Flat roof leaking after Chicago snow -- help!
December 30, 2020 6:37 AM Subscribe
We bought our first house this summer, and woke up this morning (after the first heavy snow of the season) with water dripping through our bathroom ceiling vent. What happens next?
It's a 1997 town house with a flat roof (mostly covered by a roof deck) that has been patched up but not replaced since it was built, so we knew we'd be facing issues at some point, and we have money set aside for it. But we'd been hoping to wait until this summer to get any serious work done.
Three real questions:
1) What do we do RIGHT NOW given that there's currently water dripping from our ceiling? Should I try to clear the snow off the flat roof? Should I dismantle the vent to try to dry out any water that's inside? (We can see dampness around the vent too, so there's presumably some pooling inside..?) Do we need to call some sort of roof-repair Batman to do emergency fixes of some sort?
2) How does getting more serious repair work done during the Chicago winter happen? If we need to rip off the deck and the roof in order to do a replacement, that's got to be summer work, right? Are we just doomed to drippy ceilings until the warm/dry weather returns?
3) Do you have recommendations for roofers in the Chicago area?
Thanks so much! Off to change out the buckets...
It's a 1997 town house with a flat roof (mostly covered by a roof deck) that has been patched up but not replaced since it was built, so we knew we'd be facing issues at some point, and we have money set aside for it. But we'd been hoping to wait until this summer to get any serious work done.
Three real questions:
1) What do we do RIGHT NOW given that there's currently water dripping from our ceiling? Should I try to clear the snow off the flat roof? Should I dismantle the vent to try to dry out any water that's inside? (We can see dampness around the vent too, so there's presumably some pooling inside..?) Do we need to call some sort of roof-repair Batman to do emergency fixes of some sort?
2) How does getting more serious repair work done during the Chicago winter happen? If we need to rip off the deck and the roof in order to do a replacement, that's got to be summer work, right? Are we just doomed to drippy ceilings until the warm/dry weather returns?
3) Do you have recommendations for roofers in the Chicago area?
Thanks so much! Off to change out the buckets...
If you can safely do it, Clean the snow off the roof, and keep it cleared. It's just going to keep melting and doing more water damage until it's gone.
Somehow the water is getting from the roof to the vent, I would take a look from the deck to try and figure out where that is. If you're lucky it's something you can put a tarp over to prevent further damage.
My next steps would be to call a professional, but I'm not handy.
posted by TheAdamist at 6:50 AM on December 30, 2020 [4 favorites]
Somehow the water is getting from the roof to the vent, I would take a look from the deck to try and figure out where that is. If you're lucky it's something you can put a tarp over to prevent further damage.
My next steps would be to call a professional, but I'm not handy.
posted by TheAdamist at 6:50 AM on December 30, 2020 [4 favorites]
Ugh. So sorry to hear this. I've been there, but with an building about 100 years older, so, my experience may be a bit different. Here is what I learned in my leaky roof process:
Water is going to find the path of least resistance down. Where is it coming from? In my case, it was coming in from a parapet wall (the low walls that surrounded 3 sides of the roof). It was entering through broken coping tiles (the cap tiles). The water came down the wall and across the ceiling. We thought there was a roof leak, but there was not. So, you need someone to localize where the water is coming in. That will dictate the next steps.
Flat roof work, to my recollection, takes place any time.
Cost and what need to be done are key. How long will a stopgap measure last? How many times has the roof been overcoated/re-done? There are building codes regarding how may layers of roofing is allowable. Each layer of new roofing (tar paper, tar, etc.) adds weight to your roof. In my old building, there were several layers. That weight will slightly bow the rafters...meaning...if you take the weight off...the rafters will return to form, pulling everything upward a bit. I had plaster ceilings, so, that would have added a good bit of cost to have to re-do them.
No roofer recommendations, sorry. My contacts are 10 years old.
A roofer is what you need. Sooner than later (will be much more expensive for the next couple of holiday days).
posted by zerobyproxy at 6:59 AM on December 30, 2020
Water is going to find the path of least resistance down. Where is it coming from? In my case, it was coming in from a parapet wall (the low walls that surrounded 3 sides of the roof). It was entering through broken coping tiles (the cap tiles). The water came down the wall and across the ceiling. We thought there was a roof leak, but there was not. So, you need someone to localize where the water is coming in. That will dictate the next steps.
Flat roof work, to my recollection, takes place any time.
Cost and what need to be done are key. How long will a stopgap measure last? How many times has the roof been overcoated/re-done? There are building codes regarding how may layers of roofing is allowable. Each layer of new roofing (tar paper, tar, etc.) adds weight to your roof. In my old building, there were several layers. That weight will slightly bow the rafters...meaning...if you take the weight off...the rafters will return to form, pulling everything upward a bit. I had plaster ceilings, so, that would have added a good bit of cost to have to re-do them.
