Dealing with mental illness & financial expectations from parents
July 1, 2022 2:33 AM Subscribe
I'm 24F, and struggle with severe anxiety and PTSD. Currently in therapy, but it'll take a while for me to gain basic functionality. I graduated from college in 2020, and have been unemployed ever since (mostly due to mental illness, but also the pandemic.) My college savings are running out, so I will need to move back in with my parents in order to get back on my feet. My mom wants me to pay rent even though they're financially stable. That feels off to me, but I can't tell if that's an appropriate reaction or if I'm expecting too much here. How should I navigate this?
I get that this might be a contentious question due to the understandably strong and varying opinions people have on their adult children paying/not-paying rent when living back at home, especially when you throw mental illness into the mix, so I'd appreciate sensitivity and care here since this is a tough situation I'm currently living. Thanks! (And I'm posting this anonymously since it has details about my mental health + family.)
Essentially, I've been struggling with my mental health my whole life, and was finally diagnosed with severe PTSD and a whole lot of anxiety that has kept me housebound, semi-suicidal (not anymore, thank god), and generally miserable for most my life. I'm finally in effective treatment, but it will likely take at least 1-3 years for me to gain basic functionality (working a steady job, making more friends, having a relationship, etc.)
Through a Herculean effort and a lot of misery, I graduated college with good grades and a liberal arts degree in mid-2020. However, during and after I never was able to work a paid job due to said severe anxiety and a ton of other disabling symptoms. While I was studying, I was lucky and privileged enough to be able to pay my rent + food using the college fund my parents set up for me when I was a kid, plus there were no tuition fees due to my location (non-US). I know most people don't get that luxury, so I'm incredibly grateful that I got that; not having to handle a job on top of studying full time probably saved my mental health during those 4 years.
After I graduated, I've continued living in my own apartment using what's left of my fund (plus staying a few months with my parents last year for free to supplement that), and trying my best to manage my symptoms in order to eventually start working to get an income. That's taking forever, though, and I'm running low on money. I'll have to move in with my parents in the fall.
My mom brought up the idea of me paying rent while living there this time. It's not set in stone, but the idea is out there. I don't necessarily disagree with her—it can be financially tough to support a whole extra person, and having some money coming in can help. Especially since we're all adults now. If they were in a tough spot financially I'd genuinely have zero problems helping out.
Thing is, I talked to my dad and he said they don't need the money. At all. And since I've always paid for my treatment myself (my parents never really offered, though I do understand that), the only cost of me living there would be food and bills, which isn't an issue for their finances. It seems like my mom wants me to pay rent out of principle, or as a motivator for me to "clean myself up" more quickly, and it has little to do with their actual financial situation.
Knowing that makes me feel unsafe in a way that's hard to describe—like my mom's support is conditional, that I could end up on the street if things got really bad though she denies that—and I can't tell if that's just some kind of unchecked privilege or entitlement I need to work on, or if it's actually kind of strange/unreasonable/etc for her to be asking her mentally ill adult child for rent money when I have no income and little savings left. Maybe I'm framing that unfairly, trying to make myself sound sympathetic, but it feels like a rejection, or a harsh condition for her material support that I can't meet. I'm not saying that everyone who asks for rent money from their adult kids is cruel—in a lot of situations it makes sense or there are no other options; I just can't tell if my case is like those or not.
When I live there, I plan on pitching in with chores, cleaning, dog-walks, etc as much as I am able to, and will do my best to ensure my symptoms don't impact them (no outbursts, no yelling, try to limit anything that might make them uncomfortable or that would be too taxing to handle.) I genuinely can sympathize that this is a scary, complicated situation for everybody, and I'm trying to take responsibility for my part in all this.
If it comes down to it, I will pay rent or food or bills if I need to, but I really cannot shake this sickening sense of coldness from my mom. My mom's never been all that close with me, but this feels harsh, even for her. I know she's worried about me, because what if they die and can't take care of me? So she wants me to be functional and independent as soon as possible. God knows I worry myself sick about that all the time, too, I've been terrified that I'd end up homeless ever since I was 12.
But if I start working now I'll likely go into crisis and shatter my mental health, something my therapist agrees with; we need to take this slowly. I need time—I do want to be independent at some point—and I hate feeling like my own mother refuses to give me another second or that I have to "earn" basic housing and food. I'm incredibly unwell right now and she knows that; it feels harsh for her to expect me to use what little savings I have left to pay to live with my own family while working hard to manage my mental illness long-term. Yet I also understand her perspective and empathize with the difficult position her and my father are in.
In short, my question is this: is my mother being reasonable requesting rent in this situation? How have other families handled financial expectations & boundaries when an adult child has moved back in due to mental illness? Any thoughts, stories or perspectives here would be very appreciated. I know this is an incredibly fraught, sensitive topic, so apologies for that. Thank you.
(If anyone wants to answer this privately instead, I set up a throwaway email: anon98069@gmail.com).
I get that this might be a contentious question due to the understandably strong and varying opinions people have on their adult children paying/not-paying rent when living back at home, especially when you throw mental illness into the mix, so I'd appreciate sensitivity and care here since this is a tough situation I'm currently living. Thanks! (And I'm posting this anonymously since it has details about my mental health + family.)
Essentially, I've been struggling with my mental health my whole life, and was finally diagnosed with severe PTSD and a whole lot of anxiety that has kept me housebound, semi-suicidal (not anymore, thank god), and generally miserable for most my life. I'm finally in effective treatment, but it will likely take at least 1-3 years for me to gain basic functionality (working a steady job, making more friends, having a relationship, etc.)
Through a Herculean effort and a lot of misery, I graduated college with good grades and a liberal arts degree in mid-2020. However, during and after I never was able to work a paid job due to said severe anxiety and a ton of other disabling symptoms. While I was studying, I was lucky and privileged enough to be able to pay my rent + food using the college fund my parents set up for me when I was a kid, plus there were no tuition fees due to my location (non-US). I know most people don't get that luxury, so I'm incredibly grateful that I got that; not having to handle a job on top of studying full time probably saved my mental health during those 4 years.
After I graduated, I've continued living in my own apartment using what's left of my fund (plus staying a few months with my parents last year for free to supplement that), and trying my best to manage my symptoms in order to eventually start working to get an income. That's taking forever, though, and I'm running low on money. I'll have to move in with my parents in the fall.
My mom brought up the idea of me paying rent while living there this time. It's not set in stone, but the idea is out there. I don't necessarily disagree with her—it can be financially tough to support a whole extra person, and having some money coming in can help. Especially since we're all adults now. If they were in a tough spot financially I'd genuinely have zero problems helping out.
Thing is, I talked to my dad and he said they don't need the money. At all. And since I've always paid for my treatment myself (my parents never really offered, though I do understand that), the only cost of me living there would be food and bills, which isn't an issue for their finances. It seems like my mom wants me to pay rent out of principle, or as a motivator for me to "clean myself up" more quickly, and it has little to do with their actual financial situation.
Knowing that makes me feel unsafe in a way that's hard to describe—like my mom's support is conditional, that I could end up on the street if things got really bad though she denies that—and I can't tell if that's just some kind of unchecked privilege or entitlement I need to work on, or if it's actually kind of strange/unreasonable/etc for her to be asking her mentally ill adult child for rent money when I have no income and little savings left. Maybe I'm framing that unfairly, trying to make myself sound sympathetic, but it feels like a rejection, or a harsh condition for her material support that I can't meet. I'm not saying that everyone who asks for rent money from their adult kids is cruel—in a lot of situations it makes sense or there are no other options; I just can't tell if my case is like those or not.
When I live there, I plan on pitching in with chores, cleaning, dog-walks, etc as much as I am able to, and will do my best to ensure my symptoms don't impact them (no outbursts, no yelling, try to limit anything that might make them uncomfortable or that would be too taxing to handle.) I genuinely can sympathize that this is a scary, complicated situation for everybody, and I'm trying to take responsibility for my part in all this.
If it comes down to it, I will pay rent or food or bills if I need to, but I really cannot shake this sickening sense of coldness from my mom. My mom's never been all that close with me, but this feels harsh, even for her. I know she's worried about me, because what if they die and can't take care of me? So she wants me to be functional and independent as soon as possible. God knows I worry myself sick about that all the time, too, I've been terrified that I'd end up homeless ever since I was 12.
But if I start working now I'll likely go into crisis and shatter my mental health, something my therapist agrees with; we need to take this slowly. I need time—I do want to be independent at some point—and I hate feeling like my own mother refuses to give me another second or that I have to "earn" basic housing and food. I'm incredibly unwell right now and she knows that; it feels harsh for her to expect me to use what little savings I have left to pay to live with my own family while working hard to manage my mental illness long-term. Yet I also understand her perspective and empathize with the difficult position her and my father are in.
In short, my question is this: is my mother being reasonable requesting rent in this situation? How have other families handled financial expectations & boundaries when an adult child has moved back in due to mental illness? Any thoughts, stories or perspectives here would be very appreciated. I know this is an incredibly fraught, sensitive topic, so apologies for that. Thank you.
(If anyone wants to answer this privately instead, I set up a throwaway email: anon98069@gmail.com).
There's a different lens through which to look at your mother's idea that you should pay rent that might be of use to you.
Paying rent (or more properly board, if they're also supplying food and utilities) to one's parents for living in their home as an adult is reasonable, regardless of differing financial circumstances, because it establishes and maintains the habit of paying for necessities first and everything else second that's so fundamental to successful adulting.
That, in turn, means that there's a much lower financial barrier to moving out on your own, once you're up to that for whatever other reason; moving out won't suddenly jack up your outgoings anywhere near as much as it would do if you'd been living rent-free before doing so.
So it decouples the point at which you do move out again from the point at which you're confident enough in your own mental health that you could move out again. With a bit of luck you might end up staying at your folks' place for years and years while paying them a rental or board rate that leaves you with no basis for niggling suspicions that your ongoing presence might be a one-sided deal that they're just too polite to object to.
The difference between paying rent to parents and paying it to some unrelated landlord, especially if the parents are in financial circumstances that mean they're not dependent on that rental income for their own security, is that should you fail to get your rent paid you're super unlikely to end up evicted.
The faster you can get past seeing your mother as some kind of ogre on this issue, and move toward open and frank negotiations about what a reasonable rate of rent or board would look like given your circumstances, the less distress will be caused for all and if your mental health is already dubious then removing reasons for distress can only be good.
