I was at her home yesterday, for christsakes!
December 1, 2011 12:23 PM Subscribe
A friend getting married needed something borrowed, I lent her a valuable pin. You know the rest.
So, I lent this friend a pin for her wedding day. It was made of gold with tiny pearls, and most importantly, it was a present from my grandmother, who's now dead.
I know it wasn't the smartest decision, but I don't have a lot of jewelry, and she called me when I was on my way to the wedding, so I had to drive back home and quickly pick something in a hurry. I figured the pin worked because she was wearing a pashmina.
A month passed, and I really didn't want to remind her of it because it didn't seem polite, but hey, after a month I felt I had to ask. So I wrote her an email about it. We have seen eachother several times between her wedding and today, and we have even been alone cooking for HOURS.
So to my surprise, just today, when I asked her, she told me she lost it and she was planning to buy a new one, which was odd, cause she's leaving on a trip around the US this Sunday, so hey, she was about to skip town without telling me.
I don't know how to react to this, I know one can lose stuff with the stress of a wedding, etc., but I feel insulted that she didn't tell me until I asked her.
Should I ask for payment? Should I stop being her friend? Should I let her buy a new one and if so, how much should it be? I have no idea what a pin like this sells for. It was pretty simple, but I really freaking loved my grandma. I am so upset I cried a little bit at work and ate two cupcakes. :(
So, I lent this friend a pin for her wedding day. It was made of gold with tiny pearls, and most importantly, it was a present from my grandmother, who's now dead.
I know it wasn't the smartest decision, but I don't have a lot of jewelry, and she called me when I was on my way to the wedding, so I had to drive back home and quickly pick something in a hurry. I figured the pin worked because she was wearing a pashmina.
A month passed, and I really didn't want to remind her of it because it didn't seem polite, but hey, after a month I felt I had to ask. So I wrote her an email about it. We have seen eachother several times between her wedding and today, and we have even been alone cooking for HOURS.
So to my surprise, just today, when I asked her, she told me she lost it and she was planning to buy a new one, which was odd, cause she's leaving on a trip around the US this Sunday, so hey, she was about to skip town without telling me.
I don't know how to react to this, I know one can lose stuff with the stress of a wedding, etc., but I feel insulted that she didn't tell me until I asked her.
Should I ask for payment? Should I stop being her friend? Should I let her buy a new one and if so, how much should it be? I have no idea what a pin like this sells for. It was pretty simple, but I really freaking loved my grandma. I am so upset I cried a little bit at work and ate two cupcakes. :(
Wow, that's really awful. You should definitely let your feelings out - cry, be upset. Do this with someone like your partner or a non-mutual friend.
Then wait for a while - at least until tomorrow, before you contact her. I'd say wait even longer than that, but she's leaving on the trip soon and you might want to deal with this first. Your feelings are real and important, but they're separate from how you want to resolve this question.
As for whether she should pay you some money or buy you a new pin, would that be meaningful for you? It sounds like the value is mostly because it was your grandma's, and that's irreplaceable. But, maybe some money, or choosing a new pin together, would be valuable to you. Think about that, then discuss it with her once you've had a chance to cry it out.
As for being friends - it sounds like you're close friends. Is this worth losing the friendship to you? Only you can answer that. Is it typical behavior for her to be careless with other people's things? To not tell you right away that she lost it? Or is she usually responsible, and the stress of the wedding and the big trip just got away from her? Think about that, again, once you're feeling a bit calmer.
I'm so, so sorry you don't have something that was so meaningful to you.
posted by insectosaurus at 12:29 PM on December 1, 2011 [2 favorites]
Then wait for a while - at least until tomorrow, before you contact her. I'd say wait even longer than that, but she's leaving on the trip soon and you might want to deal with this first. Your feelings are real and important, but they're separate from how you want to resolve this question.
As for whether she should pay you some money or buy you a new pin, would that be meaningful for you? It sounds like the value is mostly because it was your grandma's, and that's irreplaceable. But, maybe some money, or choosing a new pin together, would be valuable to you. Think about that, then discuss it with her once you've had a chance to cry it out.
As for being friends - it sounds like you're close friends. Is this worth losing the friendship to you? Only you can answer that. Is it typical behavior for her to be careless with other people's things? To not tell you right away that she lost it? Or is she usually responsible, and the stress of the wedding and the big trip just got away from her? Think about that, again, once you're feeling a bit calmer.
I'm so, so sorry you don't have something that was so meaningful to you.
posted by insectosaurus at 12:29 PM on December 1, 2011 [2 favorites]
Did she know anything about its special significance to you when you lent it to her? I think that's fairly important in judging this situation.
posted by yoink at 12:31 PM on December 1, 2011 [4 favorites]
posted by yoink at 12:31 PM on December 1, 2011 [4 favorites]
Does she know how upset you are about it? With you not bringing it up for so long, I can see how she would get the wrong idea.
posted by supercres at 12:31 PM on December 1, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by supercres at 12:31 PM on December 1, 2011 [2 favorites]
Best answer: I think it's fair for you to tell her that that pin had a lot of sentimental value and that you're very hurt that she didn't tell you sooner. Definitely put more stress on the hurt because she didn't tell you than the anger that it was lost on the first place. Probably she was hoping she'd find it or embarrassed and didn't know how to bring it up, but that doesn't forgive it.
posted by brainmouse at 12:31 PM on December 1, 2011 [21 favorites]
posted by brainmouse at 12:31 PM on December 1, 2011 [21 favorites]
So.. I don't think she was maliciously keeping you uninformed. She probably knew how important the pin was to you, and was scared of how you would react to find out she lost it. People do stupid things when they're scared. Their judgement is often way off target.
