How to I ask my partner to stop working so much?
March 5, 2020 6:33 PM Subscribe
My spouse has a supposedly part-time position at a university near us. But...she works way way too much, plus...baby is on the way...
It's a really interesting job, where she has a lot of decision making power and there are lots of interesting other opportunities. We made a very large life switch (moved states) because of this job, and I still believe that it is a very interesting opportunity. However, she sometimes works six days a week, sometimes for 10+ hours a day. I have tried talking to her and have asked her not to work so much, but she gets frustrated at me. She doesn't have enough support at work and if she is going to do her job properly, she needs to work these extra hours. In addition, she expects a lot of help from me, proofreading emails, sometimes going and helping her do more physical aspects of her job. I am happy to help, to a point.
To top this all off, we're expecting a baby in two weeks. We need to have some time to spend together and relax before this happens but she just spends time at work. She has always been a hard worker and has consistently valued results over compensation at numerous jobs. It's really really frustrating to me.
I think this is wage theft and unfair. I think that she is being taken advantage of. She is in charge of making sure that things are all set up before she leaves, including hiring her own temporary replacement. OUTRAGEOUS, I say. I have said this to her, but she becomes defensive or says things like "it doesn't matter, I have to get this done, no one else will do it." I think that she should just not let it get done. I don't care about her job enough to have it ruin the last bits of time before we have a child.
I love her very much but I just don't know what to do. I just want to spend more time with her.
It's a really interesting job, where she has a lot of decision making power and there are lots of interesting other opportunities. We made a very large life switch (moved states) because of this job, and I still believe that it is a very interesting opportunity. However, she sometimes works six days a week, sometimes for 10+ hours a day. I have tried talking to her and have asked her not to work so much, but she gets frustrated at me. She doesn't have enough support at work and if she is going to do her job properly, she needs to work these extra hours. In addition, she expects a lot of help from me, proofreading emails, sometimes going and helping her do more physical aspects of her job. I am happy to help, to a point.
To top this all off, we're expecting a baby in two weeks. We need to have some time to spend together and relax before this happens but she just spends time at work. She has always been a hard worker and has consistently valued results over compensation at numerous jobs. It's really really frustrating to me.
I think this is wage theft and unfair. I think that she is being taken advantage of. She is in charge of making sure that things are all set up before she leaves, including hiring her own temporary replacement. OUTRAGEOUS, I say. I have said this to her, but she becomes defensive or says things like "it doesn't matter, I have to get this done, no one else will do it." I think that she should just not let it get done. I don't care about her job enough to have it ruin the last bits of time before we have a child.
I love her very much but I just don't know what to do. I just want to spend more time with her.
Awww.
I am about a month out from birth and going through some of what your wife is.
First, some of what she might be experiencing, from the perspective of a pregnant academic.
I am sure you know academia is a crazy industry where you are repeatedly told that your work is life, and as a woman, often explicitly discriminated against for being married, being of "child-bearing age," etc. Horrifying stories. So it makes the actual process of going on maternity leave a real landmine... You've been told for so long both TO YOUR FACE and also in many ways implicitly that you are doing something Bad by not putting your career first. At least this is true for faculty, #academiatwitter and personal experience confirm it's super normal to be told point blank that kids are career suicide.
So obviously it's an emotional transition to shift a core aspect of your identity, and risk a life you have built over a decade or more. My friend recommended this book (she is a psychologist) which has actionable tips for working through the identity transition that is the third trimester.
Have you asked your wife about specific things you'd like to do together? In our case, there has been a lot of house prep, which is draining and not fun or romantic, and my most succesful way to pump the brakes on my husband's hardcore nesting impulse was to be like: tonight, we're putting on slow jams and making pasta from scratch, put it on your calendar. Such a cozy night (sub "your couple thing" obviously).
So. Advice: don't tell her she's working too much. Provide resources and listening support for the huge identity transition she is going through. Show her you value your time together by making some concrete FUN plans to enjoy your time together as a couple.
And congrats! I bet we're all going to do just fine.
posted by athirstforsalt at 7:11 PM on March 5, 2020 [13 favorites]
I am about a month out from birth and going through some of what your wife is.
