How to deal with a hopeless dreamer?
October 11, 2012 4:19 PM Subscribe
My BF suggested that I ask this question here, as I am at a loss as to what to do: A 'poet' came up to me the other day at the university, asking me if i could tell him more about a poet from my (Asian) country. After that, we met twice, all he is talking about is his poems (which he has been planning to publish for years) and "inventions" on paper. After 30, he still lives with his parents and is not working (he is a mature student). After learning i've got a boyfriend, he seems to have become so upset and heartbroken and told me that relationships never happened to him for many years and he doesn't know why. He writes me long and emotional text messages. He doesn't seem to have many friends and he obviously lack confidence. Now he has told me he loves me and wishes to spend his life with me but he can't meet with me ever again as it upsets him too much. I wonder if I could help him in anyway, he obviously needs to do something to get out of his rut, perhaps join some student societies to socialise more with other people, but I don't know if he would take well to receiving such advice from me.
Best answer: He fell in love with you, he realizes he can't have you, and he's doing his best to move on by breaking contact. He's doing just fine. The trouble with trying to help him through this -- with "this" not only being his general lack of social contacts, but also his realization that he can't have a relationship with you -- is that you can't help him with the second part, and helping him with the first part will probably provoke difficulty for him in dealing with the second part. So let him move on, instead of trying to help him.
posted by davejay at 4:27 PM on October 11, 2012 [6 favorites]
posted by davejay at 4:27 PM on October 11, 2012 [6 favorites]
Best answer: Instead of trying to help, I'd suggest staying out of it. I know it's really tempting to try to help him with his problems, but ultimately no one except a professional is going to be able to. Especially since he's told you he loves you and wants to spend his life with you, any further involvement on your part is likely to cause a drama-fest. I'd suggest he see a therapist and then cut off contact with him. It seems cruel, but it's best for you to stay out of it and it will probably be good for him as well.
posted by Autumn at 4:27 PM on October 11, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by Autumn at 4:27 PM on October 11, 2012 [2 favorites]
He sounds kinda creepy. Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but why do feel you need to 'do' anything about this at all?
posted by Pecinpah at 4:27 PM on October 11, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by Pecinpah at 4:27 PM on October 11, 2012 [2 favorites]
Don't talk to him anymore.
posted by KokuRyu at 4:28 PM on October 11, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by KokuRyu at 4:28 PM on October 11, 2012 [1 favorite]
No, he obviously has some major emotional problems. You should be considering an order of protection, not dragging other people into this unless they are mental health professionals.
posted by halogen at 4:28 PM on October 11, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by halogen at 4:28 PM on October 11, 2012 [1 favorite]
You are not responsible for this man's mental and emotional health. Take care of yourself.
posted by sawdustbear at 4:30 PM on October 11, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by sawdustbear at 4:30 PM on October 11, 2012 [3 favorites]
I fear/suspect you are dealing with a prototypical "nice guy."
posted by deathpanels at 4:31 PM on October 11, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by deathpanels at 4:31 PM on October 11, 2012 [3 favorites]
Best answer: You seriously need to read The Gift of Fear. If I had someone like that drop into my life I'd be filled with a growing concern for my safety. The fact that you feel a need to chase him down and force your good nature on him is sending off all kinds of alarm bells. From your short description he's got some heavy emotional problems. You CAN NOT fix him, trying to is only going to make things worse. For him and for you.
If he reaches out to you after saying he won't, block and ignore.
posted by Dynex at 4:32 PM on October 11, 2012 [4 favorites]
If he reaches out to you after saying he won't, block and ignore.
posted by Dynex at 4:32 PM on October 11, 2012 [4 favorites]
He is ill. That is why at 30 years old he is living at home, has no friends, and no social skills. You cannot help him and he knows this. You need to accept that you cannot help him and keep your distance.
posted by cairnoflore at 4:44 PM on October 11, 2012 [5 favorites]
posted by cairnoflore at 4:44 PM on October 11, 2012 [5 favorites]
He may or may not be a "hopeless dreamer," but more importantly he seems to have some very serious emotional and psychological issues that have nothing to do with you and that you cannot fix. He's not actually in love with you, and joining a student group will not help him. He almost certainly needs serious professional help. Do not contact him, and do not respond if he contacts you again.
posted by scody at 4:46 PM on October 11, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by scody at 4:46 PM on October 11, 2012 [2 favorites]
Do not communicate with him! I remember Anderson Cooper once saying that he made a big mistake in trying to help or reason with a stalker. That communication only made the stalker feel like he/she was making progress connecting with Anderson or was already somehow personally closer to him.
posted by Dansaman at 4:48 PM on October 11, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by Dansaman at 4:48 PM on October 11, 2012 [2 favorites]
Don't talk to him or respond to him. This is not even close to normal behavior and you cannot help him.
