Ubuntu + Virtual Box + ??? = profit
December 20, 2008 10:57 AM
Is it wise to setup Ubuntu for my parents virtual box for ie?
So I'm basicly sick and tired of getting phone calls from my parents asking me why there computer isn't work or why it's soo slow. The only thing really stoping me from putting ubuntu is the fact my father need IE (activeX to be exact) for work. Would Virtual Box with IE be more of headache then the current setup?
So I'm basicly sick and tired of getting phone calls from my parents asking me why there computer isn't work or why it's soo slow. The only thing really stoping me from putting ubuntu is the fact my father need IE (activeX to be exact) for work. Would Virtual Box with IE be more of headache then the current setup?
If you're all but wiping the system for Linux, what about using a fresh Windows install? That always works wonders.
posted by niles at 11:26 AM on December 20, 2008
posted by niles at 11:26 AM on December 20, 2008
I think this would be more painful than it's worth, unless it somehow makes it easier for you to troubleshoot their issues remotely. If that's the case, there are some nifty VNC-based solutions out there that will let you do all manner of remote troubleshooting.
Other than the IE issue (which, sorry erifneerg, but I don't know of a solution to that one), I want to disagree with this. I just switched my mother over to Ubuntu. While there's been a slight learning curve for her, mostly due to a lack of patience over very minor changes (mostly, why she can't use her spyware-bloated screensaver), it's been going well so far, and she once again has a usable, reliable computer. If you do decide to switch them over to Ubuntu, I'd recommend doing what I did, which is to place programs on the desktop clearly labeled for their function so they don't have to wonder what unfamiliar program does what.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 11:26 AM on December 20, 2008
Other than the IE issue (which, sorry erifneerg, but I don't know of a solution to that one), I want to disagree with this. I just switched my mother over to Ubuntu. While there's been a slight learning curve for her, mostly due to a lack of patience over very minor changes (mostly, why she can't use her spyware-bloated screensaver), it's been going well so far, and she once again has a usable, reliable computer. If you do decide to switch them over to Ubuntu, I'd recommend doing what I did, which is to place programs on the desktop clearly labeled for their function so they don't have to wonder what unfamiliar program does what.
posted by PhoBWanKenobi at 11:26 AM on December 20, 2008
God damn it, parent technical support is exasperating.
I went through the same thing with my parents, who weren't computer-literate at all.
My dad kept on installing bloated software suites that would run at startup on his 120Mhz Toshiba, and after a while it would get so bogged down he couldn't do anything anymore so he'd call me up to reinstall Windows 98 for him, to be repeated every three months.
The real problem in a case like this is that the parents have an old computer that just can't do what they're trying to get it to do, and the parents don't understand that because not only do they not know the first thing about computers, they don't know how to use the Internet to find out how computers work and probably don't want to because it's easier to call their kid up to fix the problem for them.
If they don't want to buy a new, faster computer, I would help install some RAM for them, reinstall Windows, show them how they can use Google to find out how their computer works, and tell them they're on their own for now on.
posted by dunkadunc at 11:40 AM on December 20, 2008
I went through the same thing with my parents, who weren't computer-literate at all.
My dad kept on installing bloated software suites that would run at startup on his 120Mhz Toshiba, and after a while it would get so bogged down he couldn't do anything anymore so he'd call me up to reinstall Windows 98 for him, to be repeated every three months.
The real problem in a case like this is that the parents have an old computer that just can't do what they're trying to get it to do, and the parents don't understand that because not only do they not know the first thing about computers, they don't know how to use the Internet to find out how computers work and probably don't want to because it's easier to call their kid up to fix the problem for them.
If they don't want to buy a new, faster computer, I would help install some RAM for them, reinstall Windows, show them how they can use Google to find out how their computer works, and tell them they're on their own for now on.
posted by dunkadunc at 11:40 AM on December 20, 2008
For yourself it would make sense to have linux as the host system and Xp as a guest. VirtualBox has the ability to take snapshots. You will lose whatever changes you've made to the guest file system when you revert to a snapshot. You could have the majority of user file space mounted as a vbox shared drive from the host system on the XP instance. Put working files in the shared space and make snapshots at significant events; at a know good installation of a new program, when the the system's behavior is OK, etc. Backup the host system religiously. Then you get to regress to the most convenient snapshot and restore working files whenever you run into a problem. You also get to use ubuntu's package management system. I find it incredibly easier to find and fix problems using apt-get and configuration files rather than window's broken add/remove program stuff.
This scheme won't solve your father's problem. Whatever he is doing that is slowing down his computer or breaking it will keep happening on the virtual machine. Someone has to reliably backup the host or the scheme will not work. You would also have the additional burden of admin'ing the ubuntu system. I'd say that you need to figure out what your parents are doing to break their system and show them other ways to work.
posted by rdr at 11:43 AM on December 20, 2008
This scheme won't solve your father's problem. Whatever he is doing that is slowing down his computer or breaking it will keep happening on the virtual machine. Someone has to reliably backup the host or the scheme will not work. You would also have the additional burden of admin'ing the ubuntu system. I'd say that you need to figure out what your parents are doing to break their system and show them other ways to work.
posted by rdr at 11:43 AM on December 20, 2008
If a new machine is possible, how about a Mac for day to day operations, and then VirtualBox with XP for work related surfing?
I have 3 family members I support on Macs and one on Windows. The Windows box takes more time than the rest combined due to spyware, viruses, trojans. Most of the problems come from 'forwards' and them clicking on those fake windows system windows that install software.
