Dealing With A Computer Crime Felony In A Corporate Environment?
August 8, 2010 5:46 PM Subscribe
I recently got a job as an IT support analyst through a third party IT consulting firm. The three months went well, and the client decided to hire me fulltime. There was no background check when I had the contractor position, and for the first two weeks when I was an actual employee there was no talk of an actual background check...
My offer letter had said something about it, but I thought they had forgotten about it. When the paperwork came up, I went to my IT manager, and asked her if we could keep it private and I wanted her opinion. She proceeded to say (she started 8 months ago) that she never needed any paperwork to start working, she also stated that the HR lady is forgetful, and I should just ignore her request unles it comes up again. This seemed to calm me, and I was okay with that answer. (I was obviously too trusting) Just for the record, I do have a felony(computer crime: criminal copyright infringement in 2006, probation/fine completed in 2009). I went to lunch, and then a few hours later my boss came to me and said to meet in her office... the HR lady was there and they said with their type of work that my crime is a trust crime and cannot be tolerated. (They do legal services work, forensics etc) I can understand where they are coming from, but since I was honest my first question is; is this normal? And would they have given me a chance if I had said something right when I got my offer letter? I figured I would have gotten canned right away due to this and that's why I hadn't said anything. I am starting to think I can only do contracting or own my own business; I am looking for general advice in terms of : Is this true? How can I get this expunged? Is it even expungable? I didn't make a dime from my crime, but it is a felony and I was raided by the FBI etc. Looks and SOUNDS very bad to employers, but I actually was just couriering software for my own good and to share with others for free. Looking for a general opinion and hopefully some guidance info in terms of pardons, how to handle job prospects, interviews etc. Would be much appreciated! To get a grip on what the crime was visit: http://www.cybercrime.gov/fastlink.htm
My offer letter had said something about it, but I thought they had forgotten about it. When the paperwork came up, I went to my IT manager, and asked her if we could keep it private and I wanted her opinion. She proceeded to say (she started 8 months ago) that she never needed any paperwork to start working, she also stated that the HR lady is forgetful, and I should just ignore her request unles it comes up again. This seemed to calm me, and I was okay with that answer. (I was obviously too trusting) Just for the record, I do have a felony(computer crime: criminal copyright infringement in 2006, probation/fine completed in 2009). I went to lunch, and then a few hours later my boss came to me and said to meet in her office... the HR lady was there and they said with their type of work that my crime is a trust crime and cannot be tolerated. (They do legal services work, forensics etc) I can understand where they are coming from, but since I was honest my first question is; is this normal? And would they have given me a chance if I had said something right when I got my offer letter? I figured I would have gotten canned right away due to this and that's why I hadn't said anything. I am starting to think I can only do contracting or own my own business; I am looking for general advice in terms of : Is this true? How can I get this expunged? Is it even expungable? I didn't make a dime from my crime, but it is a felony and I was raided by the FBI etc. Looks and SOUNDS very bad to employers, but I actually was just couriering software for my own good and to share with others for free. Looking for a general opinion and hopefully some guidance info in terms of pardons, how to handle job prospects, interviews etc. Would be much appreciated! To get a grip on what the crime was visit: http://www.cybercrime.gov/fastlink.htm
...is this normal?
If your job involves forensics which will be used in court, yes, this is completely normal. I lost out on a computer forensics job due to less-than-stellar credit a while back. I would have been called to testify and the poor credit could have been used to impeach my credibility.
You will need to speak with an attorney to know if it can be expunged, but my guess is no.
posted by sanko at 6:09 PM on August 8, 2010
If your job involves forensics which will be used in court, yes, this is completely normal. I lost out on a computer forensics job due to less-than-stellar credit a while back. I would have been called to testify and the poor credit could have been used to impeach my credibility.
You will need to speak with an attorney to know if it can be expunged, but my guess is no.
posted by sanko at 6:09 PM on August 8, 2010
Relief From The Collateral Consequences Of A Criminal Conviction: A State-By-State Resource Guide
National H.I.R.E. Network Resources, Information & Assistance
If you are a New York state resident, contact the Legal Action Center.
posted by mlis at 6:14 PM on August 8, 2010
National H.I.R.E. Network Resources, Information & Assistance
If you are a New York state resident, contact the Legal Action Center.
posted by mlis at 6:14 PM on August 8, 2010
Response by poster: Wow, thank you for the fast response! I appreciate the insight; because I can understand a bit more why something like that on my record would be bad. Personally, I believe paying for software in business is 100% worth it; and would never use unlicensed software in a business setting. Glad to have agencies like the BSA out there policing those who do wrong... in my case though, there is an argument to be made that I do have morals in a business setting and I would not be out to make money and/or save a business money in that sense. I am thinking your point is, any large place that does a check; will immediately overrule any argument that I may have(no matter how logical). Do felonies expire in terms of background checks after 10 years or is this possibly something that is permanent?
