What can I really do about my ticket?
September 29, 2007 7:04 AM Subscribe
Canadianlawfilter: What to do about my ticket?
So I made a bad decision.
I was walking around (on private property) with open alcohol. In those regulation party cups. And I managed to be the only person that got a ticket (open alcohol).
This is section 31(2) of the Liquor License Act for anyone part of the vast majority that isn't Canadian.
So, my question is: is there anything I can really do about this ticket? If this is something that shows up on a police record check, I might as well drop out now. I will not be able to start a career with an alcohol related offence.
My problem with this ticket is that under the offence comitted the offence is wrong. I'm down for consuming liquor in a non-private place. I did not drink anything in public, nor was I on public property at any time.
Is there any merit in arguing that I was the only one out of a bunch of people that was charged (who were all doing the exact same thing)?
Is any of this worth anything (I'm assuming not)?
Also am I only going to be making things worse by showing up in court to point this out?
In the end the only thing that matters is my reputation. I never though that a beer was going to get me in this much trouble, but I tend to learn new things every day.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Questions can be directed to thecrownvsme@gmail.com
Oh, and I am too poor to even start to think about getting a lawyer.
So I made a bad decision.
I was walking around (on private property) with open alcohol. In those regulation party cups. And I managed to be the only person that got a ticket (open alcohol).
This is section 31(2) of the Liquor License Act for anyone part of the vast majority that isn't Canadian.
So, my question is: is there anything I can really do about this ticket? If this is something that shows up on a police record check, I might as well drop out now. I will not be able to start a career with an alcohol related offence.
My problem with this ticket is that under the offence comitted the offence is wrong. I'm down for consuming liquor in a non-private place. I did not drink anything in public, nor was I on public property at any time.
Is there any merit in arguing that I was the only one out of a bunch of people that was charged (who were all doing the exact same thing)?
Is any of this worth anything (I'm assuming not)?
Also am I only going to be making things worse by showing up in court to point this out?
In the end the only thing that matters is my reputation. I never though that a beer was going to get me in this much trouble, but I tend to learn new things every day.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Questions can be directed to thecrownvsme@gmail.com
Oh, and I am too poor to even start to think about getting a lawyer.
You need to talk to a lawyer. I don't care how poor you are.
posted by unSane at 7:44 AM on September 29, 2007
posted by unSane at 7:44 AM on September 29, 2007
I looked up the regulation:
Unlawful possession or consumption
(2) No person shall have or consume liquor in any place other than,
(a) a residence;
(b) premises in respect of which a licence or permit is issued; or
(c) a private place as defined in the regulations. R.S.O. 1990, c. L.19, s. 31 (2).
So it's 'have OR consume' and it looks as though any place to which the public has access, whether or not it is private property, is covered.
On the other hand, it's a $130 ticket. I don't think most employers would give a flying F.
posted by unSane at 7:54 AM on September 29, 2007
Unlawful possession or consumption
(2) No person shall have or consume liquor in any place other than,
(a) a residence;
(b) premises in respect of which a licence or permit is issued; or
(c) a private place as defined in the regulations. R.S.O. 1990, c. L.19, s. 31 (2).
So it's 'have OR consume' and it looks as though any place to which the public has access, whether or not it is private property, is covered.
On the other hand, it's a $130 ticket. I don't think most employers would give a flying F.
posted by unSane at 7:54 AM on September 29, 2007
I will not be able to start a career with an alcohol related offence.
What? Where?
posted by Saucy Intruder at 8:07 AM on September 29, 2007
What? Where?
posted by Saucy Intruder at 8:07 AM on September 29, 2007
This is not a big deal. Relax. Take the ticket, pay it, and move on with your life.
posted by c:\awesome at 8:11 AM on September 29, 2007
posted by c:\awesome at 8:11 AM on September 29, 2007
I'm guessing that anonymous means Ontario and not Canada, since liquor licensing is a provincial matter.
posted by oaf at 9:22 AM on September 29, 2007
posted by oaf at 9:22 AM on September 29, 2007
Pay the ticket. It won't come up again.
posted by davey_darling at 9:25 AM on September 29, 2007
posted by davey_darling at 9:25 AM on September 29, 2007
If you google up the regulation unSane refers to, they define 'residence' as:
“residence” means a place that is actually occupied and used as a dwelling, whether or not in common with other persons, including all premises used in conjunction with the place to which the general public is not invited or permitted access, and, if the place occupied and used as a dwelling is a tent, includes the land immediately adjacent to and used in conjunction with the tent. R.S.O. 1990, c. L.19, s. 31 (1).
