Not OK, Cupid
September 7, 2015 9:03 PM Subscribe
Lately the same thing has happened to me repeatedly: she and I will plan a date through OKCupid, agreeing on a clear date, time, and location. And then ... she forgets and the date never happens. This has recently happened to me three times in a row, with three different women! In each case, I contacted her earlier on the day of the date just to make sure we were "still on," and she responded along the lines of: "Oh, crap, I forgot, and now I'm out of town."
(Of course, I instantly block her on OKCupid and my phone.)
So here's my question (which you can jump right to answering if you don't want to read the rest of this): Is there anything I could do differently to minimize the chances of experiencing this kind of time-wasting disappointment?
Background info, for anyone who's interested:
The most recent time, we had not only messaged back and forth, but also talked on the phone for over an hour (at her request — she said she wanted to make sure we clicked "in real time" before meeting, and afterwards she said she'd "love" to get together). All three dates were going to be pretty standard — getting drinks in NYC. Note: none of them said they were unclear on whether we had made definite plans.
I'm a 34-year-old straight man who's had an OKCupid account for almost a decade (not always active), have gotten a generally positive response from it, have gone on a lot of dates from the site, and have been in relationships that started on OKCupid. So I know it can work — I'm not someone who's questioning whether online dating is for me, or whether my whole profile or approach to messaging is way off.
My profile is pretty long and detailed, and I've answered the multiple-choice questions with scrupulous honesty, to try to filter out people I won't be compatible with. I always read through her profile and her answers to the multiple-choice questions thoroughly before contacting her, and I won't contact her if I notice anything that suggests we're probably incompatible. I avoid setting up a date if we have a low match percentage.
Not that this necessarily matters, but since I anticipate that some might be wondering: My profile says I'm only interested in "long-term dating"; I'm not on the site to look for casual sex; and I don't message anyone who doesn't seem like she's potentially interested in a relationship.
In short, I feel like I'm doing pretty much everything right. I'm not looking for broader advice about how to do a good job at online dating (I know there have been plenty of AskMe threads about that in the past) — I'm just focused on this one problem.
Maybe it's just coincidence that this has happened three times in a row. But this seems so unusual that I can't help but wonder if there's any way around it.
I've added a note in my profile admitting that this has been happening a lot, and basically saying: please don't message me if you would do that kind of thing. But I'll probably delete that soon, since I try to avoid being negative in the profile.
I have a feeling someone is going to suggest this, so just to preempt it: No, I don't think women are Googling me after we schedule the date and finding out something horrible about me. There's nothing horrible to find out, and anyway, I've recently Googled my full name, gone through several pages of search results, and not found anything problematic. It's possible someone could find my blog and decide their political views or other view are too different from mine — I'd be fine with someone letting me know that upfront — but I don't think that's what's happening.
(Of course, I instantly block her on OKCupid and my phone.)
So here's my question (which you can jump right to answering if you don't want to read the rest of this): Is there anything I could do differently to minimize the chances of experiencing this kind of time-wasting disappointment?
Background info, for anyone who's interested:
The most recent time, we had not only messaged back and forth, but also talked on the phone for over an hour (at her request — she said she wanted to make sure we clicked "in real time" before meeting, and afterwards she said she'd "love" to get together). All three dates were going to be pretty standard — getting drinks in NYC. Note: none of them said they were unclear on whether we had made definite plans.
I'm a 34-year-old straight man who's had an OKCupid account for almost a decade (not always active), have gotten a generally positive response from it, have gone on a lot of dates from the site, and have been in relationships that started on OKCupid. So I know it can work — I'm not someone who's questioning whether online dating is for me, or whether my whole profile or approach to messaging is way off.
My profile is pretty long and detailed, and I've answered the multiple-choice questions with scrupulous honesty, to try to filter out people I won't be compatible with. I always read through her profile and her answers to the multiple-choice questions thoroughly before contacting her, and I won't contact her if I notice anything that suggests we're probably incompatible. I avoid setting up a date if we have a low match percentage.
Not that this necessarily matters, but since I anticipate that some might be wondering: My profile says I'm only interested in "long-term dating"; I'm not on the site to look for casual sex; and I don't message anyone who doesn't seem like she's potentially interested in a relationship.
