People who've had interfaith marriages:
April 25, 2021 7:48 PM Subscribe
How have they worked out for you, your partner/children, and the families involved? What have been some of your greatest challenges, rewards or regrets? And what advice would you have to give someone who might be considering going down a similar route?
I don't know if my marriage counts as interfaith, as I converted to my partner's religion (Judaism). But I was raised Christian, and now my partner and I live with my mother who is a devout Christian, so we have an interfaith household.
What works for us is that we all live pretty ecumenical lives with a strong you-do-you approach. We respect each others practices. My mother is happy to have us light candles on a Friday. I'm still "culturally Christian" and insist on stockings and pancakes on Christmas morning (just because I don't believe in salvation through Christ doesn't mean that I don't enjoy pancakes and little presents). We recognize that we have two different religions, but we don't have to dwell on the differences.
I think it works because our families really don't feel threatened by differences of religion. My mom knows I wasn't happy in Christianity (having left it when I was 12), and my husband has always insisted that I only get involved as much in Judaism as much as I wish to - and my conversion was absolutely not for him. If I hadn't wanted to make part of the minyan, I wouldn't have done it. His parents are also areligious, and don't set any expectations. So no family drama.
I think that it also matters where the two people are within their own religion and how comfortable they are with people of different religions, how much they can see them as different but compatible paths. I once meet a young person whose parents were a Minister and a Rabbi married to each other, and they were presumably both equally committed to their own traditions - but they both belonged to the very liberal wings of their respective faiths, and maybe that helped. Similarly, my mother is that lesser known breed of liberal evangelical Christian - she believes in a literal Heaven and Hell and might occasionally worry about my soul, but she's not going to bug me about it as long as I'm happy. (I, of course, don't believe in Hell - though I hope that if there is a Heaven that she meets her recently lost best friends there).
One thing to ask yourself: how important is it to you that your partner practice your religion with you? Not at all? A little important? Very? If it's not at all, then you can probably be happy with someone who is in another faith (or none) and practice separately.
But even if it's important to you that your partner practice your religion with you, but you're struggling to find a partner already within that religion, my advice is to be open to people who may be open to your religion. You'll never know whether someone raised in another tradition (or none) might find yours really satisfying.
I think that overall, it's more important to agree on fundamental values than the particular form or ritual you enact those values in. For example, I could never, ever marry someone who believed in the prosperity gospel, but I could possibly be quite happy with a social justice oriented Anglican - or Sufi.
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On the kids issue: it probably would save a lot of angst if neither of you belongs to a stream/denomination/movement of your religion that insists that people not of that religion (or sect) are going to hell. I think it's a lot easier for kids to participate in the practices of both if they understand them as practices and not the one-and-only-way-to-be. But maybe that's also my Jewish-bias, where practice matters more than belief.
posted by jb at 8:28 PM on April 25, 2021 [5 favorites]
What works for us is that we all live pretty ecumenical lives with a strong you-do-you approach. We respect each others practices. My mother is happy to have us light candles on a Friday. I'm still "culturally Christian" and insist on stockings and pancakes on Christmas morning (just because I don't believe in salvation through Christ doesn't mean that I don't enjoy pancakes and little presents). We recognize that we have two different religions, but we don't have to dwell on the differences.
I think it works because our families really don't feel threatened by differences of religion. My mom knows I wasn't happy in Christianity (having left it when I was 12), and my husband has always insisted that I only get involved as much in Judaism as much as I wish to - and my conversion was absolutely not for him. If I hadn't wanted to make part of the minyan, I wouldn't have done it. His parents are also areligious, and don't set any expectations. So no family drama.
I think that it also matters where the two people are within their own religion and how comfortable they are with people of different religions, how much they can see them as different but compatible paths. I once meet a young person whose parents were a Minister and a Rabbi married to each other, and they were presumably both equally committed to their own traditions - but they both belonged to the very liberal wings of their respective faiths, and maybe that helped. Similarly, my mother is that lesser known breed of liberal evangelical Christian - she believes in a literal Heaven and Hell and might occasionally worry about my soul, but she's not going to bug me about it as long as I'm happy. (I, of course, don't believe in Hell - though I hope that if there is a Heaven that she meets her recently lost best friends there).
One thing to ask yourself: how important is it to you that your partner practice your religion with you? Not at all? A little important? Very? If it's not at all, then you can probably be happy with someone who is in another faith (or none) and practice separately.
But even if it's important to you that your partner practice your religion with you, but you're struggling to find a partner already within that religion, my advice is to be open to people who may be open to your religion. You'll never know whether someone raised in another tradition (or none) might find yours really satisfying.
I think that overall, it's more important to agree on fundamental values than the particular form or ritual you enact those values in. For example, I could never, ever marry someone who believed in the prosperity gospel, but I could possibly be quite happy with a social justice oriented Anglican - or Sufi.
