Please. Stop. Whining.
June 11, 2013 6:34 PM Subscribe
My dog whines incessantly when I leave him alone. Time has passed. I've tried all the things. Dog is otherwise great. It is time for my sweet pup who I otherwise adore to chill out quietly in his kennel so that I can leave the house. What to do?
I have a three year old lab mix who I rescued from a shelter about four months ago. He is mostly an awesome dog, and he's settled in brilliantly (aside from the occasional plastic bag snack). He's a well-socialized and confident little guy, training up quite nicely. We've done an obedience class together, on top of the puppy class I'm pretty sure his original owners put him through.
There's just one ongoing problem. He cannot be left alone for any amount of time without whining. Continuously. For hours.
For the first few months I had him, this was clearly separation anxiety. To make a long story short, anxiety is not an immediate problem anymore.
Except for the whining. He wines CONSTANTLY and FOR HOURS any time I leave him, even just for a few minutes. He does not tire himself out. Even if I leave him at a time that he usually wants to be napping in his kennel, anyway. He will make an exception to his routine in order to get some quality whining in.
My downstairs neighbors are very annoyed with the whining, and at this point are dropping not so subtle hints that I should rehome him.
I've basically not left the house without my dog since February. Running errands is a huge pain, and doing anything fun is out of the question. I have guests coming to town next month, and not doing anything with them because of the dog is not an option. At this point, the dog has got to settle down and be OK alone for short periods.
What can I do? Is there a foolproof recipe for getting a dog to stop whining? He doesn't have this problem when I'm there, and when I'm around and he whines, he self-calms after being ignored for a few minutes. I am comfortable with simple training techniques and have about three weeks to devote to nipping this in the bud once and for all.
Or is there another way around this? Some way I can mask the noise my downstairs neighbors hear? Some kind of understanding we can come to? If you've been in a whining dog/thin walls situation before, how did you handle it?
Please assume I have done all the commonly recommended training and shaping stuff for general separation anxiety. Also please assume my dog gets plenty of exercise and mental stimulation.
I have a three year old lab mix who I rescued from a shelter about four months ago. He is mostly an awesome dog, and he's settled in brilliantly (aside from the occasional plastic bag snack). He's a well-socialized and confident little guy, training up quite nicely. We've done an obedience class together, on top of the puppy class I'm pretty sure his original owners put him through.
There's just one ongoing problem. He cannot be left alone for any amount of time without whining. Continuously. For hours.
For the first few months I had him, this was clearly separation anxiety. To make a long story short, anxiety is not an immediate problem anymore.
Except for the whining. He wines CONSTANTLY and FOR HOURS any time I leave him, even just for a few minutes. He does not tire himself out. Even if I leave him at a time that he usually wants to be napping in his kennel, anyway. He will make an exception to his routine in order to get some quality whining in.
My downstairs neighbors are very annoyed with the whining, and at this point are dropping not so subtle hints that I should rehome him.
I've basically not left the house without my dog since February. Running errands is a huge pain, and doing anything fun is out of the question. I have guests coming to town next month, and not doing anything with them because of the dog is not an option. At this point, the dog has got to settle down and be OK alone for short periods.
What can I do? Is there a foolproof recipe for getting a dog to stop whining? He doesn't have this problem when I'm there, and when I'm around and he whines, he self-calms after being ignored for a few minutes. I am comfortable with simple training techniques and have about three weeks to devote to nipping this in the bud once and for all.
Or is there another way around this? Some way I can mask the noise my downstairs neighbors hear? Some kind of understanding we can come to? If you've been in a whining dog/thin walls situation before, how did you handle it?
Please assume I have done all the commonly recommended training and shaping stuff for general separation anxiety. Also please assume my dog gets plenty of exercise and mental stimulation.
Best answer: Have you talked to your vet about meds? Even just Benadryl might help him relax.
How about long-lasting treats to get over the initial separation hump?
If it's any consolation, I had the same problem, and it took a lot longer than four months for her to adjust and be more secure in her new setting about being alone. I know this isn't much help now, though.
posted by supercres at 6:41 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
How about long-lasting treats to get over the initial separation hump?