So it, as I understand it in my all of my non-lawyerness, it depends on what kind of private property it is. If it's the lawn belonging to a house, it's considered part of the residence. If it's a lot or field that's privately owned, but does not have a dwelling on it, it's not considered a residence.
Your best bet might be to find a free law clinic in the area.
posted by CKmtl at 10:27 AM on September 29, 2007
“residence” means a place that is actually occupied and used as a dwelling, whether or not in common with other persons, including all premises used in conjunction with the place to which the general public is not invited or permitted access, and, if the place occupied and used as a dwelling is a tent, includes the land immediately adjacent to and used in conjunction with the tent. R.S.O. 1990, c. L.19, s. 31 (1).
So it, as I understand it in my all of my non-lawyerness, it depends on what kind of private property it is. If it's the lawn belonging to a house, it's considered part of the residence. If it's a lot or field that's privately owned, but does not have a dwelling on it, it's not considered a residence.
Your best bet might be to find a free law clinic in the area.
posted by CKmtl at 10:27 AM on September 29, 2007
If this is something that shows up on a police record check, I might as well drop out now. I will not be able to start a career with an alcohol related offence.
Your lesson for the day: This will not keep you from starting a career. Seriously. It's a misdemeanor, and a minor one at that. Pay your fine.
Or put on a suit and go to the judge swearing that you will never, ever, ever hold a beer but not drink from it in a place that is not public but fits within the scope of the non-private ever again. The judge may may reduce the fine, if it's high.
Before doing this, please at least seek advice from your university, who should be able to give you some relevant advice. If you're still in high school, tell your parents, and take them with you to court.
posted by desuetude at 2:21 PM on September 29, 2007
Your lesson for the day: This will not keep you from starting a career. Seriously. It's a misdemeanor, and a minor one at that. Pay your fine.
Or put on a suit and go to the judge swearing that you will never, ever, ever hold a beer but not drink from it in a place that is not public but fits within the scope of the non-private ever again. The judge may may reduce the fine, if it's high.
Before doing this, please at least seek advice from your university, who should be able to give you some relevant advice. If you're still in high school, tell your parents, and take them with you to court.
posted by desuetude at 2:21 PM on September 29, 2007
IANAL, but I am fairly certain this is not a criminal offence - IIRC the Liquor License Act is not part of the Criminal Code. Therefore, this will not hinder your career any more than a speeding ticket (which is also not a criminal offence).
Call Legal Aid to see if you can get duty counsel to help you, or if you're in a city with a law school, contact their legal clinic to see if you can get some advice. If they can't help you, they can usually refer you to a lawyer who accepts fees on a sliding scale or who might give you a free consultation. I wouldn't get too worked up about this though.
posted by AV at 2:41 PM on September 29, 2007
Call Legal Aid to see if you can get duty counsel to help you, or if you're in a city with a law school, contact their legal clinic to see if you can get some advice. If they can't help you, they can usually refer you to a lawyer who accepts fees on a sliding scale or who might give you a free consultation. I wouldn't get too worked up about this though.
posted by AV at 2:41 PM on September 29, 2007
Dude, Call a Lawyer.
Your poor so here's a few options:
1)call the legal aid clinic in your town during intake hours. They will most likely not represent you for a ticket, but they will give you advice during intake hours. (Although they may end up as duty council if you fight it.)
2)look for free legal counseling. In my city (Guelph, On) there is some offered once a week at an affordable housing clinic. Ask when you call the clinic, they should know if there is anything. Also google.
-I might as well drop out now
3) It sounds like your a student. Your school should have some sort of legal resource centre for students. It may be through the Students Union or the Admin. Use it. They will have seen this before. (also they are really up on tenant law, FYI)
4)Talk to the External VP/Commissioner on your Students Union (or another VP, whichever is right). They should know about who to talk to etc, and if they're good, be able to offer ideas/solutions. This is what external VP's do.