First, some of what she might be experiencing, from the perspective of a pregnant academic.
I am sure you know academia is a crazy industry where you are repeatedly told that your work is life, and as a woman, often explicitly discriminated against for being married, being of "child-bearing age," etc. Horrifying stories. So it makes the actual process of going on maternity leave a real landmine... You've been told for so long both TO YOUR FACE and also in many ways implicitly that you are doing something Bad by not putting your career first. At least this is true for faculty, #academiatwitter and personal experience confirm it's super normal to be told point blank that kids are career suicide.
So obviously it's an emotional transition to shift a core aspect of your identity, and risk a life you have built over a decade or more. My friend recommended this book (she is a psychologist) which has actionable tips for working through the identity transition that is the third trimester.
Have you asked your wife about specific things you'd like to do together? In our case, there has been a lot of house prep, which is draining and not fun or romantic, and my most succesful way to pump the brakes on my husband's hardcore nesting impulse was to be like: tonight, we're putting on slow jams and making pasta from scratch, put it on your calendar. Such a cozy night (sub "your couple thing" obviously).
So. Advice: don't tell her she's working too much. Provide resources and listening support for the huge identity transition she is going through. Show her you value your time together by making some concrete FUN plans to enjoy your time together as a couple.
And congrats! I bet we're all going to do just fine.
posted by athirstforsalt at 7:11 PM on March 5, 2020 [13 favorites]
I really like the above responses. (also, as the genders and who is expecting are not completely spelled out, I guess I will go with the same assumption as everyone else that the person who is expecting is the same person who is working 10hr days, i.e. you are probably a dude and your wife is the expectant one?) I will say that as a parent, yes, having a child changes your life, but I wouldn't turn the last bits of time together pre-child in to a big thing which you will forever regret not maximizing. 13 years out, I remember shockingly little about third trimester life as a couple. YMMV. In general, you should defer to whatever the pregnant person wants and prioritizes- they are the one doing the "heavy lifting" here.
posted by Larry David Syndrome at 7:24 PM on March 5, 2020 [10 favorites]
posted by Larry David Syndrome at 7:24 PM on March 5, 2020 [10 favorites]
In general, you should defer to whatever the pregnant person wants and prioritizes- they are the one doing the "heavy lifting" here.
This.
posted by pompomtom at 7:26 PM on March 5, 2020 [7 favorites]
This.
posted by pompomtom at 7:26 PM on March 5, 2020 [7 favorites]
I've never been pregnant, so adjust your grain of salt accordingly, but I've been in a situation many times where I knew I was going to be laid up or out of commission for a while, and those were times when I felt incredibly driven to do as much as I could, while I still could.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 7:53 PM on March 5, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by The Underpants Monster at 7:53 PM on March 5, 2020 [3 favorites]
A few things:
1. You've kind of missed the window on pre-baby relaxing, already. At this point she's in the final countdown.
2. "We need to have some time together to relax" is not a statement of fact. YOU want couple time with her right now. She doesn't. If she did, she'd be having it. What she wants to do right now is work as much as possible while she can. She does not share your belief that her job is more trouble than it's worth.
3. It does not work, and is a very bad idea in general, to tell pregnant people how to feel. Even when you really, really wish they'd see things your way. It's just not a good time for that sort of thing.
4. Instead of complaining that she's not focusing enough on you right now, it would probably serve your marriage better for you to take charge of other things that you can help with. Make food and stock the freezer. Assemble the baby furniture. Research the local parent groups. She's got a lot on her plate right now. Be a prop. Don't let her go into this incredibly hard transition feeling like you were another source of demands she had to manage.
posted by fingersandtoes at 9:39 PM on March 5, 2020 [47 favorites]
1. You've kind of missed the window on pre-baby relaxing, already. At this point she's in the final countdown.
2. "We need to have some time together to relax" is not a statement of fact. YOU want couple time with her right now. She doesn't. If she did, she'd be having it. What she wants to do right now is work as much as possible while she can. She does not share your belief that her job is more trouble than it's worth.
3. It does not work, and is a very bad idea in general, to tell pregnant people how to feel. Even when you really, really wish they'd see things your way. It's just not a good time for that sort of thing.