If it's any consolation, I had the same problem, and it took a lot longer than four months for her to adjust and be more secure in her new setting about being alone. I know this isn't much help now, though.
posted by supercres at 6:41 PM on June 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
Does "all the things" include the Thundershirt?
posted by thelonius at 6:45 PM on June 11, 2013 [8 favorites]
posted by thelonius at 6:45 PM on June 11, 2013 [8 favorites]
Second dog? He's probably reeeally worried about being alone from his time at the shelter. But I know that's unlikely to work for an apartment dweller.
posted by amtho at 6:51 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by amtho at 6:51 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Maybe a white noise machine would make the whining less noticeable for your neighbors.
posted by bluesapphires at 7:05 PM on June 11, 2013
posted by bluesapphires at 7:05 PM on June 11, 2013
Best answer: Take your dog to a vet and ask about Fluoxitine. We had a cat with severe separation anxiety and a small, daily dose chilled him out instantly. It is more commonly used for separation anxiety in dogs and is used to treat depression/anxiety in humans. Your vet might also recommend behavioral therapy and with time your dog may be weened off of the medication. It is affordable as well, we pay $12 dollars or so for a monthly supply.
Side effects are also very mild. If I recall, our cat lost his appetite for a while, but obviously your vet can tell you more.
posted by Young Kullervo at 7:16 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Side effects are also very mild. If I recall, our cat lost his appetite for a while, but obviously your vet can tell you more.
posted by Young Kullervo at 7:16 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: supercres, what did you do in order to live a somewhat normal life in the time that it took to get your dog adjusted? I'm OK with the idea that this has been a long time coming (I know it's awful to complain about a little non-anxious whining when a few months ago he was literally ripping the place apart), but something's got to give. Tomorrow I have to pay to put him in daycare so I can return some things to a store. It's getting very, very old.
posted by Sara C. at 7:20 PM on June 11, 2013
posted by Sara C. at 7:20 PM on June 11, 2013
Maybe you've tried this already, but get some really awesome treats - hot dog or bacon bits. Put him in the kennel and leave the house as normal, but just stand outside and listen. As soon as he starts whining, open the door, make your "no" noise, and leave the house again. After 30-60 seconds with no whining, come in, praise him and give an awesome treat. Repeat several times a day, every day, and gradually build the time up more - you may want to have a book or something outside so you can sit out there for 10, 20, 30 minutes waiting. But start with very small, frequent sessions.
He also might just be scared by the quietness. A lot of people leave the radio or TV on for their dog.
posted by nakedmolerats at 7:21 PM on June 11, 2013 [7 favorites]
He also might just be scared by the quietness. A lot of people leave the radio or TV on for their dog.
posted by nakedmolerats at 7:21 PM on June 11, 2013 [7 favorites]
More bad news: nothing. It just took time before she was happy and secure enough with us, and knows we're her forever-people. We're not in an apartment, so there's no one to complain. It went from 30 minutes of barking, to 15 minutes, down to 0-1 minutes.
We had a dog walker for a while, and now I come home in the middle of the day. She's ok for 4-5 hours by herself. She starts up again when she hits about that time because she's bored/has to pee.
She almost never goes in her crate voluntarily, but we never put her in there when we're annoyed with her, and give her tons of praise when she goes in for the day.
Maybe a crate cover so it feels more cozy?
posted by supercres at 7:31 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
We had a dog walker for a while, and now I come home in the middle of the day. She's ok for 4-5 hours by herself. She starts up again when she hits about that time because she's bored/has to pee.
She almost never goes in her crate voluntarily, but we never put her in there when we're annoyed with her, and give her tons of praise when she goes in for the day.
Maybe a crate cover so it feels more cozy?
posted by supercres at 7:31 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Bonus: the crate cover muffles some of the sound. Rug under the crate for sure. Blanket over it if it's not too hot. On that note, make sure the crate isn't too hot or too cold.
posted by supercres at 7:33 PM on June 11, 2013
posted by supercres at 7:33 PM on June 11, 2013
Best answer: what kind of feedback is she getting when you leave and she whines?
I mean, exactly what is the timeline of everything from the time you decide you want to leave until you are in the car? Specifically, are you re-entering your home after exiting it? If you are, he has trained you to respond to the whining and is sort of running on the extinction burst. If you are exhibiting anxiety before you go, that might be rubbing off on the dog (they really do respond to your body language, so if you're annoyed by the whining, they know it but can't figure out what's wrong. So they worry for you.)
