Exorcising the Late Demon?

June 21, 2009 9:01 PM

How did you overcome a lifetime of chronic lateness?

[THE SHORT VERSION: Always late, bad at estimating time. You too? Fixed it? How??? ]

[THE LONG VERSION:]

I'm one of those people who's always late to everything. Everything. Sorry.

I've been this way as long as I can remember -- especially once I got my driver's license and was responsible for my own transportation.

I'm not (especially) disorganized, I don't get a power-high from keeping people waiting, I really do respect people's time. I have suffered personal and career consequences, as well as the internal guilt and shame I feel every time I arrive, flustered and apologetic, to a room full of frustrated faces. But I'm still late to everything. Everything.

I've tried for years and years to come up with "systems" to overcome this--all sorts of alarm clocks, beeping things, reminders, phone calls from friends, cutesy "put a dollar in a jar every time I'm late" kind of stuff--but nothing seems to work for more than a few days. I *am* capable of self-discipline but I think this issue has a different origin.

Another MeFi thread confirms the root cause of my lateness: I have a very poor internal clock. I cannot estimate how long things will take or have taken. I always think I can squeeze in one more task before I walk out the door. If I look at my watch and see there are 10 minutes before I have to leave, my brain keeps flashing "no problem, you still have 10 minutes" for the next 20--then I'm shocked when I realize the time disappeared. I am an intelligent person but cannot get over the assumption that putting on my shoes, finding my keys, locking up the house, walking to the car, putting on my seatbelt, and starting the car will all occur instantaneously and do not count towards travel time. On the rare occasion that I--through a monumental effort--manage to leave early, I am so proud of myself that I look at my watch, see all of that luxurious extra time, and say "excellent, I have plenty of time to stop for coffee on the way." And of course you know what happens next.

45 minutes ago I sat down at my computer and said to myself "I'll just take 2 minutes to write up this AskMe question before going to bed." How did I not anticipate this? It happens every time.

Even self-awareness and knowing/anticipating my own tendencies doesn't seem to help. If my instinct tells me a task will take 1 hour, I know enough to distrust that instinct and leave myself 3 hours instead. Then the task ends up taking 5.

Those of you who are NOT chronically late: I'm sure this makes no sense to you, comes off as excuse-making. I acknowledge that everything I have written is absolutely stupid. After all, the answer is simple: just leave earlier.

Unfortunately it's been decades and no amount of reasoning or concentrated effort have cured me -- I'm starting to feel that "just leave earlier" is like "just read in a straight line" to a dyslexic person.

But those of you who "get" everything I've written here: has anyone conquered It? How? Tell me everything. Details, philosophy, systems, self-flaggelation, self-help books, joining the army,therapy, whatever worked for you could work for me. This has beaten me my whole life but it hurts people and makes me look like/feel like a jerk. I'm going to conquer it in this lifetime even if it takes until I'm 90. Better late than never?

[Full-disclosure: I was diagnosed with ADD as an adult and am on medication for this. The medication helps in many ways but my time-issues have not changed at all.]

[I do oversleep but that's only a small portion of my overall lateness-habit. I appreciate alarm-clock-tricks but that's not what I'm looking for here]

Thank you

posted by anonymous to society & culture (57 comments total)

...I really do respect people's time...

I believe you may be in denial on this. You've spent your entire life putting yourself before others. Perhaps thinking of others and putting yourself in "their shoes" may help you put things in perspective.
posted by torquemaniac at 9:09 PM on June 21, 2009 [19 favorites]

I'm not perpetually late, in fact being late stresses me out so much that I tend to be early. I've even been known to cry when I knew I was running behind, but that's just how I am.

Anyway, here's how I keep track of the time-- my car clock is set about 15 minutes late, as is my alarm clock. I pay attention while on my way to work to see how long it takes me and I give myself more time than I think I'll need to get ready in the mornings. Sure a shower may only take me 20 minutes, but grabbing a bite to eat, finding clothes to wear and even the act of waking up takes me a while so I give myself more than an hour most of the time. If you are having a very difficult time, consider setting up alarms on your phone to go off when yu=ou have 15 minutes before you have to leave the house, then 10, then finally 5 minutes. Once that third alarm goes off, you must stop whatever you're doing and leave.

Those are my suggestions. Try to monitor how long different activities last so you can estimate accurately in the future.
posted by wild like kudzu at 9:13 PM on June 21, 2009

I agree with wild like kudzu about timing things. Know that it takes X minutes to drive through and get coffee, Y minutes for you to get your shoes on and out the door, etc. Just the awareness of those things has helped me with time management, but having the real numbers is great. It's hard to talk yourself out of unloading the dishwasher right now when you've timed yourself and you know it takes under 3 minutes.
One of the ways I got over frequently being late was to get comfortable being early. If I thought it would take me 10 minutes to walk to class, I'd leave 20 minutes early and bring a book. If I was wrong, I still had a good chance of making it on time. And if I was right, the worst that happened was I sat down for a couple of minutes and read my book. I've gotten to really like getting places early, avoiding the stress of constantly watching the clock to see if I'll make it in under the wire.
posted by katemonster at 9:23 PM on June 21, 2009 [4 favorites]

I used to be a chronic late person. It took being put in a position of waiting on someone a few times coupled with being left behind a few times to realize what a dick I had been. Also, when my time is money, working, and someone is late for an appointment is makes me bitter. So I decided to force myself to be on time. Until you accept that you are screwing with others time and that you are putting yourself above all else, then you will not change. Only you can make yourself change. It is not about tricks and systems. Just plan ahe4ad and be realistic about travel times.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 9:29 PM on June 21, 2009 [2 favorites]

If you have to be somewhere familiar, you know how long it takes you to get there. Add 10-15 minutes to your travel time. For example, when I have to be at the doctor's office that's 15 minutes away, I make sure to leave about a half hour before I need to be there.

I have a family member who's always 30-60 minutes late, but with her it's a power play (look at me! I'm so important that I can keep everyone from eating before I get there!). (Not accusing you of this.) We have solved the problem by simply telling her that whatever we're inviting her to starts an hour before it actually does.

If you make an appointment somewhere, let's say the doctor's, and they tell you your appointment is 1:30, write down 1:15. Then forget it's really at 1:30.

Do you have anyone living with you who is good at being on-time who can help you? I have a usually-late friend, and when I am there to hurry her along, or her husband is there to hurry her, she does a lot better job of being on time.
posted by IndigoRain at 9:37 PM on June 21, 2009

Alex?

Well I happen to know somoene who is like this and uses the same "I have 10 minutes left, so I decide to do Y and then spend 30 minutes doing it" explanation. Look, if there are 10 minutes left, just leave now. You'll be 10 minutes early, if all goes as expected. So what? When you get there, you'll have to wait 10 minutes, it's true. But deciding (knowing your history) that you would rather risk having someone else wait 30 minutes than risk waiting 10 minutes yourself is not respecting other people's time.

Also, assume something will go wrong. The following excuse:

"I had know way of knowing the subway would be delayed/there would be traffic in the middle of the day/the car would stall/the call would take so long/I would forget X and have to go back/I would spill something and have to stop to clean it up/I would get a headache and have to stop to buy tylenol/ I would get mud splashed on me and have to stop to clean it up / I would get stopped for speeding / etc. etc. "

may technically be true. You had no idea that any of those specific things will happen. However, you can assume that a sizeable proportion of the time something will cause a delay. It may take 20 minutes to get downtown under ideal circumstances, but only 20% of trips will be ideal. Something will always go wrong, so just assume that even though you don't know what it will be something will go wrong. Plan 30-40 minutes for the trip instead. And if you plan 30-40 minutes and you're ready to go 40-50 minutes ahead of time, leave then and be early.

It's basically impossible to plan to be somewhere at 12:03 (or 1:25, or 3:14 or 4:00) unless you're literally in the same building down the hall. You're always going to be either early or late, so stop trying to be on time and start trying to be early. If you wait, you wait.