You're allowed to cry and eat two cupcakes. It's okay. My suggestion is not to decide on anything right now. Over the next few days ask yourself is the loss of the pin worth losing this friend? How about the strain that asking for a payment or replacement of the pin would bring?
On preview, exactly what insectosaurus is saying. I love the idea of going and picking out a new pin together.
posted by royalsong at 12:31 PM on December 1, 2011 [3 favorites]
You're allowed to cry and eat two cupcakes. It's okay. My suggestion is not to decide on anything right now. Over the next few days ask yourself is the loss of the pin worth losing this friend? How about the strain that asking for a payment or replacement of the pin would bring?
On preview, exactly what insectosaurus is saying. I love the idea of going and picking out a new pin together.
posted by royalsong at 12:31 PM on December 1, 2011 [3 favorites]
Response by poster: No I didn't tell her about the pin. I mean I totally get how the pin could get lost, it's just the fact that she chode not to tell me for a whole month...
posted by Tarumba at 12:32 PM on December 1, 2011
posted by Tarumba at 12:32 PM on December 1, 2011
She probably didn't tell you because she was embarrassed to have lost it. Did she know the significance of the item? She probably figured she could find a replacement so that you wouldn't notice. She's gone so long without telling you because she was trying to find a replacement not realising it was essentially an heirloom.
While its understandable that you're upset, stopping being her friend over this seems like an overreaction and a denial of your own culpability. She needed something borrow, she didn't need a valuable piece of jewellery of enormous sentimental value. That part was your own choice.
Money or dumping your friend wont bring your pin back. Do you want a replacement? It sounds like the sentimental value was why you liked the pin, a new pin wont have that.
IMO, forgive and forget. If the pin has been lost then its been lost and ruining a friendship wont bring it back. I also don't see the value in telling your friend after she's lost it how important the pin was to you. She probably feels bad enough already.
posted by missmagenta at 12:38 PM on December 1, 2011 [2 favorites]
While its understandable that you're upset, stopping being her friend over this seems like an overreaction and a denial of your own culpability. She needed something borrow, she didn't need a valuable piece of jewellery of enormous sentimental value. That part was your own choice.
Money or dumping your friend wont bring your pin back. Do you want a replacement? It sounds like the sentimental value was why you liked the pin, a new pin wont have that.
IMO, forgive and forget. If the pin has been lost then its been lost and ruining a friendship wont bring it back. I also don't see the value in telling your friend after she's lost it how important the pin was to you. She probably feels bad enough already.
posted by missmagenta at 12:38 PM on December 1, 2011 [2 favorites]
So to my surprise, just today, when I asked her, she told me she lost it and she was planning to buy a new one
Someone lost something they lent you. They said they would buy a new one for you.
I think that's enough.
posted by Ironmouth at 12:38 PM on December 1, 2011 [6 favorites]
Someone lost something they lent you. They said they would buy a new one for you.
I think that's enough.
posted by Ironmouth at 12:38 PM on December 1, 2011 [6 favorites]
Oh, okay. Then let me up date my first comment then to say that she might not have known it was important to you at all. You feel it's very important and therefore a very big deal for it to be lost.. but she simply could be clueless about it.
If mean, if my friend lent me something without telling me how valuable it was.. and then didn't ask for it back right away -- I would be like: huh, must be some old thing she had in her drawer. I feel bad that I lost it, but thankfully it wasn't something irreplaceable! Hey, it might even turn up..
I'm not saying that it's your fault that she lost it. It's not, what I'm saying is that she might have made assumptions and acted on those assumptions. Humans function on assumptions, we make them every day about tons of things.
We're also very prone to making mistakes based on our assumptions. This seems more like a mistake and less a mean and vengeful "on purpose" thing she did to you.
posted by royalsong at 12:40 PM on December 1, 2011
If mean, if my friend lent me something without telling me how valuable it was.. and then didn't ask for it back right away -- I would be like: huh, must be some old thing she had in her drawer. I feel bad that I lost it, but thankfully it wasn't something irreplaceable! Hey, it might even turn up..
I'm not saying that it's your fault that she lost it. It's not, what I'm saying is that she might have made assumptions and acted on those assumptions. Humans function on assumptions, we make them every day about tons of things.
We're also very prone to making mistakes based on our assumptions. This seems more like a mistake and less a mean and vengeful "on purpose" thing she did to you.
posted by royalsong at 12:40 PM on December 1, 2011
This is a possibility when lending things. I am sorry.
posted by k8t at 12:42 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by k8t at 12:42 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
I'm sure had she known the tremendous sentimental value of the object, she would have been meticulous in her care for it. If someone lends me something without any objections or caveats I don't assume its anything more than a thing. When I don't hear back about it for several weeks, I start to assume it's not that important a thing and probably put it in the back of my mind that I'll replace it and, honestly, probably forget. If they asked me about it, I'd offer to replace it. If they got mad at me and said it was an heirloom I'd ask "Well, Jesus, why didn't you tell me that up front! I wouldn't have even borrowed it!"
