by Ironmouth at 8:55 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Ironmouth at 8:55 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Sports questions still work as long as they bubble up just far enough to reach the general (but not international) consciousness. Examples:
Wo was the most famous NASCAR driver to die in a crash?
Home run king, steroid user. Name him.
Rowdy Roddy ______ (I know, not a real sport)
That football guy who had that horrible leg injury, Joe __________.
And even the older ones. It's amazing how much we assume the world knows, but only Americans, I'll bet, will be able to get these players from their nicknames:
Joltin' Joe ________
Wilt "The Stilt" _________
"Say Hey" Willie _____
And so on. And I'm not a sports guy.
posted by argybarg at 8:59 AM on September 29, 2013
Wo was the most famous NASCAR driver to die in a crash?
Home run king, steroid user. Name him.
Rowdy Roddy ______ (I know, not a real sport)
That football guy who had that horrible leg injury, Joe __________.
And even the older ones. It's amazing how much we assume the world knows, but only Americans, I'll bet, will be able to get these players from their nicknames:
Joltin' Joe ________
Wilt "The Stilt" _________
"Say Hey" Willie _____
And so on. And I'm not a sports guy.
posted by argybarg at 8:59 AM on September 29, 2013
I would totally fail a lot of these tests (hangs head).
posted by small_ruminant at 9:02 AM on September 29, 2013 [20 favorites]
posted by small_ruminant at 9:02 AM on September 29, 2013 [20 favorites]
Yeah, I would fail the sports test.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:03 AM on September 29, 2013 [6 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:03 AM on September 29, 2013 [6 favorites]
What are the five classic instruments that make up a bluegrass band?
(fiddle, guitar, banjo, mandolin, string bass. If they say "violin" instead of "fiddle" they ain't American.)
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 9:05 AM on September 29, 2013
(fiddle, guitar, banjo, mandolin, string bass. If they say "violin" instead of "fiddle" they ain't American.)
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 9:05 AM on September 29, 2013
How many digits in a social security number?
What are the sides at Kentucky fried chicken?
posted by misspony at 9:07 AM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
What are the sides at Kentucky fried chicken?
posted by misspony at 9:07 AM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
Would just like to add my voice to the others saying that TV is not a good bet. I'm 26, and only know that Donna Martin... was a character on 90210. And I think she was played by Tori Spelling who was in that college call-girl movie? Or possibly Prue from Charmed? I only know any of that because I was a latchkey kid and watched too much TV; most other people from my age cohort would be shot on sight if you applied the Donna Martin test.
posted by c'mon sea legs at 9:11 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by c'mon sea legs at 9:11 AM on September 29, 2013
Here's one that I think would work for Americans above age 27 or so (and many below): Who was Christa McAuliffe?
posted by ocherdraco at 9:15 AM on September 29, 2013 [4 favorites]
posted by ocherdraco at 9:15 AM on September 29, 2013 [4 favorites]
I would fail almost all of these as well. This gives credence to my theory (or, okay, my futile wishing) that I am a Canadian changeling.
posted by Stacey at 9:16 AM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by Stacey at 9:16 AM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
What temperature constitutes a fever in a person?
The bus question above doesn't work for anyone who lives or lived in NYC, which is a significant number of people.
How far away is the store?
What are the words to (and then hum the song that is used for both God Save the Queen and My Country Tis of Thee)?
Names of common weeds - these can be fairly local and I'd need to talk to some Canadians and UKians about this before naming good identifiers.
You could just ask someone to pick up a sprig of nettles or poison ivy or giant hog weed or poison oak/sumac or some other horrible thing and see if they freak out and refuse to take it from you. There should be enough local things like this to distinguish. That said, city people are not useful for this.
posted by sciencegeek at 9:16 AM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
The bus question above doesn't work for anyone who lives or lived in NYC, which is a significant number of people.
How far away is the store?
What are the words to (and then hum the song that is used for both God Save the Queen and My Country Tis of Thee)?
Names of common weeds - these can be fairly local and I'd need to talk to some Canadians and UKians about this before naming good identifiers.
You could just ask someone to pick up a sprig of nettles or poison ivy or giant hog weed or poison oak/sumac or some other horrible thing and see if they freak out and refuse to take it from you. There should be enough local things like this to distinguish. That said, city people are not useful for this.
posted by sciencegeek at 9:16 AM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
What is this percentage: 0.7 (U.S.=zero point seven, elsewhere=naught point seven).
Nah, British-English uses zero a lot of the time. Naught sounds pretty outdated to me although still might be used by some people.
posted by EndsOfInvention at 9:24 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
Nah, British-English uses zero a lot of the time. Naught sounds pretty outdated to me although still might be used by some people.
posted by EndsOfInvention at 9:24 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
What is this percentage: 0.7 (U.S.=zero point seven, elsewhere=naught point seven).
Oh point seven
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 9:26 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Oh point seven
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 9:26 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Who shot JR?
I guess that only catches a specific demographic too, but it's funny to me.
posted by bilabial at 9:32 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
I guess that only catches a specific demographic too, but it's funny to me.
posted by bilabial at 9:32 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Color of lucky charms marshmallows?
When is Mother's Day?
What age is high school?
What year groups in high school can bring a date to prom?
What is the job of a rodeo clown?
What do you pledge alligamce to at school?
What's the first line of the constitution and national anthem?
What's the United States speed limit on a highway?
What's the difference between odd and even highways and give an example!
What is jaywalking?
When is thanksgiving?
posted by misspony at 9:35 AM on September 29, 2013
When is Mother's Day?
What age is high school?
What year groups in high school can bring a date to prom?
What is the job of a rodeo clown?
What do you pledge alligamce to at school?
What's the first line of the constitution and national anthem?