And I bet your never late to things where being late has actual irrevocable consequences, so you already know how to be on time.
posted by If only I had a penguin... at 9:38 PM on June 21, 2009 [27 favorites]

Hi! You sound like me, and I have two suggestions for you:

1. This one comes from software engineering. Figure out a slop factor (the actual number is empirical) that all your estimates need to be multiplied by to make them realistic. Then just always apply that factor to your estimates. For example, when I'm estimating hours at work, I usually just double them. 4 hours of estimated work means, in reality, one whole work day. I started doing this at home (1 hour recipe? 2 hours.) and it works great.


2. This one comes from my own struggle with procrastination, and I think this is what torquemaniac is getting at. Try what I call "the attitude of the knife"*: if you're not ready for something, screw it. Call yourself done and meet the deadline. Going to be late because you haven't showered yet? Get dressed and show up. Sitting in your own funk will learn you. Task not done at work? Fire off an email with an apology and accept the consequences on time. Harsh but true. Trust me, I've been there.

*Arrakis teaches the attitude of the knife — chopping off what's incomplete and saying: "Now it's complete because it's ended here." Frank Herbert, Dune

posted by mindsound at 9:44 PM on June 21, 2009 [15 favorites]

I agree with katemonster (and on preview, iiohap). Why are you aiming at being on time? In this situation:

If I look at my watch and see there are 10 minutes before I have to leave, my brain keeps flashing "no problem, you still have 10 minutes" for the next 20--then I'm shocked when I realize the time disappeared.

You shouldn't aim to fill up the next 10 minutes exactly. You should just leave right then. Even if you were capable of managing these 10 minutes properly, this doesn't rule out unexpected traffic etc. In fact, why not aim to be (roughly) where you need to be a half hour early? I try to do this regularly with situations where it is just not possible to be late (teaching, meetings).
posted by advil at 9:46 PM on June 21, 2009 [1 favorite]

I am not always late.

I am crap at organising/estimating times. The trick is to be flaky ON YOUR OWN TIME.

1) Get used to being early. Bring a book. Be prepared to chillax a bit in a waiting room with your book.
2) Set every alarm (mental and physical) for every appointment about half an hour early.
3) Stop setting up appointments near each other until you get this issue under control.

On non-preview:

You're always going to be either early or late, so stop trying to be on time and start trying to be early.

THIS.
posted by pompomtom at 9:48 PM on June 21, 2009 [3 favorites]

How did you overcome a lifetime of chronic lateness?

I'd start by not putting a lifetime of momentum behind it. This isn't about that. This can only be about being on time or close next time.

Count me unconvinced on your analysis, simply because the level of convincing was excessive--indicating you are trying to convince yourself of its truth.

I'd suggest you explore the area around your issues surrounding success and failure.

How to cure? Purchase a small moleskein book. Take it with you. Everytime you arrive somewhere, record how early or late you are to the agreed-upon time.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:49 PM on June 21, 2009

Another MeFi thread confirms the root cause of my lateness: I have a very poor internal clock. I cannot estimate how long things will take or have taken. I always think I can squeeze in one more task before I walk out the door....On the rare occasion that I--through a monumental effort--manage to leave early, I am so proud of myself that I look at my watch, see all of that luxurious extra time, and say "excellent, I have plenty of time to stop for coffee on the way." And of course you know what happens next.

It sounds like you have an aversion to being early and waiting for other people, hence your wanting to spend that "waiting time" instead doing that one extra task or going and getting yourself coffee. Which makes you late, because you don't have as much time as you think.

Maybe the thing to work on is becoming OK with being early. Carry a book with you at all times or keep one in your car so that you have something to do those 10 minutes you are now going to spend being early waiting for other people to arrive.

[on preview: looks like I am not the only one with this idea]
posted by hurdy gurdy girl at 9:50 PM on June 21, 2009

You're not respecting other people's time. You might want to. It might not be a power trip. But always being late means that you prioritize taking those extra 10 minutes and doing one last thing more than being on time. You need to accept this, because you are completely and utterly fooling yourself about this. You do not care if other people wait for you because you see "10 minutes before I have to leave to be just barely on time" and you think "well, it would waste my time to be *early*, so I'll just do stuff" and you're late, and you are wasting other people's time.

I'm being harsh here, because I think that you can't get anywhere if you pretend. I believe it's not a power trip, it's not malicious, etc. I assume that it is not what I have found about myself, which is that I am incapable of being on time when I am depressed.

If your friends are willing, have them leave without you when you are late. A few times like that and I suspect you'd be on time. Or if your friends would sometimes be very late to meet you, without you knowing when.

Otherwise, yeah, intend to be everywhere early. Figure out how much late you usually are, then just plan to get there that much earlier. I do one of those "make the appointment early" for one of my friends occasionally and it pisses me off: I shouldn't need to play stupid games for someone else. I've decided it's worth is, but it irritates anyhow.
posted by jeather at 9:57 PM on June 21, 2009 [5 favorites]

Stop trying to squeeze in that last activity. This bites me in the butt almost every single morning when I sit down to read mefi when I eat breakfast. I think, "Well I don't have to leave for another 5 minutes, so I'll just read this post and then go..." and then suddenly it's 15 minutes later. Once you're aware you're going to have to leave soon don't start anything new. In fact, if you can immediately just stop what you're doing that would be best. Don't let the "I have to leave soon" thought leave your head for even a second.

It also helps me to have something to look forward to during the trip. I don't have a problem being late when I know I'll have fun in the car, listening to my favorite talk show or singing along to something. If you don't drive, maybe find a good podcast that you only listen to when you're going somewhere -- and stop immediately when you get to your destination.
posted by lilac girl at 9:58 PM on June 21, 2009 [1 favorite]

The spare 10 minutes is not free. That 10 minutes accounts for all the things that might happen on the way to your appointment. Mistaking this buffer for free time that you can reallocate is a fundamental mistake.
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 9:59 PM on June 21, 2009 [5 favorites]

Make yourself a list of standard travel times. If I want to get to work at 7, I have to leave the house by 6:15. Call it 6, for unexpected traffic or whatever. Write that down.

To leave the house at 6, I have to be up by 5:30 at the latest, and that's a total stressful panic rush. Say, 5 for comfort, so I can have a cup of coffee and be at peace. Set the alarm for 4:51 - that's ONE snooze button.

Then, DO THAT. Do not let your mind talk you into deviating from the plan - your mind will be wrong and make you late.

Extend that example to all your other deadlines. Calculate ahead when you have to do stuff, and do not allow yourself to make deviations from the plan on the fly.
posted by ctmf at 10:03 PM on June 21, 2009 [2 favorites]

I reached a realization a few years ago when I was chronically late for hanging out with a certain friend: doing a small task that takes between 10 and 20 minutes suddenly seems much more attractive when I think I can do it right before leaving somewhere. Do I do this task after I get up on a day off? No. Do I do it after I get home from work? No. Do I do it before I go to sleep? No. But if I have to leave to go somewhere in 10 minutes, and ideally the task would take me 10 minutes to complete (though in practice more like 15-20), well suddenly I think to myself that I can "squeeze" it in. I think the attraction to this distorted time-management is that I don't have to schedule time for the task, that it's "free" time since I have to leave immediately after it.

But as someone noted above, there are many elements of the day that take time that you wouldn't necessarily schedule for; sure, it takes you 15 minutes to drive to work, but what if it takes you a solid 3 or 4 minutes just to find a parking spot and walk from your car to your desk? You have to find a space for that time or you'll be considered late.

