I hate gyms
June 26, 2007 6:08 PM Subscribe
Canceling gym membership, problems with their billing company...
When I joined my gym they told me that the only way I could pay was to use their billing company who would directly debit my account each month on a certain day, the 20th of the month. If I wanted to cancel my membership I could at any time but the billing company requires 30 days to cancel a membership. Basically if I cancelled on the 22nd I would have to pay for an additional month the NEXT 20th. Ok I can work with that I think.
I go to cancel my membership, which they require in writing, and send them an email on the 18th. I hear nothing from them, and write them another email on the 25th. They tell me that they never received the first email, and since I am cancelling on the 25th I must pay for an additional month due to their billing companies cancellation policy.
This seems pretty shitty to me, as I have no contract or agreement with their billing policy. They say they talked to this company and there is no way around getting charged for next month. I told the manager he could write me a check for the $40 I am going to be billed, so it would get taken out of my account but I would be reimbursed by him. No dice.
What else can I do? This is not on a credit card, its on a bank account. Can I tell my bank to decline any debits from a certain person? If I do this could the gym / billing agency file anything against me credit wise?
When I joined my gym they told me that the only way I could pay was to use their billing company who would directly debit my account each month on a certain day, the 20th of the month. If I wanted to cancel my membership I could at any time but the billing company requires 30 days to cancel a membership. Basically if I cancelled on the 22nd I would have to pay for an additional month the NEXT 20th. Ok I can work with that I think.
I go to cancel my membership, which they require in writing, and send them an email on the 18th. I hear nothing from them, and write them another email on the 25th. They tell me that they never received the first email, and since I am cancelling on the 25th I must pay for an additional month due to their billing companies cancellation policy.
This seems pretty shitty to me, as I have no contract or agreement with their billing policy. They say they talked to this company and there is no way around getting charged for next month. I told the manager he could write me a check for the $40 I am going to be billed, so it would get taken out of my account but I would be reimbursed by him. No dice.
What else can I do? This is not on a credit card, its on a bank account. Can I tell my bank to decline any debits from a certain person? If I do this could the gym / billing agency file anything against me credit wise?
Slightly off topic note: I've found that most hospitals have a gym program that's cheaper and better than the commercial gyms.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:52 PM on June 26, 2007
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:52 PM on June 26, 2007
From the Official Staff Interpretation of Federal Reserve Regulation E:
In any case, tell the bank in writing what is going on. Submit evidence that you complied with the terms for cancelling the ongoing authorization.
If it were me, I would then send a letter certified mail to the billing company and CC the gym, saying that you already sent them notification on time that further debits were unauthorized. I'd tell them that you have notified the bank, which will not honor any future debits. Furthermore, I'd say that any attempt to issue another electronic debit would be fraudulent, and would result in a criminal complaint being made to the district attorney. But I'm not you, and I'm certainly not a lawyer, just a well-meaning layperson, so decide yourself.
Warning: even if you are successful in avoiding an ACH debit, they could still pass on your account to a collection agency or sue you for it.
posted by grouse at 6:59 PM on June 26, 2007 [1 favorite]
10(c) Consumer's Right To Stop PaymentNote that the bank can charge you (sometimes more than $30) for a stop payment order. I don't think they should for a revocation of authorization, but they might; there doesn't seem to b a rule against it. If you'd rather take your chances, I think they have to reverse an unauthorized payment after it is made for free. They may ask you to make an affidavit or a written statement signed under penalty of perjury to confirm this.
1. Stop-payment order. The financial institution must honor an oral stop-payment order made at least three business days before a scheduled debit. If the debit item is resubmitted, the institution must continue to honor the stop-payment order (for example, by suspending all subsequent payments to the payee-originator until the consumer notifies the institution that payments should resume).
2. Revocation of authorization. Once a financial institution has been notified that the consumer's authorization is no longer valid, it must block all future payments for the particular debit transmitted by the designated payee-originator. (However, see comment 10(c)–3.) The institution may not wait for the payee-originator to terminate the automatic debits. The institution may confirm that the consumer has informed the payee-originator of the revocation (for example, by requiring a copy of the consumer's revocation as written confirmation to be provided within 14 days of an oral notification). If the institution does not receive the required written confirmation within the 14-day period, it may honor subsequent debits to the account.
3. Alternative procedure for processing a stop-payment request. If an institution does not have the capability to block a preauthorized debit from being posted to the consumer's account—as in the case of a preauthorized debit made through a debit card network or other system, for example—the institution may instead comply with the stop-payment requirements by using a third party to block the transfer(s), as long as the consumer's account is not debited for the payment.
In any case, tell the bank in writing what is going on. Submit evidence that you complied with the terms for cancelling the ongoing authorization.
If it were me, I would then send a letter certified mail to the billing company and CC the gym, saying that you already sent them notification on time that further debits were unauthorized. I'd tell them that you have notified the bank, which will not honor any future debits. Furthermore, I'd say that any attempt to issue another electronic debit would be fraudulent, and would result in a criminal complaint being made to the district attorney. But I'm not you, and I'm certainly not a lawyer, just a well-meaning layperson, so decide yourself.
Warning: even if you are successful in avoiding an ACH debit, they could still pass on your account to a collection agency or sue you for it.
posted by grouse at 6:59 PM on June 26, 2007 [1 favorite]
I go to cancel my membership, which they require in writing, and send them an email on the 18th. I hear nothing from them, and write them another email on the 25th. They tell me that they never received the first email, and since I am cancelling on the 25th I must pay for an additional month due to their billing companies cancellation policy.
