Do I Tell Her Why We Don't Hang Out Anymore?

June 30, 2009 12:57 PM

Do I Tell Her? I have a friend that I no longer enjoy hanging out with. She wants to know why I haven't been in touch.

Let's call her Kelly.

Kelly has a magnetic personality. When we first met, it was fun. We have a few things in common, so we started to hang out from time to time. I guess that's typical of how a new friendship begins.

But, over time, I've found that I don't enjoy hanging out with Kelly. That's how new friendships work, sometimes, right? Sometimes they bloom and sometimes they don't.

Kelly is loud and overbearing in social settings. A conversation can feel more like an argument because she will keep pushing and pushing, constantly restating her point even when you agree with her. It can feel like she's having a conversation AT you rather than with you. Also, she doesn't seem to pick up on social cues, which means you get stuck in a conversation with her. At one point, I saw someone pull a fake exit on her with a "What's that, Tom? Hang on" so he could end a conversation with Kelly (but Tom wasn't even talking!)

Also, Kelly's drinking gets out of hand and it can be embarrassing to be around her. The more she drinks, the louder and needier she gets. Kelly drinks a lot.

She has been pestering me about whether I'm avoiding her, and it's true that I am. The question is, do I tell her why? Complication: We have some friends in common and Kelly is the gossipy sort. I don't want to hurt her feelings, but it's becoming clear that I can't just ignore her. And maybe she needs to know how others see her?

What do I do? What would you do?

posted by anonymous to human relations (47 comments total)

Personally, I would disappear and hang out with mutual friends individually or eventually go Christian Bale on her.

I'm pretty sure many others here would have more graceful and mature responses, but those are two possible options.
posted by spec80 at 1:02 PM on June 30

Magnetic personality? Loud and Overbearing? Embarrassing? Needy? Gossipy?

Kelly is what we call a "Drama Queen."

No matter how you give her the brush off, short of not brushing her off at all and bending to her whim to avoid her inevitably fury, she will likely overreact, so why not be honest about it? It will stop her from wanting to "fix" the relationship she has with you, and it sounds like quite a few of your friends already know that she's a pill.
posted by coryinabox at 1:08 PM on June 30

Here's something that's worked for me in the past:

Don't tell her. Instead, next time she asks you to hang out, go - but be absolutely dull. I mean totally uninteresting and zero fun dull. It won't take long.
posted by widdershins at 1:11 PM on June 30 [4 favorites]

It's okay to just let people go. That's the way she is; even if you told her, she wouldn't change.
posted by heather-b at 1:14 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

Take your courage into both hands and be honest with her (but don't be drawn into an argument). If people are pulling fake exits on her, you're obviously not the only one with a problem being around her, and she deserves to know if that there's something in her behavior that makes it difficult to keep friends or makes her unpleasant to be around. Sure, she may just get angry or think the problem is you, not her; but there's the possibility that she might take a close look at herself and decide there's things she could work on (or that she's fine with being a drama queen). If I was doing something that turned a lot of people off, I would want to know.
posted by frobozz at 1:16 PM on June 30

Clearly Kelly does not care if she hurts other people's feelings. It's very noble and altruistic of you to want to spare hers, but I think you should tell her the truth without using it as a weapon. You don't enjoy hanging out with her. Tell her that. Yes, she'll gossip, but she'd do that no matter what your reason for exiling her - it's who she is.

We owe nobody our time and attention. Life's short enough without wasting it on people whose company we endure rather than enjoy. Friends are the people who enhance our lives, not the people who diminish them. Is whether Kelly's feelings got hurt by your rejection really going to matter to you in 10 years time? Is not hurting Kelly's feelings one of the things of which you'll be most proud on your death bed.

Kelly will find new enablers - people like her always do. You don't owe her your friendship. Friendship is a gift we give to those who deserve it - don't waste it on those who don't.
posted by Lolie at 1:19 PM on June 30 [13 favorites]

This is classic drama behaviour. Mostly it is rude to ask people why they don't like you or if they are avoiding you. It makes them uncomfortable and you probably won't like what you hear. While it maybe sometimes acceptable to find out if you have made a faux pas, mostly it's a bad scene.

