Pricing out different ways to get a travel/live van for two months
April 21, 2013 8:52 AM Subscribe
I'm going to drive around the U.S. for about two months, living out of a vehicle. I don't currently have a car, and I won't be able to keep one after the end of the summer (moving to a big city where a car would be impractical). I've found some excellent sites and prior AskMes that cover all the techniques of actually doing this: the parking, sleeping, health and safety, etc. What I'm having trouble sorting out -- getting conflicting advice with lots of variables -- is whether to lease a vehicle, or buy-and-sell (as well as best makes and models for the buy-and-sell approach). Has anyone done this temporary vehicle approach before, or have more general advice?
(Renting seems to be universally considered the worst possible choice for a trip of this nature.) I will be traveling with friends sometimes, on different legs, so I'd like it to sleep two (maybe three in a pinch?) with bags and pads. If you have any advice about reliability and mileage I'd love to hear it -- and invisibility: many of the people I've talked to about this emphasize the value of cargo vans and the like for blending in. Mostly I'm trying to make sure that the price makes sense: money isn't necessarily the deciding factor (I've budgeted and set aside for this trip, including what I won't be paying in rent) but I'm trying not to take a bath on either lease terms or an illiquid van. Thanks so much for any help!
(Renting seems to be universally considered the worst possible choice for a trip of this nature.) I will be traveling with friends sometimes, on different legs, so I'd like it to sleep two (maybe three in a pinch?) with bags and pads. If you have any advice about reliability and mileage I'd love to hear it -- and invisibility: many of the people I've talked to about this emphasize the value of cargo vans and the like for blending in. Mostly I'm trying to make sure that the price makes sense: money isn't necessarily the deciding factor (I've budgeted and set aside for this trip, including what I won't be paying in rent) but I'm trying not to take a bath on either lease terms or an illiquid van. Thanks so much for any help!
I've never heard of someone leasing a vehicle for this purpose. Are you sure that the lease options even have enough coverage for the mileage you'll be doing? Or is a short enough time span that it wouldn't matter? What are the pros to leasing?
posted by barnone at 9:56 AM on April 21, 2013
posted by barnone at 9:56 AM on April 21, 2013
Two people is no problem; I'd buy a Grand Caravan and remove the rear seats. Caravans are cheap and easy to service and the Grand versions have eight feet between the front seats and the rear door so plenty of space to layout a mattress while still leaving space for your suitcase. Also they are fairly good on gas.
Once you kick it up to three people though you need to accommodate the third seating position. Stow and go seating will solve that but those vans are relatively new (and IMO the stow and go seats are pretty uncomfortable for an adult).
What ever you buy used you can probably sell for about what you paid for it. A single trip around the US won't significantly change the vehicle's value. Especially if you happen to be going from someplace without rust to someplace with rust. The more buying:selling price differential you are willing to accept the easy it would be to sell.
posted by Mitheral at 10:13 AM on April 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Once you kick it up to three people though you need to accommodate the third seating position. Stow and go seating will solve that but those vans are relatively new (and IMO the stow and go seats are pretty uncomfortable for an adult).
What ever you buy used you can probably sell for about what you paid for it. A single trip around the US won't significantly change the vehicle's value. Especially if you happen to be going from someplace without rust to someplace with rust. The more buying:selling price differential you are willing to accept the easy it would be to sell.
posted by Mitheral at 10:13 AM on April 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: I should say I'm moving to Manhattan, and to a really demanding job, so the man-with-a-van plan, while an excellent idea, isn't practical for me right now.