Given that they're not hurting for money, I would suggest proposing a peppercorn board to begin with that ramps up over time as improvements in your mental health allow. 30% of after-tax income would be a reasonable guideline to work toward as a sustainable rate of board at some point down the track; that's what I paid my own folks for board until I moved out at 30.
posted by flabdablet at 3:02 AM on July 1, 2022 [38 favorites]
Paying rent (or more properly board, if they're also supplying food and utilities) to one's parents for living in their home as an adult is reasonable, regardless of differing financial circumstances, because it establishes and maintains the habit of paying for necessities first and everything else second that's so fundamental to successful adulting.
That, in turn, means that there's a much lower financial barrier to moving out on your own, once you're up to that for whatever other reason; moving out won't suddenly jack up your outgoings anywhere near as much as it would do if you'd been living rent-free before doing so.
So it decouples the point at which you do move out again from the point at which you're confident enough in your own mental health that you could move out again. With a bit of luck you might end up staying at your folks' place for years and years while paying them a rental or board rate that leaves you with no basis for niggling suspicions that your ongoing presence might be a one-sided deal that they're just too polite to object to.
The difference between paying rent to parents and paying it to some unrelated landlord, especially if the parents are in financial circumstances that mean they're not dependent on that rental income for their own security, is that should you fail to get your rent paid you're super unlikely to end up evicted.
The faster you can get past seeing your mother as some kind of ogre on this issue, and move toward open and frank negotiations about what a reasonable rate of rent or board would look like given your circumstances, the less distress will be caused for all and if your mental health is already dubious then removing reasons for distress can only be good.
Given that they're not hurting for money, I would suggest proposing a peppercorn board to begin with that ramps up over time as improvements in your mental health allow. 30% of after-tax income would be a reasonable guideline to work toward as a sustainable rate of board at some point down the track; that's what I paid my own folks for board until I moved out at 30.
posted by flabdablet at 3:02 AM on July 1, 2022 [38 favorites]
All of the above assumes that your PTSD was not caused by parental abuse. If it was, moving back in with them is a bad plan.
posted by flabdablet at 3:03 AM on July 1, 2022 [25 favorites]
posted by flabdablet at 3:03 AM on July 1, 2022 [25 favorites]
I can imagine your mother is doing this out of the best of intentions. She wants you to be well and functional. She might even be thinking of this as a kind of "training wheels" for renting your own place- like, if you can manage to pay some rent to them, with lower consequences than if you were actually renting, it will "train you up" to be able to face the more stressful and potentially risky "real world" renting. She may well be having the (painful, distressing) thought that, well the kid is 24 now and has a degree, how much longer has she got to sort herself out? And so feel it's her job to bootstrap you there.
Obviously this is very painful and distressing for you. I really feel for you. If I were you I would sit down with her and have a heart-to-heart. Tell her what your therapist says about you being too unwell to work. Tell her how afraid you are. Tell her how much you need her unconditional support right now. Tell her all the ways you plan to help out which aren't financial. Tell her how hard you're working on getting better and how much you WISH you could be independent and have an income. Try to get to a level where you can each share your fears about the situation and come to a place where you both feel understood and can work together, instead of you feeling frightened and pressurised and abandoned by her, which will really be very bad for your health to be living with.
My other advice comes from living with my parents as a mentally-ill 20 something. When I moved back, post-college and post-breakdown, my parents wanted me to pay a small contribution to household funds. Not "rent", but just a contribution towards food and bills. And I got a very part time low key job in retail to do so. And also to have my own little bit of spending money. Looking back, I think this was very therapeutic and helped me a huge amount. You don't need to be taking steps in a professional career in order to get out of the house a bit, earn some cash, and work on important life skills. Obviously, work with your therapist- and if you're too ill, you're too ill. But consider that a little part time job (or volunteering to get some resume experience to lead to a part time job) can be really healthy and rewarding and might also help your parents get off your back a little.
Wishing you all the best.
posted by Balthamos at 3:09 AM on July 1, 2022 [18 favorites]
Obviously this is very painful and distressing for you. I really feel for you. If I were you I would sit down with her and have a heart-to-heart. Tell her what your therapist says about you being too unwell to work. Tell her how afraid you are. Tell her how much you need her unconditional support right now. Tell her all the ways you plan to help out which aren't financial. Tell her how hard you're working on getting better and how much you WISH you could be independent and have an income. Try to get to a level where you can each share your fears about the situation and come to a place where you both feel understood and can work together, instead of you feeling frightened and pressurised and abandoned by her, which will really be very bad for your health to be living with.
My other advice comes from living with my parents as a mentally-ill 20 something. When I moved back, post-college and post-breakdown, my parents wanted me to pay a small contribution to household funds. Not "rent", but just a contribution towards food and bills. And I got a very part time low key job in retail to do so. And also to have my own little bit of spending money. Looking back, I think this was very therapeutic and helped me a huge amount. You don't need to be taking steps in a professional career in order to get out of the house a bit, earn some cash, and work on important life skills. Obviously, work with your therapist- and if you're too ill, you're too ill. But consider that a little part time job (or volunteering to get some resume experience to lead to a part time job) can be really healthy and rewarding and might also help your parents get off your back a little.
Wishing you all the best.
posted by Balthamos at 3:09 AM on July 1, 2022 [18 favorites]
Unfortunately, I think, as you've identified, the answers to this are going to be all over the map. Ideally, she wouldn't be charging you and would throw everything she had at supporting your recovery. For whatever reason of her own, she feels that charging you is a stepping stone to helping you recover. It sounds like you have a gut reaction to this but are not entirely settled in your feelings (or you wouldn't be asking us what we think). So a few ways you can handle this ambivalence:
* Have you explained your concerns about relapse to your mother? Do you think there's a way to have that conversation that wouldn't descend into arguing and upset? Perhaps you can practice with your therapist first.
* Can you find a way to make this less black and white? e.g. you pay for your food and share of the bills, but less than full rent. Or you pay nothing/less for a few months and then start increasing your payments gradually.
One of the tough things with our emotions and mental health is finding a balance between two options - trusting your gut and honouring your real feelings, vs. accepting the way things are and just choosing to feel whichever way is going to be most productive. This feels like a good opportunity to explore those two poles and find your way between them. On the one hand, it sounds like you've identified a bit of a gut feeling about this - excellent work - that's a big deal and a good sign for you being in touch with your emotions. On the other hand, you may not have much option, if it turns out your mum is wedded to this route. In which case, feeling angry about it is only going to heighten your distress. Finding a way to think "OK, this is not ideal, and it's made me angry/upset in the first instance. But it's the best path open to me right now, let's work out how to deal with the practicalities of it, and give up trying to be angry about it" is going to give you a much better outcome.
I guess that's just another way of rehashing the old serenity prayer.
posted by penguin pie at 3:17 AM on July 1, 2022 [5 favorites]
* Have you explained your concerns about relapse to your mother? Do you think there's a way to have that conversation that wouldn't descend into arguing and upset? Perhaps you can practice with your therapist first.
* Can you find a way to make this less black and white? e.g. you pay for your food and share of the bills, but less than full rent. Or you pay nothing/less for a few months and then start increasing your payments gradually.
One of the tough things with our emotions and mental health is finding a balance between two options - trusting your gut and honouring your real feelings, vs. accepting the way things are and just choosing to feel whichever way is going to be most productive. This feels like a good opportunity to explore those two poles and find your way between them. On the one hand, it sounds like you've identified a bit of a gut feeling about this - excellent work - that's a big deal and a good sign for you being in touch with your emotions. On the other hand, you may not have much option, if it turns out your mum is wedded to this route. In which case, feeling angry about it is only going to heighten your distress. Finding a way to think "OK, this is not ideal, and it's made me angry/upset in the first instance. But it's the best path open to me right now, let's work out how to deal with the practicalities of it, and give up trying to be angry about it" is going to give you a much better outcome.
I guess that's just another way of rehashing the old serenity prayer.
posted by penguin pie at 3:17 AM on July 1, 2022 [5 favorites]
It's very difficult to answer this question without knowing more about your relationship with your mother.
I wonder if this whole "should they ask me to pay rent" question isn't just the tip of the iceberg of your concerns about the whole idea of living with your parents again.
I might be way off here, but from your question it does not seem like you've had a good, clear talk with them in which everyone can clarify how they see the situation, what everyone's expectations are, any boundaries etc.
I get the impression that you might be making all kinds of assumptions about your mother's opinions and motives. You might be right, or you might not.
Assuming, of course, that the relationship with your parents is healthy, and not the cause of your mental health problems. If that's the case, moving back with them isn't a good idea regardless of the rent question.
posted by Zumbador at 3:21 AM on July 1, 2022 [9 favorites]
I wonder if this whole "should they ask me to pay rent" question isn't just the tip of the iceberg of your concerns about the whole idea of living with your parents again.
I might be way off here, but from your question it does not seem like you've had a good, clear talk with them in which everyone can clarify how they see the situation, what everyone's expectations are, any boundaries etc.
I get the impression that you might be making all kinds of assumptions about your mother's opinions and motives. You might be right, or you might not.
Assuming, of course, that the relationship with your parents is healthy, and not the cause of your mental health problems. If that's the case, moving back with them isn't a good idea regardless of the rent question.
posted by Zumbador at 3:21 AM on July 1, 2022 [9 favorites]
When I live there, I plan on pitching in with chores, cleaning, dog-walks, etc as much as I am able to
That's a potential point of negotiation: perhaps, if they're already paying somebody else to do some of those things, you could propose being paid to do them instead to a similar standard, at a discount rate that reflects the discount they're offering you on board?
Parents can be quite understanding employers.
posted by flabdablet at 3:22 AM on July 1, 2022
That's a potential point of negotiation: perhaps, if they're already paying somebody else to do some of those things, you could propose being paid to do them instead to a similar standard, at a discount rate that reflects the discount they're offering you on board?
Parents can be quite understanding employers.
posted by flabdablet at 3:22 AM on July 1, 2022
Both my kids left school when they reached age 16, for their own different mental health reasons. They're in their late teens now. Neither has immediate plans to leave home, go to college, get a job or any of those other markers of incipient adulthood. I do not charge them rent, nor do I ever intend to do so. I'm glad to have them around, they enrich my life in multiple ways that are independent of anything financial. If you were my kid, you'd have free room & board in perpetuity.