My guess is that if you tell the truth, that the gauntlet will be throne. It will be drama, she may be hurt, she may decide you are her enemy and trash talk you.

You should lie, side step the question, claim your busy or make excuses until she stops pestering you.

You know that not everyone has to be friends and it doesn't mean you hate her, but I don't think she realizes this.
posted by Gor-ella at 1:20 PM on June 30

Look at it this way, if everyone takes the cowardly approach and just starts avoiding her, she will never know what's going on and will have no opportunity to change what you and other people don't like about her. Maybe if enough people do it she'll catch on to the idea that something about her is scaring people off but she may not have the capacity to self-analyse and see what it is about her personality that other people find so objectionable.

If you just want to avoid conflict then keep hiding from her, if you actually want to give her the chance to change, then tell her. It will probably be unpleasant and you will most likely hurt her feelings a lot if she has no idea how other people perceive her (of course it could be like water off a duck's back - some people are like that, they wont ever see that they have flaws and are therefore incapable of change) but if she can redirect that hurt into making positive changes to her behaviour then you will have done her (and her present and future friends) a kindness.
posted by missmagenta at 1:21 PM on June 30

"I think you and I are really different, and hanging out together just isn't working for me. I wish you all the best!"

That's true, and she can twist it into "Anon is SOOO JEALOUS of my outgoing personality and joie de vivre," which is a story that might make her feel better for a while.
posted by Sidhedevil at 1:21 PM on June 30 [5 favorites]

maybe she needs to know how others see her?

I think whether you let you her know which specific behaviors have turned you off really depends on the answer to this question.

If you really think she has a drinking problem, and that's the root of what you can't stand, to me that would probably fall in the zone of "she needs to know, even if it's uncomfortable to be the messenger." (Not that you have any particular obligation to be the messenger if you don't want to. But I think it would be okay ethically to let her know, as kindly as possible, that her personality changes when she drinks in a way that you find very hard to be around, and that you don't want to put yourself in that situation anymore.)

If it's more a matter of her personality not being your cup of tea, then it falls firmly in the camp of being cruel to tell her. After all, people can't really change their personalities**, so it's a pointless parting shot that has the potential to turn into a full-blown self-conscious worry for years. And for what? There may be people out there who enjoy her personality. Just because you're not one of them doesn't mean they don't exist. This is kind of like how it's not nice to tell your boyfriend he didn't satisfy you sexually when you break up: pointless and mean.



**Okay, okay, I don't actually believe no one can change their personality. But that sort of message--"there's this aspect of you that is driving people away, and you need to change it"--is probably only going to be successful if it comes from someone she knows and trusts. Not from someone who is in the process of dropping her as a friend.
posted by iminurmefi at 1:25 PM on June 30 [3 favorites]

Do as Gor-ella says. She'll probably trash-talk you either way, but you don't need to give her ammunition. Just let it slide--if you don't give her the drama she craves, you'll slip off her radar faster, and any mutual friends won't be put in impossible her-or-you situations. Plus, if you happen to run into her, you won't need to worry about a giant scene.
posted by MrMoonPie at 1:25 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

I really don't think that you will change her even if you tell her what's going on. She will probably find a way to rationalize what a jerk you are. When she asks you to hang out, tell her you are busy or have other plans. Keep doing that. If she presses you, repeat that you've been busy. You don't really owe her an explanation. If you help things fizzle out by being unavailable and unemotional, she will move on to other people who can provide her with the drama she wants.
posted by Kimberly at 1:28 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

Tell her you don't like the person she is and is going to continue being? Ha ha! It can't end well--chances are she will be extremely hurt and, in typical drama queen fashion, will turn the whole thing into a huge shit-fest.

