Car accident, on dangerous ice day. Late. Academic contract terminated!
November 20, 2017 5:12 PM Subscribe
Attending a school, placed on academic probation for attendance. Late, on a particularly dangerous day(easily could have been very hurt, in an effort to continue to try to reach the school). Arrived two hours late. Almost no one is in attendance. Another student's vehicle was stranded. On this day, the director of the program decides to suspend, then terminate my contract, for attendance!
Please read on, I would love some help, or insight! I am in the midst of filing an internal grievance, hoping to reinstate my contract.
Last year, Oregon had a record ice storm.
During this day, I wrecked my car on the way to school. I accumulated $600 in damages for the car, and could not commute for the next 7-10 days(thus, damage extended beyond the initial $600).
I had already been on probation for attendance, but when I arrived two and a half hours late at the school(after literally inching my way through a neighborhood on an elevated hill/mountain[former active volcano], even after a concerned neighbor saw me struggling, and came outside to lend me some Yaktrax[cleats for shoes, in ice[[I had actually fallen more than a few times, and easily, EASILY could have broken a bone, or worse!]]) the directors decided to officially suspend my contract, based on my attendance that day. There is no way it's justifiable. I'm in the process of writing the school for internal grievances, and I need to submit some documents within the next 1-2days! (preferably tomorrow!!). This is with the hope to resolve such internally, before submitting grievances to the local Board of Education.
I am having a lot of trouble clearly locating references to student's rights(particularly in Oregon), as well as supporting laws, and safety regulations, in reference to such a situation.
There were so many news reports. I believe at least half, to three fourths of the class, was absent. One student's car slid into a stop sign, where she had to leave it, until collecting it a few days later. A lot of late students, between the few that showed up.
Please help, what can I do?!
The Higher Education Coordinating Commission in my area has been of great, supportive help- I am just trying to support my grievance with local laws, student's rights, and laws, or structure pertaining to the Board of Education, etc. I am hoping to deliver this by tomorrow afternoon.
Anyone have any experience?
Thanks so much for reading!
Last year, Oregon had a record ice storm.
During this day, I wrecked my car on the way to school. I accumulated $600 in damages for the car, and could not commute for the next 7-10 days(thus, damage extended beyond the initial $600).
I had already been on probation for attendance, but when I arrived two and a half hours late at the school(after literally inching my way through a neighborhood on an elevated hill/mountain[former active volcano], even after a concerned neighbor saw me struggling, and came outside to lend me some Yaktrax[cleats for shoes, in ice[[I had actually fallen more than a few times, and easily, EASILY could have broken a bone, or worse!]]) the directors decided to officially suspend my contract, based on my attendance that day. There is no way it's justifiable. I'm in the process of writing the school for internal grievances, and I need to submit some documents within the next 1-2days! (preferably tomorrow!!). This is with the hope to resolve such internally, before submitting grievances to the local Board of Education.
I am having a lot of trouble clearly locating references to student's rights(particularly in Oregon), as well as supporting laws, and safety regulations, in reference to such a situation.
There were so many news reports. I believe at least half, to three fourths of the class, was absent. One student's car slid into a stop sign, where she had to leave it, until collecting it a few days later. A lot of late students, between the few that showed up.
Please help, what can I do?!
The Higher Education Coordinating Commission in my area has been of great, supportive help- I am just trying to support my grievance with local laws, student's rights, and laws, or structure pertaining to the Board of Education, etc. I am hoping to deliver this by tomorrow afternoon.
Anyone have any experience?
Thanks so much for reading!
This post was deleted for the following reason: poster's request -- LobsterMitten
I'm just realizing I am asking questions that invite a back-and-forth, sorry. I guess my answer is that your question is too confusing to answer. It sounds like there is a lot of backstory that would be relevant.
posted by lakeroon at 5:22 PM on November 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by lakeroon at 5:22 PM on November 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Did you pursue the avenues suggested in your last question about this, and what happened?
posted by chesty_a_arthur at 5:23 PM on November 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by chesty_a_arthur at 5:23 PM on November 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Yes there are some trade schools that require mandatory attendance and if you miss days - even if it is not your fault, you are out of luck. Specifically, in Oregon for Tattoo artists it is the Oregon Government that set these rules. The Director's hands are tied to an extent.