No roofer recommendations, sorry. My contacts are 10 years old.
A roofer is what you need. Sooner than later (will be much more expensive for the next couple of holiday days).
posted by zerobyproxy at 6:59 AM on December 30, 2020
Upon re-read: water is coming in through the vent. Not a roof leak issue.
The vent flows warm air out. Where the vent pipe exits could be covered in snow. The cap top of the vent could be missing. Water is not draining appropriately from the roof and is somehow flowing into the vent pipe. Can you get to the roof and check the vent pipe?
posted by zerobyproxy at 7:03 AM on December 30, 2020 [9 favorites]
The vent flows warm air out. Where the vent pipe exits could be covered in snow. The cap top of the vent could be missing. Water is not draining appropriately from the roof and is somehow flowing into the vent pipe. Can you get to the roof and check the vent pipe?
posted by zerobyproxy at 7:03 AM on December 30, 2020 [9 favorites]
Seconding that this is likely not a roof issue. In addition to the cap top, another potential culprit is the flange around the vent pipe.
posted by carmicha at 7:10 AM on December 30, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by carmicha at 7:10 AM on December 30, 2020 [2 favorites]
Call your insurance company!!!
posted by nkknkk at 7:19 AM on December 30, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by nkknkk at 7:19 AM on December 30, 2020 [2 favorites]
Hold up! It miiiiggghhtttt not be terrible!
If the hot, moist air leaving your house through the vent (even when the fan is off) is encountering very cold metal on its way out, it will condense onto the sides of the vent pipe, and will eventually drip down the vent. If there's snow or ice TOUCHING the vent pipe, this will make it cold enough to condense for sure.
This can happen with appliance exhausts, too, not just bathroom vents -- especially with gas furnaces and water heaters, because the clean combustion of natural gas results in water vapour (and carbon dioxide).
Turn on your bathroom vent fan and leave it on. This may stop the dripping after a few minutes as the hot interior air dries out the condensation.
Meantime, if you can safely get up on your roof, look at the vent pipe, and see if it's insulated on the outside (and capped). If it's not insulated, that's the first thing you should do. Just a few inches of foam insulation, taped around it and flashed off on the bottom, should keep the condensation from coming back!
If turning on the vent fan doesn't stop the dripping, the problem is likely more serious. But it could just be as simple as leaving the fan on all the time (short term) and insulating the vent pipe (long term).
Good luck.
posted by seanmpuckett at 7:35 AM on December 30, 2020 [3 favorites]
If the hot, moist air leaving your house through the vent (even when the fan is off) is encountering very cold metal on its way out, it will condense onto the sides of the vent pipe, and will eventually drip down the vent. If there's snow or ice TOUCHING the vent pipe, this will make it cold enough to condense for sure.
This can happen with appliance exhausts, too, not just bathroom vents -- especially with gas furnaces and water heaters, because the clean combustion of natural gas results in water vapour (and carbon dioxide).
Turn on your bathroom vent fan and leave it on. This may stop the dripping after a few minutes as the hot interior air dries out the condensation.
Meantime, if you can safely get up on your roof, look at the vent pipe, and see if it's insulated on the outside (and capped). If it's not insulated, that's the first thing you should do. Just a few inches of foam insulation, taped around it and flashed off on the bottom, should keep the condensation from coming back!
If turning on the vent fan doesn't stop the dripping, the problem is likely more serious. But it could just be as simple as leaving the fan on all the time (short term) and insulating the vent pipe (long term).
Good luck.
posted by seanmpuckett at 7:35 AM on December 30, 2020 [3 favorites]
The previous answer brought to you by someone who had to put a bucket under the natural gas boiler exhaust stack in the basement because it would just fucking drip all winter long because it was metal and ran up through the old chimney with over 10' of external, uninsulatable exposure. C'est la old house.
posted by seanmpuckett at 7:37 AM on December 30, 2020
posted by seanmpuckett at 7:37 AM on December 30, 2020
Response by poster: Thanks so much everyone!
To clarify, it's dripping through the (incoming) HVAC vent, not the (outgoing) extractor fan. I'm not sure if the condensation theory works in that case? Another data point: when I took off the screen, the inside of the housing felt bone dry; the water seems to be dripping in along the outside of the housing. See here: https://ibb.co/YDYGY5K
I shoveled all the snow off our deck, which covers the area above the vent, and the dripping seems to have stopped now. (Those two ominous-looking droplets marked in the photo have been hanging around for 10-15 minutes now without falling, after having previously been dripping every second or two.)