All you have to say is that you've been busy and that it's no big deal. Play it cool. Hang out with her still, but with extreme infrequency (be flakey about it too), and as widdershins says, when you hang out with her, act distracted and uninterested. This process doesn't take long.
posted by flavor at 1:29 PM on June 30 [3 favorites]

As several folks -- particularly coryinabox -- said, Kelly is a drama queen. Not to put too fine a point on it, she could potentially have a borderline personality disorder. I'm not saying she does have BPD, but there is a possibility she could. And that calls for a very different response.

Rather than give in to her demands and tell her why you no longer wish to hang out with her, I would suggest either backing off until she no longer seeks you out, or tell her something that puts her one-up and you one-down. Maybe something like "I just always feel like a frump when I'm with you cuz you're so vivacious. This has helped me realize that I'm more the quiet-times type."

Otherwise, she will definitely trash you to whatever mutual friends you have and, if you should ever find yourselves at the same party or whatever, it would be extremely uncomfortable for you.
posted by DrGail at 1:34 PM on June 30

If you decide to confront Kelly on her behavior, don't go about it by telling her she's an obnoxious overbearing drama-queen who drinks too much.

I advise that you frame it in terms of how her behavior makes you feel, and how it affects you. Say something like,
"Kelly, when we spend time together, I don't feel like you're listening to me. I don't feel comfortable around you. I don't enjoy myself." Or whatever. You know how you feel better than I do. Then, tell her that because you feel uncomfortable around her, you think it's the best for you not to hang out with her.

She can't argue with how you feel, and it might make her think about how her behavior is affecting others.

Regardless, she may get all drama queen on you and freak out loudly. She may try to get any mutual friends you might have to take sides. She may try to hurt you or anger you by attacking an issue that is sensitive for you. Be prepared for this. Try to stay calm, don't get drawn in to her drama, and don't be a spectator to her freak-out. Just walk away.
posted by cleverevans at 1:37 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

This is classic drama behaviour. Mostly it is rude to ask people why they don't like you or if they are avoiding you.

I disagree. If you cut someone off you at least owe them an explanation. But then I always seem to be in the minority in this regard.

I've also found that the kind of people who cut people off do it all the time. They have a history of it. If you're one of these people it might be time to look at your own behavior and figure out why nobody's good enough to be your friend.
posted by Evangeline at 1:38 PM on June 30 [5 favorites]

I like Sidhedevil's approach a lot.

I think if you give a critical explanation ("I find you loud and overbearing, which makes hanging out with you tedious.") then you ought to give her a chance to try to address the things you're taking issue with. If you just want to cut ties and not give her a second chance, then it seems unfair to lay out your case against her. If you're at all open to continuing this friendship, then I think you have a lot more flexibility.
posted by Meg_Murry at 2:01 PM on June 30

This question has been asked a lot.

Here's my thought. You don't like her because...well, you don't find her decent. She's too loud, inconsiderate, whatever. Fair enough.

Every person who hasn't been a total dick to us deserves to be talked to. Like a person.

Fading away, just cutting off contact, that's a dick move 100% more than what she did. Don't be a dick.
posted by TomMelee at 2:14 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

I don't like any of this advice. I dunno. I recently did this to a similar type friend, and the best way, IMO, is to treat her like a clingy gf, so, the best way would be to go the "It's not you, it's me route".

Or tell her that you would love to hang out with her, but that you're really busy with your own passions - tell her you want to focus more on running, photography, programming, etc. Tell her you're trying to start a revenue-generating blog/program, decided you wanted to write more, cook more, etc.

Whatever you say, don't tell her how you really feel. Then it becomes a real shit-fest, and you might end up with some unfortunate casualties- friends might be forced to pick sides.

Drama queens thrive on attention, and she's never going to believe you anyway. When I told my friend, his response was basically well, "Oh yeah, well you DID this!" - which is all fine, and dandy, except that I didn't care.