They can also use their Word, Excel and Photoshop without too much fuss.
posted by bottlebrushtree at 12:13 PM on December 20, 2008
I have 3 family members I support on Macs and one on Windows. The Windows box takes more time than the rest combined due to spyware, viruses, trojans. Most of the problems come from 'forwards' and them clicking on those fake windows system windows that install software.
They can also use their Word, Excel and Photoshop without too much fuss.
posted by bottlebrushtree at 12:13 PM on December 20, 2008
For the record, I think Ubuntu makes a fabulous desktop OS, especially for folks you need to support remotely or relatives who only want to do basic surfing, e-mail and word processing with fewer worries about viruses, spyware and the like.
Trying to shoe-horn IE into Ubuntu can be a pain, though. Awhile back, there was a quick-install widget for IE which downloaded all of the necessary components, DLLs and whatnot, then booted up IE under WINE. It worked, but was pretty flaky and I gave it up pretty quick, choosing to use MS apps in a VMWare instance instead. That worked pretty well, but I had a decent workstation to start with.
posted by jquinby at 12:18 PM on December 20, 2008
Trying to shoe-horn IE into Ubuntu can be a pain, though. Awhile back, there was a quick-install widget for IE which downloaded all of the necessary components, DLLs and whatnot, then booted up IE under WINE. It worked, but was pretty flaky and I gave it up pretty quick, choosing to use MS apps in a VMWare instance instead. That worked pretty well, but I had a decent workstation to start with.
posted by jquinby at 12:18 PM on December 20, 2008
Would Virtual Box with IE be more of headache then the current setup?
Just the other day I was running VirtualBox on an x86-64 machine. A kernel update came out, but an update for the VirtualBox kernel modules didn't. So after the kernel update the (now outdated) kernel modules wouldn't load, so VirtualBox wouldn't run.
What I'm saying is: switching them to Ubuntu/VirtualBox might just mean you're swapping one set of support problems for another.
posted by Mike1024 at 1:03 PM on December 20, 2008
Just the other day I was running VirtualBox on an x86-64 machine. A kernel update came out, but an update for the VirtualBox kernel modules didn't. So after the kernel update the (now outdated) kernel modules wouldn't load, so VirtualBox wouldn't run.
What I'm saying is: switching them to Ubuntu/VirtualBox might just mean you're swapping one set of support problems for another.
posted by Mike1024 at 1:03 PM on December 20, 2008
Ubuntu for parents will certainly cost you less time in the long run than Windows for parents. I have one parent with each, and I know of what I speak.
Running Windows in VirtualBox or VMWare is certainly do-able, provided you have enough RAM. You need enough to give the VM at least 512MB of its own (and that's for a fairly stripped-down XP install, too). If you have much less than 2GB in the host machine, you will get parental complaints that what you've given them is too slow.
You can run older versions of Windows with less RAM (Windows 98SE works perfectly well in a 128MB VM) and this might be a reasonable option if all you're going to run on the thing is IE. Use VMWare rather than VirtualBox for this, since VirtualBox has no sound support for Win9X.
The way I think you ought to do it is to set up a minimal virtual Windows environment to run the web browser plus whatever ActiveX controls your Dad needs for work, snapshot it once you've confirmed with him that it's usable, then arrange for that snapshot to be reloaded every time he launches the VM. That way he can break it to his heart's content, and all the breakage will just go away every time he closes the VM's window.
posted by flabdablet at 6:59 PM on December 20, 2008
Running Windows in VirtualBox or VMWare is certainly do-able, provided you have enough RAM. You need enough to give the VM at least 512MB of its own (and that's for a fairly stripped-down XP install, too). If you have much less than 2GB in the host machine, you will get parental complaints that what you've given them is too slow.
You can run older versions of Windows with less RAM (Windows 98SE works perfectly well in a 128MB VM) and this might be a reasonable option if all you're going to run on the thing is IE. Use VMWare rather than VirtualBox for this, since VirtualBox has no sound support for Win9X.
The way I think you ought to do it is to set up a minimal virtual Windows environment to run the web browser plus whatever ActiveX controls your Dad needs for work, snapshot it once you've confirmed with him that it's usable, then arrange for that snapshot to be reloaded every time he launches the VM. That way he can break it to his heart's content, and all the breakage will just go away every time he closes the VM's window.
posted by flabdablet at 6:59 PM on December 20, 2008
By the way: you might well be able to get away with running IE in Wine, and ignoring the VM and Windows part entirely. Winetricks can help make lots of things Just Work that would otherwise need endless fiddling about.
Wine-based apps are generally installed per-user, since the fake C drive generally occupies a folder inside the user's home folder. That makes it pretty easy to generate a wrapper script that completely regenerates the user's Wine folder every time you launch the script, which allows you to do the same kind of guaranteed-clean-start thing you can do with VM snapshots.
posted by flabdablet at 7:05 PM on December 20, 2008
Wine-based apps are generally installed per-user, since the fake C drive generally occupies a folder inside the user's home folder. That makes it pretty easy to generate a wrapper script that completely regenerates the user's Wine folder every time you launch the script, which allows you to do the same kind of guaranteed-clean-start thing you can do with VM snapshots.
posted by flabdablet at 7:05 PM on December 20, 2008
This thread is closed to new comments.
If the computer is slow, it's slow. Why? There might be things that can be cleared out, optimized, and so on. Adding RAM usually delivers a lot of bang for the buck, too.
posted by jquinby at 11:13 AM on December 20, 2008