Getting referred to a credit agency by a scetchy company
August 18, 2015 11:19 AM Subscribe
I have some questions about an online payment company and their ability to sick a collection agency on me.
Earlier this year I joined what seemed to be an ethical adult site (ersties.com) and paid through an online payment company (clickandbuy.com). It appears I joined for three months. When I logged into the site it was buggy and the videos didn't load and I stopped using it.
3 months later after forgetting about this, a charge appeared on my credit card to "clickandbuy.com" for something in german (something like gmbhshmoo or thereabouts). I didn't recall the name of the company or have any reason to know why they were charging me, so I had the credit card company cancel the charge.
Ersties.com contacted me later telling me that I had done a chargeback and I needed to pay them "avoid unnecessary extra costs". I responded telling them that I had not authorized a charge.
Clickandbuy.com later contacted me and told me that I owed them $45. I told them that I had not authorized the charge and had no intention of paying them.
Clickandbuy.com is now sending me emails saying that they have closed my account and if I don't transfer $45 to them by 8/20 they will be referring the bill to a collection agency.
As far as I'm concerned I don't owe anyone any money. But I'm concerned about the collection agency part. I'm just wondering what that would mean, if that's a legitimate threat and if it could affect my (otherwise stunningly good) credit.
.
Very confused by the situation. I'd appreciate any knowledge about something like this.
If it were to affect my credit, I'd just pay it, but doing a bank transfer seems extremely sketchy.
Thanks
Earlier this year I joined what seemed to be an ethical adult site (ersties.com) and paid through an online payment company (clickandbuy.com). It appears I joined for three months. When I logged into the site it was buggy and the videos didn't load and I stopped using it.
3 months later after forgetting about this, a charge appeared on my credit card to "clickandbuy.com" for something in german (something like gmbhshmoo or thereabouts). I didn't recall the name of the company or have any reason to know why they were charging me, so I had the credit card company cancel the charge.
Ersties.com contacted me later telling me that I had done a chargeback and I needed to pay them "avoid unnecessary extra costs". I responded telling them that I had not authorized a charge.
Clickandbuy.com later contacted me and told me that I owed them $45. I told them that I had not authorized the charge and had no intention of paying them.
Clickandbuy.com is now sending me emails saying that they have closed my account and if I don't transfer $45 to them by 8/20 they will be referring the bill to a collection agency.
As far as I'm concerned I don't owe anyone any money. But I'm concerned about the collection agency part. I'm just wondering what that would mean, if that's a legitimate threat and if it could affect my (otherwise stunningly good) credit.
.
Very confused by the situation. I'd appreciate any knowledge about something like this.
If it were to affect my credit, I'd just pay it, but doing a bank transfer seems extremely sketchy.
Thanks
Best answer: If I understand correctly: you signed up for a three-month subscription that costs $45.
You did not find it suitable. At this point, you did nothing.
When you were billed $45, you initiated a chargeback and claimed you "had not authorized the charge."
I don't understand if you had paid $45 and were being charged a second $45, or if this is all just the one $45?
If it is just the one $45, the onus was on you to sort out the problems you had with the site when you had them, not just claim to your bank later on that you "had not authorized the charge." If you did pay $45 but there was fine print about automatic renewals, well... It sounds more like a lesson learned than a sketchy company, but a lot of details are missing here.
posted by kmennie at 11:33 AM on August 18, 2015
You did not find it suitable. At this point, you did nothing.
When you were billed $45, you initiated a chargeback and claimed you "had not authorized the charge."
I don't understand if you had paid $45 and were being charged a second $45, or if this is all just the one $45?
If it is just the one $45, the onus was on you to sort out the problems you had with the site when you had them, not just claim to your bank later on that you "had not authorized the charge." If you did pay $45 but there was fine print about automatic renewals, well... It sounds more like a lesson learned than a sketchy company, but a lot of details are missing here.
posted by kmennie at 11:33 AM on August 18, 2015
Best answer: I'm confused. Did you pay for the initial three months as agreed or not? If so, fuck 'em. When it does eventually go to collections, send the debt collector a letter disputing the validity of the debt. If they put it on your report before sending the necessary documentation, you can sue them for a wilful violation of the FDCPA.
In the meantime, you can dispute the validity of the entry on your credit report with the CRAs and it will be removed during their investigation.
If you do actually owe them, just pay as agreed unless there is some reason why you should not. (Forgetting you had signed up doesn't really count)
posted by wierdo at 11:36 AM on August 18, 2015
In the meantime, you can dispute the validity of the entry on your credit report with the CRAs and it will be removed during their investigation.
If you do actually owe them, just pay as agreed unless there is some reason why you should not. (Forgetting you had signed up doesn't really count)
posted by wierdo at 11:36 AM on August 18, 2015
Best answer: Pay them. If you didn't like the site, you should have canceled right away. It would be very weird for a site like this to charge you $45 for three months without also specifying that the subscription would be renewed unless pro-actively cancelled. Failing to cancel is on you, not them. As you have told your story, this business is within their rights to refer you to a credit agency for non-payment.
I am a lazy, disorganized person. In a few months I will probably owe Sirius XM some amount of money because I failed to cancel after my original trial period. I am the reason "Free X month trial, cancel any time!" promotions make money. Apparently, you are too!
Pay them, cancel your membership, move on.
posted by kythuen at 11:38 AM on August 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
I am a lazy, disorganized person. In a few months I will probably owe Sirius XM some amount of money because I failed to cancel after my original trial period. I am the reason "Free X month trial, cancel any time!" promotions make money. Apparently, you are too!
