They wouldn't not let me in, right?
May 11, 2019 11:20 PM Subscribe
I am visiting France and I feel like I shouldn't need a visa, but now it seems like maybe I do. And I have an extremely limited about of time to sort this out, so I am freaking out. Details below.
I am going to (big sports event) in France as a writer for (news outlet). Suddenly it has been sprung on me that just about any American can travel to France for up to 90 days without a visa, except for journalists. There has been conflicting information out there about this, but I just don't want to do anything wrong, so now I am trying to get a visa in short order and I am terrified that I won't be able to enter France.
So, France has apparently outsourced all U.S. visa applications to a company called VFS. An in-person appointment is required and they only have nine centers in the entire United States, none of which I live remotely near. I will be in the same city as one of them later this month on the date that happens to be the soonest appointment that location has available, so I have signed up for it. But they told me it can take 15 to 22 business days for the visa to be processed. I am supposed to leave for France 9 business days after my appointment. I've called VFS and they haven't been helpful - they say I should explain my situation to the agent at my appointment. That hardly sounds like a promise or reassurance, and just waiting around and hoping the agent in-person helps me seems risky. I have to turn over my passport to get the visa, so if I don't get it back by the time I need to leave on June 7, I would be absolutely, completely fucked.
I've spoken to many journalists from (major outlets) that are not going to get visas and are just going to say they are there to see (big sports event). I probably should have done that - thousands of Americans will be going to France for this event and there's nothing to indicate I am also not just a tourist going to this event. But I have already started an application and I am scared I can't back out now without them seeing it. Even worse, I also emailed the French consulate in Washington DC asking for help to expedite my application. They responded asking me for my full name and date of birth, which I provided, but I haven't gotten another response yet. So I am worried I have already flagged myself in their system somehow. (I emailed them because they do not accept phone calls, and they are ultimately the ones who get all the visa applications from VFS and process them, so the buck stops with them.)
What should I do? I am totally freaking out. I have been an emotional wreck since this was sprung on me and I am terrified I will have troubles getting into France. All my flights and hotels are booked and they cost thousands of dollars. I also have already agreed to cover this for (major outlet). I have to go. Not going isn't an option. This needs to work out.
I need advice and, if possible, reassurance. Would France really not let a journalist in the country to cover a sports event for four weeks? If I said I was just there to be a spectator, would that really arouse any suspicion or lead to any problems? Have I flagged myself in their computer system? I have return flights booked. I have money. I have no criminal record. Etc. I feel like this should be a non-issue, and I don't understand the journalist exception to the rules. I assume maybe it has more to do with journalists reporting on the government or on France or something - not journalists coming to watch a sporting event to cover a non-French team. This also seems to be a new rule, (maybe due to idiot Trump?), hence the confusion regarding it.
Is there anyone else who can help me? Is there anything else I can do? I'm really worried about this and it's causing me an unbearable amount of anxiety. It's all I can think about.
What I really do NOT need is blind speculation. But if anyone can offer any advice, experience, whatever, please do. In case, a throw-away email address for me is: heresathrowawayemail@gmail.com. Thank you.
I am going to (big sports event) in France as a writer for (news outlet). Suddenly it has been sprung on me that just about any American can travel to France for up to 90 days without a visa, except for journalists. There has been conflicting information out there about this, but I just don't want to do anything wrong, so now I am trying to get a visa in short order and I am terrified that I won't be able to enter France.
So, France has apparently outsourced all U.S. visa applications to a company called VFS. An in-person appointment is required and they only have nine centers in the entire United States, none of which I live remotely near. I will be in the same city as one of them later this month on the date that happens to be the soonest appointment that location has available, so I have signed up for it. But they told me it can take 15 to 22 business days for the visa to be processed. I am supposed to leave for France 9 business days after my appointment. I've called VFS and they haven't been helpful - they say I should explain my situation to the agent at my appointment. That hardly sounds like a promise or reassurance, and just waiting around and hoping the agent in-person helps me seems risky. I have to turn over my passport to get the visa, so if I don't get it back by the time I need to leave on June 7, I would be absolutely, completely fucked.