What's the United States speed limit on a highway?
What's the difference between odd and even highways and give an example!
What is jaywalking?
When is thanksgiving?
posted by misspony at 9:35 AM on September 29, 2013
Best answer: I'm Canadian so I'm aware of many U.S. things, but I'm always thrown off by your system of having sophomore years and the fact that "junior" year isn't the first year you're in a school (I think?). That would be a good shibboleth.
posted by zadcat at 9:40 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
posted by zadcat at 9:40 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
Awareness of (and a strong opinion pertaining to) the "soda vs. pop" debate.
Nthing Thanksgiving trivia, even beyond the traditional foods (e.g., which department store hosts the Thanksgiving parade?)
posted by scody at 9:49 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
Nthing Thanksgiving trivia, even beyond the traditional foods (e.g., which department store hosts the Thanksgiving parade?)
posted by scody at 9:49 AM on September 29, 2013 [3 favorites]
Ask what tax form people fill out.
posted by almostwitty at 9:50 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by almostwitty at 9:50 AM on September 29, 2013
Food, sports, and pop-culture can be class- or generation-dependent.
But I'd expect that the ability to recite the Pledge of Allegiance is universal among US-educated Americans, and virtually unknown among foreigners.
posted by Dimpy at 9:53 AM on September 29, 2013
But I'd expect that the ability to recite the Pledge of Allegiance is universal among US-educated Americans, and virtually unknown among foreigners.
posted by Dimpy at 9:53 AM on September 29, 2013
Best answer: If someone knows the second stanza of the American national anthem, they are most certainly pretending to be American.
posted by deanc at 9:54 AM on September 29, 2013 [19 favorites]
posted by deanc at 9:54 AM on September 29, 2013 [19 favorites]
Familiarity with the SATs?
Familiarity with bigtime college sports things, like March Madness or the Heisman Trophy?
Familiarity with small liberal arts colleges? (There are a few outside the US, but overwhelmingly other countries' higher ed systems are based on large universities)
posted by LobsterMitten at 9:55 AM on September 29, 2013
Familiarity with bigtime college sports things, like March Madness or the Heisman Trophy?
Familiarity with small liberal arts colleges? (There are a few outside the US, but overwhelmingly other countries' higher ed systems are based on large universities)
posted by LobsterMitten at 9:55 AM on September 29, 2013
The survey has only one question: "When you were a kid, with whom did you watch The Price is Right?"
I'm American and am not at all certain that I watched TPiR until I was elevenish -- Air Force brat who spent most of his life until then on various AF bases in Germany, and I don't think AFRTS carried it back in the 70s when the F-4s were powered by dinosaurs winding rubber bands.
Separating Canadians and Americans is easy; just ask them to read a long passage and before too long the Canadian will slip up and say proe-cess or sore-ry or zed.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 9:57 AM on September 29, 2013
I'm American and am not at all certain that I watched TPiR until I was elevenish -- Air Force brat who spent most of his life until then on various AF bases in Germany, and I don't think AFRTS carried it back in the 70s when the F-4s were powered by dinosaurs winding rubber bands.
Separating Canadians and Americans is easy; just ask them to read a long passage and before too long the Canadian will slip up and say proe-cess or sore-ry or zed.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 9:57 AM on September 29, 2013
Listing the names for high school years in order with corresponding age ranges is a really good one.
posted by Sara C. at 10:07 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by Sara C. at 10:07 AM on September 29, 2013
I feel like tons of these questions will not work at all if the person under test realizes that you're fishing for the "American" answer.
I mean, really guys, if you realize they pronounce "Z" as "zed", don't you think they probably realize you pronounce it as "zee"?
posted by Precision at 10:10 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
I mean, really guys, if you realize they pronounce "Z" as "zed", don't you think they probably realize you pronounce it as "zee"?
posted by Precision at 10:10 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]
Is the abbreviation DMV only used in the US? If so, asking what that stands for might be a good question.
posted by Dansaman at 10:18 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by Dansaman at 10:18 AM on September 29, 2013
What does it mean to "table" something? Quoting Churchill:
The enjoyment of a common language was of course a supreme advantage in all British and American discussions. ... The British Staff prepared a paper which they wished to raise as a matter of urgency, and informed their American colleagues that they wished to "table it." To the American Staff "tabling" a paper meant putting it away in a drawer and forgetting it. A long and even acrimonious argument ensued before both parties realized that they were agreed on the merits and wanted the same thing.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:32 AM on September 29, 2013
The enjoyment of a common language was of course a supreme advantage in all British and American discussions. ... The British Staff prepared a paper which they wished to raise as a matter of urgency, and informed their American colleagues that they wished to "table it." To the American Staff "tabling" a paper meant putting it away in a drawer and forgetting it. A long and even acrimonious argument ensued before both parties realized that they were agreed on the merits and wanted the same thing.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:32 AM on September 29, 2013
What is meant by IRA?
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 10:34 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 10:34 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
(nah, Dansaman, in Massachusetts it's the RMV, so that doesn't help much.)
Also, I think that it's (to use an awkward word) un-American to focus so much on accents or pronunciation. People in the US often grow up in households with parents whose first language is not English. I know 35-year-old who have lived here since birth who have definite pronunciation quirks. There's actually a somewhat smooth accent gradient from northern Michigan into southern Ontario. And Precision's point is a good one - if someone is consciously pretending to be American they'd be perfectly capable of adjusting their spellings (colour, centre) and word usage (zed, biscuit, lift, rubber).
I like the idea of asking about college sports, and find it hilarious that holgate suggested that, while referring to it as "sport", which is a non-US phrasing.