Does this still sound like it might be a minor leak-around-the-flange or condensation-type issue? Or am I doomed to getting a roofer involved to root around for problems underneath the deck?
posted by Yo Soy La Morsa at 7:48 AM on December 30, 2020
To clarify, it's dripping through the (incoming) HVAC vent, not the (outgoing) extractor fan. I'm not sure if the condensation theory works in that case? Another data point: when I took off the screen, the inside of the housing felt bone dry; the water seems to be dripping in along the outside of the housing. See here: https://ibb.co/YDYGY5K
I shoveled all the snow off our deck, which covers the area above the vent, and the dripping seems to have stopped now. (Those two ominous-looking droplets marked in the photo have been hanging around for 10-15 minutes now without falling, after having previously been dripping every second or two.)
Does this still sound like it might be a minor leak-around-the-flange or condensation-type issue? Or am I doomed to getting a roofer involved to root around for problems underneath the deck?
posted by Yo Soy La Morsa at 7:48 AM on December 30, 2020
If that HVAC run isn't insulated, it very well could still be condensation. This assumes A. Hot air blowing through the duct and vent, and B. nothing insulating the duct from the very cold environment above the ceiling (attic?)
posted by Thorzdad at 8:01 AM on December 30, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Thorzdad at 8:01 AM on December 30, 2020 [1 favorite]
That said, it would be a good idea to get up into the attic (if you can) and take a look yourself before you call a roofer. You're definitely going to have to repair that ceiling, though.
posted by Thorzdad at 8:19 AM on December 30, 2020
posted by Thorzdad at 8:19 AM on December 30, 2020
If you can from the safety of the deck, check for blockages (ice, or debris) of the drains that might cause pooling of water on the roof. If there is a crack in the roofing material, or around a vent pipe, you can minimize intrusion by reducing the water above. Some buildings have a heater on the drain to encourage flow in even cold weather.
posted by nickggully at 8:23 AM on December 30, 2020
posted by nickggully at 8:23 AM on December 30, 2020
If that's a heating supply duct, it is not a condensation problem, with or without insulation around it. Because condensation would occur when warm moist air meets a cold surface. You say the inside of the duct is bone dry. Condensation inside a heating duct would be very unusual in any case. And it's not condensation onto the outside of the duct, because that would happen only if you have warm moist air outside of it and cold air (like air conditioning) inside it. So, not condensation.
As to "leak around the flange" — this duct does not go through your roof in any way; it connects to your furnace. So you have water coming through the roof somewhere, which happens to drip onto the duct and then comes into your living space.
The fact that shoveling the deck stopped the flow could be good news, assuming that the snow atop the deck was in fact melting and dripping to the roof surface below. If there was no melting up there, then it's just a coincidence. If it was melting, then you might be able to stave off roof work til spring by putting a giant tarp over the deck. But I would not proceed to trying that before you have a roofer actually look at it.
posted by beagle at 8:43 AM on December 30, 2020 [2 favorites]
As to "leak around the flange" — this duct does not go through your roof in any way; it connects to your furnace. So you have water coming through the roof somewhere, which happens to drip onto the duct and then comes into your living space.
The fact that shoveling the deck stopped the flow could be good news, assuming that the snow atop the deck was in fact melting and dripping to the roof surface below. If there was no melting up there, then it's just a coincidence. If it was melting, then you might be able to stave off roof work til spring by putting a giant tarp over the deck. But I would not proceed to trying that before you have a roofer actually look at it.
posted by beagle at 8:43 AM on December 30, 2020 [2 favorites]
Most roofing companies have a guy, or will recommend a guy, who does repairs that take only a couple hours. They don't always start by heaving deep sighs and recommending complete roofing jobs.
I had a problem similar to yours, but It was long enough ago that I don't remember the details. But I do remember there were two parts to it. One was that the vent itself had become clogged with leaves (we live in the woods). The other was that roofing sealant (tar) around the vent pipe had dried out and cracked.
I think "leak around the flange" is quite possible.
posted by SemiSalt at 4:10 PM on December 30, 2020 [1 favorite]
I had a problem similar to yours, but It was long enough ago that I don't remember the details. But I do remember there were two parts to it. One was that the vent itself had become clogged with leaves (we live in the woods). The other was that roofing sealant (tar) around the vent pipe had dried out and cracked.
I think "leak around the flange" is quite possible.
posted by SemiSalt at 4:10 PM on December 30, 2020 [1 favorite]
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posted by beagle at 6:48 AM on December 30, 2020 [1 favorite]