-------
On the kids issue: it probably would save a lot of angst if neither of you belongs to a stream/denomination/movement of your religion that insists that people not of that religion (or sect) are going to hell. I think it's a lot easier for kids to participate in the practices of both if they understand them as practices and not the one-and-only-way-to-be. But maybe that's also my Jewish-bias, where practice matters more than belief.
posted by jb at 8:28 PM on April 25, 2021 [5 favorites]
Seconding that the particular faiths we're talking about and the degree of religiosity are key.
I was raised Catholic and am now agnostic, and my wife is a Jew who was raised in a Jewish (Reform)/Episcopalian family. She was pretty adamant about our kids having some exposure to Judaism, which I'm fine with (I grew up in a heavily Jewish area and was already acculturated to the basics), so they do Shabbat and holiday services, we collectively do Christmas with the practicing grandparents, and our kids have been to church with their grandmother. Judaism is heavily cultural for my wife, and a component of her social justice work, and I while I don't find organized religion personally useful, I'm not at all bothered by its non-proselytizing/evangelical forms.
If I either of us were more fervent about our positions, though, it would definitely be a point of conflict.
posted by ryanshepard at 8:52 PM on April 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
I was raised Catholic and am now agnostic, and my wife is a Jew who was raised in a Jewish (Reform)/Episcopalian family. She was pretty adamant about our kids having some exposure to Judaism, which I'm fine with (I grew up in a heavily Jewish area and was already acculturated to the basics), so they do Shabbat and holiday services, we collectively do Christmas with the practicing grandparents, and our kids have been to church with their grandmother. Judaism is heavily cultural for my wife, and a component of her social justice work, and I while I don't find organized religion personally useful, I'm not at all bothered by its non-proselytizing/evangelical forms.
If I either of us were more fervent about our positions, though, it would definitely be a point of conflict.
posted by ryanshepard at 8:52 PM on April 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
My mum is Catholic and my dad is an atheist. They agreed she'd raise the two kids in her religion and dad would stay out of it. We got baptized, went to church every week, did Sunday school, communion and confirmation, the whole deal. By our teen years my sibling and I had independently decided we were agnostic; we were full of questions and the church was quietly hateful about our queerness, so we all stopped going, mum too.
That's not the part I look back on with horror. It's the acrimony between my parents about their decision. Dad thought Mom was a right fool for believing, and Mom lost faith in Dad because he scoffed every time we got dressed up for Mass. We kids saw that and called phooey on the whole mess.
Now I have a devoted meditative practice and some personal gnosis under my belt. I pluck ideas from many religious traditions, but it would be a long day in purgatory before I'd step into a flesh-and-blood church again.
Whatever you do, keep contempt out of it. Kids are smart, they'll consider all sides. I'd expose them to both practices and support them in making their own decisions. The world is wide. They'll find their place in it.
posted by lloquat at 9:27 PM on April 25, 2021 [10 favorites]
That's not the part I look back on with horror. It's the acrimony between my parents about their decision. Dad thought Mom was a right fool for believing, and Mom lost faith in Dad because he scoffed every time we got dressed up for Mass. We kids saw that and called phooey on the whole mess.
Now I have a devoted meditative practice and some personal gnosis under my belt. I pluck ideas from many religious traditions, but it would be a long day in purgatory before I'd step into a flesh-and-blood church again.
Whatever you do, keep contempt out of it. Kids are smart, they'll consider all sides. I'd expose them to both practices and support them in making their own decisions. The world is wide. They'll find their place in it.
posted by lloquat at 9:27 PM on April 25, 2021 [10 favorites]
My parents did a whole lot of things wrong in raising us, but one thing they did very right (and which I felt thankful for from a very young age) was raising us agnostic. My mom's side of the family was Catholic, my dad's side of the family was Buddhist, and my parents never pressured us to believe one thing or another. They told us explicitly that it was for us to choose and encouraged us to explore all beliefs.
I learned about religion from both grandmas and often went to Sunday school with my best friend, whose family was devout. I was the kind of kid who read encyclopedias for fun and had a lot of questions that the Sunday school teacher wasn't prepared for. I decided early on that religion was not the thing for me, and that was just fine with my parents. It was one of the few things that wasn't a point of contention in my family.
posted by keep it under cover at 1:21 AM on April 26, 2021 [2 favorites]
I learned about religion from both grandmas and often went to Sunday school with my best friend, whose family was devout. I was the kind of kid who read encyclopedias for fun and had a lot of questions that the Sunday school teacher wasn't prepared for. I decided early on that religion was not the thing for me, and that was just fine with my parents. It was one of the few things that wasn't a point of contention in my family.
posted by keep it under cover at 1:21 AM on April 26, 2021 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Hey, thanks a lot guys... I can use all the advice I get.
