Refusing a raise
May 17, 2023 4:44 AM Subscribe
Have you and your partner ever been of two minds over a potential raise? My fiancée has been offered the chance to switch from contract to employee at a job he loves. It would be a 15-20% raise, considering the benefits that would be added and the time costs he’d no longer have to spend on taxes and the like. He is resisting, and I don’t understand.
My fiancée has a lot of criteria that he wants his job to meet. Part-time, so that he can work on independent projects, work that he finds intellectually stimulating, supportive boss and colleagues, good pay.
He found a job last year that meets all of these criteria and more. He had been looking for about six months, after about six months of sabbatical he took after quitting a job because he didn’t like the work and felt drained. Many companies were interested, but only if he would work full-time. The current job lets him work from home if he wants, pays for as many hours as he wants to work, with no hard minimum. The boss is supportive and kind, and the team is competent. He respects his colleagues and likes working with them. He gets to work on fun and exciting problems. When he goes to the office, they buy lunch. He has had nothing but good things to say about this job.
Recently, the boss offered a transition to be an employee, with fully-paid benefits, but with an hourly rate. He won’t need to increase the number of hours he works, and can still work more than part-time if he wants. My fiancée reviewed the contract, and got stuck on a couple of clauses. He doesn’t like the fact that the contract asks him to be exclusive to this one company, and that there is a three-month period after separation when he would be barred from working with similar companies.
I am confused. He has not been looking for other work, and has been very vocal for the past two years about wanting to work part time so that he would have time for himself. He had a lot of trouble finding part-time work before this job. He has also taken between six months and a year off of working every time that he’s quit in the past. I understand that he feels some principled objection to agreeing to exclusivity, but I can’t understand why he would reject a huge raise, health insurance, retirement benefits, unemployment protections, and so on at a job he loves and that has seemed to be a perfect fit since day one.
The closest explanation I can imagine is the kind of FOMO that people feel when they get close to being married, and think it means the end of their options. I shared that with him, and he reassured me that he doesn’t feel the same kind of resistance to making our commitment in our relationship. He asked if I’m worried about him being unpredictable, but that’s not it, either. I feel guilty for saying it, but I feel a little angry, and worried that this is a sign of bad judgment, selfishness, or immaturity. I know this is in part because I can’t imagine making this same choice. I don’t know anyone else I can imagine making this choice, either.
I’m not pressuring him to take the agreement, but have asked him to help me understand why this one con outweighs all the pros. He hasn’t turned the offer down yet, just not followed up since the last conversation about it a few weeks back. That worries me, too, because it feels like avoiding unpleasant situations and avoiding the possibility of compromise. I told him about that feeling when we talked tonight. He acknowledges it, but didn’t really have any other response.
There is context insofar as I recently lost my job. I had to search for over a year to find it, in part because I moved to live with my fiancée in a city that doesn’t have a lot of jobs in my field. We’re doing ok, but I’m feeling internal pressure and uncertainty.
We were in couples therapy earlier this year, but our therapist ultimately recommended that we take a break because he shuts down around difficult conversations. He started seeing a therapist earlier this year, and I have a therapist as well. We talk through everything, and he is incredibly supportive of me, but we do have a dynamic where I tend to compromise and he doesn’t. He’s not mean or angry about it, just steadfast in his wants and not very motivated to seek solutions. I have a lot of people-pleasing tendencies, and have been working on them for years. When I look at our relationship, “compromise” on my side doesn’t usually look like I’m giving up much, but I do think it’s added up over time. We’ve talked about this a bit, but our former couples therapist never really worked with us on it.
Have you ever been in this kind of a situation? What can I do to better understand him, or to deal with these worries I have? Some part of me wants to know if I’m being an asshole. Am I dragging drama into this issue by relating it to broader concerns about compromise in our relationship? I’ll be talking with him more about it, but it would help to hear some outside advice.
My fiancée has a lot of criteria that he wants his job to meet. Part-time, so that he can work on independent projects, work that he finds intellectually stimulating, supportive boss and colleagues, good pay.
He found a job last year that meets all of these criteria and more. He had been looking for about six months, after about six months of sabbatical he took after quitting a job because he didn’t like the work and felt drained. Many companies were interested, but only if he would work full-time. The current job lets him work from home if he wants, pays for as many hours as he wants to work, with no hard minimum. The boss is supportive and kind, and the team is competent. He respects his colleagues and likes working with them. He gets to work on fun and exciting problems. When he goes to the office, they buy lunch. He has had nothing but good things to say about this job.
Recently, the boss offered a transition to be an employee, with fully-paid benefits, but with an hourly rate. He won’t need to increase the number of hours he works, and can still work more than part-time if he wants. My fiancée reviewed the contract, and got stuck on a couple of clauses. He doesn’t like the fact that the contract asks him to be exclusive to this one company, and that there is a three-month period after separation when he would be barred from working with similar companies.
I am confused. He has not been looking for other work, and has been very vocal for the past two years about wanting to work part time so that he would have time for himself. He had a lot of trouble finding part-time work before this job. He has also taken between six months and a year off of working every time that he’s quit in the past. I understand that he feels some principled objection to agreeing to exclusivity, but I can’t understand why he would reject a huge raise, health insurance, retirement benefits, unemployment protections, and so on at a job he loves and that has seemed to be a perfect fit since day one.
The closest explanation I can imagine is the kind of FOMO that people feel when they get close to being married, and think it means the end of their options. I shared that with him, and he reassured me that he doesn’t feel the same kind of resistance to making our commitment in our relationship. He asked if I’m worried about him being unpredictable, but that’s not it, either. I feel guilty for saying it, but I feel a little angry, and worried that this is a sign of bad judgment, selfishness, or immaturity. I know this is in part because I can’t imagine making this same choice. I don’t know anyone else I can imagine making this choice, either.
I’m not pressuring him to take the agreement, but have asked him to help me understand why this one con outweighs all the pros. He hasn’t turned the offer down yet, just not followed up since the last conversation about it a few weeks back. That worries me, too, because it feels like avoiding unpleasant situations and avoiding the possibility of compromise. I told him about that feeling when we talked tonight. He acknowledges it, but didn’t really have any other response.
There is context insofar as I recently lost my job. I had to search for over a year to find it, in part because I moved to live with my fiancée in a city that doesn’t have a lot of jobs in my field. We’re doing ok, but I’m feeling internal pressure and uncertainty.
We were in couples therapy earlier this year, but our therapist ultimately recommended that we take a break because he shuts down around difficult conversations. He started seeing a therapist earlier this year, and I have a therapist as well. We talk through everything, and he is incredibly supportive of me, but we do have a dynamic where I tend to compromise and he doesn’t. He’s not mean or angry about it, just steadfast in his wants and not very motivated to seek solutions. I have a lot of people-pleasing tendencies, and have been working on them for years. When I look at our relationship, “compromise” on my side doesn’t usually look like I’m giving up much, but I do think it’s added up over time. We’ve talked about this a bit, but our former couples therapist never really worked with us on it.
