Does Omega 3 fish oil, even temporarily, relieve arthritic knee pain?
March 4, 2013 6:25 PM Subscribe
A couple of years ago, I was diagnosed with arthritis in my left knee (no surprise there: ultramarathons, century bike rides, fiendishly long hikes). I've been taking glucosamine chondroitin for a couple of years. The pain flares ever so rarely and when it does, its tenure is brief; and so, it's totally manageable.
Now, lucky me, the right knee, the one I had cartilage taken out of 15 years ago, has decided to antagonize me. This while I was taking the glucosamine chondroitin.
I've read of the benefits of Omega 3 oil (capsules, serum) for joint pain. I'm writing to inquire if anyone out there has any actual experience, good or bad, with such oil.
Thank you.
Response by poster: thanks, ThePinkSuperhero, good to know!
posted by holdenjordahl at 7:03 PM on March 4, 2013
posted by holdenjordahl at 7:03 PM on March 4, 2013
Best answer: I've been taking Lovaza (omega 3 fish oil) for a while now, at my doctor's request. Unfortunately, it seems to have no positive effect on my knee arthritis.
posted by gudrun at 7:47 PM on March 4, 2013
posted by gudrun at 7:47 PM on March 4, 2013
Response by poster: hello gudrun.
may i ask for how long? i'm told it can take many months to take effect.
thanks.
posted by holdenjordahl at 8:28 PM on March 4, 2013
may i ask for how long? i'm told it can take many months to take effect.
thanks.
posted by holdenjordahl at 8:28 PM on March 4, 2013
Best answer: I have mild osteoarthritis in my knees and I have less knee pain when I take fish oil regularly. It took about 2-3 months before I noticed a difference.
posted by bedhead at 8:50 PM on March 4, 2013
posted by bedhead at 8:50 PM on March 4, 2013
Best answer: The key is to balance your omega-3 fatty acids with your omega-6 fatty acids. Taking fish oil won't work if you also eat lots of chips and cookies and fried food, which are full of omega-6 fatty acids from the soybean oil or corn oil or safflower oil. You need to keep a high ratio of omega-3 to omega-6. It's the relative quantities that matter.
I take fish oil for a different inflammatory condition. I take three grams of omega-3 oil per day, in the form of nine 1000-mg capsules of fish oil, each of which contains some 300+ milligrams of omega-3 oil. I take three capsules just before each meal. (If you are troubled by fishy burps, try storing the capsules in the freezer and taking them cold. I don't bother.) This is near the maximum intake regarded as GRAS by the FDA; it might reduce clotting and slightly increase the risk of hemorrhagic stroke, at the same time that it probably does reduce the chance of thrombotic stroke and heart attack. It has risks, like any drug regimen. Talk to your doctor about it next time you see him/her.
I also avoid mayonnaise (canola oil mayo is okay if it doesn't contain any soy oil), chips, French fries, and commercially-made crackers. The nutrition data search at the Self website is the handiest for looking up omega-3 versus omega-6 content. Olive oil and canola oil aren't too bad in moderation. Soybean oil always seems to put me in a lot more pain for several days if I eat too much of it, as do most nut besides macadamia nuts; hazelnuts aren't too bad, but most nuts are packed with omega-6; nuts are healthy for most people, but not for me. I buy refrigerated flax oil to use along with olive oil in salad dressings, hummus, etc; flax oil has four times as much omega-3 as omega-6, so it helps balance other things in my diet. Flax oil is much less effective than fish oil as a treatment for inflammation, though. One serving of wild Alaskan salmon contains as much omega-3 as over twenty of the fish oil capsules.
I aim for a ratio of one or two milligrams of omega-6 fats for every one milligram of omega-3 fats. The typical American diet contains as much as ten times the omega-6 as compared to omega-3, but a 1:1 or 1:2 ratio seems to reduce inflammation.
How does it work (if indeed it does work for you)? Prostaglandins are the body's messengers to increase inflammation and pain. They are what we take aspirin or other NSAIDs like ibuprofen to combat. Only trouble is, NSAIDs cause hypertension and other trouble for many people. If you can't take a daily Celebrex, diet is a less effective but harmless way to achieve the same reduction in prostaglandins, if to a lesser extent. (Of course this is an oversimplification, but it works for me.)
