Replace Quicken? Gnucash or....?
January 2, 2019 12:52 PM Subscribe
I'm increasingly uncomfortable using Quicken, which recently replaced the local password with an online login. I'm unhappy giving a for-profit company my spending details.
Opensource alternative Gnucash seems challenging to set up, may not have the same download functionality available in Quicken. Is there something else out there for the more security-minded among us who want easy and light financial management software? Is it worth pushing through gnucash's learning curve? Is Quicken not so bad in terms of privacy, given that I use gmail, so I'm already giving away info?
Here's my current hurdle with gnucash: downloading transactions.
1. It doesn't seem to easily download all accounts from the same bank at once, I'd need to go into each account and request downloads for every individual account.
2. I got it set up for a Credit Union, but can't make it work at all yet for downloading from BofA.
3. The interface for handling/allocating downloaded transactions isn't yet clear. Presumably with more time & practice I could figure this out though, if it's worth the trouble.
4. Inside the account setup wizard for new DirectConnect banking imports, the dropdown options give Quicken2013 as the latest system to emulate...which is old enough that it doesn't inspire confidence. No idea whether that matters, though.
Here's my current hurdle with gnucash: downloading transactions.
1. It doesn't seem to easily download all accounts from the same bank at once, I'd need to go into each account and request downloads for every individual account.
2. I got it set up for a Credit Union, but can't make it work at all yet for downloading from BofA.
3. The interface for handling/allocating downloaded transactions isn't yet clear. Presumably with more time & practice I could figure this out though, if it's worth the trouble.
4. Inside the account setup wizard for new DirectConnect banking imports, the dropdown options give Quicken2013 as the latest system to emulate...which is old enough that it doesn't inspire confidence. No idea whether that matters, though.
I have been using Moneydance for about 8 years and am generally happy with it, but I don’t use the auto download of files from the banks. I export them from the bank, then import them to Moneydance, just because I never fully learned how to use it. I paid once for Moneydance and get free updates. The software and the files all live on your machine, not in the cloud.
posted by jkent at 1:06 PM on January 2, 2019 [3 favorites]
posted by jkent at 1:06 PM on January 2, 2019 [3 favorites]
If you are comfortable with spreadsheets, Tiller. It pulls data from your accounts and populates a Google Sheets or Excel spreadsheet. Several templates to choose from. You will have to manually categorize transactions.
I’ve been using it for half a year and really like it. $5 per month.
posted by notyou at 1:11 PM on January 2, 2019 [1 favorite]
I’ve been using it for half a year and really like it. $5 per month.
posted by notyou at 1:11 PM on January 2, 2019 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: Thanks for the ideas.
If anyone is using Quicken, and has perspective on the privacy/security of Quicken, I'd love to hear that perspective as well.
posted by quinoa at 1:48 PM on January 2, 2019
If anyone is using Quicken, and has perspective on the privacy/security of Quicken, I'd love to hear that perspective as well.
posted by quinoa at 1:48 PM on January 2, 2019
I just moved to Personal Capital which seems to be the go to quicken replacement. I too searched for an offline tool that would balance automatic downloading and privacy, but couldn't find anything that was as good as Quicken was in the 2000s. It's a shame, since I'm not sure how Intuit (now standalone quicken) could get this so wrong from such a lead.
Personal capital is slick - it's also free, so the internet adage applies "you are the product". They are a big financial services firm - so they won't be selling your personal transaction histories, but you will need to constantly ignore their requests to help you manage your money. They seem to be fine w/ people using the tool and not signing up for services from them. I suspect they get enough people to start using their services over time that this makes sense from their side.
posted by NoDef at 1:48 PM on January 2, 2019
Personal capital is slick - it's also free, so the internet adage applies "you are the product". They are a big financial services firm - so they won't be selling your personal transaction histories, but you will need to constantly ignore their requests to help you manage your money. They seem to be fine w/ people using the tool and not signing up for services from them. I suspect they get enough people to start using their services over time that this makes sense from their side.
posted by NoDef at 1:48 PM on January 2, 2019
Just to follow up on your additional question. I left quicken because recent updates started to break existing functionality - downloading from certain banks, etc. this seemed to be accelerating. If they can't seem to get visible things like this correct, I don't trust them with the things beneath the surface. They also seem to be struggling with business model in a manner that would lead me to believe my data may not be safe with them in the long term.
posted by NoDef at 1:57 PM on January 2, 2019 [1 favorite]
posted by NoDef at 1:57 PM on January 2, 2019 [1 favorite]
Response by poster: NoDef, thanks for that. What I'm not clear on is whether my data is held by Quicken at all. I don't check yes to their offers to "store this on our servers". So I try not to give them information.