[off topic] Rent is not an inevitable fact of life, nor is paying it a means to earn credentials as an adult. It's an extractive financial arrangement that's based on differential of privilege. I am lucky, because I'm in a position to choose not to contribute towards normalisation of that landlord bullshit by forcing it onto my own kids when they're least able to put up with it.
[back on topic] You say a couple of things that make me wonder about the position & meaning of money in your earlier family life. First is that your father feels financially more secure than your mother. Second is that you had your own fears of precarity (via homelessness) at an early age. I wonder - are your parents' financial circumstances based mainly on your father's earning power, or is he from a wealthier background? Does your mother feel like there's some conditionality in her access to "his" money? She may have her own fears of financial precarity, should circumstances change. I wonder if her worrying about that was a factor in your own fear of homelessness when you were younger.
Either way though - it sucks that you have to psychoanalyse your own parents to understand why they're not offering you a place of safety when you need it most.
posted by rd45 at 3:22 AM on July 1, 2022 [10 favorites]
[off topic] Rent is not an inevitable fact of life, nor is paying it a means to earn credentials as an adult. It's an extractive financial arrangement that's based on differential of privilege. I am lucky, because I'm in a position to choose not to contribute towards normalisation of that landlord bullshit by forcing it onto my own kids when they're least able to put up with it.
[back on topic] You say a couple of things that make me wonder about the position & meaning of money in your earlier family life. First is that your father feels financially more secure than your mother. Second is that you had your own fears of precarity (via homelessness) at an early age. I wonder - are your parents' financial circumstances based mainly on your father's earning power, or is he from a wealthier background? Does your mother feel like there's some conditionality in her access to "his" money? She may have her own fears of financial precarity, should circumstances change. I wonder if her worrying about that was a factor in your own fear of homelessness when you were younger.
Either way though - it sucks that you have to psychoanalyse your own parents to understand why they're not offering you a place of safety when you need it most.
posted by rd45 at 3:22 AM on July 1, 2022 [10 favorites]
I don’t know of any culture on this planet (and I’ve lived in more than a dozen countries) besides Christian-American, who would in a million years find it acceptable to ask an adult child to pay rent. I will never stop feeling shocked that this is a thing in the United States.
posted by asimplemouse at 3:49 AM on July 1, 2022 [16 favorites]
posted by asimplemouse at 3:49 AM on July 1, 2022 [16 favorites]
If you parents are abusive clearly you should not move back in with them but focus all your efforts on figuring out what alternative support is available to you to allow you to live elsewhere. Disregard everything I'm going to say in that case.
it sucks that you have to psychoanalyse your own parents to understand why they're not offering you a place of safety when you need it most.
Not sure that is a very helpful interpretation to put on it.
For most parents this is not about the money they charge for board but about the fact that you are moving back as adult. You were (most likely) a teenager when you moved out and you're now coming back as adult and would like to be treated as one. That means everybody has to re-set and adjust their expectations and behaviour. The relationship should become much more equal. So the best interpretation here is that your mother simply wants to treat you as adult and is using this request for board as one of the ways of doing that.
Unfortunately, adults have to figure out how to eat and live and pay for various other things even if their (mental) health challenges make that difficult. It is unlikely that she intended to trigger these extreme fears about homelessness by making that request. That's your anxiety talking. For most non-abusive parents it would take a lot before they ask their children to move out if these children have nowhere else to go.
Now, despite your real struggles and challenges, you will have to figure out how to live with your parents as adult. Despite your mother's request, that may not entail a (significant) financial contribution. But you do have to sit down as a family and agree what your moving back will look like.
Be honest about your health and financial constraints, your fears, hopes and plans for your recovery. As you've been living independently they may not really understand how dire the situation was and how much progress you've already made. In that case, tell them.
Be honest about where you're at now and where you hope to get to and your timeframe and what that means in terms of what you can contribute at the moment and what you hope to contribute as you recover. And let them be honest as well.
Talk about everybody's expectations around
- participation in family life and activities including meals
- participation in domestic labour/effort to run the home
- privacy
- financial responsibilities
- etc
and agree what these things will look like initially.
And also talk about how you'll revisit what you agree now every x months. Basically, have an adult conversation about this. Work with your therapist about what you feel you can offer as contribution (monetary or otherwise) and practice articulating these things.
Your parents are not denying you safety - they are opening their home for you again after all and they are unlikely to kick you out once you've moved in. But I really feel that if you can try to look at this as request to figure out how you'll now live together as adults that would set you up for a much better outcome.
posted by koahiatamadl at 4:20 AM on July 1, 2022 [23 favorites]
it sucks that you have to psychoanalyse your own parents to understand why they're not offering you a place of safety when you need it most.
Not sure that is a very helpful interpretation to put on it.
For most parents this is not about the money they charge for board but about the fact that you are moving back as adult. You were (most likely) a teenager when you moved out and you're now coming back as adult and would like to be treated as one. That means everybody has to re-set and adjust their expectations and behaviour. The relationship should become much more equal. So the best interpretation here is that your mother simply wants to treat you as adult and is using this request for board as one of the ways of doing that.
Unfortunately, adults have to figure out how to eat and live and pay for various other things even if their (mental) health challenges make that difficult. It is unlikely that she intended to trigger these extreme fears about homelessness by making that request. That's your anxiety talking. For most non-abusive parents it would take a lot before they ask their children to move out if these children have nowhere else to go.
Now, despite your real struggles and challenges, you will have to figure out how to live with your parents as adult. Despite your mother's request, that may not entail a (significant) financial contribution. But you do have to sit down as a family and agree what your moving back will look like.
Be honest about your health and financial constraints, your fears, hopes and plans for your recovery. As you've been living independently they may not really understand how dire the situation was and how much progress you've already made. In that case, tell them.
Be honest about where you're at now and where you hope to get to and your timeframe and what that means in terms of what you can contribute at the moment and what you hope to contribute as you recover. And let them be honest as well.
Talk about everybody's expectations around
- participation in family life and activities including meals
- participation in domestic labour/effort to run the home
- privacy
- financial responsibilities
- etc
and agree what these things will look like initially.
And also talk about how you'll revisit what you agree now every x months. Basically, have an adult conversation about this. Work with your therapist about what you feel you can offer as contribution (monetary or otherwise) and practice articulating these things.
Your parents are not denying you safety - they are opening their home for you again after all and they are unlikely to kick you out once you've moved in. But I really feel that if you can try to look at this as request to figure out how you'll now live together as adults that would set you up for a much better outcome.
posted by koahiatamadl at 4:20 AM on July 1, 2022 [23 favorites]
I don’t know of any culture on this planet (and I’ve lived in more than a dozen countries) besides Christian-American, who would in a million years find it acceptable to ask an adult child to pay rent. I will never stop feeling shocked that this is a thing in the United States.
It would be normal to ask an adult child to pay rent, but more often called 'houskeeping' in the UK. Particularly in a working class or lower middle class family. In all the examples I can think of it's tied to income/job, so you would pay more if you earned more. Sometimes where parents don't need the money they give some or all of it back in the form of a gift when the child has moved out.
posted by plonkee at 4:28 AM on July 1, 2022 [13 favorites]
It would be normal to ask an adult child to pay rent, but more often called 'houskeeping' in the UK. Particularly in a working class or lower middle class family. In all the examples I can think of it's tied to income/job, so you would pay more if you earned more. Sometimes where parents don't need the money they give some or all of it back in the form of a gift when the child has moved out.
posted by plonkee at 4:28 AM on July 1, 2022 [13 favorites]
This is going to be a complicated one no matter how you slice and dice it.
On a practical level, I would suggest that you sit down with your parents and talk to them about your plans, goals, hopes, and fears for the next say, 6 months and then a few years out. If you have a solid plan, it may totally shift the conversation. Treatment is work, for sure, and it can be full time work.
For me as a parent, I wouldn't be concerned with whether you were paying,. I'd be concerned for you (and for our relationship) about supporting you in taking steps that would help you feel agency, connection, and capability in your life and for us to interact as adults. For my kids, they will always have a home with me. But I can see asking them to contribute financially. I'd save the money up for them.
Having been the rent-paying child with PTSD,* having pursued fairly intensive treatment for PTSD, and having been in support groups with people with PTSD, I don't see your mum's approach as inherently wrong.
A lot depends on the tone of it and the way your parents operate. But I have known people who moved home (nothing wrong with that) and who then got stuck in patterns that became detrimental to their treatment, which was the issue. It was sort of like staying in a bad marriage, being 'the child' at home sucked the life out of them at the end of the day.
A red flag I see just in your post though: you were worried about homelessness at 12. Why? If it was economic precarity, having zero income may not help. If it was because you had an underlying sense your parents could throw you out...that speaks volumes. I would be careful about becoming fully dependent in that case whether that's working or looking for alternative supports. Otherwise you may just shift from being anxious at work to being anxious that you're going to lose your home and I don't know that that's a net gain, if that makes sense?
Finally...I think you and your therapist know best. But I will say that when I did enter really good therapy (by which time I was working full time), my therapist and I disagreed on whether working full time was possible or good for me. She thought it was too much. For me though, it was a net good and after a year she agreed. For me
It also really helped me to have something to focus on/all day on that wasn't Past Shit. Some days it was really hard to drag myself out of bed after flashbacks and get to answering emails. But doing that also gave me an...off switch that I needed. I didn't "have to" work; my husband would have totally supported me.
This is very personal and it totally may not describe you. I think though that if your mother is actually supportive and caring, talking it over with her may help at both ends.
In some cultures for sure rent is not a part of family, but those cultures sometimes have other ways of establishing norms that aren't always conducive to mental health either because they may not see the child in the relationship as having agency. So for example, not paying rent but being expected to be a caretaker can be just as intense a demand.
posted by warriorqueen at 4:47 AM on July 1, 2022 [16 favorites]
On a practical level, I would suggest that you sit down with your parents and talk to them about your plans, goals, hopes, and fears for the next say, 6 months and then a few years out. If you have a solid plan, it may totally shift the conversation. Treatment is work, for sure, and it can be full time work.
For me as a parent, I wouldn't be concerned with whether you were paying,. I'd be concerned for you (and for our relationship) about supporting you in taking steps that would help you feel agency, connection, and capability in your life and for us to interact as adults. For my kids, they will always have a home with me. But I can see asking them to contribute financially. I'd save the money up for them.
