Have the liquor laws in New York changed?
September 7, 2021 5:26 PM Subscribe
I just bought a fifth of Fireball whisky at my local grocery store in Queens. In my 25 years of living in NYC, it's never been legal to sell hard alcohol in grocery stores. I don't see anything online about the laws having changed in New York and I feel like I wouldn't have missed that in the news. Is my grocery store just shady?
You couldn't sell 20 proof in a grocery store in NY state legally either. Shady.
posted by JPD at 5:54 PM on September 7, 2021
posted by JPD at 5:54 PM on September 7, 2021
Any chance that, on closer inspection, the whisky is only half-strength (i.e. ≤20% abv)? This definitely happens in Ohio.
In New York City the limit for grocery stores is SIX percent. No way this is legal (unless it’s not actually alcoholic).
posted by showbiz_liz at 5:54 PM on September 7, 2021 [1 favorite]
In New York City the limit for grocery stores is SIX percent. No way this is legal (unless it’s not actually alcoholic).
posted by showbiz_liz at 5:54 PM on September 7, 2021 [1 favorite]
Can grocery stores in NY now get liquor licenses? A few grocery stores in New Jersey have them, and if you happen to be in one, you can drop the liquor into your cart with everything else and checkout at any cashier.
posted by mollweide at 6:00 PM on September 7, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by mollweide at 6:00 PM on September 7, 2021 [2 favorites]
Can grocery stores in NY now get liquor licenses?
Folks, it's OK to not answer the question if you don't know the answer. If you have a NY Wine or LIquor Store license, here's the entire list of things you're allowed to sell that are not booze:
posted by zamboni at 6:09 PM on September 7, 2021 [26 favorites]
Folks, it's OK to not answer the question if you don't know the answer. If you have a NY Wine or LIquor Store license, here's the entire list of things you're allowed to sell that are not booze:
• Lottery tickets, when duly authorizedAnywhere with a NY liquor store license would be a pretty lousy grocery store.
• Corkscrews
• Ice
• Publications/audio cassettes/seminars to educate consumers
• Non-carbonated, non-flavored mineral waters, spring waters, and drinking waters
• Wine glasses
• Wine storage racks
• Devices meant to minimize oxidation of wine after opening
• Gift bags/boxes/wrapping
This list is exhaustive and constitutes the only items other than alcoholic beverages that may be sold at a
wine store or liquor store. This means that you cannot sell mixers or have an ATM, for instance.
posted by zamboni at 6:09 PM on September 7, 2021 [26 favorites]
Response by poster: gnomeloaf, no, unless I got a counterfeit bottle, this is the full 66 proof stuff, not the branded lemonade.
It is sounding like shady may be the answer! But the Fireball had its own really visible endcap, they were not remotely hiding it. I guess I will see if it is still on sale next time they go in. I have no desire to report them, I was just curious!
posted by Neely O'Hara at 6:26 PM on September 7, 2021 [1 favorite]
It is sounding like shady may be the answer! But the Fireball had its own really visible endcap, they were not remotely hiding it. I guess I will see if it is still on sale next time they go in. I have no desire to report them, I was just curious!
posted by Neely O'Hara at 6:26 PM on September 7, 2021 [1 favorite]
Does NY allow the phenomenon of a liquor store inside of another store? This is a thing in Massachusetts, where it's possible but unusual for a grocery store to have a liquor license.* For instance, my local supermarket contains a liquor store called "The Liquor Aisle" - The Liquor Aisle is literally the aisle in the middle of the supermarket in which liquor is sold, but it's a separate entity with a separate checkout staffed by a different set of people than the main store and a separate POS system. The supermarket does not own The Liquor Aisle - I assume The Liquor Aisle just rents an aisle in the store, to the mutual benefit of The Liquor Aisle and the supermarket.
But probably if that was a thing in NY you would have noticed it before now, and you don't mention there being a Fireball-specific checkout...
* A single entity can only own a limited number of "off-premises" liquor licenses in the Commonwealth, so if you own a chain of 100 supermarkets, only a handful of them can sell booze
posted by mskyle at 7:11 PM on September 7, 2021 [1 favorite]
But probably if that was a thing in NY you would have noticed it before now, and you don't mention there being a Fireball-specific checkout...
* A single entity can only own a limited number of "off-premises" liquor licenses in the Commonwealth, so if you own a chain of 100 supermarkets, only a handful of them can sell booze
posted by mskyle at 7:11 PM on September 7, 2021 [1 favorite]
I'm in Brooklyn, and my bodega has 375mL bottles of Fireball next to the register. It's the only liquor they've ever stocked (they have the usual beer and less-alcohol wine, otherwise). It started maybe a year or so ago? I assumed it was a pandemic thing that the police or liquor authority don't care about right now. The Fireball commonality is a little suspicious though.
posted by unknowncommand at 7:41 PM on September 7, 2021 [4 favorites]
posted by unknowncommand at 7:41 PM on September 7, 2021 [4 favorites]
Does NY allow the phenomenon of a liquor store inside of another store?