I would approach the Director, humblely, and look for a resolution she would sign off on. You may be able to salvage some of your completed hours but perhaps requiring you to pay additional fees.
posted by saucysault at 5:52 PM on November 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
I would approach the Director, humblely, and look for a resolution she would sign off on. You may be able to salvage some of your completed hours but perhaps requiring you to pay additional fees.
posted by saucysault at 5:52 PM on November 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: My apologies for the fragmented brevity, folks! Please let me explain.
"Did you pursue the avenues suggested in your last question about this, and what happened?" - Please expand.
"I'm just realizing I am asking questions that invite a back-and-forth, sorry. I guess my answer is that your question is too confusing to answer. It sounds like there is a lot of backstory that would be relevant." Thank you for clarifying your rhetoric!
There is quite some backstory, it's a bit complex. I will try to be concise, but thorough.
I'm in Oregon. I had been attending a "Private Post Secondary Education Facility" to obtain my tattooist's license(OR is the only state that mandates this sort of structure for a tattooist's license. It is the most bureaucratic process for this licensing, in the country- However, occasionally the work is of higher quality, and the artists are paid better wages. I myself am not entirely enamoured with the tattoo world, however, this environment takes sort of a twist, that makes it more appealing to me-).
I was working on another creative project while enrolled in licensing, and negotiated a lot of flexibility in my schedule with the "school"/licensing facility, and its directors(who were quite willing to work with me). With the approval of the directors, I deliberately put my own level of attendance on ice, in the confidence that I could balance obtaining my license, and working on other creative projects. Essentially I was taking sick days(to the director's approval) to commit to work on other projects, while attending.
This logic may have been entirely well and fine- had that ice storm not occurred!
I am "just pursuing" this now- as initially my contract had been suspended for six months(up to a year, where I was able to return)- then midway, the director decided to terminate it, based on a technicality(the school is now taking students for the rest of the year, then curiously closing- uncertain quite what is happening, there).
I then contacted the local Higher Education Coordinating Commission, for support. Their Specialist suggested I file an internal grievance- and if the grievance cannot be resolved internally, within the school's academic perimeters, the Program Specialist at HECC then recommended filing an external grievance, to HECC itself(uncertain if this is an Oregon-local Board, or if other states have it too, but HECC works closely with the State Board and Department of Edu).
I am now in the process of writing that grievance - which is nearly finished - I am just having difficultly locating student's rights, what a student is to do if suspended for attendance during dangerous/severe weather, or local, supporting statutes that would justify my cause for grievance(positing that it is unfair that I have my contract suspended/terminated for an absence on a day it was generally acknowledged to be dangerous to commute to school, or anywhere).
I understand this is confusing, as the subject matter itself is a bit confusing, and the extra personal elements, and timeline aren't helpful! Please bare with me, if you've read thus far, I appreciate your curiosity, and concern.. !
posted by thewolfandewe at 6:03 PM on November 20, 2017
"Did you pursue the avenues suggested in your last question about this, and what happened?" - Please expand.
"I'm just realizing I am asking questions that invite a back-and-forth, sorry. I guess my answer is that your question is too confusing to answer. It sounds like there is a lot of backstory that would be relevant." Thank you for clarifying your rhetoric!
There is quite some backstory, it's a bit complex. I will try to be concise, but thorough.
I'm in Oregon. I had been attending a "Private Post Secondary Education Facility" to obtain my tattooist's license(OR is the only state that mandates this sort of structure for a tattooist's license. It is the most bureaucratic process for this licensing, in the country- However, occasionally the work is of higher quality, and the artists are paid better wages. I myself am not entirely enamoured with the tattoo world, however, this environment takes sort of a twist, that makes it more appealing to me-).
I was working on another creative project while enrolled in licensing, and negotiated a lot of flexibility in my schedule with the "school"/licensing facility, and its directors(who were quite willing to work with me). With the approval of the directors, I deliberately put my own level of attendance on ice, in the confidence that I could balance obtaining my license, and working on other creative projects. Essentially I was taking sick days(to the director's approval) to commit to work on other projects, while attending.
This logic may have been entirely well and fine- had that ice storm not occurred!
I am "just pursuing" this now- as initially my contract had been suspended for six months(up to a year, where I was able to return)- then midway, the director decided to terminate it, based on a technicality(the school is now taking students for the rest of the year, then curiously closing- uncertain quite what is happening, there).