If it's not that, then my suggestions are (and you probably are trying or have tried most of these):
posted by bilabial at 7:53 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
I mean, exactly what is the timeline of everything from the time you decide you want to leave until you are in the car? Specifically, are you re-entering your home after exiting it? If you are, he has trained you to respond to the whining and is sort of running on the extinction burst. If you are exhibiting anxiety before you go, that might be rubbing off on the dog (they really do respond to your body language, so if you're annoyed by the whining, they know it but can't figure out what's wrong. So they worry for you.)
If it's not that, then my suggestions are (and you probably are trying or have tried most of these):
- Boredom? try a good puzzle toy, or a kong filled with something tasty.
- Fear of sound or quiet? are you leaving a tv or radio on? If yes, change the station. If no, try the local NPR affiliate (music is not crazy, the talk is gentle)
- Try having a friend come over to stay in your home while you leave. Try this in 30 second, 1 minute, etc, increasing increments, first out of the crate, social like. Have the other person reward/click your dog when you are gone and dog isn't whining. Any whining gets a command to do something else that you desire. Not a no, but a command to sit or shake. Find a few friends willing to do this, and work up to like, an hour. Then work up to you leaving while the friend is over and the dog is in the crate. Yes, these have to be pretty good friends! Your dog will learn that you always come back, without having to be alone. Then you can transition to working on leaving the dog all alone.
- Make the crate more comfortable? This doesn't work for every dog, especially given her history as a chewer, but maybe a blanket? Or, as supercres suggests, a cover. Even just a blanket or a sheet will make the crate more like the cozy den that some people suggest is the evolutionary analog to crates.
- Don't ever use the crate to punish. Suggest a few times during the day that he go to his crate, and reward for that. Make the crate the awesomest place to go. So that when you leave him there in lockup it doesn't feel like doggie jail.
posted by bilabial at 7:53 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
Try a different kind/size of crate? Maybe he associates the crate with the scary ones at the shelter?
But I would try muddgirl's advice first. He'll probably make a different kind of noise galumphing around the room for a while, so warn the neighbors of your experiment?
posted by SuperSquirrel at 8:00 PM on June 11, 2013
But I would try muddgirl's advice first. He'll probably make a different kind of noise galumphing around the room for a while, so warn the neighbors of your experiment?
posted by SuperSquirrel at 8:00 PM on June 11, 2013
I've had a dog with separation anxiety in an apartment. He was a solo dog for 6 months and it was about that long before we saw any real results, while he wasn't gotten for that purpose, the arrival of our second dog pretty much solved the anxiety problems.
Things that helped us and some other ideas follow.
Leave a radio or tv on in the room with him, the sound can not only sooth the dog it can help muffle some of the whining. One of my dogs loves the shopping network, lots of talking I think helps.
Have you tried pheromone collars or plug in, we had good luck with a dog with separation anxiety with those. Meds might help as it seems a bit of an emergency situation with it being in an apartment so it might be worth seeing a vet about. Look for anti anxiety meds and not just ones that make the dog sleepy.
My MIL's dog got claustrophobia or some such thing when locked in his crate (with or without a cover) and would stress out and cry continually whenever he was in it so they just stopped putting him in, some dogs love crating some don't. Just because you are crating correctly doesn't mean the previous owners did and that might be adding to the stress, so that might be an area to work on making the crate a nice experience for him.
Leave the dog with kongs like other have suggested. Put lots of high value yummies in there to distract him. Use 3 or 4 kongs if you have to to keep him busy.
Do you leave something with your smell on in the crate with the dog?
Keep trips short at first when you leave the dog. 5 mins here or there and then slowly build up the time away. When you return, stay calm and don't reward the dog with lots of pats hello, just act like nothing happened. Try to keep your coming and going times to a routine, dogs love routine. If they know when they are going to expect you home they relax more, I know from experience this is hard when you work from home.
Dog training classes might help, not so much directly with the issue, but will help build up your dogs confidence and so it won't stress as much when you are separated. We had great results with agility training building up the confidence of our second dog. Or look at getting a trainer to come around, a good trainer would help you work on techniques to work on with your dog and maybe offer more personalized suggestions, they are less expensive than you think. Also you can tell your neighbour you are getting a trainer to work on the issue, which might defuse him a bit.
Walk your dog a huge long walk before you go out make him even tireder than he normally is at the time he likes to nap. A tired dog does tend to be quieter. For a dog the size of yours a nice half hour - one hour walk before you go will help.