Raised Muslim, grew up American (you know--bombarded with human rights for all, and religion no bar) so had a very *open* constitution of faiths. Have always had trouble with my own in my formative years but as I grew up, and lived a bit of life--realized that religion can play a role in our modern world if tempered with logic, so have ended up making my peace with it and practicing more than I used to. Still not as much as I should, probably, but I'm doing the best I can.
Marriage is one of those spheres where the rubber meats the road I guess. Have grown up with a myriad ways of living by which people choose to define their identity, so am open to all things as far as what other people have a right to practice, or not, as far as they are concerned--even if that person happens to be my wife--but the kids are another issue which pose their own set of unique problems, that have been touched upon here by the others.
Have always wanted to give them the right to choose whatever it is that they wanted, by trying to live the example that I was putting forward, so will take everything said ihere nto consideration.
Thanks guys.
posted by hadjiboy at 5:11 AM on April 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
Raised Muslim, grew up American (you know--bombarded with human rights for all, and religion no bar) so had a very *open* constitution of faiths. Have always had trouble with my own in my formative years but as I grew up, and lived a bit of life--realized that religion can play a role in our modern world if tempered with logic, so have ended up making my peace with it and practicing more than I used to. Still not as much as I should, probably, but I'm doing the best I can.
Marriage is one of those spheres where the rubber meats the road I guess. Have grown up with a myriad ways of living by which people choose to define their identity, so am open to all things as far as what other people have a right to practice, or not, as far as they are concerned--even if that person happens to be my wife--but the kids are another issue which pose their own set of unique problems, that have been touched upon here by the others.
Have always wanted to give them the right to choose whatever it is that they wanted, by trying to live the example that I was putting forward, so will take everything said ihere nto consideration.
Thanks guys.
posted by hadjiboy at 5:11 AM on April 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
I would encourage you to think of this as an opportunity to immerse your children into the traditions of two faiths, providing them with a sense of belonging to two tribes. This is like growing up in a household where the parents speak two different native languages: you can choose to view this as an opportunity for the child to have both those languages.... OR you can make it a power struggle between spouses (whose language will win? which set of grandparents will be offended?), or worse a power struggle between parent and child (are you perhaps protesting a little too loudly that you believe in children making their own free choices in which language they choose to speak as adults?) Do you see what I mean? You can choose to focus on joy and the doubling of that joy... or you can choose to see things in terms of power, winning, losing.
The day-to-day awkwardness is another matter, but it is small potatoes, a normal part of life, little moments that you can and will handle quite easily and move on. What's way more important is the joyful attitude with which you introduce your children to both worlds, the lessons in inclusiveness and diversity that your child will be enriched by, and the wonderful communities you are gifting to your children as their inheritance from you.
posted by MiraK at 6:51 AM on April 26, 2021 [2 favorites]
The day-to-day awkwardness is another matter, but it is small potatoes, a normal part of life, little moments that you can and will handle quite easily and move on. What's way more important is the joyful attitude with which you introduce your children to both worlds, the lessons in inclusiveness and diversity that your child will be enriched by, and the wonderful communities you are gifting to your children as their inheritance from you.
posted by MiraK at 6:51 AM on April 26, 2021 [2 favorites]
My husband and I are different faiths, although both Christian, and both believers to differing degrees. I think, like with so many things in a marriage, what really matters are values and respect.
If I truly believed he was going to hell because of his faith, or vice versa, that would be a very difficult place to raise children. I mean, it would be a very difficult way to be married period, but especially with kids. Instead we both are of the belief - hold the value - that the God we believe in didn't put 300 million people on earth with different religions to send the majority to hell. We talk about respect for other religions, and the idea that religions are a social construct that can be positive because they provide solace and ritual and a way to do good in the world, but that like all social constructs they are flawed and imperfect.
My husband was very worried about the kids wondering why I get communion and he doesn't. I think each kid has asked about that once and has otherwise been completely nonplussed. This reflects my own reality where my siblings and other family members were not Catholic and would sometimes attend Mass and sometimes not, and sometimes get communion and sometimes not. (lots of this also depends on the individual church within the larger institution - for example, at our wedding my priest welcomed everyone, even if they weren't catholic, to receive communion. Most priests aren't going to do that; mine did because I said *I* wasn't going to receive communion if my husband couldn't, since that seemed like a strange way to start a marriage. He had agreed to give my husband communion; I had no idea until our wedding that he was going to welcome everyone else).