Have you ever been in this kind of a situation? What can I do to better understand him, or to deal with these worries I have? Some part of me wants to know if I’m being an asshole. Am I dragging drama into this issue by relating it to broader concerns about compromise in our relationship? I’ll be talking with him more about it, but it would help to hear some outside advice.
First off, depending on where you are, it's quite possible that the noncompete part of the agreement is illegal and/or unenforceable. Or even just talking to the employer about what that "exclusivity" clause would mean - like, what other kinds of work that he would want to do would he be prohibited from doing, and would there be any room for renegotiating that down the road? I think it's very common for exclusivity to be the default, but for exceptions for specific projects to be carved out.
Basically I think you both might be a little naive in thinking that this is a yes/no "accept or reject the contract exactly as it is" situation. He can get out a marker and cross out the parts he doesn't like, then see what happens!
But also, in your shoes, yeah, I would be very frustrated with him for digging in over a principle that would have zero impact on his day-to-day work life (since he doesn't actually want to take on any side jobs) and would improve both of your lives financially. There's a difference between enjoying a shit milkshake and eating your vegetables.
posted by mskyle at 5:08 AM on May 17, 2023 [31 favorites]
Basically I think you both might be a little naive in thinking that this is a yes/no "accept or reject the contract exactly as it is" situation. He can get out a marker and cross out the parts he doesn't like, then see what happens!
But also, in your shoes, yeah, I would be very frustrated with him for digging in over a principle that would have zero impact on his day-to-day work life (since he doesn't actually want to take on any side jobs) and would improve both of your lives financially. There's a difference between enjoying a shit milkshake and eating your vegetables.
posted by mskyle at 5:08 AM on May 17, 2023 [31 favorites]
Maybe I have some insight? I feel like my husband lets perfect be the enemy of the great when it comes to his job with great pay and fantastic benefits for our children. Even thought he had these golden handcuffs on before he met me, and has pretty much made our plans regarding timelines for change… he hasn’t managed to find joy because it’s not in his specific childhood home city. It’s a long story. But anyway, what he wants and desires is super specific and he refuses to be happy otherwise and it’s been a massive bummer for me and prevented me from enjoying things how they are now. I feel like there’s a sense of entitlement there under the surface “I’m entitled to MY perfect job and life, I shouldn’t have to compromise for x periods of time” and it’s weird. I mean is your fiancé taking opportunities off the table? Does this take buying a house off the table? Reduce choices for you guys as a couple in other ways?
posted by pairofshades at 5:09 AM on May 17, 2023 [15 favorites]
posted by pairofshades at 5:09 AM on May 17, 2023 [15 favorites]
You aren’t being an asshole.
It sounds like your partner has an expectation that the world around him will be very specifically catered to his needs. You moved to where he wants to live despite it hurting your own career prospects, and now that you’re out of work he’s not interested in more than what he is contributing now. He seems to be pretty clear that he’s not interested in compromise per your therapy discussions.
A lot of people would struggle to continually compromise to a person who isn’t compromising much with them. It doesn’t feel fair. I don’t have a solution on why he feels the way he does but I just want you to know it’s ok to feel conflicted about his approach to things.
posted by openhearted at 5:11 AM on May 17, 2023 [43 favorites]
It sounds like your partner has an expectation that the world around him will be very specifically catered to his needs. You moved to where he wants to live despite it hurting your own career prospects, and now that you’re out of work he’s not interested in more than what he is contributing now. He seems to be pretty clear that he’s not interested in compromise per your therapy discussions.
A lot of people would struggle to continually compromise to a person who isn’t compromising much with them. It doesn’t feel fair. I don’t have a solution on why he feels the way he does but I just want you to know it’s ok to feel conflicted about his approach to things.
posted by openhearted at 5:11 AM on May 17, 2023 [43 favorites]
Three months is nothing and a non compete clause is straightforward, but as pointed out he’s entitled to his own deal breakers as long as he’s pulling a fair weight for shared bills etc.
What you wrote sounds more like frustration that he’s not putting in effort to help you understand his reasoning, just presenting it as a fait accompli through avoidance and silence. That would be incredibly frustrating especially if that’s the latest in a history of such silences.
You can have a dealbreaker too that you want your partner to be open and up front about their own big decisions. It’s his decision so while you don’t get a vote, you should get a seat at the table to understand.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 5:12 AM on May 17, 2023 [4 favorites]
What you wrote sounds more like frustration that he’s not putting in effort to help you understand his reasoning, just presenting it as a fait accompli through avoidance and silence. That would be incredibly frustrating especially if that’s the latest in a history of such silences.
You can have a dealbreaker too that you want your partner to be open and up front about their own big decisions. It’s his decision so while you don’t get a vote, you should get a seat at the table to understand.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 5:12 AM on May 17, 2023 [4 favorites]
It doesn't sound like you are being an asshole and neither does your fiancée.
You have different deal breakers, a different attitude towards what is an "acceptable compromise", both in your professional work and your personal relationships, and a different definition of "communication".
Those differences are unlikely to fundamentally change. Only you can decide if those differences are YOUR deal breaker.
posted by underclocked at 5:25 AM on May 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
You have different deal breakers, a different attitude towards what is an "acceptable compromise", both in your professional work and your personal relationships, and a different definition of "communication".
Those differences are unlikely to fundamentally change. Only you can decide if those differences are YOUR deal breaker.
posted by underclocked at 5:25 AM on May 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
EVERY job is a temporary job. Frankly, he sounds like he's being unreasonable to me, and not respectful of you. He should be able to explain a situation like this to you as an adult. It's work, it's something you do to pay bills and keep a roof over your head.
Talk to him more. I don't know what else to say. I'm not getting a good feeling about this, especially as to how he's treating you.
posted by SoberHighland at 5:27 AM on May 17, 2023 [20 favorites]
Talk to him more. I don't know what else to say. I'm not getting a good feeling about this, especially as to how he's treating you.
posted by SoberHighland at 5:27 AM on May 17, 2023 [20 favorites]
I've been in a position to turn down a raise, yes, and have done so. My household was comfortable enough with the money I was already making, and the raise would have come with a significant downside (a title bump that would have triggered a return-to-office requirement and had me giving up my mostly-remote status, which would have made me much unhappier than any happiness the extra money could have bought.)
I did discuss it with my partner but only in the sense that I told him what was on the table, that I was pretty firmly settled on my choice, but that I wanted to talk it through with him to see if there was anything he could think of that I was missing in my thought process that might warrant a different choice. I'm the sole earner for our household so my decisions affect both of us, and if he had shown up with a really strong justification for taking that raise I would have considered it. But it's hard to imagine what would have changed my mind. Remote-first is essential to my happiness in my job at this point so if I can support my household well enough on what I'm making now, I'm not willing to trade my dealbreaker away for more money.
To me, my dealbreaker is entirely sane and reasonable, while your husband's sounds pretty silly - but maybe he'd say the same thing about me. I guess I think he's allowed to have his dealbreaker, if you're comfortable enough on what he makes now. But that being a good partner to you should involve actually explaining why it's so important to him and I would say in this specific case it should involve making at least an attempt to redline that contract and send it back with the objectionable parts removed. Maybe they'll negotiate. Hell, maybe they'll accept it exactly the way he likes it. Three months doesn't seem like enough of a bump that it's worth either side putting up much of a fight.
