What is going on with this guy at work
January 5, 2024 6:09 AM Subscribe
Hi all
So I have been working with a guy in a senior position to me at work for a year. He is (as far as I know single) as am I.
He started flirting with me and it got to the stage where I got really embarrassed, red in the face, nervous, stuttering etc. as I started to really like him.
There were times that we would hold each other’s eye contact for ages when he walked in the room. The thing is, he’s a naturally friendly guy and I would see him talking to other women at work and get the feeling maybe I am not special to him so I started to avoid him and be cold. He then panicked and started to almost hunt me down to get my attention and things went back to the way they were whereby we would get giddy and excited in each others company. The thing is I always got the vibe he was frightened to single me out so would always make sure that he spoke to everyone else I worked with equally. Then one day it just kind of stopped and he was doing this thing where it seemed like he was trying to make me jealous by calling his female work colleague dear on the phone in front of me, when he didn’t even have to ring her from my office. Then he came in with me day and spoke to everyone except me then later said “You’re very quiet today Colnoln, are you okay?” In a real gleeful tone because he could tell I was feeling upset. I am shamed to say I went red and felt embarrassed. Now he comes in and pretends he doesn’t know anything about me. For example, he knows I drive a car, we’ve had loads of conversations about it but he came in and said in front of colleagues “I didn’t know you drove Colnoln?” Even my colleagues were shocked at why he said it because they know he knows I drive. So why is he doing this? I have a feeling he still finds me attractive because I can see him out the corner of my eye looking at me when he thinks I’m not looking. So what’s his deal? Do I work from home to avoid him from now on because I’m so besotted with him it’s painful, especially when he will make a point of telling me and another colleague how him and a female were having a right good chat yesterday when we weren’t in work. I feel foolish and like a teenager around him. Help. What’s his deal?Oh yes forgot, before he started going cold he tried to get me to go to his office by asking me to scan something on the printer and email it over to him, then take it back round to his office afterwards. Unfortunately I saw someone I knew outside his office before I knocked and he heard me talking to her and came and got the paper off me.
He is in and out of our area four to five times a day for what seems like stupid excuses.
There were times that we would hold each other’s eye contact for ages when he walked in the room. The thing is, he’s a naturally friendly guy and I would see him talking to other women at work and get the feeling maybe I am not special to him so I started to avoid him and be cold. He then panicked and started to almost hunt me down to get my attention and things went back to the way they were whereby we would get giddy and excited in each others company. The thing is I always got the vibe he was frightened to single me out so would always make sure that he spoke to everyone else I worked with equally. Then one day it just kind of stopped and he was doing this thing where it seemed like he was trying to make me jealous by calling his female work colleague dear on the phone in front of me, when he didn’t even have to ring her from my office. Then he came in with me day and spoke to everyone except me then later said “You’re very quiet today Colnoln, are you okay?” In a real gleeful tone because he could tell I was feeling upset. I am shamed to say I went red and felt embarrassed. Now he comes in and pretends he doesn’t know anything about me. For example, he knows I drive a car, we’ve had loads of conversations about it but he came in and said in front of colleagues “I didn’t know you drove Colnoln?” Even my colleagues were shocked at why he said it because they know he knows I drive. So why is he doing this? I have a feeling he still finds me attractive because I can see him out the corner of my eye looking at me when he thinks I’m not looking. So what’s his deal? Do I work from home to avoid him from now on because I’m so besotted with him it’s painful, especially when he will make a point of telling me and another colleague how him and a female were having a right good chat yesterday when we weren’t in work. I feel foolish and like a teenager around him. Help. What’s his deal?Oh yes forgot, before he started going cold he tried to get me to go to his office by asking me to scan something on the printer and email it over to him, then take it back round to his office afterwards. Unfortunately I saw someone I knew outside his office before I knocked and he heard me talking to her and came and got the paper off me.
He is in and out of our area four to five times a day for what seems like stupid excuses.
Work is for work, this is not high school. His deal is that he doesn't know how to behave himself at work. Your deal should be that work has nothing to do with attractiveness or what random crap dudes think of you or being besotted or these ridiculous cat-and-mouse games you think you're playing.
Other people can see you, you realize that right? They do not want to deal with this at work. It will have a significant effect on what they think of you. It's not good things.
It's time to grow up, recognize terrible behavior when you see it, and if you can't control yourself you should find a different job elsewhere and be a grownup there. If you are able to start acting like a professional but he continues to...do whatever this shit is, you need to start documenting to protect yourself.
Older men who act like this at work are sometimes just annoying hornbag jerks, but other times they are setting up the most gullible women in the office to take the fall for shady dealings.
Join a dating app or something, this is not what the workplace is for.
posted by Lyn Never at 6:19 AM on January 5 [49 favorites]
Other people can see you, you realize that right? They do not want to deal with this at work. It will have a significant effect on what they think of you. It's not good things.
It's time to grow up, recognize terrible behavior when you see it, and if you can't control yourself you should find a different job elsewhere and be a grownup there. If you are able to start acting like a professional but he continues to...do whatever this shit is, you need to start documenting to protect yourself.
Older men who act like this at work are sometimes just annoying hornbag jerks, but other times they are setting up the most gullible women in the office to take the fall for shady dealings.