I guess this is a long way of saying I think it is entirely doable, as long as each person respects the other one. As someone said upthread, if you hold the other religion in contempt, or are constantly trying to convert your partner, that's going to lead to a great deal of strife in the relationship.
posted by dpx.mfx at 7:26 AM on April 26, 2021 [3 favorites]
If I truly believed he was going to hell because of his faith, or vice versa, that would be a very difficult place to raise children. I mean, it would be a very difficult way to be married period, but especially with kids. Instead we both are of the belief - hold the value - that the God we believe in didn't put 300 million people on earth with different religions to send the majority to hell. We talk about respect for other religions, and the idea that religions are a social construct that can be positive because they provide solace and ritual and a way to do good in the world, but that like all social constructs they are flawed and imperfect.
My husband was very worried about the kids wondering why I get communion and he doesn't. I think each kid has asked about that once and has otherwise been completely nonplussed. This reflects my own reality where my siblings and other family members were not Catholic and would sometimes attend Mass and sometimes not, and sometimes get communion and sometimes not. (lots of this also depends on the individual church within the larger institution - for example, at our wedding my priest welcomed everyone, even if they weren't catholic, to receive communion. Most priests aren't going to do that; mine did because I said *I* wasn't going to receive communion if my husband couldn't, since that seemed like a strange way to start a marriage. He had agreed to give my husband communion; I had no idea until our wedding that he was going to welcome everyone else).
I guess this is a long way of saying I think it is entirely doable, as long as each person respects the other one. As someone said upthread, if you hold the other religion in contempt, or are constantly trying to convert your partner, that's going to lead to a great deal of strife in the relationship.
posted by dpx.mfx at 7:26 AM on April 26, 2021 [3 favorites]
I was in an interfaith marriage (I am a Jewish atheist, my ex is Catholic). We did not have children.
Life cycle events were really the only times we bumped up against religion in a big way. His family's approach to death and mourning did not sit well with me - he lost a parent just months after we were married and it coloured our entire marriage, if I'm being honest.
He is, or at least was at the time, something of a believer, but that did not bother me. Note I said it didn't bother me - that's not great. I should have been thrilled and happy that he enjoyed his faith. While I appreciate the moral structure Judaism has given me, I am staunchly atheist and probably shouldn't marry someone who believes in something I think is a myth. YMMV.
I don't think respect is enough. I think we should revel in the things that make up the core of our partners. What that means to you, only you can decide.
posted by wellred at 7:33 AM on April 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
Life cycle events were really the only times we bumped up against religion in a big way. His family's approach to death and mourning did not sit well with me - he lost a parent just months after we were married and it coloured our entire marriage, if I'm being honest.
He is, or at least was at the time, something of a believer, but that did not bother me. Note I said it didn't bother me - that's not great. I should have been thrilled and happy that he enjoyed his faith. While I appreciate the moral structure Judaism has given me, I am staunchly atheist and probably shouldn't marry someone who believes in something I think is a myth. YMMV.
I don't think respect is enough. I think we should revel in the things that make up the core of our partners. What that means to you, only you can decide.
posted by wellred at 7:33 AM on April 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Hmmm, interesting... I would, if I could, revel in someone else's way of reaching a higher spiritual plain but--the *least*, LEAST, mind you, is respect that I'm asking, which is what everyone else here is I'm assuming. Hey, it'd be fucking spectacular if I were able to know some of the inner-workings of their religion, in a way, but if I use that as a barometer to measure how much I love a woman then I'm going to be playing in a shallower pool... but then you know what--I've got luck on my side: most of the women that I've fallen in love with who're from where I am, have been Hindu, and that's a religion, having lived side-by-side with, I am much more attune to and not only respect but can (as you've put it) revel in as well!
dp: Ha! I've always preferred taking the long way home anyway. (:
You know what, Mira... you ended up hitting the nail right on the head with your reply. The way I see it, marriage is gonna be a "plus", rather than a minus as far as the kids are concerned--two faiths; two ways of life to live by; two experiences to cherish... I know it ain't gonna be smooth sailing, what type of parenthood is, but the upside should make up for the downs, whenever they might crop up, I'm hoping.
Which is why it's imperative that I find the right woman--someone with whom I happen to be on the same page with, and that apparently isn't as easy as I thought it was gonna be. Not until I've finished unloading the garbage that I've been piling up on my shoulders for the past few years/decades... long story, but it might have a happy ending after all.
Here's hoping, aye.
posted by hadjiboy at 7:53 AM on April 26, 2021
dp: Ha! I've always preferred taking the long way home anyway. (:
You know what, Mira... you ended up hitting the nail right on the head with your reply. The way I see it, marriage is gonna be a "plus", rather than a minus as far as the kids are concerned--two faiths; two ways of life to live by; two experiences to cherish... I know it ain't gonna be smooth sailing, what type of parenthood is, but the upside should make up for the downs, whenever they might crop up, I'm hoping.