So, as someone said above, don't try to be on time. Try to be early.
posted by malapropist at 10:11 PM on June 21, 2009 [3 favorites]

You can be my friend if you want, my internal clock is poor too. We can meet and give each other relaxed 2-hour time frame:)
Just kidding:)
I don't have a solution for our problem, and it really can be a problem, but it may be comforting for you to know that you are not alone.
Here are some articles: article1, article2.
posted by leigh1 at 10:13 PM on June 21, 2009 [1 favorite]

I was chronically late until I was around 30. I failed classes and lost jobs because of it. I, too, have a really bad internal clock, and I still get bogged down in things that "will only take a minute", but I'm mostly on time for things that involve other people now.

What changed? I think it was, first and foremost, suddenly realizing that I was taking someone else's time when I was late (which is my main motivator to be on time now), coupled with a job that I dearly wanted to keep after a long and difficult period of unemployment having a zero-tolerance policy on tardiness. To get to work at 6am, in another city and using public transit, I had to learn how long it took me to do everything. It was stressful, but I learned the habit of keeping track of those things and it helped a lot.

There are two things I would recommend -
Time your regular trips, including time to get out of the house - know exactly how long it takes to get to work, or band practice, or whatever, and also how long with traffic. You also need to know if you normally spend 15 minutes just gathering up your stuff and "just doing that one last little thing" (which is what always gets me). Do this regularly. If you're like me you'll have to do it a lot because you'll forget how long things take.
ALWAYS keep the other person in the forefront of your mind. Imagine them being stressed out and rushing to meet you and you being 30 minutes late - I hate rushing, so I hate to think of someone else rushing, especially if there's no point to it because there's no one there to meet them. If it's work, imagine how you'd feel if you lost your job because of being late (the class I failed was with a teacher who didn't care that I was late until one day he kicked me out of his class - it could happen).

I really hope this helps. Believe me, if I can be almost always on time now, so can you. And, fwiw, I think that my problem wasn't so much thinking other people's time was less important than mine as not realizing that other people had a different relationship with time than I did, and therefore not realizing how much I was putting them out.
posted by smartyboots at 10:31 PM on June 21, 2009 [3 favorites]

Sidetrack - torquemaniac:
I've had the same proposition put to me, with additions such as -
"Well you'd never miss a plane would you?"

Why uh, yes. Yes I would, have. This is just stuff that directly harms me only:
National & international flights (and it's not like I've been on many of the latter).
Buses, boats & trains.
Paid concerts/movies/appointments, any and every event I am going to by myself.
(My gift-vouchers always expire too :P).

I can't think of one single thing that I've never been late for.

Now, I am far FAR less late for social engagements than I am to my 'own' things, because I feel so mortified about running late. I often spend money I can't afford on last minute taxis so no one knows just how late I was running.

And yet I still tell my friends to please lie to me on occasion and tell me something is starting say, 30-60 minutes earlier than it is, so I don't hold anyone up (and that I won't be put out).

And yet I still use to bow out of too many social engagements right from scratch, because I can't take the stress of the usual absolute panic to get there, and then the prospect of disappointing people and feeling guilty and ashamed (I've also cried when running late, and so during more emotionally fragile periods of my life, it was the major reason for my not going to social things).

And even though I've tried things like, even when I'm too late for a party or occasion to join in (that no one is relying on me for), I've walk there anyway, and then turn around and go home, because I didn't want being late to be some kind of subconscious ploy to get out of the effort. Well, I did this for several months - to no effect).


Not everyone procrastinates/is late for the same reasons (and yes, I have met the selfish late types you speak of - I was horrified at the thought that that might be my motivation, but, for reasons above and others, I don't think it is, so will have to take a different tack), so with that out of the way, maybe we can come up with some solutions...


So, you saw from the above I don't have this problem licked either. But some suggestions:
* I have a phone with beepy calender reminders for everything (better would be if I could set *multiple alarms* for everything)
* This syncs up with Google Calendar, which I enter in most all events from my email, having this as a 'trusted system' means I don't mind slowly typing in extra events directly to my phone
* I have as the 'time I'm thinking of' - not the time of the appt, not the time I leave the building, but the time I have to *start getting ready to leave*. Because otherwise, subconsciously, I don't do anything til the time in my head.
* A lot of the public transport websites have a journey calculator, which tells you how long it takes to get from A to D, including walking time. I look it up even when walking, because my internal clock is SO, FAR, OFF.
* I ask people around me how long they thing something will take - the journey etc. (It goes against years of me thinking I'm 'smart enough to work around it', but now I just go with the assumption I'm, in practice, brain-damaged in this area)
* Time sense exercise pdf here
* I set many of my activities to rely on other people - often, I have people come pick me up (I try to pay the social balance in other ways), or meet me (eg I'll go do my work at the library or cafe, meet me there before we go to *blah*!), or have one activity lead onto another somehow.
* It helps when I can buddy up or have a person relying on me - eg, I started getting up at the same time as a housemate so we could both leave for work together. He *could not* run late, so if he didn't knock on my door before my alarm went off, I was up and off waking him up so he wouldn't be late - ironic! But it gave me the urgency to get up right away since he depended on me too, and I couldn't hold him up. It meant I was getting to work an hour earlier than I needed too, but at least I was consistent and not late! Now, he doesn't work in the mornings, so I'm screwed again. It's the principle here, not the application that might help.
Of course, if it's not the mutually symbiotic relationship like above, and they're just relying on *me*, then I'll feel terrible when I inevitably screw it up.
* I can't have too much free time before my destination - I cannot do any sidetasks. I either get out of the house in 30 minutes in the morning, or it takes me 2 hrs. I don't understand, but I no longer try for anything longer than 30 minutes.
* Follow-on - I'm not allowed to stop, or do any errands 'on my way' somewhere. I am not allowed to stop if I am, or think I will be, running late. I have to write this down.
* Practice stopping in the middle of tasks, like half way through a sentence. An inability to put things down does contribute. At least with me - being responsible is not finishing the thing I'm doing if it means I'm late for the next thing.
* I always carry a book or projecty thing, so that if I get somewhere early, I can reward myself by having something fun to do. Because I *have* that option, I often try to get places 30 minutes 'early' - which doesn't work well in practice, but I'm so proud of myself when it does. This is part of it relates to - you're probably running start time + travel timeminuspersonal divisable + your-personal-variable late. Again, my brain doesn't seem to get travel-time, or buses-not-running-on-time lee-way, but most of your events will be within a certain radius, and travel time. So if you try and run early by some fixed amount, then that can work. Kinda.
But you can NOT tell yourself that you are running early! Just tell yourself that is the new starttime.
I have a poor memory, so sometimes I've subtracted 30 minutes twice, but, eh, who cares.

All the last tricks will sound silly to others, or obvious, but really - they don't work so well in practice. Because despite prior evidence, the heaps-of-additional-time estimate feels like a ridiculous lie or a make-believe time, and it doesn't really take that long, does it? And well, it doesn't, but my head is out of wack too, and if I waited for the internal 'it's time to go now', then I'm late for everything, always.

It's like putting your hand in hot water doesn't cause a 'pull out!' reflex, or it feels only warm when apparently it's nearly scalding, and it's the sort of thing you can consciously be aware of, and try to consciously compensate for, but it's awkward, and when it's every minute of every day, you get tired and forget, and - meh, sorry for being a whiner. :P

I'm making it sound like a big problem just because it's a big problem for me, but apparently it's not a great problem, most of the population seems to have it figured, we're just in that 5th percent and lower quartile. :P

I'm sure if I ever finally get the system sorted, I won't understand why it was such a trial. :P
posted by Elysum at 11:00 PM on June 21, 2009 [8 favorites]

Log everything. The time you get up. The time you leave the house. The time you get to work. Every "event" log the time. For weeks.

Next time you're wondering how long something will take, don't guess. Look it up in your log. Most people do very few things in any given day that they haven't done many times before.