Having been the rent-paying child with PTSD,* having pursued fairly intensive treatment for PTSD, and having been in support groups with people with PTSD, I don't see your mum's approach as inherently wrong.
A lot depends on the tone of it and the way your parents operate. But I have known people who moved home (nothing wrong with that) and who then got stuck in patterns that became detrimental to their treatment, which was the issue. It was sort of like staying in a bad marriage, being 'the child' at home sucked the life out of them at the end of the day.
A red flag I see just in your post though: you were worried about homelessness at 12. Why? If it was economic precarity, having zero income may not help. If it was because you had an underlying sense your parents could throw you out...that speaks volumes. I would be careful about becoming fully dependent in that case whether that's working or looking for alternative supports. Otherwise you may just shift from being anxious at work to being anxious that you're going to lose your home and I don't know that that's a net gain, if that makes sense?
Finally...I think you and your therapist know best. But I will say that when I did enter really good therapy (by which time I was working full time), my therapist and I disagreed on whether working full time was possible or good for me. She thought it was too much. For me though, it was a net good and after a year she agreed. For me
It also really helped me to have something to focus on/all day on that wasn't Past Shit. Some days it was really hard to drag myself out of bed after flashbacks and get to answering emails. But doing that also gave me an...off switch that I needed. I didn't "have to" work; my husband would have totally supported me.
This is very personal and it totally may not describe you. I think though that if your mother is actually supportive and caring, talking it over with her may help at both ends.
In some cultures for sure rent is not a part of family, but those cultures sometimes have other ways of establishing norms that aren't always conducive to mental health either because they may not see the child in the relationship as having agency. So for example, not paying rent but being expected to be a caretaker can be just as intense a demand.
posted by warriorqueen at 4:47 AM on July 1, 2022 [16 favorites]
prereq) part time low expectation job
a) pay for your own groceries, or fraction thereof.
b) do the chores you offered without expectation or resentment.
c) offer a way-way-below-market rate for rent. it's a token of goodwill and intention.
d) start a move-out savings account that will be up to level on your target date.
e) renogotiate with friendly goodwill and integrity as circumstances evolve.
posted by j_curiouser at 4:47 AM on July 1, 2022 [5 favorites]
a) pay for your own groceries, or fraction thereof.
b) do the chores you offered without expectation or resentment.
c) offer a way-way-below-market rate for rent. it's a token of goodwill and intention.
d) start a move-out savings account that will be up to level on your target date.
e) renogotiate with friendly goodwill and integrity as circumstances evolve.
posted by j_curiouser at 4:47 AM on July 1, 2022 [5 favorites]
I’ve been a close witness to several family members who had adult children stay with them for long (multi-year) periods of time and often felt that it would have been to everyone’s advantage, and most particularly the children, if there had been some kind of rent expectation to ease/encourage the eventual transition toward independent living. The specific circumstances here with mental illness that precludes a job may mean it wouldn’t be appropriate in this case, but pushing back against commenters suggesting it’s a heartless approach in all situations, and the idea that it mean the parents are only offering love/support conditionally.
I think it’s reasonable to make a contribution to the household that signifies that this is a different relationship than when you were a child. But it sounds like it cant be income if you’re unable to have a job, so I think a conversation with your parents where you share how you do plan to contribute makes sense - above and beyond “chores” which sound like what a child would be expecting to do. Cooking dinner and/or washing dishes on a regular basis, plus the dog-walking, for example.
posted by purplevelvet at 4:48 AM on July 1, 2022 [11 favorites]
I think it’s reasonable to make a contribution to the household that signifies that this is a different relationship than when you were a child. But it sounds like it cant be income if you’re unable to have a job, so I think a conversation with your parents where you share how you do plan to contribute makes sense - above and beyond “chores” which sound like what a child would be expecting to do. Cooking dinner and/or washing dishes on a regular basis, plus the dog-walking, for example.
posted by purplevelvet at 4:48 AM on July 1, 2022 [11 favorites]
Whoops, forgot the * - my mother was not respectful about demanding rent (don't be a lazy mess you lousy daughter kind of tone), and it remains a sore spot -- but then, it was also a good reason to GTFO of there.
posted by warriorqueen at 4:49 AM on July 1, 2022
posted by warriorqueen at 4:49 AM on July 1, 2022
Seconding that it is quite common in the UK. I believe some parents give it back to children on moving out, but there are a lot of households where, once you start earning money, you're expected to contribute (even if that contribution is designed to prepare for the realities of living independently).
posted by mippy at 4:49 AM on July 1, 2022 [9 favorites]
posted by mippy at 4:49 AM on July 1, 2022 [9 favorites]
It's not unreasonable, strange, or harsh to ask you to pay rent in the context of American societal norms. But it's also not inevitable; many families wouldn't in a million years think to charge a returning child rent, and many would find some other way for you to contribute. I think the best approach might be to approach it as "I hear that you want me to contribute in a reliable, regular, concrete way beyond 'I'll try to help when I can'. I agree, but my treatment team doesn't think I should work* right now. So can we figure out together another way for me to contribute? " That might look like cooking three nights a week and doing all the laundry, or whatever other chores you pick - but something significant that you are completely responsible for, on a regular schedule, that makes their lives easier. It might also give you an opening to find out what she's really asking of you; is it "pay your share" or is it "take concrete steps toward interacting with the outside world in a reliable way that can help you build skills?" If it's the latter, maybe a volunteer gig would be as acceptable as a job, and maybe that's more manageable for you.
*You don't have to tell us, but something to think about - is your therapist's recommendation that you not work at all, or is it that you not work in your chosen field, not work a 40 hour week, etc.? Would your therapist feel the same way about you picking up a few hours a week of retail work somewhere or taking the occasional dog walking gig? Very possibly so, I can imagine a lot of good reasons why not working at all would be the best thing for your mental health right now. But if there's ambiguity here, have the discussion with your therapist.
posted by Stacey at 5:05 AM on July 1, 2022 [10 favorites]
*You don't have to tell us, but something to think about - is your therapist's recommendation that you not work at all, or is it that you not work in your chosen field, not work a 40 hour week, etc.? Would your therapist feel the same way about you picking up a few hours a week of retail work somewhere or taking the occasional dog walking gig? Very possibly so, I can imagine a lot of good reasons why not working at all would be the best thing for your mental health right now. But if there's ambiguity here, have the discussion with your therapist.
posted by Stacey at 5:05 AM on July 1, 2022 [10 favorites]
Sorry this is not exactly a direct answer to your question.
When living at home over summers with my parents, which could be quite stressful, I started house sitting and pet sitting which both provided a way to be out of my parents’ house and a chill way to make a little cash. Where I was living at the time, lots of folks were thrilled to hire a young college grad at reasonable rates to stay in their home while they were traveling for weeks or even months at a time.
This may not make sense for your situation, but just thought it was a potential option especially if you already have a dog and know how to take care of dogs.
posted by forkisbetter at 5:32 AM on July 1, 2022 [1 favorite]
When living at home over summers with my parents, which could be quite stressful, I started house sitting and pet sitting which both provided a way to be out of my parents’ house and a chill way to make a little cash. Where I was living at the time, lots of folks were thrilled to hire a young college grad at reasonable rates to stay in their home while they were traveling for weeks or even months at a time.
This may not make sense for your situation, but just thought it was a potential option especially if you already have a dog and know how to take care of dogs.
posted by forkisbetter at 5:32 AM on July 1, 2022 [1 favorite]
It sounds like your parents gave you the money ("savings") to start with, for college, and now that is complete? No, it is not unreasonable for them to ask you give to some of the excess back if you move in with them. (My 23y.o. child currently lives rent free in my house fwiw.)
posted by Press Butt.on to Check at 5:58 AM on July 1, 2022 [8 favorites]
posted by Press Butt.on to Check at 5:58 AM on July 1, 2022 [8 favorites]
As a survivor of a situation like this, when an older sibling moved back in with my parents, I can offer a slightly different perspective. Your parents have undoubtably heard stories about kids moving back in and never leaving, never making an effort to work on their mental health, never contributing to the household either financially or otherwise. In that story, the kid stayed in the home forever, and everyone was miserable, and no one ever felt safe, and eventually the parents died and the kid was out on the streets and had never learned to support themselves or be independent. That's my family's story. (I don't use the term "survivor" lightly.)
If your parents are anything like mine were, they've spent time trying to figure out how to make this work for you without making you dependent on them forever - trying to figure out how to keep you safe in their home without allowing you to stagnate. One of the first suggestions they will have heard, and they will have heard it a LOT, is to make you pay some token form of rent. The idea isn't to make you pay to feel safe; it's to take away an incentive (financial security) for remaining dependent. It was probably coupled with "make them get a job".
So while it is a tone-deaf ask from your perspective, it might help if you view it through this lens -- it may have nothing to do with coldness or your parents not loving you enough to help you. It's more likely a way that they think they ARE helping you. I think this is especially likely to be the case if they don't really need the money. Realistically, your parents are likely aware that once you live with them again, you're probably there to stay until YOU want to leave again - so the risk is that you will never want to leave again. Even in a perfectly, mutually open and loving relationship without any trust issues, that is a situation that is only tenable as long as the parents are alive to shelter the adult child. Your parents may be trying to avoid a future where they are gone, and you have never gained the skills or financial buffer you need to live as an independent person.
I think the advice others have given above is good, in terms of navigating this situation. If they're set on this course, the only way to move them from it is to offer other, non-financial, concrete ways in which you will contribute to the household, and show that you've given thought to how to regain independence - that independence is in fact your main goal. I don't have any other advice to offer on how to do that - I just wanted you to see that the request they're making, while it may be untenable for you, can come from a place of love rather than coldness. If that's the case, that is something you can actually talk about together and find alternate solutions.
posted by invincible summer at 6:09 AM on July 1, 2022 [28 favorites]
If your parents are anything like mine were, they've spent time trying to figure out how to make this work for you without making you dependent on them forever - trying to figure out how to keep you safe in their home without allowing you to stagnate. One of the first suggestions they will have heard, and they will have heard it a LOT, is to make you pay some token form of rent. The idea isn't to make you pay to feel safe; it's to take away an incentive (financial security) for remaining dependent. It was probably coupled with "make them get a job".