Which is why it's imperative that I find the right woman--someone with whom I happen to be on the same page with, and that apparently isn't as easy as I thought it was gonna be. Not until I've finished unloading the garbage that I've been piling up on my shoulders for the past few years/decades... long story, but it might have a happy ending after all.
Here's hoping, aye.
posted by hadjiboy at 7:53 AM on April 26, 2021
Wait, you're not even in a relationship yet? :) I admire the thoroughness and attention to detail you're bringing into your daydreams and hopes for the future, but knowing that you're not in a relationship at the moment makes me want to amend my advice to: "you will cross that bridge when you get to it; for now, what are some of the real-life barriers you are facing in your romantic prospects?"
I know it's not easy to date in India and social conventions around romantic relationships can be extremely tricky to navigate. I think you may be feeling a little stuck in the real world, so you're pouring all this intellectual energy into dreams for the far future. Perhaps we can help you unpick the here-and-now stuckness you are facing?
posted by MiraK at 8:04 AM on April 26, 2021 [4 favorites]
I know it's not easy to date in India and social conventions around romantic relationships can be extremely tricky to navigate. I think you may be feeling a little stuck in the real world, so you're pouring all this intellectual energy into dreams for the far future. Perhaps we can help you unpick the here-and-now stuckness you are facing?
posted by MiraK at 8:04 AM on April 26, 2021 [4 favorites]
As the child of an interfaith marriage, I became an atheist. (So did all my siblings.) So there’s that perspective. I also became an anthropologist, which I actually attribute to having to figure out the clash of parental cultures I experienced as a child.
posted by spitbull at 8:24 AM on April 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by spitbull at 8:24 AM on April 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
So my perspective on this is going to be a little different from the norm, in that I'm now in a third generation "interfaith" marriage. My paternal grandparents were "interfaith" in the sense that my grandfather was an atheist and my grandmother a (Syrian Orthodox) Christian, in India. My grandmother's faith was extremely important to her; she prayed every day, church every Sunday, raised their four kids to be Christian. However, they managed to live together in mutual harmony by basically not interfering in each other's beliefs. (They were an extremely unusual couple, even by today's standards, and especially so for the Indian standards of the time. They also had a "love marriage", but I digress.) The result was three kids who were / are strong Christians, and one atheist (my dad). My dad married my mom who is somewhat more religious, but not strongly so, and comes from a Hindu family. They raised me fairly agnostic, in that they refused to get me baptized, allowed me to attend church services as needed (though I didn't often go), and took me to temples with my maternal grandparents. We celebrated both Hindu and Christian festivals, which I loved, but I am definitely atheist now.
I have married someone who is himself the product of Jewish and Christian intermarriage in the grandparental generation, but is also an atheist - so now we are... confused? Not really, because I guess in one sense we are both atheists, but in another sense we are both now raising our two children far away from our home cultures, and so feel the need to pass on something of "tradition". But what that means is a constantly renegotiated thing.
We celebrate Hindu and Jewish and Christian festivals, but they do feel a bit hollow now two generations removed from people who actually believe in the meanings behind the rituals. And my husband did not even really celebrate much in the way of Jewish festivals growing up in Soviet and then post-Soviet Belarus, so he feels especially conflicted about celebrating Jewish festivals, here, in the US, given that he has neither faith nor tradition to back it up. However, I love what MiraK said about approaching this with a joyful attitude - we are complicated, but that's something to be celebrated, not worried about.
posted by peacheater at 8:56 AM on April 26, 2021 [3 favorites]
I have married someone who is himself the product of Jewish and Christian intermarriage in the grandparental generation, but is also an atheist - so now we are... confused? Not really, because I guess in one sense we are both atheists, but in another sense we are both now raising our two children far away from our home cultures, and so feel the need to pass on something of "tradition". But what that means is a constantly renegotiated thing.
We celebrate Hindu and Jewish and Christian festivals, but they do feel a bit hollow now two generations removed from people who actually believe in the meanings behind the rituals. And my husband did not even really celebrate much in the way of Jewish festivals growing up in Soviet and then post-Soviet Belarus, so he feels especially conflicted about celebrating Jewish festivals, here, in the US, given that he has neither faith nor tradition to back it up. However, I love what MiraK said about approaching this with a joyful attitude - we are complicated, but that's something to be celebrated, not worried about.
posted by peacheater at 8:56 AM on April 26, 2021 [3 favorites]
Caveat: all of the below advice pertains to an interfaith marriage WITH children. With kids it’s a whole different ballgame.
I'm a former Muslim, now atheist, and I co-parent two teenagers with my Muslim ex-husband so I have an interfaith family. Unless you are extremely liberal/non-practicing, I urge caution.
