Should I go to grad school for my Msc in International Relations?
May 13, 2008 5:46 PM   Subscribe

Ok here's my deal. I graduated with a degree in PolySci 5 years ago and have since worked in sales in the corporate sector. About a year ago I came to the conclusion that this wasn't for me long term, began volunteering in international development locally (and really enjoyed it) and started the process of applying to graduate programs in International Relations this past fall. I've been accepted to my top choices (average schools, not Tufts, Harvard etc) and I am sitting here looking at my acceptance letters and having a bit of a tough time deciding whether to go or not... the overall student loan debt that I'd face (of $50K max) is scaring me...should money make the decision for me?
posted by inight33 to Education (20 answers total) 1 user marked this as a favorite
 
You mean you're wondering if $50K is worth the educational investment? And the potential of doing work for the rest of your life in a field that you actually love and excel at?

Sure it is.
posted by jabberjaw at 6:05 PM on May 13, 2008 [1 favorite]


First I'll say that as a poor grad student I feel your pain about debt, but unless the difference between schools is really dramatic ($25 vs. $50), I'd choose my school based on a variety of factors. (a $40K student loan is much the same as a $50K, once you're out of the program and on your way, and to me the difference wouldn't be worth suffering through a sub-par program). My method for gauging these "other factors" takes a lot of time and is probably only for obsessively list-making people like myself, but here goes...

First look at the requirements of each program and how stringent they are (how much they have you jump through hoops to graduate). That kind of thing can really make you loathe a program in the long term. Rate the schools 1-10.

Secondly I'd look at all the courses. A really great course that you're interested in taking scores a 10. One you think will probably suck gets a 1. Get an average per school.

Rate the schools 1-10 based on how much debt you'd be accruing: most debt=1, least=10.

Rate the schools based on location and weather. You may not think this is important, but I made my college decision based solely on money and academics and I tell ya, long grey winters can really suck. If I could do it again and still have met my husband, I'd have gone with my second choice, a U.California school, instead.

Add a bonus point here and there for things like the school's prestige (which goes a long, long way in the job market), proximity to family (if this is a plus for you), accessibility of public transportation, especially low cost of living, things like that.

Make a chart and put together all these numbers. Figure out which schools rank fairly low and which rank high overall. Yes it's fairly arbitrary, but it might help you sort out some of the different factors that go into making a decision like this.

It also might help if you tell us the schools you're deciding between: I'd bet other MeFites might have good observations about grad programs there.
posted by GardenGal at 6:09 PM on May 13, 2008


I see that some of the answers to your last question on the topic already asked this, but it's still not clear to me: What do you want to do with this degree? What career path is it preparing you for?

Taking on massive debt (or any debt, really) for a graduate program is usually a bad idea, with the exception of professional degrees that lead directly to employment. I don't know poli-sci or IR very well personally, so I can't say for sure that this degree doesn't lead directly into a new career track, one that the degree is a necessary qualification for – but some of your previous question's answers indicate that this is unlikely. So maybe you should skip it and just pursue employment in your chosen field. Do all the openings that are closely related to your interests really require this training, or is there another way into work that interests you?

Before even considering taking on the debt, at least, be sure you have a good answer to the question of what this Master's degree is going to do for you and why it is necessary. Even fully-funded graduate programs require a student to have a very clear sense of the degree's goal and purpose; taking on debt to make it through a graduate program is not the best way to find out whether a field is for you.
posted by RogerB at 6:34 PM on May 13, 2008


a $40K student loan is much the same as a $50K, once you're out of the program and on your way

I disagree. That's a 20% difference. If the schools are comparable, that should be a no-brainer (assuming all else is equal, which of course it never really is). In real life things are more complicated, but too many people take on huge student debt, figuring that it'll work out ok in the end, and in doing so they constrain their future options. I'm not saying don't take on debt -- but be very, very aware of the consequences of doing so.

should money make the decision for me?

Yes, for a professional master's program, in large part. It's an investment in your future earning potential; if the debt is $50k but you will only earn $20/month extra, that would be a pretty bad deal. If the future earnings you can expect, plus your happiness at having those opportunities, are worth the cost, then go for it.

So be realistic about where graduates from those programs are ending up. If you are 100% certain that you want to work for one of the big NGOs, then make sure you are picking a program that has connections into those organizations. Ditto multilateral aid organizations, or wherever you are wanting to go. Different schools offer different sets of connections, via professors and alumni networks, plus internships and other programs; make sure you are picking one that matches your interests very, very closely.

If you can't articulate your career goals that specifically, I'd suggest delaying grad school for a year or two until you can. It's too expensive, and too much work, to go in unfocused and confused.