It does sound like the overall pattern re: compromise in your relationship is a problem. I don't know if this is the specific issue where I'd dig in my heels in your shoes, without knowing the overall pattern and context better, but you're not wrong to think the pattern here sounds bad.
posted by Stacey at 5:29 AM on May 17, 2023 [5 favorites]
I did discuss it with my partner but only in the sense that I told him what was on the table, that I was pretty firmly settled on my choice, but that I wanted to talk it through with him to see if there was anything he could think of that I was missing in my thought process that might warrant a different choice. I'm the sole earner for our household so my decisions affect both of us, and if he had shown up with a really strong justification for taking that raise I would have considered it. But it's hard to imagine what would have changed my mind. Remote-first is essential to my happiness in my job at this point so if I can support my household well enough on what I'm making now, I'm not willing to trade my dealbreaker away for more money.
To me, my dealbreaker is entirely sane and reasonable, while your husband's sounds pretty silly - but maybe he'd say the same thing about me. I guess I think he's allowed to have his dealbreaker, if you're comfortable enough on what he makes now. But that being a good partner to you should involve actually explaining why it's so important to him and I would say in this specific case it should involve making at least an attempt to redline that contract and send it back with the objectionable parts removed. Maybe they'll negotiate. Hell, maybe they'll accept it exactly the way he likes it. Three months doesn't seem like enough of a bump that it's worth either side putting up much of a fight.
It does sound like the overall pattern re: compromise in your relationship is a problem. I don't know if this is the specific issue where I'd dig in my heels in your shoes, without knowing the overall pattern and context better, but you're not wrong to think the pattern here sounds bad.
posted by Stacey at 5:29 AM on May 17, 2023 [5 favorites]
There's a set of circumstances in which all of this would be FINE, but he would have to be deeply and collaboratively communicating with you with real enthusiasm for that to be possible.
Because what he's offering you at this point is "take it or leave it", and I would find that pretty fucking insulting. Assuming you have a relatively traditional relationship that is and always will be a financial team, one person can't hoard the reins for themself. And I don't think you're wrong to wonder what else he just simply will refuse to do because it doesn't tick every box for him, including supporting you in anything you want or need to do in your own life and career. You certainly cannot have children with someone who feels it is his right and obligation to nope out on anything he doesn't like (including, horribly, a child who isn't perfect by his definition), and assuming part-time work is sufficient for buying property how can you have any expectation that he won't leave you holding the bag when boring expensive tedious shit needs to be done to it?
I feel like his refusal to explain this line of thought is meant to also excuse him from speaking aloud of the expected financial commitments of a relationship. It just gives him SO much control, and so many future loopholes to exploit.
You know, he got booted from couples therapy for refusing to participate. I think you have reason to be unsettled around this decision and by extension around future decisions, and unfortunately you can't MAKE him be a collaborative partner. It is time for you to sit down and go through everything you know and decide if you can do this long-term if nothing about him ever changes. I wouldn't advise a friend to stay without more answers and more involvement, a lot more, and even then it might reveal a throughline of abusive control-hoarding that leaves you with a pretty rotten foundation.
If he "can't" or won't sit down and explain how this isn't - as it appears to you and me - a damagingly stubborn decision, there is a problem that is either a serious obstacle that needs to be worked on with better therapy OR is something sinister.
posted by Lyn Never at 6:07 AM on May 17, 2023 [42 favorites]
Because what he's offering you at this point is "take it or leave it", and I would find that pretty fucking insulting. Assuming you have a relatively traditional relationship that is and always will be a financial team, one person can't hoard the reins for themself. And I don't think you're wrong to wonder what else he just simply will refuse to do because it doesn't tick every box for him, including supporting you in anything you want or need to do in your own life and career. You certainly cannot have children with someone who feels it is his right and obligation to nope out on anything he doesn't like (including, horribly, a child who isn't perfect by his definition), and assuming part-time work is sufficient for buying property how can you have any expectation that he won't leave you holding the bag when boring expensive tedious shit needs to be done to it?
I feel like his refusal to explain this line of thought is meant to also excuse him from speaking aloud of the expected financial commitments of a relationship. It just gives him SO much control, and so many future loopholes to exploit.
You know, he got booted from couples therapy for refusing to participate. I think you have reason to be unsettled around this decision and by extension around future decisions, and unfortunately you can't MAKE him be a collaborative partner. It is time for you to sit down and go through everything you know and decide if you can do this long-term if nothing about him ever changes. I wouldn't advise a friend to stay without more answers and more involvement, a lot more, and even then it might reveal a throughline of abusive control-hoarding that leaves you with a pretty rotten foundation.
If he "can't" or won't sit down and explain how this isn't - as it appears to you and me - a damagingly stubborn decision, there is a problem that is either a serious obstacle that needs to be worked on with better therapy OR is something sinister.
posted by Lyn Never at 6:07 AM on May 17, 2023 [42 favorites]
What is your current situation re: health insurance? Do you have coverage you're paying for out of pocket? Or are you uninsured? If he's walking away from a contract which offers insurance over some relatively minor negatives and leaving you vulnerable in the case of a medical emergency, that's just foolish and selfish.
If the new contract offers such a big pay bump, how long would it take for the additional money to be equivalent to 3mos of his current salary? I.e. after a length of time the company will essentially be paying him for the non-compete period.
posted by Larry David Syndrome at 6:10 AM on May 17, 2023 [6 favorites]
If the new contract offers such a big pay bump, how long would it take for the additional money to be equivalent to 3mos of his current salary? I.e. after a length of time the company will essentially be paying him for the non-compete period.
posted by Larry David Syndrome at 6:10 AM on May 17, 2023 [6 favorites]
You're out of work because you moved to be with him and he won't take a job that he basically already has with benefits for the both of you because he wants freedom to "work on independent projects"? You're not being an asshole and I would be way, WAY madder than you seem to be. What kind of independent projects? Is he legit writing a novel, training for an Iron Man, etc, or is he just ducking around? It better be the former or I'm pissed for you.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 6:11 AM on May 17, 2023 [44 favorites]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 6:11 AM on May 17, 2023 [44 favorites]
Has he actually asked the company whether those clauses are negotiable? I'm inclined to think he's being unreasonable anyway but if he's nitpicking the contract to you, a person with no control over it, and then not actually negotiating, that's just silly.
posted by babelfish at 6:20 AM on May 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by babelfish at 6:20 AM on May 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
First, I agree with everyone saying that he should negotiate to see if there is flexibility on those points. Perhaps wording could be changed in the "don't work for others" clause to limit that restriction to direct competitors, say.