4. Instead of complaining that she's not focusing enough on you right now, it would probably serve your marriage better for you to take charge of other things that you can help with. Make food and stock the freezer. Assemble the baby furniture. Research the local parent groups. She's got a lot on her plate right now. Be a prop. Don't let her go into this incredibly hard transition feeling like you were another source of demands she had to manage.
posted by fingersandtoes at 9:39 PM on March 5, 2020 [47 favorites]
It is never a good time to tell another human being how to feel.
Especially not if you are suggesting that their work ethic or priorities are foolish, "more trouble than it's worth" or otherwise being dismissive of things they feel are necessary. These tasks may literally be necessary for her to keep her job, or for her to have a positive recommendation from this job if she does not return to it, or for her not to be shunted into the "mommy track" when she does return to work.
Her own emotions are hers. They give her information about what she wants or needs to do, what she has done, and what the people around her are doing.
If someone were telling me that things I was prioritizing were beneath me, I would perhaps go out of my way to spend a bit less time around that person, especially if I was feeling a ton of internal and/or external to do the things I was prioritizing. Or if I enjoyed the work that someone was encouraging me to cut back on. Or maybe a lot less time.
I don't know which of you is the pregnant person, but if I was pregnant, this would be magnified, rather than diminished.
posted by bilabial at 9:48 PM on March 5, 2020 [3 favorites]
Especially not if you are suggesting that their work ethic or priorities are foolish, "more trouble than it's worth" or otherwise being dismissive of things they feel are necessary. These tasks may literally be necessary for her to keep her job, or for her to have a positive recommendation from this job if she does not return to it, or for her not to be shunted into the "mommy track" when she does return to work.
Her own emotions are hers. They give her information about what she wants or needs to do, what she has done, and what the people around her are doing.
If someone were telling me that things I was prioritizing were beneath me, I would perhaps go out of my way to spend a bit less time around that person, especially if I was feeling a ton of internal and/or external to do the things I was prioritizing. Or if I enjoyed the work that someone was encouraging me to cut back on. Or maybe a lot less time.
I don't know which of you is the pregnant person, but if I was pregnant, this would be magnified, rather than diminished.
posted by bilabial at 9:48 PM on March 5, 2020 [3 favorites]
Is there any way you can help her?
posted by amtho at 9:48 PM on March 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by amtho at 9:48 PM on March 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
This would be difficult enough conversation to have if she were not heavily pregnant. As it is... back away. This is not the time. Could there be a chance that some of your concern is stemming from your own anxiety about not being ready for the baby's arrival? I agree with others, don't approach this by telling her that she needs to focus less on work because Baby Is On The Way! That's just... displacing and exacerbating stress. Because not only is she now worried about the state of her work when she leaves (which is related to the state of her employment when she returns) but she's worried about being ready to be a parent, which... ugh, none of us are man.
I agree with the other comments. Channel your energy towards taking care of family life so she doesn't have to.
- Stock up on freezer meals or research good food delivery services in your area.
- Look into hiring a cleaner, best to get them settled in before the baby arrives.
- Is the bassinet/cot ready?
- Have you got enough diapers and babygrows and wipes?
- Do you know how to use your stroller?
- Have you practiced strapping on a baby carrier?
- If she plans on breastfeeding, do some research for lactation consultants in your area now, just in case. My husband had to frantically locate one at short notice because I was in tears.
- If you're planning on bottlefeeding, get comfortable with proper bottle sterilisation and formula mixing now.
- Research AskMe posts from soon to be parents asking about how they can prepare, there are few.
This issue will not be an an issue in a few weeks. You'll have MUCH BIGGER things to think about. Focus on that. You're missing the forest for the tree right now.
posted by like_neon at 1:55 AM on March 6, 2020 [4 favorites]
I agree with the other comments. Channel your energy towards taking care of family life so she doesn't have to.
- Stock up on freezer meals or research good food delivery services in your area.
- Look into hiring a cleaner, best to get them settled in before the baby arrives.
- Is the bassinet/cot ready?
- Have you got enough diapers and babygrows and wipes?