Ignoring and letting it linger is fun for a bit because it'll pick at her and eat her up, but in the end, it just makes the problem worse- like an infected wound.
posted by unexpected at 2:25 PM on June 30

Kelly is loud and overbearing in social settings. A conversation can feel more like an argument because she will keep pushing and pushing, constantly restating her point even when you agree with her. It can feel like she's having a conversation AT you rather than with you. Also, she doesn't seem to pick up on social cues, which means you get stuck in a conversation with her. At one point, I saw someone pull a fake exit on her with a "What's that, Tom? Hang on" so he could end a conversation with Kelly (but Tom wasn't even talking!)

This is my husband (or was before we got married*). My husband has Asperger's Syndrome and his social issues result largely from this: doesn't seem to pick up on social cues.

I'm not saying this is Kelley's problem, but be aware there are more reasons to be this way than: a) is a drama queen or b) is a dick.

*He's gone through therapy to help the social issues, plus he's asked me to kick him under the table when he's gone on too long or when he gets too strident. *shrugs* It works for us.
posted by elfgirl at 2:31 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

I'll bet if you simply avoid doing things with Kelly that involve drinking alcohol, her behavior will either improve or she will not want to hang out. Then she will quit harrasing you about not hanging out with her and you won't feel guilty. Ask her to go for a bike ride or play tennis on a sunday afternoon. Tell her you are busy, but could meet for breakfast or coffee some morning at like 7am. These types of friendship "dates" tend to scare away loud party animals.
posted by pluckysparrow at 2:33 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

Ignoring and letting it linger is fun for a bit because it'll pick at her and eat her up...

This is your idea of fun?
posted by Evangeline at 2:35 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

Also, Kelly's drinking gets out of hand and it can be embarrassing to be around her. The more she drinks, the louder and needier she gets. Kelly drinks a lot.

This kind of says it all for me. Kelly's an alcoholic and it's ruining her life, driving her friends away etc. I've seen it happen way too often with people in my own life. Short of a twelve step program or some reasonable facsimile thereof, she's only likely to become less bearable.

As for what to do, I'd try to communicate the above to her sometime when she's sober, and, as I've had to do more than once, tell her you have no interest in being around her if she's drinking. PERIOD. If she blows up at you, that's her call ... but at least she'll have some relevant information to fall back on if she ever gets reflective and wonders what the hell happened to you, her former friend.

Good luck.
posted by philip-random at 2:47 PM on June 30

Ignoring and letting it linger is fun for a bit because it'll pick at her and eat her up...

This is your idea of fun?

I'm not the poster you're replying too, but I think this aspect of the ignoring/confronting debate could use some expounding:

I've done the complete cut-off to people before, when I did it, it was because they had crossed lines that cemented in my mind that I never wanted to see or hear from them ever again, even just to tell them off. In one case, it was to a selfish and needy person who was repeatedly stepping on her friends--myself included--for her own social gain, the other was a stereotypical AlphaBitch, as described in this question. In both cases--and this is important--ignoring them was a calculated act of aggression on my part.

That's right, aggression. I ignored them because I wanted to be the biggest dick I could be. I make no apologies for it now, I'm glad I did it, it achieved everything I wanted it to achieve. I never labored under some flimsy idea that I was 'sparing their feelings.' I knew the needy one would drop into a spiral of self-doubt and the AlphaBitch would see no flaws in herself, repeat the same behavior, and have to go through it again with her next batch of high turnover friends.

People know when you're ignoring or avoiding them, Kelly knows you're ignoring or avoiding her, that's why she asked "Why are you avoiding me?" You're putting her through an uncomfortable situation because you don't want to go through the uncomfortable situation of telling her off.

So do you want to maintain a civil relationship with Kelly for the sake of your mutual friends? But don't want to bring her crazy drama back into your life? That's certainly possible. When she asks "Why are you avoiding me?" You answer honestly, "Yeah, you were starting to get on my nerves, so I took some time to cool off. I'll see you at [future get-together]." If she blows up at this and starts trash talking you to your friends, you'll say, "Yeah, she was starting to get on my nerves so I took some time too cool off, and she didn't like that." Kelly will self-destruct as long as you dont fuel the fire.