I also like checking for intuitive familiarity with the imperial measurement system - temperature as suggested previously, but also inches and ounces (a British pint is 19 oz, a metric pint is 500ml, a US pint is 16 oz) (and to top it off, we use ounces as both volume and weight and that's super-confusing) Not that someone can't train themselves to do these conversions, but a smart spy might be slightly slower at their imperial-based estimates than a dumb American.
posted by aimedwander at 10:35 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Also, I think that it's (to use an awkward word) un-American to focus so much on accents or pronunciation. People in the US often grow up in households with parents whose first language is not English. I know 35-year-old who have lived here since birth who have definite pronunciation quirks. There's actually a somewhat smooth accent gradient from northern Michigan into southern Ontario. And Precision's point is a good one - if someone is consciously pretending to be American they'd be perfectly capable of adjusting their spellings (colour, centre) and word usage (zed, biscuit, lift, rubber).
I like the idea of asking about college sports, and find it hilarious that holgate suggested that, while referring to it as "sport", which is a non-US phrasing.
I also like checking for intuitive familiarity with the imperial measurement system - temperature as suggested previously, but also inches and ounces (a British pint is 19 oz, a metric pint is 500ml, a US pint is 16 oz) (and to top it off, we use ounces as both volume and weight and that's super-confusing) Not that someone can't train themselves to do these conversions, but a smart spy might be slightly slower at their imperial-based estimates than a dumb American.
posted by aimedwander at 10:35 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
When do stores usually put up Christmas decorations?
posted by postcommunism at 10:44 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by postcommunism at 10:44 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Although half you other Americans would have shot me as a spy by now.
posted by postcommunism at 10:48 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by postcommunism at 10:48 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Soap opera questions... Also perhaps the time of soap operas?
My students call these types of programs "dramas." (We call them soaps because their early sponsors made soap )
I've heard (here!) that another way to identify the Canadians is to have 'em sing Head, Shoulders Knees and Toes.
This US/American would fail almost any sports test. Also any but the most basic Sesame Street question.
posted by Rash at 10:50 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
My students call these types of programs "dramas." (We call them soaps because their early sponsors made soap )
I've heard (here!) that another way to identify the Canadians is to have 'em sing Head, Shoulders Knees and Toes.
This US/American would fail almost any sports test. Also any but the most basic Sesame Street question.
posted by Rash at 10:50 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Itsy-Bitsy Spider (US) versus Incy-Wincy Spider (Commonwealth)
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:55 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:55 AM on September 29, 2013
Sing "If you're happy and you know it". If it involves your face surely showing it, you are American.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:56 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:56 AM on September 29, 2013
Empire, a British movie magazine, used to ask a celebrity each month how much a pint of milk cost. The results were often hilarious.
A shibboleth does not have to be impossible - the opposite is true. You want it to be common currency among your target group. A good shibboleth can simply require that the responder has to take too long to think about the answer. In the case of "how much is a quart of milk?" the responder needs to both know what a quart is and roughly what milk sells for in the US. Anyone - which pretty much means everyone outside the US - who does not use quarts as a unit of measurement and does not have a passing familiarity with the pruce of milk will struggle to respond quickly. Sure, you might accidentally shoot he odd person from your own side who is too out if touch to know the price of common groceries. But c'est la vie.
posted by MuffinMan at 11:02 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
A shibboleth does not have to be impossible - the opposite is true. You want it to be common currency among your target group. A good shibboleth can simply require that the responder has to take too long to think about the answer. In the case of "how much is a quart of milk?" the responder needs to both know what a quart is and roughly what milk sells for in the US. Anyone - which pretty much means everyone outside the US - who does not use quarts as a unit of measurement and does not have a passing familiarity with the pruce of milk will struggle to respond quickly. Sure, you might accidentally shoot he odd person from your own side who is too out if touch to know the price of common groceries. But c'est la vie.
posted by MuffinMan at 11:02 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
I've never bought a quart of milk in America--only gallons and half gallons.
posted by Precision at 11:04 AM on September 29, 2013 [8 favorites]
posted by Precision at 11:04 AM on September 29, 2013 [8 favorites]
Doritos aren't Cool American here in the UK, they're Cool Original.
Temperature's a good one - I've been here for 13 years, and I'm still absolutely rubbish at it. I can only sort of roughly go "Um...if it's in Celsius, it's like 50 degrees higher in Fahrenheit. Or something."
posted by Katemonkey at 11:13 AM on September 29, 2013
Temperature's a good one - I've been here for 13 years, and I'm still absolutely rubbish at it. I can only sort of roughly go "Um...if it's in Celsius, it's like 50 degrees higher in Fahrenheit. Or something."
posted by Katemonkey at 11:13 AM on September 29, 2013
generic Walmart or free range, organic, grass fed?
posted by small_ruminant at 11:13 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by small_ruminant at 11:13 AM on September 29, 2013
Do you want to go to the park sometime and play football? as a leading question to determine which kind of football is inferred, American or soccer.
posted by sciencegeek at 11:20 AM on September 29, 2013
posted by sciencegeek at 11:20 AM on September 29, 2013
A lot of these answers are about language and dialect. This might add to that aspect of the discussion - http://spark-1590165977.us-west-2.elb.amazonaws.com/jkatz/SurveyMaps/
posted by CollectiveMind at 11:28 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by CollectiveMind at 11:28 AM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
Burst into the room and shout WHAT TEAM.
All those who do not immediately respond WILDCATS are suspect.
posted by elizardbits at 11:33 AM on September 29, 2013 [6 favorites]
All those who do not immediately respond WILDCATS are suspect.
posted by elizardbits at 11:33 AM on September 29, 2013 [6 favorites]
What is Downey wrinkle releaser?
Well, unfortunately you can hardly FIND it anywhere, so a lot of Americans would flunk that one.