But second, reading a little between the lines, it sounds like part of the problem here is that he is not approaching this as a partnership thing but rather just what is desirable for him personally. When you are in a situation where you are in a committed relationship and your partner has just lost their job, there needs to be a conversation about "what is good for us?" and possibly a need to suck it up for a little while. Depending on the overall circumstances, it might be important to temporarily take on a less personally desirable option that can provide more money and insurance, or perhaps not -- the point being, if this is a partnership/committed situation, the decision needs to be about "us," rather than just "me."
posted by Dip Flash at 6:43 AM on May 17, 2023 [8 favorites]
But second, reading a little between the lines, it sounds like part of the problem here is that he is not approaching this as a partnership thing but rather just what is desirable for him personally. When you are in a situation where you are in a committed relationship and your partner has just lost their job, there needs to be a conversation about "what is good for us?" and possibly a need to suck it up for a little while. Depending on the overall circumstances, it might be important to temporarily take on a less personally desirable option that can provide more money and insurance, or perhaps not -- the point being, if this is a partnership/committed situation, the decision needs to be about "us," rather than just "me."
posted by Dip Flash at 6:43 AM on May 17, 2023 [8 favorites]
Going against the grain, this is his job opportunity and therefore he gets to decide what are the things he is holding out for and what are the compromises.
You get to say what your needs are ... are your needs being met? You still need work. I think you need more support and communication from your partner. You might need someone who is more compromising. You might need health insurance or more household income. What ever you need or desire that is what you ask for. And that is what you pursue.
This job is not the important thing. Important is you being with someone that you trust, that has your back, that you can build a life with. I hope you all find a way to have these discussions and then you can make decisions for you.
posted by mutt.cyberspace at 6:47 AM on May 17, 2023 [1 favorite]
You get to say what your needs are ... are your needs being met? You still need work. I think you need more support and communication from your partner. You might need someone who is more compromising. You might need health insurance or more household income. What ever you need or desire that is what you ask for. And that is what you pursue.
This job is not the important thing. Important is you being with someone that you trust, that has your back, that you can build a life with. I hope you all find a way to have these discussions and then you can make decisions for you.
posted by mutt.cyberspace at 6:47 AM on May 17, 2023 [1 favorite]
It sounds like you’ve taken a massive career risk by moving and risking your own employment opportunities to be with him (and you lost your job) with maybe unspoken understanding that he would support you, if needed, given what you’ve sacrificed to be with him.
Now when the opportunity presents itself and he can actually step up, and give both of you what you need (benefits, insurance etc) he’s backing out of it.
Now does he have to? Of course not, he has free will. But I would also not be able to trust him to be there for you either.
Mostly because he won’t explain his reasoning so all you’re left with are his actions. (Who know, maybe he’s operating under the assumption you don’t need any of these things as you’ll get your own job soon enough?)
But it must be frustrating to feel that some of your fears until this happens (insurance etc) could so easily be allayed and he won’t do it. Or maybe he will do it, you don’t know because he won’t talk about it. It doesn’t bode well for you as a couple, from a communication point of view or an acting for the benefit of you together as a team point of view either.
I would just be very concerned that while you view him as a partner, you’ve walked away from your life to be with him, he doesn’t seem to view you the same and make decisions unilaterally without discussion that affects you both.
posted by Jubey at 7:00 AM on May 17, 2023 [6 favorites]
Now when the opportunity presents itself and he can actually step up, and give both of you what you need (benefits, insurance etc) he’s backing out of it.
Now does he have to? Of course not, he has free will. But I would also not be able to trust him to be there for you either.
Mostly because he won’t explain his reasoning so all you’re left with are his actions. (Who know, maybe he’s operating under the assumption you don’t need any of these things as you’ll get your own job soon enough?)
But it must be frustrating to feel that some of your fears until this happens (insurance etc) could so easily be allayed and he won’t do it. Or maybe he will do it, you don’t know because he won’t talk about it. It doesn’t bode well for you as a couple, from a communication point of view or an acting for the benefit of you together as a team point of view either.
I would just be very concerned that while you view him as a partner, you’ve walked away from your life to be with him, he doesn’t seem to view you the same and make decisions unilaterally without discussion that affects you both.
posted by Jubey at 7:00 AM on May 17, 2023 [6 favorites]
I have a friend who has a husband with similar stringent requirements about perfectly common clauses in employment agreements, and this has led to some pretty serious financial difficulties for them, on and off, and tremendous trauma and stress for my friend. After watching that dance for several years (he won't accept an otherwise fantastic job offer because he doesn't believe in signing NDAs! so they're just going to keep living on their home equity loan indefinitely!) this kind of refusal to compromise would 100% be a dealbreaker for me. Not in the job. In the relationship.
posted by restless_nomad at 7:04 AM on May 17, 2023 [31 favorites]
posted by restless_nomad at 7:04 AM on May 17, 2023 [31 favorites]
I don't know the circumstances of you moving to be with him. (Maybe he feels like that was "your decision" and not something he asked you to do.) But I do know that if he was thinking in terms of the two of you being a team now and in the future, the current discussion would be much different.
The part about him being fired from couple's therapy isn't great either, in terms of the likely long term success of your partnership. It's ok to hate and reject therapy, but in that case you have to be collaborative and communicative enough with your partner that therapy isn't necessary.
I wonder whether he is one of those men who fear having to support their partner, and is intentionally making it impossible for him to do that, by turning down the fulltime benefits.
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:16 AM on May 17, 2023 [6 favorites]
The part about him being fired from couple's therapy isn't great either, in terms of the likely long term success of your partnership. It's ok to hate and reject therapy, but in that case you have to be collaborative and communicative enough with your partner that therapy isn't necessary.
I wonder whether he is one of those men who fear having to support their partner, and is intentionally making it impossible for him to do that, by turning down the fulltime benefits.
posted by fingersandtoes at 7:16 AM on May 17, 2023 [6 favorites]
I think you're 1000% pulling your own anxieties about your job and the relationship into this issue, which doesn't mean the issue is itself straightforward, just that you're definitely seeing his (potential) decision as being "about" things that maybe it's not about. It sounds like the relationship is maybe pretty imbalanced and not great, and that you don't feel like an actual partner in it, and I have no advice on that.
I will say that I did exactly what your fiancé is considering, and well...it sucks! And I knew in advance that it really might suck, and I thought long and hard about taking the offer when it was made. (And also enraged my partner at the time with my indecision and my ambivalence about how to feel about all of it.) The reason I did it is the money; ultimately, in my life right now, money is the thing I need, and I don't get to prioritize other things over it. If money had not been my chief-above-all priority I would not have done it. When you become an official employee you lose a lot of control over the terms of your job and, as he's noticing, the terms of your other/next jobs. It's very easy for a "perfect fit" contract job to turn into a legit nightmare when it goes permanent.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 7:21 AM on May 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
I will say that I did exactly what your fiancé is considering, and well...it sucks! And I knew in advance that it really might suck, and I thought long and hard about taking the offer when it was made. (And also enraged my partner at the time with my indecision and my ambivalence about how to feel about all of it.) The reason I did it is the money; ultimately, in my life right now, money is the thing I need, and I don't get to prioritize other things over it. If money had not been my chief-above-all priority I would not have done it. When you become an official employee you lose a lot of control over the terms of your job and, as he's noticing, the terms of your other/next jobs. It's very easy for a "perfect fit" contract job to turn into a legit nightmare when it goes permanent.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 7:21 AM on May 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
Leaving aside all the interpersonal stuff, which others have responded to: How sure are you that he will be able to continue on a contract basis if he turns down the offer?
