Creepy to sleep with employer/employee if both sides are consenting?
June 3, 2015 6:39 AM   Subscribe

BF thinks it is, while I think otherwise. Supporting literature regarding this issue would be appreciated.

A mutual friend of my boyfriend and I recently disclosed to us that he is sleeping with his cleaner. Later, my boyfriend mentioned that he thinks it's creepy that our friend is having sexual relations with someone he is employing. I was taken quite by surprise because I personally don't think the same way, as both parties are consenting and single, and it's not like our friend sought the cleaner out to sleep with her (friend made that pretty clear and he's not the sort anyway) - it just sorta happened. She wanted to as much as he did. Boyfriend thinks even if both parties are consensual, there is an 'unequal dynamics of power' between employee/employer that makes the whole situation unprofessional, inappropriate and creepy. If they are attracted to each other and wanted to pursue something more, they should have ceased their professional relationship. I said that there shouldn't be a power imbalance because they are both almost the same age, and she has as much autonomy as he does - and to suggest otherwise is almost unfeminist. BF said that's not what he was suggesting at all, but is focused more on the initial agreed upon relationship that the two have. We talked about it a lot more, but that's pretty much the gist of it. In the end, we just agreed to disagree.

However, that discussion has got me thinking... that maybe it is creepy to have sex with your employee/employer, no matter if both are willing. I mean, I agree wholeheartedly that it is unprofessional, even inappropriate... but creepy? That sounds like there are predatory undertones to it, which is definitely not the case here.

So I need some views on this from AskMefi, coz you guys are really good about these sort of things. Given the situation described above... creepy to sleep with your cleaner, or no? Please don't just say 'yes' or 'no' but provide with supporting explanation because I would really like to understand this.

Please note that I'm not looking to be able to say who's right or wrong in this discussion with my BF, maybe we are both right/wrong. I just want some honest ideas surrounding this (whether coming from a feminist perspective or not) so we are both more informed about these things. Thus, it'd be awesome if I can get some articles, blogs, or videos etc. that can help enlighten the both of us.

Thank you in advance.
posted by milque to Human Relations (11 answers total)

This post was deleted for the following reason: As posted this is a bit too much on the chatfilter side of things. Given the context folks are likely to just offer their opinion anyway I feel, and frankly it's going to be hell just keeping this thread from turning into one big debate. If you want to rework this I'd focus more heavily on the articles etc. so what you're looking for is clear and specific and people will be less likely to interpret the question as simply asking for opinions. -- goodnewsfortheinsane

 
I think it is a highly uncomfortable situation for me to think about, because not only is this person his cleaner's boss, but it's a direct employer/employee relationship (unlike, say, your boss in a large company). So the dynamic could easily become one where, if the sexual relationship ends, the financial situation might be affected, which puts terrible pressure on the one who is employed.

I personally would not feel right about sleeping with someone in my direct employ.
posted by xingcat at 6:46 AM on June 3, 2015


the person you're fucking should never be in the position to fire you. i say this as someone who slept with a couple of my bosses when i was younger. there is a power imbalance before clothes ever come off. it doesn't matter who approached who. on the gender issue it's also sort of weird and icky feeling that he's paying for what is commonly seen as "women's work" and then adding sex to the mix. i'd find it creepy and predatory no matter what the genders, but a male boss sleeping with his female maid? that is ooky.

and not in this situation, but in office situations, it is unfair to the other employees. a boss sleeping with an employee creates a hostile work environment for the other people.
posted by nadawi at 6:48 AM on June 3, 2015 [1 favorite]


Echoing xingcat (and nadawi).

There's a reason why this sort of thing is anathema in nearly all workplaces. The employer/employee relationship is just writ smaller here in this case.
posted by jquinby at 6:49 AM on June 3, 2015 [1 favorite]


However, that discussion has got me thinking... that maybe it is creepy to have sex with your employee/employer, no matter if both are willing.

For me, what makes it creepy is that there is no way to 100% ascertain whether the employee is genuinely willing, or whether they'd prefer not to do it but need the job.
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 6:49 AM on June 3, 2015 [3 favorites]


I'm of the mind that you can't take the sexual consent of someone whose livelihood depends on you at face value unless it's explicitly sex work.
posted by almostmanda at 6:51 AM on June 3, 2015 [3 favorites]


The problem with an employer/employee sexual relationship is that the power dynamic is such that even if the employee says they're consenting...how can you trust that that's so? Even only subconsciously they may be feeling like they kinda have to say they consent, because "what happens if I say I don't want this, that'd be weird, right?"
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:52 AM on June 3, 2015 [1 favorite]


She's an adult. Unless he told her that she had to sleep with him or she would be fired, then it's not the end of the world. Better than him firing her in order to sleep with her. Yes, they should have found sex elsewhere but they didn't. The right thing to do now is to encourage your boyfriend to get his friend to create a severance package of at least 3 months wages for when things go bad.
posted by myselfasme at 6:52 AM on June 3, 2015


I don't think it's unfeminist to say she has less power. It's not that she has less power because she's a woman, it's that she has less power because presumably this income is important to her and he controls it. She needs the income he provides more than he needs his house cleaned. And even if they each needed equally, it's easier for him to replace a cleaner than for her to replace a client/employer.

Also, one does not be a feminist by simply declaring/believing that a woman has the same amount of power as a man. In fact, most forms of feminism are precisely about examining/acknowledgding/dealing with/ and ending the various forms of inequality. But just saying "it's not so" doesn't end it.

Yeah, probably creepy, though if they both really are all gung-ho about this, it's unclear what the solution is for making it happen without creepiness. Presumably SHE would start seeking out another client for those days and quit working for him and once she found one they could carry on with their relationship.
posted by If only I had a penguin... at 6:53 AM on June 3, 2015 [4 favorites]


This is pretty much chatfilter, since creepy is in the eye of the beholder.

That said, my personal opinion is it can range from very slightly creepy/awkward to very creepy, depending on a host of factors, many of which are mentioned above. There would always be a soupcon of creep, but under certain conditions a negligable one.

Also there is a Seinfeld episode about this.
posted by pseudonick at 6:53 AM on June 3, 2015


Unless he told her that Unless she thinks it might be that she had to sleep with him or she would be fired, then it's not the end of the world.>

And how would one rule it out? How could he ever rule it out?
posted by If only I had a penguin... at 6:55 AM on June 3, 2015


Why do you think it's unfeminist to suggest that there are more constraints on her autonomy in this situation than on his? I would think that, in any situation where A's financial security depends on what B chooses to do -- and not vice versa -- A's autonomy in the relationship is limited in a way that B's isn't. This has nothing at all to do with gender. I would say the same if the employer were a woman or if the employee were a man. I would add that her being his cleaner adds an extra dimension of boundary-crossing, because her workplace is his home. There is something creepy to me about the idea that someone's workplace and their sex life should be so intimately tied together.
posted by Aravis76 at 6:55 AM on June 3, 2015


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