I store my file locally (with a backup to Dropbox, which I'm aware is another potential security hole). In this scenario, does anyone know whether Intuit/Quicken has access to my transactions?
posted by quinoa at 2:04 PM on January 2, 2019 [1 favorite]
I store my file locally (with a backup to Dropbox, which I'm aware is another potential security hole). In this scenario, does anyone know whether Intuit/Quicken has access to my transactions?
posted by quinoa at 2:04 PM on January 2, 2019 [1 favorite]
Moneydance is what we've used for a _long_ time. We don't do automatic downloading of transactions, though (now I'm wondering if our credit union offers it...). It works well, and it's available on Windows, Mac, and Unix.
posted by amtho at 3:01 PM on January 2, 2019
posted by amtho at 3:01 PM on January 2, 2019
AFAIK unless you've marked accounts to 'be available' in the web version of Quicken (which was made available in their latest release) your stuff stays in the local .DATA file. I have none of my accounts setup to download transactions nor are they available in the web version of Quicken, and it doesn't need an online login. The only online thing I have it do is pull in stock quotes, and it'll ask for my Intuit login when I initially install/upgrade since they've moved to a subscription model.
I'd run through your accounts (right click them and edit them) and make sure that you aren't sending them to their server in those options. Another place to check is if you've enabled online bill import. Some bill providers will link in and try to have them populate your bills electronically if you're adding them to the scheduler.
posted by msbutah at 3:36 PM on January 2, 2019 [2 favorites]
I'd run through your accounts (right click them and edit them) and make sure that you aren't sending them to their server in those options. Another place to check is if you've enabled online bill import. Some bill providers will link in and try to have them populate your bills electronically if you're adding them to the scheduler.
posted by msbutah at 3:36 PM on January 2, 2019 [2 favorites]
I’m another voice in the little “I’ve been using Moneydance for years but don’t auto-download transactions” chorus. Given it can do this, I assume someone actually does...
posted by fabius at 5:14 AM on January 3, 2019
posted by fabius at 5:14 AM on January 3, 2019
Response by poster: This is all been really helpful. Getting this input, and talking through the issue with others IRL, here's where I'm at (since some of you sent DM asking):
+ It seems that if I don't do the "One Step Update" in Quicken, and I instead download transactions from the bank websites account-by-account as a QFX file, and then import them into Quicken myself, that would avoid the privacy issue of me giving Intuit/ Quicken all my data.
+ The Gnucash process for importing transactions also involves downloading account-by-account, and then importing account-by-account.
+ I did a test run mini-import for my main active checking account, just for January 1-2, into both Quicken and Gnucash. It appears that the process of classifying the accounts is quite manual in Gnucash. I'm going to have to decide if the extra time spent on the computer is worth the trouble.
+ In addition to the issues raised above, I also have some assistive technology needs, so I prefer options with less typing required, where I can use keyboard shortcuts and Dragon NaturallySpeaking. Unfortunately, neither Quicken nor Gnucash is particularly good in this area. Gnucash may be worse than Quicken. This may impact my ultimate decision.
+ I've also realized that I have been tracking more than I need to. I really only need to track transactions related to expenses, and I only need to track my actively-used accounts. The others, like some laddered CDs I have, I don't really need to track in a separate system. And I can skip the step of entering paycheck detail, tax lines, and so forth...it's all available on the paystubs if I need it later. I don't get much value out of that...except the sense of satisfaction of "it reconciled!" or "it's all complete and in one place!" and I can let go of that, it's not really where I want to put my attention. So I have decided to minimize my work (and maximize my time available for other things in life!) by only doing the pieces that actively improve things, by allowing me to track my spending.