In short, I feel like I'm doing pretty much everything right. I'm not looking for broader advice about how to do a good job at online dating (I know there have been plenty of AskMe threads about that in the past) — I'm just focused on this one problem.
Maybe it's just coincidence that this has happened three times in a row. But this seems so unusual that I can't help but wonder if there's any way around it.
I've added a note in my profile admitting that this has been happening a lot, and basically saying: please don't message me if you would do that kind of thing. But I'll probably delete that soon, since I try to avoid being negative in the profile.
I have a feeling someone is going to suggest this, so just to preempt it: No, I don't think women are Googling me after we schedule the date and finding out something horrible about me. There's nothing horrible to find out, and anyway, I've recently Googled my full name, gone through several pages of search results, and not found anything problematic. It's possible someone could find my blog and decide their political views or other view are too different from mine — I'd be fine with someone letting me know that upfront — but I don't think that's what's happening.
This post was deleted for the following reason: This isn't working out. OP maybe you can rephrase the question to post later. -- taz
You make it sound like you're planning dates way in the future. Today/tomorrow, mayyyybe "this coming Saturday" is about the farthest I'd do, and I'd make sure it was still on the day before and day of.
But it seems you've done that, so, don't know what else to tell you. Coincidental string of bad luck, probably. I haven't noticed that it's a OKC 'thing'.
posted by ctmf at 9:21 PM on September 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
But it seems you've done that, so, don't know what else to tell you. Coincidental string of bad luck, probably. I haven't noticed that it's a OKC 'thing'.
posted by ctmf at 9:21 PM on September 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
It may simply be a run of bad luck, but I wonder what kind of time frames you're dealing with here and what interim communication you're engaging in? I know you mentioned a long phone call with one of them, but what happened after the phone call and before the date?
In my experience on OKCupid, most people keep chatting, by text or email or on OKCupid between the time when the date is set and the time that the date takes place. If that's more than about 24 hours, it could be that they're either losing interest or believe you have lost interest.
posted by jacquilynne at 9:21 PM on September 7, 2015
In my experience on OKCupid, most people keep chatting, by text or email or on OKCupid between the time when the date is set and the time that the date takes place. If that's more than about 24 hours, it could be that they're either losing interest or believe you have lost interest.
posted by jacquilynne at 9:21 PM on September 7, 2015
Response by poster: You make it sound like you're planning dates way in the future.
The most recent one, we planned 7 days in advance. I don't know if I want to date someone who can't handle making a plan 7 days in advance. That's just so far off from how I would do things. If I make a plan, I naturally write it down in my calendar so that I know what day I need to do it, just like I'd do with a haircut or dentist appointment.
posted by John Cohen at 9:36 PM on September 7, 2015
The most recent one, we planned 7 days in advance. I don't know if I want to date someone who can't handle making a plan 7 days in advance. That's just so far off from how I would do things. If I make a plan, I naturally write it down in my calendar so that I know what day I need to do it, just like I'd do with a haircut or dentist appointment.
posted by John Cohen at 9:36 PM on September 7, 2015
If someone messes up to the point of forgetting they had a date, they should be offering to reschedule to show that they are still interested. If they aren't apologetic enough to take the lead in suggesting a different time to meet up instead, I'd be inclined to think that they didn't actually forget, or they're really apathetic about meeting up.
posted by needs more cowbell at 9:39 PM on September 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by needs more cowbell at 9:39 PM on September 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
It's not personal; it's overwhelm.
For a woman in your target age range with reasonably attractive pictures, OKCupid is a horrendously hectic place. Never mind the onslaught of "sup!," "nice pics," etc.; the flood
of sincere, polite, and attentive messages is a recipe for burnout. That woman you spoke with for an hour? She probably enjoyed it and sincerely intended to meet you, but simply cannot. Keep. Up.
So, some women opt out of most searches by skewing their age to the highest available year of birth. Some don't post pictures, or just pixelated ones. Some women post pictures that show the outline of their body, but have a stunned cat filling most of the frame. These women tend to take a more active approach in making first contact.
Is there anything I could do differently to minimize the chances of experiencing this kind of time-wasting disappointment?
- If you get seemingly aged and/or faceless visitors to your profile, take the time to look at what they've written.
- Do your own searches among the 99-plus crowd.