And, have you talked with people in the kinds of jobs to which you aspire? What sorts of graduate degrees do they suggest? General ones like international relations? Or more focused ones like public health, planning, and management? Make sure you are starting from the end goal, and working backwards to see where you should start, rather than picking a starting point and hoping things will work out somehow.

Lastly, have you asked the DGS of each program to which you have been admitted, explicitly and in so many words, if there are any scholarships, TA-ships, tuition remissions, or other funding sources they could give you? If you don't ask, the answer is guaranteed to be "no"; by asking, you could get a very happy surprise.
posted by Forktine at 6:46 PM on May 13, 2008


Response by poster: Apologies for my inexperience here, as I failed to post follow-up information to my initial question from last Fall.

Anyways, in broad terms you could say that I am interested in International Development...and to be a bit more specific topics like FDI and Microfinance. To me it seems as though most positions in the field require (or are aided by) an advanced degree, but there may be some opportunities for this with simply a BA.

In terms of the actual programs, I am deciding between Suffolk Univ and Umass-B. I recognize that they aren't the most prestigious programs in the world but were most accessible to me on an academic and financial level. The loan debt I mentioned would be a combination of remaining undergrad debt and the cost to cover grad school tuition/fees.
posted by inight33 at 6:56 PM on May 13, 2008


I do political science. I would pay for a master's in political science in only two scenarios.

First, if I were a good undergraduate student from an unremarkable school, such that a bit of polishing might make me much more competitive at top-10 PhD programs.

Second, if I already had a job such that getting an MA in anything vaguely relevant would mean I get a raise.

You don't seem to meet either, so I wouldn't pay.

Otherwise:

I second RogerB and Forktine. Why do you want an MA in IR? What do you think it will get you? What do you mean when you say that you want to "do" IR? Why do you want an MA and not a PhD, which are fully-funded at good programs and where the job prospects are okay?
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 7:01 PM on May 13, 2008


In terms of the actual programs, I am deciding between Suffolk Univ and Umass-B.

I would not bother with either of those programs.

I would talk to people actually running those programs to see what sort of degree, if any, you should pursue. I would be astonished if it were an academic IR program. This sounds much more like an MPA mill.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 7:15 PM on May 13, 2008


Seconding ROU_Xenophobe. I did PoliSci as an undergraduate, and my impression from all of my professors was basically that a PhD was the way to go if you wanted to really do stuff in the PolS/IR field, and furthermore that if you didn't get fully funded for a PhD, you shouldn't be going (although this applies to most fields, as near as I can tell.)
posted by fuzzbean at 7:21 PM on May 13, 2008


Response by poster: Thanks to all for the feedback.

In response to some of the questions/comments posed:

I would talk to people actually running those programs to see what sort of degree, if any, you should pursue. I would be astonished if it were an academic IR program. This sounds much more like an MPA mill


I did meet with the Deans of the programs I applied to and explained my situation...most saw obtaining this type of degree as a way for me to get ahead and (for lack of a better phrase) a way to catch up (particularly for someone who has limited experience in the field). I recognize that their responses were aimed at pushing me to attend their respective universities though.
posted by inight33 at 7:51 PM on May 13, 2008


Talk to potential employers. Seriously -- you seem to be connected enough to the field that you can probably find people at places you want to go and ask them "how much more likely are you to hire someone with a MA in IR versus not?"

Only then can you decide whether the tuition (and the opportunity cost of 1yr+ of practical job experience) is worth it.

I will say that I'm profoundly unimpressed with Stanford's international policy studies masters students (then again, I'm a political theorist: I have obscenely high standards), and find it hard to imagine that what they're learning will get them jobs. But the people doing the hiring are who you should ask.
posted by paultopia at 7:58 PM on May 13, 2008


It seems to me that you have had some exposure to the field of International Development and have found that you do need extra experience / stuff on your resume to have a career in the field. In that case, you should go for it. Unless you want to go into academics or research, a PhD program is not for you - as I'm sure you realized. There are MA programs that are geared towards prepping you to be in a PhD program and there are terminal MA programs that are prepping you to get a non-academic job.
posted by chrisalbon at 8:59 PM on May 13, 2008


Honestly, even then I would suggest entering a PhD program and then leaving after you get your master's. Your odds of funding are astronomically higher that way. Do not *EVER* tell any program you're applying to that you intend to leave after the master's.

This still sounds more like an MPA program than an academic MA. The people you want to talk to are not the people running the programs you might attend, but rather the people doing the work you want to do.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 9:15 PM on May 13, 2008


I did meet with the Deans of the programs I applied to and explained my situation...most saw obtaining this type of degree as a way for me to get ahead and (for lack of a better phrase) a way to catch up (particularly for someone who has limited experience in the field).

