Short circuiting violent thoughts
March 5, 2022 11:03 AM Subscribe
I'm scared that at some point I may be violent against my wife. I have had thoughts about being violent in middle of arguments (i.e visualizing me pushing her or slapping her). At worst I've punched some pillows, but nothing violent, and arguments have died down extremely quickly. I've told her about this and she just sort of thinks it a joke (I haven't hit anyone in 25 years and we have a pretty loving relationship).
How does one even get help for this? Will a therapist report me if I bring this up? Do you have any suggestions on books or else? or suggestions?
It is highly unlikely that a therapist will report you for this, unless there is immediate and clear danger to another person. This would be a completely valid, appropriate and good reason to seek a professional's direct help.
posted by furnace.heart at 11:31 AM on March 5, 2022 [12 favorites]
posted by furnace.heart at 11:31 AM on March 5, 2022 [12 favorites]
A thorough physical workup may be called for, in case of hormonal problems, or undiagnosed depression. At the same time, your physician could refer you to a therapist.
posted by Enid Lareg at 11:39 AM on March 5, 2022 [6 favorites]
posted by Enid Lareg at 11:39 AM on March 5, 2022 [6 favorites]
intrusive thoughts of this sort are scary and awful for you, but not necessarily indicative that you're actually going to do a violent thing.
Second that this is a great thing to take to a therapist. Intrusive thoughts are very much what they're there to help you deal with and solve. And there may be pharmacological help for it as well; I know for myself, the only time I ever suffered from something like this, it was definitely in the midst of a serious round of PPD.
posted by fingersandtoes at 11:40 AM on March 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
Second that this is a great thing to take to a therapist. Intrusive thoughts are very much what they're there to help you deal with and solve. And there may be pharmacological help for it as well; I know for myself, the only time I ever suffered from something like this, it was definitely in the midst of a serious round of PPD.
posted by fingersandtoes at 11:40 AM on March 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
I don’t think we’re qualified to tell you whether these are intrusive thoughts or actual urges, and I’m concerned people are doing so, but the recommendations for therapy are appropriate in either case.
posted by kapers at 11:48 AM on March 5, 2022 [9 favorites]
posted by kapers at 11:48 AM on March 5, 2022 [9 favorites]
Agree with kapers, but I will nonetheless offer my nonexpert take:
This is more than intrusive thoughts as per my experience. Intrusive thoughts happen at unrelated times, e.g. you are brushing your teeth, reading, doing a puzzle, taking a walk. Or maybe you are chopping vegetables and cannot stop thinking about cutting off your own fingers even though you have no real desire to do so.
What you are describing is not this. It is "violent fantasy" in the heat of the moment.
Are you on any medications? Anything affecting your brain e.g. antidepressants? Or, any chance of undiagnosed issues related to emotional regulation, e.g. ADHD? Those are things to investigate. If this is a sudden change you probably have something going on medically affecting balance of some kind of systems (hormones, etc.) and you are very right to be concerned. Could be the beginning of anything (neurological disorder, tumor, etc.) as well. Undiagnosed sleep apnea messing with your sleep causing chronic exhaustion, even. I mean the list is pretty much endless. So do not ignore this especially if it is something new.
posted by cape at 11:58 AM on March 5, 2022 [17 favorites]
This is more than intrusive thoughts as per my experience. Intrusive thoughts happen at unrelated times, e.g. you are brushing your teeth, reading, doing a puzzle, taking a walk. Or maybe you are chopping vegetables and cannot stop thinking about cutting off your own fingers even though you have no real desire to do so.
What you are describing is not this. It is "violent fantasy" in the heat of the moment.
Are you on any medications? Anything affecting your brain e.g. antidepressants? Or, any chance of undiagnosed issues related to emotional regulation, e.g. ADHD? Those are things to investigate. If this is a sudden change you probably have something going on medically affecting balance of some kind of systems (hormones, etc.) and you are very right to be concerned. Could be the beginning of anything (neurological disorder, tumor, etc.) as well. Undiagnosed sleep apnea messing with your sleep causing chronic exhaustion, even. I mean the list is pretty much endless. So do not ignore this especially if it is something new.
posted by cape at 11:58 AM on March 5, 2022 [17 favorites]
There is some very good advice here already, especially kapers and cape. I would like to add that you might call a domestic violence agency and explain what’s going on, and ask if they have any counseling available for abusers or potential abusers, and if not, can they refer you to someone. This kind of counseling actually has a very high success rate.
Find an agency:
USA DomesticShelters.org
International: HotPeachPages.net
posted by MexicanYenta at 12:37 PM on March 5, 2022 [5 favorites]
Find an agency:
USA DomesticShelters.org
International: HotPeachPages.net
posted by MexicanYenta at 12:37 PM on March 5, 2022 [5 favorites]
I suggest you look at certain implicit contradictions in your thinking as you have laid it out so far, and see if that gets you anywhere.