If you don't want to maintain a civil relationship with Kelly, go on and ignore her, but when she trash talks to your friends saying "I asked him what was wrong and he couldn't even be bothered to reply." She's going to have a point.
posted by coryinabox at 2:50 PM on June 30 [3 favorites]

I had to let a drama queen go just this weekend, mainly because she took some totally out-of-context perceived slight that happened in the three minutes she left the dinner table Friday night to hit the restroom and wound it up so tight in her head that she felt it was worth killing the friendship.

I've known her long enough to know two things. One, she wasn't going to be interested in a conversation about what really happened and two, she was going to carry this perceived slight that caused this deep, deep wound with her and trot it out whenever it was convenient to play the victim in our friendship.

So I let her yell at me for a bit, then told her I wasn't interested in having the discussion, and it was up to her whether the past tense language she was using to describe our friendship was really where she wanted to go. I told her to think about it, but I wasn't about to let her continue on with her yelling if she wasn't interested in getting past it.

I decided that if she was intent on nailing herself to the cross, that I sure as hell wasn't going to give her the nails.

Less is more. In your case, consider what's going to happen if you try to talk to her. If she's that self-involved, she is either going to get mad or weep when you tell her she's a lousy person, and once she's through with those emotions, her need for validation will probably lead her to taking what you said to people you know, asking them, "Did you hear what anonymous said about me? What a bitch! She's so unfair, isn't she?"

Lie to her. It's-not-you-it's-me is the right play. You don't need her drama in person or in absentia. Cut it clean, and be a good person about walking away. Don't talk to mutual friends about it, because a drama queen will find out and it will come back to haunt you. Find a way to walk away, and leave that tangled mess for others to sort out.
posted by GamblingBlues at 2:51 PM on June 30

Evangeline, it's fun in a "schadenfreude" sense. It gives them a taste of their own medicine, albeit passive-aggressively. Call me a bit shallow. Although I think I make it clear that this is not a viable strategy when i say, "in the long run, this only makes the problem worse".
posted by unexpected at 3:00 PM on June 30

I think that the answer to this "should I tell him/her" question is usually "it depends". The various scenarios have been mentioned here already.

If you are truthful, are you willing to endure the probably dramafest that will ensue? If so, be honest with her.

Do you think she respects you enough to take your advise to heart, or is even in a place where she is capable of self-relexion? If so, be honest with her.

Do you feel in any way, let's say, responsible, for telling her that she is hard to get along with? If not, don't be honest with her. Just keep on ignoring.

Would you feel bad if you simply dropped contact with her without any attempt at cutting ties, but don't want to make the dramafest worse than it has to be? Then give her plausible excuses when she asks to hang out, or asks if you are avoiding her, such as "I have a lot of things going on and I'm pretty busy. Ignoring you? No, I'm just usually pretty busy." Repeat until she stops asking. Accept she will probably talk shit about you anyway, but it might not be as bad as if you had been all-out honest.

Are all avenues leading to a dead end and she just won't stop asking? Take a deep breath and be honest, because what else are you going to do?

I understand the "how will she knows until someone tells her" argument. I just don't believe that it should be just anyone who has this conversation with her. I think it's fine if you, OP, want to do it, but I don't think it's your moral obligation either. Personally, I would choose the Plausible Excuses route, leading up to the What Else Are You Going To Do option if it doesn't work, because I would feel a bit shitty if I just disappeared. But to be honest, I would start off with the truth only if she were my good, close friend.
posted by DrGirlfriend at 3:06 PM on June 30

The thing is that, if pressed for more WHY WHY WHY, you can be both honest and diplomatic. "You like to drink and party, and I don't enjoy that; you're very outgoing, and I'm very retiring, so it doesn't always feel comfortable for me to hang out with you" etc., etc.

You don't have to tell the woman she's an overbearing boor, just that her personal style doesn't mesh with yours. I mean, yeah, the reason her style doesn't mesh with yours is that her style sucks, but if I were in this position, I wouldn't want to get into that with her.
posted by Sidhedevil at 3:13 PM on June 30 [2 favorites]

Hang out with her again and call her out on her behavior. If she still does it, confront her and tell her you can't hang out with her if she's going to behave inappropriately.
posted by ishotjr at 4:14 PM on June 30

Just tell her what's bothering you or do the classic drift away if you really have no interest in being her friend.
posted by mpls2 at 4:19 PM on June 30

It gives them a taste of their own medicine, albeit passive-aggressively. Call me a bit shallow.

