help me buy a car
April 7, 2022 12:58 PM Subscribe
The second in a series of related questions. This is both "What car do I want?" and "How do I want to get it?" Snowflakes inside. Perspectives from people who bought cars in 2021-2022 and from hybrid compact sedan owners especially desired.
So, full disclosure, I haven't done this before and I don't have knowledgeable older relatives or anything I can ask about it. Assume these questions are coming from your earnest, recent-college-grad nephew or something who has read a bunch on Google and Carfax. I haven't driven a car on a daily basis in more than a decade, though I've rented cars for a handful of weekends and I have been in many rideshares.
1. I am like 95% sure that I want a hybrid for better gas mileage and lower environmental impact. I believe that there is no practical way to charge a plug-in EV where I live or work - both office and apartment are in dense neighborhoods on upper floors, with parking lot and on-street parking respectively. I also think non-hybrid gasoline-powered cars are much worse for the planet, and hybrid technology is good enough in 2022 that a hybrid that is driven five days a week can safely live outside in Massachusetts. Am I wrong about any of this?
2. I am 100% sure I want a backup camera or rearview camera. I live in a neighborhood with kids and outdoor cats, and will rely on on-street parallel parking. Collision detection is not adequate for me to feel safe operating a rental car in my area. This feature is required on all 2018 and newer cars, so this doesn't narrow the field much, but I am completely inflexible on it.
3. I am 100% sure that I want relatively little car for relatively little money, because I do not have a lot of money and my impression is that smaller, lighter, cheaper cars have lower environmental impacts. Sometimes I have to haul around equipment for work, but it's on the scale of a very heavy, very expensive IKEA FRAKTA bag or some suitcases - as a single person in a four-seat compact sedan, I figure it'll be fine even if there's not much trunk space.
4. I am about 80% sure I want to buy right now, like, as soon as this weekend. As other people's tax returns come in and as gas prices stay high, I think car prices are going to get worse over the next 4-6 weeks, not better, especially for hybrids. Is this absurd?
5. I am about 75% sure about make and model - I want a Toyota Corolla Hybrid, Honda Accord Hybrid, Toyota Prius, or Honda Insight Hybrid, specifically. Probably. This is largely going off of being in these cars as rideshares and looking at online pictures and reviews. Do I want to go to a dealership and do some test drives? I'm not sure that'll help, as my concerns about differences between cars are mainly about pricing, availability, and maintenance costs.
6. I am maybe 60% confident I understand the actual order of operations. From my computer, I find a car I like on a car website, get a quote from a dealership, get approved for financing from banks and the dealership, accept the financing option I want, get auto insurance, and tell the dealership I'm ready to come get it. Then I physically go to the dealership, sign the papers, get the keys, title, and registration, and drive away in it. Later, I go to the RMV and update the registration so the state knows it's my car now. Please tell me if this is naive/illegal/inaccurate.
7. I am roughly 40% sure I want to buy used instead of new. The used car market is so bad that a new car might be more affordable over the next few years - I have a coworker who says he has a Toyota with an extended warranty that has meant his car payments include maintenance costs for the first ten years, so he hasn't had to pay a mechanic for anything on it. That sounds amazing and incredible, as someone who is mildly terrified of unexpected, unpredictable mechanic expense situations. I'm not sure if it's really worth the money, though.
8. I'm like 30% sure I've remembered to ask everything I need to know about buying this car. What else should I be asking?
Thank you in advance, automobile experts of MetaFilter.
So, full disclosure, I haven't done this before and I don't have knowledgeable older relatives or anything I can ask about it. Assume these questions are coming from your earnest, recent-college-grad nephew or something who has read a bunch on Google and Carfax. I haven't driven a car on a daily basis in more than a decade, though I've rented cars for a handful of weekends and I have been in many rideshares.
1. I am like 95% sure that I want a hybrid for better gas mileage and lower environmental impact. I believe that there is no practical way to charge a plug-in EV where I live or work - both office and apartment are in dense neighborhoods on upper floors, with parking lot and on-street parking respectively. I also think non-hybrid gasoline-powered cars are much worse for the planet, and hybrid technology is good enough in 2022 that a hybrid that is driven five days a week can safely live outside in Massachusetts. Am I wrong about any of this?
2. I am 100% sure I want a backup camera or rearview camera. I live in a neighborhood with kids and outdoor cats, and will rely on on-street parallel parking. Collision detection is not adequate for me to feel safe operating a rental car in my area. This feature is required on all 2018 and newer cars, so this doesn't narrow the field much, but I am completely inflexible on it.