Just some ideas as I'm not sure what you have and haven't done. Good luck with everything, remember dogs can get over this, it just takes a bit of time.
posted by wwax at 8:01 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
Things that helped us and some other ideas follow.
Leave a radio or tv on in the room with him, the sound can not only sooth the dog it can help muffle some of the whining. One of my dogs loves the shopping network, lots of talking I think helps.
Have you tried pheromone collars or plug in, we had good luck with a dog with separation anxiety with those. Meds might help as it seems a bit of an emergency situation with it being in an apartment so it might be worth seeing a vet about. Look for anti anxiety meds and not just ones that make the dog sleepy.
My MIL's dog got claustrophobia or some such thing when locked in his crate (with or without a cover) and would stress out and cry continually whenever he was in it so they just stopped putting him in, some dogs love crating some don't. Just because you are crating correctly doesn't mean the previous owners did and that might be adding to the stress, so that might be an area to work on making the crate a nice experience for him.
Leave the dog with kongs like other have suggested. Put lots of high value yummies in there to distract him. Use 3 or 4 kongs if you have to to keep him busy.
Do you leave something with your smell on in the crate with the dog?
Keep trips short at first when you leave the dog. 5 mins here or there and then slowly build up the time away. When you return, stay calm and don't reward the dog with lots of pats hello, just act like nothing happened. Try to keep your coming and going times to a routine, dogs love routine. If they know when they are going to expect you home they relax more, I know from experience this is hard when you work from home.
Dog training classes might help, not so much directly with the issue, but will help build up your dogs confidence and so it won't stress as much when you are separated. We had great results with agility training building up the confidence of our second dog. Or look at getting a trainer to come around, a good trainer would help you work on techniques to work on with your dog and maybe offer more personalized suggestions, they are less expensive than you think. Also you can tell your neighbour you are getting a trainer to work on the issue, which might defuse him a bit.
Walk your dog a huge long walk before you go out make him even tireder than he normally is at the time he likes to nap. A tired dog does tend to be quieter. For a dog the size of yours a nice half hour - one hour walk before you go will help.
Just some ideas as I'm not sure what you have and haven't done. Good luck with everything, remember dogs can get over this, it just takes a bit of time.
posted by wwax at 8:01 PM on June 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
Is regular everyday puppy daycare not an option?
posted by elizardbits at 8:02 PM on June 11, 2013
posted by elizardbits at 8:02 PM on June 11, 2013
Response by poster: Early best answer for the "enlist a friend" idea. I had not thought of that. He's fine doing daycare a few days a week, but that's different because it's a change of venue and DOGS TO PLAY WITH YAY! Also, I might be able to get the annoyed neighbors involved here -- aside from whining dog, we are good friends -- which might help them feel like they have a little control.
But, of course, keep the ideas coming.
(I also love the rug under the crate idea. There are already blankets inside and covering, but more insulation is surely better.)
Answers to other questions:
- My boy loves his crate. Hangs out there voluntarily. Goes in on command. Leaving him out of the crate when I'm gone is simply not an option, and never will be until we are years past the vaguest whiff of separation anxiety. The crate is basically my best friend right now in terms of whipping his anxiety.
- We do daycare a few days a week, and it has been a godsend, but it is not cheap. It also doesn't solve every problem.
- A second dog is not happening, partially because of my tiny apartment, but also because, well, what happens if dog #2 has real problems? Getting another dog because one dog is whiny is a pretty "there was an old lady who swallowed a fly" approach to this problem.
- As I said, separation anxiety in general is not really the problem anymore. My dog is, at this point, not exhibiting any other anxiety symptoms. He's just whining.
posted by Sara C. at 8:16 PM on June 11, 2013
But, of course, keep the ideas coming.
(I also love the rug under the crate idea. There are already blankets inside and covering, but more insulation is surely better.)
Answers to other questions:
- My boy loves his crate. Hangs out there voluntarily. Goes in on command. Leaving him out of the crate when I'm gone is simply not an option, and never will be until we are years past the vaguest whiff of separation anxiety. The crate is basically my best friend right now in terms of whipping his anxiety.
- We do daycare a few days a week, and it has been a godsend, but it is not cheap. It also doesn't solve every problem.