Ask them if they study math or what a spider is.
posted by jgirl at 11:47 AM on September 29, 2013
Well, unfortunately you can hardly FIND it anywhere, so a lot of Americans would flunk that one.
Ask them if they study math or what a spider is.
posted by jgirl at 11:47 AM on September 29, 2013
If someone knows the second stanza of the American national anthem, they are most certainly pretending to be American.
and if they know all FOUR, they went to a church school and had to learn and recite that and a million other things to pass English and Social Studies ;)
The DMV is the BMV in Ohio, so that doesn't cover the whole country.
It certainly depends on whether the person is intentionally trying to pass, or if you're just curious and don't want to ask straight out. Things like the pledge of allegiance, the date format, those would be giveaways that anyone trying to come across as American would probably know.
The only one I can think of is if they celebrate Mother's Day in any other month but May. (Though if they celebrate in May it doesn't automatically mean they're American, of course.)
posted by lemniskate at 12:20 PM on September 29, 2013
and if they know all FOUR, they went to a church school and had to learn and recite that and a million other things to pass English and Social Studies ;)
The DMV is the BMV in Ohio, so that doesn't cover the whole country.
It certainly depends on whether the person is intentionally trying to pass, or if you're just curious and don't want to ask straight out. Things like the pledge of allegiance, the date format, those would be giveaways that anyone trying to come across as American would probably know.
The only one I can think of is if they celebrate Mother's Day in any other month but May. (Though if they celebrate in May it doesn't automatically mean they're American, of course.)
posted by lemniskate at 12:20 PM on September 29, 2013
I'm a lifelong white guy from suburbia, and I would fail almost all of these. I honestly couldn't tell you what any amount of milk costs, and barely gas. So I'd get shot for being a barely driving Commie Northerner Pinko vegan-ish guy. Which I know a large number of Americans wouldn't slow down for on a highway anyway....maybe the fact that I know that?
posted by nevercalm at 12:47 PM on September 29, 2013
posted by nevercalm at 12:47 PM on September 29, 2013
Ask them the last letter in the alphabet. Americans say zee while others, including dastardly Canadians, say zed.
I'd say it's in fact ü.
posted by Pyrogenesis at 12:49 PM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
I'd say it's in fact ü.
posted by Pyrogenesis at 12:49 PM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
But... I don't DRINK milk!
I agree though, with metric v. imperial measurements. Most Americans I've run into (including me despite my best efforts) cannot convert them quickly (if at all) so if you ask the temp of anything they'll answer in degrees and not Celcius.
posted by patheral at 12:49 PM on September 29, 2013
I agree though, with metric v. imperial measurements. Most Americans I've run into (including me despite my best efforts) cannot convert them quickly (if at all) so if you ask the temp of anything they'll answer in degrees and not Celcius.
posted by patheral at 12:49 PM on September 29, 2013
Interestingly, I remember sometimes they'd do this not so much for the answer but because it was unlikely a foreign spy would've trained to say the names properly, so they'd pick them up by their accent.
posted by Ghostride The Whip at 1:28 PM on September 29, 2013
posted by Ghostride The Whip at 1:28 PM on September 29, 2013
Best answer: How do you make fry bread?
How many days is Kwanzaa?
Why is it insulting to call a Jewish girl a princess?
What museum is in Dearborn MI?
Knowing these questions makes you just as American as having eaten apple pie.
posted by third rail at 2:08 PM on September 29, 2013
How many days is Kwanzaa?
Why is it insulting to call a Jewish girl a princess?
What museum is in Dearborn MI?
Knowing these questions makes you just as American as having eaten apple pie.
posted by third rail at 2:08 PM on September 29, 2013
What? Just, what? I hardly know any of these. And I was raised in the most patriotic conservative Go Amur'cah family possible.
posted by celtalitha at 2:20 PM on September 29, 2013
posted by celtalitha at 2:20 PM on September 29, 2013
(In fact, one of the only ones I DO know is the second stanza to the National Anthem. So apparently I'm actually an imposter.)
posted by celtalitha at 2:21 PM on September 29, 2013
posted by celtalitha at 2:21 PM on September 29, 2013
or what a spider is.
OK, you have to explain this one to me. I can assure you that eight-legged beasties exist on both sides of the pond.
'Candy', 'bay-zle' (basil - as opposed to 'bazzle'), tomayto and garbage ('rubbish')/garbage can ('bin') always give me away as a yankee.
posted by Gordafarin at 2:24 PM on September 29, 2013
OK, you have to explain this one to me. I can assure you that eight-legged beasties exist on both sides of the pond.
'Candy', 'bay-zle' (basil - as opposed to 'bazzle'), tomayto and garbage ('rubbish')/garbage can ('bin') always give me away as a yankee.
posted by Gordafarin at 2:24 PM on September 29, 2013
Also - the American schooling system is somewhat bizzare.
How old is the average sixth grader? How long does it take to get an associate's degree? How long does it take to get a diploma? (correct answer = what the heck? from high school? um, 12 years I guess? Anything that indicates that a "diploma" is not a type of higher education) What's a GED? How old were you when you graduated high school?
posted by aimedwander at 3:18 PM on September 29, 2013
How old is the average sixth grader? How long does it take to get an associate's degree? How long does it take to get a diploma? (correct answer = what the heck? from high school? um, 12 years I guess? Anything that indicates that a "diploma" is not a type of higher education) What's a GED? How old were you when you graduated high school?
posted by aimedwander at 3:18 PM on September 29, 2013
what is your insurance copay?
posted by desjardins at 3:47 PM on September 29, 2013
posted by desjardins at 3:47 PM on September 29, 2013
Don't think I stated my filter properly: elsewhere, a continuing melodrama televised in the afternoon could not be identified as a 'soap opera', but merely a 'drama.' (Not sure about Canada on this one).