I take the point about leasing -- after your comment, barnone, I realized that all of the people I know who were like, "What, buy? No, lease!" are people I know personally who haven't done this kind of trip (I don't think) -- older professional folks with families. I think they're thinking in terms of buying v. leasing a normal car for two months of commuter-type use. They know about the trip, but I suspect it's just what they're familiar with, so their perspective is reliability, late model, and no headaches trying to sell on the other side. I've been trying to work out how to make leasing practical, and you're right about the mileage issues (among other things). I kept thinking I was missing something, but there may be no way to make it good relative to buying.
posted by the brave tetra-pak at 10:40 AM on April 21, 2013
I take the point about leasing -- after your comment, barnone, I realized that all of the people I know who were like, "What, buy? No, lease!" are people I know personally who haven't done this kind of trip (I don't think) -- older professional folks with families. I think they're thinking in terms of buying v. leasing a normal car for two months of commuter-type use. They know about the trip, but I suspect it's just what they're familiar with, so their perspective is reliability, late model, and no headaches trying to sell on the other side. I've been trying to work out how to make leasing practical, and you're right about the mileage issues (among other things). I kept thinking I was missing something, but there may be no way to make it good relative to buying.
posted by the brave tetra-pak at 10:40 AM on April 21, 2013
Response by poster: Oh, and I should mention I live near Detroit right now, if there's any geographically specific advice about purchasing something along these lines.
posted by the brave tetra-pak at 10:45 AM on April 21, 2013
posted by the brave tetra-pak at 10:45 AM on April 21, 2013
Not sure why a rental won't work, but if you change your mind, there are plenty of vans to rent that have all the living stuff in it. The ease of having everything included might be nice.
posted by Vaike at 11:36 AM on April 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Vaike at 11:36 AM on April 21, 2013 [1 favorite]
Yeah, there are various camper vans you can rent that come included with futons/beds, little tables, curtains on the windows, etc. They run from $50-100 a day depending on size and features. Depending on your preferred ratio of finances:convenience, it might save you from the hassles of buying/registering and selling on the other end. Leasing makes zero sense to me.
posted by barnone at 11:53 AM on April 21, 2013
posted by barnone at 11:53 AM on April 21, 2013
I would think a drawback to buying is if you are 15 days into your trip and the transmission blows, it would suck to have to sink a lot of money into it for repairs when you will be reselling it very soon. Whereas if you rent and that happens, I would think the rental company would just replace the vehicle. Now it you got into an accident that would be different and you would be held responsible for repairs.
I would run the numbers for each option to compare because doing that may eliminate one choice or the other for you.
You don't mention, but what would you do about car insurance? Since you don't have a car now, I assume you're not currently paying it. Most places require proof for purchase or at least having an agent on standby for the call if you want to drive it off the lot. Don't forget to include those costs in your budget.
posted by NoraCharles at 12:41 PM on April 21, 2013
I would run the numbers for each option to compare because doing that may eliminate one choice or the other for you.
You don't mention, but what would you do about car insurance? Since you don't have a car now, I assume you're not currently paying it. Most places require proof for purchase or at least having an agent on standby for the call if you want to drive it off the lot. Don't forget to include those costs in your budget.
posted by NoraCharles at 12:41 PM on April 21, 2013
Best answer: There's a huge churning market for vans like this. Many friends of mine are in bands that seem to buy them, go on tour, then sell them. Several friends have bought one in somewhere like Arkansas and driven it to Washington then dumped it.
I wouldn't screw around with renting one. I'd just find one on Craigslist for a couple grand, take it to a mechanic to have it checked out for $100 or so, get the cheapest possible liability insurance and go. You'll probably end up looking at 3-4 vans before you find a good one.
Oh, and don't get a VW. It might be tempting as there's a strong market for them basically everywhere, but they're pieces of crap and if you break down in a small town you're boned. Everyone I know basically had a Chevy/gmc g20/g30 van with the 350 engine and th400 transmission. Every repair shop in America will have stuff for that. A ford econoline with the 351 Windsor or straight six is just as good for that. Don't get one based on a caravan or other front wheel drive minivan, you want a cargo van based one like the models I suggested. They're just put together significantly better. Several friends have put 200k miles on their g20 type vans and they're still going. You don't want to melt a crappy caravan transmission in the middle of nowhere because the extra weight of the conversion van addons and your stuff is overtaxing it.