I used to work at a bank, and I can tell you that if all you are getting charged for is one extra month, you are getting off pretty easy. At least once a week we heard a story about a gym simply refusing to stop debiting accounts for many many months. We had many cases where we simply moved people into new accounts, as it was easier than actually getting the ACH stop payments to work reliably.
My advice to all my customers was to never authorize anyone to make direct debits from their account unless they were pretty sure they would never want the debit to stop. If that means not becoming a member of a certain gym, well there are always other gyms.
You could certainly fight this, but my guess is that it will cost you more than $40 in time and money.
posted by Rock Steady at 7:17 PM on June 26, 2007
I used to work at a bank, and I can tell you that if all you are getting charged for is one extra month, you are getting off pretty easy. At least once a week we heard a story about a gym simply refusing to stop debiting accounts for many many months. We had many cases where we simply moved people into new accounts, as it was easier than actually getting the ACH stop payments to work reliably.
My advice to all my customers was to never authorize anyone to make direct debits from their account unless they were pretty sure they would never want the debit to stop. If that means not becoming a member of a certain gym, well there are always other gyms.
You could certainly fight this, but my guess is that it will cost you more than $40 in time and money.
posted by Rock Steady at 7:17 PM on June 26, 2007
I had to call in my local tv station's "Troubleshooter" to get a refund from a shady gym I belonged to. Keep a close eye on your account and if you continue to have problems, you might want to do the same. Gyms are notorious for this kind of sticky business.
posted by pinky at 7:44 PM on June 26, 2007
posted by pinky at 7:44 PM on June 26, 2007
Its $40 let it go.
You are at least partially responsible for what has happened. You knew about their policy - and its not an uncommon one.
You emailed them 2 days before your debit was due and left it 7 days to chase them up. At the very least you should have sent the email with a receipt request. If they needed it in writing and you were so adamant about not being charged an extra month you should have sent a letter by recorded delivery so you had proof they got it. Then shady or not, they couldn't deny it.
You cant prove that they got your first email and if they didn't get it, they cant prove you sent it.
Anyone can say they sent an email x days ago just as much as they can say they didnt get it. Its your word against theirs.
posted by missmagenta at 6:32 AM on June 27, 2007
You are at least partially responsible for what has happened. You knew about their policy - and its not an uncommon one.
You emailed them 2 days before your debit was due and left it 7 days to chase them up. At the very least you should have sent the email with a receipt request. If they needed it in writing and you were so adamant about not being charged an extra month you should have sent a letter by recorded delivery so you had proof they got it. Then shady or not, they couldn't deny it.
You cant prove that they got your first email and if they didn't get it, they cant prove you sent it.
Anyone can say they sent an email x days ago just as much as they can say they didnt get it. Its your word against theirs.
posted by missmagenta at 6:32 AM on June 27, 2007
I would have to agree that sending notification via email is not the best choice. It leaves you little recourse when they say it was never received.
At this point you should monitor your account very closely to see if they are continuing to debit your account in future months.
posted by SoftSummerBreeze at 9:16 AM on June 27, 2007
At this point you should monitor your account very closely to see if they are continuing to debit your account in future months.
posted by SoftSummerBreeze at 9:16 AM on June 27, 2007
Those who are saying that this is not worth fighting over for $40 might be right. Like I said, even if you keep them from debiting you, they can still sue you. Or ding your credit report. That alone may cost you much more than $40.
But I think to say that the OP is partially responsible is really blaming the victim. Saying his actions were not the best choice is more correct. But in the end, the gym is the one standing on a technicality to make an extra month's payment that they don't deserve. The OP has evidence that he sent the notification on time, and it is undisputed that they were notified well before the debit, and had ample time to stop offering their services and the debit, despite what they claim about needing a month's notice for their billing company.
Its your word against theirs.
Not really, because the OP has written documentation that the message was sent. So unless they have server logs of all incoming messages (which they might), I don't think a claim that they never saw the message is good enough.
posted by grouse at 9:40 AM on June 27, 2007
But I think to say that the OP is partially responsible is really blaming the victim. Saying his actions were not the best choice is more correct. But in the end, the gym is the one standing on a technicality to make an extra month's payment that they don't deserve. The OP has evidence that he sent the notification on time, and it is undisputed that they were notified well before the debit, and had ample time to stop offering their services and the debit, despite what they claim about needing a month's notice for their billing company.
Its your word against theirs.
Not really, because the OP has written documentation that the message was sent. So unless they have server logs of all incoming messages (which they might), I don't think a claim that they never saw the message is good enough.
posted by grouse at 9:40 AM on June 27, 2007
Interesting.
Over here (Australia, wrt cancelling gym memberships, and many other legal contracts), 'in writing' means paper and a signature. An email is generally not sufficient, and the gym would be quite within their rights to ignore the email as a valid request for the termination of the contract.
The legal situation differs over there, of course, and maybe in your favour.
posted by ysabet at 5:18 PM on June 27, 2007
Over here (Australia, wrt cancelling gym memberships, and many other legal contracts), 'in writing' means paper and a signature. An email is generally not sufficient, and the gym would be quite within their rights to ignore the email as a valid request for the termination of the contract.
The legal situation differs over there, of course, and maybe in your favour.
posted by ysabet at 5:18 PM on June 27, 2007
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by la petite marie at 6:37 PM on June 26, 2007