I never labored under some flimsy idea that I was 'sparing their feelings.' I knew the needy one would drop into a spiral of self-doubt...

Let's be clear. The OP isn't talking about someone who's slept with her boyfriend or trashed her behind her back. The friend may be a drama queen, but that doesn't mean she's an "AlphaBitch". At most, this friend dominates the conversation and embarrasses her. So where's the need to be an asshole? Why hurt this person?

I understand the need to distance yourself from this type of behavior (though again, I think the decent thing to do is to explain yourself), but I don't understand the pleasure some of the commenters seem to get in inflicting mental pain. I guess if you look at your friends as disposable commodities, you can ignore their feelings.
posted by Evangeline at 4:35 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

Do you basically like this person except for the behavior you described? If she were less dramatic in the ways you describe, but otherwise was 'Kelly', would you want to continue the friendship? It sounds like you liked her until your feelings about these behaviors got in the way. If so, isn't she worth you risking telling her the truth? Not to change her, because you can't do that (and shouldn't, even if you could), but to give her the opportunity to see herself as you, and probably some others, see her? She may or may not be ready or able do anything with it, and it's possible she'll react negatively to it, in that conversation and/or later. Your challenge would be to frame your explanation as your perceptions of her behavior, and in as undramatic a way as possible, and to not take the bait if she offers an argument. Keeping it as kind and as on track as possible and not letting the conversation get diverted in any direction will give her the best opportunity to hear what you have to say for what it is and only what it is. You seem to be caring enough to want to treat her kindly despite needing to take some distance. Best of luck if you choose that route.
posted by TruncatedTiller at 4:45 PM on June 30

Give her an answer to her question.

When people like her ask questions like that, they're counting on one of two things: either you will be too considerate of her feelings to say much, or you answer more truthfully, and she can freak out on you.

She's counting on you choosing the first option, and she knows the possible consequences of telling the truth will keep you biting your tongue.

As you see by the majority of the advice in this thread, most people opt to fade out, no explanation.

I think if more people would be honest with her, she would stop asking questions like this to others, and perhaps start asking herself some questions.

I say, be warm and blunt: You know, the thing is I don't really enjoy your company. I wasn't going to tell you, but you asked. I don't have anything against you, but I think it's better if we don't hang out.

She'll probably try to get into a argument with you, or she´ll want to know what´s wrong with her (more manipulation) but don't get involved.

When you see her around, you will no longer have to worry about if she's going to talk to you, or ask you why you haven't been around, or anything like that. If anyone asks, just shrug and say, I don't really enjoy her company.

Everyone will understand, and they will be impressed and envious that you could be so honest and are now free of her.
posted by Locochona at 4:57 PM on June 30

As elfvirl writes, there may be another explanation for her behavior. ADD? Aspergers? BPD?

The fact that she's pestering you about why you're not in touch implies that she cares about you and your friendship. Don't do her the disservice of ditching her coldly.

Maybe make a coffee or lunch date and say essentially what you said above. 'Kelly, I love x, y and z about you but sometimes those same qualities can be overbearing to me too. If you turned doen the volume a bit, it'd be easier for me. I've been avoiding you a bit because of this and I'm sorry. If there is anything I can do, please let me know.'