- A second dog is not happening, partially because of my tiny apartment, but also because, well, what happens if dog #2 has real problems? Getting another dog because one dog is whiny is a pretty "there was an old lady who swallowed a fly" approach to this problem.
- As I said, separation anxiety in general is not really the problem anymore. My dog is, at this point, not exhibiting any other anxiety symptoms. He's just whining.
posted by Sara C. at 8:16 PM on June 11, 2013
The only things I could think of are:
Clicker training (although I found with my lab mix it was much easier to get her to do something than to get her to stop doing something).
Thunder shirt (although I've been loathe to leave her in it for long stretches when I'm not around, in case she gets too hot or something. That might just be me. )
Maybe leave the radio or tv on for him? Like NPR playing softly? It might serve as a reminder that humans are around and keep him company.
I'd also recommend exercising the crap out of him. I think in general that's always a help for all behavior issues with labs.
Good luck
posted by loveyallaround at 8:54 PM on June 11, 2013
Clicker training (although I found with my lab mix it was much easier to get her to do something than to get her to stop doing something).
Thunder shirt (although I've been loathe to leave her in it for long stretches when I'm not around, in case she gets too hot or something. That might just be me. )
Maybe leave the radio or tv on for him? Like NPR playing softly? It might serve as a reminder that humans are around and keep him company.
I'd also recommend exercising the crap out of him. I think in general that's always a help for all behavior issues with labs.
Good luck
posted by loveyallaround at 8:54 PM on June 11, 2013
Oh just looked at the picture. What a handsome boy -- and those bedroom eyes!!
posted by loveyallaround at 9:03 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by loveyallaround at 9:03 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
My dog looooves his crate, too ... when we're around.
I assume as part of the separation anxiety work, y'all did separation training (leave for a few seconds, return; Leave for longer and longer periods of time, etc)? I wonder if you have to go back and start that over, and try to catch him before he starts whining (like, put him in the crate, walk to the door, turn immediately back around and praise/treat. Then the next time, open the door, return, praise treat, then out the door for a split second, etc. etc.)
posted by muddgirl at 9:16 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
I assume as part of the separation anxiety work, y'all did separation training (leave for a few seconds, return; Leave for longer and longer periods of time, etc)? I wonder if you have to go back and start that over, and try to catch him before he starts whining (like, put him in the crate, walk to the door, turn immediately back around and praise/treat. Then the next time, open the door, return, praise treat, then out the door for a split second, etc. etc.)
posted by muddgirl at 9:16 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
He doesn't have this problem when I'm there, and when I'm around and he whines, he self-calms after being ignored for a few minutes.
This!
When you come home, do you go right to the crate and let him out right away?
Try leaving him in his crate for a few minutes until he calms down.... Then let him out.
Try this for a few days and see what happens.
posted by bq at 9:48 PM on June 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
This!
When you come home, do you go right to the crate and let him out right away?
Try leaving him in his crate for a few minutes until he calms down.... Then let him out.
Try this for a few days and see what happens.
posted by bq at 9:48 PM on June 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
Could you leave the crate open?
Crates/cages are a relatively new thing in keeping dogs as pets; thirty years ago, no one I know put their dog in any kind of cage. It's not like dogs need them.
If it's open, he can still sit in it if it makes him feel safer, but he has the choice to go out of it too.
posted by Too-Ticky at 12:20 AM on June 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
Crates/cages are a relatively new thing in keeping dogs as pets; thirty years ago, no one I know put their dog in any kind of cage. It's not like dogs need them.
If it's open, he can still sit in it if it makes him feel safer, but he has the choice to go out of it too.
posted by Too-Ticky at 12:20 AM on June 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
Had a dog who did this. Two things helped. One was a second dog. The other was fluoxetine (Prozac).
posted by professor plum with a rope at 2:21 AM on June 12, 2013
posted by professor plum with a rope at 2:21 AM on June 12, 2013
"Crates/cages are a relatively new thing in keeping dogs as pets; thirty years ago, no one I know put their dog in any kind of cage. It's not like dogs need them."
This.
Every dog loves their place - which can be a dog bed/pillow/blanket on the floor.
Try to change the crate for an open bedding option and see how that changes things. Even as an experiment for some time at first.
Please note that I did read your update. Parts of it can be attributed to the "my place" thing ("My boy loves his crate. Hangs out there voluntarily. Goes in on command.")