- Many faceless women offer pictures prior to meeting. A few don't, for reasons that may or may not be compatible with your approach to dating, but don't mean those women are necessarily unattractive. So, if you receive messages from pictureless profiles, consider risking whatever time you'd "lose" by answering politely instead of immediately insisting that photos precede communication.
On preview: absolutely, early scheduling is a compatibility filter. I'll spare you the anecdata.
On second preview: OKC Overwhelm® can make the most conscientious and considerate woman behave toward online-dudes-she-hasn't-met in ways she would never treat IRL acquaintances. Maybe it is helpful to consider what these women are going through and how they feel, rather than positioning yourself as yet another chore.
posted by wonton endangerment at 10:01 PM on September 7, 2015 [6 favorites]
For a woman in your target age range with reasonably attractive pictures, OKCupid is a horrendously hectic place. Never mind the onslaught of "sup!," "nice pics," etc.; the flood
of sincere, polite, and attentive messages is a recipe for burnout. That woman you spoke with for an hour? She probably enjoyed it and sincerely intended to meet you, but simply cannot. Keep. Up.
So, some women opt out of most searches by skewing their age to the highest available year of birth. Some don't post pictures, or just pixelated ones. Some women post pictures that show the outline of their body, but have a stunned cat filling most of the frame. These women tend to take a more active approach in making first contact.
Is there anything I could do differently to minimize the chances of experiencing this kind of time-wasting disappointment?
- If you get seemingly aged and/or faceless visitors to your profile, take the time to look at what they've written.
- Do your own searches among the 99-plus crowd.
- Many faceless women offer pictures prior to meeting. A few don't, for reasons that may or may not be compatible with your approach to dating, but don't mean those women are necessarily unattractive. So, if you receive messages from pictureless profiles, consider risking whatever time you'd "lose" by answering politely instead of immediately insisting that photos precede communication.
On preview: absolutely, early scheduling is a compatibility filter. I'll spare you the anecdata.
On second preview: OKC Overwhelm® can make the most conscientious and considerate woman behave toward online-dudes-she-hasn't-met in ways she would never treat IRL acquaintances. Maybe it is helpful to consider what these women are going through and how they feel, rather than positioning yourself as yet another chore.
posted by wonton endangerment at 10:01 PM on September 7, 2015 [6 favorites]
Well, here it goes: I skimmed your blog and your OKC profile, and both look fine so I don't think they're the issue at all. Perhaps this situation is just a fluke, and it's just something to move on from. However, since you had asked for feedback, here's my bit: in terms of OKCupid, seven days ahead is an infinity unless one of you is out of town the whole time, etc. I'm super busy, so I know there are times in people's lives where it's fully legit. However, in a place like NYC, people are super busy but they also have tons of options. (This is both good and bad, as you know.) Meeting up less than 24 hours can feel way too rushed, too, unless both parties are really, really clicking but just a few days could be ideal.
Are you initiating these first dates or are the women? If these women were very interested in you from the start, they would have been maintaining the contact more so that you wouldn't have even needed to ask "still on," you know? For some people, that anticipation is fun and awesome. However, they may well be losing interest or moving on during those seven days if they're really active on the site, busy with other stuff and not 100% from the start, etc. I think it's totally OK to only want to date women who are willing to set up the date a week in advance; however, the distance between set-up and date may mean a few people lose interest. (However, it sounds like you're not really interested in people with such an attitude anyway, so you're essentially saving yourself the time and money, if not the disappointment.)
Also, something to consider: I think it's great that you know what type of relationship you're looking for and determined to be true to yourself. However, there's a catch in that both parties -- you and the woman -- are probably more likely to jettison something that doesn't seem 100% great. A woman open to short-term and long-term dating might be actually be more open to seeing if things develop between you two rather than making snap dating judgements like I'm sensing from the others.