I've spoken to many journalists from (major outlets) that are not going to get visas and are just going to say they are there to see (big sports event). I probably should have done that - thousands of Americans will be going to France for this event and there's nothing to indicate I am also not just a tourist going to this event. But I have already started an application and I am scared I can't back out now without them seeing it. Even worse, I also emailed the French consulate in Washington DC asking for help to expedite my application. They responded asking me for my full name and date of birth, which I provided, but I haven't gotten another response yet. So I am worried I have already flagged myself in their system somehow. (I emailed them because they do not accept phone calls, and they are ultimately the ones who get all the visa applications from VFS and process them, so the buck stops with them.)
What should I do? I am totally freaking out. I have been an emotional wreck since this was sprung on me and I am terrified I will have troubles getting into France. All my flights and hotels are booked and they cost thousands of dollars. I also have already agreed to cover this for (major outlet). I have to go. Not going isn't an option. This needs to work out.
I need advice and, if possible, reassurance. Would France really not let a journalist in the country to cover a sports event for four weeks? If I said I was just there to be a spectator, would that really arouse any suspicion or lead to any problems? Have I flagged myself in their computer system? I have return flights booked. I have money. I have no criminal record. Etc. I feel like this should be a non-issue, and I don't understand the journalist exception to the rules. I assume maybe it has more to do with journalists reporting on the government or on France or something - not journalists coming to watch a sporting event to cover a non-French team. This also seems to be a new rule, (maybe due to idiot Trump?), hence the confusion regarding it.
Is there anyone else who can help me? Is there anything else I can do? I'm really worried about this and it's causing me an unbearable amount of anxiety. It's all I can think about.
What I really do NOT need is blind speculation. But if anyone can offer any advice, experience, whatever, please do. In case, a throw-away email address for me is: heresathrowawayemail@gmail.com. Thank you.
Have you tried FIFA's media liasion?
Does your employer have any contacts with FIFA.
Flying to an adjacent country and hopping on a train/driving into France should be fairly uncomplicated if all else fails.
posted by fullerine at 11:51 PM on May 11, 2019 [1 favorite]
Does your employer have any contacts with FIFA.
Flying to an adjacent country and hopping on a train/driving into France should be fairly uncomplicated if all else fails.
posted by fullerine at 11:51 PM on May 11, 2019 [1 favorite]
Yeah. Continue with you current steps and enter through a nearby Schengen country if the worst comes to the worst. Free movement within Schengen is a legal commitment, so you're no worse off from that perspective than your more eagerly deceitful colleagues: you're just fibbing at a different airport to them.
posted by howfar at 12:22 AM on May 12, 2019 [1 favorite]
posted by howfar at 12:22 AM on May 12, 2019 [1 favorite]
Previous responses seem to have missed the part where anonymous says "I have to turn over my passport to get the visa".
posted by DanSachs at 2:00 AM on May 12, 2019
posted by DanSachs at 2:00 AM on May 12, 2019
Not relevant, they don't need to apply for a visa.
posted by turkeyphant at 3:06 AM on May 12, 2019 [2 favorites]
posted by turkeyphant at 3:06 AM on May 12, 2019 [2 favorites]
If you really can't get an answer any other way I live about 10m from the VFS office in L.A. (which is actually in a Regus shared executive suite, heh) and will be near it on business this week. I have no idea if they will answer some business-attired rando's questions but I'd give it a shot.
If it does turn out to be a problem, I'd imagine someone at Major Outlet will know what to do about it?
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:49 AM on May 12, 2019 [1 favorite]
If it does turn out to be a problem, I'd imagine someone at Major Outlet will know what to do about it?
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:49 AM on May 12, 2019 [1 favorite]
It may not specifically be an issue for journalists so much as if you are going there to do work - often this requires you to have some kind of business visa. Whether or not they have an issue with journalists regarding what you are or aren't reporting on and whether they will "let you in" is irrelevant though - if you, visiting there as a working journalist officially require one, you officially require one. And your issue most likely isn't so much actually being the granted the visa, but being granted the visa *in time*.
Having said that, I would have probably done like many of your counterparts seem to have and just not bothered declaring it. That is always a risk though. Whether or not you have flagged yourself in their system, none of us can say, but it isn't completely impossible that you have. I would done what you've already done and just ring the consulate/embassy and just be honest about what has happened, and see what happens. It's not unheard of that someone from the embassy might also tell you to just not worry about it (it has been known to happen).