Bonus: just the act of observing how long the same things take over and over will calibrate your internal clock. The rest of us weren't born with accurate internal clocks and time estimation abilities either. It's a learned skill.
posted by ctmf at 11:19 PM on June 21, 2009 [1 favorite]

You need a reason to be early. When you think 'I just have time to..' you don't. Get up and go as soon as you have that thought, because it's an utter killer.

It sounds like you've always got something to do before you leave; I'm the same. Do as much prep work as you can beforehand. Get your work clothes ready the night before, set them out, and put them on as soon as you can after you wake up. Put your shoes on well before you need to leave - even your coat, if you need that extra push.

Don't fill up your car in the morning on the way there; fill it up at a scheduled time after work every week, so you always have fuel. Make a routine of it.

Give yourself a reward that you're *only* allowed to do when you're early - a book you've been really wanting to read; a new album you want to listen to; a journal, so you can write your blog posts up before you post them. Whatever it is, you're only allowed to do it in that time you're there early and waiting for everybody else.

You may also benefit from a work-process; time management of some sort. Many people swear by Getting Things Done; I've found Time Management for System Adminstrators very useful personally.

If metafilter in the morning is a killer, then be brutal; add it to the scheduled blacklist on your router, and stop yourself going entirely in the morning. Sometimes it's the only way.

Have I solved my chronic lateness problem? No. I've mitigated it somewhat, and the things above are ones that have helped me, and when I stop doing them, my lateness comes back with a vengeance. My biggest problem is getting absorbed in something, and not realising how late it's getting, so my other half has carte blanche to tell me 'to stop doing that, and get on with this other thing'.

I need to leave for work in an hour, to be there in an hour and a half. I'm going to finish getting ready now, and as soon as I am, I'm leaving.
posted by ArkhanJG at 11:42 PM on June 21, 2009

I really do respect people's time.

Your behavior shows the opposite. I say this as someone who is reformed from chronic lateness. If this was occasional, your friends and family would probably not think about it. If it's a constant, then many of them probably do think that you are rude, self-absorbed or disrespectful. It may not be your intent, but it is the result. Stopping for coffee is more important to you than meeting your friend when you promised. Sorry about the tough love, but your behavior is detrimental to other people. When you own that, you can take responsibility.

You mentioned that you are a bad estimator of time. So was I. How much effort have you put into learning to correctly estimate? Start by keeping notes on how long tasks take. If I want to visit a friend who lives about 2 miles away, it takes about 30 minutes. What? Leaving the house takes me about 15 minutes (find keys, brush hair, bathroom, fill a water bottle, feed cat, put on shoes). Driving may take 10 minutes + parking + walking to house. I know those things because I tracked my time leaks for several weeks. Within a month I went from being sucky at estimating to reasonably good. Before keeping track of this, I would have guessed 10 minutes of driving and missed estimating the other 20 minutes.

I'm also ADD and time management can be a challenge. Try hard to observe how long things take. Commit to improving your estimating.
posted by 26.2 at 11:53 PM on June 21, 2009 [2 favorites]

Hopping on the second ArkhanJG's comment that Getting Things Done might help. I often find myself arriving late because it's "Still too early to leave" and I randomly remember something I need to get done that SHOULD be quick. Of course, the task is never quick, but I feel the desperate need to complete it then because I fear that I'll forget the task completely otherwise.

Once you invest yourself in a system whereby you know that you'll better getting everything done (without forgetting any important tasks), there's nothing else that want to fill that tricksy "it's still-10-minutes-too-early-to-leave" gap.

...At least, it's worked for me. Good luck!
posted by samthemander at 12:05 AM on June 22, 2009

Apart from the ADD, I could have written this question. I've always been late to everything; school, work, appointments, social outings. I'm the frantic person dashing from one end of the airport to the other at a full run, and I even missed a plane on one occasion. Like you, I finally figured out that it was caused by having no clue how long it takes me to do anything. I say "I'll just do this one thing before I go" when I've got to leave in 5 minutes, and that one thing always seems to take me 15 minutes.

I don't have it licked. Not even close. But here's one thing that's helped me: try to completely forget about what time you have to be there, and focus on what time you have to leave. As long as I'm thinking I have to be there at noon, I can tell myself there's time for one more thing because it's not noon yet, or it's okay if I get going a minute or two late because I can just make up for it by driving faster. If I just tell myself I have to leave at 11:30, I have a much better chance of actually getting there on time.

...you know, as long as I can find my keys and wallet and cell phone, and remembered to print out directions ahead of time, and don't need to take out the trash on the way out the door, etc. etc. etc.
posted by tomatofruit at 12:21 AM on June 22, 2009

I realise I misunderstood the 10 minutes -- the poster is saying that if they think they are 10 minutes ahead, they spend that 10 minutes.

Poster, do you have a chronic urge to keep busy? Maybe it would be nice for you to think "wow, I'm 10 minutes ahead, if I can just stay on schedule I'll have 10 minutes of peace and quiet to prepare when I get there."
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 12:22 AM on June 22, 2009

I had similar issues in my 20s. It's only been the past few years that I've been able to abolish my tardiness. So it can totally be done. And when you do it you will feel far less stressed, and far less guilty and generally in more control of your time.

It looks like there's a ton of advice in this thread so I'm just going to give you a couple hacks:
- Being late makes you look like a passive aggressive douche. Visualize that douche. Do not become him.
- I use the timer on my iPhone a lot. Establish a set time for yourself before you begin the task and when the timer goes off you are done. Pencils down, turn in your test, etc. Don't ignore the clock.
- not everything needs to be perfect. Learn accept a tolerable level of incompleteness and then move on to the next task.
- If you need extra time to meet someone, etc. then identify the need well before the arranged time and notify them asap. You'd be surprised how forgiving people can be if you let them know you'll be 15 minutes late. But you have to let them know!
- leave way earlier than you think you should for something but bring a book to keep you occupied while you wait. This will give you 5 or 10 minutes of something to do while you're waiting around for the other person. (note: this actually feels refreshing).

If you're knocking your head against the wall and you simply can't ever be on time then consider moving to a country/culture where this behavior is acceptable. I hear they are quite ok with tardiness in South America - but maybe this is a fantasy of mine . . . a mythical place where late comers live in exile and happiness.
posted by quadog at 1:01 AM on June 22, 2009 [2 favorites]

As a latester myself, I've read up on this a good bit and have thought about it a lot. The issue I keep seeing come up, and which resonates with me, is that it can be a control issue. YMMV. I too am tempted to say that I have problems estimating time, but in my case I think that's an attempted cop out. There's just something too irrationally persistent and inexplicably consistent about my refusal to change in this regard despite having identified the pattern and the negative consequences and the really simple corrective path to take. You seem to be similarly baffled at your inability to break the pattern. That smells strongly of neurosis for both of us and not some hazy time-judgment defect.

I know that I've always had some resentment about work, for example, about submitting to arbitrary unearned authority and having unavoidable obligations to do things I don't like. It's a childish thing ultimately and has been with me strongly since I was a child, but there it is. I want to do what I want, I feel I deserve to do what I want, and for lack of more adult terms, I get sulky and agitated when I'm forced to do something else instead. I loathe feeling like someone is controlling me, or that I'm not in control of my life as my prime slips away. So I know that being late to work every day is about that. I resent that time thief and rebel against it in a petty way. I "fool" myself into thinking I've got time to lay in bed and read for a while longer and still shower, dress and make it on time. But part of me knows that's a self snowjob even as it's happening - and I do it anyway. Just like you and your coffee stop. You doublethink on that - you know you don't have time and simultaneously "believe" that you do. I think we know what's happening. It's like picking a scab. You know you shouldn't do it, and that it causes minor damage, but you do it anyway and it's satisfying, like scratching an itch, even if it makes you bleed. The key for us is to identify the cause of the itch.