In my experience this type of situation doesn’t translate to “here are two different ways you could continue to work for us” so much as “we need to convert this position to full-time for whatever reason, and are giving you the right of first refusal before putting it on the job market.”
Just something to consider.
posted by staggernation at 7:26 AM on May 17, 2023 [20 favorites]
In my experience this type of situation doesn’t translate to “here are two different ways you could continue to work for us” so much as “we need to convert this position to full-time for whatever reason, and are giving you the right of first refusal before putting it on the job market.”
Just something to consider.
posted by staggernation at 7:26 AM on May 17, 2023 [20 favorites]
Actions speak louder than words. In this case, his refusal or inability to explain his reasoning and the actual decision to forego the change says a lot about him in context of his mindset. I am not putting any value judgment on it, good or bad. I am saying that only you can evaluate what his actions mean to you and your relationship.
posted by JohnnyGunn at 7:45 AM on May 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by JohnnyGunn at 7:45 AM on May 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
I am currently married to someone who finds it very, very hard to compromise or bend in any way when he thinks he is right. I, too, have been a people pleaser for most of my life and don't have a lot of problems with bending to help out those people I love. That said, after 15 years, it has become a Problem because I realized I have bent so many times to keep the peace that I don't know that I can stand up straight anymore.
Whether or not he takes the job is totally up to him but it feels like this is another example of his lack of compromise and that is something to be concerned about. If I could go back and talk to myself when I was still engaged to my now husband, I'd do what I could to make her understand that she cannot spend the next decade compromising and bending to fit his needs without losing something of herself.
This is a good opportunity for you to fully examine the relationship and see if this is a pattern you want to continue for the rest of your life.
posted by teleri025 at 7:56 AM on May 17, 2023 [30 favorites]
Whether or not he takes the job is totally up to him but it feels like this is another example of his lack of compromise and that is something to be concerned about. If I could go back and talk to myself when I was still engaged to my now husband, I'd do what I could to make her understand that she cannot spend the next decade compromising and bending to fit his needs without losing something of herself.
This is a good opportunity for you to fully examine the relationship and see if this is a pattern you want to continue for the rest of your life.
posted by teleri025 at 7:56 AM on May 17, 2023 [30 favorites]
Does he distinguish between sacrifices he is willing to make himself, and sacrifices he is asking of you?
I feel like there's a theme in the world of young idealistic mostly-men who see themselves as willing to live a very spartan, sacrificial life, for sake of The Work*. Then eventually they grow up, recognize the real world and mortgages and all, and make compromises. One of the motivating factors for joining the real world is the recognition that they cannot ask everyone around them to make sacrifices for them or to support them. So if he can distinguish between what he's willing to do (extremes) and what is reasonable to ask of you (less, one would hope), that's a start.
*or in more extreme cases, Not Work For The Man. Or, just not work. But that's a different digression.
posted by Dashy at 8:11 AM on May 17, 2023 [1 favorite]
I feel like there's a theme in the world of young idealistic mostly-men who see themselves as willing to live a very spartan, sacrificial life, for sake of The Work*. Then eventually they grow up, recognize the real world and mortgages and all, and make compromises. One of the motivating factors for joining the real world is the recognition that they cannot ask everyone around them to make sacrifices for them or to support them. So if he can distinguish between what he's willing to do (extremes) and what is reasonable to ask of you (less, one would hope), that's a start.
*or in more extreme cases, Not Work For The Man. Or, just not work. But that's a different digression.
posted by Dashy at 8:11 AM on May 17, 2023 [1 favorite]
As a decision for himself, this would seem misguided to me, but it's his life.
The problem is that it's not a decision just for himself. He's not flying solo anymore. Once you're part of a team, you have to start thinking about what's best for the team, not just yourself. If he's not willing to do so and not willing to work on coming to accept the necessity of doing so, he will be a miserable long-term partner. He will end up with the foot-dragger's veto over your entire shared life, and you won't like what that looks like. Imagine having to argue with a grown man about changing his gaming afternoons to Sundays so he can go to the kid's Saturday soccer games sometimes. That's where this kind of attitude leads.
I'm extremely fond of my autonomy and struggle with compromise all the time--but as an adult who believes in equality in my relationships, I know it's absolutely necessary. I'm not telling you to break up with him, but I am telling you you need to start addressing this now, preferably before marrying him, and absolutely before you have any kids with him.
posted by praemunire at 8:44 AM on May 17, 2023 [12 favorites]
The problem is that it's not a decision just for himself. He's not flying solo anymore. Once you're part of a team, you have to start thinking about what's best for the team, not just yourself. If he's not willing to do so and not willing to work on coming to accept the necessity of doing so, he will be a miserable long-term partner. He will end up with the foot-dragger's veto over your entire shared life, and you won't like what that looks like. Imagine having to argue with a grown man about changing his gaming afternoons to Sundays so he can go to the kid's Saturday soccer games sometimes. That's where this kind of attitude leads.
I'm extremely fond of my autonomy and struggle with compromise all the time--but as an adult who believes in equality in my relationships, I know it's absolutely necessary. I'm not telling you to break up with him, but I am telling you you need to start addressing this now, preferably before marrying him, and absolutely before you have any kids with him.
posted by praemunire at 8:44 AM on May 17, 2023 [12 favorites]
Have you ever been in this kind of a situation?
In my marriage, I've switched careers three times (coming up to #4, although it doesn't come with a compensation cut) and taken lower salaries to do it. So I've been on the other side. Each time I:
- did the math and presented it to my spouse
- tried to get the best job/situation that worked for us each time
- did not have gaps in employment that were up to me (I was laid off for two months once, which is how long it took to get the next job and my child through eye surgery)
Also, at one point my spouse wasn't completing paperwork that eventually got him a $25,000 raise. That was very frustrating. I made a little chart of how much university tuition he could pay with that money (for our kids).
But...all that said, I think your partner is behaving really weirdly. The 3 months is short and possibly not enforceable. For the exclusive work -- is he actually looking to pick up other contracts? Is that what the independent contracts are? I think he should dig into that clause because if it's unrelated, or say he does video editing and he can't make other corporate videos but he can still make music videos, that might be okay?
That said I think --
What can I do to better understand him, or to deal with these worries I have?
I feel like you're substituting "confusion" for "frustration or anxiety or anger." It is a very normal thing for you to feel anxious or frustrated in the situation you've described. It's great that he wants to work part time and has found a good job but even that is a compromise in earning power as a couple, and when you add in that you had to move and give up a career and that you're unemployed, it really isn't confusing, it's anxiety-producing.
It sounds like he doesn't get at all that his decisions impact you, and that's a major concern.
Some part of me wants to know if I’m being an asshole.
No.
Am I dragging drama into this issue by relating it to broader concerns about compromise in our relationship?
