difficult boss question number 4384
February 22, 2019 1:07 AM Subscribe
freind wants to change groups. friend anticipates getting screwed. friend needs help.
(asking for a friend.)
a friend of mine works for a difficult boss - no matter what she does in her group, he does not pay attention enough to it to believe she deserves any credit for it. she keeps getting dinged in reviews for things that she has documentation that she has done, but that he ignores, and gives her a mediocre review.
she believes that this may be due to working as a woman in a male dominated field, but rather than go up the chain (who are equally useless) just to stay and be hated/humiliated more, she’d rather just change groups.
herein lies the problem. her immediate boss has to approve her looking for positions in other groups and has to write her what will surely be an unfair reference of her skills. he has had many other people leave the group as of late for other reasons, so she is sufficiently paranoid that he will freak out about her leaving, but she is to the point where she knows a group change needs to happen. how does she diplomatically approach her boss about starting to look for other positions on other teams? looking for phrasing, demeanor, etc. not looking for “she should quit or sue”. she likes her company, and it is quite large, and there are many other groups she is uniquely qualified for. the problem is getting there in a way in which her boss will not try to torpedo her chances.
TIA, mefites.
(asking for a friend.)
a friend of mine works for a difficult boss - no matter what she does in her group, he does not pay attention enough to it to believe she deserves any credit for it. she keeps getting dinged in reviews for things that she has documentation that she has done, but that he ignores, and gives her a mediocre review.
she believes that this may be due to working as a woman in a male dominated field, but rather than go up the chain (who are equally useless) just to stay and be hated/humiliated more, she’d rather just change groups.
herein lies the problem. her immediate boss has to approve her looking for positions in other groups and has to write her what will surely be an unfair reference of her skills. he has had many other people leave the group as of late for other reasons, so she is sufficiently paranoid that he will freak out about her leaving, but she is to the point where she knows a group change needs to happen. how does she diplomatically approach her boss about starting to look for other positions on other teams? looking for phrasing, demeanor, etc. not looking for “she should quit or sue”. she likes her company, and it is quite large, and there are many other groups she is uniquely qualified for. the problem is getting there in a way in which her boss will not try to torpedo her chances.
TIA, mefites.
I think terretu has it. She needs to get out in front of this and have some conversations with other bosses. I don't know if I'd go so far as to literally say that I fear retaliation though—that's potentially pretty confrontational and I don't think she wants to have that fight. I would just say that I'm interested in joining their group but that I don't think my current boss wants me to leave the group where I am now, and leave the rest unsaid. Anyone who understands the politics of the company—which managers surely do, if they're any good—should catch her drift just fine.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 3:51 AM on February 22, 2019 [3 favorites]
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 3:51 AM on February 22, 2019 [3 favorites]
Decent employers have robust processes that enable staff development & career development, including movement between groups - those processes should be sufficiently well established that even the worst boss couldn't arbitrarily screw up a good employee's change of progression.
If your friend's employer is any good, they'll be able to handle all of this gracefully, and the difficult boss's opportunity to foul it up for her is actually fairly limited. On the other hand - if her organisation can't see past one bad boss's prejudice - then... you know how the rest of that sentence goes.
Having said all that - the others are right, the formal procedure is only there for backup, this whole thing is best handled as a fait-accompli that's been pre-arranged in a discreet side conversation between your friend & her future (wonderful) boss in another group. Then, the paperwork is just a series of boxes for everyone to tick. Don't ask the bad boss for permission, ask him for forgiveness.
posted by rd45 at 4:07 AM on February 22, 2019
If your friend's employer is any good, they'll be able to handle all of this gracefully, and the difficult boss's opportunity to foul it up for her is actually fairly limited. On the other hand - if her organisation can't see past one bad boss's prejudice - then... you know how the rest of that sentence goes.
Having said all that - the others are right, the formal procedure is only there for backup, this whole thing is best handled as a fait-accompli that's been pre-arranged in a discreet side conversation between your friend & her future (wonderful) boss in another group. Then, the paperwork is just a series of boxes for everyone to tick. Don't ask the bad boss for permission, ask him for forgiveness.
posted by rd45 at 4:07 AM on February 22, 2019
I really want to say that the HR department, if there is one, ought to be your friend. However, my experiences in a Fortune 500 company make me distrustful. Still, if you find your fellow employees have an OK view of HR, then it may be a place to start.
I think you should put the spotlight on a desire for career development and new opportunities and not mention your old boss at all.
posted by SemiSalt at 6:49 AM on February 22, 2019 [2 favorites]
I think you should put the spotlight on a desire for career development and new opportunities and not mention your old boss at all.
posted by SemiSalt at 6:49 AM on February 22, 2019 [2 favorites]
Does your friend's boss have a difficult personality? Like, is he also aggressive, chauvinistic, etc., or is he just neglectful (willfully or otherwise)? Because if other people have left his group recently, it means that they successfully did that with or without his "blessing" regardless of what he wrote in a recommendation, and if he doesn't like managing her, he might actually write a glowing review of her just to get her out from under him. That being said...
First step might actually be to document any instances of discrimination, and evidence that he willfully ignored her work product - especially when you mention that he documented poor performance for things he said she had not done, when there is evidence that she had done those things. Put that together and go to HR, and say: "I think there is a pattern of my manager being unfair to me in my performance evaluations, and I brought evidence. I really like working here at this company, but I am concerned that continuing to work under him is going to hurt my chances of career development and that of other women. I am interested in a lateral transfer to another team but I am concerned that based on his previous behavior that he will hurt my chances with an unfairly poor recommendation, which there is a pattern of and which I have provided evidence of. (Hand over folder of evidence.) How would you recommend that I proceed?"