So while it is a tone-deaf ask from your perspective, it might help if you view it through this lens -- it may have nothing to do with coldness or your parents not loving you enough to help you. It's more likely a way that they think they ARE helping you. I think this is especially likely to be the case if they don't really need the money. Realistically, your parents are likely aware that once you live with them again, you're probably there to stay until YOU want to leave again - so the risk is that you will never want to leave again. Even in a perfectly, mutually open and loving relationship without any trust issues, that is a situation that is only tenable as long as the parents are alive to shelter the adult child. Your parents may be trying to avoid a future where they are gone, and you have never gained the skills or financial buffer you need to live as an independent person.
I think the advice others have given above is good, in terms of navigating this situation. If they're set on this course, the only way to move them from it is to offer other, non-financial, concrete ways in which you will contribute to the household, and show that you've given thought to how to regain independence - that independence is in fact your main goal. I don't have any other advice to offer on how to do that - I just wanted you to see that the request they're making, while it may be untenable for you, can come from a place of love rather than coldness. If that's the case, that is something you can actually talk about together and find alternate solutions.
posted by invincible summer at 6:09 AM on July 1, 2022 [28 favorites]
Have you ever worked? Before I worked a job, shy, socially anxious and depressed me was absolutely terrified and convinced it would be a terrible experience. Actually, working saved my life. Work is not like a family, and it is not like school. It is not actually an arbitrary, private sphere of power that is insular and competitive. Work is, surprisingly, a regulated public sphere that, in my experience, usually feels better than either of the former two environments. Because workplaces have to achieve tangible results, the amount that someone can completely fail to cooperate with others is somewhat limited. Laws exist to protect workers. Working was also, on a purely practical level, much, much easier than school (or pleasing my parents) for me personally.
That bad feeling that you have is telling you that if you become dependent on your parents, your job will be "pleasing your parents." You will not truly be free or truly be "unemployed." They will become your "bosses."
I know there is a lot of general rhetoric around work being demeaning, and it is true that some workplaces can be toxic. However, working for a wage was the most freeing experience of my life, and I mean that. It empowered me and gave me a deep self-respect that nothing else ever has.
posted by stockpuppet at 6:16 AM on July 1, 2022 [40 favorites]
That bad feeling that you have is telling you that if you become dependent on your parents, your job will be "pleasing your parents." You will not truly be free or truly be "unemployed." They will become your "bosses."
I know there is a lot of general rhetoric around work being demeaning, and it is true that some workplaces can be toxic. However, working for a wage was the most freeing experience of my life, and I mean that. It empowered me and gave me a deep self-respect that nothing else ever has.
posted by stockpuppet at 6:16 AM on July 1, 2022 [40 favorites]
The problem here isn't rent, it's that you don't have your own financial resources and don't have a plan for gaining any for at least a year. Judging by your long history of PTSD and the tension already going on around rent, living in total dependence on family is going to worsen your mental health, not improve it.
I would begin looking for part time work or volunteer opportunities now, and if those are really impossible, look into disability.
posted by kingdead at 7:08 AM on July 1, 2022 [12 favorites]
I would begin looking for part time work or volunteer opportunities now, and if those are really impossible, look into disability.
posted by kingdead at 7:08 AM on July 1, 2022 [12 favorites]
Mod note: Several deleted. Remember Ask Metafilter is for answering the OP's question in a direct and helpful way, not for chatting, arguing, or debating with other answerers.
posted by taz (staff) at 7:09 AM on July 1, 2022
posted by taz (staff) at 7:09 AM on July 1, 2022
I don't know your specific story or situation but I'll just add this: Your parents are also people with feelings, desires, goals, social pressures, stressors, etc. I think it's good to keep in mind as you think about this that you will have an impact on them by moving back in.
posted by latkes at 7:12 AM on July 1, 2022 [13 favorites]
posted by latkes at 7:12 AM on July 1, 2022 [13 favorites]
Since your parents don't need the money, perhaps your mother's motivation is: It is likely that paying rent will help you feel more independent and self-sufficient, and will help ensure that you continue to feel like a contributing adult, and that it will help you feel stronger, more confident, and less dependent (ie, not reverting back to being a child whose parents financially support them but, instead, an independent adult boarding with other, equal adults ... who, as a bonus in this case, love them in that special parent/child way).
posted by SageTrail at 7:21 AM on July 1, 2022 [6 favorites]
posted by SageTrail at 7:21 AM on July 1, 2022 [6 favorites]
This is a pretty popular concept for boomerang kids in the advice columns these days. Typically it is suggested that the parent put the rent money into a savings account for the kid for when they launch. See if that is what your mom had in mind. But more to the point, does your mom see you as being a boomerang kid (i.e. can't launch because pandemic, you aren't stepping up etc.) or does she see you as having to move home because of severe illness. It sounds like based on the rent ask she thinks you are the first, and you feel you are the second. This sounds like a set up for a very bad experience for all. Do you have any other housing options here? Someone mentioned going on disability, is that an option where you live?
posted by Toddles at 7:33 AM on July 1, 2022 [7 favorites]
posted by Toddles at 7:33 AM on July 1, 2022 [7 favorites]
One vote for charging rent as appropriate, and creating some effective protections/framework for both of you. I have a much younger family member living with me, and charge (very modest) rent, but also allow them to work at 2x minimum wage to pay off monthly rent for various around the house projects. Some months I get rent, some months I get a bunch of house projects done.
If you’re uncomfortable paying rent, I would think about perhaps looking for government subsidized housing close by your parents (in the US, this might be section 8 or disability, but I know you mention you’re not in the US)
posted by arnicae at 7:36 AM on July 1, 2022 [4 favorites]
If you’re uncomfortable paying rent, I would think about perhaps looking for government subsidized housing close by your parents (in the US, this might be section 8 or disability, but I know you mention you’re not in the US)
posted by arnicae at 7:36 AM on July 1, 2022 [4 favorites]
From a practical standpoint: I think it's a good idea to have a set rent amount. In my experience, when I've lived with my parents and had a set rent amount, I paid them that amount and then could do what I liked with the money left over, including save it so I could move away again. I gave them small amounts otherwise if they were short for some reason, but my rent was generally considered enough by both of us. Conversely, when I've lived with my parents and not had a set rent amount, I've ended up just giving whatever money they needed/wanted, which ended up with me having literally $0 and needing to take out loans, etc. Everyone was resentful (it was never enough for them, it was always too much for me), and really did feel like it robbed me of my independence.
Regarding the amount: to come up with the rent amount, we split the mortgage roughly three ways (me, my mom, my dad) and I paid my third. I still was paying the least because I wasn't really contributing to food and utilities costs. But it was a real amount that at least kind of offset the cost of me being there. I also paid for all my personal bills, health insurance and transportation and clothes and phone and all that. I thought that worked well.
In terms of whether it is cold-hearted of your mom to ask you for money: maybe, but since she wants a nominal, set amount and it sounds like your parents are stable (at least financially), I think this is likely her attempt to give you some structure and a sense of independence. I think it's a valid parenting decision, even if not every parent would make it, and you shouldn't take it personally or be offended.
Anyhow, I definitely would not ask her if she's going to save the money for you to use when you move out. Just as a human-relations thing, I think that's a bad idea. I also would not frame chores as an alternative to rent. You're going to be expected to do household chores as a member of the household, making it an "extra" is going to make it sound like living with you will be a nightmare. Same thing for trying to contain your outbursts and yelling -- that's a baseline expectation, making it sound like an "extra" thing you're doing for them in lieu of rent is going to make them pretty nervous about living with you. And making them nervous will just make the whole situation more tense.
Also, if I had it to do over again, I would not move back in with my parents for any reason. I think for some people it can work, but if your mental health is shaky it can be a pressure cooker.
posted by rue72 at 9:01 AM on July 1, 2022 [8 favorites]
Regarding the amount: to come up with the rent amount, we split the mortgage roughly three ways (me, my mom, my dad) and I paid my third. I still was paying the least because I wasn't really contributing to food and utilities costs. But it was a real amount that at least kind of offset the cost of me being there. I also paid for all my personal bills, health insurance and transportation and clothes and phone and all that. I thought that worked well.
In terms of whether it is cold-hearted of your mom to ask you for money: maybe, but since she wants a nominal, set amount and it sounds like your parents are stable (at least financially), I think this is likely her attempt to give you some structure and a sense of independence. I think it's a valid parenting decision, even if not every parent would make it, and you shouldn't take it personally or be offended.
Anyhow, I definitely would not ask her if she's going to save the money for you to use when you move out. Just as a human-relations thing, I think that's a bad idea. I also would not frame chores as an alternative to rent. You're going to be expected to do household chores as a member of the household, making it an "extra" is going to make it sound like living with you will be a nightmare. Same thing for trying to contain your outbursts and yelling -- that's a baseline expectation, making it sound like an "extra" thing you're doing for them in lieu of rent is going to make them pretty nervous about living with you. And making them nervous will just make the whole situation more tense.
Also, if I had it to do over again, I would not move back in with my parents for any reason. I think for some people it can work, but if your mental health is shaky it can be a pressure cooker.
posted by rue72 at 9:01 AM on July 1, 2022 [8 favorites]
if they let you move in, they need two things to happen no matter how long it takes: they need you to become able to leave, and they need you to want to leave. charging rent ensures the latter but sometimes at the expense of the former. so if you want to negotiate with them, acknowledge this openly. try to get them focused on the practical fact that if you can't build savings, you'll never leave. but it will be easier to get them to be flexible on this point (to, say, set your symbolic rent at a very low percentage of whatever income you have, and only when you have it) if you are able to verbalize and consent to the thing the rent symbolizes. which is going to be hard if the symbolism is exactly what you do object to.
I can't know without knowing your mother, but I am guessing that what the rent request symbolizes to her is something like: you need external motivation or your circumstances won't change; she/they failed you on some level when you were a kid so they can't just be hands-off open-ended free hosts now or it would be failing you even more; she's more afraid of making you dependent than of making you resentful. and I would guess that your acceptance of a rent agreement would mean to her something like: you are fully adult and want to be independent, even if circumstances mean you can't be right now; you want to feel like you're paying your way so that you don't get more depressed or feel like you're taking advantage; you understand and agree that living with them is temporary.