Seriously though, I don't think you'd have an issue getting most of your money back selling the van. Even in New York or Brooklyn bands are going to want cheap tour vans, and kids are going to want big road trip vans. You also don't have to be super careful or freak out if you spill coffee or something in your own van.
posted by emptythought at 1:42 PM on April 21, 2013 [9 favorites]
I wouldn't screw around with renting one. I'd just find one on Craigslist for a couple grand, take it to a mechanic to have it checked out for $100 or so, get the cheapest possible liability insurance and go. You'll probably end up looking at 3-4 vans before you find a good one.
Oh, and don't get a VW. It might be tempting as there's a strong market for them basically everywhere, but they're pieces of crap and if you break down in a small town you're boned. Everyone I know basically had a Chevy/gmc g20/g30 van with the 350 engine and th400 transmission. Every repair shop in America will have stuff for that. A ford econoline with the 351 Windsor or straight six is just as good for that. Don't get one based on a caravan or other front wheel drive minivan, you want a cargo van based one like the models I suggested. They're just put together significantly better. Several friends have put 200k miles on their g20 type vans and they're still going. You don't want to melt a crappy caravan transmission in the middle of nowhere because the extra weight of the conversion van addons and your stuff is overtaxing it.
Seriously though, I don't think you'd have an issue getting most of your money back selling the van. Even in New York or Brooklyn bands are going to want cheap tour vans, and kids are going to want big road trip vans. You also don't have to be super careful or freak out if you spill coffee or something in your own van.
posted by emptythought at 1:42 PM on April 21, 2013 [9 favorites]
You could consider buying one of these nifty-looking Swiss RoomBox "instant camper van" sets. [store] They look neat, but I honestly can't say whether they would be practical.
I think renting/leasing are both impractical (which is not the same as impossible) simply because it doesn't pay for the vendor, so they design their terms around different usage. Personally, the way I see it, the biggest value of buying a junker/clunker is that if it breaks down in Hooperville, WH you can almost just walk away and get a plane ticket home/elsewhere, but then you don't sound like you'll have a place to go home to until later.
posted by dhartung at 6:30 PM on April 21, 2013
I think renting/leasing are both impractical (which is not the same as impossible) simply because it doesn't pay for the vendor, so they design their terms around different usage. Personally, the way I see it, the biggest value of buying a junker/clunker is that if it breaks down in Hooperville, WH you can almost just walk away and get a plane ticket home/elsewhere, but then you don't sound like you'll have a place to go home to until later.
posted by dhartung at 6:30 PM on April 21, 2013
Best answer: When I did this I just bought a used Chevy (Beauville I think but this was a while ago, i think the googleable term is "panel van") van through the Want-Ads (think Craigslist but in print) and got a van for $800 that made it all the way across the country and was sellable for about $800 afterwards. Easy enough to build a removable bed in the back with 2x4s and some pegs. I had a few misc problems but they were all fixable at gas stations, they're pretty basic vehicles. Don't get great mileage but otherwise very customizeable and perfect for something like this.
posted by jessamyn at 6:39 PM on April 21, 2013
posted by jessamyn at 6:39 PM on April 21, 2013
You may find Boondocking to be more difficult than you expect. Even in remote places it's become quite difficult to not get hassled or asked to move on. I believe WallMart parking lots are still ok and most highway rest areas will let you stay up to 8 hours.
Otherwise expect to pay for camping or motels.
posted by humboldt32 at 6:58 PM on April 21, 2013
Otherwise expect to pay for camping or motels.
posted by humboldt32 at 6:58 PM on April 21, 2013
What humboldt32 said is partially true, but just poke around RV/camper forums. There's lists out there of places, like walmarts that will let you stay for free overnight or for x number of hours, etc.
Friends of mine have done this with very little money and gone cross country. There's still a lot of places out there that will actively let you stay or at the very least be ambivalent leaning towards not caring.