And in Maryland, it's the MVA, now (but old-timers used to the old name still call it the DMV).
posted by Rash at 3:54 PM on September 29, 2013
And in Maryland, it's the MVA, now (but old-timers used to the old name still call it the DMV).
posted by Rash at 3:54 PM on September 29, 2013
As a Canadian living in the US I have been caught out by this one several times:
Ask them to tell you about their schooling. If they say 'first grade' 'junior year' or 'college' they're American. If they say 'grade 1', 'grade 11' or 'university' they are Canadian. Canadians use 'college' for community college, and refer to undergraduate education as 'university'.
posted by Space Coyote at 3:58 PM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
Ask them to tell you about their schooling. If they say 'first grade' 'junior year' or 'college' they're American. If they say 'grade 1', 'grade 11' or 'university' they are Canadian. Canadians use 'college' for community college, and refer to undergraduate education as 'university'.
posted by Space Coyote at 3:58 PM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
I can assure you that eight-legged beasties exist on both sides of the pond.
Some people use this word to refer to a skillet or frying pan.
posted by elizardbits at 4:12 PM on September 29, 2013
Some people use this word to refer to a skillet or frying pan.
posted by elizardbits at 4:12 PM on September 29, 2013
> Ask them if they study math or what a spider is
Like, the thing that goes in the middle of a 45?
posted by The corpse in the library at 4:13 PM on September 29, 2013
Like, the thing that goes in the middle of a 45?
posted by The corpse in the library at 4:13 PM on September 29, 2013
Sorry to be dark, but asking them where they were when they heard about 9/11.
posted by tmacdonald at 4:19 PM on September 29, 2013 [4 favorites]
posted by tmacdonald at 4:19 PM on September 29, 2013 [4 favorites]
> Ask them if they study math or what a spider is
Like, the thing that goes in the middle of a 45?
I didn't know those had a name.
Another: Ask them if they hoover.
posted by jgirl at 5:23 PM on September 29, 2013
What does it mean to "table" something?
Similarly, you could ask them what it means to "punt".
posted by HiroProtagonist at 6:57 PM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
Similarly, you could ask them what it means to "punt".
posted by HiroProtagonist at 6:57 PM on September 29, 2013 [2 favorites]
The Anglo-American divide on "punt" is crazy. Best way for a Brit to get a conference room full of American guys to stop following what he's saying.
posted by MattD at 7:44 PM on September 29, 2013
posted by MattD at 7:44 PM on September 29, 2013
I think Australians call a Coke float a "spider." At least that's what they're called in Vanuatu (whose English is very heavily influenced by Australia).
posted by orrnyereg at 9:06 PM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by orrnyereg at 9:06 PM on September 29, 2013 [1 favorite]
When is Tax Day?
Tell me your social security number, including dashes.
posted by fings at 9:35 PM on September 29, 2013
Tell me your social security number, including dashes.
posted by fings at 9:35 PM on September 29, 2013
What is the difference between Country and Western?
posted by GeeEmm at 9:53 PM on September 29, 2013
posted by GeeEmm at 9:53 PM on September 29, 2013
What would be culturally ubiquitous enough to reach everyone in the US without also reaching the world?
I don't live there now, but I spent my first decades in the US, so I'm more American (in actual years raised there) than a lot of you are, and yet I would fail many of these tests. You couldn't pay me to watch The Price is Right or any other game show, not then and not now, I didn't watch Mr. Rogers or soaps or football or baseball, and I know pretty much nothing about Kwanzaa and Dearborn and fry bread.
The best tests are simple, universal things like:
posted by pracowity at 1:05 AM on September 30, 2013 [1 favorite]
I don't live there now, but I spent my first decades in the US, so I'm more American (in actual years raised there) than a lot of you are, and yet I would fail many of these tests. You couldn't pay me to watch The Price is Right or any other game show, not then and not now, I didn't watch Mr. Rogers or soaps or football or baseball, and I know pretty much nothing about Kwanzaa and Dearborn and fry bread.
The best tests are simple, universal things like:
- zip codes -- everyone who lives in the US has a zip code and has to deal with zip codes, and you could root out simple liars by asking to supply their zip code without giving them a chance to look it up, and then you could easily verify that it matches the supposed home of the person.
- measurements -- everyone is forced to think in gallons, quarts, and Fahrenheit degrees. You could ask "If I heated this gallon of milk [but show a picture of a quart or cup of milk] to 100 degrees, what would happen? Could you drink it?" and see what kind of response you get.
- Social Security Number -- almost everyone of working age has one and is forced to supply it for various reasons
posted by pracowity at 1:05 AM on September 30, 2013 [1 favorite]
Wouldn't those GIs have pretty much all been male and within a certain age bracket? It'd be much easier to do this with people who were within a decade's span of years; the reason most of the pop culture and sports references don't work well is that they tend to be generational.
It's possible that there might be inverted questions that work: say, asking for a postal code instead of a zip code and testing to see if there's a bit of a delay in the answer would show some Americans out, but not ones who did international shipping or had lived abroad. (Though I suppose those questions would make you look like a spy yourself.)
Familiarity with the NCLB-mandated tests might work, but I'm not sure how you'd phrase that, and it would give false positives for Americans who went to private schools.
It's possible that even though there are specific TV shows that wouldn't work, non-show stuff that's also on TV might work. GEICO ads, "The More You Know" campaigns, and various PSA campaigns ("This is your brain on drugs") might function for this.
Food colorings like Yellow 5 are banned in much of Europe and in Canada, so familiarity with those from ingredient lists might work.