Not so much. The SLA specifies "exclusive control of the premises", elsewhere it's described as "a premises solely devoted to do so". The Alcoholic Beverage Control law additionally specifies that a liquor store can have up to two entrances: "the principal entrance to which shall be from the street level and located on a public thoroughfare".
A single entity can only own a limited number of "off-premises" liquor licenses in the Commonwealth
In the Great State of New York, it's one. You can have one (1) liquor store. The usual workaround is for different family members to own individual stores, but the SLA doesn't always go for it - q.v. the Wegmans getting tweaked by the SLA for how they were running their "independent and individually owned" liquor stores that were conveniently adjacent to their corporate grocery stores.
posted by zamboni at 8:58 PM on September 7, 2021 [1 favorite]
Not so much. The SLA specifies "exclusive control of the premises", elsewhere it's described as "a premises solely devoted to do so". The Alcoholic Beverage Control law additionally specifies that a liquor store can have up to two entrances: "the principal entrance to which shall be from the street level and located on a public thoroughfare".
A single entity can only own a limited number of "off-premises" liquor licenses in the Commonwealth
In the Great State of New York, it's one. You can have one (1) liquor store. The usual workaround is for different family members to own individual stores, but the SLA doesn't always go for it - q.v. the Wegmans getting tweaked by the SLA for how they were running their "independent and individually owned" liquor stores that were conveniently adjacent to their corporate grocery stores.
posted by zamboni at 8:58 PM on September 7, 2021 [1 favorite]
Best answer: I have the answer! "Fireball Cinnamon" is legal to sell as a malt beverage in NYC and looks deceptively like Fireball Whiskey. As noted, Fireball Cinnamon is a malt beverage and legal to sell, tastes like whiskey but doesn't have that rot gut alcohol that comes with the gross taste. Alcohol prices in NYC are notoriously high and they still have blue laws for some reason. Your liquor store took advantage of this and is selling bootleg liquor aka the real stuff and hoping law enforcement doesn't know/care given the confusion introduced by the legal fake stuff.
Stop snitching!
posted by geoff. at 10:16 PM on September 7, 2021 [30 favorites]
Stop snitching!
posted by geoff. at 10:16 PM on September 7, 2021 [30 favorites]
Best answer: Here's an article about the confusion: Table Hopping: Liquor stores heated up over sneaky Fireball move
posted by knapah at 3:01 AM on September 8, 2021 [13 favorites]
posted by knapah at 3:01 AM on September 8, 2021 [13 favorites]
I've noticed this at a small international grocer in North Dakota, which similarly forbids the sale of beer, wine, and liquor in grocery stores. This is good to know, thanks.
posted by easy, lucky, free at 3:50 AM on September 8, 2021
posted by easy, lucky, free at 3:50 AM on September 8, 2021
Back in the early 90s up in Inwood any number of Dominican bodegas sold Barceló Añejo under the table (it was not imported into NY at that time). So I have no trouble imagining a NYC grocer selling Fireball today.
posted by slkinsey at 4:01 AM on September 8, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by slkinsey at 4:01 AM on September 8, 2021 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: geoff. solved it! It is indeed NOT the whisky but the malt beverage version. It looks virtually identical to the real stuff. I haven’t tried it yet so we'll see how the taste matches up. Mystery solved!!
posted by Neely O'Hara at 5:22 AM on September 8, 2021 [9 favorites]
posted by Neely O'Hara at 5:22 AM on September 8, 2021 [9 favorites]
"Liquor stores in New York can’t sell beer?"
Nope! However compared to Boston, where I lived before, you can buy beer in way more places here. Just not at a liquor store.
posted by cakelite at 7:38 AM on September 8, 2021
Nope! However compared to Boston, where I lived before, you can buy beer in way more places here. Just not at a liquor store.
posted by cakelite at 7:38 AM on September 8, 2021
In New York City the limit for grocery stores is SIX percent
What about all those 8+% micro brews in the bodegas? Is that different because it's beer?
posted by Liquidwolf at 9:34 AM on September 8, 2021
What about all those 8+% micro brews in the bodegas? Is that different because it's beer?
posted by Liquidwolf at 9:34 AM on September 8, 2021
Those microbrews are illegal. As are bodega cats. I don't want to surprise anyone but you can buy all kinds of stuff if you know the bodega owner.
posted by geoff. at 11:30 AM on September 8, 2021 [4 favorites]
posted by geoff. at 11:30 AM on September 8, 2021 [4 favorites]
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