They are not the ones you need to talk to -- you need to talk with people in the field. Ideally, people who have the job you would want to have in five years. You ask them, what are the qualifications I need? what experience? how did you get from where you began to this job? etc. As you noticed, the deans will just tell you how great their program is -- that is their job, especially for master's programs which are big cash cows for a department. You need to work from the other direction -- figure out your goal, and then work out how to get there.

Also, what is you plan for getting the on-the-ground experience in a developing country that is the minimum qualification for most international development jobs? A MS isn't usually enough -- most credible organizations want proof that you can handle difficult situations and deal with the contradictions of development work. I think you would be far better served by spending two years volunteering or working (eg with the Peace Corps, a religious organization, directly with an NGO, whatever) to get hands-on experience and cultural/language training.

If you are really, really set on doing a master's degree right now, consider applying into one of the Peace Corps Masters International programs -- that way you combine your grad school and practical work, and end up very employable.

Here is one of the major job posting sites for development work (there are lots of others, of course), which will give you a sense of what is being looked for in terms of experience, language skills, education, etc. Most of those are not entry-level, but that will still give you a sense of what an early- or mid-career person would look like in that field. The few that I took a quick look at uniformly required 2-3 years of international experience, rather than requiring advanced degrees. The MS will help, but is not really a substitute for demonstrating that you can tough it out on the ground.
posted by Forktine at 9:45 PM on May 13, 2008


Also, you can get an MA in the UK in 9 months and for 10,000 pounds + living expenses.
posted by k8t at 12:11 AM on May 14, 2008


Also, an IR degree isn't the bestest eva for ID. Why not get an MA in International Development?
posted by k8t at 12:13 AM on May 14, 2008


Response by poster: Again thanks for all the feedback. A few responses:


Also, what is you plan for getting the on-the-ground experience in a developing country that is the minimum qualification for most international development jobs?


In terms of gaining field experience I (through a connection) have applied for an internship with the UN this summer doing work on FDI in Southern Africa. If I am chosen, I would leave for Zimbabwe in 6 weeks and be a RA there for 2 months. Again, not a huge amount of field experience but something that will help build the resume and my network. If this falls through, I was hoping to gain in country experience next summer instead.

Also, an IR degree isn't the bestest eva for ID. Why not get an MA in International Development?


As for this question...I think I am interested in a more generic IR degree as an attempt to "cover my bases." Let's say I do have extreme difficulty finding a job in 3-5 years, it seems better to me to have a more generic degree (that some have applied to the fields of diplomacy, development, even international business) than one that is a bit narrower like ID.
posted by inight33 at 5:53 AM on May 14, 2008


Go to the best school you can get into, regardless of what you can afford. Make friends, connect with people, keep your eyes open for new opportunities, and you'll get lucky. Luck is largely the result of a) being happy/optimistic; b) mixing with people who are interested in what you are interested in (i.e. alumni, professional groups, organizations shopping for qualified people).
posted by ewkpates at 6:06 AM on May 14, 2008


IR, as I understand it, is really political science/diplomacy driven. Development is not.
posted by k8t at 9:52 AM on May 14, 2008


Let's say I do have extreme difficulty finding a job in 3-5 years, it seems better to me to have a more generic degree (that some have applied to the fields of diplomacy, development, even international business) than one that is a bit narrower like ID.

For undergraduate degrees, this is a really smart approach -- being general gives you more options than a focused, applied degree. For graduate study, the opposite is true -- a focused, career-specific degree gives you many more options than does an unfocused, generalist degree that may not get much respect.

But again, the answers to this that you should be listening to with great care will come from mid-career people in the specific sub-field you are interested in. Don't ask entry-level people -- they may not stick with that career, and don't yet have perspective on what worked and what didn't. And don't ask people with lots of seniority, because they came into the field in a different era and may give you advice that's well-meaning but not completely helpful. Work your contacts, and don't be afraid to make cold-calls; people are usually very happy to talk about themselves, and it is very flattering to have someone asking for your opinion and perspective (especially since you won't be asking for an additional favor, like a job or a place to stay).
posted by Forktine at 10:09 AM on May 14, 2008


Let's say I do have extreme difficulty finding a job in 3-5 years, it seems better to me to have a more generic degree (that some have applied to the fields of diplomacy, development, even international business) than one that is a bit narrower like ID.

Offhand, the only way I can think of that a more generic political science MA might be better than a more directed MA in ID is that political science programs generally, but by no means always, have more rigorous methodological requirements. So, it *might* be easier to parlay a poli-sci MA into being a Stata coder or market-research analyst than it would be for a MA/ID.

But you didn't say you wanted to sit in a cubicle churning out stata do-files and taking a first pass at digesting regression output.

And, looking at their courses, both of the programs you mentioned seem quite weak in that regard in any case.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 11:56 AM on May 14, 2008


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