If there's a way you can practice your faith without indirectly casting judgement on your non-Muslim partner's behaviour, it could work. The problem is, that kind of judgement is kinda inherent to Islam. There are a lot of rules, and it's not one of those "we're all going to heaven" kinda religions.
For example, what happens if your partner eats pork and you don't, and your kids ask why. "I believe pigs carry disease and don't want to pollute my body" can cause your kids to become concerned about their other parent. Or what if you don't want to allow your daughter to wear a bikini but your partner wears one. How will you explain that? Really think about these things. Kids ask a lot of questions. And if you plan to be honest with your kids, you may find yourself causing them a lot of confusion/worry/anger/frustration. As a young girl it infuriated me that my brother could wear shorts and I couldn’t, and I never got any good answers about why. (And this was in a household with two Muslim parents! Imagine what my anger level would’ve been if I saw my mom wearing shorts…!).
Again as I said, if you yourself are extremely liberal, this stuff can be N/A. But before you get into a relationship with a non-Muslim, I would advise you to get VERY CLEAR about what Islamic practices you follow and why, what you’d want to impose on your kids, and how it would impact them. My kids (now agnostic) find themselves torn between their two parents. They've chosen "my side" and that makes their dad sad. Which in turn makes them feel guilty. 2/10, would not recommend.
posted by yawper at 9:24 AM on April 26, 2021 [5 favorites]
I'm a former Muslim, now atheist, and I co-parent two teenagers with my Muslim ex-husband so I have an interfaith family. Unless you are extremely liberal/non-practicing, I urge caution.
If there's a way you can practice your faith without indirectly casting judgement on your non-Muslim partner's behaviour, it could work. The problem is, that kind of judgement is kinda inherent to Islam. There are a lot of rules, and it's not one of those "we're all going to heaven" kinda religions.
For example, what happens if your partner eats pork and you don't, and your kids ask why. "I believe pigs carry disease and don't want to pollute my body" can cause your kids to become concerned about their other parent. Or what if you don't want to allow your daughter to wear a bikini but your partner wears one. How will you explain that? Really think about these things. Kids ask a lot of questions. And if you plan to be honest with your kids, you may find yourself causing them a lot of confusion/worry/anger/frustration. As a young girl it infuriated me that my brother could wear shorts and I couldn’t, and I never got any good answers about why. (And this was in a household with two Muslim parents! Imagine what my anger level would’ve been if I saw my mom wearing shorts…!).
Again as I said, if you yourself are extremely liberal, this stuff can be N/A. But before you get into a relationship with a non-Muslim, I would advise you to get VERY CLEAR about what Islamic practices you follow and why, what you’d want to impose on your kids, and how it would impact them. My kids (now agnostic) find themselves torn between their two parents. They've chosen "my side" and that makes their dad sad. Which in turn makes them feel guilty. 2/10, would not recommend.
posted by yawper at 9:24 AM on April 26, 2021 [5 favorites]
I am a culturally (but not practicing/believing) Catholic woman married to a Jewish man, who was himself the child of a Jewish mother and a Catholic (of multiple levels of belief) father. I agree with everyone above who has said that the important thing is not that my partner and I share the same religion, but that we share the same approach toward religion: i.e. that it can be important to people or not, and both are okay. That it can be a component of someone’s inner life and a frame for how they think about the world, or they can have other frames, and both are okay. That it can be a moral guide for action in the world, or they can have moral belief systems based elsewhere, and both are okay.
I am very happy to celebrate Jewish holidays with my partner and our Jewish loved ones. I am very happy to celebrate an aesthetic Christmas together. We can both appreciate the complex, weird, interesting, and unexpected ways that our ideas and histories overlap. But neither one of us believe that our religious identities or practices are fundamentally “right”, in the sense of an objective truth about God or the universe, or in fact that a religious identity is even a thing that it is possible to be right about.
For example, I share many rituals with my partner because sharing them makes me feel close to him, but I don’t feel alienated or judged by my husband when he practices without me. He doesn’t fast because it is “right” or necessary to honor God or because it marks him as chosen; he fasts because it makes him feel closer to his family, culture, and history, and because it provides time and space to think about his religious life. If I ever felt that he thought my not-fasting was disrespectful to him or God or myself, that would be a problem for me.
For us, religion is frameworks that help us think; cultural practices that make us comfortable and happy; histories to consider and reckon with; moral ideas that resonate in our hearts and help us live. I think I could share a life with someone of any religion, if they approached it in this way. I think I could not share a life with someone who shared even my exact religious identity if they did not.
posted by CtrlAltDelete at 10:05 AM on April 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
I am very happy to celebrate Jewish holidays with my partner and our Jewish loved ones. I am very happy to celebrate an aesthetic Christmas together. We can both appreciate the complex, weird, interesting, and unexpected ways that our ideas and histories overlap. But neither one of us believe that our religious identities or practices are fundamentally “right”, in the sense of an objective truth about God or the universe, or in fact that a religious identity is even a thing that it is possible to be right about.
