Creative soccer goals
March 22, 2006 10:33 PM   Subscribe

Is this soccer move, in which a player steals the ball from a kicking goalie, legal? [video site with possible NSFW ads]

I'm curious why I don't see this more often. If plays like this can lead to easy goals, why do most players retreat when their opposing goalie gains control of the ball? Even if such a lucky steal is rare, what prevents players from giving the goalie a "full court press" type of pressure in general. (Not sure how off-sides rules apply to this situation.)
posted by alex3005 to Sports, Hobbies, & Recreation (28 answers total)
Its illegal. The movement of dropping the ball onto the foot is classed asstill in the keepers possesion. George best tried it once. And I think the goal was given. But it was tried quite recently and dissalowed.

However. If the keeper is holding the ball in one hand you can head it out of his hanfd and score. Ive seen that done!
posted by gergtreble at 10:59 PM on March 22, 2006

For one, I think it's also not very sporting-like to score like that.
posted by arrowhead at 11:08 PM on March 22, 2006

No expert here, but I think it's illegal.

From the FIFA rules site, under fouls and misconduct:

19. If a goalkeeper is bouncing the ball, may an opponent play the ball as it touches the ground without being guilty of dangerous play?
>> No.

21. As a goalkeeper throws, clears, releases – apart from at a goal clearance – or kicks the ball back into play, an opponent intercepts it before it touches the ground. Is this permitted?
>> No. It is an offence to prevent the goalkeeper from releasing the ball from his hands. Throwing, releasing and kicking the ball is regarded as a single action.
posted by frogan at 11:11 PM on March 22, 2006

I'd be surprised if it wasn't legal. There's no reason that I can see (under US rules, at least) that the ball is not "in play" during the drop. No hands were used, and off-sides rules wouldn't apply at all since that would require a pass from another offensive player in that half of the field.

Nice video though! I imagine most goalies would be more careful than that. It's got to be a rare event.
posted by Ufez Jones at 11:13 PM on March 22, 2006

Well, shit. Folks that know more than I do completely deny my previous comment. Guess I watch too much basketball.
posted by Ufez Jones at 11:15 PM on March 22, 2006

It looks like the keeper has dropped the ball in preparation for kicking it upfield. The scorer did not kick it out of his hands. This is not a "dead ball" situation so once the keeper's dropped it then he can be treated like any other outfield player and be tackled and dispossesed. Peter Shilton of England made a similar error in the World Cup play-offs for third & fourth place a few years ago.

As far as kicking/heading the ball out of the keeper's hands goes, you wouldn't get away with it these days. Neil Crossley, I believe, of Nottingham Forest did it about ten years ago and the goal was allowed, but these days the keeper is afforded so much protection that it would be disallowed.
posted by TiredStarling at 11:53 PM on March 22, 2006

Best answer: Continued...

This doesn't happen more often because there usually aren't strikers hiding behind the goalie. As soon as the keeper sees an opposing player approaching they either pick the ball up or kick it away. Occasionally the keeper willl stuff it up and get caught dribbling the ball, but a striker would waste too much energy always closing down the goalie every time the goalie had possession, then have to dash upfield again to take part in the next phase of play and not get caught offside.

And as far as offside goes in the video, because the ball was last touched by an opposing player, the offside rule does not apply.
posted by TiredStarling at 12:02 AM on March 23, 2006

TiredStarling: you beat me to it, that's exactly right. That's why I think the goal was valid. The keeper looked like he was going to "idle" with the ball at his feet for a while and therefore it was in play. However, if the player had intercepted the ball as it was on it's way from the keeper's hands to his foot to be kicked right upfield, that would be illegal (see Thierry Henry a few seasons ago).

That Forest one years and years ago was Gary Crosby I think. I remember the pundits arguing for weeks about whether it should've been allowed.
posted by uk_giffo at 12:06 AM on March 23, 2006

It's allowed. The keeper had dropper the ball, it wasn't taken out of his hand. A few years ago, Dion Dublin scored a goal like there where the keeper had put the ball down to kick it and Dion sneaked in and scored. The goal was allowed.
posted by essexjan at 12:07 AM on March 23, 2006

Yup, legal. Have even seen a ball headed out of keeper's open palm and the resulting goal given.
posted by brautigan at 12:35 AM on March 23, 2006

There was a famous goal in which Paul "Gazza" Gasciogne kicked the ball out of the goalie's hands as he was holding it, let alone bouncing it. Wasn't that allowed? I could swear it was.
posted by AmbroseChapel at 12:48 AM on March 23, 2006

On the subject of sicking goalies, nobody comes even close to Johan Cruijff, aka Jesus Christ, aka El Salvatore. After the goals was scored, the crowd didn't even bother to cheer, because they thought moves like this were off limits (crappy google video alert) en yes it was a penalty en yes it was legal.
posted by ouke at 1:03 AM on March 23, 2006

