Do people sometimes regret losing a massive amount of weight?
May 11, 2006 11:20 AM   Subscribe

I need to lose a lot of weight, but I'm worried about being left with excess skin. Like, it worries me to the point where I'm reluctant to even start Project Weightloss. My question is: do people sometimes regret losing a massive amount of weight?

When it comes to discussions of weightloss, it seems like loose skin is a forbidden subject; the weightloss industry pretends it doesn't exist, except to imply that working out and developing muscle tone will fix it (muscle tone and skin tone are different things). People who've lost a lot of weight often seem to gloss over the issue, saying stuff like, "Yeah, it's pretty terrible, but I'd rather have the baggy skin than the fat!" I just don't know if I buy this; sometimes it seems like cognitive dissonance, or someone trying to make peace with their current body.

Here's my situation: I'm 32 and female. I've always been fat, but right now I'm about forty kilos overweight. I've never loved my body aesthetically (I think that's normal for most women) but I've always been at peace with it and it's served me well. I consider myself sexy. I'm healthy, with excellent blood pressure, blood sugar and cholesterol levels - but my cardiovascular fitness is shit. I get puffed really easily and I don't feel at all agile. I am definitely, even by my own forgiving standards, too fat. I would like to lose some weight but feel paralysed by the idea of giving myself a deformity. I'm fine with my body, looks-wise, as it is... okay, that's not really true, but I'm just not convinced that I'll look better if I lose weight. I'm worried I'll look a lot worse and feel hideous.

The other thing is, I've googled a lot of cosmetic surgery pictures and seen what's involved in an abdominoplasty; I've been pretty horrified with both the before and after pictures, and I doubt I could ever afford to get one anyway.

So, I'd like to know the truth. Are people who've lost a lot of weight ever traumatised by it and wish they could go back to how they were? Or perhaps my real question is: how do I deal with this anxiety and lose the weight anyhow? If you'd like to talk to me about this privately, my email for this question is
posted by anonymous to Health & Fitness (42 answers total) 10 users marked this as a favorite
Yes, people sometimes have lots of loose skin and yes, plastic surgery often only makes you look better clothed. However, being healthy is really paramount in this situation. Losing weight slowly will help minimize the loose skin issue. It took years and years to get to the weight you are now and it will most likely take years to lose it, however going slow will save your skin.

Some people say massage helps keep skin firm. It is not the "firming lotion" that does it, but the massage which increases blood flow to an area which can help skin retain its elasticity.
posted by stormygrey at 11:29 AM on May 11, 2006

My sister recently had gastric-bypass surgery and has so far lost 100 pounds. Her plan is to get a tummy tuck after she loses all the weight. Currently, I personally think she looks fine and I don't really think her skin is very loose. However, she does and that is why she is planning on doing the plastic surgery. I will say that she is definitely happy that she has lost weight. She much prefers the loose skin to all of the extra weight on her body. She walks more easily, doesn't lose her breath so quickly, and she feels more fit.

I have also been told that you are more likely to have loose skin if you lose weight really quickly. Also, it appears that skin resiliency is somewhat genetic.
posted by bove at 11:30 AM on May 11, 2006

This is not directly answering your question, as I have never gained and lost enough weight to be in the situation, but I am confident in saying:

You're inventing a reason not to pursue what is a difficult yet neccesary task. Forty kilos overweight is by definition unhealthy. If you have never been at a more reasonable weight, you don't even know how tiring it is to carry around that much excess. As someone who has been 20 pounds over and very occasionally 10-15 pounds under my ideal weight (which is still slightly heavier than the current US standards for BMI) I can say that even simply sitting on my couch when I am fit is a more pleasurable experience than when I am on the heavier side.
posted by mzurer at 11:33 AM on May 11, 2006

I don't think 40 kilos (that's < 20 lbs.) is nearly enough to cause significant change to your>
Here's the answer you need, but don't want to hear: Stop coming up with excuses not to lose weight and just go for it. Once the ball gets rolling, it's easy. You'll be so glad you did it.
posted by mkultra at 11:35 AM on May 11, 2006 [1 favorite]

this is only from watching tv shows, but I think that a lot of people with loose skin are more than 40 kilos overweight.

from reality: a friend lost about 20 kilos in her late twenties and she doesn't seem to be plagued by loose skin at all. I think it has to do with age, and the speed at which you lose it. she did it over the course of two years. no stomach stapling, she just stopped eating from boredom.