If all else fails, I would do as many above have suggested and just enter France from another Schengen country. Officially this is still a risk, but a low one. Alternately you could just go anyway, and if questioned, just say you were intending to go as a journalist but things fell through. Obviously you need to be careful in that instance in not taking any tools etc. that will make it obvious you are actually intending to work.
Obviously some of what I've said above is not the most honest way to approach the situation (and there would absolutely be consequences if you were caught) but people do this all the time and it is fairly low risk.
posted by ryanbryan at 4:50 AM on May 12, 2019 [2 favorites]
Having said that, I would have probably done like many of your counterparts seem to have and just not bothered declaring it. That is always a risk though. Whether or not you have flagged yourself in their system, none of us can say, but it isn't completely impossible that you have. I would done what you've already done and just ring the consulate/embassy and just be honest about what has happened, and see what happens. It's not unheard of that someone from the embassy might also tell you to just not worry about it (it has been known to happen).
If all else fails, I would do as many above have suggested and just enter France from another Schengen country. Officially this is still a risk, but a low one. Alternately you could just go anyway, and if questioned, just say you were intending to go as a journalist but things fell through. Obviously you need to be careful in that instance in not taking any tools etc. that will make it obvious you are actually intending to work.
Obviously some of what I've said above is not the most honest way to approach the situation (and there would absolutely be consequences if you were caught) but people do this all the time and it is fairly low risk.
posted by ryanbryan at 4:50 AM on May 12, 2019 [2 favorites]
You might also try contacting the U.S. Embassy in Paris, specifically the Press and Culture officers, to see if they can provide any reassurance or perhaps some contact point that can expedite issuance of a journalist visa if you decide to go that route.
You could also try calling the French consulate (the one here is down the street from where VFS is) and tell them VFS' phone staff isn't answering your questions regarding whether you in fact need a visa, and ask to speak to someone who can tell you who and what this regulation applies to in the abstract rather than discussing your potential application, specifically, so you know whether to go forward with VFS.
posted by snuffleupagus at 5:00 AM on May 12, 2019 [2 favorites]
You could also try calling the French consulate (the one here is down the street from where VFS is) and tell them VFS' phone staff isn't answering your questions regarding whether you in fact need a visa, and ask to speak to someone who can tell you who and what this regulation applies to in the abstract rather than discussing your potential application, specifically, so you know whether to go forward with VFS.
posted by snuffleupagus at 5:00 AM on May 12, 2019 [2 favorites]
It's not unheard of that someone from the embassy might also tell you to just not worry about it (it has been known to happen).If you do this, and someone tells you "no worries it'll be fine", then *absolutely* record the date & time and the name of the person you talk to, and ideally get them to email you for confirmation. I once spent 8 hours sitting in a holding cell at Heathrow after being told by the UK Consulate that I'd be fine to enter the UK without a visa and sort out my patriality visa and work status once I was there, with questions like "who told you that and when? it's not correct and nobody would have said that".
posted by russm at 5:04 AM on May 12, 2019 [1 favorite]
Entering through another country doesn't change the fact that you'd be violating French law by working there.
posted by deadweightloss at 5:07 AM on May 12, 2019 [3 favorites]
posted by deadweightloss at 5:07 AM on May 12, 2019 [3 favorites]
Kind of a long shot, but I know someone for whom it's worked: you could try appealing to your congressperson to help resolve this as part of their constituent services.
posted by trig at 5:38 AM on May 12, 2019
posted by trig at 5:38 AM on May 12, 2019
Our Congressperson helped my Mom expedite an Italian visa once, for a one-semester educational job. But in that instance it was clear she really needed it, and the Rep's office knew who to call.
posted by snuffleupagus at 5:59 AM on May 12, 2019
posted by snuffleupagus at 5:59 AM on May 12, 2019
Right.
So for my last job I did a lot of visa chasing for business travel to Nigeria, which is one of the most freakin' complicated visas to get. We worked with a visa broker, CIBT, but I still had to navigate red tape and got to the point that one time someone at CIBT called me simply to say he was impressed because I had just submitted the best application he'd seen all month. So here are my thoughts.