It is legal. No offside or other rule against it.
The goal was given. The reporter in the studio also says so. The goalie should be mad at his teammates for not warning him.
posted by ollsen at 2:10 AM on March 23, 2006

Yes, it's totally legal. Not offside, and the ball is not in the keeper's possesion. There's been even more blatant goalie robbing in the past that has stood (Gary Crosby for Nottingham Forest heading the ball from Man City keeper Andy Dibble's hand for example). However, if the ball is in mid air when the striker takes it from the keeper, then it's likely to be disallowed for dangerous play: see for a discussion on the BBC site when Thierry Henry had, what looked to many people, a perfectly good goal disallowed against Blackburn a couple of years ago. (Also talks about teh George Best incident).
posted by Hartster at 2:13 AM on March 23, 2006

I agree with FIFA that kicking or heading the ball out of the keeper's hands (even if he's just holding it with one hand) should be illegal. If he's dropped it tough, and it's lying/rolling a few meters in front of him, he should be considered regular player.

This happened once a few seasons ago in the Premiership, when the keeper was unaware of a player that had been shuffled out of the pitch beside the goal and sprinted back much later than the rest of the players. The goalie threw the ball a few meters in front of him to kick it out, and the player snapped it resulting in an easy goal. Perfectly legal, of course. The Henry incident, on the other hand, isn't. And shouldn't be, IMHO.
posted by Haarball at 4:02 AM on March 23, 2006

And the reason it doesn't happen too often is because most goalies are wise to it now. 99 times out of 100 they'll check behind them once they pick up the ball, just to make sure they know there is no-one there. Guess this guy forgot.

As to whether it's SPORTING or not... well... that's a different question.
posted by snowgoon at 4:52 AM on March 23, 2006

Yeah it's a "legal" goal. As soon as the goalie puts the ball down, it's in play no matter if he has an opposing player behind him or not. Offside doesn't come into is since the striker is receiving the pall from an opponent. Kicking or heading the ball from the goalkeepers hands is not permitted, although they probably have been given in the past.

The Dion Dublin goal is the best example of this - and it stood.
posted by fire&wings at 4:53 AM on March 23, 2006

It looked to me like the goalie had dropped the ball and touched it with his foot before the striker stole it. If that's the case, it was definitely in play.
posted by kirkaracha at 6:28 AM on March 23, 2006

Ouke— What happened in your Google vid? I can't make it out.
posted by klangklangston at 6:52 AM on March 23, 2006

Ouke— What happened in your Google vid? I can't make it out.

Rather than kicking it straight at the goal, Cruyff first passes it to team mate Olsen before finishing it off. Perfectly legal.

Check here for an amusing failure to recreate it.
posted by swordfishtrombones at 7:12 AM on March 23, 2006

A couple of jerks tried the two-touch PK against our team in a city league game in Charlottesville a few years ago, but our keeper (and my roommate) blocked it.
posted by mbd1mbd1 at 7:20 AM on March 23, 2006

Just to clarify: This would not be legal for a goal kick.
posted by DieHipsterDie at 7:21 AM on March 23, 2006

as mentioned above, every once in a while -- very rarely at pro level obviously -- an absentminded goalie makes that mistake. they key factor is, you can't foul the goalie -- no shoves or kicks to steal him the ball. but the ball is in play, and if you can manage to steal the ball without fouling -- as in the video you linked -- the goal must be allowed.

about 40 years ago in the old Champions league Liverpool lost a key game to Internazionale Milan because of a similar goal -- scored by Joaquin Peirò
posted by matteo at 8:14 AM on March 23, 2006

The sneaky thing in Ouke's video was that it looked like he was pretending to pass the ball to the ref.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:57 AM on March 23, 2006

Getting to this later, but another reason this isn't attempted much any more is that if the goalie makes the kick and the ball is returned by your team, you'll be offside, stopping play. Most players try to get onside as quickly as possible when the goalie has the ball in this hands (or at his feet)...
posted by benzo8 at 9:01 AM on March 23, 2006

Regarding Ouke's video: why isn't the second player to touch the ball offsides? And also the initial PK taker when he receives the return touch? Are there off-camera defenders outside the box along the endline?
posted by redsnare at 10:26 AM on March 23, 2006

why isn't the second player to touch the ball offsides?

I don't think offsides applies on penalty kicks, and even if it does, both of the players are behind the ball (i.e., closer to their own goal than the ball is).
posted by kirkaracha at 2:30 PM on March 23, 2006

why isn't the second player to touch the ball offsides?

Player two was in an onside position when his teammate kicked the ball to him. And you'll notice that player 1 then makes sure he's behind player two when he takes the final pass.

The only situations where offsides does not apply is on a goal kick, corner kick or throw in.
posted by DieHipsterDie at 4:57 PM on March 23, 2006

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