Be upset over the loss of a priceless token of memory, sure, but I don't think this friend really needs to be pilloried for not treating as sacred something she did not realize was sacred. I mean, you can if you want, then you've gained both a lost friend and a lost memento instead of just a lost memento. That doesn't seem like a great exchange.
posted by absalom at 12:43 PM on December 1, 2011
Be upset over the loss of a priceless token of memory, sure, but I don't think this friend really needs to be pilloried for not treating as sacred something she did not realize was sacred. I mean, you can if you want, then you've gained both a lost friend and a lost memento instead of just a lost memento. That doesn't seem like a great exchange.
posted by absalom at 12:43 PM on December 1, 2011
Response by poster: Actually...sorry to change the story but I did tell her it was from my grandma. I just remembered.
Also, as I said before, I understand that she lost the pin. I just feel she should have told me before I asked her. Is it so crazy to want to be notified before they leave town?
posted by Tarumba at 12:44 PM on December 1, 2011
Also, as I said before, I understand that she lost the pin. I just feel she should have told me before I asked her. Is it so crazy to want to be notified before they leave town?
posted by Tarumba at 12:44 PM on December 1, 2011
My understanding (which may be totally wrong) of the 'something borrowed' tradition is that it's often a relatively valueless item. The point is the borrowed-ness of it, not its inherent beauty or value. She may simply not have thought at all that it was something particularly significant to you--especially when you didn't immediately call her up the next day to ask if it was safe etc.
I think this is mostly a case of misunderstanding and miscommunication and it would be sad to let something like that kill a friendship. You should let her know how much the pin meant to you (I would definitely want to know if I'd done something to hurt my friend, even if I'd done so unintentionally) and let her make it up to you as she sees fit.
This is a long shot, but is there anyone in your family who holds more of your grandma's jewelry who might be willing to part with something for you? Having something else of your grandma's to remember her by is presumably the only thing that really has a chance of filling the hole here.
posted by yoink at 12:45 PM on December 1, 2011
I think this is mostly a case of misunderstanding and miscommunication and it would be sad to let something like that kill a friendship. You should let her know how much the pin meant to you (I would definitely want to know if I'd done something to hurt my friend, even if I'd done so unintentionally) and let her make it up to you as she sees fit.
This is a long shot, but is there anyone in your family who holds more of your grandma's jewelry who might be willing to part with something for you? Having something else of your grandma's to remember her by is presumably the only thing that really has a chance of filling the hole here.
posted by yoink at 12:45 PM on December 1, 2011
Oops, failed to preview and now I see that you did tell her it was from your grandma. O.K., then she really did do something wrong. Ugh.
I guess all you can do is sit down over a cup of coffee or something and spell out your feelings and hope she has an adequate response. Losing it is entirely forgivable, of course, in the kerfuffle of a wedding. Failing to contact you and apologize when she knew it was a family heirloom is just plain bad behavior. It's up to you whether you choose to forgive or not. In any case, she should know how upset you are and then it's up to her to try to patch things up.
posted by yoink at 12:48 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
I guess all you can do is sit down over a cup of coffee or something and spell out your feelings and hope she has an adequate response. Losing it is entirely forgivable, of course, in the kerfuffle of a wedding. Failing to contact you and apologize when she knew it was a family heirloom is just plain bad behavior. It's up to you whether you choose to forgive or not. In any case, she should know how upset you are and then it's up to her to try to patch things up.
posted by yoink at 12:48 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
Best answer: My personal attitude is to never loan something I would hate to give away.
posted by xingcat at 12:48 PM on December 1, 2011 [22 favorites]
posted by xingcat at 12:48 PM on December 1, 2011 [22 favorites]
Is she leaving town for good or something, or is it just a trip? if it's just a trip then I don't see how that matters. Going on a trip is not "skipping town"... that generally means leaving, without intending on returning or letting folks know where you've gone.
She lost something of yours and likely felt really bad about it. So she delayed telling you because she knew you'd be upset and also maybe because she might just find it one of these days and then the problem is solved.
This is a natural reaction. Should she have owned up immediately? Probably, but to me this doesn't indicate any malice or that she's a bad friend. I think you are overreacting because of your emotional connection to the keepsake.
posted by utsutsu at 12:50 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
She lost something of yours and likely felt really bad about it. So she delayed telling you because she knew you'd be upset and also maybe because she might just find it one of these days and then the problem is solved.
This is a natural reaction. Should she have owned up immediately? Probably, but to me this doesn't indicate any malice or that she's a bad friend. I think you are overreacting because of your emotional connection to the keepsake.
posted by utsutsu at 12:50 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
Best answer: If this is unlike her, I would give her the benefit of the doubt that the reason she hasn't told you before now is that for the past month she's been frantically tearing the house apart looking for it, and was hoping she could just give it to you with a big smile and say "here it is, all safe and sound!"