Join a dating app or something, this is not what the workplace is for.
posted by Lyn Never at 6:19 AM on January 5 [49 favorites]
His ‘deal’ is he’s a fucking dick. Whatever you think you want from this guy, he does not have it to give. Sorry.
posted by showbiz_liz at 6:21 AM on January 5 [25 favorites]
posted by showbiz_liz at 6:21 AM on January 5 [25 favorites]
Mod note: Moved bulk of the text to interior of the post.
posted by Brandon Blatcher (staff) at 6:21 AM on January 5
posted by Brandon Blatcher (staff) at 6:21 AM on January 5
He sounds like an asshole who relishes your attention and who manipulates people when he feels like he isn’t getting enough of it. Please do not pursue your crush on him. Try to accept the gooey besotted feelings you have as pleasant sensations without accompanying emotive depth, and work on getting over him. You deserve a partner who communicates clearly with you, doesn’t use other people to hurt you, and makes you feel steady and safe instead of bewildered like you are in this post. And yes, if you can, document any creepy or aggressive actions of this guy and go to HR if you have it if he escalates his advances. If you can work from home without this compromising your career or work relationships with colleagues who are not him, you should consider it, but you don’t deserve to change your preferred work style because of one crappy dude. If that impulse to WFH is coming from a place of guilt or a desire for isolation, push back on that.
posted by Mizu at 6:31 AM on January 5 [12 favorites]
posted by Mizu at 6:31 AM on January 5 [12 favorites]
He's being super unprofessional and is deliberately putting you in a no-win position. He'll keep pushing the boundaries until either you shoot him down and then you are the "bitch" since he was "just being friendly," or you go along with it and then you are in the vulnerable position of getting physical with a higher-up.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:44 AM on January 5 [2 favorites]
posted by Dip Flash at 6:44 AM on January 5 [2 favorites]
Dating someone at work can be done successfully, but only (and this is really key) if both parties are very mature about it. From what you've written, neither of you come across as very mature when it comes to dating/flirtation - him with his dickish negging of you (i.e. pretending he forgot basic info about you), you with your over-analyzing of every small interaction with him.
This won't end well - some attractions are best not pursued. I don't know if you should go to HR - HR is not there to be your friend, they are there to make problems go away - you wouldn't be the first woman to be punished for reporting on a senior male employee acting badly. Is there someone at your office you trust, ideally someone who has been there longer with you and understands the social hierarchy/unspoken rules of the place? They might best be able to advise how you might shut this down while protecting yourself from backlash.
posted by coffeecat at 6:51 AM on January 5 [9 favorites]
This won't end well - some attractions are best not pursued. I don't know if you should go to HR - HR is not there to be your friend, they are there to make problems go away - you wouldn't be the first woman to be punished for reporting on a senior male employee acting badly. Is there someone at your office you trust, ideally someone who has been there longer with you and understands the social hierarchy/unspoken rules of the place? They might best be able to advise how you might shut this down while protecting yourself from backlash.
posted by coffeecat at 6:51 AM on January 5 [9 favorites]
Response by poster: Thanks for the replies everyone. He is not much older than me - we’re about 2-3 years age difference,
I do agree that I feel as though he is acting unreasonably, and I almost feel intimidated and very insecure around him. As much as I want him to like me romantically, I also feel like I want to avoid him because sometimes when he deliberately becomes over friendly with someone else in front of me, I go home feeling very depressed and unable to control my emotions. I hate feeling this way.
posted by colnoln at 6:56 AM on January 5 [2 favorites]
I do agree that I feel as though he is acting unreasonably, and I almost feel intimidated and very insecure around him. As much as I want him to like me romantically, I also feel like I want to avoid him because sometimes when he deliberately becomes over friendly with someone else in front of me, I go home feeling very depressed and unable to control my emotions. I hate feeling this way.
posted by colnoln at 6:56 AM on January 5 [2 favorites]
The best case scenario here is that he has really poor social judgement and is acting like he's fifteen and trying to make you jealous when he's a grown adult at work and in a senior position. At worst, this is a stunt he pulls with younger women at work because he's an asshole.
His actions are his fault, he's being either a clueless jerk or a creep and you should definitely document all this going forward while you yourself work to make your behavior neutral and move past your crush. If you get back to baseline yourself and he keeps being a weirdo, that will be the time to go to HR, in my opinion.
This stuff seems really complicated, but it's not. High school-like flirtation at work is a bad idea. I don't think it's weird to find yourself in this dynamic once or twice in a career, but it's good to be able to spot it and stop your side of it.
Ask yourself what is drawing you to this guy - sometimes people are just feeling bored or stressed at work and get into a flirtation for those reasons, but is this something where you're often drawn to people who are unreliable or withholding in some way? Or do you often find yourself semi-consciously seeking out situations where you will feel bad or insecure because that seems familiar or like something you deserve?
This guy - he's just some guy who is jerking you around. He's not special. You think he's special because that's how we all think in these situations, but in a couple of years you'll look back and be astonished that you found him so compelling. There are guys out there with all his good qualities who don't manipulate junior colleagues at work.
posted by Frowner at 7:03 AM on January 5 [19 favorites]
His actions are his fault, he's being either a clueless jerk or a creep and you should definitely document all this going forward while you yourself work to make your behavior neutral and move past your crush. If you get back to baseline yourself and he keeps being a weirdo, that will be the time to go to HR, in my opinion.
This stuff seems really complicated, but it's not. High school-like flirtation at work is a bad idea. I don't think it's weird to find yourself in this dynamic once or twice in a career, but it's good to be able to spot it and stop your side of it.
Ask yourself what is drawing you to this guy - sometimes people are just feeling bored or stressed at work and get into a flirtation for those reasons, but is this something where you're often drawn to people who are unreliable or withholding in some way? Or do you often find yourself semi-consciously seeking out situations where you will feel bad or insecure because that seems familiar or like something you deserve?