Also, if you're 40 kilos overweight, perhaps you don't have to lose all 40. You say you feel sexy? You're healthy? If that's true, perhaps you only need lose enough weight to make a significant increase in stamina. Lose a little bit at a time. You can stop when you think you're starting to look worse. I think you'll be fine though! go for it!
posted by chelseagirl at 11:35 AM on May 11, 2006

mkultra: you've got the conversion backwards: 40 kilos =~ 88 lbs US
posted by tippiedog at 11:39 AM on May 11, 2006

40 kilos (that's < 20 lbs)/em>

No. That's more like 80 lbs.

posted by NekulturnY at 11:40 AM on May 11, 2006 [1 favorite]

I'm healthy, with excellent blood pressure, blood sugar and cholesterol levels - but my cardiovascular fitness is shit. I get puffed really easily and I don't feel at all agile.

Why not focus first on becoming more active and fit rather than losing weight, then? There are people who claim that fitness/activity level is more important than weight. (I have not done enough research to agree or disagree with them.)
posted by needs more cowbell at 11:48 AM on May 11, 2006

It sounds like you have done a lot of reading about this, but if you haven't seen it, it's probably worth taking a look at this FAQ about loose skin from 3 Fat Chicks. No one can tell you whether you will have loose skin, and people's results are highly variable with age, amount of weight lost, and genetics.

For what it's worth, I have lost about 50 pounds (22 kilos) over the course of more than a year, and I have no baggy skin at all. I'm working on losing some more weight, and I imagine that that will probably change. I never hated myself when I was fatter, I always thought I was totally healthy and okay-looking -- and I feel so much better now than I ever did before. For me, it has been an awesome experience to feel lighter in my body, more able to move around, and to actually feel like I am hot and look good, not just okay.

You know you need to lose weight. I do think you're underestimating how good it will feel to be healthier and more mobile, and to look different and see more definition in your body -- and overestimating this cosmetic issue, which is not a deformity by any means. You say you like your body, but to me (and forgive me if this is presumptuous), it sounds more like you have just resigned yourself to it.

You are overwhelming yourself by imagining what will happen waaay down the road. You don't need to think about it now, and as chelseagirl says, you can be healthy and active without losing all 40 kilos. I promise that losing 10 kilos will make you feel better and look noticeably different, and I suspect you will probably like the change. Make that your goal, see how you look and feel, and reevaluate then.
posted by Siobhan at 11:52 AM on May 11, 2006 [1 favorite]

I've gone from 175 lbs to 125 lbs (about 23 kilo) and my skin didn't really sag anywhere... except my breasts. With the lost weight, the fullness and perkiness disappeared to leave what to me were sad saggy bags, and I was extremely self-conscious of them for months when I first lost weight, but with the help of friends and boyfriends, learned to love my boobs for what they are.

I never once regretted losing the weight though... I feel much much MUCH more healthy and comfortable with my body now than I did at 80 kilo.

It's wonderful that you're comfortable with your body no matter your weight and that you feel sexy... but you said yourself you don't feel healthy, and that should seriously be a priority. Your sugars, lipids, blood pressure are under control now, but you're young. Being overweight will catch up with you... it's comparable to smoking in that sense... no real consequences while you're young, except maybe impaired fitness levels, but hit 50s/60s after having smoked for 30 years, or been overweight for 30 years and you're going to start seeing complications.

Yes my skin is saggy in places after having lost weight, but to me it was definitely a no-brainer exchange.
posted by degnarra at 11:53 AM on May 11, 2006

... 40 kilos (that's < 20 lbs.) ...

I'm a metric-dumb American, and I was wondering how much 40 kilos is, so I looked at an online kilo-to-pound converter.

It said that 40 kilos is about 88 pounds.

After I saw mkultra's comment, I re-checked with another
converter, and it came up with 88 pounds also.

Just fyi...

And I sympathize anon, I have a lot more than that to lose, and I've wondered about that too, and have also done a lot of thinking about gastric bypass also. Haven't been able reach a decision yet. Just wanted you to know that there's someone else (and I'm sure MANY others) who understand, even if we don't have a good answer to your question.
posted by marsha56 at 11:54 AM on May 11, 2006

Oops. Just saw several others already caught this while I was SLOWLY typing.
posted by marsha56 at 11:55 AM on May 11, 2006

I'd say most people who lose a lot of weight are not happy with their body image before. (Duh.) So they would gloss over any minor physical problems because they are happy with the big picture. You seem to be in a different place to start with so it makes sense you don't feel the same way.