For example, I share many rituals with my partner because sharing them makes me feel close to him, but I don’t feel alienated or judged by my husband when he practices without me. He doesn’t fast because it is “right” or necessary to honor God or because it marks him as chosen; he fasts because it makes him feel closer to his family, culture, and history, and because it provides time and space to think about his religious life. If I ever felt that he thought my not-fasting was disrespectful to him or God or myself, that would be a problem for me.
For us, religion is frameworks that help us think; cultural practices that make us comfortable and happy; histories to consider and reckon with; moral ideas that resonate in our hearts and help us live. I think I could share a life with someone of any religion, if they approached it in this way. I think I could not share a life with someone who shared even my exact religious identity if they did not.
posted by CtrlAltDelete at 10:05 AM on April 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thanks a lot, yawper: That was golden Advice, and something that I needed to hear from a woman of my own faith. Yes, it's gonna be tricky--but then the women that interest me are very much psychologically similar to my own ways of functioning. Except for the "pork" ...problem, shall we call it, which is something that wasn't a problem since she'd never tried it or wanted to. Drinking on the other hand, might've been another matter since she had a bear now and then, and something stronger once in a month, so... doable, I was thinking? Ehhh, anyway, read below for the conclusion of my meanderings.
peacheater: Thanks a lot for the input; it always is a joy to read about how inter-faith families have come to be--past and present... hey, I hope all the people who you've mentioned in your reply are well, and that your kids are doing as good as can be expected from someone who is a very perceptive mother I'm guessing.
Couldn't have said it better, Ctrl... in the sense that I'm not looking to *change* anyone's faith--their upbringing; their way of life; or what they are comfortable with. All I want is for them to give me the same respect which I don't mind sharing with them. Everything else, is as you've so beautifully laid out here: "For us, religion is frameworks that help us think; cultural practices that make us comfortable and happy; histories to consider and reckon with; moral ideas that resonate in our hearts and help us live. I think I could share a life with someone of any religion, if they approached it in this way. I think I could not share a life with someone who shared even my exact religious identity if they did not."
>>>Wait, you're not even in a relationship yet? :)
Haha, no-no--was set to marry a spectacular woman, everything that I could've dreamed of, and then some (she was a Bengali Beauty--smart as a whip, the smartest woman I've met till date, which is a really high bar to cross; a non-practicing-hindu, who shared my fascination with her faith, as she did with mine; and lived in Hyderabad as well)... thought I'd hit the jack-pot, and so did she, so we'd started making plans for the future... kids, parents, family/friends--you name it, the whole kit-and-caboodle! Only problem was, as you might've already guessed by the sort of reply you gave me earlier... I am, the way I am, sadly, with a head full of rainbows and a mouth to match--which is where the problem usually arises.
The mistake that I often make in such situations is taking the lead in our courtship, which is what I've become better and better at avoiding as time's gone by and thought I wouldn't even bring it up this time--so imagine my surprise when it was she that wanted me and not the other way around... I mean, I'm not a bad looking guy, or stupid, or not passionate of what I want from this life. But, yeah, have that baggage I was talking about and thought she'd understand it might take me a little while to work out the kinks (along with another thing here and there) but, I think she just realized it was something that she was getting into with eyes wide shut.
Long story short, it's been 6 months now, 7 this 20th, so before I ventured back into the abyss that is the dating-hell-in-India, thought I'd put up this question. (:
posted by hadjiboy at 10:45 AM on April 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
peacheater: Thanks a lot for the input; it always is a joy to read about how inter-faith families have come to be--past and present... hey, I hope all the people who you've mentioned in your reply are well, and that your kids are doing as good as can be expected from someone who is a very perceptive mother I'm guessing.
Couldn't have said it better, Ctrl... in the sense that I'm not looking to *change* anyone's faith--their upbringing; their way of life; or what they are comfortable with. All I want is for them to give me the same respect which I don't mind sharing with them. Everything else, is as you've so beautifully laid out here: "For us, religion is frameworks that help us think; cultural practices that make us comfortable and happy; histories to consider and reckon with; moral ideas that resonate in our hearts and help us live. I think I could share a life with someone of any religion, if they approached it in this way. I think I could not share a life with someone who shared even my exact religious identity if they did not."