This guy - he's just some guy who is jerking you around. He's not special. You think he's special because that's how we all think in these situations, but in a couple of years you'll look back and be astonished that you found him so compelling. There are guys out there with all his good qualities who don't manipulate junior colleagues at work.
posted by Frowner at 7:03 AM on January 5 [19 favorites]
annoying hornbag jerks, ...setting up the most gullible vulnerable women in the office to take the fall
He sounds like an asshole who relishes your attention and who manipulates people when he feels like he isn’t getting enough of it.
He's being super unprofessional
His ‘deal’ is he’s a fucking dick.
All of this and more. He is manipulating you and your discomfort gives him a feeling of power. Be blandly polite, friendly-ish and as prodessional as possible. Learn, if you you, to be a little tougher. Some men are icky predators and vulnerability draws them. He will never like you romantically in a healthy or happy way. Ideally, get to know nice single guys and develop healthy friendships, which enhance your life. This guy is a toxic, flaming jerk and you will not change that.
posted by theora55 at 7:16 AM on January 5 [11 favorites]
He sounds like an asshole who relishes your attention and who manipulates people when he feels like he isn’t getting enough of it.
He's being super unprofessional
His ‘deal’ is he’s a fucking dick.
All of this and more. He is manipulating you and your discomfort gives him a feeling of power. Be blandly polite, friendly-ish and as prodessional as possible. Learn, if you you, to be a little tougher. Some men are icky predators and vulnerability draws them. He will never like you romantically in a healthy or happy way. Ideally, get to know nice single guys and develop healthy friendships, which enhance your life. This guy is a toxic, flaming jerk and you will not change that.
posted by theora55 at 7:16 AM on January 5 [11 favorites]
Hi, I'm an expert in employee rights in the UK and I 100% echo the advice to start writing everything down. Every weird interaction, especially if he's trying to get you to come to his office, etc. What feels like a maybe attraction to you right now could start feeling very unwelcome as it sounds like he's already acting in weird manipulative ways. If you're in the UK, sexual harassment is defined as "unwelcome sexual attention" in the Equality Act and most people don't know that simply writing down what has happened is enough to count as evidence. If you ever need to raise it to your employer later on to ask them to deal with it, having a record of the weird behaviour over time would be incredibly helpful.
I recommend you write down the who, what, where, when of each encounter that gives you weird feelings, and also make a note of when you wrote it down.
You are more than welcome to MeMail me any time if this starts to feel uncomfortable. I agree with others that this is bad vibes and could escalate!
posted by ukdanae at 7:34 AM on January 5 [15 favorites]
I recommend you write down the who, what, where, when of each encounter that gives you weird feelings, and also make a note of when you wrote it down.
You are more than welcome to MeMail me any time if this starts to feel uncomfortable. I agree with others that this is bad vibes and could escalate!
posted by ukdanae at 7:34 AM on January 5 [15 favorites]
It seems like you're making a lot of assumptions about what he his thinking and feeling, but the fact of the matter is, you don't know anything unless he says it directly. I think your crush is coloring what you're interpreting from him. Even if he is truly doing all these things, is that the kind of guy you want to be with?
posted by BlueBear at 7:35 AM on January 5 [5 favorites]
posted by BlueBear at 7:35 AM on January 5 [5 favorites]
What’s happening is that you have (had?) a major crush on this guy and are spending too much time and energy focusing on him:
“In a real gleeful tone because he could tell I was feeling upset.”
“he still finds me attractive because I can see him out the corner of my eye looking at me when he thinks I’m not looking."
Honestly, this sounds like projection. Whatever game he is playing can be handled by ignoring him and being professional. Be polite and cordial but don't engage.
“ I’m so besotted with him it’s painful .... I feel foolish and like a teenager around him.”
Perseverating on him and his words, looking for attention and affirmation won't help. It sounds like you need to fortify your self-esteem and your confidence overall. A person calling someone "dear" on the phone (which is generally unprofessional) should not make you feel jealous, it should make you scoff at what an immature moron he is.
Learning to manage physical reactions like blushing or getting nervous takes practice. Here he comes, time for you to get on the phone, put on headphones, go walk somewhere, etc. He's talking about non-work things, you don't participate. You have agency, you should use it, no matter how cute or appealing you find him.
If you are want a romantic life, pursue it outside of your place of employment.
Good luck.
posted by rhonzo at 7:58 AM on January 5 [14 favorites]
“In a real gleeful tone because he could tell I was feeling upset.”
“he still finds me attractive because I can see him out the corner of my eye looking at me when he thinks I’m not looking."
Honestly, this sounds like projection. Whatever game he is playing can be handled by ignoring him and being professional. Be polite and cordial but don't engage.
“ I’m so besotted with him it’s painful .... I feel foolish and like a teenager around him.”
Perseverating on him and his words, looking for attention and affirmation won't help. It sounds like you need to fortify your self-esteem and your confidence overall. A person calling someone "dear" on the phone (which is generally unprofessional) should not make you feel jealous, it should make you scoff at what an immature moron he is.
Learning to manage physical reactions like blushing or getting nervous takes practice. Here he comes, time for you to get on the phone, put on headphones, go walk somewhere, etc. He's talking about non-work things, you don't participate. You have agency, you should use it, no matter how cute or appealing you find him.
If you are want a romantic life, pursue it outside of your place of employment.
Good luck.
posted by rhonzo at 7:58 AM on January 5 [14 favorites]
Leaving aside the practical, work side of this and focusing only on the emotional side: Something I wish I'd known when I was younger is the difference between limerance and love.