No. Financial issues are relationship issues. In my family, we make those decisions together as much as possible.
posted by warriorqueen at 8:46 AM on May 17, 2023 [9 favorites]
In my marriage, I've switched careers three times (coming up to #4, although it doesn't come with a compensation cut) and taken lower salaries to do it. So I've been on the other side. Each time I:
- did the math and presented it to my spouse
- tried to get the best job/situation that worked for us each time
- did not have gaps in employment that were up to me (I was laid off for two months once, which is how long it took to get the next job and my child through eye surgery)
Also, at one point my spouse wasn't completing paperwork that eventually got him a $25,000 raise. That was very frustrating. I made a little chart of how much university tuition he could pay with that money (for our kids).
But...all that said, I think your partner is behaving really weirdly. The 3 months is short and possibly not enforceable. For the exclusive work -- is he actually looking to pick up other contracts? Is that what the independent contracts are? I think he should dig into that clause because if it's unrelated, or say he does video editing and he can't make other corporate videos but he can still make music videos, that might be okay?
That said I think --
What can I do to better understand him, or to deal with these worries I have?
I feel like you're substituting "confusion" for "frustration or anxiety or anger." It is a very normal thing for you to feel anxious or frustrated in the situation you've described. It's great that he wants to work part time and has found a good job but even that is a compromise in earning power as a couple, and when you add in that you had to move and give up a career and that you're unemployed, it really isn't confusing, it's anxiety-producing.
It sounds like he doesn't get at all that his decisions impact you, and that's a major concern.
Some part of me wants to know if I’m being an asshole.
No.
Am I dragging drama into this issue by relating it to broader concerns about compromise in our relationship?
No. Financial issues are relationship issues. In my family, we make those decisions together as much as possible.
posted by warriorqueen at 8:46 AM on May 17, 2023 [9 favorites]
I have been in a similar position as your fiancé multiple times. I'm a developer and I haven't been a direct W-2 employee in 14 years (although I have been a W-2 employee through a contracting agency, more on that later).
Over the years I have been offered to be "brought on" to a company (to convert from contractor to direct W-2 employee) and I've always declined. I've carefully considered the offers but I've found that such a conversion always came with strings that I didn't like. And the client/potential employer and even my friends and family have been shocked that I would give up such an opportunity. Too many people see direct W-2 employment as some kind of holy grail, superior to what is perceived as the instability of contract work, but I've found that's not been the case for me at all.
Working direct W-2 often comes with the types of restrictions that your fiancé has found to be dealbreakers for him, as they would be for me as well. And then there are additional things that are just annoying to me, like mandatory meetings, rigid work schedules, in-office mandates, performance reviews, vulnerability to layoffs, etc. I choose to opt out of all of that and remain independent.
I'm currently working 1099 for 3 main clients. I work as little or as much as I want, my rate is high enough that I can earn in 2 hours what a person with an average salary for my area would earn in a full 8 hour day, and I can work during whatever time of day I wish, fully remotely. I easily provide for my own health insurance benefits and have full options in doing so (I'm not limited to the few or even single option(s) provided by an employer). I contribute to my own retirement plans (IRAs and a solo 401k) and have plenty saved back to take long stretches of "PTO" if I want, but because I need to work so little and I can work from anywhere, I find that I don't really need it. It is ultimate freedom and affords me ultimate flexibility and happiness. I wouldn't trade it for anything.
That said, I wonder if there's another option that would be a compromise for both you and your fiancé. Would he consider working as a contractor via a consulting company? And would the client consider such an arrangement? I find that can provide a middle ground between 1099 contractor and W-2 employee. During my last placement as a W-2 contractor via an agency, I received full benefits including 3 highly discounted health insurance options, excellent 401k match, and 3 weeks of PTO. If that's something that you think might work, you are welcome to memail me and I can share more of my experience. I've worked for different agencies and I can provide some pros/cons and perspectives there.
It seems that you've done the math on the difference in pay/benefits this raise would give your fiancé and determined that difference to be worth the transition but in my experience that difference in nominal and wouldn't come close to changing my mind about staying on contract. When it comes down to it, as long as your fiancé can meet his responsibilities as they relate to the relationship (whatever you've decided as to who contributes how much to the household) then this is ultimately his decision to make and that should be respected.
posted by mezzanayne at 12:12 PM on May 17, 2023 [8 favorites]
Over the years I have been offered to be "brought on" to a company (to convert from contractor to direct W-2 employee) and I've always declined. I've carefully considered the offers but I've found that such a conversion always came with strings that I didn't like. And the client/potential employer and even my friends and family have been shocked that I would give up such an opportunity. Too many people see direct W-2 employment as some kind of holy grail, superior to what is perceived as the instability of contract work, but I've found that's not been the case for me at all.
Working direct W-2 often comes with the types of restrictions that your fiancé has found to be dealbreakers for him, as they would be for me as well. And then there are additional things that are just annoying to me, like mandatory meetings, rigid work schedules, in-office mandates, performance reviews, vulnerability to layoffs, etc. I choose to opt out of all of that and remain independent.
I'm currently working 1099 for 3 main clients. I work as little or as much as I want, my rate is high enough that I can earn in 2 hours what a person with an average salary for my area would earn in a full 8 hour day, and I can work during whatever time of day I wish, fully remotely. I easily provide for my own health insurance benefits and have full options in doing so (I'm not limited to the few or even single option(s) provided by an employer). I contribute to my own retirement plans (IRAs and a solo 401k) and have plenty saved back to take long stretches of "PTO" if I want, but because I need to work so little and I can work from anywhere, I find that I don't really need it. It is ultimate freedom and affords me ultimate flexibility and happiness. I wouldn't trade it for anything.
That said, I wonder if there's another option that would be a compromise for both you and your fiancé. Would he consider working as a contractor via a consulting company? And would the client consider such an arrangement? I find that can provide a middle ground between 1099 contractor and W-2 employee. During my last placement as a W-2 contractor via an agency, I received full benefits including 3 highly discounted health insurance options, excellent 401k match, and 3 weeks of PTO. If that's something that you think might work, you are welcome to memail me and I can share more of my experience. I've worked for different agencies and I can provide some pros/cons and perspectives there.
It seems that you've done the math on the difference in pay/benefits this raise would give your fiancé and determined that difference to be worth the transition but in my experience that difference in nominal and wouldn't come close to changing my mind about staying on contract. When it comes down to it, as long as your fiancé can meet his responsibilities as they relate to the relationship (whatever you've decided as to who contributes how much to the household) then this is ultimately his decision to make and that should be respected.
posted by mezzanayne at 12:12 PM on May 17, 2023 [8 favorites]
I found myself, a few years into my marriage, the primary breadwinner, and I never expected that my now-ex husband would be unemployed or underemployed for so most of the rest of our marriage. We made a decision (or maybe I did? and he just went along out of loyalty?) to move for grad school for me early on, and we moved a few more times for jobs for me, and he never really got over the resentment of that -- which I only found out during the divorce, years later.