Calm down. It's a ticket. It shouldn't show up on a record. And it's one of those things that a few people get nailed for, but everyone has done from time to time.
Good Luck
posted by dr. moot at 3:07 PM on September 29, 2007
Your poor so here's a few options:
1)call the legal aid clinic in your town during intake hours. They will most likely not represent you for a ticket, but they will give you advice during intake hours. (Although they may end up as duty council if you fight it.)
2)look for free legal counseling. In my city (Guelph, On) there is some offered once a week at an affordable housing clinic. Ask when you call the clinic, they should know if there is anything. Also google.
-I might as well drop out now
3) It sounds like your a student. Your school should have some sort of legal resource centre for students. It may be through the Students Union or the Admin. Use it. They will have seen this before. (also they are really up on tenant law, FYI)
4)Talk to the External VP/Commissioner on your Students Union (or another VP, whichever is right). They should know about who to talk to etc, and if they're good, be able to offer ideas/solutions. This is what external VP's do.
Calm down. It's a ticket. It shouldn't show up on a record. And it's one of those things that a few people get nailed for, but everyone has done from time to time.
Good Luck
posted by dr. moot at 3:07 PM on September 29, 2007
My problem with this ticket is that under the offence comitted the offence is wrong. I'm down for consuming liquor in a non-private place. I did not drink anything in public, nor was I on public property at any time.
Well, then simply have it go to trial and explain this to the judge. There's a quite likely possibility that the issuing officer will not appear, in which case it will get tossed, and if he/she does appear, they'd have to perjure themselves in order for you to be convicted - and that's not a likely proposition.
If you pay or are convicted, this is not a criminal matter, and the only "police checks" that are done for public consumption is the Criminal Records Check
posted by Neiltupper at 3:36 PM on September 29, 2007
Well, then simply have it go to trial and explain this to the judge. There's a quite likely possibility that the issuing officer will not appear, in which case it will get tossed, and if he/she does appear, they'd have to perjure themselves in order for you to be convicted - and that's not a likely proposition.
If you pay or are convicted, this is not a criminal matter, and the only "police checks" that are done for public consumption is the Criminal Records Check
posted by Neiltupper at 3:36 PM on September 29, 2007
In Ontario, the law society recommends that lawyers offer a free initial half-hour consultation and almost all lawyers do.
"Other people were doing it and they didn't get ticketed" won't get you anywhere (see also: speeding).
If you believe that you didn't break this law, then it may be worth showing up in court and telling your side of the story. If you did break the law but have some other reason why you think the situation is unfair then it's probably not. (IANAL)
posted by winston at 5:32 PM on September 29, 2007
"Other people were doing it and they didn't get ticketed" won't get you anywhere (see also: speeding).
If you believe that you didn't break this law, then it may be worth showing up in court and telling your side of the story. If you did break the law but have some other reason why you think the situation is unfair then it's probably not. (IANAL)
posted by winston at 5:32 PM on September 29, 2007
I have like three of these.
They are minor offenses that will never show up on any criminal record check (that is, if you pay the ticket). A criminal record check is for criminal activity, this is not considered severe enough. Don't sweat it.
Chances are, if you show up in court to fight it the officer won't even be there and a polite explanation to the judge will either allow for a fine reduction or he'll let you off altogether.
posted by ageispolis at 6:57 PM on November 5, 2007
They are minor offenses that will never show up on any criminal record check (that is, if you pay the ticket). A criminal record check is for criminal activity, this is not considered severe enough. Don't sweat it.
Chances are, if you show up in court to fight it the officer won't even be there and a polite explanation to the judge will either allow for a fine reduction or he'll let you off altogether.
posted by ageispolis at 6:57 PM on November 5, 2007
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I don't know anything about the law, but you're probably going to need one if you do decide to fight this (and if you do, I doubt "everybody else was doing it" would be your best line of defense, but, yeah IANAL, nor do I know anything about the law). You sound like a student, though-- your university might have some sort of legal aid that can help you.
posted by synecdoche at 7:43 AM on September 29, 2007