3. I am 100% sure that I want relatively little car for relatively little money, because I do not have a lot of money and my impression is that smaller, lighter, cheaper cars have lower environmental impacts. Sometimes I have to haul around equipment for work, but it's on the scale of a very heavy, very expensive IKEA FRAKTA bag or some suitcases - as a single person in a four-seat compact sedan, I figure it'll be fine even if there's not much trunk space.
4. I am about 80% sure I want to buy right now, like, as soon as this weekend. As other people's tax returns come in and as gas prices stay high, I think car prices are going to get worse over the next 4-6 weeks, not better, especially for hybrids. Is this absurd?
5. I am about 75% sure about make and model - I want a Toyota Corolla Hybrid, Honda Accord Hybrid, Toyota Prius, or Honda Insight Hybrid, specifically. Probably. This is largely going off of being in these cars as rideshares and looking at online pictures and reviews. Do I want to go to a dealership and do some test drives? I'm not sure that'll help, as my concerns about differences between cars are mainly about pricing, availability, and maintenance costs.
6. I am maybe 60% confident I understand the actual order of operations. From my computer, I find a car I like on a car website, get a quote from a dealership, get approved for financing from banks and the dealership, accept the financing option I want, get auto insurance, and tell the dealership I'm ready to come get it. Then I physically go to the dealership, sign the papers, get the keys, title, and registration, and drive away in it. Later, I go to the RMV and update the registration so the state knows it's my car now. Please tell me if this is naive/illegal/inaccurate.
7. I am roughly 40% sure I want to buy used instead of new. The used car market is so bad that a new car might be more affordable over the next few years - I have a coworker who says he has a Toyota with an extended warranty that has meant his car payments include maintenance costs for the first ten years, so he hasn't had to pay a mechanic for anything on it. That sounds amazing and incredible, as someone who is mildly terrified of unexpected, unpredictable mechanic expense situations. I'm not sure if it's really worth the money, though.
8. I'm like 30% sure I've remembered to ask everything I need to know about buying this car. What else should I be asking?
Thank you in advance, automobile experts of MetaFilter.
We’ve liked our Hyundai Ioniq hybrid a lot, so just another possibility for your list if you haven’t considered it.
About buying - read up a little on dealership sales practices and the common advice is to go in with a firm idea of the “total, out the door” price youre willing to pay for the car, so the salesperson can’t try to confuse you by swapping numbers around in a “low monthly payment but for many more months => much higher total price” kind of way.
posted by LobsterMitten at 1:15 PM on April 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
About buying - read up a little on dealership sales practices and the common advice is to go in with a firm idea of the “total, out the door” price youre willing to pay for the car, so the salesperson can’t try to confuse you by swapping numbers around in a “low monthly payment but for many more months => much higher total price” kind of way.
posted by LobsterMitten at 1:15 PM on April 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
Especially if you live in a high-density area, there's probably more charging infrastructure than you think. And it usually doesn't take very long to fully charge. I rented a Nissan Leaf last year, and would charge it from empty while I ate dinner. There was a charging station at a church a few blocks from the restaurant, and the weather was nice, so I left it at the charging station, went to dinner, and had a full charge after an hour or so. If you're just topping off, it would take even less. My big complaint with the Leaf was that the battery didn't last long, but I was also driving it quite a lot. If you're just running errands, you could easily go a week or more between charges. I do think a hybrid is probably better, not least because of the snow and rain and stuff in Massachusetts, and would probably be easier to find, but it doesn't sound like you have to completely write off full-electrics.
Hybrids parked outside are fine. I'm in New Hampshire, and my wife has 2020 RAV4 Hybrid that never goes inside, and it's never had a problem.
Backup cameras have been standard since 2018, but they were pretty common even before then. I drive a 2014 Corolla, and it has a backup camera. Before buying that car, the newest car I'd ever owned was a 1996, so I was awed by the backup camera at first, but my impression is that people who have owned new cars since like 2008 generally take it for granted.
Little cars are not actually that little anymore. The trunk of my Corolla comfortably fits luggage for a family of four and a double stroller with room to spare, and that's not even using the back seat. The only cars that won't fit what you need are cars that are specifically designed NOT to hold any cargo, e.g. Smart cars.
Definitely test drive. When my wife got her first RAV4 a couple of years ago, she was fairly certain going in that she actually wanted a Subaru Forrester, and I actually just had her go to the Toyota dealership because I like my Corolla so much. She was blown away by how much more she liked the RAV4 than the Forrester. With cars, there's so much of a feel element that it's hard to really know what you like unless you've been behind the wheel. Even if you've driven the model you're looking to buy before, it's still good to have something to compare it to, even if it's just to validate your decision.