Asking what region makes the best pizza might work, or just bringing up New York vs. Chicago.
posted by NoraReed at 3:58 AM on September 30, 2013 [1 favorite]
It's possible that there might be inverted questions that work: say, asking for a postal code instead of a zip code and testing to see if there's a bit of a delay in the answer would show some Americans out, but not ones who did international shipping or had lived abroad. (Though I suppose those questions would make you look like a spy yourself.)
Familiarity with the NCLB-mandated tests might work, but I'm not sure how you'd phrase that, and it would give false positives for Americans who went to private schools.
It's possible that even though there are specific TV shows that wouldn't work, non-show stuff that's also on TV might work. GEICO ads, "The More You Know" campaigns, and various PSA campaigns ("This is your brain on drugs") might function for this.
Food colorings like Yellow 5 are banned in much of Europe and in Canada, so familiarity with those from ingredient lists might work.
Asking what region makes the best pizza might work, or just bringing up New York vs. Chicago.
posted by NoraReed at 3:58 AM on September 30, 2013 [1 favorite]
How many miles over the speed limit do you have to be going before you'll get a ticket?
Test not valid for residents of New England, Atlanta, or Houston.
posted by hobo gitano de queretaro at 4:16 AM on September 30, 2013 [2 favorites]
Test not valid for residents of New England, Atlanta, or Houston.
posted by hobo gitano de queretaro at 4:16 AM on September 30, 2013 [2 favorites]
"Where you were during 9/11" wouldn't work for the people who were studying overseas during college. I know two American guys who would have said "China" and "London".
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:16 AM on September 30, 2013
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:16 AM on September 30, 2013
I would think any question would give some false positives like that; you'd have to either be asking a series of questions or okay with shooting a lot more non-spies than spies.
posted by NoraReed at 6:43 AM on September 30, 2013
posted by NoraReed at 6:43 AM on September 30, 2013
As pracowity says, there's a distinction here between the kind of shibboleths that are based upon group practices, as opposed to ones that are dependent upon group memory and group knowledge.
'Name some herbs used in Italian cooking' would count as the first, as they cover 'basil' and 'oregano' (and 'herb', for that matter).
Group memory / knowledge is harder to distill into questions, but easier to discern in conversation. There are domains that are impenetrable to me, such as the daily routines of an American high school, even though the rest of the world gets a sense of what that environment is like from film and television. Somebody could nail the accent and broader cultural references, but still be caught out while chatting about what they did during recess or how they needed to ace this one class to raise their GPA. (Those are real things, right?)
and find it hilarious that holgate suggested that, while referring to it as "sport", which is a non-US phrasing.
A decade of living in the US has not exactly assimilated me.
posted by holgate at 8:21 AM on September 30, 2013
'Name some herbs used in Italian cooking' would count as the first, as they cover 'basil' and 'oregano' (and 'herb', for that matter).
Group memory / knowledge is harder to distill into questions, but easier to discern in conversation. There are domains that are impenetrable to me, such as the daily routines of an American high school, even though the rest of the world gets a sense of what that environment is like from film and television. Somebody could nail the accent and broader cultural references, but still be caught out while chatting about what they did during recess or how they needed to ace this one class to raise their GPA. (Those are real things, right?)
and find it hilarious that holgate suggested that, while referring to it as "sport", which is a non-US phrasing.
A decade of living in the US has not exactly assimilated me.
posted by holgate at 8:21 AM on September 30, 2013
It's how the other person speaks, surely? Accent and idiom, patterns of speech. (I mean rather than answers to factual questions.) My daughter said her expression "A little bit of..." marked her as foreign.
A way to turn the question round and shake more out of it is to ask: How do you know that the people you meet (in America) aren't American?
Or to ask immigrants and foreigners: What is at about you that tells Americans you aren't one (yet)?
posted by glasseyes at 9:04 AM on September 30, 2013
A way to turn the question round and shake more out of it is to ask: How do you know that the people you meet (in America) aren't American?
Or to ask immigrants and foreigners: What is at about you that tells Americans you aren't one (yet)?
posted by glasseyes at 9:04 AM on September 30, 2013
Just thought of a pronounciation one: I haven't ever heard an American aspirate the 'h' on 'herb'.
on preview: whoops.
posted by glasseyes at 9:15 AM on September 30, 2013
on preview: whoops.
posted by glasseyes at 9:15 AM on September 30, 2013
measurements -- everyone is forced to think in gallons, quarts, and Fahrenheit degrees. You could ask "If I heated this gallon of milk [but show a picture of a quart or cup of milk] to 100 degrees, what would happen? Could you drink it?" and see what kind of response you get.
I think folks are drastically underestimating how easy it is to pick up a basic sense of measurements.
I've cumulatively spent less than 6 months outside the US, and yet I could tell you that 100 degrees celsius is boiling and that 750 mL is a bottle of wine.
I'm pretty sure "basic familiarity with non-metric measurements" is the first thing on the list for anyone training spies. Though, frankly, this might not even be something you have to train, since after a month or so in country any decent spy could pick it up.
I think a test based on measurements would have to be exceedingly tricky and involve a lot of quick math based on fractions of obscure measurements. Like if I have 53 half-gallons of soda, how many six-packs would that be? And it would be a judgment call to pick out the spies from the people who suck at math and the people who have no life skills.
posted by Sara C. at 11:49 AM on September 30, 2013
I think folks are drastically underestimating how easy it is to pick up a basic sense of measurements.
I've cumulatively spent less than 6 months outside the US, and yet I could tell you that 100 degrees celsius is boiling and that 750 mL is a bottle of wine.
I'm pretty sure "basic familiarity with non-metric measurements" is the first thing on the list for anyone training spies. Though, frankly, this might not even be something you have to train, since after a month or so in country any decent spy could pick it up.