P.S. I lost 70 lbs a while back and have no loose skin. YMMV.
posted by smackfu at 12:03 PM on May 11, 2006

I lost 20 lbs. over the course of a year and, yeah, I've got some loose skin around the midriff and, even better, stretch-marks. But the loose skin doesn't really show in normal activities. The stretch-marks are badges of honor.

Go ahead and do it, you'll feel so much better about yourself that the loose skin won't bother you.
posted by lekvar at 12:14 PM on May 11, 2006 [1 favorite]

Exercise is at least as important as diet in losing weight. And exercise is its own reward; it makes you feel better physically and emotionally. I think once you start you'll feel immediate benefits (assuming you adopt a reasonable program) and you'll be less concerned about the end result. You can enjoy the journey without worrying so much about how you'll feel when you eventually arrive at the destination.
posted by TimeFactor at 12:40 PM on May 11, 2006

I lost about 90 lbs a couple of years ago, and didn't have a baggy skin problem, really. Of course, I had another 150 to lose, so maybe it would have appeared with more weight loss.
posted by jacquilynne at 12:41 PM on May 11, 2006

I've lost a lot of weight (70, 80 lbs) a few times (and it's back, so perhaps eventually I may do it again) and my skin has been through the wringer. The last time I was thin, I was not particularly happy with the appearance of my stomach (like a little deflated balloon), but that problem was dramatically preferable to just being heavy. No one is ever going to pay me money to look good naked, so I tried not to stress about it too much.

(and surgery - eeyah. with my track record, that would be incredibly foolish)

email in profile. feel free.
posted by pinky at 12:48 PM on May 11, 2006

I have to honestly side with those suggesting this is just being used as an obstacle to avoid starting. Since any changes will obviously come relatively gradually, you can stop if you aren't liking the effects, can't you?
posted by nanojath at 12:52 PM on May 11, 2006

Just another testimonial here:
I recently lost about 80lbs - I'm now at my goal weight - admittedly I have some odd sag around the middle, but I'm so much more comfortable in my (loose) skin for so many reasons I'd never willingly go back and I'd do it again in an instant.
posted by soplerfo at 12:53 PM on May 11, 2006

I lost 100 pounds. I have loose skin and I had to get used to that. I found it difficult adjusting to the new me because I did not think I looked that much better than before. Sure, I was thin now (even though there is loose skin, I still fit a size XS), but I felt my body was better when I was fat. Like you, I felt quite OK with my body when I was fat (somehow, nobody believes that). I had never tried to lose weight before. The reason I wanted to lose weight was because I became convinced of the health risks of being obese (and I became aware of the fact that all that talk about obesity was about me - I always thought that obese people were the people who were really fat...), and I wanted to be healthy after the birth of my daughter. I also wanted to set better examples and stop eating junk food and start exercising.

I have kept the weight off for 18 months now, and I still do not like my belly sometimes. However, I am SO glad I lost weight. I can imagine you would think it is cognitive dissonance, but I think it really isn't. It feels SO much better to be thin. I love to be able to run with my daughter without getting tired and without the floor of our apartment building's gallery trembling beneath my feet (sorry if this is a crappy English sentence, I hope you understand what I mean). I love being able to sit on a swing with my daughter and being able to sit in a couch without touching strangers. And I love being more active and not getting exhausted so fast. I know there are fat acceptance people who say you can be just as fit when you're fat, but I do think the 100 pounds weight I was carrying with me made everything much harder.

I feel great at this weight (62 kilo, 1.71m.). I also feel I look MUCH better when I have clothes on. I am shocked when I see a picture of me at my old weight (110 kilo) and I know for sure I never ever want to go there again. However, I only started to feel this way when I weighed about what I weigh now. My initial goal was 80 kilo, but at that weight I did not feel substantially better than at 110 kilo and I felt that all people who said that they felt so much better after losing weight were probably suffering from cognative dissonance.

I think the tips to minimize sagging are: lose the weight slowly and exercise. Take a variety of exercise, both low intensity cardio and weight training.