- Do you know how to use your stroller?
- Have you practiced strapping on a baby carrier?
- If she plans on breastfeeding, do some research for lactation consultants in your area now, just in case. My husband had to frantically locate one at short notice because I was in tears.
- If you're planning on bottlefeeding, get comfortable with proper bottle sterilisation and formula mixing now.
- Research AskMe posts from soon to be parents asking about how they can prepare, there are few.
This issue will not be an an issue in a few weeks. You'll have MUCH BIGGER things to think about. Focus on that. You're missing the forest for the tree right now.
posted by like_neon at 1:55 AM on March 6, 2020 [4 favorites]
I don’t want to pile on, but I do want to underscore for OP that a lot of responders are assuming you are a male and that your wife is pregnant precisely because your ask reads as assigning responsibility to your wife for broad systematic pressures on women and particularly on new mothers in the workplace.
For example: She is in charge of making sure that things are all set up before she leaves, including hiring her own temporary replacement. OUTRAGEOUS, I say. This may be “OUTRAGEOUS” but is...almost always what is expected of women about to go on parental leave? Like, to the point that I am confuzzled that you don’t seem to know or acknowledge that? And suggesting your wife she is wrong to do It leaves her in an impossible position.
I actually think that 60+ hour weeks for a *non-parent-to-be* who is nominally part time and not receiving OT is an entirely reasonable point of discussion in a marriage, and it sounds like this pattern does predate your expecting a baby — but the window for having that discussion closed months ago and may not reopen for years If your wife is going to be balancing work and having a young child.
posted by LadyInWaiting at 4:18 AM on March 6, 2020 [20 favorites]
For example: She is in charge of making sure that things are all set up before she leaves, including hiring her own temporary replacement. OUTRAGEOUS, I say. This may be “OUTRAGEOUS” but is...almost always what is expected of women about to go on parental leave? Like, to the point that I am confuzzled that you don’t seem to know or acknowledge that? And suggesting your wife she is wrong to do It leaves her in an impossible position.
I actually think that 60+ hour weeks for a *non-parent-to-be* who is nominally part time and not receiving OT is an entirely reasonable point of discussion in a marriage, and it sounds like this pattern does predate your expecting a baby — but the window for having that discussion closed months ago and may not reopen for years If your wife is going to be balancing work and having a young child.
posted by LadyInWaiting at 4:18 AM on March 6, 2020 [20 favorites]
She is in charge of making sure that things are all set up before she leaves, including hiring her own temporary replacement. OUTRAGEOUS, I say. I have said this to her, but she becomes defensive or says things like "it doesn't matter, I have to get this done, no one else will do it.
Another voice chiming in here in case the repetition helps: this is absolutely bog standard in many, many workplaces. She is not doing something above and beyond the call of duty, she is doing the expected and typical amount of work to a) maintain a good relationship with her workplace to minimize the chances that she comes back to find herself subtly or directly pushed out of a job and b) frontloading her work now so she can focus on the baby and your newly-expanded family once the baby arrives instead of handling frantic calls every twelve seconds.
The general question of her work-life balance and how you each feel about it is real and serious and it sounds like an important gap between you. But the time to talk about it is either months/years ago, or as she's ramping up to go back to work after the baby and you can talk about shared expectations and how she can set better work-life boundaries when she returns to her job. Right now is a once-or-twice-in-a-lifetime special situation and you need to trust her to manage it the most appropriate way for her, ask her what support she wants, and give her that support. This is not the time to put your foot down about her entire work ethic and value system.
It's completely appropriate to have your own needs and you can certainly say "hey, I wish we had some time to just relax together before the baby comes, can we find a way to make that happen?" It wouldn't be over the top to ask to designate, say, a couple of specific date nights or a Saturday for No Work Time. I suspect you'll have a lot better luck owning it as something you want, need, and would feel good about, rather than something SHE deserves because SHE is being TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF OUTRAGEOUSLY. She's been clear to you about her own wants and priorities right now and you telling her they are wrong and should be what you wish they were, rather than approaching it as "I respect that but also here's how they conflict with mine, let's work up a compromise" is probably setting yourself up for failure.
posted by Stacey at 5:11 AM on March 6, 2020 [15 favorites]
Another voice chiming in here in case the repetition helps: this is absolutely bog standard in many, many workplaces. She is not doing something above and beyond the call of duty, she is doing the expected and typical amount of work to a) maintain a good relationship with her workplace to minimize the chances that she comes back to find herself subtly or directly pushed out of a job and b) frontloading her work now so she can focus on the baby and your newly-expanded family once the baby arrives instead of handling frantic calls every twelve seconds.