I think a test based on measurements would have to be exceedingly tricky and involve a lot of quick math based on fractions of obscure measurements. Like if I have 53 half-gallons of soda, how many six-packs would that be? And it would be a judgment call to pick out the spies from the people who suck at math and the people who have no life skills.
posted by Sara C. at 11:49 AM on September 30, 2013
I'm an American and I wouldn't get half of the ones you marked as best answers. I don't know who King Friday XIII is either.
One thing that would work, even for Americans who aren't middle class, and would work for almost all ages, would be a variant on a question I saw in a documentary on the Miss Navajo pageant. Contestants were asked, in Navajo, and had to answer, in Navajo: How do you get to your house?
So, a simple question anyone who isn't institutionalized can answer, and an answer that can be expanded on if needed, if there isn't enough information. Adaptable to different age groups. Answerable whether you drive, take a subway, bus, walk. Gives information that should match with ID or other records.
How do you get to your house?
posted by yohko at 1:04 PM on September 30, 2013 [2 favorites]
One thing that would work, even for Americans who aren't middle class, and would work for almost all ages, would be a variant on a question I saw in a documentary on the Miss Navajo pageant. Contestants were asked, in Navajo, and had to answer, in Navajo: How do you get to your house?
So, a simple question anyone who isn't institutionalized can answer, and an answer that can be expanded on if needed, if there isn't enough information. Adaptable to different age groups. Answerable whether you drive, take a subway, bus, walk. Gives information that should match with ID or other records.
How do you get to your house?
posted by yohko at 1:04 PM on September 30, 2013 [2 favorites]
Who is George Washington Carver?
posted by thelastpolarbear at 5:59 PM on September 30, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by thelastpolarbear at 5:59 PM on September 30, 2013 [2 favorites]
How about singing part of "Grammar Rock"? 🎵"Oh, I'm just a bill/Here on Capitol Hill"🎵
Something about the Fourth of July? Or asking what they put on a hot dog? Or the best part of a parade? (Acceptable answers include Shriners in tiny cars; drum majorettes; sweaty politicians kissing babies; local high school marching bands.)
posted by wenestvedt at 7:45 PM on September 30, 2013 [1 favorite]
Something about the Fourth of July? Or asking what they put on a hot dog? Or the best part of a parade? (Acceptable answers include Shriners in tiny cars; drum majorettes; sweaty politicians kissing babies; local high school marching bands.)
posted by wenestvedt at 7:45 PM on September 30, 2013 [1 favorite]
Actually I think that within a certain age group the lyrics to Schoolhouse Rock would work really well.
posted by NoraReed at 10:05 PM on September 30, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by NoraReed at 10:05 PM on September 30, 2013 [1 favorite]
Except for all of us TV-less hippie kids.
posted by small_ruminant at 10:16 PM on September 30, 2013
posted by small_ruminant at 10:16 PM on September 30, 2013
Though not too long ago I ran into the Varla Jean Merman one(youtube), and I probably could recite a few lyrics from it.
posted by small_ruminant at 10:19 PM on September 30, 2013
posted by small_ruminant at 10:19 PM on September 30, 2013
I saw schoolhouse rock at school. Is that not common? I just assumed it was because it happened so many times.
posted by NoraReed at 10:37 PM on September 30, 2013
posted by NoraReed at 10:37 PM on September 30, 2013
I saw schoolhouse rock at school. Is that not common?
That's very age-dependent. We had film projectors at school, so occasionally we got to see things that were available on 16-mm film. That meant "Paddle to the Sea" and "The Red Balloon" and... "Paddle to the Sea". But mainly we memorized arithmetic tables, read about Dick and Jane, practiced how to write in cursive, and rehearsed what we would do (lie down in neat rows and die) in the event of a nuclear attack.
posted by pracowity at 12:33 AM on October 1, 2013 [1 favorite]
That's very age-dependent. We had film projectors at school, so occasionally we got to see things that were available on 16-mm film. That meant "Paddle to the Sea" and "The Red Balloon" and... "Paddle to the Sea". But mainly we memorized arithmetic tables, read about Dick and Jane, practiced how to write in cursive, and rehearsed what we would do (lie down in neat rows and die) in the event of a nuclear attack.
posted by pracowity at 12:33 AM on October 1, 2013 [1 favorite]
Yeah, we watched The fucking Red Balloon every time it rained (I live in the northwest, or at least the edge of it, so it rained.)
Whose fucking idea was it to make kids watch The Red Balloon over and over? Ugh!
Though one day in algebra class at summer school we watched Rambo. Pretty sure that wasn't pre-approved material. My parents would have had a conniption.
posted by small_ruminant at 9:36 AM on October 1, 2013
Whose fucking idea was it to make kids watch The Red Balloon over and over? Ugh!
Though one day in algebra class at summer school we watched Rambo. Pretty sure that wasn't pre-approved material. My parents would have had a conniption.
posted by small_ruminant at 9:36 AM on October 1, 2013
Maybe knock-knock jokes? I can't imagine another country coming up with something so corny.
posted by orrnyereg at 1:54 PM on October 1, 2013
posted by orrnyereg at 1:54 PM on October 1, 2013
Awesome notion, orrnyereg, that you could shout out "Knock knock" to a mixed roomful of people and only the Americans would respond with the instinctive "Who's There?"
But is your assumption correct? I looked around, and it may be -- the question's been asked before but never here, as far as I can tell. (That discussion implies that they're also known in Australia.)
posted by Rash at 3:39 PM on October 1, 2013
But is your assumption correct? I looked around, and it may be -- the question's been asked before but never here, as far as I can tell. (That discussion implies that they're also known in Australia.)
posted by Rash at 3:39 PM on October 1, 2013
Maybe knock-knock jokes?
