Kitty needs a friend?

May 16, 2008 12:45 PM

Do I get a second cat (long details inside)?

I am thinking of getting a companion for PointyCat (mentioned previously). I have a few questions and would appreciate advice.

-I live in a large 1 BR apartment (landlord is good friend and cat lover so no issues there) - is this enough space for 2 cats?
-I have one really great convenient spot for the large litterbox, but finding a spot for a second box is a challenge. Is a seond box strictly necessary?
-PointyCat was 13 months old when I got him a year ago, and neutered at time of adoption. At first he had some serious dominance agression issues but he has mellowed into a very good cat with affection and training. He still nips, but it's mostly boisterous and not angry.
-I share a back deck with a neighbor (who rarely uses it). Back deck has wood lattice-like, high fence so cat and I can hang out there together (he can see through the slats to the outside but can't get out and I don't let him out unattended anyway). PointyCat met NeighborCat there (a female) and loved her (it was not mutual though he stares longingly up at her window) and when strays or ferals come up near the fence, if they are toms and/or aggressive, PointyCat gets hissy but for gentle ones, he's all curious and friendly.
-If I do decide to get a new kitty, is there such thing as a trial adoption in case they don't get along?

Apoligies for being so lengthy and thanks in advance!

posted by pointystick to Pets & Animals (20 answers total)

From my personal experience:

- large 1BR apt is probably large enough. I've done so with two cats myself (about 650 sq. ft.)
- I've never had more than 1 litter box for my 2 cats, and they haven't been crapping or peeing in any weird places at all. You just have to change it more often.
- Pointycat probably will not like Newcat at first (might actually *hate* newcat) but they will learn to at least get along, if not love each other. They will play together eventually.
- Pointycat might start spraying your furniture.

IANAVeterinarian.
posted by jabberjaw at 12:56 PM on May 16, 2008

Cats don't really need roommates. It depends on the cats involved but it can sometimes take months for cats to come around to each other. I have two cats that I adopted that lived together since kittens. They tolerate each other but it isn't like they hang out and about once a year they have a knock-down drag-out fight with flying where they aren't play fighting like they do the rest of the time.

Having the second cat will provide you with hours of entertainment like PointyCat does. Each cat has a different personality and so if you get a second cat, you'll get a second set of quirks and personality traits that both you and PointyCat will need to get used to.

When we added a second cat my family when I was a kid, the older cat went into a serious bout of depression since she was used to getting 100% of the attention. So if you get a second cat, make sure that -- at least to PointyCat -- he is still the center of the universe.

You can't really "try out" cat adoptions. If you get another cat, you should be prepared to keep it.
posted by birdherder at 12:59 PM on May 16, 2008

Your space - yes, it sounds fine.

One litter box - depends on the cats. It helps to be scrupulous about scooping.

Dominance issues - the cats will work it out without your help, although you should be vigilant at first if they really seem antagonistic to each other.

Trial adoption - yes, generally shelters will take back an animal if it doesn't work out. Good ones will try their best to match you with an animal so it doesn't happen, but it's not unheard of.

Really, it all depends on the cats involved. Could you ask your neighbor to bring their cat for a visit, just to see how PointyCat will react with another cat on his turf?
posted by SuperSquirrel at 1:00 PM on May 16, 2008

Regarding your first two questions:

I have 2 cats who are almost 13 years old. In that time I have lived in everything from a 1-bedroom apt (approx 720 sq. ft) to a 3-bedroom house (approx. 1380 sq. ft), with various sized domiciles in between. I really can't think of any time where the size of my apt/house has ever made any difference to my cats. More space simply means greater variety of places to sleep, but they don't really seem to care how many options they have.

I have always had 2 litterboxes, on the advice of my vet when I got the cats, and most conventional wisdom (though I have seen people disagree with this on AskMe). My litterboxes are right next to each other--is this not an option for you?