Or maybe she thought she knew where it was ("duh, it's in the jewelry box in my room") and it just kept slipping her mind to give it back to you (she DID just get married and then go straight into planning a vacation, and her attention's scattered), and it's only just this week when she went to that jewelry box where it was supposed to be: "oh, right, before I forget, let me give back the pin that I put in here safe and -- oh. Uh-oh."
I am sorry for your loss, but I am not really getting a sense of her being "tra-la-la it's no big deal" so much as I'm sensing she didn't tell you was because she was embarrassed.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:53 PM on December 1, 2011 [11 favorites]
Or maybe she thought she knew where it was ("duh, it's in the jewelry box in my room") and it just kept slipping her mind to give it back to you (she DID just get married and then go straight into planning a vacation, and her attention's scattered), and it's only just this week when she went to that jewelry box where it was supposed to be: "oh, right, before I forget, let me give back the pin that I put in here safe and -- oh. Uh-oh."
I am sorry for your loss, but I am not really getting a sense of her being "tra-la-la it's no big deal" so much as I'm sensing she didn't tell you was because she was embarrassed.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:53 PM on December 1, 2011 [11 favorites]
Best answer: Ugh, that's just terrible. I'm sure you're feeling sick about it. But if she didn't know that it was a pin that was especially extra important to you -- regardless of its provenience -- the fact that she lost it in the shuffle of the wedding probably seemed much less important to her. That doesn't make it okay, but I do think it's really really possible that she wasn't "keeping it from you" out of anything other than simply not realizing it was actually quite important.
And as far as them leaving town goes...I mean, she's coming back, right? She's not skipping town. She may have actually been planning to find you something on her trip to bring back, or hoping it would turn up.
I totally understand why you are upset, but cutting off your friendship over this seems really extreme to me, unless she's been a terrible friend to you otherwise and this is just the last straw. Is it also possible that you're feeling this much upheaval over the whole situation because you are mad at yourself for loaning out something that you would be devastated to lose?
I am really sympathetic about how upset you are, because I would be too, but cutting off your friendship over this seems like an overreaction. When she told you she lost it, did you then tell her that you were really really upset? Because her reaction to THAT would be more telling to me.
posted by Countess Sandwich at 12:54 PM on December 1, 2011
And as far as them leaving town goes...I mean, she's coming back, right? She's not skipping town. She may have actually been planning to find you something on her trip to bring back, or hoping it would turn up.
I totally understand why you are upset, but cutting off your friendship over this seems really extreme to me, unless she's been a terrible friend to you otherwise and this is just the last straw. Is it also possible that you're feeling this much upheaval over the whole situation because you are mad at yourself for loaning out something that you would be devastated to lose?
I am really sympathetic about how upset you are, because I would be too, but cutting off your friendship over this seems like an overreaction. When she told you she lost it, did you then tell her that you were really really upset? Because her reaction to THAT would be more telling to me.
posted by Countess Sandwich at 12:54 PM on December 1, 2011
I think thats rude as hell. If you lose or damage something, even inadvertently, you try to replace or fix it, you don't slink around hoping you'll get away with it. Unless you're 4.
posted by fshgrl at 12:54 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by fshgrl at 12:54 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
Best answer: Not telling you for a whole month isn't really that surprising -- between being distracted and the unpleasantness of the pending conversation, she may have slightly-willfully forgotten about it.
Can you let her know that actually, the piece had tremendous sentimental value and wasn't replaceable, and ask if she knows where she lost it so you can contact the venues and see if anyone returned it? I would at least go through the paces of making that attempt, and this will allow her to offer her apologies.
People don't mean to do shit like this, and generally feel pretty terrible about it. After giving actually finding it your best shot, I would then let it go and try to forgive your friend.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:54 PM on December 1, 2011 [3 favorites]
Can you let her know that actually, the piece had tremendous sentimental value and wasn't replaceable, and ask if she knows where she lost it so you can contact the venues and see if anyone returned it? I would at least go through the paces of making that attempt, and this will allow her to offer her apologies.
People don't mean to do shit like this, and generally feel pretty terrible about it. After giving actually finding it your best shot, I would then let it go and try to forgive your friend.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:54 PM on December 1, 2011 [3 favorites]
Someone lost something they lent you. They said they would buy a new one for you.
I think that's enough.
Yeah except for the whole 'it belonged to my dead grandma' thing. This ISN'T a new one to buy.
posted by spicynuts at 12:54 PM on December 1, 2011 [3 favorites]
I think that's enough.
Yeah except for the whole 'it belonged to my dead grandma' thing. This ISN'T a new one to buy.
posted by spicynuts at 12:54 PM on December 1, 2011 [3 favorites]
The loss of the pin, while horribly careless with something you told her was a gift from your grandmother, isn't what makes this person somewhat dubious as a friend prospect.
It's the not saying anything until confronted about it, and then admitting it was lost. That is what I would be upset about, were it me.
I would at a minimum not ever loan this person anything again.
posted by winna at 1:02 PM on December 1, 2011
It's the not saying anything until confronted about it, and then admitting it was lost. That is what I would be upset about, were it me.