That said, Toyotas and Hondas are great cars, and, me personally, I'd be happy with any of the four you mentioned.
I don't really know the order of operations that well myself (and it's Massachusetts, so there's probably some weird step that's not applicable in the other 49 states anyway), but that's another good reason to test drive a few different cars: to find a salesman/dealer who is actually helpful. A good car salesman will explain this for you much better than anyone else. (That's another reason my wife went with the RAV4 instead of the Forrester - the Subaru salesman was not at all helpful.)
I've heard anecdotes that used cars are actually selling for more than new ones at this point. If you go to a dealer that sells both, they could answer this more definitively.
Also keep in mind leasing. I know it's not a great financial decision, especially with how used car prices are right now, but if your biggest concerns are low upfront cost and no worries about maintenance, it could work for you.
If you do buy, shoot for a monthly payment below your actual budget, so that you can overpay your monthly payment. You'll save a bunch on interest this way. I paid off my loan almost a year early just by throwing an additional $40/month onto each payment.
My last piece of advice is: don't sweat so much. Overthinking every detail is a thing for Metafilter car buyers, and I'm certainly guilty of it myself. But like, buying a car isn't rocket science. People much less intelligent and competent than you do it every day. You'll do a fine job, I promise.
posted by kevinbelt at 1:59 PM on April 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
Hybrids parked outside are fine. I'm in New Hampshire, and my wife has 2020 RAV4 Hybrid that never goes inside, and it's never had a problem.
Backup cameras have been standard since 2018, but they were pretty common even before then. I drive a 2014 Corolla, and it has a backup camera. Before buying that car, the newest car I'd ever owned was a 1996, so I was awed by the backup camera at first, but my impression is that people who have owned new cars since like 2008 generally take it for granted.
Little cars are not actually that little anymore. The trunk of my Corolla comfortably fits luggage for a family of four and a double stroller with room to spare, and that's not even using the back seat. The only cars that won't fit what you need are cars that are specifically designed NOT to hold any cargo, e.g. Smart cars.
Definitely test drive. When my wife got her first RAV4 a couple of years ago, she was fairly certain going in that she actually wanted a Subaru Forrester, and I actually just had her go to the Toyota dealership because I like my Corolla so much. She was blown away by how much more she liked the RAV4 than the Forrester. With cars, there's so much of a feel element that it's hard to really know what you like unless you've been behind the wheel. Even if you've driven the model you're looking to buy before, it's still good to have something to compare it to, even if it's just to validate your decision.
That said, Toyotas and Hondas are great cars, and, me personally, I'd be happy with any of the four you mentioned.
I don't really know the order of operations that well myself (and it's Massachusetts, so there's probably some weird step that's not applicable in the other 49 states anyway), but that's another good reason to test drive a few different cars: to find a salesman/dealer who is actually helpful. A good car salesman will explain this for you much better than anyone else. (That's another reason my wife went with the RAV4 instead of the Forrester - the Subaru salesman was not at all helpful.)
I've heard anecdotes that used cars are actually selling for more than new ones at this point. If you go to a dealer that sells both, they could answer this more definitively.
Also keep in mind leasing. I know it's not a great financial decision, especially with how used car prices are right now, but if your biggest concerns are low upfront cost and no worries about maintenance, it could work for you.
If you do buy, shoot for a monthly payment below your actual budget, so that you can overpay your monthly payment. You'll save a bunch on interest this way. I paid off my loan almost a year early just by throwing an additional $40/month onto each payment.
My last piece of advice is: don't sweat so much. Overthinking every detail is a thing for Metafilter car buyers, and I'm certainly guilty of it myself. But like, buying a car isn't rocket science. People much less intelligent and competent than you do it every day. You'll do a fine job, I promise.
posted by kevinbelt at 1:59 PM on April 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
You might look at the Prius C as well, the compact Prius. Also known as "Aqua" in some markets.
posted by nickggully at 2:44 PM on April 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by nickggully at 2:44 PM on April 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
Definitely shop around for financing ahead of time. They will approve you for up to a certain amount- you don’t have to use all of that and you definitely don’t want to tell the dealership salesperson how much you’re approved for. I went with a credit union and got a great rate (this was in 2019 though). The dealership couldn’t beat it. This was for a used car- for a new car, there may be special financing deals from the dealership that might be worth it. Definitely focus on the total cost, not any monthly payment shenanigans.
