HVAC Buyer's Remorse
November 9, 2024 12:38 PM Subscribe
Can I sell a recently installed combi-boiler? If so, how? If not, what are my options?
I recently replaced my HVAC with a Heat Pump (AC and primary heat) and a combi-boiler for backup heat and tankless water heater. This all seemed reasonable at the time. However, now that it's all installed I'm not liking it.
My thermostat is set to dual fuel and the boiler doesn't kick-in until the outside temp is below freezing. However, the heat pump is rated at 100% capacity down to 5° Fahrenheit so the backup heat isn't needed. (I know that gas heating could be cheaper than electric).
The bigger issue is the tankless hot water. It takes 45 seconds for warm and a minute to get hot water. Which is annoying for general use, but makes laundry difficult as there's no hot water for washing.
Ideally I'd like to replace the boiler with a water tank and call it a day. But I can't afford to just throw away the several thousand dollars I spent on the boiler along with whatever a new water tank is going to cost. Is there a legitimate way to sell/recycle the boiler so it doesn't go to waste and hopefully offset the cost of a new water tank?
What else should I be considering?
Addendum: I had a terrible time with the HVAC installer and have cut ties with them. Or I would have called them up and asked for options.
I recently replaced my HVAC with a Heat Pump (AC and primary heat) and a combi-boiler for backup heat and tankless water heater. This all seemed reasonable at the time. However, now that it's all installed I'm not liking it.
My thermostat is set to dual fuel and the boiler doesn't kick-in until the outside temp is below freezing. However, the heat pump is rated at 100% capacity down to 5° Fahrenheit so the backup heat isn't needed. (I know that gas heating could be cheaper than electric).
The bigger issue is the tankless hot water. It takes 45 seconds for warm and a minute to get hot water. Which is annoying for general use, but makes laundry difficult as there's no hot water for washing.
Ideally I'd like to replace the boiler with a water tank and call it a day. But I can't afford to just throw away the several thousand dollars I spent on the boiler along with whatever a new water tank is going to cost. Is there a legitimate way to sell/recycle the boiler so it doesn't go to waste and hopefully offset the cost of a new water tank?
What else should I be considering?
Addendum: I had a terrible time with the HVAC installer and have cut ties with them. Or I would have called them up and asked for options.
Is there a sink near your clothes washer? Run the sink for a minute until the water is hot enough for laundry. You could do this many, many times before the value of the wasted water approached the cost of changing your plumbing.
posted by drdanger at 3:39 PM on November 9, 2024 [2 favorites]
posted by drdanger at 3:39 PM on November 9, 2024 [2 favorites]
Here is a possible option related to hot water washing. This would annoying, but what you could do is turn on the washer and let the water run into the empty washer for a minute until the water becomes hot, and then turn it to the cycle that empties out the water. Then, after the water empties out, do a "real" cycle, because the fake cycle would have brought the hot water near.
You might also research whether or not hot water washing is ever needed. I successfully wash 100% of everything in cold water (sometimes I use bleach) and have had zero problems related to it.
posted by SageTrail at 4:29 PM on November 9, 2024 [1 favorite]
You might also research whether or not hot water washing is ever needed. I successfully wash 100% of everything in cold water (sometimes I use bleach) and have had zero problems related to it.
posted by SageTrail at 4:29 PM on November 9, 2024 [1 favorite]
Run the sink for a minute until the water is hot enough for laundry
If you don’t have a sink, and you’re at least a little handy, you could rig up a branch off the washer hot water supply with a valve and direct it into the standpipe drain. just run that until it heats up, then start the washer.
posted by supercres at 8:49 PM on November 9, 2024
If you don’t have a sink, and you’re at least a little handy, you could rig up a branch off the washer hot water supply with a valve and direct it into the standpipe drain. just run that until it heats up, then start the washer.
posted by supercres at 8:49 PM on November 9, 2024
You might want to check first whether the combi has a recirculation option, which would keep preheated water in the pipes so you don't have the wait. That will make it more expensive to run, but probably not as expensive as switching out your entire hot water system!
posted by quacks like a duck at 3:40 AM on November 10, 2024
posted by quacks like a duck at 3:40 AM on November 10, 2024
Like SageTrail I wash almost everything cold - modern detergents do not need hot water to get stuff clean. And running hot water in the sink until it's hot enough is a good answer - every house I've lived in took a while to get hot water to the tap even with old style hot water heaters.