Limerance is that strawberry-ice cream -IM-IN-LOVE 💖💕🌸💖🍧💖💕🌸 feeling that makes you blush and stammer around your crush and you just can't stop focusing on and thinking about them.
It's caused by hormones and brain chemistry, our brains and bodies trying to make it easier for us to trust another person enough to bond with them and have sex.
That feeling has got very little to do with love.
The person you crush on usually doesn't exist, you're crushing on your mental image of them.
It's also really exciting and addictive, and can be dangerous if you confuse it with love and think it's some kind of proof that this person is *really important in your life*
We live in a world where almost every pop song, movie and TV show barrages us with the message that limerance is love.
You're addicted to the chemicals your brain releases when you are with this guy and when you think about him.
Totally relatable, no judgement.
But you'll get over it faster if you recognise it for what it is.
posted by Zumbador at 8:25 AM on January 5 [6 favorites]
Limerance is that strawberry-ice cream -IM-IN-LOVE 💖💕🌸💖🍧💖💕🌸 feeling that makes you blush and stammer around your crush and you just can't stop focusing on and thinking about them.
It's caused by hormones and brain chemistry, our brains and bodies trying to make it easier for us to trust another person enough to bond with them and have sex.
That feeling has got very little to do with love.
The person you crush on usually doesn't exist, you're crushing on your mental image of them.
It's also really exciting and addictive, and can be dangerous if you confuse it with love and think it's some kind of proof that this person is *really important in your life*
We live in a world where almost every pop song, movie and TV show barrages us with the message that limerance is love.
You're addicted to the chemicals your brain releases when you are with this guy and when you think about him.
Totally relatable, no judgement.
But you'll get over it faster if you recognise it for what it is.
posted by Zumbador at 8:25 AM on January 5 [6 favorites]
As much as I want him to like me romantically
Why??? Ew.
I mean seriously, walk yourself through this: you want to have a relationship with someone who dangles the threat of other relationships at you, and doesn't have enough sense, or maturity, or survival instinct to not do this at work? You just love that tasty promise of him having to change jobs every two years or less because he's shit too much where he eats? Never knowing who else he's stringing along? Is it romantic for someone to want you to feel uncertain and unclear where they stand?
The fact that you can even say that in the face of all these warnings is a pretty big red flag. Are you okay? Is there something going on in your life that you are trying to plaster over with attention from an unreliable and likely unavailable man? A lot of time intense crushes are not really about the crushee but about a lack in your life, and the problem is that there's a lot of predators out there looking for people with that kind of vulnerability. Do you have anyone to talk to, like a friend, who can maybe help you process this some?
You're just making some really bad choices here. And they are choices; while base attraction will do what it does, you should be capable of finding someone unattractive because their behavior is gross, and you should be capable of shutting down an infatuation when it is inappropriate and regrettable. This is your ability to earn a paycheck you're putting on the line, your survival skills should be getting involved at this point.
posted by Lyn Never at 8:41 AM on January 5 [12 favorites]
Why??? Ew.
I mean seriously, walk yourself through this: you want to have a relationship with someone who dangles the threat of other relationships at you, and doesn't have enough sense, or maturity, or survival instinct to not do this at work? You just love that tasty promise of him having to change jobs every two years or less because he's shit too much where he eats? Never knowing who else he's stringing along? Is it romantic for someone to want you to feel uncertain and unclear where they stand?
The fact that you can even say that in the face of all these warnings is a pretty big red flag. Are you okay? Is there something going on in your life that you are trying to plaster over with attention from an unreliable and likely unavailable man? A lot of time intense crushes are not really about the crushee but about a lack in your life, and the problem is that there's a lot of predators out there looking for people with that kind of vulnerability. Do you have anyone to talk to, like a friend, who can maybe help you process this some?
You're just making some really bad choices here. And they are choices; while base attraction will do what it does, you should be capable of finding someone unattractive because their behavior is gross, and you should be capable of shutting down an infatuation when it is inappropriate and regrettable. This is your ability to earn a paycheck you're putting on the line, your survival skills should be getting involved at this point.
posted by Lyn Never at 8:41 AM on January 5 [12 favorites]
Yep - document your interactions, minimize time spent with him as much as possible, and just keep reminding yourself as needed that this dude is an unprofessional and unkind jerk. Eventually the crush will fade, until then you just have to tough it out and realize that this guy is showing you by his actions that he is not someone you would actually want to date if you could.
posted by Stacey at 9:06 AM on January 5 [1 favorite]
posted by Stacey at 9:06 AM on January 5 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: I’m truly grateful for each and everyone who has replied. I want to shut this attraction down, I know his behaviour is childish and unprofessional amongst other worst things but my brain won’t let me forget it. It’s on my mind all the times. I have tried talking to a friend but it wasn’t much help. I’m leaning towards working from home until I get over him. I don’t like working from home because I find it isolating and depressing but equally this work situation is making me very stressed and anxious, and down.
posted by colnoln at 9:11 AM on January 5 [4 favorites]
posted by colnoln at 9:11 AM on January 5 [4 favorites]
Response by poster: I meant to add, I don’t think talking to anyone at work would work - he’s very well liked by everyone because he is “laidback” and not a “strict boss”, so everyone thinks he’s great because he’s not on anyone’s backs and basically lets people do as they like.