The biochemical pathway the body uses to make them involves omega-6 fatty acids. If you consume a lot more omega-6 than omega-3, it increases prostaglandin levels. If you consume no more than twice as much omega-6 oil as compared to omega-3 oil, you might find yourself in less pain. It's something to try if you can't take ibuprofen around the clock. Ibuprofen works better, if you take the maximum dose and don't skip a dose, but it's something to think about if you get high blood pressure or stomach or kidney trouble and have to lay off the ibuprofen.
posted by artistic verisimilitude at 9:30 PM on March 4, 2013 [8 favorites]
I take fish oil for a different inflammatory condition. I take three grams of omega-3 oil per day, in the form of nine 1000-mg capsules of fish oil, each of which contains some 300+ milligrams of omega-3 oil. I take three capsules just before each meal. (If you are troubled by fishy burps, try storing the capsules in the freezer and taking them cold. I don't bother.) This is near the maximum intake regarded as GRAS by the FDA; it might reduce clotting and slightly increase the risk of hemorrhagic stroke, at the same time that it probably does reduce the chance of thrombotic stroke and heart attack. It has risks, like any drug regimen. Talk to your doctor about it next time you see him/her.
I also avoid mayonnaise (canola oil mayo is okay if it doesn't contain any soy oil), chips, French fries, and commercially-made crackers. The nutrition data search at the Self website is the handiest for looking up omega-3 versus omega-6 content. Olive oil and canola oil aren't too bad in moderation. Soybean oil always seems to put me in a lot more pain for several days if I eat too much of it, as do most nut besides macadamia nuts; hazelnuts aren't too bad, but most nuts are packed with omega-6; nuts are healthy for most people, but not for me. I buy refrigerated flax oil to use along with olive oil in salad dressings, hummus, etc; flax oil has four times as much omega-3 as omega-6, so it helps balance other things in my diet. Flax oil is much less effective than fish oil as a treatment for inflammation, though. One serving of wild Alaskan salmon contains as much omega-3 as over twenty of the fish oil capsules.
I aim for a ratio of one or two milligrams of omega-6 fats for every one milligram of omega-3 fats. The typical American diet contains as much as ten times the omega-6 as compared to omega-3, but a 1:1 or 1:2 ratio seems to reduce inflammation.
How does it work (if indeed it does work for you)? Prostaglandins are the body's messengers to increase inflammation and pain. They are what we take aspirin or other NSAIDs like ibuprofen to combat. Only trouble is, NSAIDs cause hypertension and other trouble for many people. If you can't take a daily Celebrex, diet is a less effective but harmless way to achieve the same reduction in prostaglandins, if to a lesser extent. (Of course this is an oversimplification, but it works for me.)
The biochemical pathway the body uses to make them involves omega-6 fatty acids. If you consume a lot more omega-6 than omega-3, it increases prostaglandin levels. If you consume no more than twice as much omega-6 oil as compared to omega-3 oil, you might find yourself in less pain. It's something to try if you can't take ibuprofen around the clock. Ibuprofen works better, if you take the maximum dose and don't skip a dose, but it's something to think about if you get high blood pressure or stomach or kidney trouble and have to lay off the ibuprofen.
posted by artistic verisimilitude at 9:30 PM on March 4, 2013 [8 favorites]
Best answer: Here's a link for the self.com/tools/nutrient-search I like to use to find the omega-3 and omega-6 contained in various foods. Just type the food into the box at the top of the page.
posted by artistic verisimilitude at 9:45 PM on March 4, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by artistic verisimilitude at 9:45 PM on March 4, 2013 [1 favorite]
Best answer: The best book about omega-3s and omega-6s and inflammation and how the omega-3 to omega-6 ratio has fallen drastically in the American diet in the last half-century is The Queen of Fats: Why Omega-3s Were Removed from the Western Diet and What We Can Do to Replace Them, by Susan Allport. Full of good science. Our local public library has it; if yours does not, ask about Interlibrary Loan.
posted by artistic verisimilitude at 9:53 PM on March 4, 2013
posted by artistic verisimilitude at 9:53 PM on March 4, 2013
Best answer: I take fish oil, one capsule per day, and while my knees do generally feel better, my wife chimes in with the following:
"I take fish oil and my knees don't hurt going up and down stairs anymore. I gave it to the dog first and when it worked for her (same problem), I tried it for myself and presto...it worked in 2-3 days for the dog and 2-3 days for me."
posted by maxwelton at 10:02 PM on March 4, 2013
"I take fish oil and my knees don't hurt going up and down stairs anymore. I gave it to the dog first and when it worked for her (same problem), I tried it for myself and presto...it worked in 2-3 days for the dog and 2-3 days for me."
posted by maxwelton at 10:02 PM on March 4, 2013
Best answer: I'm hesitant to link it, because I failed to find and assess the original article on Google Scholar, but certain researchers claim that the combination of fish oil and aspirin prevents chronic inflammation by way of stimulating D3 resolvin production.