Speaking of work, I should have gone to bed a long time ago, but here I still sit, once again ruining my chance at a good night's sleep. This happens 19 out of 20 nights, me on the computer till the wee hours. It was stuuuuupid of me to sit here ruminating on this question for an amount of time I'm too embarrassed to admit. Just turn the computer off, self, just do it. No, don't wanna. Why not? This one is fairly conscious for me now, having identified it and analyzed it enough in recent years. I know that as soon as I go to bed, time evaporates and I'm waking for work before I know it. I have to go spend the bulk of my day doing something I don't want to do. Since I feel my time/life is being stolen from me, I try to stretch out the personal part of my day as long as possible to maximize the amount of my time/life that I'm in control of. So resentment is driving me ultimately to sabotage myself through an irrational act of delay. It's screwed up and I need to find a way to reshuffle my perspective there, but I at least understand its cause.

But that's why I remain puzzled about being late for personal fun things like dinner with a friend or getting to the game before it starts, or useful things like getting to the store before it closes or showing up to the doctor on time. There's no resentment there. There's no struggle for control, no feeling of stolen time, no itch. I like the people involved and want to do those things. I may even be the person to suggest dinner and set the meeting time, but still I sabotage myself and show up late. Why? Again the temptation is to say I can't judge time, but that's a cop out and sidesteps an easy solution. I've been aware of my tardiness flaw for most of my life, enough to talk about it at length like this, and I could therefore just plan to show up everywhere 30 minutes early to compensate for that known quantity. But despite being aware of my problem, and the unwavering, consistent, entirely predictable outcome, I push it every time and lose almost every time. Then I feel horrible and guilty and anxious about it.

Something's going on there. I'm trying to get something for myself by engaging in that squinty doublethink and letting the late-making behavior play out when I could stop it. But I'm not sure what it is I'm trying to get, at least not in non-work scenarios. Yet I have a feeling that both the work and non-work lateness must be related and must be driven by the same thing deep down.

Btw, I think that the issue of not respecting other people's time, while a legitimate point, will not likely form the basis of your solution. When you're making the bad time choices, it's not a lack of respect that's motivating you. It's something else, something active, and I think it's more than just prioritizing yourself over others. You are fooling yourself in some way for some fundamental reason, and I bet it's the same one each time. When you act on that mystery motivation and indulge in some personal task that makes you late, there can then be a side effect of wasting other people's time, a passive thing that can effectively be portrayed as a lack of respect. But that really only becomes visible in the post-game analysis. It's a side issue. It's just another reason to feel bad after you've screwed up. But feeling bad hasn't gotten you anywhere yet, so I'm not sure that trying to embrace that guilt more acutely will be what does it for you. The key is to determine the active motivation that's at work right when you make the bad time choice, before there are any side effects.

Why do we keep doing this? We hate it. It makes us feel bad. It's a stressor. But we keep doing it. Do we get something out of feeling bad? Is it some kind of self-flagellation we feel we deserve? Do we get satisfaction from that pain? Do we revel in the uncertainty and challenge of the sprint to try to still make it on time? I don't know. I would just encourage you to dig a bit deeper and not write it off as merely a quirk. If your attempts to solve it in a commonsense way never work, consider that it's not the commonsense issue it may appear to be. Look, I made it all the way to the end of this long answer before suggesting... THERAPY. Ha ha, got you! (If you're late to therapy, you can just say, "See? That's what I'm talking about!")
posted by kookoobirdz at 1:13 AM on June 22, 2009 [9 favorites]

I keep a book in my purse. During the summer, I leave my apartment at good 20 minutes before the bus will arrive and sometimes I catch the one that's a half hour earlier, but only on a good day. The book saves me. If I'm close to finishing my first book, I pack a second. I got a purse especially big enough to do this, and it isn't as big as the messenger bag I was lugging around previously.

I head to the bus stop, I sit in the sun or shade, depending, and read and smoke. Considering my university campus is smoke-free, this is an amazing time for me. It's quiet, and I don't have to deal with other people.

As a result, and thanks to my local library, I've gotten to read a lot of Scalzi and Stross. They're both MeFites and I've enjoyed their books.
posted by lilywing13 at 1:44 AM on June 22, 2009

Also, I used to be late some and my ex still is a lot, especially with dropping off or picking up the kids. It's excruciating at times, if there's any other extra scheduling to keep in mind. But, he's always late, or weirdly early. I'm forgiving with the time window, but man, there's nothing that'll throw off your entire day than that. Having to reschedule around someone else is just plainly annoying, so just be considerate and take a book.
posted by lilywing13 at 1:48 AM on June 22, 2009

In another mood, or a few years ago, I would have written the same post as kookoobirdz.

The thing we definately share in common, is that we analyse the crap out of it.

But...
Keep digging? When we've been digging for how long now? I started deciding that I was just digging myself into a hole, that doing the 'research' was just another source of procrastination.

I mean, there's things I can come up with nice theories that fit, eg 'I resent my work'. But if that were true, then why am I late for my OWN things, FUN things, by exactly the same variable margin?
If you can't find any evidence in your behaviour, then you're just caught up in (god I hate the phrase) analysis-paralysis.
The only pattern I really notice for myself is,
Other people? Yes = less late.

And that makes sense. But, I've talked with my therapist, and decided researching, analysing, was just procrastinating and digging a hole. I've read enough that if there's stuff I should do, I probably know it already, and can adapt it as needed.

If you are going to go down the digging route, there are actually two ways that can be useful. If you analyse out-loud, to another person, who can call you on your bullshit/well-meaning confusion, or if you *write it down*.
Don't think, write. It's much more obvious when you are going around and around in circles, and your brain is less likely to worry at it like a terrier.

Also, you can be more productive - think of what has just gone wrong, isolate the problem, either by the chain of events that let to the screw up, and then brainstorm solutions at different points in the chain, or phrase it as a 3 sentence maximum, non-annoying ask Mefi-Question to yourself, and then brainstorm solutions to your own problem. One small specific issue at a time.
posted by Elysum at 1:49 AM on June 22, 2009

Yet I have a feeling that both the work and non-work lateness must be related and must be driven by the same thing deep down.

This ties in to Elysum's comment.

You've trained yourself to be late. The ultimate cause may very well be resentment about external forces, but the part of you that keeps (or fails to keep) time doesn't distinguish, and makes you late for everything.

So I think kookoobird and Elysum can both be right: the root cause is a need for autonomy, but the cure is to modify the behaviour and thinking around all timekeeping things.
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 2:01 AM on June 22, 2009

nthing comments about if there are 10 minutes before you have to leave, just leave.

I have a good friend who is also chronically late. His intentions are not to waste others' time, but everyone is annoyed with him constantly. He also doesn't seem to get that even though his plan isn't to be disrespectful, that's how everyone perceives it. Start surprising people with your earliness by assuming you have to be there 30 minutes before you are scheduled. Things rarely go exactly as planned, so if you plan to be 30 minutes early, maybe you'll only be 15 minutes early. Being the first one to arrive is never a bad thing. Also, the waiting around may make you start to realize how much of a pain it can be to have to wait for others to show up, and it will put your previous late self into perspective.
posted by King Bee at 4:11 AM on June 22, 2009

I wish I could favourite tourquemaniac's answer more than once. Once you start really seeing how much being late is really selfish and devaluing the people forced to wait you will (hopefully) make a more concerted effort and retrain yourself to be on time, or even better, early.

Good luck.
posted by gwenlister at 4:28 AM on June 22, 2009 [1 favorite]

I come at this from the other end--always being too early, to the point that someone being five minutes late used to make me furious. Longer than that left me bereft--"the cheese stands alone" feeling. I had perfect attendance and punctuality as a child, yet I came from a chaotic home where nothing happened on time, and my siblings and I were often left waiting. I recognized this when I made adult friends later on who were also obsessively on time--people with "the cheese stands alone" childhoods.