Reading the whole thread again, I think it’s time I looked for another job.
posted by colnoln at 9:20 AM on January 5 [11 favorites]
Reading the whole thread again, I think it’s time I looked for another job.
posted by colnoln at 9:20 AM on January 5 [11 favorites]
I think this guy is fucking with you because he's bored and he's on a little bit of a power trip. He's probably done this before or, if not, something has changed in his life so he no longer gives a shit, doesn't care if he gets fired, etc. It's not your fault; you just happened to be in his path. If this guy's superiors know he is acting like this and don't care, yes, probably look for another job.
posted by BibiRose at 10:16 AM on January 5 [2 favorites]
posted by BibiRose at 10:16 AM on January 5 [2 favorites]
He's probably done this before or, if not, something has changed in his life so he no longer gives a shit, doesn't care if he gets fired, etc.
My guess is that this is his normal behavior and he's been getting away with it for years; it's the women who quit (like the OP is saying she is now considering) or get fired. If called out by HR, he'd say that he's just a friendly, approachable boss who believes in creating a fun and laid-back office environment, and is careful to be equally friendly with everyone. And he'll claim that she is crazy/hysterical/was always flirting with him in public which others noticed and made him uncomfortable. Or something like that; if he's been doing this for a long time, he'll have a pretty good nose for exactly how far he can go in public while maintaining sufficient deniability.
posted by Dip Flash at 10:34 AM on January 5 [6 favorites]
My guess is that this is his normal behavior and he's been getting away with it for years; it's the women who quit (like the OP is saying she is now considering) or get fired. If called out by HR, he'd say that he's just a friendly, approachable boss who believes in creating a fun and laid-back office environment, and is careful to be equally friendly with everyone. And he'll claim that she is crazy/hysterical/was always flirting with him in public which others noticed and made him uncomfortable. Or something like that; if he's been doing this for a long time, he'll have a pretty good nose for exactly how far he can go in public while maintaining sufficient deniability.
posted by Dip Flash at 10:34 AM on January 5 [6 favorites]
Response by poster: Yes I agree I think he has form for this. Particularly as he makes sure to do the exact same behaviours to other coworkers after he has done them to me. For example, he made an excuse to sit with me in my office all day when I was lone working one day and was asking me a lot of personal questions. He made sure to do the same to my colleague, except for asking her personal questions. One time he told me to email him about something ( and it felt like an excuse to get me to email him), and I just emailed him. The next day he did the same to my colleague.
My gut instinct is that he is very clever at covering his tracks so that he can say “but I did that with all the coworkers.”
F@@k! This thread has really opened my eyes to what a sleeze bag he is! I feel so embarrassed because here’s me thinking that he felt genuine attraction towards me.
posted by colnoln at 11:29 AM on January 5 [6 favorites]
My gut instinct is that he is very clever at covering his tracks so that he can say “but I did that with all the coworkers.”
F@@k! This thread has really opened my eyes to what a sleeze bag he is! I feel so embarrassed because here’s me thinking that he felt genuine attraction towards me.
posted by colnoln at 11:29 AM on January 5 [6 favorites]
You don't have to be embarrassed. It is perfectly normal not to put the most cynical construction on everything people do. That is what people like him count on and it's why they are so often successful. I think many of us have had similar experiences. The next time someone does this to you, you'll be able to laugh in their face.
posted by BibiRose at 11:37 AM on January 5 [6 favorites]
posted by BibiRose at 11:37 AM on January 5 [6 favorites]
Working from home is an *excellent* idea! Perhaps if you focus only on the actual work you need to accomplish, you'll feel more in control. If xyz, about the workplace or people in it, or anything which is not task-related should come into your mind, divert your thoughts back to what you're trying to accomplish.
After you finish for the day, do something social--call a friend, go out for a walk and coffee, go to the library and sit and read for an hour or two. Push back on the isolation. If you have positive work friends that support you, maybe get together. If you have a friend that also works from home, could you work together somewhere? Could the two of you work in an office away from the official office? Maybe in your living room, the library, or a coffee house?
I'm a believer on calling out this type of crap and pointing the finger, but it takes a lot of time and energy while you're still spending 40 hours earning a living. The idea of documenting all of this while having to deal with and deflect him AND still working your job everyday seems like it would be exhausting to me, with a no guarantee for a great outcome. Do you want to put your effort toward that, or maybe just bag the whole thing? It's crap that you would need to have to move jobs just to get away from this A-hole, but sometimes that's what gives the best outcome. Maybe this could be the lemon you make lemonade with?
posted by BlueHorse at 11:53 AM on January 5
After you finish for the day, do something social--call a friend, go out for a walk and coffee, go to the library and sit and read for an hour or two. Push back on the isolation. If you have positive work friends that support you, maybe get together. If you have a friend that also works from home, could you work together somewhere? Could the two of you work in an office away from the official office? Maybe in your living room, the library, or a coffee house?
I'm a believer on calling out this type of crap and pointing the finger, but it takes a lot of time and energy while you're still spending 40 hours earning a living. The idea of documenting all of this while having to deal with and deflect him AND still working your job everyday seems like it would be exhausting to me, with a no guarantee for a great outcome. Do you want to put your effort toward that, or maybe just bag the whole thing? It's crap that you would need to have to move jobs just to get away from this A-hole, but sometimes that's what gives the best outcome. Maybe this could be the lemon you make lemonade with?
posted by BlueHorse at 11:53 AM on January 5
The push/pull or run/chase dynamic is used by insecure people to manipulate and control others. It works like a slot machine: because the payout is random but always possible, people get hooked into it and keep throwing money away. Being attracted to that dynamic may hint at some co-dependent issues within yourself that need exploring. He will never be upfront or honest and he will gaslight the shit out of you.
posted by SamanthaK at 1:18 PM on January 5 [1 favorite]
posted by SamanthaK at 1:18 PM on January 5 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: I think I will turn the home working thing into a positive thing in the interim- get straight up and into the shower and get dressed as if I was going into work properly, that way I won’t feel slobby and depressed. It’s so easy to just get up, not bother with hair or clothes but throw on some joggers and generally be lazy but it usually ends up with me feeing bad for some reason. I could also make sure I get out for a walk, either first thing or during the day so that I don’t feel as though I have been in my four walls all day. In the evening I usually have a fitness class I go to, so it’s not too bad.