And, if I may: I'd really consider reconsidering what Crystalinne wrote because, while it may not be exactly what you're looking for, it could offer insight into where these women are coming from. Based on what you wrote and replied here alone as well as other MetaFilter posts, I can tell that you're very firm in your beliefs and see a lot of things in black and white. I sense you're more focused on ethics and facts rather than feelings and hunches; this is totally legit but, again, tends to be something that polarizes people. I find it a little off-putting but that doesn't matter. It's just a difference, which leads me back to this: it may be disappointing now that you're finding things aren't working out. In fact, that really sucks and is rude of these dates! (But nothing personal, more par for the course.) However, if it means less time wasted on bad matches and ultimately leads you to the serious relationship you really want, isn't that a good thing?
posted by smorgasbord at 10:05 PM on September 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
Are you initiating these first dates or are the women? If these women were very interested in you from the start, they would have been maintaining the contact more so that you wouldn't have even needed to ask "still on," you know? For some people, that anticipation is fun and awesome. However, they may well be losing interest or moving on during those seven days if they're really active on the site, busy with other stuff and not 100% from the start, etc. I think it's totally OK to only want to date women who are willing to set up the date a week in advance; however, the distance between set-up and date may mean a few people lose interest. (However, it sounds like you're not really interested in people with such an attitude anyway, so you're essentially saving yourself the time and money, if not the disappointment.)
Also, something to consider: I think it's great that you know what type of relationship you're looking for and determined to be true to yourself. However, there's a catch in that both parties -- you and the woman -- are probably more likely to jettison something that doesn't seem 100% great. A woman open to short-term and long-term dating might be actually be more open to seeing if things develop between you two rather than making snap dating judgements like I'm sensing from the others.
And, if I may: I'd really consider reconsidering what Crystalinne wrote because, while it may not be exactly what you're looking for, it could offer insight into where these women are coming from. Based on what you wrote and replied here alone as well as other MetaFilter posts, I can tell that you're very firm in your beliefs and see a lot of things in black and white. I sense you're more focused on ethics and facts rather than feelings and hunches; this is totally legit but, again, tends to be something that polarizes people. I find it a little off-putting but that doesn't matter. It's just a difference, which leads me back to this: it may be disappointing now that you're finding things aren't working out. In fact, that really sucks and is rude of these dates! (But nothing personal, more par for the course.) However, if it means less time wasted on bad matches and ultimately leads you to the serious relationship you really want, isn't that a good thing?
posted by smorgasbord at 10:05 PM on September 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
I operate in life as you do, where I follow through on plans that I make and expect others to do so. I would find this situation immensely frustrating and I am frustrated just reading about it. But I think it's a little vindictive to immediately block them from all forms of communication.
I would like to know the exact phrasing before I submitted exact phrasing of my own, but if the message from her is exactly:
"Oh, crap, I forgot, and now I'm out of town."
...I might reply "Too bad! Unfortunately, I generally have a busy schedule and I need someone who can almost always follow through on dates when they are planned, so I don't think we're a match. Good luck!"
Somehow it is the case that many, many mid-twenties to mid-thirties Americans in 2015 feel empowered to break social commitments for any or no reason. I don't like it any more than you do, but I think that you and I will do better if we recognize that we are out of step with the norm. I think you should explain yourself with a certain apologetic kindness as though it is a special-snowflake need for you that people do what they goddamned say they are going to do, because, against all odds, it *is* such a special snowflake need. Argh.
posted by Kwine at 10:09 PM on September 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
I would like to know the exact phrasing before I submitted exact phrasing of my own, but if the message from her is exactly:
"Oh, crap, I forgot, and now I'm out of town."
...I might reply "Too bad! Unfortunately, I generally have a busy schedule and I need someone who can almost always follow through on dates when they are planned, so I don't think we're a match. Good luck!"
Somehow it is the case that many, many mid-twenties to mid-thirties Americans in 2015 feel empowered to break social commitments for any or no reason. I don't like it any more than you do, but I think that you and I will do better if we recognize that we are out of step with the norm. I think you should explain yourself with a certain apologetic kindness as though it is a special-snowflake need for you that people do what they goddamned say they are going to do, because, against all odds, it *is* such a special snowflake need. Argh.
posted by Kwine at 10:09 PM on September 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
It kind of sucks, but I've sorta done the same thing to women I've had dates planned with, although more forthrightly than your dates did, by telling them I wasn't feeling well or that something had come up, but at least a day in advance and never on the day of, unless I had been suddenly stricken by a horrendous, rampaging illness. In those cases that I hadn't, in fact, been stricken, I canceled because I had been having second thoughts — I thought about it and I realized that I wasn't as into them or wasn't as interested in meeting up with them as I was when we set things up. I always felt bad about it, but I think I made the right call pretty much every time, and saved her and me quite a bit of time. Looking back on my OKC experiences, I think the more engaged we were (i.e., the more messages we sent, the more we wrote in these messages, etc.), the higher the odds were that we'd make the arranged-upon time work, since it's harder to not meet up at that point rather than the other way around. However, that doesn't necessarily mean that the odds that you two click are also higher — no matter how you slice it, it's a crapshoot.