Don't expect to park on the street in a lot of places, but don't count on having to pay money either. And hell, when I was driving up the coast in a city bus I ended up only paying $20 to park behind a motel. And there's plenty of that sort of cheap easy stuff out there. No part of this type of traveling is hard or unrealistic, and it can be done pretty cheaply. Just have backup cash incase you get stuck, whether its because of your vehicle or having to shell out to stay somewhere if you end up in a place where that's the best option, or you just want a break from the van.
posted by emptythought at 8:15 PM on April 21, 2013
Friends of mine have done this with very little money and gone cross country. There's still a lot of places out there that will actively let you stay or at the very least be ambivalent leaning towards not caring.
Don't expect to park on the street in a lot of places, but don't count on having to pay money either. And hell, when I was driving up the coast in a city bus I ended up only paying $20 to park behind a motel. And there's plenty of that sort of cheap easy stuff out there. No part of this type of traveling is hard or unrealistic, and it can be done pretty cheaply. Just have backup cash incase you get stuck, whether its because of your vehicle or having to shell out to stay somewhere if you end up in a place where that's the best option, or you just want a break from the van.
posted by emptythought at 8:15 PM on April 21, 2013
Boondocking can be difficult in the northeast, but in the rest of the country it's not really that difficult to find a place. Especially with just a van. For the past 8 years we have boondocked across the U.S. and Canada, with a pickup pulling a 32' 5th wheel, and have never been asked to move on. It's obvious what we are doing by our rig, and I will mention that both vehicles nearing 20 yrs old and not in the best shape, and even then we have had little trouble. Walmarts (and other store parking lots) and rest areas are actually our last choice. Sometimes we will stop in a small town and ask where there is a place we can stay, and many times, a local person invites us to their own property for the night. Church parking lots in rural areas. Old construction staging areas. Etc. There are even free and cheap campgrounds, many of them city sponsored (small towns). Look over the various boondocking websites, and don't worry too much about being able to find a place to stay cheap or free.
posted by batikrose at 8:46 PM on April 21, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by batikrose at 8:46 PM on April 21, 2013 [2 favorites]
I would also recommend the top tier AAA membership. They have hauled my ass out of trouble more than once.
I would probably agree with the Grand Caravan concept. It will be a little cramped with three people + stuff, but as long as three is a rare occurrence, I wouldn't worry about it. Part of the fun is living in cramped quarters.
What I'd do is buy one that's two or three years old and sell it at the end. The prices should be more or less stable between buy and sell, and even if you have to throw a transmission into it, that will be cheaper than $50-$100 a day car rental.
And I don't know of any places that will lease a vehicle for such a short time, especially to pick up and drop off in two different places.
I would say that the best way to avoid hassles along the way is to not look homeless. You are just moving to a new place and taking a scenic route. So make sure you keep the vehicle looking not too lived-in.
I've slept in rest stops and didn't feel particularly unsafe, but I was creeped out the whole time. I'd probably bring a hammer or a baseball bat the next time I do it.
Also, hit up some trucker forums to find out where clean truckers showers are located, and where the lot-lizardy places are to avoid.
posted by gjc at 2:05 AM on April 22, 2013 [1 favorite]
I would probably agree with the Grand Caravan concept. It will be a little cramped with three people + stuff, but as long as three is a rare occurrence, I wouldn't worry about it. Part of the fun is living in cramped quarters.
What I'd do is buy one that's two or three years old and sell it at the end. The prices should be more or less stable between buy and sell, and even if you have to throw a transmission into it, that will be cheaper than $50-$100 a day car rental.
And I don't know of any places that will lease a vehicle for such a short time, especially to pick up and drop off in two different places.
I would say that the best way to avoid hassles along the way is to not look homeless. You are just moving to a new place and taking a scenic route. So make sure you keep the vehicle looking not too lived-in.
I've slept in rest stops and didn't feel particularly unsafe, but I was creeped out the whole time. I'd probably bring a hammer or a baseball bat the next time I do it.
Also, hit up some trucker forums to find out where clean truckers showers are located, and where the lot-lizardy places are to avoid.
posted by gjc at 2:05 AM on April 22, 2013 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
Even in America's most "impractical to have a car" cities, there IS street parking, and having a car isn't the end of the world. You just typically don't want to use it to commute full time.
posted by Sara C. at 9:09 AM on April 21, 2013