Seriously? Is there a country in the english-speaking world that doesn't have knock-knock jokes?
posted by HiroProtagonist at 6:59 PM on October 1, 2013 [1 favorite]
Seriously? Is there a country in the english-speaking world that doesn't have knock-knock jokes?
posted by HiroProtagonist at 6:59 PM on October 1, 2013 [1 favorite]
Best answer: What about place name pronunciations, especially those that are Native American in origin? I bet many non-Americans have only ever seen them in print. You can pick out a Wisconsinite based on how they pronounce Fond du Lac or Prairie du Chien.
posted by desjardins at 8:27 AM on October 2, 2013
- Albuquerque
- Yosemite
- Applachia
- Baton Rouge (i.e. the first part is not prounounced the French way)
- Amarillo (not pronounced the Spanish way)
- Boise
- Syracuse
posted by desjardins at 8:27 AM on October 2, 2013
Baton Rouge (i.e. the first part is not prounounced the French way)
Yes, it absolutely is. Or at least, that's a perfectly acceptable pronunciation. Someone with a Cajun accent will say it exactly as it's pronounced in French, and people without Cajun accents will say a more anglicized variation of that, but definitely something recognizeable as "the French way", and not the English word "baton".
In fact, that highlights one of the main problems with the pronunciation test -- a lot of these are highly localized, in a way where you're going to get different pronunciations based on exactly how local the speaker is to the place in question.
A Francophone/Cajun-accented Louisianian will say Baton Rouge in French, pronounced correctly for French.
Someone from southern Louisiana but who is not a French speaker will say a very close approximation of the French: "Batten Rouzh".
Someone from northern Louisiana or the Deep South will say "Batten Rooj".
Someone from completely outside the area will probably say "BAT-awn Rooj".
Only then do you get someone completely unfamiliar with the existence of such a place, who will pronounce it in some wacky way that would immediately mark them as a foreigner/outsider/potential spy. And I still think you have to go pretty far afield to find someone with no cultural literacy whatsoever who can't guess that the words are French and err on the side of the French pronunciation, which, again, is a perfectly acceptable pronunciation.
Sure, if you ask a potential spy to pronounce Baton Rouge and they say "ba-TAWN roo-GAY" or something, yeah, dead giveaway. But only the stupidest spy is going to say that. Especially since Baton Rouge is a state capital, and thus easily memorized.
posted by Sara C. at 2:41 PM on October 2, 2013 [1 favorite]
Yes, it absolutely is. Or at least, that's a perfectly acceptable pronunciation. Someone with a Cajun accent will say it exactly as it's pronounced in French, and people without Cajun accents will say a more anglicized variation of that, but definitely something recognizeable as "the French way", and not the English word "baton".
In fact, that highlights one of the main problems with the pronunciation test -- a lot of these are highly localized, in a way where you're going to get different pronunciations based on exactly how local the speaker is to the place in question.
A Francophone/Cajun-accented Louisianian will say Baton Rouge in French, pronounced correctly for French.
Someone from southern Louisiana but who is not a French speaker will say a very close approximation of the French: "Batten Rouzh".
Someone from northern Louisiana or the Deep South will say "Batten Rooj".
Someone from completely outside the area will probably say "BAT-awn Rooj".
Only then do you get someone completely unfamiliar with the existence of such a place, who will pronounce it in some wacky way that would immediately mark them as a foreigner/outsider/potential spy. And I still think you have to go pretty far afield to find someone with no cultural literacy whatsoever who can't guess that the words are French and err on the side of the French pronunciation, which, again, is a perfectly acceptable pronunciation.
Sure, if you ask a potential spy to pronounce Baton Rouge and they say "ba-TAWN roo-GAY" or something, yeah, dead giveaway. But only the stupidest spy is going to say that. Especially since Baton Rouge is a state capital, and thus easily memorized.
posted by Sara C. at 2:41 PM on October 2, 2013 [1 favorite]
What is the job of a rodeo clown?
Rodeo is a Thing in Canada (and Australia, and even here in New Zealand) too.
posted by Catch at 11:52 PM on October 4, 2013
Rodeo is a Thing in Canada (and Australia, and even here in New Zealand) too.
posted by Catch at 11:52 PM on October 4, 2013
Also, I'm an American -- and even an American from a rural place where there are sometimes rodeos -- and I couldn't tell you what a rodeo clown does aside from... clowning around at rodeos?
posted by Sara C. at 12:49 AM on October 5, 2013
posted by Sara C. at 12:49 AM on October 5, 2013
The shibboleths used in WWII were mostly specific to males of a certain age. It's not an apples-to-apples comparison if your modern day shibboleths don't also share that limitation.
There are many local/regional/temporal/cultural/subcultural shibboleths, but modern national shibboleths are hard, because the US is large, the US is diverse, and the US freely exports and imports much of its mass culture. This is all the more true in the internet age.
Many of your "best answers" are puzzling to me. For example, I don't know what goes on top of a green bean casserole.
...
The school system is a great angle, though. The US has a unique school system, and even homeschooled people would know it.
posted by Sticherbeast at 9:43 AM on October 5, 2013
There are many local/regional/temporal/cultural/subcultural shibboleths, but modern national shibboleths are hard, because the US is large, the US is diverse, and the US freely exports and imports much of its mass culture. This is all the more true in the internet age.
Many of your "best answers" are puzzling to me. For example, I don't know what goes on top of a green bean casserole.
...
The school system is a great angle, though. The US has a unique school system, and even homeschooled people would know it.
posted by Sticherbeast at 9:43 AM on October 5, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by The Whelk at 7:23 AM on September 29, 2013 [5 favorites]