Can't help with the socializing stuff, as my cats are from the same litter. Sorry :(
posted by DiscourseMarker at 1:03 PM on May 16, 2008

Space-wise, my two do fine in 450 sq ft. Common wisdom and my experience agree that a neutered male and a female will get along better than any other pair. My two girls, gotten many years apart, loathe each other, while my eldest didn't mind the big old orange boy my last roommate had. A lot of it is age/personality/compatibility, though.

And even though they hate each other, my eldest is much less neurotic when there's another critter around. I think two is just better.
posted by restless_nomad at 1:05 PM on May 16, 2008

Adult cats generally have a hard time getting on with other cats they haven’t known since kittenhood, especially males, so there’s a fair chance this isn’t going to work out, especially if it's another male. It sounds like Pointycat gets on better with females so you probbaly want to factor that into any new cat specifications.

Regarding the possibility Pointycat might start spraying your furniture, remember that all males can do this if they feel territorially threatened – even neutered cats, which was a bit fo a surprise to me.
posted by Artw at 1:07 PM on May 16, 2008

Has your cat interacted with any other cats recently?

We got a "companion" cat (male) a couple years after getting our first cat (female), and they definitely never become companions. The older cat skulked out in the basement and avoiding being in the same room as the new cat.

On the other hand, since then the companion cat has died, and we got two new kittens -- brother and sister -- at the same time. They play with each other and get along fine, and the older cat doesn't seem to mind them that much since they bother each other and leave her alone.

Point being, cats can get along just fine on their own, and in some cases might prefer being that way, especially in such a small space and with limited attention to go around.
posted by puffin at 1:07 PM on May 16, 2008

Response by poster: Birdherder - I was curious as to whether this was something shelters did or even recommended. I hope it didn't come across like I would dump a cat who didn't work out. (eek!Just wasn't sure what the protocol was - is it better to keep 2 that don't get along, find another home for one, or just don't get two in the first place?

DiscourseMarker - have 2 side by side might work, but they would be smaller. Wasn't sure if that was preferable. I am very scrupulous scooper too!

SuperSquirrel - I might but NeighborCat doesn't like other cats. I might have a friend bring a visitor, though. That's a good idea.

Puffin- I brought PointyCat to visit a friend's cats once last year (neut. males) He did ok, not awful. Other cats were more cranky I think.

Thanks so far everyone, input helps, more advice is welcome!
posted by pointystick at 1:13 PM on May 16, 2008

I got a kitten as my second cat, and it has worked out just fine. First cat was scared at first (!), then curious. Now they play together, eat together, and curl up together to sleep.

I agree that it's better to get an older cat from a shelter (as they are harder to place), but I was terrified of it not working out as I knew I could never take a cat back to the shelter, and I would be stuck with years of catfights in my tiny apartment. So a shelter kitten might be an option for you. Otherwise, shelter staff should be able to advise on an older cat that can handle company, which leaves only PointyCat as the unknown quantity.

Good luck!
posted by different at 1:27 PM on May 16, 2008

PointyCat has met my cats (neutered males), as pointystick mentioned above; plus, he's visited when my boys have been closed off in the bedroom. He's a very confident and curious cat and has become a real sweetie over the past year. [Even when my Abyssinian backed PointyCat into a corner and lectured him severely on some topic of cat importance, PointyCat was a gentleman .] I haven't taken one of my boys over to visit PC on his own turf, although I think he'd prefer a girl roommate so am not sure whether his reaction to neutered males with whose scent he is familiar would be a decent indicator.

FWIW, I have two boxes just because I happen to have two bathrooms, but my upstairs neighbor has two cats and one box.
posted by catlet at 1:33 PM on May 16, 2008 [1 favorite]

Here is my experience:

Situation 1 - Had an older female cat, got a female kitten. Older cat didn't like kitten for a couple weeks, but then they were practically lovers, sleeping together and licking each other all the time.

Situation 2 - Older female cat went away with her owner (ex bf's cat) and left younger female cat alone. Younger female cat is on her own for several months (and by now is about 1.5 years old) until stray male kitten is brought in. They don't get along for a couple weeks then they settle into tolerating (but not really loving) each other. I think the issue is that the female cat is more skittish and doesn't really like hanging around a lot of people whereas the male cat is pretty dominant and likes to be the center of attention.