Do read The Gift of Fear. It will help you to understand why engaging with mentally unbalanced people can be dangerous. He is fixated on you in a way that is not normal or healthy. Stay away.
posted by quince at 4:49 PM on October 11, 2012
Do read The Gift of Fear. It will help you to understand why engaging with mentally unbalanced people can be dangerous. He is fixated on you in a way that is not normal or healthy. Stay away.
posted by quince at 4:49 PM on October 11, 2012
Response by poster: Thank you so much for all your advice. You've really given me a new perspective on the situation. I hadn't considered the potential danger. I guess I just can't help him and I won't try.
posted by Morbuto at 4:51 PM on October 11, 2012 [4 favorites]
posted by Morbuto at 4:51 PM on October 11, 2012 [4 favorites]
he can't meet with me ever again as it upsets him too much
Whether it's dangerous or not, it's better for him if you don't try to help. He's made the right decision to try to cut off contact; the most help you can give him is to never see him again- and that is a help, compared to trying to intervene.
posted by BungaDunga at 5:38 PM on October 11, 2012 [1 favorite]
Whether it's dangerous or not, it's better for him if you don't try to help. He's made the right decision to try to cut off contact; the most help you can give him is to never see him again- and that is a help, compared to trying to intervene.
posted by BungaDunga at 5:38 PM on October 11, 2012 [1 favorite]
It is admirable that you feel some compassion for him and that is to be commended... but this person is obviously not mature in some major way. As much as you would like to help him, you cannot. As others have stated, tell him one final time that you can no longer communicate with him and if need be, change your number. You are not being mean or insensitive. He'll get over it.
posted by brownrd at 5:50 PM on October 11, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by brownrd at 5:50 PM on October 11, 2012 [1 favorite]
Best answer: A rant, because this touched a nerve: I'm going to mildly disagree with the some of the sentiment here. The whole "he's damaged, worry about yourself" attitude, writ large, makes the world a sadder, emptier place. The truth is that there are people in this world who need help, and people that are able to offer it – and it'd be sad if the latter was arbitrarily avoiding the former. That attitude, as a general life principle, is not one I agree with.
That said, HOLY SHIT stay away from THIS PARTICULAR GUY.
There are some people who misinterpret even the most simple kind gestures as signals of some deep, unbreakable connection, especially if they are unused to such things (If you're a Simpsons fan: see "I Choo choo choose you"). Your brief but vivid description clearly makes your poet out to be one such person. Helping this kind of person in your professional-boundary-free social-peer role (as opposed to, say, a social worker or therapist role) is like swimming out to save a weak swimmer who is stronger than you: it will end with you both drowning, because you have no flotation device to offer but yourself. Once someone who does not understand social conventions latches on, there is no easy way to pull back, short of punching them off.
I speak from personal – almost eerily similar – experience. What began as me thinking "Oh, you're a frustrated creative type who seems alienated in this particular social milieu, here have some human decency and minor life-assistance" ended with thrice daily phone calls detailing paranoid delusions, professions of deep love and, ultimately, threats against me if I didn't comply with their demands. I got pulled under so quickly I couldn't even see it as it happened, and it was too late to stop it by the time I did. Agony ensued.
Turning back to you, your poet is already close to that later stage of attachment and threats. Don't make my mistake. Swim away now.
posted by ordinary_magnet at 7:38 PM on October 11, 2012 [19 favorites]
That said, HOLY SHIT stay away from THIS PARTICULAR GUY.