I then contacted the local Higher Education Coordinating Commission, for support. Their Specialist suggested I file an internal grievance- and if the grievance cannot be resolved internally, within the school's academic perimeters, the Program Specialist at HECC then recommended filing an external grievance, to HECC itself(uncertain if this is an Oregon-local Board, or if other states have it too, but HECC works closely with the State Board and Department of Edu).
I am now in the process of writing that grievance - which is nearly finished - I am just having difficultly locating student's rights, what a student is to do if suspended for attendance during dangerous/severe weather, or local, supporting statutes that would justify my cause for grievance(positing that it is unfair that I have my contract suspended/terminated for an absence on a day it was generally acknowledged to be dangerous to commute to school, or anywhere).
I understand this is confusing, as the subject matter itself is a bit confusing, and the extra personal elements, and timeline aren't helpful! Please bare with me, if you've read thus far, I appreciate your curiosity, and concern.. !
posted by thewolfandewe at 6:03 PM on November 20, 2017
Response by poster: "I'm just realizing I am asking questions that invite a back-and-forth, sorry. I guess my answer is that your question is too confusing to answer. It sounds like there is a lot of backstory that would be relevant." Saucysault, thank you, this may be what it is shaping up, to be. I am still looking for any other avenues- the licensing is relatively quite spendy, and it would be really beneficial to save any costs(including time)!
posted by thewolfandewe at 6:05 PM on November 20, 2017
posted by thewolfandewe at 6:05 PM on November 20, 2017
If you've already been on probation for attendance, it sounds like this is just the last straw for the school. From what I can glean, it sounds like you've been given a lot of concessions and flexibility, you've still missed attendance or been late, they've put you on probation and then the ice storm hit, you were late and they've had enough. Does this sum it up or am I off?
The issue is probably less that other students were also late, rather than you have a track record of being behind on attendance and this is just another one to add to the pile, even if this time it wasn't your fault.
If this is the case, I would definitively appeal, it's always worth trying but it sounds like the school have attempted to meet you halfway before and once you're late too often, they have to draw a line in the sand somewhere. I wouldn't be aggressive about filing for grievances etc, I would be humble and apologetic. Sorry if I got any of this wrong, the question is tricky to understand.
posted by Jubey at 6:22 PM on November 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
The issue is probably less that other students were also late, rather than you have a track record of being behind on attendance and this is just another one to add to the pile, even if this time it wasn't your fault.
If this is the case, I would definitively appeal, it's always worth trying but it sounds like the school have attempted to meet you halfway before and once you're late too often, they have to draw a line in the sand somewhere. I wouldn't be aggressive about filing for grievances etc, I would be humble and apologetic. Sorry if I got any of this wrong, the question is tricky to understand.
posted by Jubey at 6:22 PM on November 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Other people's attendance has fuck all to do with you. Sorry there was weather but you were already having attendance issues before that...not to mention the 7-10 days after the weather event. You're an adult. Figure out how to be there regularly.
Did you get any kind of written okay from the director about missing so you could work?
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 6:34 PM on November 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Did you get any kind of written okay from the director about missing so you could work?
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 6:34 PM on November 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
This is life advice, not legal advice. Respectfully, it seems that they terminated your contract because they were tired of your many absences and/or drama. I mean really, a "former active volcano"? Is that the type of excuse you're using with the school? If you're a hassle to deal with, AND you're not showing up to class AND the school is concerned about certifying someone whose work is not up to par, then it is no wonder that they declined to continue teaching you. And now it seems like they're trying to get out of the business altogether-- all the more reason to not take you on again. While you can continue the legal route, my best advice is to apologize sincerely and present a plan to fix your previously unacceptable behavior.
posted by acidic at 6:35 PM on November 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by acidic at 6:35 PM on November 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
Like others, I am confused. Did you really miss seven to ten days because you had a car accident, and could not take public transportation, carpool, bike, rent a car, etc, and are trying to frame that as part of an unavoidable circumstance? Or is the mention of seven-to-ten (which is it?) just to underscore the extent of the car issue?
Have you been told anything about all of this hinging on that one icy day? With the history, that seems wildly unlikely.