Moral of the story (based on this and previous posters' experiences): Gender doesn't really matter. Personality does.

Also - read up on introducing cats to one another when they'll be living together. This could be a factor in how well they get along. Most people will suggest keeping the cats apart mostly with supervised play until they get used to the other cat's scent and being around.
posted by pontouf at 1:42 PM on May 16, 2008

In my own experience, it's easier for two cats of the opposite sex to get along with one another. You probably want a young, female cat or kitten with a calm and sociable temperament.

If you live in a 1-bedroom apartment, it really really helps to have a cat tree or kitty condo to take advantage of vertical space and give the cats something to climb and scratch. I've known two-cat families that live happily in studio apartments and the kitty condo is crucial.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 1:55 PM on May 16, 2008

I have two cats and we've recently moved into a place less than 400 sq ft and they are fine (although it helps that they are old and don't run around so much). One litter box, but a big one scooped regularly. My girl cat was a little over a year when I got my boy cat as a kitten. She hated him for the first month or so, but then they became good friends.
posted by kimdog at 2:13 PM on May 16, 2008

We have two cats and one litter box here, and it's ok. No personal experience on the personality conflicts, as our two are from the same litter and get on well, and I've never had two cats before. I will say that my aunt always has four or so cats (in a huge house), bringing in a new one when one dies. The new cats have varied; young, old, male, female, and there are definately conflicts and allegiances. The only pattern to them however, is the temperament of the individual cat - mean cat = no friends. If you can find another cat as laid back as PC, it sounds like you should be fine. I think you should try it, two is different and better somehow.

I also wanted to take this opportunity to say that PointyCat sounds like an admirable and awesome cat and I wish him all the best!
posted by crabintheocean at 2:29 PM on May 16, 2008

I don't know, introducing cats can be a problem but if they DO get a long it will be one of the best things you could ever do for your cat. Cats CAN be alone, but in my experience they don't really like it. If they have someone to hang around they like, they're more stable, less clingy, and less mischievous.
posted by Anonymous at 3:18 PM on May 16, 2008

I wonder if you could take him to pick out his new friend?
(I've known cats that would be down with that and currently own one that definitely wouldn't. He would just hate the place and anyone he met there. And be dirty with me when the pair of us got home... ALONE!)

I can't see why any sensible person wouldn't let you see how it goes. (It's not like you want to see if your two massive dogs would like a kitty). And he does sound friendly (um.. that is a friendly kitty you got there!) so you are just being responsible and cautious.

The litter tray will only be an issue if he doesn't want to share. This might just be an initial thing 'til order is re-established if he even cares at all. My two are litter-mates so they squabble about everything else but.. although they do lie in wait to pounce on each other on the way out. If they didn't HAVE to love each other there would probably be trouble. She is fastidiously and anally clean whereas he is (literally) What-a-mess the cat.

The thing is - you just don't know until you try it. Kitties that like to play are more inclined to be accepting or interested in such an arrangement. (If he's gazing wistfully at the kitty across the way, I'd say your chances are good).

Oh! And have a read of this helpful stuff. (Warning- their illustrative kitty pictures are pretty cute!)

posted by mu~ha~ha~ha~har at 3:20 PM on May 16, 2008

Best answer: -is this enough space for 2 cats?
Yup, should be.

-Is a seond box strictly necessary?
No. Growing up, we had as many as 4 cats using the same box, and no spraying. The only time we had spraying was when we adopted a cat who liked to spray. A separate litterbox made no difference, she just liked to pee on things. Personality. Sheesh.

-PointyCat was 13 months old . . . had some serious dominance agression issues
Our Kitty was the same way! Very very bitey, would NOT take kindly to a firm "no". Actually would put his ears all the way back and try to jump up and slap my face. Once he got a "little sister", his attitude towards us changed 100%. It was nothing short of miraculous. We think he had just been bored, and that had been making him cranky.