However this: "Leaving him out of the crate when I'm gone is simply not an option, and never will be until we are years past the vaguest whiff of separation anxiety. The crate is basically my best friend right now in terms of whipping his anxiety." is a bit crass.
Consider that the crate was a crutch until he felt safe enough with his new home and you. Now he seems to have reached that level. Now it might be your crutch.
posted by travelwithcats at 4:17 AM on June 12, 2013 [3 favorites]
This.
Every dog loves their place - which can be a dog bed/pillow/blanket on the floor.
Try to change the crate for an open bedding option and see how that changes things. Even as an experiment for some time at first.
Please note that I did read your update. Parts of it can be attributed to the "my place" thing ("My boy loves his crate. Hangs out there voluntarily. Goes in on command.")
However this: "Leaving him out of the crate when I'm gone is simply not an option, and never will be until we are years past the vaguest whiff of separation anxiety. The crate is basically my best friend right now in terms of whipping his anxiety." is a bit crass.
Consider that the crate was a crutch until he felt safe enough with his new home and you. Now he seems to have reached that level. Now it might be your crutch.
posted by travelwithcats at 4:17 AM on June 12, 2013 [3 favorites]
A few ideas that worked for our barky dogs.
Routine for leaving. On workdays, I get up at about 5AM, we hang out while I have coffee. Then, we take a solid 2 mile/30 min walk. They get breakfast while I shower. We start ignoring the dogs about 20 mins before we leave. They can have a few gentle pats but no real talking of interacting. The dogs (we have 2) start to relax and transition into sleepy time. They get Kongs stuffed with some kind of animal jerky, kibble and a little peanut butter every time we leave. The jerky was a recent innovation of mine. I stuff it in the Kong in a way that makes them really work for it. When we are leaving, they go to their spots on the floor, we start up white noise over the sound system, they start drooling, we give them kongs, say "We will be back" and calmly take our leave. We haven't had trouble with separation anxiety, per se, but barking while we were gone was a problem. I strongly encourage you to develop a leaving routine with a leaving "command."
One of our dogs was an angel in the crate. The other. . .he would be ok if you were with him in the room but would whine and yip if left alone in the crate. He destroyed a lot while we worked on his house manners but the crate was obviously stressful while we were away and it wasn't worth it to push the issue.
Cover windows and doors to reduce stimulation from outside.
Video tape the pup while you are gone. We discovered that our neighbors said they barked all day but the dogs would bark for about 15 seconds every hour or so. Super annoying but a different problem than all day. It turned out they could see out the front window into a courtyard where cats and people would hangout. We covered the window and played white noise and the problem was solved. If you are relaying on neighbors, even good friends, videotape a few hours just to see. You can show it to a trainer if you hire someone to help you out.
You might consider hiring a good positive trainer to help you with this issue. I think this is your first dog? I know we really value our relationship with our trainer because he has so much experience and can think of things to try that we haven't. And his manner is so great with dogs that is helps reduce our stress just to see him work with the dogs.
Finally, exercise. I know you exercise your pup a lot. We were SHOCKED how much it really takes to tire our dogs out so that they just sleep while we are gone. If you can, pump up the length or speed of your walks, or run with the pup, and/or have training breaks in the walk. So, walk and sniff then spend 30 seconds in heel, or doing doggy push ups. Our dogs walk or run about 5 miles a day during the week. On the weekends, it can be up to 15 miles a day of mostly running on trails with great smells and sights. This seems to work and if I drop below that, they get barky.
Good luck. This is really hard and having annoyed neighbors is the worst! You are doing a good job and pup is lucky to have you. I would also suggest giving him more time to relax. When we moved recently, it took our dogs about 6 months to calm down and relax while alone and they have both lived with us since they were puppies.
posted by rachums at 4:53 AM on June 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
Routine for leaving. On workdays, I get up at about 5AM, we hang out while I have coffee. Then, we take a solid 2 mile/30 min walk. They get breakfast while I shower. We start ignoring the dogs about 20 mins before we leave. They can have a few gentle pats but no real talking of interacting. The dogs (we have 2) start to relax and transition into sleepy time. They get Kongs stuffed with some kind of animal jerky, kibble and a little peanut butter every time we leave. The jerky was a recent innovation of mine. I stuff it in the Kong in a way that makes them really work for it. When we are leaving, they go to their spots on the floor, we start up white noise over the sound system, they start drooling, we give them kongs, say "We will be back" and calmly take our leave. We haven't had trouble with separation anxiety, per se, but barking while we were gone was a problem. I strongly encourage you to develop a leaving routine with a leaving "command."