My next steps:
+ At end of January, do the manual import of accounts (for 8 active accounts, including a couple credit cards, and checking/savings accounts) into Gnucash and Quicken, see how painful it is. I suspect I'll decide to stick with Quicken, based on my first test run mini-import described above, but at least I'll know I gave it a real try. Remove/hide data for accounts which I've determined I don't get value from tracking.
+ Check out Moneydance, if I have the time, consider it as another alternative to Quicken. I would still be giving my data to a for-profit, but I feel so iffy about Intuit/Quicken that I might prefer to be working with an alternative product.
posted by quinoa at 12:02 PM on January 3, 2019
+ It seems that if I don't do the "One Step Update" in Quicken, and I instead download transactions from the bank websites account-by-account as a QFX file, and then import them into Quicken myself, that would avoid the privacy issue of me giving Intuit/ Quicken all my data.
+ The Gnucash process for importing transactions also involves downloading account-by-account, and then importing account-by-account.
+ I did a test run mini-import for my main active checking account, just for January 1-2, into both Quicken and Gnucash. It appears that the process of classifying the accounts is quite manual in Gnucash. I'm going to have to decide if the extra time spent on the computer is worth the trouble.
+ In addition to the issues raised above, I also have some assistive technology needs, so I prefer options with less typing required, where I can use keyboard shortcuts and Dragon NaturallySpeaking. Unfortunately, neither Quicken nor Gnucash is particularly good in this area. Gnucash may be worse than Quicken. This may impact my ultimate decision.
+ I've also realized that I have been tracking more than I need to. I really only need to track transactions related to expenses, and I only need to track my actively-used accounts. The others, like some laddered CDs I have, I don't really need to track in a separate system. And I can skip the step of entering paycheck detail, tax lines, and so forth...it's all available on the paystubs if I need it later. I don't get much value out of that...except the sense of satisfaction of "it reconciled!" or "it's all complete and in one place!" and I can let go of that, it's not really where I want to put my attention. So I have decided to minimize my work (and maximize my time available for other things in life!) by only doing the pieces that actively improve things, by allowing me to track my spending.
My next steps:
+ At end of January, do the manual import of accounts (for 8 active accounts, including a couple credit cards, and checking/savings accounts) into Gnucash and Quicken, see how painful it is. I suspect I'll decide to stick with Quicken, based on my first test run mini-import described above, but at least I'll know I gave it a real try. Remove/hide data for accounts which I've determined I don't get value from tracking.
+ Check out Moneydance, if I have the time, consider it as another alternative to Quicken. I would still be giving my data to a for-profit, but I feel so iffy about Intuit/Quicken that I might prefer to be working with an alternative product.
posted by quinoa at 12:02 PM on January 3, 2019
Moneydance is my app for this. I do use its feature for downloads of transactions from my credit union & credit card issuer. That's usually pretty smooth, but about once a year there's some glitch on the provider side (I vaguely recall it being related to either Java updates or changes to the Quicken version that the banks require & MD has to emulate) that blocks the process. There's usually a MD update soon after that fixes it, and the option of manually getting the data files and importing them has gotten me through the downtime. I only use it to categorize transactions and match payments, but there are a lot of other features.
Yes, Moneydance is produced by a company that's for-profit. However, none of my data ever passes through them. The data is just between me and my banking sites. I'm happy to pay for software that's so useful to me and so well-maintained. The online forums and help pages are full of helpful tips from users and responses from the developers. Buying a license lets you use MD on as many computers and platforms as you own, and the one-time purchase price means you don't have to pay to keep using it. It's not perfect, and other applications might suit others' needs more, but it's a great fit for me in terms of features and feel.
posted by NumberSix at 9:54 PM on January 3, 2019
Yes, Moneydance is produced by a company that's for-profit. However, none of my data ever passes through them. The data is just between me and my banking sites. I'm happy to pay for software that's so useful to me and so well-maintained. The online forums and help pages are full of helpful tips from users and responses from the developers. Buying a license lets you use MD on as many computers and platforms as you own, and the one-time purchase price means you don't have to pay to keep using it. It's not perfect, and other applications might suit others' needs more, but it's a great fit for me in terms of features and feel.