HR is not your friend. Not ever. Don't ever treat them like they are. But if you go to corporate HR with a problem that they identify as their problem, and in their best interest to address and fix, they will be interested.
posted by juniperesque at 8:06 AM on February 22, 2019
First step might actually be to document any instances of discrimination, and evidence that he willfully ignored her work product - especially when you mention that he documented poor performance for things he said she had not done, when there is evidence that she had done those things. Put that together and go to HR, and say: "I think there is a pattern of my manager being unfair to me in my performance evaluations, and I brought evidence. I really like working here at this company, but I am concerned that continuing to work under him is going to hurt my chances of career development and that of other women. I am interested in a lateral transfer to another team but I am concerned that based on his previous behavior that he will hurt my chances with an unfairly poor recommendation, which there is a pattern of and which I have provided evidence of. (Hand over folder of evidence.) How would you recommend that I proceed?"
HR is not your friend. Not ever. Don't ever treat them like they are. But if you go to corporate HR with a problem that they identify as their problem, and in their best interest to address and fix, they will be interested.
posted by juniperesque at 8:06 AM on February 22, 2019
Terretu has it in the first note, I think. The best solution for your friend would be to discreetly approach other managers and showcase her skills, and then arrange to be "headhunted" out of her current position.
If there is a particular skill that is in demand in her organization that she does not currently have, now is the time to take steps to acquire it, even if she has to do training at her own expense or volunteer for outside tasks.
The other advice about documenting etc is also good, but less likely to yield individual results for your friend in the immediate term.
posted by rpfields at 8:57 AM on February 22, 2019
If there is a particular skill that is in demand in her organization that she does not currently have, now is the time to take steps to acquire it, even if she has to do training at her own expense or volunteer for outside tasks.
The other advice about documenting etc is also good, but less likely to yield individual results for your friend in the immediate term.
posted by rpfields at 8:57 AM on February 22, 2019
Can she get in touch with the other folks who have left her current work group to find out how that process went for them? They know her work group sucks, and will probably be favorably disposed toward helping her get out, too. They're likely also proud of how they managed a difficult work situation and will be happy to talk about it for that reason.
Going to HR with documentation of mistreatment and a request to transfer (ideally to a group that is hiring / wants her) is a solid option, but first see if you can get more information about how recently-transferred employees managed things. I would also start out treading very lightly with accusations of discrimination - HR will see where this is headed if you start with "this position is a bad fit" and give specific examples.
She should definitely not start with talking to her awful boss.
posted by momus_window at 8:57 AM on February 22, 2019
Going to HR with documentation of mistreatment and a request to transfer (ideally to a group that is hiring / wants her) is a solid option, but first see if you can get more information about how recently-transferred employees managed things. I would also start out treading very lightly with accusations of discrimination - HR will see where this is headed if you start with "this position is a bad fit" and give specific examples.
She should definitely not start with talking to her awful boss.
posted by momus_window at 8:57 AM on February 22, 2019
Absent a prior good relationship with the boss of another group, I absolutely would not go to him/her with "my current boss is a meanie and is going to say mean things about me but I'd like to come to your group." You do not want the first thing they know about you to be that you have trouble getting along with your boss! Worst case scenario, they are in tight with your current boss and will let them know what you said. Most likely case, they think you're (consciously or not) a management problem just looking for some other group to be a problem in.
Also, as a general rule, HR is not your friend and you will be doing yourself no favors talking to them.
The current boss may actually (albeit unfairly) be glad to be rid of the employee if she can pitch her departure as not in any way reflecting on his group or his management skills. "Lately I've been getting really interested in x...." She could even ask his advice. "Do you think it would be a good idea to see if maybe I could transition over to ABC group, since I know we don't deal much with x at all?"
Yes, it sucks to have to negotiate this nonsense. But work relationships, especially boss-employee ones, are not like romantic ones. Honesty is not only not necessary to success, it's often actively harmful.
posted by praemunire at 11:04 AM on February 22, 2019
Also, as a general rule, HR is not your friend and you will be doing yourself no favors talking to them.
The current boss may actually (albeit unfairly) be glad to be rid of the employee if she can pitch her departure as not in any way reflecting on his group or his management skills. "Lately I've been getting really interested in x...." She could even ask his advice. "Do you think it would be a good idea to see if maybe I could transition over to ABC group, since I know we don't deal much with x at all?"
Yes, it sucks to have to negotiate this nonsense. But work relationships, especially boss-employee ones, are not like romantic ones. Honesty is not only not necessary to success, it's often actively harmful.
posted by praemunire at 11:04 AM on February 22, 2019
« Older Should I have "the talk"with him now or give him... | Cool ways to keep track of movies Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.
Those options for the last sentence only really work if she has good trust with the managers she'd be talking to from the other groups. If she can have this conversation, there's at least a record of her interest in moving and a note, if safe to leave one, that the reference her current boss gives may not reflect her true capabilities and skills.
If there is anything approaching decent HR in her organisation, I would also be tempted to have a conversation with them, covering similar ground to the conversation with the potential new managers - that she's interested in an internal move but concerned about retaliation or an unfair reference from her current manager and ask them for strategies on how to manage the transition.
Assuming most people at the company are normal and professional and can be trusted not to take this directly back to her boss and have it blow up in her face, this is how I would approach the situation before speaking to current boss at all.
posted by terretu at 2:55 AM on February 22, 2019 [9 favorites]