One of our dogs was an angel in the crate. The other. . .he would be ok if you were with him in the room but would whine and yip if left alone in the crate. He destroyed a lot while we worked on his house manners but the crate was obviously stressful while we were away and it wasn't worth it to push the issue.
Cover windows and doors to reduce stimulation from outside.
Video tape the pup while you are gone. We discovered that our neighbors said they barked all day but the dogs would bark for about 15 seconds every hour or so. Super annoying but a different problem than all day. It turned out they could see out the front window into a courtyard where cats and people would hangout. We covered the window and played white noise and the problem was solved. If you are relaying on neighbors, even good friends, videotape a few hours just to see. You can show it to a trainer if you hire someone to help you out.
You might consider hiring a good positive trainer to help you with this issue. I think this is your first dog? I know we really value our relationship with our trainer because he has so much experience and can think of things to try that we haven't. And his manner is so great with dogs that is helps reduce our stress just to see him work with the dogs.
Finally, exercise. I know you exercise your pup a lot. We were SHOCKED how much it really takes to tire our dogs out so that they just sleep while we are gone. If you can, pump up the length or speed of your walks, or run with the pup, and/or have training breaks in the walk. So, walk and sniff then spend 30 seconds in heel, or doing doggy push ups. Our dogs walk or run about 5 miles a day during the week. On the weekends, it can be up to 15 miles a day of mostly running on trails with great smells and sights. This seems to work and if I drop below that, they get barky.
Good luck. This is really hard and having annoyed neighbors is the worst! You are doing a good job and pup is lucky to have you. I would also suggest giving him more time to relax. When we moved recently, it took our dogs about 6 months to calm down and relax while alone and they have both lived with us since they were puppies.
posted by rachums at 4:53 AM on June 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
I wish crate training had been a more common thing when we got our first puppy, who had severe separation anxiety with destruction and whining/howling (one neighbor comment: "was your dog having puppies the other night?").
Basically it just took time/training with suggestions as you are receiving here. But to answer the question about getting by until the dog was not freaking out, we resorted to tricking the dog.
This was a small basement apartment with one exit and those sort of skinny windows at ceiling height. The dog's "spot" was a dog bed in the kitchen near the exit. Our bedroom door was at the opposite end of the kitchen. The dog slept in its bed and we closed the bedroom door when we went to sleep and the dog had no problem with that after just a little training (sometimes we'd find her sleeping against the bedroom door in the morning).
So when we wanted to go out for the night, we'd start acting like we were getting ready for bed. Then I would take the dog into a spare room out of sight of the kitchen area and distract her and my wife would close the bedroom door and then go out the front door. Then I'd pretend to get ready a bit more then get the dog into her bed then go into the bedroom and shut the door, turn out the lights, etc. Then I would stand on the bed, take the screen out of the window, shimmy up and through, put the screen back on and we were good to go. The dog always freaked out a bit when we came home but never figured out exactly what was going on.
A bit ridiculous, to be sure, but we got to go out with no neighbor/landlord complaints.
posted by mikepop at 5:47 AM on June 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
Basically it just took time/training with suggestions as you are receiving here. But to answer the question about getting by until the dog was not freaking out, we resorted to tricking the dog.
This was a small basement apartment with one exit and those sort of skinny windows at ceiling height. The dog's "spot" was a dog bed in the kitchen near the exit. Our bedroom door was at the opposite end of the kitchen. The dog slept in its bed and we closed the bedroom door when we went to sleep and the dog had no problem with that after just a little training (sometimes we'd find her sleeping against the bedroom door in the morning).
So when we wanted to go out for the night, we'd start acting like we were getting ready for bed. Then I would take the dog into a spare room out of sight of the kitchen area and distract her and my wife would close the bedroom door and then go out the front door. Then I'd pretend to get ready a bit more then get the dog into her bed then go into the bedroom and shut the door, turn out the lights, etc. Then I would stand on the bed, take the screen out of the window, shimmy up and through, put the screen back on and we were good to go. The dog always freaked out a bit when we came home but never figured out exactly what was going on.