There are some people who misinterpret even the most simple kind gestures as signals of some deep, unbreakable connection, especially if they are unused to such things (If you're a Simpsons fan: see "I Choo choo choose you"). Your brief but vivid description clearly makes your poet out to be one such person. Helping this kind of person in your professional-boundary-free social-peer role (as opposed to, say, a social worker or therapist role) is like swimming out to save a weak swimmer who is stronger than you: it will end with you both drowning, because you have no flotation device to offer but yourself. Once someone who does not understand social conventions latches on, there is no easy way to pull back, short of punching them off.
I speak from personal – almost eerily similar – experience. What began as me thinking "Oh, you're a frustrated creative type who seems alienated in this particular social milieu, here have some human decency and minor life-assistance" ended with thrice daily phone calls detailing paranoid delusions, professions of deep love and, ultimately, threats against me if I didn't comply with their demands. I got pulled under so quickly I couldn't even see it as it happened, and it was too late to stop it by the time I did. Agony ensued.
Turning back to you, your poet is already close to that later stage of attachment and threats. Don't make my mistake. Swim away now.
posted by ordinary_magnet at 7:38 PM on October 11, 2012 [19 favorites]
Best answer: I'm pretty good at keeping strangers at arm's length as a general rule, so this is admittedly a biased take on this. But I look at these situations this way: There is a category of people in the world you could call "Crazy, not worth your time, and possibly dangerous." They're best dealt with by avoiding them altogether.
Statistically, you're bound to run into people in this category sooner or later, and you just did. So it's no mark on your good character to follow through--just cut him off and save your good intentions for somebody who respects you enough to not be a creeper.
posted by Rykey at 8:27 PM on October 11, 2012
Statistically, you're bound to run into people in this category sooner or later, and you just did. So it's no mark on your good character to follow through--just cut him off and save your good intentions for somebody who respects you enough to not be a creeper.
posted by Rykey at 8:27 PM on October 11, 2012
Now he has told me he loves me and wishes to spend his life with me but he can't meet with me ever again as it upsets him too much
Also: believe the things that people tell you about themselves. He doesn't think it's a good idea either. He's said directly that he does not want you in his life as a friend. Honesty is sometimes better than years of unrequited love.
posted by jaymzjulian at 11:15 PM on October 11, 2012 [2 favorites]
Also: believe the things that people tell you about themselves. He doesn't think it's a good idea either. He's said directly that he does not want you in his life as a friend. Honesty is sometimes better than years of unrequited love.
posted by jaymzjulian at 11:15 PM on October 11, 2012 [2 favorites]
RUN AWAY. Stay the hell away from this guy. You can't help him, and you really don't want him in your life.
posted by windykites at 2:34 AM on October 12, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by windykites at 2:34 AM on October 12, 2012 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Think about the danger to him. He's actually shown good judgement by deciding to stay away from someone he wants but can't have, and has also been honest about it.
Suggesting clubs he could join is likely to be painful for him in ways you probably haven't anticipated: if you don't want to associate with him, why assume anyone else would? His problems relating to people are more serious than anything an attitude adjustment can fix, and he knows it.
It's also very likely, at his age, that he's had the Making Friends 101 advice from a lot of people, so you wouldn't be telling him anything he doesn't already know. He may have tried to join clubs in the past and had bad experiences.
Sorry, it sucks. I know you really want to help this undoubtedly nonmalicious and unfortunate person, but I believe he's identified the best way you can help him, and that's by honouring his wish for no contact.
posted by tel3path at 6:17 AM on October 12, 2012 [1 favorite]
Suggesting clubs he could join is likely to be painful for him in ways you probably haven't anticipated: if you don't want to associate with him, why assume anyone else would? His problems relating to people are more serious than anything an attitude adjustment can fix, and he knows it.
It's also very likely, at his age, that he's had the Making Friends 101 advice from a lot of people, so you wouldn't be telling him anything he doesn't already know. He may have tried to join clubs in the past and had bad experiences.