In any case, it's likely got nothing to do with you — chalk it up to random chance and be glad that you dodged these flaky bullets. There's no excuse for leaving things unsettled til the day of, then completely bailing. Anyhow, I haven't anybody stand me up yet in a year or so of online dating, but it's just a matter of time before my number comes up.
posted by un petit cadeau at 10:10 PM on September 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
In any case, it's likely got nothing to do with you — chalk it up to random chance and be glad that you dodged these flaky bullets. There's no excuse for leaving things unsettled til the day of, then completely bailing. Anyhow, I haven't anybody stand me up yet in a year or so of online dating, but it's just a matter of time before my number comes up.
posted by un petit cadeau at 10:10 PM on September 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
I guess the "Oops, I'm out of town!" excuse is the female equivalent to the "I'm sorry I can't meet! I just got into a car accident."
I received that excuse from FOUR DIFFERENT MEN while I was on OKCupid.
Unfortunately, it may just be a necessary evil of online dating. People flake on things they don't want to do. It's a risk. Like when you're going on job interviews and they've already given the job to someone else, etc.
posted by Piedmont_Americana at 10:18 PM on September 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
I received that excuse from FOUR DIFFERENT MEN while I was on OKCupid.
Unfortunately, it may just be a necessary evil of online dating. People flake on things they don't want to do. It's a risk. Like when you're going on job interviews and they've already given the job to someone else, etc.
posted by Piedmont_Americana at 10:18 PM on September 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
OK, here's a straight answer for you: prominently link this post in your OKCupid profile. It is very likely this will result in fewer people setting up dates with you and then canceling at the last minute.
posted by ryanrs at 10:21 PM on September 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by ryanrs at 10:21 PM on September 7, 2015 [2 favorites]
I don't know much about OKC, but it sounds to me like you are giving them an out by confirming. There is no way to know, but I suspect if you did not confirm day of, that they may not cancel. I do not buy the out of town line. On the one hand I would rather be stood up in advance than waiting at a place for an hour with no contact, but on the other hand, try a few times to not confirm, just show up.
posted by AugustWest at 10:21 PM on September 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by AugustWest at 10:21 PM on September 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
Mod note: A few comments deleted. Quick note: I know we generally look at dating/OKC questions sort of holistically and offer general advice around questions to try to help people be more successful, but let's focus on the basic question of what the poster can do to try to avoid the situation described. OP, not every answer will be exactly what you want; it's okay to just relax and answer direct questions and pick and choose what's helpful for you.
posted by taz (staff) at 10:25 PM on September 7, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by taz (staff) at 10:25 PM on September 7, 2015 [1 favorite]
I missed the key bit that you're getting cancelled on when you contact them to confirm. Yes, I'd opt out at that point as well. Confirming a low-stakes first meeting would come across to me as way too high-maintenance, negative-anxious and paranoid-distrustful to be compatible with me. And I'm someone who plans in advance and sticks to it! I'd rather be labeled a flake than spend 20 minutes with someone who comes across as waaaaaay over invested.
Also, there's a lot of wit in your profile that can be interpreted as negative/critical. I used to give the benefit of the doubt; it's not easy to convey personality in a profile. But people with intense-sounding profiles were on probation of sorts. Anything that came down on the side of more potential negativity was enough to cancel, or end the meeting very early. (Eleven minutes was my record.) Contacting them to confirm sounds like it could be the final straw when you were on thin ice anyway. Mixed metaphors FTW.
posted by wonton endangerment at 10:41 PM on September 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
Also, there's a lot of wit in your profile that can be interpreted as negative/critical. I used to give the benefit of the doubt; it's not easy to convey personality in a profile. But people with intense-sounding profiles were on probation of sorts. Anything that came down on the side of more potential negativity was enough to cancel, or end the meeting very early. (Eleven minutes was my record.) Contacting them to confirm sounds like it could be the final straw when you were on thin ice anyway. Mixed metaphors FTW.
posted by wonton endangerment at 10:41 PM on September 7, 2015 [3 favorites]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Hermione Granger at 9:15 PM on September 7, 2015 [1 favorite]