If I was your supervisor and hearing epic excuses and so little understanding of the need to own this stuff, I would start to assume substance abuse or other serious problems going on behind the scenes. Do you have a doctor you see regularly? Do you have any problems like depression or a sleep disorder that are not under control that would help explain this mess? That is the only thing I can think of that would give me pause and make me consider leniency here, especially if you had a note from your doctor that indicated that there would be a new plan of treatment going forward.
posted by kmennie at 6:47 PM on November 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Have you been told anything about all of this hinging on that one icy day? With the history, that seems wildly unlikely.
If I was your supervisor and hearing epic excuses and so little understanding of the need to own this stuff, I would start to assume substance abuse or other serious problems going on behind the scenes. Do you have a doctor you see regularly? Do you have any problems like depression or a sleep disorder that are not under control that would help explain this mess? That is the only thing I can think of that would give me pause and make me consider leniency here, especially if you had a note from your doctor that indicated that there would be a new plan of treatment going forward.
posted by kmennie at 6:47 PM on November 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
(Also, given how hard this is to follow, I think you might be too emotional and to close to the issue to do a good job with communication with the school. Help from a friend with good writing skills and a support person for in-person dealings might be a good idea -- the latter, maybe not so much, but in your shoes I think I would want to frame this as "had serious personal problems, was in denial, have shored up supports, etc" rather than "WTF man, I had to use cleats that day!")
posted by kmennie at 6:53 PM on November 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by kmennie at 6:53 PM on November 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Mod note: A few comments deleted. OP, AskMe doesn't really do back-and-forth discussion or detailed replies/follow-ups like this. You've asked your question, now you can read other people's answers and mark the ones that are most useful for you.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 6:59 PM on November 20, 2017
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 6:59 PM on November 20, 2017
You've been advised to write a grievance. You're writing that grievance. Given that you have absolutely no information about whether you have technical grounds for a grievance or not, you're going to have to rely on a general appeal to procedural fairness.
You should note that you were placed on probation for attendance issues. You should agree that it would be appropriate to terminate your contract for future attendance issues. But you should then point out what you see as the extenuating circumstances that made this absence a special, one-off matter that is separate and distinct from your past attendance issues.
You should do this much more succinctly than you have in your post above. I'd suggest you do this without referring to falling down, hypothethical broken bones, or volcanoes. "This was an extraordinary weather event that affected a large number of students, and it would be unreasonable to expect me to counter circumstances so many others could not" should be enough.
Enough for that one day, anyway. The next 7-10 days (you're really going to have to be more precise) are going to be a different argument altogether. Was there no public transport?
posted by obiwanwasabi at 7:00 PM on November 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
You should note that you were placed on probation for attendance issues. You should agree that it would be appropriate to terminate your contract for future attendance issues. But you should then point out what you see as the extenuating circumstances that made this absence a special, one-off matter that is separate and distinct from your past attendance issues.
You should do this much more succinctly than you have in your post above. I'd suggest you do this without referring to falling down, hypothethical broken bones, or volcanoes. "This was an extraordinary weather event that affected a large number of students, and it would be unreasonable to expect me to counter circumstances so many others could not" should be enough.
Enough for that one day, anyway. The next 7-10 days (you're really going to have to be more precise) are going to be a different argument altogether. Was there no public transport?
posted by obiwanwasabi at 7:00 PM on November 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
(As a matter of procedural fairness, you should also be entitled to a statement from the decision-maker about why your contract was terminated. This may be helpful in preparing your response, particularly if you feel they've relied on false or irrelevant information, or placed undue weight on matters beyond your control.)
posted by obiwanwasabi at 7:04 PM on November 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by obiwanwasabi at 7:04 PM on November 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
The weather, the school not cancelling, and other people not being there isn't the issue. The issue is that you weren't there. Being late that particular day and then missing another 7-10 days is the issue and that's all on you. Did you miss all other work and life events those ten days? I kinda doubt it.
The only way to fix the issue is to be there. If it wasn't important enough to be there last year and you're not exactly enamored by getting the license then I'm not seeing how you think you're going to make the time for it IF you somehow grovel to get back in now. Let this go.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 7:05 PM on November 20, 2017
The only way to fix the issue is to be there. If it wasn't important enough to be there last year and you're not exactly enamored by getting the license then I'm not seeing how you think you're going to make the time for it IF you somehow grovel to get back in now. Let this go.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 7:05 PM on November 20, 2017
Mod note: Folks, if I'm reading correctly, the 7-10 days mentioned in the post weren't absences, just incidental information about the car. thewolfandewe, please refresh the page, stop commenting in here, and just let people answer.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 7:08 PM on November 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 7:08 PM on November 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
You are looking for magic words to fix a problem that nobody here can fix. You were on probation for attendance issues and you were at least two hours late. The school and board are going to look at your overall attendance and note that you set a precedent of missing enough to be on probation.