I’m hoping my feelings turn to revulsion or even indifference fairly quickly so that I can get back to seeing my work colleagues, whilst maintaining any shred of dignity I have left.
posted by colnoln at 1:19 PM on January 5 [1 favorite]
I’m hoping my feelings turn to revulsion or even indifference fairly quickly so that I can get back to seeing my work colleagues, whilst maintaining any shred of dignity I have left.
posted by colnoln at 1:19 PM on January 5 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: One last thing while I chew this over, I’m worried I somehow caused this dynamic because it was me that went cold with him initially because I was unsure what the deal was, this caused him to panic and keep trying to get my attention; once he’d won it again that’s when he turned the tables on me.
I guess I will never know but this is done now.
posted by colnoln at 1:22 PM on January 5 [1 favorite]
I guess I will never know but this is done now.
posted by colnoln at 1:22 PM on January 5 [1 favorite]
You say you don't even know if he's single or not. One way to help move your crush along: imagine that he's married and doing all these things. It would squick you out. Just let yourself be annoyed by him and/or just take everything he says with a grain of salt and no ulterior motives. Don't try to get inside his head. Play 'dumb' and just mock him (inside your head) for being a dumb oaf trying to cheat on his 'wife'.
posted by hydra77 at 1:28 PM on January 5 [1 favorite]
posted by hydra77 at 1:28 PM on January 5 [1 favorite]
You did not cause this dynamic in any way that matters. He may have been responding to your behavior but that doesn't make his response adult or acceptable. He could have responded by backing off! He could have responded by asking if he'd said something to offend you! He could have responded by being nicer and friendlier! He chose to respond by acting in an immature and offputting way. You shouldn't feel that you need to go through life walking on eggshells to prevent a rude or creepy response to you.
I mean, for all he knew, you were being cold because your dad was in the hospital and you were freaking out, or because you had gastritis and felt terrible! People can be cold or change their behavior without inviting others to be weird and creepy.
posted by Frowner at 1:30 PM on January 5 [7 favorites]
I mean, for all he knew, you were being cold because your dad was in the hospital and you were freaking out, or because you had gastritis and felt terrible! People can be cold or change their behavior without inviting others to be weird and creepy.
posted by Frowner at 1:30 PM on January 5 [7 favorites]
Another point of view: You’re both grown if not fully mature adults. Just sit down with him and tell him you’re getting a weird vibe. Discuss it. If the discussion isn’t satisfactory start with HR.
All this guessing is high school stuff.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 2:20 PM on January 5 [1 favorite]
All this guessing is high school stuff.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 2:20 PM on January 5 [1 favorite]
Another reason to stop this, if you need another one:
Like someone upthread said, everyone can see you. Do you want to be the person who's fucking the boss? Or who is making the boss think you want to fuck them to get special favors? Later, do you want all your accomplishments written off as having been gained through your "special" relationship with the boss.
You need to stop this shit right now. And document and go to HR if HE doesn't stop on his end when you do.
posted by ctmf at 3:35 PM on January 5
Like someone upthread said, everyone can see you. Do you want to be the person who's fucking the boss? Or who is making the boss think you want to fuck them to get special favors? Later, do you want all your accomplishments written off as having been gained through your "special" relationship with the boss.
You need to stop this shit right now. And document and go to HR if HE doesn't stop on his end when you do.
posted by ctmf at 3:35 PM on January 5
There's no way you "going cold" could cause this complex dynamic. Honestly though, hearing that, I am a little worried about retribution and think it wouldn't hurt to focus on documentation and maybe even finding a pro bono law clinic or paid lawyer that takes on sexual harassment cases. Just in case something happens next.
I’m hoping my feelings turn to revulsion or even indifference fairly quickly
Having a crush you don't want really sucks. Here's a quick brainstorm of ideas for getting over it:
1. Develop an intense after-work exercise regime or similar thing that you live for. Yoga, dance, indoor rock climbing gym, kickboxing class. Playing in a band. Something that gives you joy or a rush of endorphins, that you arrange your eating schedule around so that you'll have energy after work, that makes your work day feel pale and bland in comparison to its vividness and intensity. Ideally this would be quasi-social with attractive people. You want it so that all day at work you'll be noticing how strong you feel and daydreaming about getting back on the water later and checking the surf timetables (or whatever).
2. Take on a big project, like repainting your house, such that you'll spend your free time at work thinking about paint colors. You're going for some kind of all-consuming sense of purpose and mission here. A big volunteer effort might work too.
3. Really remember the bad feelings you're having now. When you start to feel a crush, flip to the bad feeling and remind yourself how he makes you feel. Or find any single thing you dislike about him and make it into a habit that whenever you think about him, you think of that.
4. Read self help-type books about sexual harassment. It's hard to quit thinking about something cold turkey, so a good way to taper down the amount you think about this stuff is by thinking about it via another lens, e.g. reading about someone else going through it. Don't overdo this one though. But it might be a good first step.
5. Find other high drama. Fill up the part of your brain that would otherwise think about this drama with some other drama. Intense books. True crime.