I can imagine that any or all of these ideas could be demeaning or infuriating or incorrect in some way. but when parents charge rent to adult children, this is what they tend to mean by the principle of the thing. so you might try suggesting some of these explanations to your mom to see if she confirms any of them. if there is any possibility in your mind that your mom is trying to teach you a lesson - in the literal way, the good way, the way that parents are supposed to teach their children things, not in a punitive or sadistic way - showing her that you already understand whatever the lesson is might work to change her mind.
posted by queenofbithynia at 9:56 AM on July 1, 2022 [1 favorite]
I can't know without knowing your mother, but I am guessing that what the rent request symbolizes to her is something like: you need external motivation or your circumstances won't change; she/they failed you on some level when you were a kid so they can't just be hands-off open-ended free hosts now or it would be failing you even more; she's more afraid of making you dependent than of making you resentful. and I would guess that your acceptance of a rent agreement would mean to her something like: you are fully adult and want to be independent, even if circumstances mean you can't be right now; you want to feel like you're paying your way so that you don't get more depressed or feel like you're taking advantage; you understand and agree that living with them is temporary.
I can imagine that any or all of these ideas could be demeaning or infuriating or incorrect in some way. but when parents charge rent to adult children, this is what they tend to mean by the principle of the thing. so you might try suggesting some of these explanations to your mom to see if she confirms any of them. if there is any possibility in your mind that your mom is trying to teach you a lesson - in the literal way, the good way, the way that parents are supposed to teach their children things, not in a punitive or sadistic way - showing her that you already understand whatever the lesson is might work to change her mind.
posted by queenofbithynia at 9:56 AM on July 1, 2022 [1 favorite]
If you are not in the US and didn't have to pay for university, I'm assuming you're in Europe or somewhere else similarly civilised. Can you apply for social welfare benefits, either illness or job seekers? That would fund a weekly payment to your parents.
posted by DarlingBri at 10:02 AM on July 1, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by DarlingBri at 10:02 AM on July 1, 2022 [3 favorites]
Young AFAB person with PTSD and anxiety is an indicator to get evaluated for autism, and to get an occupational health evaluation. Dealing with disability is valuable social-reproductive labour and should be compensated by society!
posted by The Last Sockpuppet at 10:15 AM on July 1, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by The Last Sockpuppet at 10:15 AM on July 1, 2022 [3 favorites]
It is, in the abstract, a possible good idea to pay or require rent in a generalized version of the 'adult child moving home' scenario.
That does not mean that 1) it makes sense or is fair or reasonable in your situation, 2) it is some kind of moral imperative, or it is inherently an unacceptable situation for an adult child to live at home without a job or rent regardless of circumstance (though as is apparent above some people do have this cultural expectation or otherwise feel this way), 3) it was fair for you mom to ask this of you knowing what she knows (whatever that may be, per the various questions above), or 4) the way that she conveyed this information was sensitive to that knowledge.
I think you feeling hurt by this in the circumstances is valid. From your perspective, what has happened has communicated to you some combination of the feelings that your parents do not understand or believe the nature of your illness, they do not believe in the genuineness of your willingness to contribute, believe that you will not want to become able to work if you can just stay at home, or whatever else. That may or may not be accurate to what they think, but your feelings about it are valid.
As much as it is fine in the abstract for parents in this scenario to have expectations, the reasons and attitude with which they hold them and how they go about communicating that makes a world of difference. In some cases, they may stem from a moral judgment and invalidation of mental illness and disability, and be communicated by way of coldness, anger, or disdain. In others, they may come from a place of love and understanding, and communicated by offers to help and encouragement. These are very different situations. Only you can know which these are. Your feeling about it reflects that you have some amount of interpretation of this as being the former thing, and reflecting a lack of understanding of you. That may be miscommunication, or it may be more problematic and cannot be overcome. If the latter, be careful about how living in that environment will affect you.
I'd recommend you be careful about your parents expectations when moving back in, as these could be hurtful to you if you are not able to meet them. A very open conversation about your health and day-to-day life experience seems potentially beneficial here, if you feel safe to do so. If you do not feel safe to do that, this would be a sign you will need to guard yourself against any judgment or expectation about things that you cannot do and find ways to get out as soon as you can.
posted by lookoutbelow at 10:36 AM on July 1, 2022 [2 favorites]
That does not mean that 1) it makes sense or is fair or reasonable in your situation, 2) it is some kind of moral imperative, or it is inherently an unacceptable situation for an adult child to live at home without a job or rent regardless of circumstance (though as is apparent above some people do have this cultural expectation or otherwise feel this way), 3) it was fair for you mom to ask this of you knowing what she knows (whatever that may be, per the various questions above), or 4) the way that she conveyed this information was sensitive to that knowledge.
I think you feeling hurt by this in the circumstances is valid. From your perspective, what has happened has communicated to you some combination of the feelings that your parents do not understand or believe the nature of your illness, they do not believe in the genuineness of your willingness to contribute, believe that you will not want to become able to work if you can just stay at home, or whatever else. That may or may not be accurate to what they think, but your feelings about it are valid.
As much as it is fine in the abstract for parents in this scenario to have expectations, the reasons and attitude with which they hold them and how they go about communicating that makes a world of difference. In some cases, they may stem from a moral judgment and invalidation of mental illness and disability, and be communicated by way of coldness, anger, or disdain. In others, they may come from a place of love and understanding, and communicated by offers to help and encouragement. These are very different situations. Only you can know which these are. Your feeling about it reflects that you have some amount of interpretation of this as being the former thing, and reflecting a lack of understanding of you. That may be miscommunication, or it may be more problematic and cannot be overcome. If the latter, be careful about how living in that environment will affect you.
I'd recommend you be careful about your parents expectations when moving back in, as these could be hurtful to you if you are not able to meet them. A very open conversation about your health and day-to-day life experience seems potentially beneficial here, if you feel safe to do so. If you do not feel safe to do that, this would be a sign you will need to guard yourself against any judgment or expectation about things that you cannot do and find ways to get out as soon as you can.
posted by lookoutbelow at 10:36 AM on July 1, 2022 [2 favorites]
My sister moved in with our parents after she completed college, due to mental health issues. I believe some, but not all, of the misery in that situation came from the fact that she wasn't paying rent, so her sense of agency never really took off, and the parent-child relationship never really grew into a parent-adult child relationship. And, even before that, my sister had no experience working outside the home - so she didn't have much of a sense of individual agency, before standing up to our parents (which is a big ask of anyone at any time in their life tbh).
So no, I don't think your mom is wrong for suggesting rent, but I also think that paying rent out of your diminishing savings is going to demoralize you in the long run, even if the amount is nominal. I also think that picking up housework/chores is a losing proposition in a long run, because you'll be "paid" in what you understand as your parents' goodwill - which, as a feeling sort of thing, is really vulnerable to both your anxiety and the whims of your parents.
Making some sort of rent-arrangement/agreement does seem like the best option if you have to go back. Making clear expectations, intentions, and what it is you can offer and when. For year 1, your priority is to get well enough to start moving and working a little outside the house; you will achieve these objectives by attending therapy, maybe making small trips outside the house, and trying out some volunteer work, or some other small recurring commitment that is manageable with your anxiety; you will do chores as an adult member of the household; your rent may be "paid" with something that lines up with your therapy and recurring commitment. 1 month's rent = 2 afternoons spent with Great Aunt Such-and-Such and getting her groceries, etc, agreement to be reviewed in one year or whatever interval you agree to. It's not money, but it's what you have to offer for the first year. Your work isn't to earn money, it is to get better; your payment for the work of getting better is, well, getting better, picking up confidence, moving closer towards the ability to earn money in the future. It may be that you need this small step before you're ready to take other steps. And in the meantime, watching a number in your bank account go down is just going to burden you with dread, which will make the process harder. Especially since you already have an understanding that the rent is, for their purposes, numerically superfluous.
I agree with other users, though, that staying independent as much as possible would probably be better long-term. It's so easy to fall into old, destructive patterns and habits with parents. Any sort of social or housing assistance avenues available to you, please consider taking.
posted by snerson at 10:41 AM on July 1, 2022 [4 favorites]
So no, I don't think your mom is wrong for suggesting rent, but I also think that paying rent out of your diminishing savings is going to demoralize you in the long run, even if the amount is nominal. I also think that picking up housework/chores is a losing proposition in a long run, because you'll be "paid" in what you understand as your parents' goodwill - which, as a feeling sort of thing, is really vulnerable to both your anxiety and the whims of your parents.
Making some sort of rent-arrangement/agreement does seem like the best option if you have to go back. Making clear expectations, intentions, and what it is you can offer and when. For year 1, your priority is to get well enough to start moving and working a little outside the house; you will achieve these objectives by attending therapy, maybe making small trips outside the house, and trying out some volunteer work, or some other small recurring commitment that is manageable with your anxiety; you will do chores as an adult member of the household; your rent may be "paid" with something that lines up with your therapy and recurring commitment. 1 month's rent = 2 afternoons spent with Great Aunt Such-and-Such and getting her groceries, etc, agreement to be reviewed in one year or whatever interval you agree to. It's not money, but it's what you have to offer for the first year. Your work isn't to earn money, it is to get better; your payment for the work of getting better is, well, getting better, picking up confidence, moving closer towards the ability to earn money in the future. It may be that you need this small step before you're ready to take other steps. And in the meantime, watching a number in your bank account go down is just going to burden you with dread, which will make the process harder. Especially since you already have an understanding that the rent is, for their purposes, numerically superfluous.
I agree with other users, though, that staying independent as much as possible would probably be better long-term. It's so easy to fall into old, destructive patterns and habits with parents. Any sort of social or housing assistance avenues available to you, please consider taking.
posted by snerson at 10:41 AM on July 1, 2022 [4 favorites]
I think this is less about paying rent and more about your relationship to your mom. Are you sure that moving back in with your parents is going to be at least neutral, if not positive for your mental health? What is your mom's understanding and attitude towards mental illness in general? Does she get it? Or she doesn't completely understand it but can at least respect that mental illness is a thing and should be taken seriously? Or does she just brush it off?
Either way, it's worth spending some time thinking about what you need from your parents, what you hope to get out of living at home again, and think about whether your parents can meet those needs. Also, an idea of when you plan to leave. It's always tricky navigating an adult child moving home because relationships and expectations need to be reset. Throw mental illness in the mix and now you're playing in hard mode. It might be worth looking into therapy with your parents or with your mom to talk this stuff out.