posted by psiwave at 6:17 PM on August 8, 2010
posted by psiwave at 6:17 PM on August 8, 2010
Response by poster: @sanko: Well, for the experts who have to testify; I can understand. However I was doing the IT support, so there would never be a need or use for me to have testified in court. I see that example working if I were testifying. I actually spoke to the owner of this company, and even though he said 'we need to be cleaner than clean', he did make the comment 'I can see how it applies to Experts, however with you being in IT I'm not sure how that would really apply.' I actually already asked my attorney, and he said no it's not possible. I looked online and saw it might be, or the one way would be to ask the President for a pardon. (Fat chance on that one).
posted by psiwave at 6:20 PM on August 8, 2010
posted by psiwave at 6:20 PM on August 8, 2010
It's an issue of your character because they can't be sure that you wouldn't, say, take a bribe from someone outside the firm to "accidentally" vape someone's hard drive during the course of your normal support duties. I'm not saying you would-- I don't know you-- but that's the sort of issue a trust crime in your background raises with HR types.
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 6:39 PM on August 8, 2010
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 6:39 PM on August 8, 2010
Response by poster: @MLIS Thank you very much, those all help with State related crimes; do you have any resources in regards to Federal issues? Looks like it were a crime investigated by the state police for example, then I'd have a good chance of getting a pardon.
posted by psiwave at 6:43 PM on August 8, 2010
posted by psiwave at 6:43 PM on August 8, 2010
Best answer: I knew someone very well who had a felony conviction. He's in IT, and works with trading companies. What he did was spend about 2 years contracting and sub-contracting (meaning, sometimes 2 layers of recruiting companies between him and the company). He would find a recruiting agency that is lax in doing background checks, by trial and error. Then, he would explain his side of the story and win them over. They would then present him to companies as a candidate for a contracting gig, and the company would assume that the recruiting company did a background check.
After a while, one of those companies offered him a job. The background check wasn't done because they assumed he'd had one already.
He will always have this problem, as his conviction can't be expunged. His hope is that with enough time, it will matter less and be something he doesn't have to work so hard to hide (because an employer will see that it was a long time ago, with no other problems, and other employers trusted him so they should, too).
posted by Houstonian at 6:53 PM on August 8, 2010
After a while, one of those companies offered him a job. The background check wasn't done because they assumed he'd had one already.
He will always have this problem, as his conviction can't be expunged. His hope is that with enough time, it will matter less and be something he doesn't have to work so hard to hide (because an employer will see that it was a long time ago, with no other problems, and other employers trusted him so they should, too).
posted by Houstonian at 6:53 PM on August 8, 2010
Psiwave, I work in an IT services environment. My experience is that background checks often show up as blanket contractual requirements for everyone working on the account. Some clients have specific checks they want done that are unique to their industry. This issue is broader than forensics or testifying in court. YMMV, but in my environment, if you can't pass the basics (no felonies, not on the Patriot act watch list), employment is a non-starter no matter what role you are applying for. The same scrutiny goes for contractors.
posted by kovacs at 7:13 PM on August 8, 2010
posted by kovacs at 7:13 PM on August 8, 2010
Why is it relevant if he completed his sentence/probation?
posted by devnull at 12:47 AM on August 9, 2010
posted by devnull at 12:47 AM on August 9, 2010
Psiwave, I don't have any answers for you, but you might want to ask the moderators to make this question anonymous, or remove your real name from your profile.
Hope things work out for you.
posted by Infinite Jest at 2:35 AM on August 9, 2010
Hope things work out for you.
posted by Infinite Jest at 2:35 AM on August 9, 2010
If your job involves forensics which will be used in court, yes, this is completely normal.Isn't that, like 0.1% of IT Jobs?
posted by delmoi at 2:45 AM on August 9, 2010
Why is it relevant if he completed his sentence/probation?
Because it means he paid his debt to society? Maybe that should mean that he's reformed and thus eligible for a fresh start on life?
posted by eas98 at 7:15 AM on August 9, 2010
Because it means he paid his debt to society? Maybe that should mean that he's reformed and thus eligible for a fresh start on life?
posted by eas98 at 7:15 AM on August 9, 2010
Because it means he paid his debt to society?
That's my point, I don't see why his conviction is relevant if he repaid his debt.
posted by devnull at 3:02 AM on August 10, 2010
That's my point, I don't see why his conviction is relevant if he repaid his debt.
posted by devnull at 3:02 AM on August 10, 2010
Response by poster: @devnull: Exactly, I've tried to argue that point; and actually an IT firm that I contract through sees its the same way. I just lost this time around because I was honest (imagine that) and the HR people freaked out.
@Infinite Jest: Indeed.
posted by psiwave at 8:03 AM on August 10, 2010
@Infinite Jest: Indeed.
posted by psiwave at 8:03 AM on August 10, 2010
This thread is closed to new comments.
That said, there should be plenty of job opportunities at smaller businesses if you don't like the idea of starting your own business or contracting (both things which I'm actually looking at doing right now, so don't dis'em!). In the Austin area, for example, there are all sorts of small consulting, computer repair, networking/web hosting, and web/graphic design shops. You can make a fairly respectable living at these kinds of businesses, too. A short while back, I made $50k working as an onsite computer technician for one of them.
posted by GnomeChompsky at 6:07 PM on August 8, 2010