1. you are so concerned about one day acting out these alarming impulses that you have started thinking about therapy (a good idea). but your prime worry is that a therapist might report you to someone.
but the immediate danger that is pushing you to therapy is genuine fear that you may harm your wife, which, when you are not angry, you do not want to do. so the fact that a therapist will report you if (and only if) they think you are about to escalate and really do it is good. It should make you feel good: safer, contained, more secure, less at risk, less out of control. But you ask the question as if you are afraid of getting that good answer & hope to hear a different one. why?
Right now, the only person who can stop you from hurting her is you. When you tell other people about that possibility, as long as they are experienced and trustworthy and ethical professionals, you will be adding to the number of people who understand the danger she may be in and who will have their own interest in making sure she does not get hurt by you. this is good. more importantly, it should feel good to you. if, instead, it makes you feel trapped or frightened, really think about why that is.
2. You told your wife and she didn’t really believe you, or seemed not to. was that frustrating in some way, and if so, why? Do you understand that if she really deep down believed it and took it as seriously as you do, she would need to leave you, maybe just temporarily but immediately? was that a fear you had, or a hope? because I am not sure why you told her or how you hoped she’d respond, but there is no possible way for her to hold you accountable when the object of your violent feelings is her. telling her in hopes that she’d help you by trying harder not to make you angry would have been, you probably realize, a threat. the only choices she has are to take it lightly so she can stay, or take it seriously and leave. and it is vastly tempting to believe that a man who feels terribly guilty over the thought of hurting you can’t really want to do it, he must just have an overactive conscience. and it would seem ridiculous to leave when nothing has even happened yet. so: she brushed it off. what else? but what did you think she should or could have done instead? how do you feel about her not having done it?
a therapist will probably get at all this eventually but may take a while to work up to it. no harm in starting to think about it now.
posted by queenofbithynia at 7:37 PM on March 5, 2022 [7 favorites]
1. you are so concerned about one day acting out these alarming impulses that you have started thinking about therapy (a good idea). but your prime worry is that a therapist might report you to someone.
but the immediate danger that is pushing you to therapy is genuine fear that you may harm your wife, which, when you are not angry, you do not want to do. so the fact that a therapist will report you if (and only if) they think you are about to escalate and really do it is good. It should make you feel good: safer, contained, more secure, less at risk, less out of control. But you ask the question as if you are afraid of getting that good answer & hope to hear a different one. why?
Right now, the only person who can stop you from hurting her is you. When you tell other people about that possibility, as long as they are experienced and trustworthy and ethical professionals, you will be adding to the number of people who understand the danger she may be in and who will have their own interest in making sure she does not get hurt by you. this is good. more importantly, it should feel good to you. if, instead, it makes you feel trapped or frightened, really think about why that is.
2. You told your wife and she didn’t really believe you, or seemed not to. was that frustrating in some way, and if so, why? Do you understand that if she really deep down believed it and took it as seriously as you do, she would need to leave you, maybe just temporarily but immediately? was that a fear you had, or a hope? because I am not sure why you told her or how you hoped she’d respond, but there is no possible way for her to hold you accountable when the object of your violent feelings is her. telling her in hopes that she’d help you by trying harder not to make you angry would have been, you probably realize, a threat. the only choices she has are to take it lightly so she can stay, or take it seriously and leave. and it is vastly tempting to believe that a man who feels terribly guilty over the thought of hurting you can’t really want to do it, he must just have an overactive conscience. and it would seem ridiculous to leave when nothing has even happened yet. so: she brushed it off. what else? but what did you think she should or could have done instead? how do you feel about her not having done it?
a therapist will probably get at all this eventually but may take a while to work up to it. no harm in starting to think about it now.
posted by queenofbithynia at 7:37 PM on March 5, 2022 [7 favorites]
Once, our family Dr prescribed something to improve the then husband's libido. After a couple of days of taking this medication, he became impossible to live with, complaining angrily about things he never had before. So maybe check with your doctor for a variety of conditions and a referral to a therapist.
Also, I'm relieved to see you say you have a loving relationship. In my experience, my rage at my now-ex husband grew so much (for very good reasons) that I stopped arguing with him, there was no point, he would not change and I despised him and I'd fantasise about his death. If your relationship has gone well beyond its best-by date, separation / divorce is very effective in reducing the rage.
Buy I do think this may be a medical condition.
posted by b33j at 9:07 PM on March 5, 2022
Also, I'm relieved to see you say you have a loving relationship. In my experience, my rage at my now-ex husband grew so much (for very good reasons) that I stopped arguing with him, there was no point, he would not change and I despised him and I'd fantasise about his death. If your relationship has gone well beyond its best-by date, separation / divorce is very effective in reducing the rage.
Buy I do think this may be a medical condition.
posted by b33j at 9:07 PM on March 5, 2022
The intrusive thoughts aren't necessarily an indicator that you may eventually act on those thoughts, but this phrase "At worst I've punched some pillows" highly concerns me. If done in the presence of the person you're arguing with, that IS A THREAT and IT IS VIOLENT. It's not something she should have laughed off, and is IS behavior you should be worried about.
You seem to be very aware that this is a problem - and that's a good thing, especially that you're recognizing it at this stage and want to address it.