I would at a minimum not ever loan this person anything again.
posted by winna at 1:02 PM on December 1, 2011
Best answer: I've always been under the impression that the "something borrowed" tradition is supposed to symbolize our ties to our friends and families. We aren't just heading into a shiny new relationship, we're part of a larger community. She asked for something with sentimental value, and it should be expected she would treat it as a valuable object. Not a trinket you pick up at the store.
Yes, these things happen. So I wouldn't DTMFA or anything. But I would feel validated in feeling very hurt and would expect the room to grieve and be upset. And I would expect some kind of remorse, even though I understand that some people broadcast their remorse differently than others.
So if you suspect she avoided the conversation out of remorse, and her offer of a replacement was a clueless attempt to make things right, I might just let her know that a replacement isn't possible, and you're upset. But such things happen, and you'll recover.
posted by politikitty at 1:13 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
Yes, these things happen. So I wouldn't DTMFA or anything. But I would feel validated in feeling very hurt and would expect the room to grieve and be upset. And I would expect some kind of remorse, even though I understand that some people broadcast their remorse differently than others.
So if you suspect she avoided the conversation out of remorse, and her offer of a replacement was a clueless attempt to make things right, I might just let her know that a replacement isn't possible, and you're upset. But such things happen, and you'll recover.
posted by politikitty at 1:13 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: For clarification, she's leaving town for at least a couple of years to different places around the US.
I just told her she doesn't need to get another one, but I wish she had been upfront. She sounded really embarrased about it, but she is a really good person, so I'll continue to be her close friend, I just won't lend her things I want to see again!
Thank you for your thoughts and advice!
posted by Tarumba at 1:14 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
I just told her she doesn't need to get another one, but I wish she had been upfront. She sounded really embarrased about it, but she is a really good person, so I'll continue to be her close friend, I just won't lend her things I want to see again!
Thank you for your thoughts and advice!
posted by Tarumba at 1:14 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
Wow, I am quite surprised at the number of people giving the friend so much benefit of the doubt. What has she done to earn this? Let’s recap here:
1. Friend calls the OP at the last minute to borrow something. OP goes out of her way to return home and bring something for her friend to wear.
2. Friend loses the item which she specifically requested to borrow, and which she knew had belonged to the OP’s grandmother.
3. Friend spends the next month going about her life, making other plans, and spending lots of time with the OP, while never once bringing up the lost pin.
4. Three days before leaving for a 2-year long trip, and only when confronted, friend reveals that she lost the pin and “was planning to buy a new one”.
This is abominable behaviour. A wedding, in itself, is never justification for rude behaviour – and it’s been a month since the wedding! OP, I don’t blame you for being upset. The fact that she wasn’t planning to tell you about the pin before she left tells you something important about her character. She is at best weak and immature, and at worst thoughtless and uncaring. I am sorry you’ve lost something irreplaceable.
On preview, you’ve said that she was very embarrassed and that she’s a good person overall, so I guess that softens the blow. But doesn’t let her off the hook, does it? If she is a true friend, she will do something to make this up to you – especially now that she knows how important the pin was to you. If you don’t see any effort on her part to do this, well, again…that will be very telling.
posted by yawper at 1:34 PM on December 1, 2011 [23 favorites]
1. Friend calls the OP at the last minute to borrow something. OP goes out of her way to return home and bring something for her friend to wear.
2. Friend loses the item which she specifically requested to borrow, and which she knew had belonged to the OP’s grandmother.
3. Friend spends the next month going about her life, making other plans, and spending lots of time with the OP, while never once bringing up the lost pin.
4. Three days before leaving for a 2-year long trip, and only when confronted, friend reveals that she lost the pin and “was planning to buy a new one”.
This is abominable behaviour. A wedding, in itself, is never justification for rude behaviour – and it’s been a month since the wedding! OP, I don’t blame you for being upset. The fact that she wasn’t planning to tell you about the pin before she left tells you something important about her character. She is at best weak and immature, and at worst thoughtless and uncaring. I am sorry you’ve lost something irreplaceable.
On preview, you’ve said that she was very embarrassed and that she’s a good person overall, so I guess that softens the blow. But doesn’t let her off the hook, does it? If she is a true friend, she will do something to make this up to you – especially now that she knows how important the pin was to you. If you don’t see any effort on her part to do this, well, again…that will be very telling.
posted by yawper at 1:34 PM on December 1, 2011 [23 favorites]
Personally, I would do my best to just let it go and not mention it to your friend again.
Yes, it was wrong of her to not tell you until you asked. I understand why you are upset, not only about losing the pin, but about how she behaved. But there are many possible reasons for her behavior and you want to continue to be her good friend. I think bringing it up again will just serve to make her feel guilty and won't do you any good.
posted by chickenmagazine at 1:56 PM on December 1, 2011
Yes, it was wrong of her to not tell you until you asked. I understand why you are upset, not only about losing the pin, but about how she behaved. But there are many possible reasons for her behavior and you want to continue to be her good friend. I think bringing it up again will just serve to make her feel guilty and won't do you any good.
posted by chickenmagazine at 1:56 PM on December 1, 2011
I think "abominable behaviour" is a ridiculous stretch.