I am sorry the weather was bad, truly.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 7:23 PM on November 20, 2017
I am sorry the weather was bad, truly.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 7:23 PM on November 20, 2017
Bluntly, as a Canadian, the weather is not an adequate response. If it was severe enough the school would have cancelled classes. There is the saying "there is no such thing as bad weather, only bad clothes." On bad weather days you leave home hours earlier, take public transit etc. OR, you accumulate enough positive attendance that missing a day won't be held against you. That one day is not held against you. It is the pattern of un-attendance, and perhaps a tendency to take a mile when given an inch, that seems to have been the real issue. So I would drop that specific day as a complaint and focus on how to address the pattern and how perhaps you have learned from it and can complete your studies without the same issues cropping up.
posted by saucysault at 7:35 PM on November 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by saucysault at 7:35 PM on November 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Here are two truths for you:
1. The rules are almost always flexible, to some extent.
I think you know this, because it sounds like you ask for concessions and special treatment a lot. (You say you negotiated attendance lenience and absences to work on other projects, etc).
2. People's patience is finite. Once it is exhausted, they will start to just say "NO".... even to things they might have said "yes" to before.
This is the part that I think you are not understanding. To my eye, your issues are complicated and detailed and long and weird. My guess is that the school is just tired of you and now the answer is no. Let's say the school has a "patience level" of 10 with each student. If you had never had issues before, you would be at a zero, and you'd have 10 whole points to spend on these weather and car problems.
If you were a model student with perfect attendance, this would be no problem.
But it sounds like you are NOT a model student, plus your attendance was already horrible.
So it's like you had already spent about 8/10 of your points on all the other special things you asked for.... and now this extra issue just put you way over the limit. I think they are just tired of the hassle and not really interested in any more.
At this point it might be really hard to save this situation. You've used up at least 9.9 of your 10 points.
Your best bet is to un-complicate what happened, and promise them that it's over and you will be easy from now on.
"I had terrible personal problems last month, compounded by car trouble. My absence was unacceptable and I am really sorry. I want you to know that I have solved those problems now, and I commit to not being late or missing a single day of class for the rest of the term."
From your school principal's position, that is a nice simple uncomplicated explanation that might work, if you can make it happen. If you propose that and they accept it, you need to follow through- and be prepared to be expelled on your first lateness, missed assignment, absence, or other issue, though!
Good luck!
posted by pseudostrabismus at 7:36 PM on November 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
1. The rules are almost always flexible, to some extent.
I think you know this, because it sounds like you ask for concessions and special treatment a lot. (You say you negotiated attendance lenience and absences to work on other projects, etc).
2. People's patience is finite. Once it is exhausted, they will start to just say "NO".... even to things they might have said "yes" to before.
This is the part that I think you are not understanding. To my eye, your issues are complicated and detailed and long and weird. My guess is that the school is just tired of you and now the answer is no. Let's say the school has a "patience level" of 10 with each student. If you had never had issues before, you would be at a zero, and you'd have 10 whole points to spend on these weather and car problems.
If you were a model student with perfect attendance, this would be no problem.
But it sounds like you are NOT a model student, plus your attendance was already horrible.
So it's like you had already spent about 8/10 of your points on all the other special things you asked for.... and now this extra issue just put you way over the limit. I think they are just tired of the hassle and not really interested in any more.
At this point it might be really hard to save this situation. You've used up at least 9.9 of your 10 points.
Your best bet is to un-complicate what happened, and promise them that it's over and you will be easy from now on.
"I had terrible personal problems last month, compounded by car trouble. My absence was unacceptable and I am really sorry. I want you to know that I have solved those problems now, and I commit to not being late or missing a single day of class for the rest of the term."
From your school principal's position, that is a nice simple uncomplicated explanation that might work, if you can make it happen. If you propose that and they accept it, you need to follow through- and be prepared to be expelled on your first lateness, missed assignment, absence, or other issue, though!
Good luck!
posted by pseudostrabismus at 7:36 PM on November 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
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posted by lakeroon at 5:21 PM on November 20, 2017