Speaking to the money stuff now: You say you have no income and little savings left. What does she say when you say you're not financially able to pay rent, and that your illness prevents you from working? Is her attitude that you're not trying hard enough, your illness is not that bad, etc.? Put it this way, if you had a *physical* injury or illness that prevented you from being able to work, would she still expect you to pay rent?
posted by foxjacket at 12:38 PM on July 1, 2022
Either way, it's worth spending some time thinking about what you need from your parents, what you hope to get out of living at home again, and think about whether your parents can meet those needs. Also, an idea of when you plan to leave. It's always tricky navigating an adult child moving home because relationships and expectations need to be reset. Throw mental illness in the mix and now you're playing in hard mode. It might be worth looking into therapy with your parents or with your mom to talk this stuff out.
Speaking to the money stuff now: You say you have no income and little savings left. What does she say when you say you're not financially able to pay rent, and that your illness prevents you from working? Is her attitude that you're not trying hard enough, your illness is not that bad, etc.? Put it this way, if you had a *physical* injury or illness that prevented you from being able to work, would she still expect you to pay rent?
posted by foxjacket at 12:38 PM on July 1, 2022
I feel like we could benefit by breaking this issue down into a couple different parts.
First of all, I want to validate any feelings of anger or fear you may have right now. Wherever you live, you live under global capitalism, and this is a brutal, merciless system towards anyone whose brain or body does not allow for 100% productivity at all times. As a disabled person, your rage towards this ableist culture, that is so violent and unreasonable in its expectations, is valid.
I think that is a separate issue from your relationship with your parents, though, and it may take some work to untangle who or what deserves all of your feelings. I bring up capitalism and ableism because by living in this society, both you and your parents have absorbed those values. It is therefore "fair" under capitalism to extort rent from tenants and to force every adult, able-bodied or not--as well as many children, in some cases--to compete and work and 'earn' their food, water, and shelter.
(I disagree with the idea that you need some special trauma in your history to fear ending up on the street-- literally everyone in our culture is socialized to fear and avoid homelessness and to see the homeless as an abject category of people.)
So I think a project for therapy might be learning to create containers for some of this-- for grieving the loss of the safety you have been denied as someone with PTSD, *and* also for working on your relationship with your parents in a way that allows for their humanity and their needs to share space with your humanity and your needs. And I think, as hard as it may be, part of the work in front of you is to cope with triggers in a way that minimizes lashing out, and helps you establish calm and productive lines of communication with others, including, in this case, your parents.
posted by coffeeand at 12:47 PM on July 1, 2022 [2 favorites]
First of all, I want to validate any feelings of anger or fear you may have right now. Wherever you live, you live under global capitalism, and this is a brutal, merciless system towards anyone whose brain or body does not allow for 100% productivity at all times. As a disabled person, your rage towards this ableist culture, that is so violent and unreasonable in its expectations, is valid.
I think that is a separate issue from your relationship with your parents, though, and it may take some work to untangle who or what deserves all of your feelings. I bring up capitalism and ableism because by living in this society, both you and your parents have absorbed those values. It is therefore "fair" under capitalism to extort rent from tenants and to force every adult, able-bodied or not--as well as many children, in some cases--to compete and work and 'earn' their food, water, and shelter.
(I disagree with the idea that you need some special trauma in your history to fear ending up on the street-- literally everyone in our culture is socialized to fear and avoid homelessness and to see the homeless as an abject category of people.)
So I think a project for therapy might be learning to create containers for some of this-- for grieving the loss of the safety you have been denied as someone with PTSD, *and* also for working on your relationship with your parents in a way that allows for their humanity and their needs to share space with your humanity and your needs. And I think, as hard as it may be, part of the work in front of you is to cope with triggers in a way that minimizes lashing out, and helps you establish calm and productive lines of communication with others, including, in this case, your parents.
posted by coffeeand at 12:47 PM on July 1, 2022 [2 favorites]
I'm sorry you're going through this. The transition from college/university to the working world can be a difficult one under even the best of circumstances, and you have some serious difficulties to deal with.
That said, it's not necessarily unreasonable for your parents to expect some kind of rent/room and board under these circumstances, but the arrangement should be realistic for both of you. As others have pointed out, it would be useful to have a discussion with them about expectations and feelings on both sides.
I also notice that you emphasize the fact that your father told you they don't need the money. While covering the costs associated with an extra person might not be beyond their means, it could have an impact on their disposable income and perhaps their ability to do some things that they want.
posted by rpfields at 3:15 PM on July 1, 2022 [3 favorites]
That said, it's not necessarily unreasonable for your parents to expect some kind of rent/room and board under these circumstances, but the arrangement should be realistic for both of you. As others have pointed out, it would be useful to have a discussion with them about expectations and feelings on both sides.
I also notice that you emphasize the fact that your father told you they don't need the money. While covering the costs associated with an extra person might not be beyond their means, it could have an impact on their disposable income and perhaps their ability to do some things that they want.
posted by rpfields at 3:15 PM on July 1, 2022 [3 favorites]
My parents did a similar push-me pull-you thing after I graduated college that really confused me.
My dad said everything was fine financially and wanted to keep paying for me. But it turns out he was emotionally invested in financially providing for his kid and wasn't ready to give up that role.
My mom had gone through something similar when I first moved out, where she wasn't ready to give up knowing every little detail of my life. Because that had been her parental role. She figured it out and got past it that first year that I was in college. She was more grounded in the parent-of-an-adult role than my dad was by the time I graduated.
unsafe in a way that's hard to describe—like my mom's support is conditional, that I could end up on the street if things got really bad though she denies that—and I can't tell if that's just some kind of unchecked privilege or entitlement I need to work on,
This something I continue to work on, as a person with anxiety. Life is fundamentally unsafe. People's support is always conditional on them being able to provide that support. The things we do to try to feel safe and supported don't always protect us.
It feels helpful when my anxiety says, if I just do x, I'll be safe. It feels helpful when my family or friends say, I'll always do y to support you. But it's the opposite of helpful, because it's an illusion. My subconscious knows it's an illusion, and my anxiety warns me that I'm still unsafe, I'm still at risk of losing my support. So I do more of x, and I arrange for a support team that's even better at y, and I figure out what a good z could be to add to the toolbox, and that's how anxiety can take over my life at times. Really facing that feeling of profound danger and aloneness, and feeling it in my body (not thinking my way past it with more x, y, and z) over and over as often as it comes up has been the key for me in reducing my anxiety. Therapy and medication and mindfulness have all helped me do that, but they didn't click until I stopped using them as z to add to the run-away-from-pain and stay-safe-and-secure toolbox and started using them as guides to help me face the abyss.
posted by Former Congressional Representative Lenny Lemming at 3:28 PM on July 1, 2022 [7 favorites]
My dad said everything was fine financially and wanted to keep paying for me. But it turns out he was emotionally invested in financially providing for his kid and wasn't ready to give up that role.
My mom had gone through something similar when I first moved out, where she wasn't ready to give up knowing every little detail of my life. Because that had been her parental role. She figured it out and got past it that first year that I was in college. She was more grounded in the parent-of-an-adult role than my dad was by the time I graduated.
unsafe in a way that's hard to describe—like my mom's support is conditional, that I could end up on the street if things got really bad though she denies that—and I can't tell if that's just some kind of unchecked privilege or entitlement I need to work on,
This something I continue to work on, as a person with anxiety. Life is fundamentally unsafe. People's support is always conditional on them being able to provide that support. The things we do to try to feel safe and supported don't always protect us.
It feels helpful when my anxiety says, if I just do x, I'll be safe. It feels helpful when my family or friends say, I'll always do y to support you. But it's the opposite of helpful, because it's an illusion. My subconscious knows it's an illusion, and my anxiety warns me that I'm still unsafe, I'm still at risk of losing my support. So I do more of x, and I arrange for a support team that's even better at y, and I figure out what a good z could be to add to the toolbox, and that's how anxiety can take over my life at times. Really facing that feeling of profound danger and aloneness, and feeling it in my body (not thinking my way past it with more x, y, and z) over and over as often as it comes up has been the key for me in reducing my anxiety. Therapy and medication and mindfulness have all helped me do that, but they didn't click until I stopped using them as z to add to the run-away-from-pain and stay-safe-and-secure toolbox and started using them as guides to help me face the abyss.
posted by Former Congressional Representative Lenny Lemming at 3:28 PM on July 1, 2022 [7 favorites]
Mod note: From the OP:
In case anyone still wants clarification, I'd like to provide some more info and some of my thoughts, given all your thoughtful, kind and useful answers:posted by travelingthyme (staff) at 4:18 PM on July 1, 2022 [5 favorites]
**When you lived with them previously, how frequent were the incidents of outbursts and yelling?**
I've never had outbursts and haven't raised my voice at them ever since I was a young teenager. Whenever I live with them, I'm always on my best behavior—mostly out of fear they'll stop caring about me (which is irrational but still in my brain somewhere.) I only included this line because I was scared of being stigmatized, since PTSD is still characterized as violent and unbearable for caregivers in a lot of spaces (and situations like those can happen, I don't want to deny that or stigmatize other survivors who have these reactions, but they haven't been part of my experience personally.)
**It's very difficult to answer this question without knowing more about your relationship with your mother.
I wonder if this whole "should they ask me to pay rent" question isn't just the tip of the iceberg of your concerns about the whole idea of living with your parents again.**
Honestly, you're probably right. I'm in consistent denial that our relationship is iffy, mostly because my parents aren't technically abusive, just... Emotionally immature and very emotionally unavailable (and have outright refused to reflect on it or work on it when I've gently suggested they might, to improve our relationship.) So I can grit my teeth and live with them without making my mental health worse, because things are bearable as long as keep things surface-level, but I won't make it better, either. I'm sorry I didn't include more detail about my dynamic with my parents in the original question—denial was pretty strong, mostly, and I didn't want to paint them in a bad light because they do try, and I know how much unfair scorn struggling parents already get.
Asking this question also made me realize why my reaction to being asked to pay rent was so strong. It's not because I disagree with the concept entirely, or don't want to be independent—but because my only reason to ever live with them again would be to *avoid* losing the rest of my dwindling savings. Savings which feel like my only safety net against homelessness (not that there's anything wrong or evil about being homeless; I just don't think I have the tools or skills to survive it right now.) Not losing the rest of my finances is all they would provide, and all their other emotionally cold, invalidating behavior would be a hindrance to my mental health right now. So paying rent *while* living with my parents would defeat the point; I'd just suffer and lose money at the same time. Maybe that sounds cruel, but that's the unfortunate reality of their parenting style when I don't deny it; sad as it makes me.