She spent one month not dealing with something but this was the month post-wedding and while planning a move, for starters. On top of this, sometimes people make a bad situation worse by avoiding a conversation they don't want to have. It sucks, it's happened to me, and I've probably done it, too. It's natural. Sure, she could have behaved better, absolutely, but understanding that it might be her awareness that it was a big deal that caused her to make such a mess of it should help keep it in perspective.
Maybe not, maybe she just doesn't care and is an actual shitty person. But the only person who can judge that is (maybe) the OP, and jumping to "she's abominable and that's that" makes me grateful for the friends that I have, let's put it that way.
posted by neuromodulator at 2:05 PM on December 1, 2011 [3 favorites]
She spent one month not dealing with something but this was the month post-wedding and while planning a move, for starters. On top of this, sometimes people make a bad situation worse by avoiding a conversation they don't want to have. It sucks, it's happened to me, and I've probably done it, too. It's natural. Sure, she could have behaved better, absolutely, but understanding that it might be her awareness that it was a big deal that caused her to make such a mess of it should help keep it in perspective.
Maybe not, maybe she just doesn't care and is an actual shitty person. But the only person who can judge that is (maybe) the OP, and jumping to "she's abominable and that's that" makes me grateful for the friends that I have, let's put it that way.
posted by neuromodulator at 2:05 PM on December 1, 2011 [3 favorites]
I think it's very kind of you to let this go. I don't know what kind of person your grandmother was but I know that my beloved grandmother would not want me to loose a good friend over a piece of jewelry. It's very distressing and I totally understand your diappointment but if you can truly let this go, you'll be better off. And if your friend does get you a new pin, accept it as its own gift, not a replacement.
posted by amanda at 2:12 PM on December 1, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by amanda at 2:12 PM on December 1, 2011 [2 favorites]
Knowing it was from your grandmother and knowing it was a powerful symbol are not the same. So maybe you can cut some slack for that. If you said the origin of something, I might take that to mean it's an antique, it's something that's sort of borrowered for me so it's a nice fit as a something borrowed for the wedding, that it was old and possibly frail so don't break it.... The value might not have been obvious to her.
All I have from my maternal grandmother are a couple of recipies and the sure knowledge that I will never, ever be as good as she was - it wouldn't occurs to me that an object would have that meaning (although I would understand if you explained!!!)
posted by Lesser Shrew at 2:26 PM on December 1, 2011
All I have from my maternal grandmother are a couple of recipies and the sure knowledge that I will never, ever be as good as she was - it wouldn't occurs to me that an object would have that meaning (although I would understand if you explained!!!)
posted by Lesser Shrew at 2:26 PM on December 1, 2011
This is abominable behaviour. A wedding, in itself, is never justification for rude behaviour – and it’s been a month since the wedding!
And maybe the newly-web woman woke up in the middle of the night a few days later and realized it was gone. When she couldn't find it, she called all the places she'd been, waited for people to call back, had them look an extra time, drove out there herself, drove back empty-handed and crying. Maybe she hoped desperately that it would show up when they turned their home upside down to pack for the move. Maybe she maintained a straight face with the OP to make everything seem normal until the pin came back because she knew that the pin belonged to OP's grandmother and OP might never forgive her and may not even want to be her friend anymore if the pin was really lost!
Or not. Maybe she just thought "well my biggest problem now isn't some stupid old pin". It could be something inbetween; only the OP can judge the pin-loser's attitude to it, but based on what we know, it seems fair to give her some benefit of doubt. If you refuse that and assume the worst in someone you otherwise like and consider a good person, how are you able to maintain any friends at all?
posted by springload at 3:01 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
And maybe the newly-web woman woke up in the middle of the night a few days later and realized it was gone. When she couldn't find it, she called all the places she'd been, waited for people to call back, had them look an extra time, drove out there herself, drove back empty-handed and crying. Maybe she hoped desperately that it would show up when they turned their home upside down to pack for the move. Maybe she maintained a straight face with the OP to make everything seem normal until the pin came back because she knew that the pin belonged to OP's grandmother and OP might never forgive her and may not even want to be her friend anymore if the pin was really lost!
Or not. Maybe she just thought "well my biggest problem now isn't some stupid old pin". It could be something inbetween; only the OP can judge the pin-loser's attitude to it, but based on what we know, it seems fair to give her some benefit of doubt. If you refuse that and assume the worst in someone you otherwise like and consider a good person, how are you able to maintain any friends at all?
posted by springload at 3:01 PM on December 1, 2011 [1 favorite]
I would send her an email that basically said "I loaned an object that was given to me out of love by my grandmother as a token of my love to you, and my good wishes for your marriage. I am distressed that you were careless enough with someone else's irreplaceable property to misplace it, but much more so that you didn't tell me immediately when there was a still a chance to contact the venue, caterers, etc to see if anyone had found it. When, exactly, were you planning to let me know? Because it was over four weeks before I asked you, and that to me is neither considerate nor contentious of our friendship."