Pay them, cancel your membership, move on.
posted by kythuen at 11:38 AM on August 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Sorry I wasn't more clear. I did pay them for the initial 3 months. I have no recollection of authorizing an automatic renewal and that's something I generally look for.
I'm protesting being charged again for $45. I never got any notice that they were charging me or renewing my account.
I will probably pay it to be done with it but the bank transfer part seems super sketchy.
posted by mockpuppet at 11:41 AM on August 18, 2015
I'm protesting being charged again for $45. I never got any notice that they were charging me or renewing my account.
I will probably pay it to be done with it but the bank transfer part seems super sketchy.
posted by mockpuppet at 11:41 AM on August 18, 2015
Best answer: Did you officially cancel the service?
If you signed up and gave them your card number, then you authorized the charges.
If you failed to formerly cancel the account during a trial period, then you authorized the charges.
Did they dispute the chargeback with your credit card company? Can you get that documentation from your credit card company?
If they did not successfully dispute the charges with your credit card company, then they don't get to keep coming after you for the money. You, however, will have to submit your documentation from your credit card company each and every time this pops up on your credit report.
Ditto, you will have to write a demand letter each and every time a collection agency contacts you about this debt asking them to prove you owe the debt. Then you will have to provide the documentation from your credit card company if the collection agency persists.
There's more, but that's the gist of it. I'm not trying to make this complicated.
posted by jbenben at 11:45 AM on August 18, 2015
If you signed up and gave them your card number, then you authorized the charges.
If you failed to formerly cancel the account during a trial period, then you authorized the charges.
Did they dispute the chargeback with your credit card company? Can you get that documentation from your credit card company?
If they did not successfully dispute the charges with your credit card company, then they don't get to keep coming after you for the money. You, however, will have to submit your documentation from your credit card company each and every time this pops up on your credit report.
Ditto, you will have to write a demand letter each and every time a collection agency contacts you about this debt asking them to prove you owe the debt. Then you will have to provide the documentation from your credit card company if the collection agency persists.
There's more, but that's the gist of it. I'm not trying to make this complicated.
posted by jbenben at 11:45 AM on August 18, 2015
I would not pay via bank transfer. I would not pay at all if the chargeback via my credit company was successful since THAT WAS THEIR CHANCE TO PROVE THEY ARE LEGALLY OWED THE MONEY.
This is the second time this month someone has posted on AskMe a question about a sketchy debt collection attempt AFTER a chargeback was completed. Must be a new scam.
Nope. Don't pay it.
posted by jbenben at 12:31 PM on August 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
This is the second time this month someone has posted on AskMe a question about a sketchy debt collection attempt AFTER a chargeback was completed. Must be a new scam.
Nope. Don't pay it.
posted by jbenben at 12:31 PM on August 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Yes I find it very sketchy. They seem to have a bad rep. I just don't know what the threat of "referring me to a credit agency" really entails. Can anyone refer anyone to a credit agency? I didn't authorize this repeat charge, had no notice of the charge renewal, and as far as I'm aware never authorized it in the first place.
posted by mockpuppet at 12:47 PM on August 18, 2015
posted by mockpuppet at 12:47 PM on August 18, 2015
if they don't have your SSN (or equivalent) the debt cannot appear on your credit report. Yes, they can refer you to a collection agency but this cannot haunt you in future credit applications,unless they sue you and get a court judgment against you.
posted by jayder at 1:11 PM on August 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by jayder at 1:11 PM on August 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
I'd call up your credit card issuer who processed your chargeback and let them know that this merchant is pressuring you to repay. The reason they want a bank transfer is that there's no way to reverse that charge. In short, they almost certainly know they're up a creek without a paddle, and they're trying to scare you into paying them.
posted by Aleyn at 3:03 PM on August 18, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by Aleyn at 3:03 PM on August 18, 2015 [4 favorites]
There could be a sneaky auto-renewal clause hidden in the Terms and Conditions or the check-out process.
- Is it possible to review the Terms and Conditions?
- Also, you could try to go through the subscription process with a dummy card number/address and look for fine print anywhere on the screen.
posted by cynical pinnacle at 5:30 PM on August 18, 2015
- Is it possible to review the Terms and Conditions?
- Also, you could try to go through the subscription process with a dummy card number/address and look for fine print anywhere on the screen.
posted by cynical pinnacle at 5:30 PM on August 18, 2015
I went and had a look - there's nothing on the signup page indicating that the charge is recurring and nothing in the terms and conditions about it. There may have been something after that point
posted by missmagenta at 8:09 AM on August 19, 2015
posted by missmagenta at 8:09 AM on August 19, 2015
Here's their terms of service, but it's in German except for a bit at the end in English
https://en.ersties.com/international_join
posted by QuakerMel at 6:35 PM on August 19, 2015
https://en.ersties.com/international_join
posted by QuakerMel at 6:35 PM on August 19, 2015
FWIW, jayder is incorrect about your SSN being necessary to ding your credit report is incorrect. The CRAs actually match based on name and address, so if they have your real name and an address that appears on your credit report, they can report.
Given how often people with similar name/address combinations end up with each other's accounts merged into their respective reports, I'd be surprised if the SSN is used at all.
posted by wierdo at 5:22 PM on August 20, 2015
Given how often people with similar name/address combinations end up with each other's accounts merged into their respective reports, I'd be surprised if the SSN is used at all.
posted by wierdo at 5:22 PM on August 20, 2015
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Oyéah at 11:26 AM on August 18, 2015