6. Plan a big vacation
7. Start therapy or talk to your therapist about this
I really wish you the best and am sorry this is happening.
posted by slidell at 1:31 AM on January 6 [3 favorites]
I’m hoping my feelings turn to revulsion or even indifference fairly quickly
Having a crush you don't want really sucks. Here's a quick brainstorm of ideas for getting over it:
1. Develop an intense after-work exercise regime or similar thing that you live for. Yoga, dance, indoor rock climbing gym, kickboxing class. Playing in a band. Something that gives you joy or a rush of endorphins, that you arrange your eating schedule around so that you'll have energy after work, that makes your work day feel pale and bland in comparison to its vividness and intensity. Ideally this would be quasi-social with attractive people. You want it so that all day at work you'll be noticing how strong you feel and daydreaming about getting back on the water later and checking the surf timetables (or whatever).
2. Take on a big project, like repainting your house, such that you'll spend your free time at work thinking about paint colors. You're going for some kind of all-consuming sense of purpose and mission here. A big volunteer effort might work too.
3. Really remember the bad feelings you're having now. When you start to feel a crush, flip to the bad feeling and remind yourself how he makes you feel. Or find any single thing you dislike about him and make it into a habit that whenever you think about him, you think of that.
4. Read self help-type books about sexual harassment. It's hard to quit thinking about something cold turkey, so a good way to taper down the amount you think about this stuff is by thinking about it via another lens, e.g. reading about someone else going through it. Don't overdo this one though. But it might be a good first step.
5. Find other high drama. Fill up the part of your brain that would otherwise think about this drama with some other drama. Intense books. True crime.
6. Plan a big vacation
7. Start therapy or talk to your therapist about this
I really wish you the best and am sorry this is happening.
posted by slidell at 1:31 AM on January 6 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: Thanks everyone.
Thinking back to when I first met him, I wasn’t attracted and actually found some of the things he said inappropriate and creepy. He has never been shy at mentioning sexual things in front of a bunch of women. It wasn’t until he started specifically with the eye contact, brushing against me, joking about “are we going on a hot date?” and acting like he had a crush on me that I allowed myself to become flattered by his attention. I mean, how sad is that?? I had become flattered by someone being inappropriate and basically sexually harassing me.
I am hoping this thread is my wake up call. Prior to posting this on the internet, I was guilty of thinking of this situation in terms of romantic feelings but reading everyone’s replies has been like pouring cold water over me.
posted by colnoln at 2:08 AM on January 6 [7 favorites]
Thinking back to when I first met him, I wasn’t attracted and actually found some of the things he said inappropriate and creepy. He has never been shy at mentioning sexual things in front of a bunch of women. It wasn’t until he started specifically with the eye contact, brushing against me, joking about “are we going on a hot date?” and acting like he had a crush on me that I allowed myself to become flattered by his attention. I mean, how sad is that?? I had become flattered by someone being inappropriate and basically sexually harassing me.
I am hoping this thread is my wake up call. Prior to posting this on the internet, I was guilty of thinking of this situation in terms of romantic feelings but reading everyone’s replies has been like pouring cold water over me.
posted by colnoln at 2:08 AM on January 6 [7 favorites]
"I mean, how sad is that?"
Give yourself a bit of grace.
We can't help what we feel. No need to feel shame about developing a crush, it just happens. It's what you do about it that matters.
Six months after my mother died, I developed a crush on a colleague who's 13 years younger than me and who I was managing. My therapist told me that it's really common for grieving people to get into this kind of situation.
See this as a symptom of an unmet need you have. Maybe you're lonely, or bored, or searching for someone who *sees you* or needing validation. Work to find what you need.
posted by Zumbador at 2:22 AM on January 6 [3 favorites]
Give yourself a bit of grace.
We can't help what we feel. No need to feel shame about developing a crush, it just happens. It's what you do about it that matters.
Six months after my mother died, I developed a crush on a colleague who's 13 years younger than me and who I was managing. My therapist told me that it's really common for grieving people to get into this kind of situation.
See this as a symptom of an unmet need you have. Maybe you're lonely, or bored, or searching for someone who *sees you* or needing validation. Work to find what you need.
posted by Zumbador at 2:22 AM on January 6 [3 favorites]
Mostly just waiting it out. The work setup meant that I was unable to avoid the person, but if I could have done that, it would have helped a lot.
It helped that I knew very clearly that it was a meaningless crush, and no chance at all for a relationship (apart from the work-hierarchy ethical aspect, I'm also happily married).
Being kind to myself, so not beating myself up every time I found myself day dreaming about my crush, but also trying to distract myself to other thoughts.
The experience made me a lot less judgmental of others. That also helped, actually.
posted by Zumbador at 4:40 AM on January 6 [1 favorite]
It helped that I knew very clearly that it was a meaningless crush, and no chance at all for a relationship (apart from the work-hierarchy ethical aspect, I'm also happily married).
Being kind to myself, so not beating myself up every time I found myself day dreaming about my crush, but also trying to distract myself to other thoughts.
The experience made me a lot less judgmental of others. That also helped, actually.
posted by Zumbador at 4:40 AM on January 6 [1 favorite]
I think what makes it hard getting over something like this at least twofold. There is the feeling you describe, that it's your fault, that you could have done something differently to avoid it. Serial seducers-- of which I suspect this guy is one-- are masters of making you feel this way. Knowing that does not automatically help you detach though. Even if you know it was sort of a fake relationship, you're going to need a little while to take your feelings back once you have invested them.