It explained so many things. I also learned that he never really looked into more work, even when I was begging him to find a job so I could cut back at mine, which was incredibly stressful and terrible for a good long while. Like, I was crying at home every night over the stress of work, and he never seriously considered working more to help me out because he was still bitter that my career had been prioritized.
He also shut down in tough conversations often. In retrospect, this was a huge problem for us, and it would have been better to think a lot more about what I was getting myself into, and maybe realize that I could find a partner where we functioned much better as a team.
My ex finally did end up finding a full time job that made him happy -- after I told him the marriage was over. (And I'm glad for him, and it's telling that this never happened while we were together.)
posted by bluedaisy at 12:14 PM on May 17, 2023 [9 favorites]
It explained so many things. I also learned that he never really looked into more work, even when I was begging him to find a job so I could cut back at mine, which was incredibly stressful and terrible for a good long while. Like, I was crying at home every night over the stress of work, and he never seriously considered working more to help me out because he was still bitter that my career had been prioritized.
He also shut down in tough conversations often. In retrospect, this was a huge problem for us, and it would have been better to think a lot more about what I was getting myself into, and maybe realize that I could find a partner where we functioned much better as a team.
My ex finally did end up finding a full time job that made him happy -- after I told him the marriage was over. (And I'm glad for him, and it's telling that this never happened while we were together.)
posted by bluedaisy at 12:14 PM on May 17, 2023 [9 favorites]
The closest explanation I can imagine is the kind of FOMO that people feel when they get close to being married, and think it means the end of their options.
trying to make it about fear of commitment is weird because if you think marriage & job are analogous he is giving you nothing but good commitment signals: he held out for a job that wasn't just tolerable but perfect-for-him, and when he was offered something "objectively" more attractive he said No, I have exactly what I want and I stick to it. he knows what he wants, he values it, and he is faithful to it. the status it gives him in the eyes of outside observers is irrelevant. that, to me, is a good quality in a partner. a whole string of good qualities actually.
But more importantly, is he financially stable, able to afford his own health insurance, able to pay his own share of expenses all of the time and cover you for now? I am tentatively assuming the answer is yes because if the answer was no, you would have the right to a vote in this matter and no need to hold back on pressuring him. but as things stand, pressure aside, I don't understand why you would even want him to change anything
posted by queenofbithynia at 4:29 PM on May 17, 2023 [3 favorites]
trying to make it about fear of commitment is weird because if you think marriage & job are analogous he is giving you nothing but good commitment signals: he held out for a job that wasn't just tolerable but perfect-for-him, and when he was offered something "objectively" more attractive he said No, I have exactly what I want and I stick to it. he knows what he wants, he values it, and he is faithful to it. the status it gives him in the eyes of outside observers is irrelevant. that, to me, is a good quality in a partner. a whole string of good qualities actually.
But more importantly, is he financially stable, able to afford his own health insurance, able to pay his own share of expenses all of the time and cover you for now? I am tentatively assuming the answer is yes because if the answer was no, you would have the right to a vote in this matter and no need to hold back on pressuring him. but as things stand, pressure aside, I don't understand why you would even want him to change anything
posted by queenofbithynia at 4:29 PM on May 17, 2023 [3 favorites]
Being a staffer is way different than being freelance. When I went from “permalancer” to in-house at a marketing agency, in was harder to turn down work and control my own workflow. Managers feel more entitled to your time and their ability to use you as a resource. If you have a good, long-term relationship as a contractor, you have more flexibility and can turn down work or take time off more at will. In short, it’s a feeling that the company owns you, and it exists on both sides of the relationship.
posted by slogger at 5:15 PM on May 17, 2023 [8 favorites]
posted by slogger at 5:15 PM on May 17, 2023 [8 favorites]
Hi, OP. I had such a strong emotional reaction to this question on first reading that I refused to answer it until enough other answers had come in that I was tolerably sure I wasn't completely off-base.
The reason for that is that young-I, people pleaser desperate for affection, married a man and promised him, implicitly and ex-, that I'd take care of pretty much all the adulting, he wouldn't have to work full-time and could have all the personal projects he wanted. Um, did I mention the "desperate" bit?
And what happened is that the sumbitch took that for granted, because he's a selfish entitled jerkass. It basically became the way things were supposed to be, unnegotiable, because it was the way things had always been with us. Before we separated, I tried to explain to him that I had given him so much time, so much, and gotten so little in return, and he couldn't even understand what I was saying.
We all have so little time. I'm still so angry at myself for wasting so much of mine on him, and I've been divorced for four years. (I know, I know. It's better than it used to be.)
How much of your one irreplaceable life are you willing to throw away on this man who cannot or will not understand what you are saying when you say you need some very basic things like income and benefits? And a partner who sees and hears you? And is an actual partner, not a mooch? Because I'm sorry, OP, your partner reads to me as exactly the kind of mooch my ex was.
I call him Casaubon these days. I do suggest taking a look at Middlemarch sometime.
posted by humbug at 8:31 PM on May 17, 2023 [9 favorites]
The reason for that is that young-I, people pleaser desperate for affection, married a man and promised him, implicitly and ex-, that I'd take care of pretty much all the adulting, he wouldn't have to work full-time and could have all the personal projects he wanted. Um, did I mention the "desperate" bit?
And what happened is that the sumbitch took that for granted, because he's a selfish entitled jerkass. It basically became the way things were supposed to be, unnegotiable, because it was the way things had always been with us. Before we separated, I tried to explain to him that I had given him so much time, so much, and gotten so little in return, and he couldn't even understand what I was saying.
We all have so little time. I'm still so angry at myself for wasting so much of mine on him, and I've been divorced for four years. (I know, I know. It's better than it used to be.)
How much of your one irreplaceable life are you willing to throw away on this man who cannot or will not understand what you are saying when you say you need some very basic things like income and benefits? And a partner who sees and hears you? And is an actual partner, not a mooch? Because I'm sorry, OP, your partner reads to me as exactly the kind of mooch my ex was.
I call him Casaubon these days. I do suggest taking a look at Middlemarch sometime.
posted by humbug at 8:31 PM on May 17, 2023 [9 favorites]
Could he negotiate a clause in his contract giving him 3 months' severance pay if the company lets him go? That would immediately make the 3-month noncompete irrelevant.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 10:03 PM on May 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 10:03 PM on May 17, 2023 [2 favorites]
One of the things going on his head may be a fear that once he signs on as an official employee, they'll alter the terms on things like telecommuting and flexible hours. But he needs to learn to use his words and talk through the issue(s) with you if you're going to be life-partners.
He has also taken between six months and a year off of working every time that he’s quit in the past.
How open is he with you about his savings? If you're both living off one partner's part-time work, even at a high consulting rate, I doubt he's accumulating the savings to do that again if this golden goose eventually runs out.
posted by Candleman at 7:45 AM on May 18, 2023 [2 favorites]
He has also taken between six months and a year off of working every time that he’s quit in the past.