In other words, I know how carefully relationships between women sometimes need to be handled, but it's okay to be pissed, to be upfront about being pissed, and to ask what the fuck she was thinking when she was busy not letting your know there was an issue here.
posted by DarlingBri at 3:53 PM on December 1, 2011
In other words, I know how carefully relationships between women sometimes need to be handled, but it's okay to be pissed, to be upfront about being pissed, and to ask what the fuck she was thinking when she was busy not letting your know there was an issue here.
posted by DarlingBri at 3:53 PM on December 1, 2011
Best answer: I wonder what you'd have said if she'd brought this up the first or second time you saw her since the wedding, and said something like this:
"Tarumba, I don't know how to tell you this, but I've looked high and low for that pin you lent me, and I cannot find it anywhere. I'm so sorry, it looks as though I lost it. Was it of great value to you? What can I do to make this right?"
I bet you'd have said: "Oh Flossie, please don't get too upset. It was my grandmother's pin and I was very fond of it, but I'm still more fond of you. I know you didn't mean to lose it, that's the risk you take when you lend things, and you did your best to find it. Just, do let me know if it turns up, won't you? Come on, o friend of my bosom, let's go outside and pick wild flowers," or something like that.
But she didn't do that. She treated it as a non-issue until you brought it up over a fucking MONTH later, and what does she say? Oh, that old thing, I just flushed it down the loo. I'll get you another one from the five-and ten-cent store, or out of a Christmas cracker, or something.
Nice.
Yes, maybe she has spent every second of the last month weeping tears of remorse and combing every inch of land from here to the thrice tenth kingdom, but she needs to say so if that's the case. All you know about her attitude over this is what she's told you, which is that she thinks it's just fine.
I don't buy the excuse that she probably assumed lent items are worthless to you. Aside from the fact that a wedding is an occasion when items of sentimental value are particularly likely to change hands in one way or another - it's not her call. If a friend lends me a book, I assume nothing and treat it like it's a first edition of Fly Fishing by J R Hartley. I do not assume that if my friend was dumb enough to let it fall into my hands, it's okay for me to line the cat litter tray with it.
Yeah, that is the risk you take when you lend things - they might get lost or damaged and you might not get them back. That's also the risk you take when you borrow things - you might lose or damage them and have to confess and make amends to the lender.
I also don't buy the idea that she was too busy getting married to bother about this. She wasn't too busy to borrow it, she shouldn't have been too busy to return it, or to apologize when that proved impossible.
I'm sorry if she was all upset and scared and not wanting to tell you and stuff, but she's a responsible adult (as in, old enough to get married) and it doesn't work like that. We all want to run and hide and hope our mistakes will just go away without our having to fix them, but other people just keep on selfishly having feelings that we have to take into consideration. Especially when it really wouldn't take much to solve the problem. A lost brooch, even a valued one, isn't nearly as serious as making a friend feel like you just don't give a toss about it, or her.
So, should you tell her exactly that? No, of course not, and I'm sure you would never think of such a thing. I just want to say that I think you have in fact been treated disrespectfully and it's okay to acknowledge that to yourself. Silently. Inside your own head.
So here is what you do say, as soon as possible because it's just going to fester:
"Dear Flossie, I am sorry to have to raise this with you but I must admit that I was surprised and hurt to learn that my grandmother's pin has been missing all this time and I wasn't told sooner.
"I'm sure you didn't mean to lose it, but the way you told me about it makes me think that you don't fully understand the sentimental value of the pin, or that any feelings I might have about it don't matter to you. Maybe I've misunderstood and you care very much about this or else thought that I saw the pin as expendable. But that's just how it came across to me and I'm really feeling upset about it. I hope we can work this out.
"Sincerely, Tarumba."
posted by tel3path at 4:33 PM on December 1, 2011 [7 favorites]
"Tarumba, I don't know how to tell you this, but I've looked high and low for that pin you lent me, and I cannot find it anywhere. I'm so sorry, it looks as though I lost it. Was it of great value to you? What can I do to make this right?"
I bet you'd have said: "Oh Flossie, please don't get too upset. It was my grandmother's pin and I was very fond of it, but I'm still more fond of you. I know you didn't mean to lose it, that's the risk you take when you lend things, and you did your best to find it. Just, do let me know if it turns up, won't you? Come on, o friend of my bosom, let's go outside and pick wild flowers," or something like that.
But she didn't do that. She treated it as a non-issue until you brought it up over a fucking MONTH later, and what does she say? Oh, that old thing, I just flushed it down the loo. I'll get you another one from the five-and ten-cent store, or out of a Christmas cracker, or something.
Nice.
Yes, maybe she has spent every second of the last month weeping tears of remorse and combing every inch of land from here to the thrice tenth kingdom, but she needs to say so if that's the case. All you know about her attitude over this is what she's told you, which is that she thinks it's just fine.
I don't buy the excuse that she probably assumed lent items are worthless to you. Aside from the fact that a wedding is an occasion when items of sentimental value are particularly likely to change hands in one way or another - it's not her call. If a friend lends me a book, I assume nothing and treat it like it's a first edition of Fly Fishing by J R Hartley. I do not assume that if my friend was dumb enough to let it fall into my hands, it's okay for me to line the cat litter tray with it.
Yeah, that is the risk you take when you lend things - they might get lost or damaged and you might not get them back. That's also the risk you take when you borrow things - you might lose or damage them and have to confess and make amends to the lender.