We've been living with a heat pump and furnace back up for a couple of years and quite like it - give it some time.
posted by leslies at 6:26 AM on November 10, 2024
We've been living with a heat pump and furnace back up for a couple of years and quite like it - give it some time.
posted by leslies at 6:26 AM on November 10, 2024
I have a question about the washing. Are you doing it by hand where you’re intermittently using the water so it’s inconvenient to have to wait for it to heat up each time you want to use it? If it is a situation like that, is there a way to keep the hot water running on a trickle so it keeps actively heating?
I just timed my washing machine, it’s a standard size, maybe a bit big, top load, and it took over 7 minutes to fill halfway on Warm so that is even faster than it would have for Hot only. It just seems to me like there shouldn’t be that much drop in temperature to have it take a minute to get hot, especially since there maybe be 10 seconds of cold water in the pipes either way. If it is a washing machine situation, have you taken the temperature of the water when it gets full?
posted by cali59 at 7:06 AM on November 10, 2024
I just timed my washing machine, it’s a standard size, maybe a bit big, top load, and it took over 7 minutes to fill halfway on Warm so that is even faster than it would have for Hot only. It just seems to me like there shouldn’t be that much drop in temperature to have it take a minute to get hot, especially since there maybe be 10 seconds of cold water in the pipes either way. If it is a washing machine situation, have you taken the temperature of the water when it gets full?
posted by cali59 at 7:06 AM on November 10, 2024
Little late to this but can you explain how your HVAC is set up? And what your previous setup was? Like in my head I’m picturing you have both air ducts and either baseboard fin tube or radiators for the boiler, is that right? And then do you know how— or were you given an explanation—on how the boiler interfaces with the tankless? I’m having trouble picturing this setup in my head, any chance you have a picture of this mechanical setup?
posted by HVACDC_Bag at 8:46 AM on November 10, 2024
posted by HVACDC_Bag at 8:46 AM on November 10, 2024
Response by poster: Regarding the Washing Machine. It's a front loader and does have a built in water heater. But that takes a lot longer and is less efficient than if it could just use hot water directly.
The old system was a gas furnace (forced hot-air; fully ducted home) with a separate gas water heater. The new system has a split from the boiler to a heat-exchanger inside the ducting. Should the system ever call for gas heat the boiler would turn on and run hot water through the exchanger to heat the air. When I had the system quoted I'd asked about just a heat pump and a separate water heater (also a heat pump, as I'd like to move away from gas). But was convinced this setup was a better option all things considered. Now, that it's been a few months I realize the boiler sits idle all the time. And even with winter temps it's never going to be needed.
Since it's a brand new boiler that's wasted on me I thought there might be a way to get it to someone who would use it. And get a setup that better matched my needs, all without wasting to much money or equipment. Hence this question about the feasibility of selling it.
posted by zinon at 10:56 AM on November 10, 2024
The old system was a gas furnace (forced hot-air; fully ducted home) with a separate gas water heater. The new system has a split from the boiler to a heat-exchanger inside the ducting. Should the system ever call for gas heat the boiler would turn on and run hot water through the exchanger to heat the air. When I had the system quoted I'd asked about just a heat pump and a separate water heater (also a heat pump, as I'd like to move away from gas). But was convinced this setup was a better option all things considered. Now, that it's been a few months I realize the boiler sits idle all the time. And even with winter temps it's never going to be needed.
Since it's a brand new boiler that's wasted on me I thought there might be a way to get it to someone who would use it. And get a setup that better matched my needs, all without wasting to much money or equipment. Hence this question about the feasibility of selling it.
posted by zinon at 10:56 AM on November 10, 2024
Response by poster: Regarding the Washing Machine. It's a front loader and does have a built in water heater. But that takes a lot longer and is less efficient than if it could just use hot water directly.
It probably does take longer, and if the washing machine heater only kicks in for things like a "Sanitize" cycle, then yeah, it's a problem. but if the machine is designed to heat hot water for hot loads, that is more efficient certainly than sending hot water to the washer through a pipe from some other source.
posted by oneirodynia at 10:50 PM on November 10, 2024
It probably does take longer, and if the washing machine heater only kicks in for things like a "Sanitize" cycle, then yeah, it's a problem. but if the machine is designed to heat hot water for hot loads, that is more efficient certainly than sending hot water to the washer through a pipe from some other source.
posted by oneirodynia at 10:50 PM on November 10, 2024
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The combi boiler should be able to be connected to an "indirect tank" which will perform like a really powerful conventional tank water heater. Boiler water is circulated through a loop in a tank (it's a heat exchanger) and the tap water in the tank is maintained at a fixed temperature. Indirect tanks aren't dirt cheap and you'd need either an additional circulator pump or zone valve depending on how your boiler system is configured. Just putting this out there in case you're unaware of this option.
posted by Larry David Syndrome at 2:50 PM on November 9, 2024 [1 favorite]