My e-mail is in my profile, if you have more questions.
posted by davar at 12:54 PM on May 11, 2006 [2 favorites]

I've lost 30 pounds since the beginning of this year and I have nary a stretch mark or loose skin. I have zero basis for this in reality but I feel like if you lose at the recommended rate (approx. 2 lbs a week) and drink lots of water and take good care of yourself, your skin should cooperate well. I'm a 28 year old female.

Gastric surgery is certainly another story, and if you're considering that (although I think you have to be 100+ lbs overweight before you're a candidate), the story is probably entirely different, I assume because of the rapid weight loss.
posted by pazazygeek at 12:56 PM on May 11, 2006

OK, here's a potentially insensitive question - if you lose a bunch of weight, get baggy skin, decide it's not worth it...can you just gain the weight back? Assuming you haven't had gastric bypass surgery?
posted by amtho at 12:57 PM on May 11, 2006 [1 favorite]

I lost over 80 pounds and was left with a very saggy belly and abdominal skin, and extremely droopy breasts. This doesn't happen to everyone, as everyone's skin, genetics and personal history is different. A lot of it depends on what you do to loose the weight, how fast it comes off, your skins natural elasticity, etc...

That said, I was very unhappy with all the loose skin, but very happy with the changes in my body and overall health. In short, it changed my life drastically for the better, loose skin and all. I ended up having a breast lift, and then later on a tummy tuck. It was worth any and all pain involved and every penny spent, and I am extremely happy with the results. I have some scars yes, but I do not look deformed at all... in fact, I look and feel better than I ever have in my entire life. If the only pictures of tummy tucks you have seen look like deformities to you, then you're not looking at the right pictures. Many surgeons out there can do incredible jobs, and I personally consider mine to be a miracle worker.

Given all that, even if I would not have opted to have the surgeries done, I still would be a million times happier with my body (and healthier) having lost the weight, droopy skin and all. I would much rather live with a saggy tummy and boobs than I would with a fat blubbery 200 pounds plus body. I suppose deformity is all in the eye of the beholder.

As others have suggested, I will too... don't get caught up on what may or may not happen to your skin. Being obese is unhealthy and your priority should be to get in shape and get healthy. I know some will vehemently disagree with my next statement, but as a former fatty who knows how much such a statement hurts I will say it any ways... at your size, your body is already deformed. I'm all about people feeling good about themselves no matter what their size or what they look like as long as it works for them... but it doesn't sound like it's working for you. Obesity is a disease like any other, and it's most obvious effect is to distort and deform your body. Being too fat on the outside is an obvious visible sign that something is wrong, it is an outward manifestation of the disease. Carrying 80 or so pounds is already a deformity, you've just gotten used to it and probably don't want to think of it that way. I am not saying that to be mean, I am saying that to be realistic. We are all so used to the fact that obesity is rampant that we've become accustomed to what it looks like and often don't see it for the mutilating deformity that it is.

I say all that because I too hope that you won't let the fear of loose skin stop you from loosing the weight that you already know you need to loose. Don't let it be an excuse. Should you be one of the unlucky like myself to get stuck with the loose skin, you will deal with that problem when you get to it. Maybe you won't have a skin problem at all, some people don't. Maybe you will and it won't bother you so much. Or maybe it will bother you and you'll eventually decide to have something done about it. Cosmetic surgery is really advanced these days and can take care of such issues marvelously without leaving you in any way deformed. Loose the weight... don't let fear of the unknown be an excuse not to, and don't kid yourself into thinking you're better off being obese rather than risking a bit of loose skin. It is well worth the trade off.
posted by RoseovSharon at 12:57 PM on May 11, 2006 [2 favorites]

Also, just as an addendum: I have 30 more pounds to go, so I have no idea what my skin will be like at the end of my journey. And exercise has been the primary cause of my weight loss, although clearly diet is a part of it. The exercise is probably a major factor in the fact that my body looks toned and my skin doesn't look saggy or stretched.
posted by pazazygeek at 12:59 PM on May 11, 2006

I lost 100 pounds and have some loose skin. A little loose skin is much better than being fat. No question about it.
posted by kdern at 1:11 PM on May 11, 2006

I know it's not direct advice, but from a slightly different perspective: I've dated someone who lost a tremendous amount of weight and had loose skin. It bugged him more than it bugged me and his self-conciousness was the only part of it that ever was an issue.