posted by hat_eater at 1:42 AM on March 5, 2013
posted by hat_eater at 1:42 AM on March 5, 2013
Best answer: I take it for inflammatory arthritis. It was the first thing I found aside from prescription drugs that made a real difference. When I don't take it for a couple of days I start feeling it. When I first began it, I felt the effects within the week. I'm on a high-strength fish oil, 7ml/day. Adding an aspirin does help (though the pharmacist suggested a very small dose, whether because of the fish oil or the other drugs I'm on I'm not sure; obviously I suggest you run it by someone before following suit). I do bleed a lot when the cat gets scratchy.
posted by springbound at 6:11 AM on March 5, 2013
posted by springbound at 6:11 AM on March 5, 2013
Best answer: My MIL says, it works for her knees (i.e. since she started CVS fish oil brand, which actually has little Omega-3 fatty acids, her knee pain is gone). YMMV
posted by zaxour at 7:43 AM on March 5, 2013
posted by zaxour at 7:43 AM on March 5, 2013
Best answer: I started taking it for what I thought was arthritis coming on in my finger joints (morning stiffness and pain), after reading up on "perimenopausal" symptoms and therapies. Fish oil has been a definitive cure for this problem -- when I've run out, the aches come back pretty quickly. Can't speak to much larger joints, though; anything I've ever had in my knees has responded only to muscle strengthening and stretching work, which is pretty different from lack of cartiledge, etc. But I'd say there are so many good reasons to take fish oil that you should give it a try!
posted by acm at 7:52 AM on March 5, 2013
posted by acm at 7:52 AM on March 5, 2013
Best answer: I take LIQUID fish oil daily as an anti-inflammatory and metabolic jump start.
I take 20g (4 teaspoons) and have noticed a major difference in my joints as a side effect (I'm a crazy runner too). Plus, it makes your skin and hair look fabulous and keeps you regular. Highly recommend it.
You can get it at Whole Foods in the refrigerated nutritionals section (next to the probiotics) - there's a few different brands and it's a little pricey, but so worth it in my opinion. Also: don't be worried about fishy burps because it's disguised with a lemon flavor.
posted by floweredfish at 8:15 AM on March 5, 2013 [1 favorite]
I take 20g (4 teaspoons) and have noticed a major difference in my joints as a side effect (I'm a crazy runner too). Plus, it makes your skin and hair look fabulous and keeps you regular. Highly recommend it.
You can get it at Whole Foods in the refrigerated nutritionals section (next to the probiotics) - there's a few different brands and it's a little pricey, but so worth it in my opinion. Also: don't be worried about fishy burps because it's disguised with a lemon flavor.
posted by floweredfish at 8:15 AM on March 5, 2013 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: thanks, everyone, this is great!
posted by holdenjordahl at 9:10 AM on March 5, 2013
posted by holdenjordahl at 9:10 AM on March 5, 2013
Best answer: I take 1 tsp. of Green Pastures fermented cod liver oil and butter oil every day, and it has definitely made a difference. I was already mostly gluten free and added-sugar free when my arthritis showed up, so I was really able to detect the relief the fish oil gave me. The Green Pastures brand is a cinnamon flavored gel. Fermentation preserves the integrity of the nutrients while making it more shelf-stable. It doesn't taste "fermented", though. Ditto what floweredfish said about benefits to hair and skin - my nails are also much stronger.
posted by dirtmonster at 9:56 AM on March 5, 2013
posted by dirtmonster at 9:56 AM on March 5, 2013
Best answer: If the fish oil doesn't work for you, consider Supartz. It's a fluid that gets injected into your knees and effectively replaces/augmetns the cartilage. My wife's knees were bone-on-bone for some time and she was taking ibuprofin daily for the pain. She got Supartz injections and says her knees haven't felt this good since she was 10 years old. No surgery required; it's injected during an office visit and hurts less than, say, cortisone shots.
posted by Doohickie at 10:10 AM on March 5, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Doohickie at 10:10 AM on March 5, 2013 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Ah, sorry to not respond sooner. I've been taking Lovaza for a couple of years, and my knees have been getting significantly worse since I've been taking it (I mean my left knee has especially taken a real nose dive). I think a combo of a stressful job with lots of standing/walking/climbing, and bad genes, have trumped any appreciable benefits of the fish oil. I'm told a knee replacement is in my future in a few years ....
posted by gudrun at 7:59 PM on March 6, 2013
posted by gudrun at 7:59 PM on March 6, 2013
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posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:00 PM on March 4, 2013 [1 favorite]