What helped me more, in a roughly analogous situation (a guy at work anyway) was realizing I was not alone. Do you have Netflix? Try watching The Tinder Swindler. I assume this person at your work is not a con artist but I do think you fell for a fraudulent relationship. I was watching that show and thinking there is nothing that interesting about the con artist himself. He is using that predictable old con artist playbook. And then look at the women who fell for him. They are all gorgeous and smart and would be a catch for anyone. They do not seem like victims in any sense of the word. Meeting up with the others was the cure for their problem. When you are isolated in this, the feeling feeds on itself. For me, running into the guy, seeing his schtick for what it was, and just walking away when he started in on me again was the best feeling ever.
posted by BibiRose at 8:05 AM on January 6
What helped me more, in a roughly analogous situation (a guy at work anyway) was realizing I was not alone. Do you have Netflix? Try watching The Tinder Swindler. I assume this person at your work is not a con artist but I do think you fell for a fraudulent relationship. I was watching that show and thinking there is nothing that interesting about the con artist himself. He is using that predictable old con artist playbook. And then look at the women who fell for him. They are all gorgeous and smart and would be a catch for anyone. They do not seem like victims in any sense of the word. Meeting up with the others was the cure for their problem. When you are isolated in this, the feeling feeds on itself. For me, running into the guy, seeing his schtick for what it was, and just walking away when he started in on me again was the best feeling ever.
posted by BibiRose at 8:05 AM on January 6
I am... Autistic and typically viewed as male in most workplace environments. I'm not in the least trying to dismiss your experience, nor the advice given above (it's all deeply good advice, please listen to them!) But at first, I was wondering if he was even aware that you thought there was flirting? It kinda sounded like he was just trying to be the cool, liked by everyone boss, and it felt good while his attention was turned to you. That's natural, especially if they are attractive and kind.
Then you said "found some of the things he said inappropriate and creepy. He has never been shy at mentioning sexual things in front of a bunch of women. It wasn’t until he started specifically with the eye contact, brushing against me, joking about “are we going on a hot date?” and acting like he had a crush" and I switched to 100% creeper, or at best completely unacceptably pushing past barriers he should know exists. You probably are not special, I'm afraid. Use that pain to sever your feelings for him.
And try not to be too hard on yourself . You know the fight or flight reaction people talk about? It's really fight, flight, freeze or... Fawn. With your update, it sounds like he's inappropriate, invading your space and upsetting your work environment. And perhaps your natural, instinctive reaction to that violation is to turn it around, because if you're interested, that's a type of control, right? Mutual benefits instead of just him being a creep. We can't always control our protective behavior instincts. But we can analyze what we do and why and work on different, better reaction.
I'm glad you listened to your instincts and posted! The book Gift of Fear is commonly recommended and might be helpful.
posted by Jacen at 12:45 PM on January 6 [1 favorite]
Then you said "found some of the things he said inappropriate and creepy. He has never been shy at mentioning sexual things in front of a bunch of women. It wasn’t until he started specifically with the eye contact, brushing against me, joking about “are we going on a hot date?” and acting like he had a crush" and I switched to 100% creeper, or at best completely unacceptably pushing past barriers he should know exists. You probably are not special, I'm afraid. Use that pain to sever your feelings for him.
And try not to be too hard on yourself . You know the fight or flight reaction people talk about? It's really fight, flight, freeze or... Fawn. With your update, it sounds like he's inappropriate, invading your space and upsetting your work environment. And perhaps your natural, instinctive reaction to that violation is to turn it around, because if you're interested, that's a type of control, right? Mutual benefits instead of just him being a creep. We can't always control our protective behavior instincts. But we can analyze what we do and why and work on different, better reaction.
I'm glad you listened to your instincts and posted! The book Gift of Fear is commonly recommended and might be helpful.
posted by Jacen at 12:45 PM on January 6 [1 favorite]
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posted by travelingthyme (staff) at 2:33 PM on January 7
posted by travelingthyme (staff) at 2:33 PM on January 7
Several people have advised to write things down that you can present to HR if this behaviour doesn't stop.
If you're going to do that, I suggest you do not write stuff like this:
I would see him talking to other women at work and get the feeling maybe I am not special to him so I started to avoid him and be cold. He then panicked and started to almost hunt me down to get my attention ... I always got the vibe he was frightened to single me out so would always make sure that he spoke to everyone else I worked with equally. Then one day it just kind of stopped and he was doing this thing where it seemed like he was trying to make me jealous
Write what you know to be objectively true:
On [date] X said "blah blah blah"
On [date] X was in my office alone with me and asked "personal question"
Do not write about what you think someone is thinking or feeling. You can write about your own feelings if that's pertinent to something someone else did or said.
On [date] X said "personal stuff" that made me feel very embarrassed.
Writing to HR about "maybe I am not special to him " or "he was trying to make me jealous" will come across as very unprofessional.
posted by HiroProtagonist at 6:15 PM on January 8 [5 favorites]
If you're going to do that, I suggest you do not write stuff like this:
I would see him talking to other women at work and get the feeling maybe I am not special to him so I started to avoid him and be cold. He then panicked and started to almost hunt me down to get my attention ... I always got the vibe he was frightened to single me out so would always make sure that he spoke to everyone else I worked with equally. Then one day it just kind of stopped and he was doing this thing where it seemed like he was trying to make me jealous
Write what you know to be objectively true:
On [date] X said "blah blah blah"
On [date] X was in my office alone with me and asked "personal question"
Do not write about what you think someone is thinking or feeling. You can write about your own feelings if that's pertinent to something someone else did or said.
On [date] X said "personal stuff" that made me feel very embarrassed.
Writing to HR about "maybe I am not special to him " or "he was trying to make me jealous" will come across as very unprofessional.
posted by HiroProtagonist at 6:15 PM on January 8 [5 favorites]
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posted by jgirl at 6:13 AM on January 5 [33 favorites]