Being excessively punctual brings about many rewards on the job front but is too hard on friends and family. And it was making me miserable and angry. I reframed the whole waiting experience. I adopted a 20-minute rule for everyone outside of work and stopped thinking of the 20-minute window as lateness. After that I would leave without guilt or anger. That sorted out people pretty fast. I finally ditched completely and forever the narcissistic late-every-time people--"My presence is so important, everybody has to wait for me." I realized they were problem friends in many other areas of our relationship.

Hate to tell you, but you are borderline that self-absorbed kind of person. Your coffee getting, Mefi checking, last minute, lateness causing behaviors say that. You do not respect people's time, only your own. You must face that and possibly go to a therapist to find out what hang-ups are making you destroy jobs and take advantage of friendships. The fact that you're asking for help keeps you from total arrogance.

There are tons of great tips on this board. If you are committed to change, start, TODAY, with a new mantra. "Oh, I have another ten minutes. No I don't." Period. If you can't do that, then call the therapist ASAP.

Second thing is have your own 20-minute rule. Bring a book, iphone, "blankie" item to occupy yourself and get to places 20-minutes early. Reframe this as a gift of private time and not somebody else's waiting time.

Third. Tell the friends you do have, whose time you "think" you respect, that you are trying to change. Ask them to leave without you as well as give you fake deadlines.

After that, try some of the fantastic systems people have given you to figure out how long things take if that is indeed the root of the problem. Good luck.
posted by Elsie at 4:37 AM on June 22, 2009 [2 favorites]

Once I learned how to knit socks I loooved getting places early. Not that I think you have to knit socks, but I agree with others that you need to look at those spare 10 minutes as a reward once you're there not something to fill before you go.

I would recommend knitting socks as they are so portable and addicting.
posted by like_neon at 5:25 AM on June 22, 2009

Simple things that has always helped me: Think of thing in blocks of time, and define that the smallest possible block of time is 15 minutes. It takes at least 15 minutes to do anything. If it takes more than 15 minutes, then it's at least 30 mins. More than 30 mins, then it's at least 45 mins, and so on.

Let's say your morning routine looks like this:

* Shower = 10 mins
* Hair and teeth = 5 mins
* Breakfast = 15 mins
* Commute = 20 mins

Now it looks like this:

* Shower = 15 mins
* Hair and teeth = 15 mins
* Breakfast = 30 mins
* Commute = 30 mins

Where previously you'd expect this to take 50 mins, now it takes 90 mins. This means you have to get started earlier. If you're expecting 90 mins and it really does takes only 50 mins, then you have 30 mins as a buffer.

Wait, you say. 90 - 50 is 40, but you said I have only 30 as a buffer? Yes, because remember, your base time unit is 15 mins, and it works in both directions -- if you think you have 40 mins of slack, you budget only 30 mins.

Do this and you will *always* be early and ready to go for everything.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 5:49 AM on June 22, 2009 [5 favorites]

I know exactly what you mean. Word for word.

I haven't beaten my lateness habit yet but sometimes I can keep it at bay.

I'm going to go out on a limb and give you some counter-intuitive advice that contradicts against what a lot of others have said.

DON'T set your clocks forward.
DON'T plan to be 30 minutes early
DON'T ask people to tell you the appointment is x minutes earlier than it is.

All of this contributes to your fuzzy sense of time. It gives you a false sense of security, a false belief that there is no urgency, because there's plenty of cushion built-in. It tempts you to push the limit, because it's not really a limit at all.

You've already stated that if there's cushion time, you will take advantage of it, squander it, and run late anyway. You can't fool yourself -- your mind will always say "I know that I don't really need to leave by this time, I can afford a few extra minutes."

Instead, you need to figure out what is the hard limit, the *absolute last minute* and work from there.

For a week or two (or longer) do the following:

1.) Look at your watch at the moment you step outside your house
2.) Look at your watch at the moment you arrive/check-in at your destination (not when you park or walk in the door -- but the moment the people who are expecting you consider you to have arrived)
3.) Keep a log where you write these times down and calculate the durations.
4.) Do this for enough days that you account for some normal variations in traffic, stoplights, random everyday delays, etc.
4.) After many days of this, look over you data. Find the "threshold minute" -- if I walk out the door after this minute, I am always late. If I leave before this minute, I am always on time. Hone it down to ONE precise minute, don't give yourself a range, don't "err the early side to be safe." If your brain knows you've left ANY wiggle room, you will constantly be tempted to push that extra minute or two. (And you know that extra minute or two really becomes 5 or 10).
5.) Set your watch/phone alarm to beep 5 minutes before that time, 2 minutes before that time, and on that time.

* 5 minute beep = "drop EVERYTHING and start moving towards the door."
* 2-minute beep = "I can't believe you haven't dropped everything already, but you're absolutely screwed if you don't get out NOW!"
* On-the-minute beep = "as of this moment, you are inevitably late. again. no amount of optimism, luck, or fortuitous traffic patterns will get you there on time. jerk."

For me, putting it in concrete terms like this is MUCH more helpful than trying to trick myself into leaving early with a fuzzy time that I know is somewhat flexible.

For the naysayers -- I know this does not account for exceptional delays -- the construction detour, traffic accident, flat tire, etc. But if the poster is like me, it's far too easy to say "there probably won't be a traffic accident today so I can dip into that cushion time..." You have to take baby steps. If the poster follows my advice, he will be punctual most of the time, which is much better than never. Once he gets in the habit of general punctuality, he can begin working on that next step.
posted by Alabaster at 5:52 AM on June 22, 2009 [3 favorites]

I know some folks who beat the lateness issue (combined with the need to get things done) by not only bringing books or things to keep themselves busy, but small laptops/netbooks or iPhone/Android devices.

Get to the place of the meet early and come prepared to (if necessary) do short interruptable tasks on whatever computing platform you require to get those tasks done.

Like a lot of folks have said so far, it does eventually come down to a respect issue. You pay lipservice to respecting other folks' time, but it really doesn't show, and appearances really matter in this kind of situation.
posted by kalessin at 6:04 AM on June 22, 2009

I'd suspect that if the root cause is simply a poor sense of time, the solution would be several buzzing alarms as others have suggested. I lose track of time when I'm working, so I set little alarms on my computer. But since this seems to be an intractable problem with you, I'd wonder if there's some reason that your unconscious resists changing.

I learned at some point (cognitive behavioral therapy, maybe) that every seemingly unhealthy pattern has a "reason" it persists. This theory would suggest that you're benefiting from your lateness in some unconscious way. I'm not saying this is definitely true for you, but it's a way to consider unconscious motivators beneath seemingly counter-productive behaviors.

Some possible ways a pesky unconscious could *want* its human to be always rushed and late (just brainstorming here, not saying any of this is what your brain is saying):

"I have so much to do! Always running running running! I must be very important!"

"Oooo, drama! Driving fast! Feeling adrenaline! Anxious and rushed! Life would be so boring without this!"

"I am a loser and will always be a loser. If I didn't screw up so much, I'd have to redefine myself. I don't like change. I am a loser."

"I'm challenged in a special way! If I didn't have this problem, I wouldn't be special anymore."

A similar approach is to think, "What would my life be like without this behavior? What would I *lose*?"

Again, I'm just brainstorming, not saying any of this is what's going on. But this kind of analysis has helped me become more patient with myself and change some long-standing behavior (in my case, "I have to do *everything*! People are such slackers! I am a bravely suffering martyr!").
posted by PatoPata at 6:46 AM on June 22, 2009 [1 favorite]

I used to have this problem, too, thanks to a poor internal clock (which was thanks to ADD). Advice to emphasize #1: "time your tasks", but with a little twist. For a few days (or a couple of weeks) try this exercise: make a to-do list of everything you plan to do--shower, brush your teeth, empty the dishwasher, take out the trash--everything. Estimate how much time it will take to do those things. Write all this down. Then, as you do the tasks, write how long it actually takes. Not only will you start developing an internal clock, you'll see how your faulty one runs (for me, I overestimated unpleasant tasks and underestimated pleasant ones, surprise surprise).