On the other hand, at some point you may just decide to give up and accept some random fee added on by the dealership at the last minute just to be done. Don’t stress too much as long as you’re getting the car you want and you’re paying what you feel comfortable paying. If you need a car now, you have less bargaining room with a dealership because you probably aren’t actually going to walk away, especially when the car market is so tough right now.
posted by MadamM at 3:13 PM on April 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
On the other hand, at some point you may just decide to give up and accept some random fee added on by the dealership at the last minute just to be done. Don’t stress too much as long as you’re getting the car you want and you’re paying what you feel comfortable paying. If you need a car now, you have less bargaining room with a dealership because you probably aren’t actually going to walk away, especially when the car market is so tough right now.
posted by MadamM at 3:13 PM on April 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
+1 for the Prius C, even though it's a hatchback not a sedan. Checks all your boxes, just a joy to drive, I only upgraded mine (to a Kira Niro, definitely a small station wagon, not a sedan), because the Prius C was a little low for my wife to get in and out of and we wanted a little more warm and a higher trim level that I had on the Prius (which was a 2012).
posted by joycehealy at 3:37 PM on April 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by joycehealy at 3:37 PM on April 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
If safety is a concern - buy the cheapest new car. Even twelve months brings an improvement in the safety of a car.
posted by Barbara Spitzer at 6:06 PM on April 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by Barbara Spitzer at 6:06 PM on April 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
Seconding LobsterMitten on the Hyundai Ioniq. On paper I was sure I wanted a Prius but after going from lot to lot at the auto mall to test drive every EV I could find, I ended up really disliking the Prius and fell in love with the Ioniq. Nice thing is that it comes in all 3 flavors: Electric, Hybrid and Plug-in Hybrid. Absolutely definitely test drive everything you can get your hands on!
posted by platinum at 8:01 PM on April 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by platinum at 8:01 PM on April 7, 2022 [2 favorites]
- The car market being what it is, it makes sense to look at new and used. You usually get better financing rates on a new car. That can tip the balance towards the new car, but not if a used car is noticeably less expensive.
- Don't get the extended warranty, it's not worth the money. It's just you paying in advance for any needed service. New cars need very little work for most of that period of time.
- If I were buying a car now, I'd 100% be looking at an electric car. I don't have charging access in my apartment but I live in a city. There are many public charging options via the city and in parking lots while shopping. Charging options are going to increase with time.
- Honda Accords are fairly large cars, from what I recall.
- Absolutely test drive your car. It's a significant purchase and comfort in operating the car is important that you can't pickup from an article or video. Especially if you're remotely approaching your middle years and beyond.
For example several years back I was sure I wanted a Honda Fit for many of the reasons you mention and folks raved about them. Within 90 seconds of sitting in the drivers seat I knew it wouldn't work as the seat was way too stiff and uncomfortable.
Another example: my mom test drove a Lexus hybrid and realized the back pillars created blind spots that were too intense for her comfort. Also that she wasn't comfortable closing the hatchback. You will want to know if any of your top picks have any physical deal-breakers where the car won't work for you so that you can cross it off your list and focus on your other top picks.
- Carmax is a nice place to look at a variety of cars all in one place and test drive anything that looks appealling in a low-pressure situation. Even if you plan to buy elsewhere, it's a nice place for getting a sense for a range of cars all in one place.
- If finances are an issue, make sure to get comprehensive auto insurance. The premiums cost more, but you want to make sure you're covered if your car were to get wrecked and you can't afford to replace it yourself.
- You're more likely to make a poor decision if you rush, so slow down. Try to get 80% of what you want and then move forward and commit in order to reduce the stress and anxiety around the decision. You won't get it all perfect but also: it's just a car. If you get it 80% right, one car over another is unlikely to have a dramatic impact on your overall quality of life.
posted by Goblin Barbarian at 7:29 AM on April 8, 2022 [1 favorite]
- Don't get the extended warranty, it's not worth the money. It's just you paying in advance for any needed service. New cars need very little work for most of that period of time.
- If I were buying a car now, I'd 100% be looking at an electric car. I don't have charging access in my apartment but I live in a city. There are many public charging options via the city and in parking lots while shopping. Charging options are going to increase with time.
- Honda Accords are fairly large cars, from what I recall.
- Absolutely test drive your car. It's a significant purchase and comfort in operating the car is important that you can't pickup from an article or video. Especially if you're remotely approaching your middle years and beyond.
For example several years back I was sure I wanted a Honda Fit for many of the reasons you mention and folks raved about them. Within 90 seconds of sitting in the drivers seat I knew it wouldn't work as the seat was way too stiff and uncomfortable.