Although it's not the norm of guys I'd seen naked, I was surprised at how much it didn't bother me or turn me off. I still found him quite sexy. After a few times of seeing him naked, I didn't notice in the least.

(Of course, I'm a girl, so I don't know if guys see it the same way.)
posted by Gucky at 1:27 PM on May 11, 2006 [1 favorite]

I lost over 90 lbs and have no loose skin issues because I exercised the entire time. Don't be afraid of it- just commit to the necessary exercise. I began with just walking and over time worked up to running. It can be done!no
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 1:53 PM on May 11, 2006

I_Love_Bananas: I exercised the whole time too and still ended up with the skin problem. It's a myth that exercising will prevent it. True, it can help, but for the most part, if the skin has lost it's elasticity, no amount of exercise during or after weightloss will prevent the loose skin.

If you didn't get the loose skin, I am willing to bet it had much more to do with your age, your genetics, the length of time you had been overweight, your status as a smoker or a non-smoker, and various other factors like these. No amount of exercising can make skin shrink back up once it's been stretched past a certain point.
posted by RoseovSharon at 1:59 PM on May 11, 2006

I exercised, lost weight slowly, (35 pounds) and have a pretty saggy abdomen. But I also had three children one right after another about two decades ago, so the area was pretty stretched out anyway.

Hubby doesn't care, my clothing covers it, and I'll just deal with it. No tummy tuck unless I wind up having to have something else done at the same time.

No regrets.

Why not simply increase your cardio to get in better shape? You actually have to train your body to use fat as the preferred fuel anyway-and the type of exercise one needs to do for that is long and slow. Think walking, not sweating. Or, water aerobics- I did this-I now do spinning for my cardio-and I feel so much better it's incredible.
posted by konolia at 2:02 PM on May 11, 2006

Folks, folks, it's the new math!

Still, my other point, and all that, blah, blah, blah.

posted by mkultra at 2:04 PM on May 11, 2006

I'm a 27 year old male, and I started out at 360 a few years ago and have lost down to 185 (The midpoint for my BMI) at one point, though I'm now around 230-240. Though I work out, I still have a tremendous amount of loose skin. I probably have 8 pack abs from all the crunches I do... but the loose skin hides them.

Sometimes I do think I probably looked better fat. Then I look at pictures and realize I'm wrong. I know I could make children cry by taking my shirt off. I look like Sharpei. I wouldn't take my shirt off at the beach or at the pool... but I wouldn't have done it when I was fat either.

I've gone from wearing XXXL shirts and a 54 waist to being in an XL and wearing 36's. I can walk without being out of breath, I can buy clothes that don't say 'Big Mans', and I just feel better.

I probably will eventually have all the loose skin taken care of because it is embarrassing... but it's less than being fat, at least for me.

But let me get on my soapbox for a moment...

I was not happy at 360 pounds. I hated every cake-filled minute of it. But we're not in the same boat. You feel sexy and beautiful and you're healthy. You seem to be off to a great start! If you're comfortable at your weight and you look and feel good at it... why worry about shedding the pounds?

Just try to get more active. Work out some, maybe jog... just start to build up your fitness levels. You'll naturally lose some weight, but not at a rate that'll cause loose skin.

Don't worry about 'getting thin', worry about getting healthy.
posted by aristan at 2:09 PM on May 11, 2006 [1 favorite]

Once you've lost the weight, depending on how loose the skin is and how much extra there is, a non-surgical skin-tightening process called Thermage may be able to help.
posted by kindall at 2:12 PM on May 11, 2006

Lost more than 60lbs. Still had more fat than I wanted, but I was miserable with things the way they were. I forked up the dough for surgery. Worth every single penny.
posted by FlamingBore at 2:29 PM on May 11, 2006

I lost about 75 pounds in the course of about a year many years ago, and had no loose skin. YMMV, IANAD, etc.

Cardio fitness is important. Losing the extra weight will have some medical benefit too, but honestly if your health is fine, your cholesterol isn't elevated, etc., then I wouldn't see 80 lbs over as that big of a deal, healthwise, particularly if you're going by those height/weight charts which are often misleading - but if you can't run a block or climb two flights of stairs without getting winded, then that's a serious issue.