The general question of her work-life balance and how you each feel about it is real and serious and it sounds like an important gap between you. But the time to talk about it is either months/years ago, or as she's ramping up to go back to work after the baby and you can talk about shared expectations and how she can set better work-life boundaries when she returns to her job. Right now is a once-or-twice-in-a-lifetime special situation and you need to trust her to manage it the most appropriate way for her, ask her what support she wants, and give her that support. This is not the time to put your foot down about her entire work ethic and value system.
It's completely appropriate to have your own needs and you can certainly say "hey, I wish we had some time to just relax together before the baby comes, can we find a way to make that happen?" It wouldn't be over the top to ask to designate, say, a couple of specific date nights or a Saturday for No Work Time. I suspect you'll have a lot better luck owning it as something you want, need, and would feel good about, rather than something SHE deserves because SHE is being TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF OUTRAGEOUSLY. She's been clear to you about her own wants and priorities right now and you telling her they are wrong and should be what you wish they were, rather than approaching it as "I respect that but also here's how they conflict with mine, let's work up a compromise" is probably setting yourself up for failure.
posted by Stacey at 5:11 AM on March 6, 2020 [15 favorites]
I think this is wage theft and unfair.
Are some of the hours she works unpaid? Is she working way over part-time hours with only part-time benefits, or no benefits? That would be something to address, in my opinion. Maybe not just now, so close to baby's arrival but when she goes back, she should address any wage theft issues. These are rampant in some institutions, especially for women. To whatever extent possible, the two of you should discuss this separately from what it's doing to your quality of life.
posted by BibiRose at 6:37 AM on March 6, 2020 [1 favorite]
As one half of a dual-workaholic family, I feel your pain. When one partner is lost in career it is very lonely and with two weeks (TWO WEEKS) to Baby staring you down in your face, I can empathize with your feelings.
However, I did want to chime in on a few things. First, this: "I don't care about her job enough to have it ruin the last bits of time before we have a child" reads very very badly. ALL of it.
If you are expressing your feelings to her in this way I think you should rethink your language. SHE cares about her job, and if this truly was a dream opportunity and you both made the decision together, I think you have to stop treating this job as if it's ruining your life. Or the baby as if it's about to ruin your life.
It's fine to say you want to sleep and not proofread her emails. It is okay to ask for what you need. But it is not okay to hammer your wife's way of dealing with her own anxiousness about her career by hammering CAPITALIST PIGS at her. Some of us just don't work well at 50%. It is totally fine to say to your wife hey, I really need to hang out with you Friday night, how can we make that happen? But it is not okay to suddenly come at her for daring to have ambition or care about her work or slam her for wanting to set things up well.
You are betraying a strange passivity/anger here where you are judging your wife for your own feelings that your life is about To End, when really, you're right on the cusp of a great new adventure together that I presume you also want. A baby! You will be the parent! So will she!
Like other people above, I encourage you to deal with your anxiety differently.
The night I had my eldest son my husband was in the middle of a SEV-1 outage on a Saturday evening. He had been working insane hours for months, a year and a half after the death of our first child which made the whole pregnancy a mess. We had had to leave Home Depot due to this SEV-1. I was actually kind of furious with him the way you sound. So on a lark I started timing my "Braxton Hicks" contractions and found they were about 90 seconds apart. I called L&D and they said to come in. I told him we had to go have our baby checked out and it took him about an hour and a half to disengage. I was losing my mind, he was losing his mind.
We made it through the doors of the hospital with about 45 minutes to spare to BABY.
Having the baby was awesome.
He was awesome.