A bit ridiculous, to be sure, but we got to go out with no neighbor/landlord complaints.
posted by mikepop at 5:47 AM on June 12, 2013 [2 favorites]
Our dog had separation anxiety, and we did the things suggested above, which all helped, even getting a webcam so we could check on her during the day. What ended up completely solving the problem was trying her with short and ever expanding time out of the crate, and she was just fine. Now she has a dog walker during the day, and we're all happy.
You might look into an exercise pen (or x pen) for your dog like this one - it's essentially a deconstructed crate you can set up to block off spaces to see how your dog does.
posted by canine epigram at 6:07 AM on June 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
You might look into an exercise pen (or x pen) for your dog like this one - it's essentially a deconstructed crate you can set up to block off spaces to see how your dog does.
posted by canine epigram at 6:07 AM on June 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
We have a lab mix too. He's a huge whiner, kind of in general, but mostly when we leave and come home. When we first got him, we had a downstairs neighbor who HATED him and in turn, us for having a dog. She was pretty terirble.
They complained a ton to the property manager about our dog being noisy all day long. The manager sort of agreed that if all this was true, it would be a problem and we'd have to rehome the dog. I ended up setting up a webcam, as per this askme. I went to work way earlier than my wife, so she gave the dog his frozen solid peanut butter kong, and put him in his crate. I ended up recording him for a full week at work (except for the 15 minutes it took me to get home every day).
The dog whined a total of 30 minutes, and barked 3 times. All of these were when we were leaving the house, or when the mail got dropped off. I then burned all the videos to a dvd and sent them in with my rent check that month. My landlord didn't even look at the DVD, but was so impressed that we went to that much effort to prove our dog wasn't being an asshole, that he basically told Ms. Downstairs Jerkface to shut up about the dog, and that he was cool (and he is, very cool).
There's a possibility your neighbors are like ours were. You need to confirm that your dog is being a serious problem before you need to really need to tackle this.
But for other more concrete things to do?
-Frozen solid kong is like, and hour of focus for a dog. Even a determined one.
-A huge, long run right before crate time. Your dog looks super similar to mine, and if that's the case, he could probably chase a ball for like an hour every day? Do this until the dog is falling over tired right before you crate him. It's good for him, an it's good for you.
posted by furnace.heart at 10:12 AM on June 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
They complained a ton to the property manager about our dog being noisy all day long. The manager sort of agreed that if all this was true, it would be a problem and we'd have to rehome the dog. I ended up setting up a webcam, as per this askme. I went to work way earlier than my wife, so she gave the dog his frozen solid peanut butter kong, and put him in his crate. I ended up recording him for a full week at work (except for the 15 minutes it took me to get home every day).
The dog whined a total of 30 minutes, and barked 3 times. All of these were when we were leaving the house, or when the mail got dropped off. I then burned all the videos to a dvd and sent them in with my rent check that month. My landlord didn't even look at the DVD, but was so impressed that we went to that much effort to prove our dog wasn't being an asshole, that he basically told Ms. Downstairs Jerkface to shut up about the dog, and that he was cool (and he is, very cool).
There's a possibility your neighbors are like ours were. You need to confirm that your dog is being a serious problem before you need to really need to tackle this.
But for other more concrete things to do?
-Frozen solid kong is like, and hour of focus for a dog. Even a determined one.
-A huge, long run right before crate time. Your dog looks super similar to mine, and if that's the case, he could probably chase a ball for like an hour every day? Do this until the dog is falling over tired right before you crate him. It's good for him, an it's good for you.
posted by furnace.heart at 10:12 AM on June 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Update: This week I finally gave in and got the vet involved. After an awesome "let's talk about separation anxiety" appointment, we agreed on a systematic arsenal of different medical options, for two weeks apiece, ultimately leading to prozac if none of the others have an effect. Honestly, just creating a systematic plan and having a pro to check in with every few days makes me feel like there is possibly a light at the end of this tunnel.
posted by Sara C. at 4:31 PM on June 20, 2013
posted by Sara C. at 4:31 PM on June 20, 2013
This thread is closed to new comments.
Have you tried leaving a very stuffed (and possibly frozen) Kong in the kennel? That's usually something tried for separation anxiety but maybe not in this case.
posted by muddgirl at 6:40 PM on June 11, 2013 [1 favorite]