I am a bit Kellyish myself and if I heard this I'd be mortified for a few days but appreciative in the long run.
posted by k8t at 5:16 PM on June 30

I'm usually like "I'm a picky person, Kelly. I think we communicate in really different ways. I think you are a really awesome person but lately I haven't been that interested in keeping our friendship going. I'm sorry that this is so awkward." Or something like that.
posted by sully75 at 5:20 PM on June 30

I was in a situation like this. When my friend approached me with 'I don't know what's happened to our friendship but I don't want to lose you as a friend,' I met her for lunch and told her (tactfully) that I didn't think we were very compatible friends because of x, y, and z. The problem with having that conversation is that if she promises to mend her ways, you kinda have to stick with the friendship to see if she does (in my experience, superficial changes only - I would imagine this is generally true). Don't let yourself be manipulated into staying friends with her.
posted by katopotato at 5:41 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

You might want to read up a bit on narcisstic behavior and how drama queens deal with conflict. Once you are not "on the team" so to speak, you are the enemy. I had a friend much like Kelly and I tried to take the high road by explaining why I no longer wanted to be friends. The response was a scathing, "you're just jealous of me because I'm outgoing and have so many more friends than you do." All of the drama queens I've known believe the rest of us are there to serve their need for attention and adoration. Maybe some day she will recognize it in herself or get therapy in order to change, but IMO anything you have to say will fall on deaf ears. MKe a clean break or just fade away, but you are not obligated to spend time with someone who makes you feel like a lesser person.
posted by tamitang at 6:00 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

I really don't see any reason why you should not just be honest & frank here. Generally speaking being "busy" more often is a good strategy for when I you want to spend less time with friend, and most people would pick up on this signal and back off a bit so that either things just fade away or you adjusted to a level of friendship that you are both comfortable with--this is how healthy friendships work.

However, it sounds like that strategy is not working for you here, and so one frank conversation about how you don't want hang out with her anymore should be all it takes...and then um, don't hang out with her. Simple as that.

In any case, whatever you say or do, she's going to think what she's going to think, but I don't see why that should be your concern (you are just about to stop having her in your life after all) . You can't control her after all, so why worry about it?
posted by dyslexictraveler at 7:07 PM on June 30

The next time she asks: "I don't want to discuss it. Stop asking me about it."
The time after that: "I don't want to discuss it. I have told you that. You are refusing to respect my boundaries. Leave me alone."

After that, avoid contact. Hang with your mutual friends and if they ask why you're not friends anymore, say that you just don't get along. Repeat as necessary.
posted by kathrineg at 7:28 PM on June 30 [1 favorite]

I had a friend I dumped once. She was just a mean person and I was fed up with it. I took the cut off all contact route. I have no qualms about it, as I didn't feel it was my responsibility to educate her on her poor behavior. I would do the same thing again if I were in your position.
posted by All.star at 7:37 PM on June 30

I had a friend I dumped once. She was just a mean person and I was fed up with it.

Argh! AGAIN, this is NOT the same situation. As far as we know, the OP's friend was not "mean" and had no malicious intent. The OP is just uncomfortable around her. That's sufficient reason to distance herself but not sufficient reason to be an asshole.
posted by Evangeline at 7:44 PM on June 30

I say distance yourself and don't give her any ammunition. She doesn't sound like a terrible person, just one you would personally prefer not to hang out with.

Not the same situation, but I had a friend who used to be a lot of fun and over the last couple of years, every time I catch up with her, she complains a lot. I thought originally I was just catching her at bad times, but I ended up noticing she was negative about everything - or found reasons to complain. So she turned into a friend I used to see every couple of months to one I saw twice a year. And I thought, "Maybe if we see each other less often, we'll both have more exciting things to talk about. Less complaining." Nope, that just meant I was getting six monthly updates on her crap. Even at times when I had exciting stuff to talk about, she'd turn it into a bitchfest about things going wrong in her life.

But I don't feel like I've got any right to tell her to stop complaining. And I'm sure with friends she sees all the time she's not like that (although who knows?). But it's just too much for me to want to put myself through that anymore. But telling her that she complains too much would hurt her and who am I to decide what she complains about isn't worth it? I just don't want to be dumped on every time I see her. So I've distanced myself.
posted by crossoverman at 11:38 PM on June 30

Start an argument about this stuff. Either it will correct her behaviour, or end your friendship. Win-win! Her feelings are hurt either way - personally, being ignored is about 100x worse than being told something negative.