DO address it. This is definitely something to seek to change your behavior on. And honestly - I'd say it would be beneficial for you and your wife to have couples therapy, too. She needs to understand that this IS serious, and not something she should be laughing off. I'm absolutely not saying she should learn to walk on eggshells around you, but because it's also a possibility that you're experiencing some level of reactive abuse, everyone needs to touch base with counseling. (Reactive abuse is a thing... and it's entirely possible for the perpetrator to be unaware that's what they're doing, if they've ingrained that type of interaction as "normal".)
And y'know... I know of a whole ONE person who was abusive, went through treatment, and actually changed. His behavior was strongly culturally influenced, and when he realized how much of a risk it was to his family and his future, he worked very hard to change it. It was hard; I had no real expectation that it was even possible, but as a close co-worker, I got a first hand view of his (true) remorse and hard work. I was surprised and impressed at the change, and admire him for his strength of character. I *also* admire his wife greatly for putting a stop to it and calling the police the VERY FIRST TIME he struck her. (Despite again, it being a cultural norm for both of them.)It definitely gave them the opportunity to make it through, though it was still a very long road. It's been 15 or so years, maybe a little more - and they're still together and stronger than ever. (They'd been together at least ten prior to the incident, and spent more than a year living apart.)
You might be the first I've heard of that is aware enough to prevent it from happening in the first place. Good luck to you.
posted by stormyteal at 9:24 PM on March 5, 2022 [5 favorites]
You seem to be very aware that this is a problem - and that's a good thing, especially that you're recognizing it at this stage and want to address it.
DO address it. This is definitely something to seek to change your behavior on. And honestly - I'd say it would be beneficial for you and your wife to have couples therapy, too. She needs to understand that this IS serious, and not something she should be laughing off. I'm absolutely not saying she should learn to walk on eggshells around you, but because it's also a possibility that you're experiencing some level of reactive abuse, everyone needs to touch base with counseling. (Reactive abuse is a thing... and it's entirely possible for the perpetrator to be unaware that's what they're doing, if they've ingrained that type of interaction as "normal".)
And y'know... I know of a whole ONE person who was abusive, went through treatment, and actually changed. His behavior was strongly culturally influenced, and when he realized how much of a risk it was to his family and his future, he worked very hard to change it. It was hard; I had no real expectation that it was even possible, but as a close co-worker, I got a first hand view of his (true) remorse and hard work. I was surprised and impressed at the change, and admire him for his strength of character. I *also* admire his wife greatly for putting a stop to it and calling the police the VERY FIRST TIME he struck her. (Despite again, it being a cultural norm for both of them.)It definitely gave them the opportunity to make it through, though it was still a very long road. It's been 15 or so years, maybe a little more - and they're still together and stronger than ever. (They'd been together at least ten prior to the incident, and spent more than a year living apart.)
You might be the first I've heard of that is aware enough to prevent it from happening in the first place. Good luck to you.
posted by stormyteal at 9:24 PM on March 5, 2022 [5 favorites]
Perpetrator assistance programs are certainly a thing.
Here's one I know of (which is almost certainly geographically inappropriate for you). Modify this search for your locality.
posted by pompomtom at 1:30 AM on March 6, 2022
Here's one I know of (which is almost certainly geographically inappropriate for you). Modify this search for your locality.
posted by pompomtom at 1:30 AM on March 6, 2022
I am a therapist in training, and here is what we are taught to do, if it helps.
When you begin seeing a therapist, they should contract with you, this means basic stuff like how often you see each other, for how long, etc etc, but it should also include something like the following: "everything you say here will be kept confidential by me, except if I am concerned there is a possibility of harm to you or someone else. If I am, I will discuss with you what I would propose to do at that point".
That means that you are in the loop at all times - you shouldn't suddenly have the police show up at your door because your therapist has made an anonymous phonecall. If they don't contract with you like this, ask them about it, or maybe get a better one.
Also, I agree strongly with queenofbythinia's comment above. It's really important to closely examine what your fears are here, and what is important to you. Be brave, do what you need to do to keep your wife and you safe from harm, and find a therapist you trust completely, so that you can openly and completely honestly do the work you need to do.
Sending you good wishes and courage.
posted by greenish at 7:55 AM on March 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
When you begin seeing a therapist, they should contract with you, this means basic stuff like how often you see each other, for how long, etc etc, but it should also include something like the following: "everything you say here will be kept confidential by me, except if I am concerned there is a possibility of harm to you or someone else. If I am, I will discuss with you what I would propose to do at that point".
That means that you are in the loop at all times - you shouldn't suddenly have the police show up at your door because your therapist has made an anonymous phonecall. If they don't contract with you like this, ask them about it, or maybe get a better one.
Also, I agree strongly with queenofbythinia's comment above. It's really important to closely examine what your fears are here, and what is important to you. Be brave, do what you need to do to keep your wife and you safe from harm, and find a therapist you trust completely, so that you can openly and completely honestly do the work you need to do.
Sending you good wishes and courage.
posted by greenish at 7:55 AM on March 7, 2022 [1 favorite]
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by february at 11:15 AM on March 5, 2022 [8 favorites]