* maybe call CIBT and ask them. They're good about sorting out conflicting information regarding visa red tape. They can also help expedite the getting of visas.
* consider getting a second passport. That second passport can be the one you send away for the journalist visa; that way, if it doesn't come in time, you can still use your original passport to go the "I'm going as a tourist, really" route as a plan b. CIBT can also help get a second passport.
This is gonna cost, but if you are this concerned the peace of mind may be worth it. For the record, you probably are fine, but it sounds like you want an official confirmation.
Good luck.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:25 AM on May 12, 2019 [2 favorites]
So for my last job I did a lot of visa chasing for business travel to Nigeria, which is one of the most freakin' complicated visas to get. We worked with a visa broker, CIBT, but I still had to navigate red tape and got to the point that one time someone at CIBT called me simply to say he was impressed because I had just submitted the best application he'd seen all month. So here are my thoughts.
* maybe call CIBT and ask them. They're good about sorting out conflicting information regarding visa red tape. They can also help expedite the getting of visas.
* consider getting a second passport. That second passport can be the one you send away for the journalist visa; that way, if it doesn't come in time, you can still use your original passport to go the "I'm going as a tourist, really" route as a plan b. CIBT can also help get a second passport.
This is gonna cost, but if you are this concerned the peace of mind may be worth it. For the record, you probably are fine, but it sounds like you want an official confirmation.
Good luck.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:25 AM on May 12, 2019 [2 favorites]
Anecdata, but I've flown in to Spain on a US passport twice and both times the border guard did not ask me a single question. They just looked at my passport, looked at me, stamped it, and gave it back to me. Friends of mine who have gone to Spain have had the same experience. So perhaps you'd have some luck flying into Spain?
(I had the same experience the one time I flew to Italy, FWIW.)
posted by breakin' the law at 9:47 AM on May 12, 2019
(I had the same experience the one time I flew to Italy, FWIW.)
posted by breakin' the law at 9:47 AM on May 12, 2019
Whatever you do, do not give your passport to VFS and expect to have it back in time for your trip. VFS is a horror show of petty assholes fond of wielding power over people in desperate situations.
I tried to get a spouse visa in order to stay 7 months in France with my wife before we moved to Canada. I went to the VFS in Chicago with absolutely every document on the checklist provided by the French visa website, in triplicate. I went with passport photos taken in France with the official stamp that says they meet criteria for French travel documents. The VFS agent rejected my photos, and rejected my application (repeatedly referring to my "husband" despite my corrections that I have a wife), saying that even though I had everything on my checklist, she had "seen other checklists before that ask for additional items."
I complained to the consulate, my wife complained in France, it made no difference.
Do not trust VFS at all, it will not end well.
posted by philotes at 1:36 PM on May 12, 2019
I tried to get a spouse visa in order to stay 7 months in France with my wife before we moved to Canada. I went to the VFS in Chicago with absolutely every document on the checklist provided by the French visa website, in triplicate. I went with passport photos taken in France with the official stamp that says they meet criteria for French travel documents. The VFS agent rejected my photos, and rejected my application (repeatedly referring to my "husband" despite my corrections that I have a wife), saying that even though I had everything on my checklist, she had "seen other checklists before that ask for additional items."
I complained to the consulate, my wife complained in France, it made no difference.
Do not trust VFS at all, it will not end well.
posted by philotes at 1:36 PM on May 12, 2019
Entering through another country doesn't change the fact that you'd be violating French law by working there.
Well, yes, but since the question asker is trying to fix the classic mistake of assuming that a border control service is a sane organisation that can be trusted with any more than the bare minimum of information about our movements, entering through another country does relieve their practical worry about doing what all their colleagues are doing anyway.
posted by howfar at 9:21 AM on May 13, 2019
Well, yes, but since the question asker is trying to fix the classic mistake of assuming that a border control service is a sane organisation that can be trusted with any more than the bare minimum of information about our movements, entering through another country does relieve their practical worry about doing what all their colleagues are doing anyway.
posted by howfar at 9:21 AM on May 13, 2019
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