Being up in the night with the baby was awesome and horrendous at once. He used to take the baby and hold him while he had conference calls with India at 4 am...I'd be trying to go back to sleep after nursing...I can still hear speakerphone technobabble in my sleep from those days.
This is life. My husband is who he is. I am who I am. That's what we love about each other. And yes, he did get me to the hospital on time. Barely. But he did.
We are still very happily married almost 15 years later.
It's going to be okay. Don't denigrate your wife's career on the way to Okay.
Do ask her to come out to dinner with you tonight.
posted by warriorqueen at 7:04 AM on March 6, 2020 [13 favorites]
However, I did want to chime in on a few things. First, this: "I don't care about her job enough to have it ruin the last bits of time before we have a child" reads very very badly. ALL of it.
If you are expressing your feelings to her in this way I think you should rethink your language. SHE cares about her job, and if this truly was a dream opportunity and you both made the decision together, I think you have to stop treating this job as if it's ruining your life. Or the baby as if it's about to ruin your life.
It's fine to say you want to sleep and not proofread her emails. It is okay to ask for what you need. But it is not okay to hammer your wife's way of dealing with her own anxiousness about her career by hammering CAPITALIST PIGS at her. Some of us just don't work well at 50%. It is totally fine to say to your wife hey, I really need to hang out with you Friday night, how can we make that happen? But it is not okay to suddenly come at her for daring to have ambition or care about her work or slam her for wanting to set things up well.
You are betraying a strange passivity/anger here where you are judging your wife for your own feelings that your life is about To End, when really, you're right on the cusp of a great new adventure together that I presume you also want. A baby! You will be the parent! So will she!
Like other people above, I encourage you to deal with your anxiety differently.
The night I had my eldest son my husband was in the middle of a SEV-1 outage on a Saturday evening. He had been working insane hours for months, a year and a half after the death of our first child which made the whole pregnancy a mess. We had had to leave Home Depot due to this SEV-1. I was actually kind of furious with him the way you sound. So on a lark I started timing my "Braxton Hicks" contractions and found they were about 90 seconds apart. I called L&D and they said to come in. I told him we had to go have our baby checked out and it took him about an hour and a half to disengage. I was losing my mind, he was losing his mind.
We made it through the doors of the hospital with about 45 minutes to spare to BABY.
Having the baby was awesome.
He was awesome.
Being up in the night with the baby was awesome and horrendous at once. He used to take the baby and hold him while he had conference calls with India at 4 am...I'd be trying to go back to sleep after nursing...I can still hear speakerphone technobabble in my sleep from those days.
This is life. My husband is who he is. I am who I am. That's what we love about each other. And yes, he did get me to the hospital on time. Barely. But he did.
We are still very happily married almost 15 years later.
It's going to be okay. Don't denigrate your wife's career on the way to Okay.
Do ask her to come out to dinner with you tonight.
posted by warriorqueen at 7:04 AM on March 6, 2020 [13 favorites]
Don't do %Thing. is no fun, and not a very successful request.
Come Home for dinner and conversation, watch Netflix with me, let's do this hike, etc. is more successful.
It's so great to be with you is a good reinforcer and can be expressed in many,many ways.
posted by theora55 at 10:49 AM on March 6, 2020
Come Home for dinner and conversation, watch Netflix with me, let's do this hike, etc. is more successful.
It's so great to be with you is a good reinforcer and can be expressed in many,many ways.
posted by theora55 at 10:49 AM on March 6, 2020
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I get that you don’t care about her job but she does and it’s not at all unusual for mothers to be told they no longer have a job by the time they’re ready to come back from having a baby, a lot of employers hate working mums. I bet this is in the back of her mind too and she’s trying to shore up her position.
Once she’s wrapped things up, I bet she’ll be able to relax (as much as one can with a newborn...) but the last thing you want is for to be anxious about work while the baby is here too. Hopefully she will completely disconnect and tell the office she’s on leave and unavailable and follow through. I know you’re probably frustrated but it’s pretty common for most mums I know to be frantically tying up loose ends before the baby arrives, life doesn’t give you much down time. Having weeks to relax before is really a luxury that she (and most others it would seem) just doesn’t have.
posted by Jubey at 7:09 PM on March 5, 2020 [17 favorites]