How open is he with you about his savings? If you're both living off one partner's part-time work, even at a high consulting rate, I doubt he's accumulating the savings to do that again if this golden goose eventually runs out.
posted by Candleman at 7:45 AM on May 18, 2023 [2 favorites]
Leaving aside the personal stuff, which I understand is also something you're concerned about but others will be more able to help you -
This is a non-compete. It sounds like a pretty standard one. It may or may not actually be enforceable in your jurisdiction - your partner should check.
'Can't work for any of our competitors while you're working for us' is so normal as to be non-negotiable. If that's a hard limit for your partner, it really sounds like he's going to have to be a contractor forever, and you have to decide whether you're happy staying with someone who has 'will never be an employee' as a hard limit.
It may or may not be something the company is willing to negotiate and may be more or less constricting depending on the field and who the company views as 'competition' - your partner should check.
There may or may not be jobs that are still in his field and in your region that he can actually do without violating an enforceable non-compete - your partner should check. In my field there are like five companies in the whole country, everyone knows everyone, everyone's HR knows who is under a non-compete, and it's like being radioactive. Moving country is an option, but god.
Three months is a really annoying time because it's too long for most people to be fully out of work but not long enough to get much traction on a stop-gap out-of-field job. If job satisfaction is a major part of your partner's wellbeing baseline general stuff (I don't know! for some people a job is something they endure to get money to do things they actually like, for others it's something that is meaningful and satisfying and important) then being stuck in a job that used to be great but has now changed to become hateful (it happens) for fear of being out of work for three months could be a really big deal.
I'm waiting out a non-compete at the moment and it sucks, so I'm suggesting things I wish I'd done before taking the job that imposed it.
posted by ngaiotonga at 3:04 PM on May 18, 2023 [2 favorites]
This is a non-compete. It sounds like a pretty standard one. It may or may not actually be enforceable in your jurisdiction - your partner should check.
'Can't work for any of our competitors while you're working for us' is so normal as to be non-negotiable. If that's a hard limit for your partner, it really sounds like he's going to have to be a contractor forever, and you have to decide whether you're happy staying with someone who has 'will never be an employee' as a hard limit.
It may or may not be something the company is willing to negotiate and may be more or less constricting depending on the field and who the company views as 'competition' - your partner should check.
There may or may not be jobs that are still in his field and in your region that he can actually do without violating an enforceable non-compete - your partner should check. In my field there are like five companies in the whole country, everyone knows everyone, everyone's HR knows who is under a non-compete, and it's like being radioactive. Moving country is an option, but god.
Three months is a really annoying time because it's too long for most people to be fully out of work but not long enough to get much traction on a stop-gap out-of-field job. If job satisfaction is a major part of your partner's wellbeing baseline general stuff (I don't know! for some people a job is something they endure to get money to do things they actually like, for others it's something that is meaningful and satisfying and important) then being stuck in a job that used to be great but has now changed to become hateful (it happens) for fear of being out of work for three months could be a really big deal.
I'm waiting out a non-compete at the moment and it sucks, so I'm suggesting things I wish I'd done before taking the job that imposed it.
posted by ngaiotonga at 3:04 PM on May 18, 2023 [2 favorites]
I read a few more answers and Blue Daisy’s and Humbug’s made me want to add, it is entirely possible that someone can decide or be incapable of not having difficult conversations or compromising AT ALL. The amount of games people can play to avoid discussing things are infinite. I think this does not bode well for you. You want to have the feeling like you are on the same team and I don’t think you will with this person. It’s the way you described the couples therapy and the way he didn’t expand or continue the conversation when you asked him about this more. What you think doesn’t matter. If they do have to make a big compromise for you then they resent it massively (like blue daisy said) In my experience it just gets worse, worse than you can ever imagine. Like you are speaking Chinese to a brick wall and emotionally very alone .
posted by pairofshades at 4:27 AM on May 19, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by pairofshades at 4:27 AM on May 19, 2023 [1 favorite]
I can imagine that even if every other aspect of being an employee is the same as being a contractor, the idea that he won't have the freedom to work with other people/companies is a big restriction. I can imagine it feels like losing a big freedom, losing out on all the possible things that could happen. Even if he's not actually doing any of that at the moment, it's a sense of possibility, of exciting maybes, that will end if he's an employee with a non-compete clause.
But I can only imagine that's the sticking point because I'm not inside his head, and he should just tell you what the issue is like anyone else in a sensible long term relationship would.
posted by fabius at 6:25 AM on May 19, 2023
But I can only imagine that's the sticking point because I'm not inside his head, and he should just tell you what the issue is like anyone else in a sensible long term relationship would.
posted by fabius at 6:25 AM on May 19, 2023
He has had nothing but good things to say about this job.
He has nothing but good things to say about this job in its current incarnation. That’s a rare thing, at least in my experience. If I were in that situation, I would not want to change my status either. Do you guys have enough money without you working? Are there enough savings to manage if you’re not able to get another job for six months, say? I don’t think you’re being an asshole but I don’t think he’s being an asshole either. I wonder if there is some part of you that would like him to make a choice that he doesn’t want to make because you’ve made a choice that you don’t like by moving to be with your fiancé. Unconsciously, maybe you want him to have to compromise too about something that’s important to him because relocation is a big fucking deal.
Personally, I would investigate the financial situation and make sure I understood what it was and his commitment to being the breadwinner until you are able to get a job that fits you. And if that’s possible, then let him keep his perfect job. There aren’t that many around. Unlike most people here, I don’t think partners need to justify to one another why they want what they want or why they like what they like. As long as the two of you can afford it and you’re not resentful about that specifically, I don’t understand why it’s a problem.
posted by Bella Donna at 4:25 AM on May 23, 2023
He has nothing but good things to say about this job in its current incarnation. That’s a rare thing, at least in my experience. If I were in that situation, I would not want to change my status either. Do you guys have enough money without you working? Are there enough savings to manage if you’re not able to get another job for six months, say? I don’t think you’re being an asshole but I don’t think he’s being an asshole either. I wonder if there is some part of you that would like him to make a choice that he doesn’t want to make because you’ve made a choice that you don’t like by moving to be with your fiancé. Unconsciously, maybe you want him to have to compromise too about something that’s important to him because relocation is a big fucking deal.
Personally, I would investigate the financial situation and make sure I understood what it was and his commitment to being the breadwinner until you are able to get a job that fits you. And if that’s possible, then let him keep his perfect job. There aren’t that many around. Unlike most people here, I don’t think partners need to justify to one another why they want what they want or why they like what they like. As long as the two of you can afford it and you’re not resentful about that specifically, I don’t understand why it’s a problem.
posted by Bella Donna at 4:25 AM on May 23, 2023
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Because it's one of his dealbreakers. Everybody has their own set of those, which is as it should be. There is no objectively correct collection of dealbreakers.
The analogy of the Shit Milkshake is useful here. Think of all the pros you've identified as analogous to improving the freshness of the milk, the quality of the chocolate syrup and the butterfat content of the ice cream plus the new milkshake offer comes with bonus whipped cream and a glacé cherry on top and two straws. Sounds great! Why would anybody reject such a clear upgrade to their existing milkshake just because the new version also contains 2% dogshit?
posted by flabdablet at 4:56 AM on May 17, 2023 [3 favorites]