>>>Wait, you're not even in a relationship yet? :)
Haha, no-no--was set to marry a spectacular woman, everything that I could've dreamed of, and then some (she was a Bengali Beauty--smart as a whip, the smartest woman I've met till date, which is a really high bar to cross; a non-practicing-hindu, who shared my fascination with her faith, as she did with mine; and lived in Hyderabad as well)... thought I'd hit the jack-pot, and so did she, so we'd started making plans for the future... kids, parents, family/friends--you name it, the whole kit-and-caboodle! Only problem was, as you might've already guessed by the sort of reply you gave me earlier... I am, the way I am, sadly, with a head full of rainbows and a mouth to match--which is where the problem usually arises.
The mistake that I often make in such situations is taking the lead in our courtship, which is what I've become better and better at avoiding as time's gone by and thought I wouldn't even bring it up this time--so imagine my surprise when it was she that wanted me and not the other way around... I mean, I'm not a bad looking guy, or stupid, or not passionate of what I want from this life. But, yeah, have that baggage I was talking about and thought she'd understand it might take me a little while to work out the kinks (along with another thing here and there) but, I think she just realized it was something that she was getting into with eyes wide shut.
Long story short, it's been 6 months now, 7 this 20th, so before I ventured back into the abyss that is the dating-hell-in-India, thought I'd put up this question. (:
posted by hadjiboy at 10:45 AM on April 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
My dad is Jewish and my mom is Catholic. Like one of the first posters said, they always said we could choose when we grew up. None of us kids experienced that as any kind of pressure or being told to choose between parents though--it was more like, you can choose what to believe (out of the full universe of options) and we are not going to indoctrinate you in any particular set of beliefs but instead will expose you to both of our traditions.
Neither parent is particularly religious so it was never a huge issue. As it turned out none of the kids are really religious either. My brother and I consider ourselves to be vaguely Jewish. My sister later converted to Catholicism when she got married but religion isn't a big part of her life. I think from time to time that I would like to get more involved in the Jewish community but also kind of feel like I'm not "Jewish enough" and I've never put in the effort, so my involvement has mostly been limited to cooking Jewish food and having strong opinions about bagels.
posted by Squalor Victoria at 11:13 AM on April 26, 2021 [2 favorites]
Neither parent is particularly religious so it was never a huge issue. As it turned out none of the kids are really religious either. My brother and I consider ourselves to be vaguely Jewish. My sister later converted to Catholicism when she got married but religion isn't a big part of her life. I think from time to time that I would like to get more involved in the Jewish community but also kind of feel like I'm not "Jewish enough" and I've never put in the effort, so my involvement has mostly been limited to cooking Jewish food and having strong opinions about bagels.
posted by Squalor Victoria at 11:13 AM on April 26, 2021 [2 favorites]
Response by poster: Hey, it's never too late you know... whatever you can do, even a little bit--it'll mean the world to someone else I'm sure.
Ps. I've never had a bagel--they're not very big where I live, I mean we have doughnuts galore but am yet to come across one of those. We should definitely talk, so that you can give me the skinny on them breads.
posted by hadjiboy at 4:27 PM on April 26, 2021
Ps. I've never had a bagel--they're not very big where I live, I mean we have doughnuts galore but am yet to come across one of those. We should definitely talk, so that you can give me the skinny on them breads.
posted by hadjiboy at 4:27 PM on April 26, 2021
Not sure how helpful this is, but: I was non-practicing but identified as Jewish enough to be adamant that our kids not be raised to believe in Jesus. My wife was Catholic, recently immigrated, looking for a church for herself, but ok with any kids being raised Jewish; it was just important to her that they be raised as *something*.
We had one. He went to Hebrew school for a few years, then my wife stopped feeling it was worth the money. I didn't really feel strongly about it, so we dropped him out. Meanwhile, my wife also is no longer observant; I'm essentially agnostic, and would probably be atheist but for not being able to fully shake the programming of my youth, and I would say she's maybe less skeptical than me but not so far down the spectrum. I don't think either of us thinks our son missed out on much, but a more religious person likely would disagree. Then again, we'd likely disagree with them on the value of organized religion.
If there's value for you in this answer, it's likely only to point out that people, like my wife, can get less religious over time. Or more religious, of course.
posted by troywestfield at 1:03 PM on April 29, 2021
We had one. He went to Hebrew school for a few years, then my wife stopped feeling it was worth the money. I didn't really feel strongly about it, so we dropped him out. Meanwhile, my wife also is no longer observant; I'm essentially agnostic, and would probably be atheist but for not being able to fully shake the programming of my youth, and I would say she's maybe less skeptical than me but not so far down the spectrum. I don't think either of us thinks our son missed out on much, but a more religious person likely would disagree. Then again, we'd likely disagree with them on the value of organized religion.
If there's value for you in this answer, it's likely only to point out that people, like my wife, can get less religious over time. Or more religious, of course.
posted by troywestfield at 1:03 PM on April 29, 2021
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by shadygrove at 8:18 PM on April 25, 2021 [14 favorites]