Would you rather be fit and have some loose skin, or have tight skin and a heart attack?
posted by joannemerriam at 2:52 PM on May 11, 2006

I'm going to add my .02, but I think it's important so please listen up. Omega 3. Eat lot's of it - at least once a day from sardines, herring and atlantic salmon. It's good for the skin and everything else it seems and may prevent excessive skin.

Also, do resistance exercise as you're losing weight. I lost 80 lbs doing so, with no sagging skin whatsoever. However, results may vary.

God bless you.
posted by rinkjustice at 4:00 PM on May 11, 2006

I lost almost a hundred lbs when I was in my thirties, although it was from the worst diet in the world: I was so stressed out, my body wouldn't digest food. I don't recommend it and I've since regained all the weight.

Anyway, I smoked, didn't exercise and basically trashed my body yet had didn't have any baggy skin, although there was some boob saggage, I was happy to drop a cup size.

One of my coworkers had gastric bypass a few months ago (she was probably +150lbs overweight) and after just 57 lbs lost, she's got bags under her arms that small children could use as hammocks (I don't want to remember what her stomach looked like - shudder). She's on multi-vitamins, has a personal trainer and is, supposedly, doing everything right including quitting smoking a year prior to the surgery.

Call it genetics, luck or whatever but there's no way of predicting and really no way of preventing it *totally* if it's going to happen. You won't know for sure until after you get losing. Don't let the fear stop you from doing something that will extend your life. If you live long enough, you're going to have baggy skin anyway.
posted by jaimystery at 6:35 PM on May 11, 2006

No one here can predict whether you'll have this problem if you decide to lose weight.

You might or might not have some baggy skin to deal with. No cream or vitamin or exercise or cigarette or salmon pattie is going to have some sort of "Or your money back, guaranteed!" effect on it.

Losing a significant amount of weight is hard work. And if we work hard, we want to be rewarded. The question then becomes this: Are you willing to work (very) hard for a not-so-perfect body?

That's tough because what do we see in magazines, movies and car tire commercials? Perfect bodies damn near everywhere.

(You're never going to look like that.)

Are you going to regret the benefits of being a healthier person if you can't have the perfect (envy inducing) after picture?

(No, you aren't.)

You are going to love fitting into new (and cheaper) clothes and airplane or auditorium seats without fear of uncomfort or embarrassment. You're going to love the freedom and confidence you get from interacting with a world that strongly devalues fat people.

Are you still going to have to accept your imperfect body? Hell yes, but so does everyone. I say go for it.
posted by 10ch at 8:56 PM on May 11, 2006 [1 favorite]

A good friend of mine (male) has lost 70 lb in the last three months, and doesn't have much of a problem with sag. However, his skin was *taut* on his giant belly. One thing I've heard is that to keep the skin tight, you've gotta keep it healthy- drink an inordinate amount of water every day. That'll help immensely.
posted by notsnot at 9:48 PM on May 11, 2006

Blimey, I could have so written this question. Same age, same feelings about being comfortable with my size, knowing that I need to lose the weight and same worries about the excess skin/surgery scars. And you know what, I think that you guys have just swung my thinking about losing the weight and to hell with the excess skin! I'm desperately hoping that I won't have the excess skin but in my heart of hearts I really know that I need to lose the weight. I've just come back from travelling where I was far more active and lost a bit of weight very quickly and I liked the difference it made. Thanks anonymous for posting the question I needed at this moment and that you get the answers that you are looking for :)
posted by floanna at 2:29 AM on May 12, 2006

After I dropped from 150kg to 90kg over the course of 18 months, I had a little belly flap where my beer gut used to be (me = male). I really enjoyed having super-loose skin - it's super-comfy to live in, and made me feel super-flexible. I would never in a million years have bits of me sliced off just because they were loose.
posted by flabdablet at 3:57 AM on May 12, 2006 [1 favorite]

That's tough because what do we see in magazines, movies and car tire commercials? Perfect bodies damn near everywhere.

(You're never going to look like that.)

Just remember that they don't actually look like that either. For various reasons, we hold recorded images of people to a much higher standard than we hold 'real life' people to.
posted by jedrek at 6:27 AM on May 12, 2006 [1 favorite]

Going through the same thing, same worries, very similar circumstances!! Thanks to anonymous and all posters. It is scary but helps to read others' stories.
posted by theredpen at 4:58 PM on May 12, 2006

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