posted by NumberSix at 9:54 PM on January 3, 2019
I recently discovered Buckets, which I found to meet a lot of my goals, and may meet some of yours.
posted by Lirp at 10:00 PM on January 3, 2019
- Lightweight budgeting (maybe too lightweight, depending on your needs)
- Local software and file storage (no cloud storage or software-as-a-service)
- Try the full software for free for as long as you want (with a trial reminder message)
- One-time purchase if you decide to buy it (no monthly fees or software-as-a-service)
- Robust and flexible transaction downloading with macros, I guess (I don't use this myself, but they seem to think it's pretty good)
- Under active development by an engaged, independent developer (I've submitted bugs and feedback both via the app itself and directly on github and had great responses in both cases. My impression is that he would be eager to get some specific feedback from a user of assistive technologies.)
posted by Lirp at 10:00 PM on January 3, 2019
Response by poster: Thanks, all, for the input. Update:
I checked out Moneydance, it wasn't sufficiently different from either gnucash or Quicken to make it worth exploring further, at this point.
After end of January, I did my first round of exporting transactions manually, rather than going through the Quicken direct/web connect interface. I did this for just 5 accounts, decided those 5 were the only ones active enough to warrant the effort. Then, in both gnucash and Quicken, for each account I...
1) downloaded transactions from the bank (took a little sleuthing to get an export for just January, and one account may only be able to do a 45-day period, we'll see next month)
2) imported and categorized transactions for each account
3) reconciled each account against the statement balance
I'm not yet sure which I'll stick with. I'm leaning towards gnucash, if after a couple months the workflow feels smooth, and if I can set up macros/shortcuts to streamline the categorization -- which I can probably do if I keep using DragonNaturallySpeaking. It just makes me less grumpy to use an open source product, and the steps involved might be similar enough (if I'm not using Quicken direct connection) between the two.
Good luck to those of you with similar issues!
Rahel
posted by quinoa at 6:01 PM on February 10, 2019
I checked out Moneydance, it wasn't sufficiently different from either gnucash or Quicken to make it worth exploring further, at this point.
After end of January, I did my first round of exporting transactions manually, rather than going through the Quicken direct/web connect interface. I did this for just 5 accounts, decided those 5 were the only ones active enough to warrant the effort. Then, in both gnucash and Quicken, for each account I...
1) downloaded transactions from the bank (took a little sleuthing to get an export for just January, and one account may only be able to do a 45-day period, we'll see next month)
2) imported and categorized transactions for each account
3) reconciled each account against the statement balance
I'm not yet sure which I'll stick with. I'm leaning towards gnucash, if after a couple months the workflow feels smooth, and if I can set up macros/shortcuts to streamline the categorization -- which I can probably do if I keep using DragonNaturallySpeaking. It just makes me less grumpy to use an open source product, and the steps involved might be similar enough (if I'm not using Quicken direct connection) between the two.
Good luck to those of you with similar issues!
Rahel
posted by quinoa at 6:01 PM on February 10, 2019
Response by poster: For those following along at home, I thought I'd be able to continue downloading the transactions as QFX files without paying to "subscribe". However, when handling the February month-end transactions, I discovered that apparently Quicken won't let me upload the QFX file -- the one I'd downloaded on my own. It still considers it a "web connect" function, for which I'd need a $50/year subscription.
So I'm going to go with gnucash for 2019. We'll see if I can hack my way to some macros to balance out Gnucash's poor user interface. Especially for the categorization of imported transactions, it's a bit painful.
posted by quinoa at 4:31 PM on March 3, 2019
So I'm going to go with gnucash for 2019. We'll see if I can hack my way to some macros to balance out Gnucash's poor user interface. Especially for the categorization of imported transactions, it's a bit painful.
posted by quinoa at 4:31 PM on March 3, 2019
« Older What is the best place to buy bicycle parts online... | What are these things we found in my... Newer »
This thread is closed to new comments.
posted by Nice Guy Mike at 1:01 PM on January 2, 2019 [2 favorites]