Another example: my mom test drove a Lexus hybrid and realized the back pillars created blind spots that were too intense for her comfort. Also that she wasn't comfortable closing the hatchback. You will want to know if any of your top picks have any physical deal-breakers where the car won't work for you so that you can cross it off your list and focus on your other top picks.
- Carmax is a nice place to look at a variety of cars all in one place and test drive anything that looks appealling in a low-pressure situation. Even if you plan to buy elsewhere, it's a nice place for getting a sense for a range of cars all in one place.
- If finances are an issue, make sure to get comprehensive auto insurance. The premiums cost more, but you want to make sure you're covered if your car were to get wrecked and you can't afford to replace it yourself.
- You're more likely to make a poor decision if you rush, so slow down. Try to get 80% of what you want and then move forward and commit in order to reduce the stress and anxiety around the decision. You won't get it all perfect but also: it's just a car. If you get it 80% right, one car over another is unlikely to have a dramatic impact on your overall quality of life.
posted by Goblin Barbarian at 7:29 AM on April 8, 2022 [1 favorite]
Kia Niro is on the same platform as the Ioniq. Different shapes, same drivetrain, same excellent mileage and reliability..... and alternative to toyota/honda.
posted by lalochezia at 7:10 PM on April 8, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by lalochezia at 7:10 PM on April 8, 2022 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Some quick updates: huge thanks to everybody who advised test driving and who pointed out how affordable it is to add a backup camera.
I've already test driven one car and I have a second test drive this afternoon. I am still stubbornly insisting on a gasoline hybrid, not gasoline-only or plug-in EV.
Makes and Models that are currently off the list because they are extremely challenging to get my hands on right now, used or new, not counting cars that are either really expensive or extremely heavily used: Toyota Camry, Hyundai Ioniq.
Makes and Models that I'm still looking at: Toyota Corolla, Toyota Prius, Toyota Prius C, Honda Accord, Honda Insight, Ford Fusion.
I'll keep you posted as I go.
posted by All Might Be Well at 7:57 AM on April 9, 2022 [1 favorite]
I've already test driven one car and I have a second test drive this afternoon. I am still stubbornly insisting on a gasoline hybrid, not gasoline-only or plug-in EV.
Makes and Models that are currently off the list because they are extremely challenging to get my hands on right now, used or new, not counting cars that are either really expensive or extremely heavily used: Toyota Camry, Hyundai Ioniq.
Makes and Models that I'm still looking at: Toyota Corolla, Toyota Prius, Toyota Prius C, Honda Accord, Honda Insight, Ford Fusion.
I'll keep you posted as I go.
posted by All Might Be Well at 7:57 AM on April 9, 2022 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Update: I now own a 2015 Toyota Prius C. It is delightful! I am spending far less time and money on unreliable public transit and costly rideshares!
I may or may not get a back-up camera installed on it - it's pretty small and easy to maneuver anyways. I'm not going to start very seriously looking for a new place to live for a week or so.
posted by All Might Be Well at 7:21 AM on April 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
I may or may not get a back-up camera installed on it - it's pretty small and easy to maneuver anyways. I'm not going to start very seriously looking for a new place to live for a week or so.
posted by All Might Be Well at 7:21 AM on April 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Bonus detail for the historical record: the US public transportation mask mandate was officially struck down yesterday, April 18th, a few days after I finally managed to stop taking public transit because I'd gotten a car.
I got hassled by another customer for wearing a mask in a takeout place that very day.
Pre-COVID, I didn't see crowds or public places as fundamentally dangerous and hostile the way I do now, but I'm so glad I can rely on driving and drive-thrus more often.
posted by All Might Be Well at 6:27 AM on April 19, 2022
I got hassled by another customer for wearing a mask in a takeout place that very day.
Pre-COVID, I didn't see crowds or public places as fundamentally dangerous and hostile the way I do now, but I'm so glad I can rely on driving and drive-thrus more often.
posted by All Might Be Well at 6:27 AM on April 19, 2022
This thread is closed to new comments.
4. If you want/need a car now, go ahead and buy a car now. You can't predict the market.
6. Order of operations I think is maybe a little off - you can get preapproved from your bank/credit union for financing ahead of time. Dealerships can be VERY HIGH PRESSURE about getting you to use their financing, so be ready for that. They can offer pretty good rates though.
Later, I go to the RMV and update the registration so the state knows it's my car now. Please tell me if this is naive/illegal/inaccurate.
If you buy from a dealership they will generally take care of all the RMV stuff for you. One less thing!
posted by mskyle at 1:08 PM on April 7, 2022 [1 favorite]