So I might as well just be independent and do my best to either get government assistance or find work before my savings run out. If worse comes to worse, I can live with them if there's a no-rent agreement (because, again, there's no other genuine benefit of putting myself into that crappy environment again), but I'm going to try for government assistance first so I can stay living independently, even if I can't work quite yet. I might not get it because capitalism hellscape and this system hates sick people etc etc, but it's worth a shot at least.
I'll probably contact a disability/unemployment lawyer (they're luckily affordable in my location) to help me proceed, since I can't do this by myself. That, or I'll try to find a manageable job that doesn't make me spiral. Point is, I'm gonna try to exhaust all my other options before moving back in with them.
Again, my apologies for not framing the question with all this additional information. Thank you, really, you helped me realize why this was bothering me so much, and hopefully I'll be able to take other steps before resorting to moving back in with them. Sorry if I sound harsh towards my parents here—they're doing their best, but unfortunately that best is very limited right now. Thanks again.
I'm assuming you are USA based.
If moving home will make you unsafe, please reach out to your therapist, meta filter, etc. to discuss alternatives.
As an internet stranger I almost certainly don't know your mother. So I can't say anything for sure about her motivations and intentions. But one possible interpretation is a fear that her child lacks direction. So do what you can to show your parents that you have a game plan to make moving to your parents' home a temporary situation. I'm not a lawyer or anything, but IMHO I think that paying even below market rent helps give your situation legitimacy even if it is only in the court of mom and dad and not the court of law.
I do think, generally speaking that dealing with a serious health condition is a reasonable exception to adult child paying parent rent expectation especially since finances aren't a problem for your parents.
If you haven't already, you might need to have a conversation with your parents about finances more generally. For instance if you're 24 now, you might be aging off your parents insurance in the next few years. Or you strive to have $xx saved up before you move out so that you can pay first and last month's rent for an apartment. Or maybe you could use their advice on which retirement vehicle could be set up on your behalf with (some of) the last of your remaining $$. In other words, show that you are making a good faith effort to plan financially for the future.
I'm not saying your mom is doing this, but there is one school of thought that says parent collects nominal rent from child, and returns money as lump sum upon move out. Perhaps you could consider asking your parents to do this on your behalf. Another 'possible' compromise might be the promise to brain storm with your therapist if there are any income generating activities that you could do (e.g. sell crafts on Etsy, assist an elderly neighbor, pet sit). (Activities are not the same as a job per se).
I think you will also need to consider being transparent with your parents about (some) of the goals you've set with your therapist and your progress. ("Parents: My therapist and I have decided that we need to revisit the job situation in 3 months time").
posted by oceano at 5:40 PM on July 1, 2022
If moving home will make you unsafe, please reach out to your therapist, meta filter, etc. to discuss alternatives.
As an internet stranger I almost certainly don't know your mother. So I can't say anything for sure about her motivations and intentions. But one possible interpretation is a fear that her child lacks direction. So do what you can to show your parents that you have a game plan to make moving to your parents' home a temporary situation. I'm not a lawyer or anything, but IMHO I think that paying even below market rent helps give your situation legitimacy even if it is only in the court of mom and dad and not the court of law.
I do think, generally speaking that dealing with a serious health condition is a reasonable exception to adult child paying parent rent expectation especially since finances aren't a problem for your parents.
If you haven't already, you might need to have a conversation with your parents about finances more generally. For instance if you're 24 now, you might be aging off your parents insurance in the next few years. Or you strive to have $xx saved up before you move out so that you can pay first and last month's rent for an apartment. Or maybe you could use their advice on which retirement vehicle could be set up on your behalf with (some of) the last of your remaining $$. In other words, show that you are making a good faith effort to plan financially for the future.
I'm not saying your mom is doing this, but there is one school of thought that says parent collects nominal rent from child, and returns money as lump sum upon move out. Perhaps you could consider asking your parents to do this on your behalf. Another 'possible' compromise might be the promise to brain storm with your therapist if there are any income generating activities that you could do (e.g. sell crafts on Etsy, assist an elderly neighbor, pet sit). (Activities are not the same as a job per se).
I think you will also need to consider being transparent with your parents about (some) of the goals you've set with your therapist and your progress. ("Parents: My therapist and I have decided that we need to revisit the job situation in 3 months time").
posted by oceano at 5:40 PM on July 1, 2022
It's hard to say exactly without knowing your location but you definitely qualify for and deserve to utilize government assistance - not just stuff like food stamps, public assistance, and SSI but also rental assistance, supportive housing, vocational programs etc. There may be free services such as care coordination to help you navigate and apply for these benefits. Your city/state government websites will hopefully help you get started. See what's available in your current location vs your hometown, if you can stay where you are so much the better.
But if moving home is all that's financially feasible, sit down with your parents and say "I have $X in the bank, spend $Y/month on treatment, and qualify for $Z in benefits - what do you think is an equitable arrangement?" and see what they say. They may just be ignorant as to how dire your financial situation is and be willing to scale their expectations towards your current situation. For example, if you get food stamps you could contribute them towards groceries for the family until you have cash income.
Then make an exit plan and stick to it!
posted by fox problems at 6:23 PM on July 1, 2022 [1 favorite]
But if moving home is all that's financially feasible, sit down with your parents and say "I have $X in the bank, spend $Y/month on treatment, and qualify for $Z in benefits - what do you think is an equitable arrangement?" and see what they say. They may just be ignorant as to how dire your financial situation is and be willing to scale their expectations towards your current situation. For example, if you get food stamps you could contribute them towards groceries for the family until you have cash income.
Then make an exit plan and stick to it!
posted by fox problems at 6:23 PM on July 1, 2022 [1 favorite]
Again, my apologies for not framing the question with all this additional information
No need to apologise! There's no way anyone can explain anything so complex and subtle as family dinamics in a few short sentences. Especially if you're trying to be accurate and fair.
I come from a very different kind of family, but I have had to face how their inability to deal healthily with anger and other uncomfortable emotions has hurt me and caused lasting harm. A family doesn't have to be what most people would recognise as abusive, in order for them to cause harm and trauma.
They can love you, and be well meaning, and do their best, and still do things that cause you lasting harm. And recognising that fact isn't being unfair to them, or denying the love.
Former Congressional's advice above to acknowledge the fundamental lack of control we all have, is something that has helped me too. I try to reframe the things I fear not as "that would be so awful I would fall apart, " but as "if x happens, it would be truly awful, but I would still cope. "
Also the comment above to look into whether you might be on the autistic spectrum.
And above all, be extra kind to yourself. This is a very stressful time. Make full use of all the self soothing techniques you have developed. Good luck! You've got this.
posted by Zumbador at 8:43 PM on July 1, 2022 [1 favorite]
No need to apologise! There's no way anyone can explain anything so complex and subtle as family dinamics in a few short sentences. Especially if you're trying to be accurate and fair.
I come from a very different kind of family, but I have had to face how their inability to deal healthily with anger and other uncomfortable emotions has hurt me and caused lasting harm. A family doesn't have to be what most people would recognise as abusive, in order for them to cause harm and trauma.
They can love you, and be well meaning, and do their best, and still do things that cause you lasting harm. And recognising that fact isn't being unfair to them, or denying the love.
Former Congressional's advice above to acknowledge the fundamental lack of control we all have, is something that has helped me too. I try to reframe the things I fear not as "that would be so awful I would fall apart, " but as "if x happens, it would be truly awful, but I would still cope. "
Also the comment above to look into whether you might be on the autistic spectrum.
And above all, be extra kind to yourself. This is a very stressful time. Make full use of all the self soothing techniques you have developed. Good luck! You've got this.
posted by Zumbador at 8:43 PM on July 1, 2022 [1 favorite]
Your parents asking asking you to pay rent is their way of setting a boundary. It's not about the money. Since you know your parents and we don't, we can only make wild speculations as to why this is the way they are choosing to do it. But it's a boundary nonetheless, and I think that if I opened my home to a family member and they didn't respect my explicit boundary in advance, I'd feel pretty iffy about pursuing the agreement at all.
posted by erattacorrige at 9:33 AM on July 2, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by erattacorrige at 9:33 AM on July 2, 2022 [1 favorite]
I went through a similar situation to what you're describing, OP, except that I was in my late 30s when I had to move back in with my parents (due to mental illness/disability, then pandemic).
The only bit of advice I feel might be helpful is make sure to have money discussions with both parents present, having to bounce between two opinions/people was really difficult for me when I first moved back in with my folks, and I realized a lot of misunderstanding and worried feelings could be resolved by getting everyone in the same room.
posted by Jarcat at 9:33 AM on July 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
The only bit of advice I feel might be helpful is make sure to have money discussions with both parents present, having to bounce between two opinions/people was really difficult for me when I first moved back in with my folks, and I realized a lot of misunderstanding and worried feelings could be resolved by getting everyone in the same room.
posted by Jarcat at 9:33 AM on July 2, 2022 [2 favorites]
I don’t know of any culture on this planet (and I’ve lived in more than a dozen countries) besides Christian-American, who would in a million years find it acceptable to ask an adult child to pay rent. I will never stop feeling shocked that this is a thing in the United States.
The OP stated that they are not located in the US.
posted by sunflower16 at 6:20 AM on July 3, 2022 [2 favorites]
The OP stated that they are not located in the US.
posted by sunflower16 at 6:20 AM on July 3, 2022 [2 favorites]
If you can, get Occupational Therapy and whatever Psychological Counseling possible. Being in the world offers friendship, adventure, interesting things, stimulation, art, just everything. You can have a life on the Internet, and I hope you do, you deserve a life, but I hope you can find a way to more.
posted by theora55 at 3:02 PM on July 6, 2022
posted by theora55 at 3:02 PM on July 6, 2022
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You mentioned a timeline of "1-3 years". Perhaps your mom would be reassured if there are steps along the way, since 3 years feels far off. Could you get a low-stress part-time volunteer position now? A volunteer position could also be helpful for your resume, for when you are ready to look for paid work in 1-3 years.
posted by vienna at 3:01 AM on July 1, 2022 [7 favorites]