Once I did that, I had a better sense of time, but I was still running late. Why? Advice to emphasize #2: it is next to impossible to be exactly on time, so don't try. Get there early. For me, I aim for 15 minutes early which usually gets me there 5 minutes early.

Once I did that, I found I was still running late. Why? Advice to emphasize 3#: mitigate your fear of being early. Mine was social anxiety related. I was afraid of any awkward conversations/encounters that might happen before the outing/appointment/whatever began. So, if I arrived somewhere early that made me uncomfortable, I found a quiet "alone" place--my car in the parking lot, a park bench, etc.--and read the book I always carried around anyway. Sometimes, to avoid looking creepy before a party, I'd actually pull my car around to the next block to wait and read (which, actually, probably looks more creepy, but I'm ok with it).

I guess the overarching advice here is to stop thinking of it as this huge, complete, powerful fault. Take it easy on yourself. Then take the problem apart and tinker with the parts that aren't working until they do.

Epilogue: once you start getting places early, you get addicted to that sense of peace and self-esteem boost.
posted by Tall Telephone Pea at 6:51 AM on June 22, 2009 [1 favorite]

I use my kitchen timer a lot. It needs to have an hour button (so you can set longer times quickly) and be really annoying. Ideally two timers as well. You would not believe how many times it goes off and I barely remember why I set it an hour ago.
posted by smackfu at 7:03 AM on June 22, 2009

Everyone's advice is good but I'd like to point out that when you do start showing up on time, you shouldn't start telling everyone how stressful it is for you to be punctual.
posted by jon_kill at 7:31 AM on June 22, 2009 [1 favorite]

Therapy really is the only way you're going to get to the root cause of your issues of procrastination and chronic lateness. You may have developed a pattern of this very early on as a defense or something, it could have been from something totally arbitrary, but once it stuck, it's just stuck. Just exploring it may free up some of the issues around it and may lead to the root cause. Also, as someone who really tries not to be late and is pretty reliable around time ( and I don't mean this as a guilt trip) but it is really annoying to be friends or work with someone who has these issues. Other people like myself get caught in the role of 'covering' for the other person in one way or another, to the point where I just keep my distance from people like this because it's really about trust and respect.
posted by Rocket26 at 7:59 AM on June 22, 2009

I don't think you need therapy for chronic lateness. Just realize it is a form of self-absorption and leave 30 minutes before you have to.
posted by heather-b at 8:01 AM on June 22, 2009

I don't mean to sound like the "I can't" echo you've had in your head for the past lifetime, but after trying a...z to solve this problem, maybe it would be helpful to just submit, to accept that you can't solve it and this is just the way you are?

You're what's known in Myers-Briggs topology as a P-type, or perceiver:

Perceiving Characteristics

Plan on-the-go.

Naturally tolerant of time pressure; work best close to the deadlines.

Instinctively avoid commitments (I'll be there at 6pm!) which interfere with flexibility, freedom and variety.

Of all of the people I know like you, none has solved it, never, ever.

Each of them, at one point or another, has tried every gimmick mentioned above and then some.

That said, one of my friends has made some headway by making himself understand that "Time is much more important to other people than it is to me."

He was always trying to solve the problem from the "him" perspective (the alarms, the setting clocks forward, the this, the that) and then he switched to the "them" perspective and it helped.

He still doesn't completely understand the feelings other people have re: punctuality (although he knows they feel terribly about his being constantly late), but he gets there on time (ok, for the most part). Now he's only 20 minutes late instead of an hour.

Note the "naturally tolerant of time pressure" for your personality type. Those of us that are always on time are not tolerant of time pressure. It really, really stresses us out to not be on time. And when other people are not on time, it makes us feel just as bad.

Once he understood the effect he was having ON OTHER PEOPLE–that his tardiness was abusive to his friendships, colleagues, relationships–he changed for the better.

Once he understood that his feelings of embarrassment were nothing compared to the stress and anger others felt, he changed for the better.

Once he understood how his tardiness ruined just about every event he was invited to (or was required to attend), he changed for the better.

He changed because he realized how THEY felt.

He's also started being upfront with people about his time commitments. He doesn't say I'll be there by 6pm. He says I'll be there sometime between 6 and 7pm. That helps "them", but also gives him wiggle room to be even later ("Oooh, it's just 6:53, I have 7 minutes!"). This helps because is establishes a soft expectation, not a firm "I will be on time" expectation (which, for Americans, is implicit**).

All of that said, relax. If there are people in your life that have known you for a long time, they already know you're going to be late.

--

**Ask just about any person from a different culture (except for perhaps the Chinese), and they'll tell you the one characteristic of Americans that stands out above all the others is their industriousness, how they get things done, how they do stuff immediately, how they don't waste time, how time is important to them. Try going to Italy and getting out a restaurant in less than 2 hours. It's not going to happen. Try asking someone in Saudi Arabia to meet you at a café at noon. If they're on time, you should not believe it is them. Middle Easterners are notoriously late, never on time. Try going to Brazil. On time? Ha ha ha ha, no? And Hawai'i, just trying to push people to go faster will make them go slower. If you think you have problems, ask someone on an H1B visa what it's like to live here. Most of their negatives will be about time and pace. All that said, if this is really bothering you as much as you say, maybe it's time to move to a different country or culture, one that respects the present more than the future.
posted by foooooogasm at 8:02 AM on June 22, 2009 [4 favorites]

Being late to work is one thing. But being late to most everything else gives you an air of sophistication. Enjoy it. You're really being too hard on yourself.

It's really not that big a deal to most people if you are late to non-work-related like a party or a game or dinner or something like that. It's really THEIR hang-up if they are. They're control freaks, anal-rententives, sheep. You are a perfectly normal, laid-back individual- and you also have a life.

Stop beating yourself up.
posted by Zambrano at 8:49 AM on June 22, 2009 [1 favorite]

I just wanted to add that possibly your chronic lateness is benefiting you by giving you the motivation you need to get moving. Especially from the ADD, your brain may be bad at regulating behavior, such as thinking of consequences, and acting accordingly. By leaving at the last minute, you put yourself in a mindset of stress, which increases adrenaline, and can help get you out the door or on to the next task.
posted by dormouse at 8:50 AM on June 22, 2009 [1 favorite]

But being late to most everything else gives you an air of sophistication.

I promise you, most people in the United States will not think you are sophisticated if you keep them waiting. They will think that you are a jerk.
posted by decathecting at 10:02 AM on June 22, 2009 [3 favorites]

As the wife of a man who has no concept whatsoever of linear time (he recognizes daylight and darkness, but that's about it), I have to say that I find it infuriating when he is perpetually late for things I want to do, but is hustling me out the door when it's things *he* wants to do. Is there a hint of that in your post? Do you feel that you're on other people's timetables when you have to meet them at the time *they* say?

I've given up asking for rides to the doctor or dentist, because he will leave the house at the precise moment he has calculated will get us there on the dot of the appointment. If we were making the same journey at 4 a.m. With no traffic, or traffic signals. Via helicopter.

One thing I've done with moderate success is to tell him to meet me half an hour earlier than I intend to get there. That way, I arrive just about the same time he does, and nobody is irritated. (I realize you can't do this with movies, work, or appointments, but it definitely works for vaguer meetings like dinner or drinks.)
posted by vickyverky at 10:24 AM on June 22, 2009 [1 favorite]

I cannot estimate how long things will take or have taken. ... 45 minutes ago I sat down at my computer and said to myself "I'll just take 2 minutes to write up this AskMe question before going to bed."

Do you see what you're doing here? You're saying, "I realize that I have no ability to estimate how long a task will take... so just now I tried to estimate how long a task will take."

If you can't do it, STOP TRYING. (Actually, you can keep trying, just to see if you can improve, but only do that when the task is not important.)