PointyCat gets hissy but for gentle ones, he's all curious and friendly.
It sounds like your cat is already ideally attuned to the potential introduction of another cat. Most cats will be super cranky all the time with every other cat. The fact that he's curious is a good sign.

-If I do decide to get a new kitty, is there such thing as a trial adoption in case they don't get along?

Not that I know of. But most cats will learn to tolerate each other very well if you introduce them properly, which takes about a week.

1) close New Cat up in a room by herself for two whole days. Old Cat will sniff around and growl and viciously hate on you. Give him whatever he needs - be it personal space or extra luvin.
2) Time to make your next move. Rub washcloths all over either cat. At feeding time, place New Cat's washcloth under Old Cat's feeding dish. Old Cat may refuse to eat at first. That's fine. Keep doing this until he eats. Let him take a few days if he needs to.
3) Place Old Cat's feeding dish, still with the washcloth, in sight of New Cat's door. Not too close. (Do the same with New Cat. they will sense each other's presence.) Again, keep it there till he eats from it.
4) Move Old Cat's and New Cat's feeding dishes right next to the door, on opposite sides.
5) Get a large obstacle such as a tall gate or a door screen ($38 at Home Depot) that the cats can see and hear through but not cross. Place it in the door and let curiosity take its course. Growling should be less by now.
6) Remove screen. Don't worry if they still look mad, are growling, slap at each other, etc. They're trying to establish dominance. The important thing is that they both now know the other is no threat.

We didn't even have to do step 6 because we had used a smaller screen, since our New Cat was a little kitten and couldn't jump that high. Old Cat, however, had completely gotten over his anger by then and was so curious that he decided he was ready to meet New Cat and jumped it. (I doubt this would have been a good thing if New Cat were invading Old Cat's territory instead).

It is so hard to wait an entire week for them to meet, but I've had such wonderful results with this method. Old Cat went from Day 1: attacking us when we drew near, hissing and biting and growling at us, to Day 6: a sweet acceptance of New Cat once he realized she wasn't a threat. They're good friends now and play and cuddle all the time.

Getting cats of different ages might also help avert issues; kittens naturally accept older cat's dominance, whereas there may be some more issues if you get an adult cat.
posted by GardenGal at 3:26 PM on May 16, 2008 [3 favorites]

Response by poster: OK, checking in again - so much useful advice! (and additional advice or anecdotes are still very welcome!). MeFites seriously are awesome.

I saw a kitty today on the local shelter site who does well with other kitties but alas, there is a setback! The handyman for my building called and he discovered a leak behind a wall and the wall is being ripped out tomorrow. Even I know better than to bring a new pet into a construction zone. The good news is handyman is a volunteer at the pet rescue so I can ask him for advice too.
posted by pointystick at 3:43 PM on May 16, 2008

I have had experience with shelters that allow you to foster a cat before adopting. Even if it's not a policy, if you ask about it they may be accommodating.

GardenGal gives good advice about the socializing. Don't get discouraged if they don't warm up to each other very quickly. Even if they're never best buddies, it's better for them to have company. Both times that I've had occasion to introduce a second cat (once bringing a kitten to live with a 4 year old, and once bringing a ~1 year old to live with a 4 year old), the original cat has been sullen at first, but then grudgingly accepted the presence of the other. The second of those two pairs still don't overtly like each other; however, though Older Cat would never admit it, she likes having Younger Cat around.
posted by Commander Rachek at 4:03 PM on May 16, 2008

Coming in late here..

but I wonder if they might get along because they are still young.

Back in about '02, my family got its first cat, Nimbus. He was about 2 months old. Several months later, they got Peter, who was 3-4 months old. So Nimbus was already a little older, entrenched in the house, very dominant, and very hostile.. but still something of a kid.

In a few months, they were very friendly with each other. Now, years later, you'd have a tough time thinking they weren't brothers (-from-another-mother).

I am sure that your mileage will vary here, as the cats' personalities will be unique.. but I noticed my situation was very similar to yours now (fairly young cat already at home). Good luck and have fun :3
posted by crunch buttsteak at 7:49 AM on May 19, 2008