So, for example, she asks if you're avoiding her? Tell her yes, and tell her why. Not in general terms, but mention the last annoying/obnoxious thing she did. Or, hang out with her, and question her behaviour when she doesn't pick up on social cues or whatever.

She will, from your description, launch into a huge argument. Let it be a make or break one.
posted by molecicco at 2:30 AM on July 1

I vote for honesty. I also agree that arguing with her will bear no fruit. Just let her know the facts, and walk away.

I'd add that you might want to talk to the mutual friends about her first, but don't give much of a time lapse between those conversations, and the bomb you'll be dropping on her.
posted by Citrus at 6:27 AM on July 1

I had a friend I dumped once. She was just a mean person and I was fed up with it.

Argh! AGAIN, this is NOT the same situation. As far as we know, the OP's friend was not "mean" and had no malicious intent. The OP is just uncomfortable around her. That's sufficient reason to distance herself but not sufficient reason to be an asshole.

I didn't mean to imply that the OP's friend was mean.... it was more of a lead up to what I did when I decided to cut my friend loose.
posted by All.star at 7:28 AM on July 1 [1 favorite]

According my my ethics, you have two responsibilities here: one to yourself and one to your "friend." The one to yourself is the more important one -- your shouldn't have to go through years of torment just because you want to spare your friend's feelings.

But you can only ignore your duty to your friend if they make it impossible to do your duty to yourself. Your duty to your friend is to explain to her that you're going to distance yourself and that the breakup is permanent. Can you do this and still do take care of yourself? If so, you have to do it.

Here's an extreme example of when you don't have to give an explanation: if you have a friend who is violent, you don't need to meet with her and risk personal injury to tell her you're breaking off the friendship. In this case, your responsibility to yourself trumps your responsibility to your friend (though, perhaps, you could send your dangerous friend an email).

I don't see that being the case here. I see you wanting to save yourself discomfort at the price of forgoing your duty to your friend. Your discomfort is not a good-enough reason to be selfish.

Here's what you need to do: meet with your friend ONE MORE TIME. If you feel you can't do that, then send your friend one more email. During the final meeting, you need to make two things clear (1) you're breaking off the friendship; (2) you're not willing to discuss it or meet again. It would be nice if you give some brief reasons for the breakup, but that's not required.

After that, your obligation is over. If your friend wants to discuss it, you may say, "Sorry, I don't feel comfortable talking about this" and leave. If your friend calls or emails you, you are free to ignore her. But you owe her the respect of making your intentions clear.

I met her for lunch and told her (tactfully) that I didn't think we were very compatible friends because of x, y, and z. The problem with having that conversation is that if she promises to mend her ways, you kinda have to stick with the friendship to see if she does (in my experience, superficial changes only - I would imagine this is generally true). Don't let yourself be manipulated into staying friends with her.

This, of course, is the danger. IF you're the sort of person who is UNABLE to resist pleas and promises, you need to look out for yourself at the expense of your friend. But be certain that you're REALLY unable to resist pleas. If pleas are just uncomfortable for you, you need to have that final meeting. Then you need to be strong and follow through with your plan to cut off contact.


We have some friends in common and Kelly is the gossipy sort.

I don't see how this enters into it. If you just ignore her, she can spin that to make you look bad. If you have a final meeting with you, she can spin THAT to make you look bad.

I guess if "just cutting off contact" is the norm in your social group, doing that won't make you seem like an asshole to your friends. It does seem to be the norm for some people who are younger than me, but cutting someone off would make you look like an asshole in my book. Giving an explanation wouldn't.


And maybe she needs to know how others see her?

Treat her like an adult. She does not deserve unsolicited advice or commentary. IF she asks why you're cutting her off and you feel like telling her, then tell her. But don't just launch into an essay on her faults.
posted by grumblebee at 7:38 AM on July 1

If she already noticed that something is wrong, and she wants to know what, I think you should tell her. That at least gives her the chance to deal with it. Otherwise, she might start to obsess about it too much.
posted by Ingenting at 12:11 AM on July 3