Sorry, it sucks. I know you really want to help this undoubtedly nonmalicious and unfortunate person, but I believe he's identified the best way you can help him, and that's by honouring his wish for no contact.
posted by tel3path at 6:17 AM on October 12, 2012 [1 favorite]
I think you can feel sympathy for this guy without responding in a way that will make you part of his "game". The game works like this: he has a lot of psychological pain, he vents the pain to you, now he gets attached to you and has to keep you around. He found out he can't have you, so you're now being "punished" by making you feel bad about having a boyfriend / friends, while nobody loves him etc. etc. All of this is just projection of the pain, though, it has nothing to do with you. The best you can do is recommend he see a therapist. That's what he probably really needs.
posted by deathpanels at 6:53 AM on October 12, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by deathpanels at 6:53 AM on October 12, 2012 [2 favorites]
I don't think because he's a mature student (there's nothing wrong with that, and a lot out there) or that he lives with his parents necessarily qualifies him as mentally ill. Maybe he didn't learn the greatest social skills, had trauma in the past, money woes, any number or mix of things. I think what you should be concerned with is the romantic feelings he has for you, and that he fell so hard after spending time with you just two times. That's the concerning part. You should really leave him alone, because he asked you to. That actually says a good thing about his judgment, it would be another thing if he was pestering you and attempting to make you return his affection. It's his life and he will figure it out, however it happens. It's really nice of you to be concerned and try to help him, and not turn your back on him. The fact is that you have a boyfriend, and with his professed feelings for you this is a situation you want to stay away from. Mostly again, because he asked you to.
posted by readygo at 7:43 AM on October 12, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by readygo at 7:43 AM on October 12, 2012 [1 favorite]
I have a friend who lived this experience, almost to the T; older, frustrated poet going after a younger woman. She got seriously pulled under, and as soon as that happened, he turned psychologically abusive. She endured this for a couple of years, with him reeling her in every time she made like she was gaining some independence, and eventually she moved to be closer to him.
Whereupon he revealed that she had been the "research" for his new collection of poems about, you guessed it, destroying the innocence of a young woman.
If I were you, I would cut off contact with this guy and stay the hell away.
posted by LN at 8:53 AM on October 12, 2012 [2 favorites]
Whereupon he revealed that she had been the "research" for his new collection of poems about, you guessed it, destroying the innocence of a young woman.
If I were you, I would cut off contact with this guy and stay the hell away.
posted by LN at 8:53 AM on October 12, 2012 [2 favorites]
Dramarama. Flee.
posted by flabdablet at 10:47 AM on October 12, 2012
posted by flabdablet at 10:47 AM on October 12, 2012
I agree with readygo. Living with one's parents whilst being thirty does not make one creepy. Being creepy does.
posted by deathpanels at 12:06 PM on October 12, 2012
posted by deathpanels at 12:06 PM on October 12, 2012
Either this is part of 'a game' - he makes you feel sorry for him and makes you feel like you should help and then you wind up being sucked into some very dangerous stuff or he did genuinely fall for you at first sight (it is possible) and finding out you're unavailable is yet another disappointment he's facing in his life.
Thing is - you have absolutely no way of knowing which one it is and it really doesn't matter. The first will hurt you horrendously and the second will hurt him horrendously. If someone tells you they love you and you're unattainable and they want you to walk away, walk away. You don't want to give him any sense of hope of anything between the two of you because that is simply cruel.
posted by heyjude at 2:49 PM on October 12, 2012
Thing is - you have absolutely no way of knowing which one it is and it really doesn't matter. The first will hurt you horrendously and the second will hurt him horrendously. If someone tells you they love you and you're unattainable and they want you to walk away, walk away. You don't want to give him any sense of hope of anything between the two of you because that is simply cruel.
posted by heyjude at 2:49 PM on October 12, 2012
I totally understand the need to be safe.
At the same time, what this person needs is friends, but he doesn't know how to make them. In a perfect world, the best thing would be for you to stay away, but have other people (guys, really) hang out with him and help him learn some social skills. That isn't your responsibility necessarily but if there were some creative, behind the scenes way to make it happen, then it could help him.
posted by yeahyeahyeah at 5:59 PM on October 12, 2012
At the same time, what this person needs is friends, but he doesn't know how to make them. In a perfect world, the best thing would be for you to stay away, but have other people (guys, really) hang out with him and help him learn some social skills. That isn't your responsibility necessarily but if there were some creative, behind the scenes way to make it happen, then it could help him.
posted by yeahyeahyeah at 5:59 PM on October 12, 2012
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posted by easily confused at 4:26 PM on October 11, 2012 [26 favorites]