I also don't buy the idea that she was too busy getting married to bother about this. She wasn't too busy to borrow it, she shouldn't have been too busy to return it, or to apologize when that proved impossible.
I'm sorry if she was all upset and scared and not wanting to tell you and stuff, but she's a responsible adult (as in, old enough to get married) and it doesn't work like that. We all want to run and hide and hope our mistakes will just go away without our having to fix them, but other people just keep on selfishly having feelings that we have to take into consideration. Especially when it really wouldn't take much to solve the problem. A lost brooch, even a valued one, isn't nearly as serious as making a friend feel like you just don't give a toss about it, or her.
So, should you tell her exactly that? No, of course not, and I'm sure you would never think of such a thing. I just want to say that I think you have in fact been treated disrespectfully and it's okay to acknowledge that to yourself. Silently. Inside your own head.
So here is what you do say, as soon as possible because it's just going to fester:
"Dear Flossie, I am sorry to have to raise this with you but I must admit that I was surprised and hurt to learn that my grandmother's pin has been missing all this time and I wasn't told sooner.
"I'm sure you didn't mean to lose it, but the way you told me about it makes me think that you don't fully understand the sentimental value of the pin, or that any feelings I might have about it don't matter to you. Maybe I've misunderstood and you care very much about this or else thought that I saw the pin as expendable. But that's just how it came across to me and I'm really feeling upset about it. I hope we can work this out.
"Sincerely, Tarumba."
posted by tel3path at 4:33 PM on December 1, 2011 [7 favorites]
I would send her an email that basically said "I loaned an object that was given to me out of love by my grandmother as a token of my love to you, and my good wishes for your marriage. I am distressed that you were careless enough with someone else's irreplaceable property to misplace it, but much more so that you didn't tell me immediately when there was a still a chance to contact the venue, caterers, etc to see if anyone had found it. When, exactly, were you planning to let me know? Because it was over four weeks before I asked you, and that to me is neither considerate nor contentious of our friendship."
I think this comment is well meant, but I would not do this if you want to continue the friendship, no matter how close you guys are. I have done things like this, out of a desire to be honest and forthright with my feelings, and instead it just escalates into email war and a lot of bad feelings and more than once the end of a friendship. I'm sure she knows she messed up and calling her out on it does nothing but give you an outlet for your own despair about this, and even though that despair is warranted, throwing it on her right now will not help your friendship.
I personally feel like she felt bad that she lost it and was hoping it would magically turn up and she could avoid the problem. But as was said upthread, we can't know if it's that or if she's just thoughtless, so better to give her the benefit of the doubt, especially if you want to keep the friendship.
posted by sweetkid at 6:22 PM on December 1, 2011
It's too late to give you advice on what kind of stuff to lend to people at this point. It has been lost and unfortunately, there is nothing you can do to recover that item.
You should be upset. My grandmother sent me all sorts of things when she was alive. I kept everything I could. My sister (who didn't have the same relationship with my grandmother as I did) threw away a raincoat my grandmother sent. I COULD HAVE COMMITTED MURDER. I think about it now and it still hurts. My grandmother sent that silly thing when I was a teenager and I am now in my forties. Anyway, to make a short story very long, you are allowed to be upset.
Tell your friend that you are happy that she will replace it. Who cares how much it is? She borrowed it, she buys one to replace it for you. You should ask your friend if you can accompany her to pick it out because you would like to find one that would remind you of your late grandmother since that pin was given to you by your late grandmother.
I think that it is only fair. If she leaves on a trip, then ask her when she can go with you to pick out a pin. Tell her you really would like it replaced ASAP or at least pick one out ASAP.
posted by Yellow at 7:26 PM on December 1, 2011
You should be upset. My grandmother sent me all sorts of things when she was alive. I kept everything I could. My sister (who didn't have the same relationship with my grandmother as I did) threw away a raincoat my grandmother sent. I COULD HAVE COMMITTED MURDER. I think about it now and it still hurts. My grandmother sent that silly thing when I was a teenager and I am now in my forties. Anyway, to make a short story very long, you are allowed to be upset.
Tell your friend that you are happy that she will replace it. Who cares how much it is? She borrowed it, she buys one to replace it for you. You should ask your friend if you can accompany her to pick it out because you would like to find one that would remind you of your late grandmother since that pin was given to you by your late grandmother.
I think that it is only fair. If she leaves on a trip, then ask her when she can go with you to pick out a pin. Tell her you really would like it replaced ASAP or at least pick one out ASAP.
posted by Yellow at 7:26 PM on December 1, 2011
My sympathies.
My one suggestion is, whatever you do, I wouldn't do it through email.
Email has a tendency to make delicate situations far worse. Things get interpreted differently and everything gets taken the wrong way and suddenly you two are mortal enemies, IMHO.
posted by The ____ of Justice at 12:10 AM on December 2, 2011
My one suggestion is, whatever you do, I wouldn't do it through email.
Email has a tendency to make delicate situations far worse. Things get interpreted differently and everything gets taken the wrong way and suddenly you two are mortal enemies, IMHO.
posted by The ____ of Justice at 12:10 AM on December 2, 2011
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by needs more cowbell at 12:28 PM on December 1, 2011 [9 favorites]