I am not chronically late, but I have a worthless temporary memory. For years, I "dealt" with it the way you have. On the one hand, I would say, "I can't remember anything!" while, on the other hand, I would continue trying to remember things. I think I did this because I didn't want to totally admit I was "crippled." That felt like giving up.

Eventually, I owned the fact that "trying to remember things" didn't work for someone like me, and I started writing down lists. The truth is, I AM crippled and I need a crutch. It doesn't matter whether or not that's giving up. It's what I need to do!

So -- right now -- STOP ESTIMATING LENGTHS OF TIME. Just stop.

Next time you sit down to write a MeFi post before bed, say to yourself, "I'm tired and should get to bed soon, but I'm choosing to post on MeFi before I go to bed, and I have NO IDEA how long that will take. By making this choice, I am knowingly engaging in an activity that might keep me up all night. That seems unlikely, but since I'm not capable of estimating lengths of time, who knows?"

Next time a friend asks you to come over for dinner at six, do one of two things:

1) Leave NOW. Even if's only 2pm and he lives five minutes away. You may wind up sitting in your car for a long time, but at least you'll be on time.

2) Tell your friend that you'll try to come but he shouldn't count on you.

Until you find a way to estimate time better, you have no more honorable choices. DON'T tell your friend that you'll definitely be there on time -- even if it feels like you will have no problem doing so. You WILL have a problem doing so. You have admitted that you can't estimate time.

Okay, now that you are clear with yourself that you have a disability, start looking for crutches. A crutch will be of no help if you don't admit you need it. Admit you need it, quit trying to deal without it. Find it and use it.

I can't tell my left from my right just by sensing it, the way most people can. So I use a crutch. There's a little freckle on my left hand, and I reference that when someone says "turn left." I don't admit that I have a problem and try sensing it anyway. I accept the fact that I am unable to figure out directions without help and I get help. That's not giving up. That's being smart. In any case, it's what I need to do.

As other people have suggested, start keeping a log. Write down timings. Other people don't need to do this, but you do. Sorry.

Once you've logged how long it take to drive to work in slow traffic and fast traffic, there's no longer any guessing involved. How soon can you get to work? Don't estimate, even if you're SURE you get it now. Check your notes. Always check your notes.

If you're going somewhere new and you've never logged about it before, they admit the truth: you have no idea how long it will take you to get there. You will know the second time you try to go. This time is for logging.

And the process for going to a friend's house doesn't begin when you think it begins. It begins when you start your car. If it's five-thirty and you start to leave, but first you stop and put some clothes in the dryer, say to yourself, "I have chosen to stop the activity called going-to-my-friend's-house. I am not multitasking. I am totally stopping that activity and doing something else instead."

And when you drive you your friends house, you're not allowed to make a "quick stop" to drop off some videos without saying, I am no longer going to my friend's house. I am quitting that and dropping off videos instead, and who knows how long that will take?

Multitasking is an illusion. You can only do one thing at a time, and while you're doing that thing, that's what you're doing. You're not making a side-track. You're switching activities.
posted by grumblebee at 10:29 AM on June 22, 2009 [2 favorites]

If you have any anxiety orders, depression, or OCD tendencies, or even sleep disorders, they can exacerbate lateness. I know that in my case, if I realize I'm going to be a little late, I start panicking and telling myself what a screw-up I am. Once that gets going, it's not just a question of getting out of the house but of defeating the disordered thinking that my anxiety and depression cause. Which takes time, making me later yet... Some mental health conditions can leave you feeling low-energy, which in my case leaves me unmotivated and unable to start things, and it also means it takes longer to get regular things done and I end up late even when I plan ahead. Such disorders can also make you more ambivalent about getting things done: in some cases, I'm late because I had to struggle against the depression-born conviction that there's no point to spending time with people, since they probably don't care about me much, and really, crying in bed would be a much more rewarding activity than going to a party. Sometime I'll actually go to a party and turn around when I reach it, both embarassed by my obvious tardiness and convinced by my depression that it's pointless to go there to begin with.

I'm nowhere near solving my habitual lateness, but I've at least learned that in my case, things that treat my mental health issues can help mitigate the lateness. They don't solve it, but when treatments are working well, it's harder to end up in a vicious cycle where being late triggers emotional problems which make me later yet. You'll still need to fight your tardiness using some of the methods mentioned above, of course, but eliminating external factors that can exacerbate yoaur late-ness is important too.

Obviously, if you haven't noticed any patterns where emotions affect your tardiness, and if you have no reason to believe that you have depression or anxiety or a sleep disorder, these suggestions might be less valuable. If the mental processes I described above sound somewhat familiar, however, or if you've realized there are patterns between tardiness and mood in your past behaviour, you can talk to a therapist and figure out how to deal with whatever mental and emotional stuff that's exacerbating your tardiness.
posted by ubersturm at 12:27 PM on June 22, 2009

I reckon I'm late because I tell people what they want to hear - "I'll just be 5 minutes", instead of thinking "they'll be less annoyed if they know beforehand they have to wait 10 minutes". It's not an easy habit to change when under pressure. It is sometimes awkward socially and professionally, but then being compulsive about being on time would be worse. It's a balance thing for me.
posted by mdoar at 2:32 PM on June 22, 2009

My mom got me this book (which she also read herself) called Never Be Late Again. It's very interesting. Not condescending at all. Helps you figure out why you're late and how to overcome it.
posted by radioamy at 6:52 PM on June 22, 2009

Could it be that being late isn't your problem, but being early is???

That's sort of how I feel. Seeing I have 10 minutes left, I don't want to leave yet, cause I don't want to be there sitting and waiting for 5 minutes watching other people casually walk in. I feel like I want to get there right at that moment it's starting. Just don't like sitting around bored when I'm too early....

Or also, there's the "fashionably late" reason... sometimes, you just feel cooler showing up late ;)
posted by 0217174 at 3:22 PM on June 29, 2009

1. There is nothing wrong with being late to a social event such as a party as long as you aren't keeping people waiting. The only problem there is you might miss the good food, or somebody you were hoping to see at the event may have left already.

2. People who actually think your lateness is due to your not respecting them are the ones who need to get over themselves. Not you. You are at worst, too absorbed in the moment or too mentally disorganized. You are not selfish.

I mean, after all, these people are trying to tell you, "I make it on time every day to work because I think about respecting my boss's feelings?"....I mean, sure you'd hold the door for your boss as a matter of general respect even though you don't respect him as a person. But to think about your boss all morning long, because how else could you be on time, would be hard to do unless you not only respected him but genuinely felt sorry for him if you were late. And that's hard to do unless you really like your boss.

3. How normal people manage to be on time has always baffled me. I figure either they are robots, or else they live by themselves, have very little to do to get ready, and are morning people to boot. Try not to be friends with anybody who doesn't have a bit of craziness at home.

4. Good luck with getting your life together.
posted by serena15221 at 10:26 PM on July 1, 2009

Depending on your theory-nerd factor, you could treat "getting somewhere at a certain time" as a project, and apply critical chain project management methods.
posted by ctmf at 11:13 AM on July 3, 2009

For every person who is judgmental and who thinks it's about power, control, or disrespect, let me just say that I struggle horribly with time. I also struggle with social anxiety. I grew up in a family where being late was the norm. If you have a friend who's chronically late, try saying "Jane, I need you to be on time for the concert/flight/appointment, and if you're late, I'll have to leave/ be seated without you", "Jane, how can I help you be prompt for this event? It's really important to me, and I'd like to help you be there on time" and "Jane, thanks so much for getting here promptly; I know it's hard. It's so nice to see you."

There are lots of areas in which I excel. I do my best to be good to my friends in many ways. Missing sleep, being ill, family crises or being stressed can throw my life way out of whack. I hate inconveniencing people. It's not a moral issue.
posted by theora55 at 7:50 AM on August 3, 2009